Dispelling Myths about 3D Printing (Play on Tabletop Response)
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- Опубликовано: 28 сен 2024
- Don't miss out on these HUGE savings from Sovol 3D on your next 3D printer. Deal #8 is particularly insane!
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1. SV07 Plus: $329
2. SV07: $259
3. SV06 Plus: $309 (use code SOV20)
4. SV06: $189 (use code SOV20)
5. SV04: $379
6. Get a 50% discount on filament orders if purchase SV06 Plus
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8. Get a free SV06 if the cumulative order amount of filaments exceeds $500
I mentioned a lot of things in this video, here is my best to make sure I've provided links to each below. Please note some of these links will be affiliate links which help support the channel at no extra cost to you should you choose to make a purchase, and if I forgot something please leave a comment and I'll add the missing link asap!
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Anycubic Mono 2 Resin 3D Printer: shrsl.com/43t22
Sovol SV07 Plus: shrsl.com/4bygi
Minirater: bit.ly/minirater
Buy me a Coffee: www.buymeacoff...
Elegoo ABS-Like 2.0 Resin: shrsl.com/42dwn
Chitusystems Conjur Sculpt Resin: geni.us/fWlCYW
Creality UW-02 Wash+Cure Machine: shrsl.com/4as0f
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Vengeful Militum (space marine proxy builder): www.myminifact...
Don't miss out on these HUGE savings from Sovol 3D on your next 3D printer. Deal #8 is particularly insane!
www.sovol3d.com/
1. SV07 Plus: $329
2. SV07: $259
3. SV06 Plus: $309 (use code SOV20)
4. SV06: $189 (use code SOV20)
5. SV04: $379
6. Get a 50% discount on filament orders if purchase SV06 Plus
7. Get free 2kg filament if purchase SV04
8. Get a free SV06 if the cumulative order amount of filaments exceeds $500
More Videos like this would be great! So many people are anti 3d Printing.
Give Sunlu ABS-LIKE and/or Nylon a try. I was using Elegoo ABS-like 2.0 + ST tenacious and will be switching after the live tests people showed me. Gives incredible durability without even any added mixtures needed.
they privated the video.
I just printed out from Station Forge there version of Death Guard mutants I had no issues with the removal of supports thay came away with no problem and this was after i increased the size to 120% and printed out 20 figures so I could do a bit of figure converting all done on my Anyqubic 2K photon SE printer I have not had so much enjoyment with the painting hobbie since I purchased my first Resin Printer I now own in just 2 years since starting this journey 2 Resin printers one being a mono x 4k and 2 FDM printers kobra go and kobra plus I still support my local gaming store with purchasing Paint and Building materials but I think that the experience of owning and printing my own army's and terrain is a great feeling and can only be a positive in my eyes.
Do the 06 plus. The ABL is superior and for whatever reason they went from linear bearings to v wheel.
'"There's no hobby here" says the guy in a rustic leather hobby apron and a pet rabbit named Pippin
As much as I love 3d printing, there is one down side that is often over looked. Its not price or the technical know how (i'm fairly tech illiterate and can still print quite well), but its the space required.
You need a space with decent ventilation, enough space for your printer and cure station, space to safely store IPA(or dirty water), and this place should preferable be far away from where you eat or sleep.
You can negate some of this by using a grow tent and an in line fan system, but the lack of space to safely 3d print is a major filter to most people.
100% I’ve been living in a small flat for… too long at this point. I wish I could, just don’t have the space
Exactly, biggest hurdle for me, too. And buying 3D printed models from etsy or elsewhere is frankly not that much cheaper than GW, as all these sellers want to earn some money, too (and they should). And quality can vary from these sellers and the resin they use.
100% this. Only thing keeping me away from printing is space. I live in small flat and I'm happy that I could barely fit a tiny table into the living rom to paint my minis on.
You do not need to print yourself. You can always use the service of someone like Excellent Minis. Yes, it will be more expensive than printing yourself. Nevertheless it will be still cheaper than gw.
Agreed, I have a nice wall space for my building, painting, and even airbrushing in my small/shared apartment but I really don't have the space for a 3D printer. I buy 3D prints of Etsy or other sites instead.
3d printing just enriches the hobby the only thing that will kill GW is GW.
In the tabletop klubs where i go the 3D printer guys are always the meta chasers with unpainted minis.
So i think i disagree.
@@grosslittlegoblin1358 well that sucks but those kinda people existed long before 3d printing was around. its like everything, theres always some people that ruin things. but any tool that can be creative within a hobby such as ours is a positive imo. but i understand your point and its just one of those things that starts with good intentions but ends up getting misused sometimes.
@@grosslittlegoblin1358meta chasers has alway been a thing in 40k, long before 3d printers became viable. The biggest thing that GW did that encouraged meta chasing was getting rid of the force organisation chart in 6th edition Onwards. Force organisation charts tied up meta chasers by restricting their choices and kept things more balanced than it is now. Being tabled within the 1st 3 turns was extremely rare. Not so mich now. Also not having force organisation charts ment meta chasers could make stupid lists for small/avarage sized games, like bringing a baneblade or imperial knights or ork stompas to 1500 point game! Which is just stupid. Also ditching the rule that only troop units can hold objectives jist made it even worse!
I know this isn't the drive of this video, but I would love a series covering the things someone would need to know to 3D print that you learned in a month. You've got a whole bunch of 3D printers you can demonstrate in from different manufacturers, you have clearly mastered trouble shooting, and have a great way of presenting information. I think my fear of all that trouble shooting is the thing that puts me off the most as someone who doesn't enjoy that at all. If you did, I sure would be tempted by that sweet sweet Sovol fdm printer....
Watch his other videos, there are several about troubleshooting and supporting files yourself
@@hyosworld109yes, but having them condensed into one video would be nice
This! He keeps saying how he learned everything in a month, but every other youtuber I see is still struggling to make it work after 5 years in this video's case. Idk, it feels very daunting to see so many professionals get it wrong.
That is the part that is so disingenuous about content creators in general. Nearly none of them are subject matter experts and even less actually come from a educators background or have infield experience as mentors. They basically present their experiences/processes as facts and that you can replicate them by just 'been like them' but its not true printing has far to many variables which are glossed over or just ignored and sadly often at the cost of the end user/viewer.
As has been the standard well before the internet "Caveat Emptor" beware the snake oil salesmen as they win even as you lose.
@@JawaBob
Depending on you're mindset 3d printing can seem very daunting I my self was very hesitant and am far from being technically minded but I bit the bullet with a very well priced fdm printer just a small one from kingron I think they are called and found I learned better by doing than just watching so my advise would be take the plunge on a cheap printer that has a good reputation and learn by doing as well as taking advice from the more knowledgeable on the likes of RUclips and you'll probably find out you're not as daunted as you thought you would be
I spent 12 dollars and printed the entire marine side of the leviathan box.... pretty sure there is some savings there and the models are the exact quality of gws
You did not spend 12$. You purchased a printer and then spent time to slice/print/clean up the prints. You also spend time disposing of the printing left over in a responsible manner. Unless you dont value your time, and got a printer for free, it cost you more than 12$. There is also an underlying element here: if you printed the Leviathan box, you basically stole IP from GW. I have absolutely nothing against people printing proxies, but printing copies/scan and then complain about GW prices is a bit dishonest as the design and marketing is a huge part of their cost and when you steal their IP, you get it for free.
@AlainPilon I already purchased the box and wanted models to practice painting on, don't assume to know people's motivations.. I have had a printer for years and everything in life costs time it's redundant to say I spent time on my hobby
@@AlainPilon Wow, being a little pedantic there, aren't you? As well as rude by, basically, calling the poster a thief? Time, as a resource, is a given especially considering the hours in the same equivalent for sprues vs printed.
Also, printers are not quick disposable items. We don't, generally, get a new printer for each new collection or game we play. There is no need to factor it in once you used it, but if you do factor it in it is based into the savings.
Since you brought up costs, there is NO reason why a decade old unit of 5 (4 knights plus one upgraded), in a defective resin material costing under 2 bucks to pour a batch, should be sold at 120. These were based on the last time I wanted a unit of 10 Blood Knights for my VC list. It would be 360 for a single 10 man unit. I could get a new printer, resin, all supplies, increased electricity prices, and throw the printer away afterwards for that single unit.
@@AlainPilon RUclips keeps eating my comment with a mathematical breakdown, but tl;dr is *the more part you print, the more you can save.*
It is a fair point to consider the overhead for the actual setup in the model production, but you also have to consider that every print that costs $12 vs. $125 closes that gap of that initial overhead by over $100, and eventually you do start saving money. The proxies for tanks, for example, can cost you $20 to print versus $175 for the GW officials: print 5 or 6 tanks, and you spent less on a printer and materials than you would just buying the official models outright. Plus, you get to print as many copies of the models you like (say, for practice paints), print custom pieces to personalize your models, and can also print more than just Warhammer minis.
If you're only printing a few pieces or models here and there, it's absolutely going to be more cost-effective to just buy from GW direct. However, the printer gives you more flexibility beyond just Warhammer, and every print you do pushes the favor on cost-benefit further into the printer's favor.
@@AlainPilon lol talking about stealing of IP when it comes to GW is a bit ironic when warhammer universe is riddled with copies of other IPs. Dune comes to mind, the Alien universe as well and dont even get started on "Sly Marbo".
I think the biggest thing GW has that might be the end of it is how they are doing their best to drive people into buying from elsewhere with their constantly increasing prices.
Regarding the bookstore comparison, one of the largest bookstore chains in the US died when the kindle and competitors came out.
This is what got me into printing 3 years ago havent the only thing I got from GW since was the HH starter set most of my armies are printed off for them or mix of the kit with bits printed off but again mostly whole prints.
Its not just GW though. This is just inflating hitting everything, but GW's marketing tries to get ahead of it. Anything of comparable quality is the same price. Marvel CP: $40 MSRP for 2 minis. Bigger single minis cost the same. I have 2 stores selling Infinity, and their kits can be $310 for 27 minis and a rulebook. The minis vary in size, the largest being ~4.5" tall roughly, and the smallest basically being a 0.5" gaunt little human. This is how it is in the US anyway. I have 4 LGS around me and shop them all for the cheapest stuff.
Making these things is just expensive now. GW makes the mistake of trying to predict inflation and tends to be the first to increase, but their prices are pretty much in line with the market (Edit: Excluding Forgeworld. Their prices are crazy). The only time you get cheaper is if you buy from Mantic or Wargames Atlantic or Warlord. Their minis are fine, but they are smaller and very clearly of a lower quality with less options.
While the bookstore thing is semi accurate they were just a retail store and were not based on their own products. So there are many more variables there when comparing it to GW. Kindle may have been the catalyst but it was already dying because so few people read books anymore was what actually killed them not the digital version.
To me its eye opening when amazon has same same product 100 dollars cheaper which is nuts since GW makes it but they cant do better than amazon
A good discussion. Thank you.
3D printing is a separate hobby, unto itself.
The upfront cost is daunting, but the satisfaction of making your own is substantial.
Customization possibilities abound.
I have been at it over 20 years.
It's beautiful to see how things have progressed.
Best,
JBR
GW have made the hobby insanely expensive. I use to be able to get a sizable army for 500. Now, I'd have to spend double if not more. I was looking at expanding my armies and realized I can get a resin printer, all the accessories, and still come out cheaper.
@@DesolateControl Indeed, the GeeDubz pricing has gone well beyond any common sense. I feel like we are simply being fleeced.
Thus, 3D printing to the rescue.
@@johnbearross Absolutely. I would rather put $200 towards a printer then a Combat Patrol.
daunting?
mate a standard current gen 4k printer costs less than a 40k leviathan box heck its costs less than a single imperial knight if you shop for used ones or discounts.
@@KT-pv3kl lets not talk about last years Christmas Imperial Knight box prices *sniffle*
3D printing is indeed a hobby in itself for a lot of people.
This reminds me of a video a saw about how much it costs to make an army MSRP straight from GW and some armies are $1 per point.
Last edition flayed ones were $3 per point at one time. It was ridiculous
They really beat the poor ad mech players into the ground.
As a total newb and completely ignorant to how warhammer tabletop works, can you explain why and how this is bad?
@@Xxgxxaxx the standard game size is 2000 points
@@Daedric1260 ……ah
Hey your videos on supports changed EVERYTHING for me with my printing! Once I took the time to really sit down and work out how to apply everything you were discussing (then learn how to adapt that to different sized supports) I was off to the races with really good amateur sculpts with no supports! Figuring out how the prints deformed with improper supports informed my placement and Lychee's updated optimization really helps to speed everything up by just optimizing the supports I manually added. I think it really must be said that confirming a level bed after any breakaway print failure will DRAMATICALLY improve your success rate!
On the costs aspect I'd add that in any group of players, only one needs a printer for the whole playing group to benefit.
Not just in terms of cost but also the learning investment too.
I'm honestly surprised I haven't seen more gaming clubs or hobby shops offer it as a service.
That's what I did, I bought an X1C, K1 Max and Saturn 2, and I've been printing terrain and minis for my play group basically non stop for like 6+ months.
I'd presume hobby shops dont do it cus they are worried about getting either sued by gm (or jsut blocked from stocking their stuff) if they do it too publicly.
I gave my local hobby cafe by old printer in exchange for a Bolt Action US army starter box I had ordered from them. They tell me that they print off minis for D&D all the time now. However, they refuse to print anything that could be construed as similar to something they sell, like alternative 40k models or anything historical that could be gotten through Warlord Games via the cafe.
Other hobby shops probably have the same limits so this is probably why they haven't jumped on the wagon.
Yeah, any IP violations are easily prevented with a simple policy such as that...
I dunno, maybe it's just that it represents too much extra hassle for most hobby shops. The only one near me that isn't GW looks like it's struggling enough that dedicating the time and energy and space needed is too risky.
I mean I've seen gaming shop 3d print Terrain, get lasers for Terrain. I think most try to stay clear like was said above. Tho non gw shops seem to be infinity more ok with you using proxies. Cause even with the 3d printers some stuff like in the tyranids, still make sense to buy.
The elegoo resin is what I ended up switching to.
It stinks, it's harsher, but going from water-washable, it's been amazing. It is not only a massive improvement, it's also less prone to failure.
Water washable is nice on cleanup, but definitely not worth the lower quality and failure rate.
As someone who both 3d prints and purchases 40k minis, I tend to agree with Nick here. I think the learning curve, initial and upkeep cost, and amount of troubleshooting easily puts 3d printing into the “hobby” side of things.
Every honest person would agree with that. The fact this whacko couldn't even be honest is sad and scary
@@leseanmccoy4514 I agree, also him saying he wouldn't have bought models off GW anyway was just bullshit, he even pulls out a fairly modern kit from GW 2/3rds of the way through the video when he's talking about convenience. Like, we get it, GW is expensive, if you don't want to spend that money and would rather 3D print as an alternative, that's fine, but don't lie to yourself and you viewers saying GW wouldn't have gotten money off you anyway lol.
I recently got a Mars 3 Pro in that crazy black friday sale and i'm loving it so far. ive only printed a couple of things: a onepagerules mini cos i heard their presupports are great and a "Chief Space-Engineerat Shmikit Paw" that i did supports on myself. still not confident doing my own supports and i lost a bit of detail round his teeth. ive learnt so much from this channel in such a short space of time and can't wait to get a full 3d printed daemon army to contrast my official Necrons
I got into 3d printing to save a buck and I absolutely did.
1st I did not subscribe to 1000 patreons.
2nd I printed almost every model I bought
Yes I have spent thousands on resin and printers.
But I also have thousands of miniatures. (most are painted)
Yes if you just make 5 miniatures you're not going to save money.
But if you want any significant quantity or larger, more expensive models, you will save money.
For anyone wanting a direct comparison on the price between buying from gw and making your own (assuming you do not own anything and are willing to leave your prints in the sun and cure them yourself). I calculated about ~£240 for a quality printer, ppe, ventilation equipment and alcohol. Then for an army - assuming it is a large army (so this is higher end) about ~£20 per kg of resin makes for maybe ~£80 for 4kg of resin to make your full army. This totals ~£320 for the FULL price of STARTING WITH NOTHING. Then ~£40-80 quid every SUBSEQUENT army. I put one of my armies into the games workshop shop to see how much it would cost me and if I had NOTHING? I would save ~£480 QUID!!!!! £800 for the full army! I could rebuy everything TWICE for that price and still save money!
3d printing is hard for amateurs, it definitely has a high learning curve. Once you get over that expensive hump, you’re good.
Who isn't just using resin autosuppprts? Once you nail down your settings, autosupports work very well. I've been printing 5-6 years and can count on one hand the times I had to manually support resin prints.
I bought both a resin and an FDM printer for my RC tank projects. There is just so much available as STL than stuff from major manufacturers.
If GW didn't charge almost $100 AUD for a box of 5 Sororitas they might not be "at risk" as some people say. They keep jacking the price up and wonder why people turn to 3D printing
Thank you for your video! I literally fell in love in your content at first sight! Do you have video about super budget printers? Or can you recommend something for western european market? Thanks!!
The only issue I've been finding so far is space. There aren't a lot of places in my home that i could safely use a resin printer (if i was willing to buy an FDM printer, that'd be a different story) and the one place i want to set it up is filled with extra stuff that my family has stored there because I'm renting the place from my in-laws. I have no doubt that I'm going to absolutely have a hard time finding space for the armies I'll be printing once i finally get it set up... But for the moment, the struggle to just find a place with decent ventilation is my biggest hurdle.
Thanks for the video.
I don't think that printing will kill a company, however I think it might kill certain product lines. For example there have been some discussions about the new Legions tiny Rhinos and how expensive they are. Also a lot of the things that were Forge World exclusive have astronomically cheaper print proxy options.
I do agree he overblows how much money it is to get into 3d printing, but I do also think the money savings most people talk about aren't as big or realistic as many say. First, obviously in the long term 3d printers greatly out perform buying official models, but I think for many people the savings don't start happening until later than expected.
As an example situation, I've been building an Eldar 2,000 point army for 40k, I started in 2021 and have been on and off adding to the army when I have money to spare. In that almost 3 year span I have spent a little bit less than 500 American dollars getting my 2000 points list between both msrp kits and discounts at local stores through sales or general lower than gw pricing. This collection spans about 39 models with 10 unique units with some bigger things like tanks and large monsters. I also recently bought a mars 3 pro and wash and cure station on a small sale for about 400 bucks. This became a total cost of around 500 once I'd gotten additional items like gloves, alcohol, resin, and replacement feps for inevitable newbie screw ups.
To me what this means is for someone to have a 3d printer be worth it, specifically monetarily, a normal person doesn't get to that point until they've printed around 1 whole Warhammer army. An army that would be covered by about 7-10 different stls increasing the difference in price, potentially significantly for things like center piece models. Now, it's true you also get to print as many as you want of those units but 40k, and most games, don't really want you to repeat that many units. Like in the video, you could print 70 intercessors, but is the average player actually going to print and use that many? Additionally, I don't think there are that many people looking to print a whole 40k army, large portions definitely but I'd say the people who print whole armies are a minority behind people who want a couple alternate sculpts, extra bits, or need to fill holes for hard to obtain units. These are types of people who won't get as much value out of the 3d printer as fast.
As a result, to me the money saving side of 3d printing only makes sense to specifically people who already know they will not buy any other mini than ones that they print themselves, and even then it will be a while before they reach that point.
Just to be clear, I do still love the things my printer does for me just I don't think saving me money is really one of them and won't be for a while.
When my flatmate was running guard cavalry and the death riders are $55/model and he needed 36 of them....
And printing them was $5 for the files and like $1 per model to print its a no brainer
This is your second video I have watched that you have made this point. I have given up on printing minis after trying to get an Elegoo Pro 3 working for months. After hours of RUclips video tutorials, exposure tests and third party accessories the only thing I ever successfully printed were a set of skulls for basing. I consider myself technical (I am an IT consultant) and I've not run into another HOBBY that is this difficult to get into. Only one opinion here, but at least in my case this argument doesn't land.
I talked with a guy who works at a shop about 3D printing. We both agreed that if your buying like smaller kits or like a combat patrol. I have no problem getting them from a shop. 30-60 bucks occasionally. No problem But if I want 3 massive models say like 3 mauler fiends, mass carinfex, or a titan, a knight army etc etc. Hell yes print em. Because F that price point.
The loss of sales due to 3D printing is definitely felt by these companies. I recently got into the larger, 1/4 figure painting. People who track the official, licensed sellers of these figures, such as Sideshow Collectibles, are showing up less and less at trade shows. Although its not wrecking the GW marketing team yet, it is hitting other companies in other mediums. Lastly, i've seen a single 32mm GW mini go from $15 a blister pack, to $45 a blister pack in the last 10 years. I'm pretty sure GW's operating costs haven't gotten high enough to justify that price increase. However, a dwindling market would. I think GW is spinning things to the shareholders, while upping the prices to keep said shareholders happy.
It can be a hobby in itself. There is a lot of nuance to 3D printing. It is misleading to say it’s plug and play. It’s more a skill you learn to expand other hobbies.
Definitely agree that resin printing is not a hobby while fdm printing is, and I think the reason for that is honestly like, super simple: You can watch the fdm printer print. You can sort of watch the resin one print, but its dunked in usually opaque liquid inside of a vat behind a big shield, and you don't want it to splash on you. I think that like fundamental difference in being able to watch the process is why one is so open to hobbyist investment interest and the other is not. I do both, not ragging on resin, if I could watch it print the same way I'd be all about it.
Man Sovol 3D printers sure are tempting!
Wargames Atlantic and Mantic have started releasing their catalogue as STLs, so if that seems profitable I'm sure GW would be at least willing to consider it. But having said that as someone who's done with GW (a proud Historics convert) it sucks that 90% of the STL market is catering to people looking for GW proxies. I know that's the easiest way into the market share but jesus, all three of the sellers you mentioned are just 40k or SW: Legion reskinners. I basically do all my purchases through Wargaming3d or a handful of Patreons/Gumroads because all the other aggregators are awash in Not-Space-Marines you have to sift through.
The reason I feel GW won't do that, is they have an extreme mark up for their minis. You can see it in their profit margins. If they were just going off inflation, the profit margin would be much smaller.
When I started into 3D printing about a year and a half ago, I got one of those super cheap printers.
I started with an anycubic photon zero, and it cost me $100 new. It had a 500x 800 resolution, barely even a 1k, and it used the old LCDs where we needed a 10 to 12 second exposure rather than the two to three we see now. I treated it well, and it treated me to a solid year of great mini before I decided to upgrade
Ive spent 300 on a printer and resin, and printed 2 new armies plus display models.. would have been 500 or more now in GW to get close… printers only add to the hobby or even to supplement gw products even further.
One of my favourite things about 3D printing, is no sprue lines... oh also just paying someone else to print my minis eliminates a lot of issues. I'm sure if I did it myself I'd get better quality prints, higher definition etc but for the convenience it provides can't really argue.
haha, and yes... absolutely it feels like the major draw for 3D printing minis specifically is to save money.
I got into resin 3d printing to do accessories for the Warhammer 40K McFarlane 7inch figures. But since then have been using them for props for dioramas for my GI Joe and Transformers displays. Have a Mars and mars 2, and just ordered a Saturn 2 to use for larger props.
The one thing that stops me from getting a 3D printer is space. I don't really have any place to put it beyond my bedroom in my tiny little apartment and have no real way to deal with fumes or smells. Would love to be able to print my own bits and I've looked into various Elegoo printers but I don't exactly want to poison myself, y'know?
Sovol is the father figure i never had, thank you Sovol
I have the Sovol SV06, SV06+, and SV07+, all of which are fully Kilpperized. In addition to my mini-printing, I also use these for real world engineering prints. My original Resin printer was the Creality LD002H and then grew into the Anycubic Mono X 6Ks.
People call me wild but I do all my 40k printing in PLA and PLA+ but my brother and I did recently pick up a resin printer, so we’re gonna try that bad boy out! Got our PLA settings actually quite close to resin quality but we don’t think we can get that much more quality out of the plastic
Never heard of Sovol, so thank you for sponsoring one of the best bits of Australian entrainment since the Degeneration.
General rant about gaming Tubers from the US - they all yell. Even when they are talking it's a yell, very annoying. So thank you Once in a Six Side for your mellow tones.
I totally agree with this vid. - If I never have to clip out from a sprue ever again I would be a happy gamer. Actually, I stopped buying minis due to the simple reason that I really didn't like the prep work - clipping. filing, assembly, and then filling. Sure, resin plated minis need post processing but I feel that level of involvement is not at the same as plastic sprue.
The outlay for a machine and resin is a cost but what isn't? I've just bought a printer and wash&cure station for less than the boxset of legions imperialism (AUD) - @Once In a Six Side.. you have to do a vid on this boxset. 🙏🏻
What I would love to see more of is game creators embracing the printing market and producing great games and content for the enduser creator. Very much like what OnePage Rules do - the rules, the figures, the tokens etc. So that vibe and excitement which is generated by that new game isn't lessened when they say "it's miniature agnostic" or find tokens or whatever. We now have the ability to produce tokens and game collateral of the like which Fantasy Flight Games use to do in cardboard, but we can product in plastics, resins and other materials. To me that's the hobby.
Games like Warmachine or Bolt-Action or any of the non-GW games would be great if there were STL options for almost all facets of the game's ecosystem.
I always look forward to one these episodes - that nice realistic dry humour which we Aussies are known for coupled with a delivery of high level of subject matter knowledge - 👌🏻
So I bought an Elegoo Saturn 8k beginning of 2023 and zooming through armies, friends, and coworkers, I have printed starter armies for about 8 unique factions. My own collection is at a point where I need to stop printing and just paint.
Bruh... this is so real! 😂😂😂 I caught the bug when my MIL accidentally bought a Sonic Phrozen 4k. Got it plugged up a month ago and subbed to OnePageRules Patreon. I have a bazillion Dwarves and vampires now, and I bought some blessed sisters to print. I went from no pile of shame to a massive hoard in like, 3 weeks flat. I gave some away at a dirty Santa just to reduce the overflow.
For one army of a well-known Fishmech creator, I have already saved money on my 1000pt Tau proxy army. I used my printer to add some ripper swarms to my Tyranids army and some bits for other forces. Sometimes you just can't get stuff without jumping through hoops or going proxy anyways. Some of the models from GW are sick, but when you can print a proxy model for $20 in materials and for the files that costs $100 per model, you quickly pay for the printer.
Did they pull their video down? I can't find it.
I'm pretty surprised at the framing Nick used for both the cost and the "mono-pose," when I'm sure I've seen him field numerous 3d printed T'au Kits with equal or greater customization. He knows that this perspective is skewed. Weird video for them to make, but then again, maybe that's why they privated it. Definitely merited the more detailed response.
Okay, on further review, I'm mistaken; I think Nick rarely uses more than printed bits. I mixed up him and Adrian from Tabletop Titans, who also plays Tau and has a 3d printed army.
I got into 3D printing because my friends got me a Warhammer 40k combat patrol box and I thought that the game was too expensive to really expand my army's capabilities or how I could built my lists. I wanted to save money in building my army and printing minis for TTRPGs. I do not care in the slightest about GW plastic. I have heard people praise it, I have a number of Tau kits at this point and it is good work but my printer does a good enough job that after I paint the models I can't tell the difference. Granted I do not have a 4k printer, I have the Anycubic Photon S and so I might have to scale the models up a little and do a few extra layers on my paints but I enjoy the process and the savings make the extra time spent worth it.
Great video. I personally feel the upfront cost/complexity of resin printing is a barrier to entry but overall you can save money. The decision to buy in has to be more than just wanting a small grouping of mini's though, otherwise you are wasting your money and should just shop at some of the vendors who can print off stuff for you.
As for playing with people with 3D printed mini's, I could honestly care less. i want everyone to have fun with the hobby regardless of where they get their little Soldiers from. A hobby is a hobby. You don't have to a be a loyalist to a product line to a fault to enjoy a hobby.
I have an Anycubic Monox and am looking for another printer. Thank you for the link for the Sovol.
my big this is this rn, im mostly a painter, kitbasher and and a sculptor, and budget and money on hobby stuff is tight, plus as much as id love it as a kitbasher to get custom bits and models, even get into 3D scultping my own, the up front cost is a lot higher between a printer and resin, a ventilator, and so on. Minis do end up cheaper long term by a very large margin with 3d printing, but, 60-100 bucks here and there to add a kit or two of models to my stack of bits is more manageable short term when i have the extra money to spend. and yeah, i could save for everything for a 3d printer, but i get that extra cash between 2 and 3 times a year currently, and a lot of the joy i personally get comes from how i can convert and change models that exsist into my own original models.
I dont at *all* agree with or enjoy GW enforcing no 3d printing in thier shops/ tournements , however the rules have been changed or not since. But i have, personally, had a lot of joy in figuring out "well i want a Sisters of Slanesh kill team, how can i make that out of nothing but offical GW kits, and greenstuff"
Which, isn't for everyone.
Id recommend 3d printing to anyone who wanted to buildcraft and meta chase too. Or who is much more into the Game aspect than anything. But GW has so many models i want to get my hands on already, and when im already30 hours into an Angron model (christmas money) right now in base coating and modeling alone, ive more than gotten my moneys worth out of what the, yes expensice, but single model has given me. A single space marine model can take me between 8-12 hours at a time because im always pushing it to both the top of my ability and customazation i can get out of just that kit, left over bits, and greenstuff.
But, im an artist and a character designer at heart, so much of my individual enjoyment comes from figuring out how i can manipulate the kits that exsist into a model that only I own any think like.
Taking Daemonettes, a battle sister squad and random old incubus and Dark Commune bits i had to make my own sister of slanesh killteam, how to turn the World eaters iconography into Night Lords iconography on my Angron (yeah yeah not lore accurate, WE are my favorite gameplay wise, NL my favorite Lore/aestetic wise)
3D printing is great, and i geniunely want to get into it at some point (especially since i have a huge intrest in 3D modeling for both videogame and tabletop design) and ive gotten very off track, but In short single purchases buying the offical kits can be cheaper if you only get 60-100 bucks every 4-6 months extra to spend on some models than all the up front, material, and set up costs with 3d printing. Its just much cheaper long term and over time.
That said my huge thing with 3d printing is terrain, i have little interest in putting the type of effort and hand crafting i do into characters into terrain, and buying expensive terrain kits eats at my soul, especially with as little as i actually get to play, so i cant even imagine arguing for a GW terrain kits being better for anything other than maybe people trying to win like, competition dioramas and such.
Your Sovol ad was def worth watching. If I was in the need for a bed-slinger, I'd be tempted. Good features.
12:10 I had no problems with my Elegoo Mars 3, but the Elegoo Saturn 2 is prone to flexing. Jan Mrázek recommends using a 40 second light-off delay for the first 0.5mm of printing to allow the unit time to return to correct position.
There's also the fact gw either have lore for stuff they don't make and or they stop making certain figures which can be problematic for some if they haven't got the money to buy everything they want in one go. Plus the fact gw are slimlining ranges so the variation that a lot of people like just isn't there. I miss being able to flick through the parts catalogue and buy just the bits I wanted for kitbashing ( and yes I am that old😊) now you have to layout what is in my opinion extortionate prices for kits you may not want or need just to get the bits you want, so yes there is a place for 3d printing even without the fact of being able to print entire factions for a fraction of what gw charge.
I invested in 3d printing when they rereleased necromunda and were charging £20+ for official weapon upgrade kits that were only usable for 1 faction.
I was never a big pirate of MP3s or movies, so doing characters isn't for me, but terrain printing sounds really intriguing.
I've printed out the terrain, miniatures, pieces, rules, and yes! Even the table (look at Stage Top)! All for the fraction of the cost and the added satisfaction of making something. I can also find model makers that have the exact model range I want that are superior to GW models for a fraction of the price to print. Cheers.
I have been printing for a couple of years now and I find this an interesting thing as everything has to be a 1 or 0. If you 3d print you will never buy another model... Nope it is a degree, Like using contrast paints or an airbrush or off the shelf paints. Printing fun parts and models to make you army yours. I think this new conversation and war on creativity is hilarious. No this is a tool you can use and it is a hobby in its self.
I would totally go for a hero forge style approach if GW tried it for stls. If I could customise and pose base stls that they use for their own plastic designs I would happily pay a small premium compared to other stls. Cheaper for consumers and cheaper for GW.
They would never, we can't even get a proper basic virtual paint studio
How good is the Sovol at printing gun lowers? :D
MAN SOVOL 3D PRINTERS SURE ARE TEMPTING!
I'll just say that GW would be wise to make their own official stl's and sell them, maybe on a subscription service (like many do on Patreon). They could set up printers in licensed hobby stores and sell their own tailored resin. They would save mountains of money on the production and distribution of physical models.
Maybe not GW, but certainly Wizards just need to embrace it and make their own STLs. I mean, the number of hobby 3D printers has gotta be in the millions by now. It feels like it's so common.
So where can I buy that wildly flexible resin????
I just bought an Elegoo Mars 4 9k resin printer, and everything I need to start printing minis. I have the space all set aside in the attic next to a window with a grow tent and vinyl flex duct and fan. I’m going to start a D&D campaign with my girlfriend and our kids. I also bought an airbrush and compressor because I plan on making NSFW pinup models. Maybe I should buy a Sovol 3D printer for making terrain and buildings for my campaign.
If you get the photon mono 2 get the sovol resin tray. The stock mono has a proprietary FEP gasket on sheet.
Looking for a printer, and here is my support. Will add the Sovol to my comparison list.
Those Sovol printers look really nice, it really tempts me.
3d printing is bareIy cost effective if you do frequent tournament wargaming. I agree with both of your opinions, you can calculate the cost per miniature including repairs, machine cost, work hours etc. It is still cheaper than gw except if you are doing heavy wargaming. My personal experience is that I might print a proxy unit of 20 models assemble and paint them. After some tournaments things break. The resin ones are a pain to redo and break at a higher rate,whereas abs is almost as not harmed after gluing. The cost of tabletop wargamin resin is still too high for the cost per miniature and in some cases younsacrifice detail, an d I won't include the time spent to paint
Interesting the subconscious lumping of GW in with MTG Hasbro and Disney--these brands are all changing product content against the better wishes of their longtime customers, continual price increases and relying on nostalgia and quickly dying legacy brand loyalty all while treating customers like pay pigs whom they despise.
No wonder people are seeking out alternatives that actually offer what they as customers really want to spend their money on and not feel bad about the it afterward.
I prefer a hybrid approach. I make enough and am fine with spending some of my money to buy GW kits, but I'm not going to buy a box of Zoanthropes and just accept that I'm going to have to choose between them or Venomthropes when all that's standing between those two options is a cheeky little 3d printed body. Same with the Hive Tyrant/Winged Tyrant/Swarmlord, I only need a handful of magnets and a few 3d printed pieces to have access to all three options with one kit.
FDM "Hot noodle printing"! I LOVE it! I have a $75 Creality Halot One that i print Fan ducts and engineering parts. It works great for my needs. I'm not a Tabletop gamer (yet) but I like the precision resin achieves.
3:46 says "Buy this printer or forever go second in Warhammer"
I started to save a buck but I found slicing programs .I have Tardive Dyskinesia I shake and jerk I lost the ability to play video game. I have a consecration trimmer in my right hand so trying to play a fast pasted game became a nightmare So I remembered my years playing Warhammer Fantasy . Glueing is Extremely hard for me. Now thru slicing I can Put a miniature together and based on the slicer. Now this is Not easy but i can do it and print the miniature as a solid part. Putting this out there so maybe someone like me might see it and pick the hobby you thought impossible might not be out of reach. Also speed paint are a blessing.
I think a good solution to not subscribing to too many patreons or buying to many files is to work on researching/window shopping/narrowing down and getting your top like 3 favorite sculptors bookmarked in your web browser before you even buy the resin printer and then focusing on those three groups of models for awhile before downloading more
The Outer Circle gets deep into 3D Printing and its effects with GW. And I agree with what he says. It’s about convenience. Once 3D printing is convenient, GW will have to adapt quickly. The outrageous prices from GW, especially to Australia and the US, all the oop models, and the secondary market and their crazy prices. When 3d printing is just download, it makes the model, clean and cure , then done, and it’s a faction of the GW price, or even close, they’ll do it. GW isn’t getting or retaining customers.
in my opinion, the barrier for entry (for me at least) is just too high for 3d printing. i Could spent a good chunk of change on a decent printer, spend hours learning how it works and getting the right prints, or i could spend that same amount of hobby time building plastic kits (which are ready to go and a LOT easier to work with). 3d printing is great for adding character to models through things like alternate helmets, shoulder pads, weapons etc, but imo its just too much of a PITA for all but the most diehard hobbyists.
I don't print to 'stick it to the man' I do so to achieve the armies I envisage in my head. GW neither has the Time nor the Inclination to make models of everything that SHOULD exist in the 40K Universe, so I am glad there are creators out there filling in the margins, especially for neglected factions. I don't think it is a major threat to GW market share, because too many folks don't want to deal with the 3D printing process. Mostly I get prints for customising stuff
Lucky for you I did need a 3d printer to print terrain this winter. I was going to buy an elegoo but maybe I'll give the sovol a shot instead. I will also blame you personally if anything goes wrong ;).
I'm ready haha, but just be sure to join my discord too where I will personally help you troubleshoot any problems you might face!
the adhd hobbyist in me watched that video and just sadly nodded through most of it
wouldnt call that the typical experience but stls and "oh that would be fun to print and paint" projects do pile up fast when you first start out printing
I do a lot of resin, with very minimal use of solvents. My particular process for processing the models does take hours, but most of that it just down time while I wait for things to dry enough to make me happy. I've gone through maybe a gallon of alcohol(and my current rinse alcohol is nowhere near the end of life) over the course of 24 kilos of resin minimum. But that's because I don't like wasting solvents, nor do I like anything but extremely clean models.
Considering how I do tend towards batch runs, and I just move things from stage to stage in a few minutes when the next bit of printing is done, it's more like 45 minutes of active time max, but then, that's for massive amounts of models in a batch. I can print about 20 28mm models in one batch without issue, dividing the 45 minutes between those 20, that's like a minute and a half per model. Which is roughly comparable to how quickly I can be ready to build a standard 28mm model. Granted, I tend to focus more on massive models over standard infantry, if only because for the largely promotional stuff I do with models, the massive ones have a large impact for less time invested.
I've been thinking of picking up a Sovol
Def would trust you for filament printers. Also play ons vid is taken down or made private
Glad i cane across this. Reminds me to pick up the terrain you made
in my country is basically imposible to buy or get plastic models, so buying a 3d printer was the only way to get into miniature wargaming so im really glad this tech exist
and in my experience it is a "hobby" but only the first weeks, once you get the hang of it, its just plug and print
That printer is super tempting! I just got an ender v3 se though so not the time
The Anycubic Mono 2 looks like good value.
I actually like videos like these now and then, in between your feature videos.
Puppets war is more modular than you give them credit for, mate.
Damn, I’m interested in the Sovol printer thats awesome!
So what I read into this... is that Play on Tabletop are GW apologists XD
this was one of your best videos, really good break down of the video and got your thoughts across
Siraya Tech ABS-Like Resin is the way to go
I think the hobby part is playing with the 3D files prior to printing. If you get in to doing your own supports you can start loading files into something like Blender and doing weapon or head swaps to customise your models.
It's kind of like how assembling models is work, converting models is a hobby.
I m brazilian, there is no official GW model resellers here, the only way to get official WH40k boxes is importing them, and Brazil's importation taxes and tarrifs add up to approximately 92% over price plus shipping (yes, it is that much). I want to get into the hobby with killteam, the only boxes I found being sold here are around 600 reais, that is close to some 120 US dollars.
I have decided to get pirated STLs (not even proxies, all tho I do intent to buy some STLs and I avoid to pirate STLs made by independent artists) of AdMech, I have no 3d printer, as it is also exceptionally more expensive here, do to those taxes, so I have paied a third party to print for me, and I have some 13 minies for 140 reais, some 28 dollars.
It is not even GW fault that it is so expensive here, but 3d printing has made the hobby close to accessable here.
For context the avarage brazilian makes some 3000 reais a month. around 600 US dollars.
I think, the more popular resin printers become, the more accessable wargaming in general will be, and I dont think this is what will break GW, because there is the opportunity for them to try incorporate it into their bussiness model, and not ban people from stores by saying "3d printing" (one british friend told me it happened to him).
I believe GW could make good money by selling STLs and selling licenses for artists to produce STLs, the same way they do for video games.
What I hope for from Gw is them making upgrade spures and addons like that an optional stl, I would gladly spend 30 1 time for a multi use stl then ever pay 12 bucks for shoulder pads for my entire army
You should use sanding paper on those layer lines. It still takes less time than filing mould lines.
Im just now getting into warhammer and building my Dark Angels army. I love painting the models and showing the detail off to my friends, wife, and my kids.
On top of that ive always wanted a 3d printer. I fish alot and hand build lures and ive had ideas for making molds for my own lures. Plus the wide variety of little things i can print. But now...the warhammer models are hot on my mind. Im doing research and looking for all the reviews tips and tricks i can find to decide which printer to get. Resin or filiment that sorta thing. But now im also trying to find where to get files. Im mainly looking for space marines(like most people do im sure) but im having a difficult time finding them. I wouldnt mind spending 60 bucks on a file that has multiple poses because i could then print all i wanted as opposed to spending 60 bucks on only 5 models.
You said that you could find any model you wanted in 10-20 minutes but im spending an hour trying to find an inceptor squad with no luck.
I'm lucky enough to have a friend who has put the time in to learn to be good at 3D printing, but man, you cannot learn all the troubleshooting information you need for a 3D printer in a month. That's just some self-serving BS. I've personally bought two $200 printers in my life, and it took me about a month to get to the point that I basically decided I could not keep trouble shooting them. Maybe that's just me being unlucky, and it's probably true that things have gotten better than they were back then, but to tell people that for $200 and a month of semi-regular research, you can have very few issues. 3D printing, that's just not true.
Sovol printers do look tempting 😁👍🏼great vids btw 👌 love the anti-bs approach.
Does 3d printing saves you money? it's not about yes or no, it's about how a frigging a lot of money it saves you. I don't paint much, I don't wargame at all, but I printed and painted a set of figures for my friends to play D&D, that's not much, but hey, it was fun to paint them and see how much they liked them. Now, I play airsoft and this shit saved me TONS of money and if I played Wargames like 40k It would have paid for itself the first afternoon, well, no, the second, maybe
I think the thing to actually take away from his and your video about this is that 3d printing is expensive in the short term. You only genuinely start to save money if you're printing a lot and often.