Even though I have quite a bit of absorption/diffusion within my small 13 x 11.5 living room, I was still able to pick up on the resonances coming from the corners. Given the fact that I already used GIK absorption/diffusion panel, I was going to go ahead and purchase their corner bass traps, too. However, considering I had already replaced my two interior doors with black velvet curtain drapes actually made the decision easier for me then rather going with Corner bass traps, why not try doubling up on the velvet curtain drapes first. I can remember watching a video where the g i k CEO stated that if you're going to use fabric material to absorb bass, one has to at least try to go thick! Couldn't believe it actually worked, though 🥳
You just need mass. Acoustic treatments are nice but they’re not strictly necessary if you have mass in the room (couches, bookshelves, curtains, paintings, etc, etc). You don’t want an anechoic chamber. You need a mix of direct and reflected sound. First reflection point treatments are only necessary in smaller rooms or where the speakers are very close to the walls. FYI: YOUR SPEAKERS SHOULD NOT BE CLOSE TO WALLS. But I get it, sometimes that isn’t possible. But pulling your speaker into the room will help a ton.
I've designed and installed dozens of theater's at all price points and I always tried to get clients to budget for acoustics. The simple fact is the room is the largest 'component' of your system and has the most impact on the overall sonic characteristic - more than the speaker, more than the electronics.
I have an SVS SB2000 subwoofer that replaced my old 8" Yamaha one. For shits and giggles, I hooked up the Yamaha as a secondary / near field LFE and placed it next to my MLP. I love it! My home theater is in one half of a fairly large room. 12ft x 24 ft. Left wall is far from me and even tho I have a decent subwoofer it mostly sounds like the lfe comes from the front, top and right. Adding the small 8" ported Yamaha subwoofer made the LFE completely surround me and my couch shakes more without adding any crazy volume to the lfe.
I have my two duplicate subwoofers sitting next to my front left and right. It takes the quality and power to the next level. Would love to run some proper diagnostics to analyse it. My room is about 12ft x 20ft but my speakers sit in a 9ft x 9ft square in front of the tv
I have just curtains, carpet, throw on the settee and in my room, movies and music sound great in my living room, not putting panels all over the walls
I can only agree, panels rule! Thank you for this amazing series on your journey building a small HT. I started my HT journey back in 1999 and never seem to get to the end. There are always things improve on. Keep up the good work.
I would like a side video of adding panels to an open plan living room and having your partner accept them. Along with how to convince them that an RSL Speedwoofer 12s mkii is perfectly ok in the middle of the room.
0:40 "this is going to get some pushback" Nope. Literally everyone in every forum I have been on agrees that room treatment is the second most important thing in a setup, after the speakers themselves of course.
Reminds me of old school tv multipath ghosting from the mountain reflections, my eyes didn’t like that either! Smaller the room the worse the problems.
you are completly right, my dad´s house has an 80´s 5.1 setup (no hdmi) so very old with acoustic pannels and sounds 100 times better than my dolby atmos setup with no acoustic treatment.
I have two questions about seats. Don't seats with headrest obstruct and affect the sounds coming from the rear surrounds and read height? And your MLP is off centre. Won't that affect soundstage and imaging? Maybe I'm OCD and need my MLP to be in the dead centre.
These aren’t the final seats. Stay tuned! With two seats, either I center one seat and the other seat is waayy off, or I split the difference. I chose the latter.
Thank you so much for this video! Love this series George, it’s been incredible, especially for those starting a home theater for the first time. Are those 4 inch thick panels? Quick question, I notice that your center channel appears to be elevated, can you provide a link to the accessory you used to get it tilted towards the MLP ?
So glad to hear you’re enjoying the videos! This theater has been a ton of fun to build. The panels are the 244 Bass Traps from GIK Acoustics. Oh man, you caught me. When I added that little accessory to my Center channel I did have the thought someone might notice it, but then I was like “nah, no way anyone has good enough eyesight to catch that.” 😆 So I wanted to add some height, as well as a bit of upward tilt to the Center channel speaker. I went thru my house looking for something that would work and found a set of legos I had saved from my childhood. I’m the opposite of a hoarder so to save stuff is rare. But I had saved these. And the case was absolutely perfect for what I needed. It’s pretty janky, but it blends in quite well. I’m surprised you saw it! Here’s what I used. images.app.goo.gl/BRo49pTB3p3b3YXx6
Loving the setup!! Looks like exactly what I want to do!! 🎉 What is under the center channel? 🎉 Also, I know it’s a reused tv you’re using, but would love to see what a TCL 85”QM8 or Hisense U8N or even a 98” TCL 98”QM7 would look like I this room!! Could be pretty awesome for under $1999.00!! 🎉
Did you mound the panels mid way up your wall vs middle of the speaker because of sound quality or aesthetics? Looking to add some in my room soon. Great video series.
George, my room is 14'x14' and I hope you have much better luck getting control of the bass in your room. No matter where I place my sub(s) I cannot get solid bass in my MLP. The center of my room is where bass goes to die. I am going start working in the vertical plane with my sub by building higher and higher platforms for it. Bass tuning is like training a 400 pound gorilla.
@@usmankhalid990 Trust me, I've had my seat moved so much I have worn holes in the carpet. I fear I am just going to have to settle for less. Thanks for the advice though.
@@usmankhalid990 Me too! I have my SVS PB1000 Pro off the floor by 14" as of last night and it seems better, but...... only a few days of movies and music will tell. I'm planning to go as high as 22" for top of the platform. May go higher if I move it from under the wall mounted TV. Sure would be great to get tight - punchy movie bass hits at some point. This morning I was able tune the bass to +/- 5dB flat from 24Hz to 110Hz. Still a big dip at 85Hz though.
Subwoofers are a pain in the ass especially if you have lots of room modes. I had the opposite problem. 2 12” subs would create such large resonances I thought my house was going to shake down to its foundation.
When you buy these things do they have diagrams of where to place them I would love to have acoustic treatments but would have no idea how to place them.
Use a tall mirror. If you can see a speaker it's also a sound reflection point for that seat. If you can only see the front right speaker on the right wall at the first point (and same for left) that's where you can use a combination panel to keep some reflection to make your room sound bigger if you want. For the rest use full absorption. Home theater guru has a good full guide on setting up home theater that includes a video on acoustic treatments that explains this more in depth.
Acoustic room treatments for those that like good sound! Bare walls for the clueless types! Why spend good money on gear and then spoil it before it gets into your ears......?
Even though I have quite a bit of absorption/diffusion within my small 13 x 11.5 living room, I was still able to pick up on the resonances coming from the corners. Given the fact that I already used GIK absorption/diffusion panel, I was going to go ahead and purchase their corner bass traps, too. However, considering I had already replaced my two interior doors with black velvet curtain drapes actually made the decision easier for me then rather going with Corner bass traps, why not try doubling up on the velvet curtain drapes first. I can remember watching a video where the g i k CEO stated that if you're going to use fabric material to absorb bass, one has to at least try to go thick! Couldn't believe it actually worked, though 🥳
Nice! That’s a great solution!
You just need mass. Acoustic treatments are nice but they’re not strictly necessary if you have mass in the room (couches, bookshelves, curtains, paintings, etc, etc). You don’t want an anechoic chamber. You need a mix of direct and reflected sound. First reflection point treatments are only necessary in smaller rooms or where the speakers are very close to the walls. FYI: YOUR SPEAKERS SHOULD NOT BE CLOSE TO WALLS. But I get it, sometimes that isn’t possible. But pulling your speaker into the room will help a ton.
This makes a lot of sense and jibes with my own experience. Thanks for posting.
I've designed and installed dozens of theater's at all price points and I always tried to get clients to budget for acoustics. The simple fact is the room is the largest 'component' of your system and has the most impact on the overall sonic characteristic - more than the speaker, more than the electronics.
Couldn't agree more. Acoustics are so important for a great theater.
Brilliant, thank you for sharing! Dear Santa all I want for Christmas is some acoustic panels!
Everyone should run two subwoofers even if they only have one subwoofer channel
This isn't always accurate. You manage bass based on the dimensions of your room and acoustics of that room.
I’ve found this to be the case in two different rooms now
I have an SVS SB2000 subwoofer that replaced my old 8" Yamaha one. For shits and giggles, I hooked up the Yamaha as a secondary / near field LFE and placed it next to my MLP. I love it! My home theater is in one half of a fairly large room. 12ft x 24 ft. Left wall is far from me and even tho I have a decent subwoofer it mostly sounds like the lfe comes from the front, top and right. Adding the small 8" ported Yamaha subwoofer made the LFE completely surround me and my couch shakes more without adding any crazy volume to the lfe.
@ this isn’t a measure of good bass management. What does your sub calibration measurements telling your. What does your REW measurement look like?
I have my two duplicate subwoofers sitting next to my front left and right. It takes the quality and power to the next level. Would love to run some proper diagnostics to analyse it. My room is about 12ft x 20ft but my speakers sit in a 9ft x 9ft square in front of the tv
Well said. I would Imagine DIRAC has a lot easier time doing it's thing after mitigating reflections. Would be interested in the result.
I have just curtains, carpet, throw on the settee and in my room, movies and music sound great in my living room, not putting panels all over the walls
Breaking up the sound waves through reflection or absorption can be accomplished many ways like the examples you and George provide.
I can only agree, panels rule! Thank you for this amazing series on your journey building a small HT. I started my HT journey back in 1999 and never seem to get to the end. There are always things improve on. Keep up the good work.
Thanks so much! Glad you’re enjoying the series!
Made my panels and what a difference!
I would like a side video of adding panels to an open plan living room and having your partner accept them. Along with how to convince them that an RSL Speedwoofer 12s mkii is perfectly ok in the middle of the room.
It might take some convincing 😂
Like how you said you’re hearing the same sounds at different times. People don’t normally think about that.
0:40 "this is going to get some pushback"
Nope. Literally everyone in every forum I have been on agrees that room treatment is the second most important thing in a setup, after the speakers themselves of course.
I always say same about acoustic treatments but nobody cares about it 😤
Reminds me of old school tv multipath ghosting from the mountain reflections, my eyes didn’t like that either! Smaller the room the worse the problems.
you are completly right, my dad´s house has an 80´s 5.1 setup (no hdmi) so very old with acoustic pannels and sounds 100 times better than my dolby atmos setup with no acoustic treatment.
I have two questions about seats.
Don't seats with headrest obstruct and affect the sounds coming from the rear surrounds and read height?
And your MLP is off centre. Won't that affect soundstage and imaging? Maybe I'm OCD and need my MLP to be in the dead centre.
These aren’t the final seats. Stay tuned!
With two seats, either I center one seat and the other seat is waayy off, or I split the difference.
I chose the latter.
Thank you so much for this video! Love this series George, it’s been incredible, especially for those starting a home theater for the first time. Are those 4 inch thick panels?
Quick question, I notice that your center channel appears to be elevated, can you provide a link to the accessory you used to get it tilted towards the MLP ?
So glad to hear you’re enjoying the videos! This theater has been a ton of fun to build. The panels are the 244 Bass Traps from GIK Acoustics.
Oh man, you caught me. When I added that little accessory to my Center channel I did have the thought someone might notice it, but then I was like “nah, no way anyone has good enough eyesight to catch that.” 😆
So I wanted to add some height, as well as a bit of upward tilt to the Center channel speaker. I went thru my house looking for something that would work and found a set of legos I had saved from my childhood. I’m the opposite of a hoarder so to save stuff is rare. But I had saved these. And the case was absolutely perfect for what I needed. It’s pretty janky, but it blends in quite well. I’m surprised you saw it! Here’s what I used.
images.app.goo.gl/BRo49pTB3p3b3YXx6
Loving the setup!! Looks like exactly what I want to do!! 🎉
What is under the center channel? 🎉
Also, I know it’s a reused tv you’re using, but would love to see what a TCL 85”QM8 or Hisense U8N or even a 98” TCL 98”QM7 would look like I this room!! Could be pretty awesome for under $1999.00!! 🎉
It’s a Lego case (long story 😁)
Do you have a link to the sound panels?
I used GIKAcoustics.com
Did you mound the panels mid way up your wall vs middle of the speaker because of sound quality or aesthetics? Looking to add some in my room soon. Great video series.
Kind of a mixture of the two. I figured a few inches difference would not be audible. Glad you’re liking the videos!
When do we get to see/hear some demos with a good mic? 🎉 😊
Hopefully soon!
George, my room is 14'x14' and I hope you have much better luck getting control of the bass in your room. No matter where I place my sub(s) I cannot get solid bass in my MLP. The center of my room is where bass goes to die. I am going start working in the vertical plane with my sub by building higher and higher platforms for it. Bass tuning is like training a 400 pound gorilla.
Square rooms have a null at the middle, try moving your seating position a foot back.
@@usmankhalid990 Trust me, I've had my seat moved so much I have worn holes in the carpet. I fear I am just going to have to settle for less. Thanks for the advice though.
@@welderfixer I am interested in hearing how your vertical plane building journey goes!
@@usmankhalid990 Me too! I have my SVS PB1000 Pro off the floor by 14" as of last night and it seems better, but...... only a few days of movies and music will tell. I'm planning to go as high as 22" for top of the platform. May go higher if I move it from under the wall mounted TV. Sure would be great to get tight - punchy movie bass hits at some point. This morning I was able tune the bass to +/- 5dB flat from 24Hz to 110Hz. Still a big dip at 85Hz though.
Subwoofers are a pain in the ass especially if you have lots of room modes. I had the opposite problem. 2 12” subs would create such large resonances I thought my house was going to shake down to its foundation.
When you buy these things do they have diagrams of where to place them I would love to have acoustic treatments but would have no idea how to place them.
Most of the acoustic panel companies will be happy to map it out if you give them room dimensions. Another way is the mirror reflection method
GIK Acoustics offers a free design service. They look at your room and recommend what panels to use and where to place them.
Use a tall mirror. If you can see a speaker it's also a sound reflection point for that seat. If you can only see the front right speaker on the right wall at the first point (and same for left) that's where you can use a combination panel to keep some reflection to make your room sound bigger if you want. For the rest use full absorption.
Home theater guru has a good full guide on setting up home theater that includes a video on acoustic treatments that explains this more in depth.
Sub to your channel because your room size and mine are about the same. Thanks to your channel, I can learn a lot from you.
Thank you 🙏
Not obviously to some 😂
A3 Emotiva is a good place to start
Very true. but panels are either ugly, or unreasonably expensive.
Dude, please please I’d be so happy with those speakers when you’re done with them!! I think I’m local too! ;) 🎉
Acoustic room treatments for those that like good sound! Bare walls for the clueless types! Why spend good money on gear and then spoil it before it gets into your ears......?
Dang i am early
I’m off the fence now!
Thank you sir! 🫡