Just curious how would it reduce debris, the tape would reduce debris if it were double sided, the cuttings would stick to that but single sided tape you already have the glue side stuck to the metal, if anything you are increasing the debris as you are cutting more material ie metal and also tape. The reason I use tape when cutting is that marking lines to cut on is easier and if you slip and the cutting wheel jumps out of the cut you may avoid scratchs if they are light enough and don't cut thru the tape.
@@tomsparks2294its more about how much of that debris accumulates to the sides of the cut - that is what produces a shitty edge. When you tape down the material, there is less material jumping out of the cut to the sides, becoming accumulated debris on the sides. The only thing the material can do is is either be taken out of the cut by the blade, or stay under the tape to the sides. So it's not so much about catching stuff thats flying away, but more about keeping it from curling off to the sides to the sides in the first place. Of course because tape is still soft material you still have some amount of debris accumulating around your cut, but this is the idea and it works relatively well.
Id personally love to see cables in a system taken to the other extreme: hardline cables make the cables part of the appeal like with hardline water-cooling through custom pcbs / power distribution blocks instead of wiggly wires. imo it would be a really badass addition to an all out balls to the wall type build
@@carinthesunset1971 I don't think it would be that difficult. I think you'd just need bare solid core copper wire. solid core copper wire is easily bendable and you could cut and solder it if you wanted. Then you could either air gap the cables or sleeve/heat shrink them individually. Yes, the solution is stupid, but so is "hard line cables" imo.
I appreciate that Fractal makes a windowless version of the pop air, and most of their other cases. Don't have to worry about your cables looking nice and no risk of glass breaking.
@@michael_baron Hell, my PC looks perfectly fine, and I keep it on the floor and never look inside. Noise is *less* of a problem (still a problem) when it's not in your face, and I don't want the distracting glow of LEDs on my desk. Besides, it would occupy a lot of room.
we should tag him on all our platforms with our real world cable management and help him re-calibrate expectations or... just roast us like we deserve 🤣🤣
I share the same concerns as Paul, there will need to be some regulation to it if manufactures go this route and it will absolutely kill compatibility with cases as well, I am using a case that is over 15 years old still and I wouldn't replace it if I can avoid it.
@@Dragon6687 Did you even watch the video? You have to cut away 90% of the material, and are left with sharp edges everywhere. "jUsT dReMeL iT" Or how about we stop doing the shit that enables these companies to make rampantly anti consumer decisions? The only reason nVIDIA charged $1600USD for a 4090 is because they knew people would pay it. Stop simping for corporations making things worse for the end user.
@@verakoo6187 This, we will have to eventually move on if we want any improvements, personally I would love this, together with a new standard for SATA that covers both the power and data transmission in one cable that isn't a pain to install, even if cases overall become wider, because I would also love HDD bays in the back to be more common place. Personally I don't see how Paul's criticism is an issue at all, unless it's a really small and older small form factor case I don't see the cables not fitting, the cooling is just false advertising and has nothing to do with the approach itself, and as far as compatibility goes would they still not use the same power connectors anyway?
What would be MUCH better is if they put all connectors along the edges of the board and have the entire board sit recessed into the tray so the visible tray walls are flush with the board height (hard to standardise that though), hiding all cables without the need for angled adapters OR extra space in the rear. Kind of how they currently do in some cases with the SATA cable area, whereby the right hand side chamber wall is slightly raised so the cables come out sideways rather than straight up, but just extend the walls to butt up to the board edge and set a standardised board height eg 2cm.
I think one of the issues is going to be the cases - and not just to adopt "a" standard. Right now, I can fit mATX, ATX, maybe "eATX" in the same case. But with the connectors on the back, they'd all need to be cut out in different areas - which means multiple cases for multiple motherboard sizes, not just one that can be used for many (unless they find a way to cluster them all in the back in the same area, which I can see causing other MB design problems.)
This. The main reason why this will not be adopted nor deployed to the masses. Full ATX cases are attractive to many seasoned and new builders because of re-usability and compatibility to smaller boards (M-ATX and M-ITX) should there be a need for one in the future. Heck... the same goes for M-ATX cases for M-ITX use cases. If cut outs for different board sizes are made (for example) on future cases to adopt such standards of having rear connectors, it will affect the structural sturdiness of the internal frame that holds the motherboard - we all know that enthusiast CPU coolers and GPUs aren't getting any lighter. Lastly, building on APE boards will cause for the motherboard to bend more when installing CPU blocks and memory - the connectors just sticks out. Whereas, the current standard still bends mobos but not THAT much.
I think it could be reasonable to have the holes be cutouts like with those metal GPU strips at the back of most cases. Then you can push them out as needed for the mobo you're going to use.
@@inquisitormuchly3199 I don't expext that to be a major issue, mATX is the same width as ATX, the board is just shorter, but the power connectors are never on the bottom anyways, so that doesn't really affect much of anything. If they put holes along the bottom edge of where an m-atx board would go for front panel, usb, etc. it would be covered when an ATX board is used, and there are already holes along the bottom edge of where an ATX board goes so that doesn't really change things. It would make it so if you put an itx board in a full atx case there are some additional unsightly holes visible, but how many people are actually putting itx boards in full atx cases and care about appearance anyways? You pay a premium for the ITX board and you lose out on a lot of features and connectivity vs matx or atx, so you probably aren't buying an itx board unless you are going to put it in an itx case anyways.
I think there's a way around this. You can just standardise a thicker backplate where just about all the material is cut away and only the few bits remain that are needed to hold the standoffs, and the connections between them. The mainboard manufacturer is then free to use all the rest of the area to place connectors where needed.
I think the point we're at currently with cable management is very good. I distinctly remember the nightmare I went through cable managing my OG Antec 900 with a non-modular PSU. These days, most competent mid-tower cases are chocked full of cable management options that make building a clean PC pretty easy. Dealing with the backside takes time if you care, but it's generally only something you do once a year at most. I see way too many compatibility nightmares with this new configuration. Plus, a few cables on the top side has absolutely no meaningful effect on airflow.
it wasn't that long ago that a typical PC looked like this on the *front* side, let alone the cables on the back. It wasn't until windows/glass panels/RGB that anyone even thought to make it look cool. Now planning out the aesthetics is one of the most fun parts of PC building IMO
I love how Linus and co spent years and tons of money building up faraday cages, power supply testing, network infrastructure, office buildout, graphics card test databases, and everything in between, but they still drag stuff out to some overgrown back porch to blow something out with some air.
I presume if this does catch on, there would be a standardised layout, specifically because case manufacturers would prefer to have only one case design, rather having a different case design for each brand or having to specialize to one motherboard manufacturer.
Agreed, should be a standardised form factor. Call it something like ATX-R (ATX reversed) and so on for all the other standard form factors, with set regulations for the connector placement
The CPU Fan header on the back would be great for AIO/water-cooled. If AIO manufacturers started putting the AIO pump cabled higher on the loop (like close to the radiator rather than right by the water block), it'd look completely cableless.
Maingear was pushing for this and Patented it almost a decade ago and released licensing fees I guess so now there is a push to use it. Its also a symptom of ATX standard not coming together to make proper revisions to the standard, alot of things are held back due to backwards compatibility, and they really need to do a radial redesign and just break it once and come into unifying standards.
Just for the avoidance of doubt, you can also get 24-pin connector right angle adapters, guys. And for pretty much everything else. If boards like this become mainstream you'll see those supplied with cables or even the motherboard itself, eventually.
I am all for this, assuming that A, a standardized system is established that works universally and accounts for high profile connectors with back-side right-angle headers, and B, that backwards compatibility allowances also continue to exist on both cases and motherboards.
@@chase5298who cares what you think? Who cares what I think? Who cares what Linus thinks? Why even come to the comments if you’re unwilling to be open to an opinion?
"they are happily married and probably wrestling over a keycap color scheme" 🤣🤣🤣🤣 i'm not jealous but this couple is one of the most realistic and beautiful ones i've ever seen on the internet.
it looks good but i was never really against cables, they were always minimal if routed properly and it was a way to give some more color to your case and make it blend in well with some custom cables. however this does look good but i am indeed concerned about how things will match and if we are gonna be able to use every motherboard in every case or not.
The obvious answer is for the mobo backplates to be a standardised "mesh" wide enough to fit all the standoffs. Call it about an inch wide strip both sides of the standoffs. Should be wide enough to maintain its integrity even with cheap stamped and rolled steel. Then, within that area, the connectors can be wherever they like. So can any m2 devices. Call it ATX '23 or something. (I like the idea of using years for versions)
1) I want that Clear Driver! 2) what do you guys do with all your builds? Do you tear then down and use the components in other systems that you build?
For GPU power, they could put a connector on the end of the card like EVGA did for some of the 3000 series cards. Then you could use a 90 degree adapter to route the cable to the back of the case so you wouldn't see the cable at all, the the adapter.
In my opinion, cables (thanks to brands like CableMod) are one of the most customizable parts of a computer and with good cable management can make a great looking PC that shows off your style.
Beautiful build. I love those Fractal Pop cases. They're really well constructed for the price and easy to build in (minus the dremel anyway). But one of my favorite things was replacing that bottom front 5.25in cover with a 3d-printed cover containing a 5.5in touch screen (it's overkill at 1440p, but didn't find anything else on Waveshare that fit as nicely). Fractal should really offer that as a kit like the Jonsbo D41.
I didn't think modern cases with good cable management looked that bad to begin with. I have an old NZXT with a channel running down the middle with a cover and cables really don't even stick out that much. Seems like overkill to move them to the back for just a little less clutter, but it is a nice look either way.
Hey @Map71Vette - looks like you've been here the day this video released. Do you by any chance remember if the "Disclaiiimeeer!" about Linus and Yvonne in the beginning has been there on release day? I'm just asking because I've seen people in the comment sections of other videos honestly worried about this, debating if it was a joke or not. I've just now watched this video for the first time but I can't imagine how anyone would have taken that joke seriously if the disclaimer was already present. Cheers, and thanks in advance should you or someone else reply!
So I'm trying to figure out if all they did was install the connectors from the back. In which case you could theoretically do this yourself with any board.
Better PCIe locks for GPUs needs to happen already. Just having to do something that should be as simple as swapping an M.2 drive is ridiculous. I also prefer the back facing cable trend that has started but not for aesthetics, it again makes things easier for doing maintenance. I hate having to remove a massive air cooler I just installed because I didn't plug in the fan to the mobo first
If they're actually going to make these, the connectors should be right-angle... Other than that this is awesome. Much easier to plug cables in. No more forgetting 8-pin CPU connectors before you mount the heat sink. While they're at it, also put the M.2s on the back. Swapping out drives without removing the GPU.
I think that this form factor could've been better, if they just made click in modules that bring the ports to the back, or better yet, a single plug that goes into a master module that goes in the back like 12V0 where you plug the ports into a module mounted to the back or under the basement. That way there's one connector to rule them all.
this is almost my exact build (basically just had an aio instead), then he turned it around and the wires were actually white as well and had so much better cable management and he called it a hot mess and i cried
I have the MSI Meg z-690 Ace. That board you have there is GORGEOUS! I LOVE the idea of this, and it seems like it would make the whole build easier. I hope this is available over here in time. Also, I LOVE my Fractal Define-7 in White!
But that would mean they can't charge extra for a proprietary setup, so it won't happen. Look at Corsair's new fans and hubs they just launched all proprietary and $50 fans.
The premium for cableless front is still there, especially when the cables are more tightly packed at the rear, reducing dust buildup via those plastic-covered dust magnet
As long as this doesn't become the *only* option in the gaming PC space in the future, I'm all for it! Personally I quite like cables. Cable management is one of the satisfying parts about PC building, and you can choose braided cables, use cable combs, its all part of it! This would also take all of the skill out of building a clean looking machine. Which is a shame.
Yeah while these mobos with hidden connectors are cool there is also something satisfying planning your cable routes. I am waiting for new GPU to arrive and already planning the new cable routing since im going from 1x8pin to 2x8pin -> 16pin adapter.
Have a removeable motherboard tray, with either an included secondary tray that is designed for this new motherboard standard included in the both, or is available for purchase on the case manufacturers website.
Superficially, it shouldn't be THAT hard to design the motherboard tray to work with back-facing controllers. Have reinforced U-beams diagonally to where the corner motherboard screws would leave huge gaps for the back-facing connectors.
Now imagine if manufacturers could invert all the headers and connectors upside down. Most cases front panel connectors are at the top, so instead of 8pin CPU connectors have front panels, usb2 and fan headers (fans are also mostly front/top/rear of the case). And then CPU EPS 8pin connectors on the bottom, mere couple inches above power supply. PSU cables for CPU 8pin could then be like 6 inches long, saving space and cost of materials and time to manufacture, potentially saving a few bucks per PSU
In my opinion, only the cables that connect to the power supply should be on the back of the board (and ones like fan and rgb headers can stay on the front), but this seems like a good idea
Ultimately, in my opinion I think it should come down to a person’s preference, if you like the cables in the front them manufacturers should continue doing what they have been doing. If you like them in the back then manufacturers should also make boards and cases for persons who want that
I really hope you start selling that clear screwdriver soon. I also think a transparent purple or transparent green would be amazing (and remind people of N64 controllers).
Not sure why this is exciting, but in the alternate angle of the cut at 6:22, was filmed a second time. The 2nd clip starts with him holding the already cut cord and pretending to cut it again. It's close, but they should have checked his arm/hand position to make it near seamless :D. "Alright Linus. We got that, but we need to get it again from another angle. Just put the wire up against the cooler. They won't know." or Linus needed a bathroom break.😅
The thing I like most about computers is their repair ability and parts changing. Computers are unbelievably easy to fix and upgrade. I have never understood why the inside of the computer has to be so clean and pretty.
Linus could lobby for case manufacturers to adopt standardized mounting points and reincorporate interchangeable motherboard trays that are compatible with all PC cases, that way Asus and MSI can continue being as weird as they are.
I hope the connectors on back of the motherboard thing is just a short fad and won't become too widespread. I prioritize structually stable cases and to see how much space the connectors need and how much less metal there would be, even with properly made cases for it, it makes me worried about the rigidity of the whole assembly. Especially since we already have a lot of GPU sack nowadays, there would be more flexing behind the motherboard, which would result in more play with the GPU as well. Also then there's a massive worry of heavier air coolers, they already seriously stress the motherboard, I don't think more play there is a good idea. You could say less metal is enough, but just think how much weight the metal behind motherboard has to actually carry, it's surprisingly lot. Also people going to lans or bringing their pc to their friends would have to be even more careful while carrying the case, and it already is dangerous and has destroyed some motherboards and GPU's due to carrying and laying the pc on the ground. Anyway to be honest, more options is a good thing, if this is just an niche option and most of the hardware would be made normally, I'm okay with that, since people who like this would have more options and I think that's nice. I just wouldn't want this to become the default at some point, but I don't think it will, since this is so different and not to everyone's tastes.
I am just waiting for CASES to have all the power conduits built in and MBs just plug into them. The only cables you will need would be for things like GPUs. If the board makers can decided on a standard layout we could be seeing DIY PC building be easier than ever.
Why not specify a Standart size for the motherboard tray that case manufacturers and the Mainboard manufacturers agree on and then have the motherboard manufacturers supply them like with the io shields?
Hard white plastic tubing meant for water cooling would look good to dress that PCIe power cable. You could also bend it U-shaped to have it dump out the bottom/backside of the pipe. Hard to explain in text.
This feels like the beauty covers under your car hood moment. You can do what you want for your aesthetic. I won't even judge that but it does lead to compromised other functions.
I continue my tradition of rebuilding my tower, in the same modded AeroFlo mATX case, that has shown its worth. All wiring, running from the PSU connector(s) until the component connector(s), are sharply laid out, shortened to length, and terminated neat & properly. Thus, there is no excess wiring to deal with! I am Old School!
There are a lot background story about this motherboard, aside from It's aesthetic and easy to do cable management: Chinese buyers attends to buy pre-builds from online shops (online market are individual shop based instead of goods based like Amazon) Ancient Ape have a pretty big shop in the market and he is a big streamer so he can convince case & board manufacture (like Asus msi and SAMA) to produce such thing, it will be highlighted in his store and in his vids, sells will be at least 30K or so, btw the price are about the same with normal mATX board or case mATX and the case have around 70% share on DIY market in China, only volume like this can back such a starter, other boards like YTX may come out if this sells good. And if reaction is good, other manufacture will naturally follow the standard. The board was his dream to create a cable-less computer, this are the best result for an individual can do.
so you get custom cables for the back of the pc where you just wont see them, then use an ugly black average power connector for the gpu, its the little things that annoy me, especially when u go so far to have an aesthetically pleasing build
I don't get the hate. We need to rout every cable to the back of the case already, wouldn't it be easier if the connector are already all there? That new Corsair PSY with the connectors on the side is also a nice addition to the trend. Manufacturers probably don't give a shit and just want people to find dumb reasons to upgrade, but for builders and enthusiasts it is actually a good thing on the long run.
The biggest issues I see are that expansion is a pain, there's a lot of wasted space, and if this catches on it might fragment the market. But this isn't a bad idea if everything is purpose-built.
My suggestions: 1) Use 3 high-current cables for 5V, 3V, and GND instead of 24 + 12 wires. 2) use USB to link to the power supply 3) have an (encrypted) data-over-power for comms between the monitor to PC. This would allow monitors to have low-speed bluetooth for kb + mouse, PC power-on from the monitor (yeah I know this is possible with CEC). To be clear, the data would travel over the A/C powerline thru the power supply back to USB.
I wish that this was more common. Yes it clearly has downsides, but the biggest upside is that it's so much easier to see all your connectors. Me as someone who sometimes does something with hardware (occasional maintenance, replace cooler, at times build my own PC once every few years), I dread doing anything with cables in that chaotic mess in the front. Now that cooling pads/blocks are becoming more popular, even my tiny fingers have issues reach some cables or plugs. Just give me the backside for all cables. For all I care we go for more square builds where the motherboard is laying flat, but with the PSU+cables below it in a way where you can easily access all off them without having to route them to the front through tiny spaces. and somehow now make them get stuck in anything. Maybe this way cables can become shorter so I don't have half the cable length of what I actually use, requiring less cable management in general. I get why cases and motherboards are the way they are, but perhaps it's time to deviate from the standard "tower" concept with the motherboard being vertical, and make more use of the vertical space, with the bottom being a "maintenance shaft" for the plugs, cables, and all the other stuff you don't want to see.
My company is designing a completely wireless PC set up. It communicates and powers CPU cooling/pump and fan speed, GPU power,pump/fan speed, case fan power and speed, motherboard power, lighting, HDDs are wireless in power and communication, as well as the power and reset buttons are wireless. The only wires are wall outlet to power supply and the GPU to monitor. Think along the lines of wireless charging but capable within 3 feet.
Im with paul. It was really take a step backwards when it comes to case compatibility and even more cable issues with sockets and bending and not seating.
If money were no object, I would update my NAS setup, to max TB size of 4 or 6 bays. User friendly not rack. If CPU/Ram could be updated on it to max. Make it cooled on a laptop cooling tray. Then get a themed desktop, I have a cyberpower laptop and its ok, but I recently started using NAS to run games off of. And well, its a space saver when my Firecuda SSHD died on me. Only 8 yrs to die but it had a good run. The dreams I have. Are huge. I wish money was never a issue. Epic video as always Linus!
I feel like the last 20+ years has just been a continual effort to make our computers look less and less like computers. As an Old, I like it when my computer looks like a computer. You can hide your power supply cables away so they don't break up the aesthetic of your sleek glass box full of RGB lighting if you want to. I miss the days when my power supply cables were color-coded so that I could tell at a glance what voltage was being carried on which wire.
I wouldn't mind seeing the GPU power connector being on the same side as the PCI-E. Sit it back a bit, and bundle it with a right-angled connector for maximum clean
The side panel on the PC case is meant to hide the insides, so I don't see the point in then hiding the insides within another separate area. My PC is just a black box, and any mess within it is only for me to see when I upgrade parts.
![BAK Jay - Find Out (For Your Love) [Official Music Video]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/10FJO_XBCvY/mqdefault.jpg)
That clear ltt screwdriver looks amazing🔥
Was scrolling down to find this, surprised it took this long.
Special edition?
@@zatoichi5049 Looks like there will be a "JerryRigEverything" edition.
@@ricardobarantini oh. I had heard them mention that on the Wan show, but I expected blue trim piece. I love the clear tho
Here before this flies
Modding 101, use low tack(like painter's) tape to cover the surface you're about to cut. Helps reduce debris and easy to draw your lines on.
Yes. For guys who have been doing 'mods' for many years, you'd think they'd know these useful tricks.
its not just modding 101, just general pro tip when cutting metal. Heck, i do it for anything that i cut with a small cut off wheel
Just curious how would it reduce debris, the tape would reduce debris if it were double sided, the cuttings would stick to that but single sided tape you already have the glue side stuck to the metal, if anything you are increasing the debris as you are cutting more material ie metal and also tape. The reason I use tape when cutting is that marking lines to cut on is easier and if you slip and the cutting wheel jumps out of the cut you may avoid scratchs if they are light enough and don't cut thru the tape.
@@tomsparks2294its more about how much of that debris accumulates to the sides of the cut - that is what produces a shitty edge. When you tape down the material, there is less material jumping out of the cut to the sides, becoming accumulated debris on the sides. The only thing the material can do is is either be taken out of the cut by the blade, or stay under the tape to the sides. So it's not so much about catching stuff thats flying away, but more about keeping it from curling off to the sides to the sides in the first place. Of course because tape is still soft material you still have some amount of debris accumulating around your cut, but this is the idea and it works relatively well.
Won't the tape melt and blow plastic bits everywhere?
that cable management is not a hot mess lmao thats actually pretty good
The whole point of having everything around back is not to care how it looks.
you gotta remember that this is per linus's standards
Also absolutely inconsequential functionally
You need to manage the cables at the back?
If that's a hot mess my cable management is a dumpster fire, which it is tbh.
Id personally love to see cables in a system taken to the other extreme:
hardline cables
make the cables part of the appeal like with hardline water-cooling through custom pcbs / power distribution blocks instead of wiggly wires. imo it would be a really badass addition to an all out balls to the wall type build
Damn amazing idea actually
Sounds really cool but you'd probably have to develop a way to cut and shape the cables like hard-line tubing.
bruh I thought this was a joke 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 Are you stupid? This is the worst idea I have ever read
yeah ok "bubba"
@@carinthesunset1971 I don't think it would be that difficult. I think you'd just need bare solid core copper wire. solid core copper wire is easily bendable and you could cut and solder it if you wanted. Then you could either air gap the cables or sleeve/heat shrink them individually. Yes, the solution is stupid, but so is "hard line cables" imo.
I appreciate that Fractal makes a windowless version of the pop air, and most of their other cases. Don't have to worry about your cables looking nice and no risk of glass breaking.
I agree. The solution to hide your cable "mess" is called an opaque box. :D
And then hide the box.
@@michael_baron Hell, my PC looks perfectly fine, and I keep it on the floor and never look inside. Noise is *less* of a problem (still a problem) when it's not in your face, and I don't want the distracting glow of LEDs on my desk. Besides, it would occupy a lot of room.
except it's only on the black, not white
And sadly not an option on the Pop Mini Air, in black or white.
man if Linus considers this bad, he should see how I've wired the inside of my Hyte y60 case.
it's terrible.
So relatable
He turned it around and i was like, ooh, ooh no, is that that bad?
As someone who just build in the y60 last night, can confirm I dont wanna go back there. But the watercooling looks nice 😅
The cabling in my y60 was solid when I first built it. A couple upgrades later, I don’t wanna talk about it.
we should tag him on all our platforms with our real world cable management and help him re-calibrate expectations or... just roast us like we deserve 🤣🤣
I share the same concerns as Paul, there will need to be some regulation to it if manufactures go this route and it will absolutely kill compatibility with cases as well, I am using a case that is over 15 years old still and I wouldn't replace it if I can avoid it.
Simple just take a Dremal to make holes for the cables. Only thing that you must do before cutting is mark the spots then cut.
Why dont they just design a nice backplate of the mobo and flip everything around?
@@Dragon6687 Did you even watch the video? You have to cut away 90% of the material, and are left with sharp edges everywhere. "jUsT dReMeL iT" Or how about we stop doing the shit that enables these companies to make rampantly anti consumer decisions? The only reason nVIDIA charged $1600USD for a 4090 is because they knew people would pay it. Stop simping for corporations making things worse for the end user.
Im all for compatibility but innovation will never happen if we always cater to decade old standards
@@verakoo6187 This, we will have to eventually move on if we want any improvements, personally I would love this, together with a new standard for SATA that covers both the power and data transmission in one cable that isn't a pain to install, even if cases overall become wider, because I would also love HDD bays in the back to be more common place.
Personally I don't see how Paul's criticism is an issue at all, unless it's a really small and older small form factor case I don't see the cables not fitting, the cooling is just false advertising and has nothing to do with the approach itself, and as far as compatibility goes would they still not use the same power connectors anyway?
What would be MUCH better is if they put all connectors along the edges of the board and have the entire board sit recessed into the tray so the visible tray walls are flush with the board height (hard to standardise that though), hiding all cables without the need for angled adapters OR extra space in the rear. Kind of how they currently do in some cases with the SATA cable area, whereby the right hand side chamber wall is slightly raised so the cables come out sideways rather than straight up, but just extend the walls to butt up to the board edge and set a standardised board height eg 2cm.
I think one of the issues is going to be the cases - and not just to adopt "a" standard. Right now, I can fit mATX, ATX, maybe "eATX" in the same case. But with the connectors on the back, they'd all need to be cut out in different areas - which means multiple cases for multiple motherboard sizes, not just one that can be used for many (unless they find a way to cluster them all in the back in the same area, which I can see causing other MB design problems.)
This. The main reason why this will not be adopted nor deployed to the masses. Full ATX cases are attractive to many seasoned and new builders because of re-usability and compatibility to smaller boards (M-ATX and M-ITX) should there be a need for one in the future. Heck... the same goes for M-ATX cases for M-ITX use cases. If cut outs for different board sizes are made (for example) on future cases to adopt such standards of having rear connectors, it will affect the structural sturdiness of the internal frame that holds the motherboard - we all know that enthusiast CPU coolers and GPUs aren't getting any lighter. Lastly, building on APE boards will cause for the motherboard to bend more when installing CPU blocks and memory - the connectors just sticks out. Whereas, the current standard still bends mobos but not THAT much.
Yep, this needs to be rolled into a new ATX revision if it's going to see wide adoption.
I think it could be reasonable to have the holes be cutouts like with those metal GPU strips at the back of most cases. Then you can push them out as needed for the mobo you're going to use.
@@inquisitormuchly3199 I don't expext that to be a major issue, mATX is the same width as ATX, the board is just shorter, but the power connectors are never on the bottom anyways, so that doesn't really affect much of anything. If they put holes along the bottom edge of where an m-atx board would go for front panel, usb, etc. it would be covered when an ATX board is used, and there are already holes along the bottom edge of where an ATX board goes so that doesn't really change things. It would make it so if you put an itx board in a full atx case there are some additional unsightly holes visible, but how many people are actually putting itx boards in full atx cases and care about appearance anyways? You pay a premium for the ITX board and you lose out on a lot of features and connectivity vs matx or atx, so you probably aren't buying an itx board unless you are going to put it in an itx case anyways.
I think there's a way around this. You can just standardise a thicker backplate where just about all the material is cut away and only the few bits remain that are needed to hold the standoffs, and the connections between them. The mainboard manufacturer is then free to use all the rest of the area to place connectors where needed.
I think the point we're at currently with cable management is very good. I distinctly remember the nightmare I went through cable managing my OG Antec 900 with a non-modular PSU. These days, most competent mid-tower cases are chocked full of cable management options that make building a clean PC pretty easy. Dealing with the backside takes time if you care, but it's generally only something you do once a year at most. I see way too many compatibility nightmares with this new configuration. Plus, a few cables on the top side has absolutely no meaningful effect on airflow.
I agree. Cases used to be opaque for a reason.... They had a lot of cables to hide.
I still have my antec 900 in my closet, that's funny.
it wasn't that long ago that a typical PC looked like this on the *front* side, let alone the cables on the back. It wasn't until windows/glass panels/RGB that anyone even thought to make it look cool. Now planning out the aesthetics is one of the most fun parts of PC building IMO
I will spread ur cheeks lil bro 😭😭🙏🙏 I betta not catch you ivvsn my comments again or it's finna gon be OVER for you 👾
@@christianmino4073 He wants to smash
I love how Linus and co spent years and tons of money building up faraday cages, power supply testing, network infrastructure, office buildout, graphics card test databases, and everything in between, but they still drag stuff out to some overgrown back porch to blow something out with some air.
I presume if this does catch on, there would be a standardised layout, specifically because case manufacturers would prefer to have only one case design, rather having a different case design for each brand or having to specialize to one motherboard manufacturer.
Agreed, should be a standardised form factor. Call it something like ATX-R (ATX reversed) and so on for all the other standard form factors, with set regulations for the connector placement
There wont be a standardized layout if they think it can drive more sales
removable and replaceable motherboard trays.
@@backgammonbacon Or just cut the back holes in every case. Then they'd be sufficient for either standard.
The CPU Fan header on the back would be great for AIO/water-cooled. If AIO manufacturers started putting the AIO pump cabled higher on the loop (like close to the radiator rather than right by the water block), it'd look completely cableless.
There is likely a non-negligible bonus to airflow in the case due to the cables being out of the way. The amount of turbulence in the case matters.
That transparent ltt screwdriver is looking amazing
Only 70 bucks.
There was a transparent screwdriver? I didn't see it.
@@Tech-Tempest 12:43 bottom of the screen
@@spammerscammerit's probably going to be much more since it's a special edition
Maingear was pushing for this and Patented it almost a decade ago and released licensing fees I guess so now there is a push to use it.
Its also a symptom of ATX standard not coming together to make proper revisions to the standard, alot of things are held back due to backwards compatibility, and they really need to do a radial redesign and just break it once and come into unifying standards.
Just for the avoidance of doubt, you can also get 24-pin connector right angle adapters, guys. And for pretty much everything else. If boards like this become mainstream you'll see those supplied with cables or even the motherboard itself, eventually.
2:15
That is a really smart PSU design though. Even if the plugs are still at the front of the board this helps moving cables along the backside.
I am all for this, assuming that A, a standardized system is established that works universally and accounts for high profile connectors with back-side right-angle headers, and B, that backwards compatibility allowances also continue to exist on both cases and motherboards.
Between the case compatibility nightmare and the fact that I like custom cables as an accent piece, this trend is going to be a hard pass for me
who cares what you think?
@@chase5298who cares what you think of what they think, and for that matter who cares what I think of what you think of what they think…
@@ryancruickshank1868 Based
@@chase5298The manufacturers, if the trend doesn’t take off.
@@chase5298who cares what you think? Who cares what I think? Who cares what Linus thinks? Why even come to the comments if you’re unwilling to be open to an opinion?
"they are happily married and probably wrestling over a keycap color scheme" 🤣🤣🤣🤣
i'm not jealous but this couple is one of the most realistic and beautiful ones i've ever seen on the internet.
it looks good but i was never really against cables, they were always minimal if routed properly and it was a way to give some more color to your case and make it blend in well with some custom cables. however this does look good but i am indeed concerned about how things will match and if we are gonna be able to use every motherboard in every case or not.
The obvious answer is for the mobo backplates to be a standardised "mesh" wide enough to fit all the standoffs.
Call it about an inch wide strip both sides of the standoffs. Should be wide enough to maintain its integrity even with cheap stamped and rolled steel.
Then, within that area, the connectors can be wherever they like. So can any m2 devices.
Call it ATX '23 or something. (I like the idea of using years for versions)
1) I want that Clear Driver! 2) what do you guys do with all your builds? Do you tear then down and use the components in other systems that you build?
For GPU power, they could put a connector on the end of the card like EVGA did for some of the 3000 series cards. Then you could use a 90 degree adapter to route the cable to the back of the case so you wouldn't see the cable at all, the the adapter.
I want one on the other side so you cant see anything
@@Simon-tr9hv
I know
They should have an option when you buy it 😀
@@Simon-tr9hv
No they have to design it not me 😋
I personally have been waiting for this I use all kinds of connectors that keep the cables from coming threw the case and give it a cleaner look.
In my opinion, cables (thanks to brands like CableMod) are one of the most customizable parts of a computer and with good cable management can make a great looking PC that shows off your style.
Why does it look like that webcam is blurry AF
Beautiful build. I love those Fractal Pop cases. They're really well constructed for the price and easy to build in (minus the dremel anyway). But one of my favorite things was replacing that bottom front 5.25in cover with a 3d-printed cover containing a 5.5in touch screen (it's overkill at 1440p, but didn't find anything else on Waveshare that fit as nicely). Fractal should really offer that as a kit like the Jonsbo D41.
I forgot what RUclips videos are like without any sponserblock stuff
I didn't think modern cases with good cable management looked that bad to begin with. I have an old NZXT with a channel running down the middle with a cover and cables really don't even stick out that much. Seems like overkill to move them to the back for just a little less clutter, but it is a nice look either way.
Hey @Map71Vette - looks like you've been here the day this video released. Do you by any chance remember if the "Disclaiiimeeer!" about Linus and Yvonne in the beginning has been there on release day? I'm just asking because I've seen people in the comment sections of other videos honestly worried about this, debating if it was a joke or not. I've just now watched this video for the first time but I can't imagine how anyone would have taken that joke seriously if the disclaimer was already present. Cheers, and thanks in advance should you or someone else reply!
But the cables for CPU and GPU power supply would still stick from the backward to the forward and not so easy to plug in, that's the point.
I feel like rear connectors should be an option but not the default. There is something beautiful to me about wires
standart doesnt mean default.
But its a stupid idea anyways.
So I'm trying to figure out if all they did was install the connectors from the back. In which case you could theoretically do this yourself with any board.
20:54 I'd say that sponsor segues are pretty darn standardized at this point 😂
Better PCIe locks for GPUs needs to happen already. Just having to do something that should be as simple as swapping an M.2 drive is ridiculous. I also prefer the back facing cable trend that has started but not for aesthetics, it again makes things easier for doing maintenance. I hate having to remove a massive air cooler I just installed because I didn't plug in the fan to the mobo first
I cant wait for this to become another proprietary standard.
same
I think it will stabilize once one company makes a case with enough cutouts for all the standards.
or no i like the cables more
As someone who's job is about teaching safety awareness...I appreciate Linus taking that moment to upgrade his PPE to a face shield...Good Job Linus 👍
Then I'm sure you would appreciate it if he used that tool correctly and stayed away from the projections....
@@mouzz baby steps
What I want are Hardline power cable mods that will effectively optimize the runs of cables with zero snag
😂😂😂😂 The "Disclaimer!* In the beginning was absolutely the best
If they're actually going to make these, the connectors should be right-angle...
Other than that this is awesome. Much easier to plug cables in. No more forgetting 8-pin CPU connectors before you mount the heat sink.
While they're at it, also put the M.2s on the back. Swapping out drives without removing the GPU.
Every time I see DIY-APE's products I get excited. I really hope they get a lot of traction with these products.
I think that this form factor could've been better, if they just made click in modules that bring the ports to the back, or better yet, a single plug that goes into a master module that goes in the back like 12V0 where you plug the ports into a module mounted to the back or under the basement. That way there's one connector to rule them all.
I drilled a hole in the wall and put my PCs in the other room so I never have to look at (or hear) them anyway. 😁
this is almost my exact build (basically just had an aio instead), then he turned it around and the wires were actually white as well and had so much better cable management and he called it a hot mess and i cried
I have the MSI Meg z-690 Ace. That board you have there is GORGEOUS! I LOVE the idea of this, and it seems like it would make the whole build easier. I hope this is available over here in time. Also, I LOVE my Fractal Define-7 in White!
If all manufacturers come together and make this as a variant of the ATX standard i can see this becoming popular
Exactly a standard must be set and it can be a proper offering from any manufacturer interested
But that would mean they can't charge extra for a proprietary setup, so it won't happen. Look at Corsair's new fans and hubs they just launched all proprietary and $50 fans.
The premium for cableless front is still there, especially when the cables are more tightly packed at the rear, reducing dust buildup via those plastic-covered dust magnet
As long as this doesn't become the *only* option in the gaming PC space in the future, I'm all for it!
Personally I quite like cables. Cable management is one of the satisfying parts about PC building, and you can choose braided cables, use cable combs, its all part of it!
This would also take all of the skill out of building a clean looking machine. Which is a shame.
Yeah while these mobos with hidden connectors are cool there is also something satisfying planning your cable routes. I am waiting for new GPU to arrive and already planning the new cable routing since im going from 1x8pin to 2x8pin -> 16pin adapter.
Have a removeable motherboard tray, with either an included secondary tray that is designed for this new motherboard standard included in the both, or is available for purchase on the case manufacturers website.
Superficially, it shouldn't be THAT hard to design the motherboard tray to work with back-facing controllers. Have reinforced U-beams diagonally to where the corner motherboard screws would leave huge gaps for the back-facing connectors.
The NexiGo footage looks so bad, lost all my interest in it.
The autofocus is absolutely horrible and there's terrible blurriness whenever there's something moving (like a person's face).
Now imagine if manufacturers could invert all the headers and connectors upside down. Most cases front panel connectors are at the top, so instead of 8pin CPU connectors have front panels, usb2 and fan headers (fans are also mostly front/top/rear of the case). And then CPU EPS 8pin connectors on the bottom, mere couple inches above power supply. PSU cables for CPU 8pin could then be like 6 inches long, saving space and cost of materials and time to manufacture, potentially saving a few bucks per PSU
Don't hide cables, let them breathe
I need to get some of those metal fans, hopefully they have good static pressure for water cooling
Alternate option where you won't see any cables: solid side panel
cool PC but that NexiGo footage looks hella awful lol
In my opinion, only the cables that connect to the power supply should be on the back of the board (and ones like fan and rgb headers can stay on the front), but this seems like a good idea
Ultimately, in my opinion I think it should come down to a person’s preference, if you like the cables in the front them manufacturers should continue doing what they have been doing. If you like them in the back then manufacturers should also make boards and cases for persons who want that
I really hope you start selling that clear screwdriver soon. I also think a transparent purple or transparent green would be amazing (and remind people of N64 controllers).
Not sure why this is exciting, but in the alternate angle of the cut at 6:22, was filmed a second time. The 2nd clip starts with him holding the already cut cord and pretending to cut it again. It's close, but they should have checked his arm/hand position to make it near seamless :D.
"Alright Linus. We got that, but we need to get it again from another angle. Just put the wire up against the cooler. They won't know." or Linus needed a bathroom break.😅
The thing I like most about computers is their repair ability and parts changing. Computers are unbelievably easy to fix and upgrade. I have never understood why the inside of the computer has to be so clean and pretty.
Linus could lobby for case manufacturers to adopt standardized mounting points and reincorporate interchangeable motherboard trays that are compatible with all PC cases, that way Asus and MSI can continue being as weird as they are.
I hope the connectors on back of the motherboard thing is just a short fad and won't become too widespread. I prioritize structually stable cases and to see how much space the connectors need and how much less metal there would be, even with properly made cases for it, it makes me worried about the rigidity of the whole assembly. Especially since we already have a lot of GPU sack nowadays, there would be more flexing behind the motherboard, which would result in more play with the GPU as well. Also then there's a massive worry of heavier air coolers, they already seriously stress the motherboard, I don't think more play there is a good idea. You could say less metal is enough, but just think how much weight the metal behind motherboard has to actually carry, it's surprisingly lot. Also people going to lans or bringing their pc to their friends would have to be even more careful while carrying the case, and it already is dangerous and has destroyed some motherboards and GPU's due to carrying and laying the pc on the ground. Anyway to be honest, more options is a good thing, if this is just an niche option and most of the hardware would be made normally, I'm okay with that, since people who like this would have more options and I think that's nice. I just wouldn't want this to become the default at some point, but I don't think it will, since this is so different and not to everyone's tastes.
BEAUTIFUL! Maybe now I can finally build my dream looking PC! Where the only visible things are the hardware itself and the tubing. No cables AT ALL!
Compared to the rats nest in the back of my case, that "hot mess" looks really good.
No we need gpu extensions they are part of the aesthetics
Nicet to see people start to agree
@@enyboiwhy did you reply to yourself?
@@Minimal_M I don't touch grass and I don't know
@12:08 *Pushes exactly where and how he shouldn't* * is surprised something breaks* Love linus hahah
I am just waiting for CASES to have all the power conduits built in and MBs just plug into them. The only cables you will need would be for things like GPUs. If the board makers can decided on a standard layout we could be seeing DIY PC building be easier than ever.
Why not specify a Standart size for the motherboard tray that case manufacturers and the Mainboard manufacturers agree on and then have the motherboard manufacturers supply them like with the io shields?
That cable is a no go and the Dremel reminds me of my Chieftec. Man i loved browsing those diy sites. Kinda miss em
Hard white plastic tubing meant for water cooling would look good to dress that PCIe power cable.
You could also bend it U-shaped to have it dump out the bottom/backside of the pipe. Hard to explain in text.
The board wobble is a feature, not a bug. It's a flexible mounting mechanism that reduces vibration noise!
This feels like the beauty covers under your car hood moment. You can do what you want for your aesthetic. I won't even judge that but it does lead to compromised other functions.
I continue my tradition of rebuilding my tower, in the same modded AeroFlo mATX case, that has shown its worth. All wiring, running from the PSU connector(s) until the component connector(s), are sharply laid out, shortened to length, and terminated neat & properly. Thus, there is no excess wiring to deal with! I am Old School!
1:13 "...the janky adventure you're about to watch, is brought to you by _Mexico!"_
That's what I heard and the subtitles heard. It's canon now lol
love how linus had the blade spinning in the wrong direction on the dremel and put a face shield on instead of just rotating his hand 180 degrees
There are a lot background story about this motherboard, aside from It's aesthetic and easy to do cable management:
Chinese buyers attends to buy pre-builds from online shops (online market are individual shop based instead of goods based like Amazon)
Ancient Ape have a pretty big shop in the market and he is a big streamer
so he can convince case & board manufacture (like Asus msi and SAMA) to produce such thing, it will be highlighted in his store and in his vids, sells will be at least 30K or so, btw the price are about the same with normal mATX board or case
mATX and the case have around 70% share on DIY market in China, only volume like this can back such a starter, other boards like YTX may come out if this sells good. And if reaction is good, other manufacture will naturally follow the standard.
The board was his dream to create a cable-less computer, this are the best result for an individual can do.
Some very nice cable management is very eye candy as well, I'll be not using this trend but I respect who wants to.
so you get custom cables for the back of the pc where you just wont see them, then use an ugly black average power connector for the gpu, its the little things that annoy me, especially when u go so far to have an aesthetically pleasing build
@12:58 - your editors put up with so much crap, I love it. Well done!
Aah pins on the backside. So you can bend them as you try to install your CPU. Sounds like fun :D
I don't get the hate. We need to rout every cable to the back of the case already, wouldn't it be easier if the connector are already all there? That new Corsair PSY with the connectors on the side is also a nice addition to the trend.
Manufacturers probably don't give a shit and just want people to find dumb reasons to upgrade, but for builders and enthusiasts it is actually a good thing on the long run.
Those gaskety things are called pinch welds. Properly done you can clean up dremel cut edges and make it look really nice.
i haven't finished the video yet but i how linus talks about that clear version of the screw driver, it looks soooo clean. give me a release date??
The biggest issues I see are that expansion is a pain, there's a lot of wasted space, and if this catches on it might fragment the market. But this isn't a bad idea if everything is purpose-built.
17:07 "There once was a ship that put to sea..."
My suggestions:
1) Use 3 high-current cables for 5V, 3V, and GND instead of 24 + 12 wires.
2) use USB to link to the power supply
3) have an (encrypted) data-over-power for comms between the monitor to PC. This would allow monitors to have low-speed bluetooth for kb + mouse, PC power-on from the monitor (yeah I know this is possible with CEC). To be clear, the data would travel over the A/C powerline thru the power supply back to USB.
I wish that this was more common. Yes it clearly has downsides, but the biggest upside is that it's so much easier to see all your connectors. Me as someone who sometimes does something with hardware (occasional maintenance, replace cooler, at times build my own PC once every few years), I dread doing anything with cables in that chaotic mess in the front. Now that cooling pads/blocks are becoming more popular, even my tiny fingers have issues reach some cables or plugs.
Just give me the backside for all cables. For all I care we go for more square builds where the motherboard is laying flat, but with the PSU+cables below it in a way where you can easily access all off them without having to route them to the front through tiny spaces. and somehow now make them get stuck in anything. Maybe this way cables can become shorter so I don't have half the cable length of what I actually use, requiring less cable management in general.
I get why cases and motherboards are the way they are, but perhaps it's time to deviate from the standard "tower" concept with the motherboard being vertical, and make more use of the vertical space, with the bottom being a "maintenance shaft" for the plugs, cables, and all the other stuff you don't want to see.
My company is designing a completely wireless PC set up. It communicates and powers CPU cooling/pump and fan speed, GPU power,pump/fan speed, case fan power and speed, motherboard power, lighting, HDDs are wireless in power and communication, as well as the power and reset buttons are wireless. The only wires are wall outlet to power supply and the GPU to monitor. Think along the lines of wireless charging but capable within 3 feet.
12:54 - the transparent screwdriver one looks infinitely cooler than everything you've released so far
I like how those werent linus' hands on the nexigo footage. Nice trick.
Im with paul. It was really take a step backwards when it comes to case compatibility and even more cable issues with sockets and bending and not seating.
I never understood why GPU manufacturers need to put the power connector on the window side of the card. Why not put it at the motherboard side?
I just swapped the tempered glass panel with a metal one. Entirely cable-free.
12:52 I thought that was a water bottle. I'd buy a noctua edition water bottle in a heartbeat!
On a full ATX board I can understand it. But a mini itx you loose CPU cooler height for hidden cables... So cases now get even bigger...
If money were no object, I would update my NAS setup, to max TB size of 4 or 6 bays. User friendly not rack. If CPU/Ram could be updated on it to max. Make it cooled on a laptop cooling tray. Then get a themed desktop, I have a cyberpower laptop and its ok, but I recently started using NAS to run games off of. And well, its a space saver when my Firecuda SSHD died on me. Only 8 yrs to die but it had a good run. The dreams I have. Are huge. I wish money was never a issue. Epic video as always Linus!
I feel like the last 20+ years has just been a continual effort to make our computers look less and less like computers. As an Old, I like it when my computer looks like a computer. You can hide your power supply cables away so they don't break up the aesthetic of your sleek glass box full of RGB lighting if you want to. I miss the days when my power supply cables were color-coded so that I could tell at a glance what voltage was being carried on which wire.
I wouldn't mind seeing the GPU power connector being on the same side as the PCI-E. Sit it back a bit, and bundle it with a right-angled connector for maximum clean
The side panel on the PC case is meant to hide the insides, so I don't see the point in then hiding the insides within another separate area. My PC is just a black box, and any mess within it is only for me to see when I upgrade parts.