No. That controls where air mode first activates. When the throttle first goes over that percent. After it activates, it stays active at all throttle positions.
@@JoshuaBardwell Thank you, I learned something today! Now this got me thinking and unless I'm mistaken, this means that airmode NEVER gets activated with the special solution you described. I checked the source code and the activation of airmode ONLY happens when its enabled and the throttle goes above airmode_start_throttle_percent (which is 25% by default). But it's NOT enabled above 10% so it won't get activated above 25%...
@@l0stb1t Yeah, i'm also very interested. This video is starting to be shared in the community as an answer to air mode problems, but if what you're saying is true, then it's very wrong
@@ThranMaru It's only the *first* time you raise the throttle that it's only enabled when you go over 25%... Normally, once you've taken off, it's permanently on until you disarm. Now, it won't enable when you go over 25% on the first take off, but after that, any time throttle goes under 10% (eg flip, power loop etc), airmode is turned on. It makes sense, and it's useful for the problem he mentioned of flying through scraggle etc, but it doesn't help my use-case: I'm a very new pilot so I crash-land a lot, often on uneven stuff. And then the quad freaks out every time. So I've just turned airmode off (since I'm not gonna be doing flips any time soon anyway).
Probably some people have already mentioned this, but I just copied my Throttle to the free 11 channel and now my AUX7 follows my Throttle. Then just set Air Mode to be enabled if the AUX7 is less than 1050.
Actually when I first discovered this with a cinewhoop the quad hopped and stuck to my thigh and gave it a nasty case of "road-rash". I screamed WTF!? Then I learned. Sometimes learning hurts.
@@sadkingbilly4531 Having just gotten my first tinywhoop, I thought he was exaggerating with the "stuck" to the wall. I thought it would just momentarily "stick" and then come off but no: I literally had to disarm to get it off.
@@Vousie I disarmed as well to get it off of my thigh's flesh as it chopped away. But hitting disarm could've just been self preservation. It all happened so fast! ;) I've got a nice scar there now as a reminder. I've now switched to EmuFlight and never turn on Airmode. As a point of reference the quad that jumped me was the Beta95x v3 with their stock Betaflight tune. I guess they call the effect "wall suck" for a reason.
@@sadkingbilly4531 Yikes. That's nasty. I've been playing with ArduPilot a lot - running test flights of pull-requests that haven't even been merged to master and haven't had any dangerous issues - the worst it gets is just flipping over when it tries to takeoff, and that's when we've messed with the EKF. The whoop I recently got is my first Betaflight quad. Literally with in 1 minute of flying it, I had already run into this issue - every time it lands on something not perfectly flat it just goes full throttle against whatever it landed on... I'm so glad this is a harmless whoop and not a 5 inch...
I'd like to extend this great comment a bit with my full settings on Taranis X9D+ as an example: 1) On the Logical Switches page add a logical switch ("L01") using: Function: "a
I think you and I both watched this and thought "why did he make it so complicated?!" but we came to different simpler methods. I thought to do it with just one logical switch and one global function: Logical switch: L01 a
You can also do this on the Betaflight side! Just get an extra transmitter mix to mirror your throttle mix, then set it up to control air mode in the modes tab.
how i can set a mix with the throttle that i can see at bf ? i only see the Throtlle moving but not an Aux Channel (this i would like to use for Air Mode)
Can you do it completely in Betaflight?? As in do nothing in controller? I like the idea of using the throttle to activate airmode at low percentage but I can’t fathom how that’d be accomplished!
@@alloutofdonuts3998 I think you'd just need to set an aux channel to mirror the throttle channel or simply use the throttle value. Then in Betaflight's modes tab assign the channel you've just set up to toggle Airmode. Then use the "grab handles" and select only the lower range (you can try experimenting by moving the throttle and seeing it's channel position on screen).
I frickin LOVE this idea! I already have Airmode on a switch, but this makes it soooo much sweeter! Thanks JB - I know that you didn't "create" this per se, however, YOU planted this seed in my head! " DYNAMIC AIRMODE" 😎
Can do this with one mixer line, one logical switch line and one special functions line. Mixer line for ch7, set source SD and then in BF Modes tab define your range so that Airmode is ON when AUX3 is middle or low switch position and off in upper position. Logical switch L01 is active when X
It's not just on throttle cut that airmode does its magic... it allows the PIDs to use the full range of the RPM no matter what your throttle setpoint is... Without airmode, airmode at say 50% throttle, your PIDs can only use RPM up to 50%. This means that the PIDs can only really decelerate motors rather than adding RPM to some motors and decelerating others.
I used a simpler method, in my opinion: Channel 6 controls the modes angle - acro trainer - acro in my case. So, I used the same logical switches as JB (actually only L02). Only thing in the mixer tab that I did is that I subtracted an extra 25 points/percent from channel 6 when L02 is active (so no replace but just a ADD) in case throttle goes OVER -80 (so over 10% throttle input). In that case (dynamic) air mode should turn off. Then I set air mode to channel 6 also, and defined it over the range 75-100 (the most upper range when L02 is inactive). In the range 50-75, it is turned off, but acro mode is still active. When going in the direction of 0 value, acro trainer mode is activated, and when going in the direction of -100 angle mode is activated. So only 2 extra lines of code, one in the mixer tab and one in the logical switches tab. In both acro trainer mode and angle mode air mode is now turned off. You could inverse that by defining a new extra range for the airmode tab… .
Would be awesome if this was implemented into Betaflight. Airmode below X% throttle (setting in GUI would be best, or at least a CLI command line for the percentage).
So i have air mode on a switch so i can slide easily. So here is my setup, i put air mode on a momentary button on my radio. I have the rotor riot skids on the bottom, but in the back i have 2 foam pads. So now, when you slide on the ground, it should stay straight, because the back feet are dragging. So now i'll grab the momentary switch, no throttle and land/slide and it won't freak out. this works really well on slides (playground slides) as if you do it while armed its freaking out. honestly i'm not great with it, but its so fun.
So take this with a grain of salt since I am still pretty new to the hobby: I'm on a flysky i6 flying a mobula 6 on 75mm frame conversion. The way I've done this in my mixes is: Master: ch3 Slave: ch6 Pos. Mix: -100% Neg. Mix: -15% Offset: -15% (The rest can be fine tuned in betaflight) I was experimenting with idle up and acro indoors but found I wasn't getting the low throttle manuvers I wanted. So I tried this mix thinking it wouldn't work but it did first try! (Some of my newly obtained computer science degree helped me out a little probably). So what I've found is that it doesn't completely eliminate the problem but it makes it significantly better. It also seems the quad is flying more smoothly and predictably now. It feels way easier to hit gaps (I usually fly through folding table legs and a small hexagonal table with about ~1.25ft gaps on all sides). When bumping into things whether on accident or purpose with me testing it, it makes it way easier to recover and correct any bumps. And now when I crash the quad doesn't fly across the room like it used too. It more or less falls right where it hit. One of the only downsides I've been noticing is that when arming for turtle mode there is a slight delay. Don't know what it is from yet but I'll find it hopefully. It is also a little weird feeling when setting up for my bookshelf dives and whole room wall surfs but I think I will get used to it with time. It definitely boost confidence with the predictability and it feels like I'm getting faster lap times around my little house course.
This sounds perfect for my cinewhoops. But i think I will set my T18 switch differently. Switch front=airmode on, middle=taking off airmode is on but turns off after 10% throttle, switch down=airmode off.
Joshua, this is content that isn't specifically pertinent to me (I fly DJI controller), but that I find very interesting. I would love to see a short follow-up video where you try it out on a whoop and see if the results work 'as intended' and if so, if it is generally useful.
I was wondering how these two differ, but it seems to me they really are different. One is trying to self level quad on crash (like in horizon mode), and one is just allowing usable motor range for maneuvers. Seems like crash_recovery really *wants* to have airmode on, I would think??? So, maybe a better way of phrasing this is, crash recovery *REALLY* needs to have airmode!
Nice one!... In Deviationtx it's real easy to setup. Just select a channel in the mixer and set THR as source and then in betaflight set that aux channel to airmode. Done.
Flying at home under the trampoline my Shen Drones Squirt sucked up to the bottom and began its spiraling dance, funny video. Had to disarm, then arm and resume flight. Thanks again JB 😊!
It seems to me like the quicker way to test this would be to just set air mode on the throttle in BetaFlight. Can’t wait to give this a try but am going to have to make it work with the all modes on one channel tip.
JB thanks works like a charm with some changes. I have my modes set on the 6 position buttons (actually just a 6 position switch), with the first (default on radio startup) position set so the quad will not arm even if the arm switch is on and the throttle down. 6P4 previously turned on Air Mode, which it still does with other qualifications. Set as Aux 3, with a value of 50%, ADD Aux 3 also includes a logical switch when the throttle is above -85, with a value of 50%, ADD So when both values are on, Betaflight goes to 2,000 and turns Air Mode on. Throttle down, Air Mode off. !6P4, with a value of -100, REPLACE so when the 6 position is on any other mode, air mode is turned off. Not flown it into anything to see how it acts but is does now land without bouncing at zero throttle, still armed. Looks good.
hey JB! I have had this idea as well but it is bad. The solution does not do anything at all to eleviate the problem. You might think that it is a good idea, but if you think about it, you see that it does not change anything: If you are below your 20% your air mode is active, so same as air mode. If you are above 20% it does not really matter if you are in air mode or not. So you might as well have it active, or if you are without air mode the FC does almost the same to maintain its authority. It makes no difference, i tried it out. On the other hand, whenever you cross the threashold - which you do all the time - the thrust ever so slightly changes which is deadly if you are edging through tight opening with your 65er. You might not even notice it but you will perform worse!
On my crtus x I've updated remote (literadio3) to just duplicate throttle to the channel. And set smaller range on drone. It is not as precise as my elrs channel has small number of stops, however it works similar
@Rebellion Above But if you crash faster into this wall, crash recovery kicks in and makes you crash just into the opposite wall as well. :D On my Tinyhawk II, both Airmode and crash recovery where turned on and it made this little whoop practically unflyable. And I was a total rookie. And it took me a week to figure out why that friggin thing isn't even remotely behaving like that simulation... gosh....
Interesting idea, might have to play with it. I usually run airmode and prearm on the momentary switch, so I can just disable it whenever I'm doing touches, landings or proximity stuff.
Couple of questions my modes are all on one switch. SD up is angle, SD middle is Hor, SD down is Air Mode. I'm on Open TX ,via a Tara is X9 Plus. The menus look different than on your radiomaster. I understand mixes somewhat. When. You want to set up a situation where throttle is down you still habe airmode enabled and when you have throttle on Airmode is off. Are the other flight modes on a different switch? Laslty on the x9D plus is there a tutorial to achieve what you'd showed here. Thanks for all your patience and kindness.
Im always set manually my diatone taycan 3 inch and beta95x, acro mode when cruising, and switch air mode when needed, whew.. so sure this is method will help alot! ^_^
Hi Joshua, is there an updated way to do this now or still the same please? I’m looking to fly my Cinebot30 indoors for work and cinematics and want to implement this. I want it on the switch so default is air mode on, then when switched up it’s “dynamic” like you have done. But is this the same method you would still use to do this or does this need an updated video before I start to make all these changes? I’m thinking of mine just having air mode on all the time but when flying in tight spaces or indoors for work use it where it only comes on when at zero throttle.
Just imagine, constant speed governor and variable pitch. Zero time wasted stopping or reversing motors. 4 tail booms of a high end heli and off to the races.... Welcome to the 3D heli world.... I fly SAB w Mikado VControl.... It seems my Jeti Duplex was made for multirotors bc this window switch setting is a menu driven piece of cake. I found this "airmode thingy" in the middle of my first build bench test "throttle freak out" seemed pid related then laughing my ars off when i grabbed the quad and lifted it up quickly then throttle cut..... no response.... then wth is airmode..... then search search.... then walla.... TY Joshua Bardwell for such a great job here and all of your very helpful videos. 👍
I've got an airmode type issue on a 1s brushed (0720) 75mm whoop that isn't exactly what is talked about here, but I thought someone might have a comment. Flying acro, after a straight at high throttle, come to a sharpish turn, and the result of a bit of pitch up plus roll and throttle reduction can cause it to suddenly tumble to the ground. I get the feeling from OSD videos it happens when roll exceeds 45 degrees. Then I found turning on airmode stopped this happening, BUT (1) on a friend's similar 85mm 8520 whoop it improved but didn't solve it and (2) airmode generally makes it very sluggish - like flying with a nearly flat battery, and flight time is reduced. The throttle in the turns is not much backed off, only to about 50%, so don't really see why airmode makes any difference. Tried betaflight and emufight, made PID/feed forward changes. Nothing affects it except airmode, and as above that has downsides. We are at our wits end on this.
i like this, in my case i add another logic to check AIL or ELE not in center (> 10 or < -10) also .. so in center stick and no throttle air mode still off, but add little AIL / ELE air mode will be enable. and no jumpy whoop during landing
Hello joshua i am having a problem with my quad , i cant do dives (when i lower the throttle to 0 the motors keep up spinning and the quad doesn’t fall ) i had this problem over two weeks ago and I can’t find any solution
I noticed something weird with this method on at least one quad (7incher), but probably also on some other quad. I got some sort of "dynamic" air mode set up on my radio like in this vid. So airmode only kicks in above a certain throttle percent value. So during flight it constantly switches on and off. Throttle rised, dynamic air mode kicks in, and then: the motors start going back and forth between 15-50 percent several times in a window of 10-20 ms. Causing really hot motors. Mostly front 2 motors in my case. Any idea why this might happen? Got the blackbox log file available.
I think there's a slight bug in the logical switches that you have setup. When the throttle is exactly -80, neither logical switch will be true. This would then set the airmode channel to the middle which luckily will then either turn airmode on or off. Sadly OpenTX doesn't support = operators, but you can do this with a single logical switch. Create one logical switch which is triggered when SC is down and the throttle is less than -80, then for your mixer lines set one to the logical switch and set the other to the inverse of the logical switch. It also means that if you want to change your threshold from -80, you now only have to do it in a single place.
I tried using a single logical switch but the combination logic with SC did not work as needed. The flaw in the logic means that air mode status is undefined when the throttle is at exactly -80 but I don't think this matters. Either it'll be on or off, which means the actual threshold is effectively either -79 or -81, but who cares?
@@JoshuaBardwell You're right, I forgot that a logical switch is just a single operation so you do indeed need two. It doesn't matter in this case because the Betaflight modes will handle it but it may be an issue in order similar cases where logical switches are used for mixers - I just wish OpenTX supported the = operators.
god forbid anyone look at their blackbox data, but.... you can absolutely relate the throttle position to whatever quad is in question hover point. air mode kicks in just below the quads hover point or over the quads over point or whatever... I usually set the TPA (Throttle - PID Attenuation) breakpoint around the hover point (throttle position) anyways....
Air mode is not active on 1st arming to prevent motor windup. But then after the throttle goes above a certain position, air mode activates. Then it is always active at every throttle position. This is a common misconception about air mode--that it deactivates when the throttle goes back down. The whole point of air mode is to improve low throttle stability so it would make no sense for it to deactivate at low throttle.
@@JoshuaBardwell Yes, but to take everything you mentioned in your video and use the hover point as a reference for when/where along the throttle to apply your video...
@@JoshuaBardwell as an example... maybe 50% between 0 throttle and hover (wherever that may be) you apply what was said in your video.... just a thought
thanks, but i ve a problem. All setup is ok, betaflight to, but when i'm engage auto air mode with throtle, it does not stop air mode of my whoop when throtle is under -80 (try with -70 same) but when i m test in BF modes it's look ok to disable air mode when throttle low... so what's wrong ? thanks ... ( in case of ask , yes, and air mode setup BF is disable on config and it s ok when i fly throtle zero motors stop good on switch position off but not on switch position auto ...)
Hey Joshua, just a question: I followed up the video but for my tinywhoops model on the tx16s I do want it 100% of the time activated and not having to flip a switch for it. I did everything exactly like you said but instead of having the switch up like in the video, in my case I left SD↓ and !SD↓ at the mixes tab, and then did the opposite at the logical switches tab, l01 if ax thr -80 SD↑ That would be correct? Haven't had the time to test it, but I would like to confirm I did the right thing because I think I don't fully understand the logic of it. Thanks!
Someone mentioned this and I’m not sure if I understand correctly but could you do this only in Betaflight, using the throttle ch in modes, to activate airmode at or below a certain rpm?? I can’t fathom how it’d be accomplished but seems like it’d be kind of automatic version of what JB did here. I’d still like to have it on a switch to turn off/on as well tho, maybe not possible??
my first flight Air Mode activated. sad to say that my flywoo firefly went heywire and flew too high and it was screwed. thanks for this video and i will try this
Wow... Computers! Great idea! I have been thinking the having air mode off was MUCH better than having it on, especially when you bump a branch and think you are going to get stuck BUT air mode kicks in, launches you as you disarm... *sigh*.
I am kind of curious to try this. All last winter we did a lot of indoor racing with 75mm-2S type ducted "whoops." Slightly larger gates and rip around full stick acro in a huge barn. Basically flying like a full 5" track with inverted dives, split S, etc. One of the issues we ran into occasionally, is if there was a large inverted maneuver resulting in a potentially prolonged period of time at zero or near zero throttle, the quad would almost "fly away" on its own. My guess is that its a problem with the gyro/FC not understanding what is going on. Ducts probably causing it to wobble while its free-falling, and then either the PID loop or air mode trying to spool up motors to account for it. I am curious if this might get rid of that, or if the issue is completely independent.
While that video doesn't show it, its in that situation where after the line along the barn's ceiling and dropping to the blue circle, probably about 50% of the time the quad would spool up its motors by itself because its essentially in a partially inverted freefall with 0 throttle input.
I think I accomplished this with only 2 Logical Switches and a single line Mix. I don't know enough about drones or the way they fly to tell if this helps - I'm still in the several crashes per pack phase. But if JB says it's good then I'm trying it.
Interesting, someone smarter than me should build this into the betaflight configurator modes, and use throttle channel as the input. Would that many it simpler to setup than opentx mixers?
Well, this shouldn't be neccesary - it's essentially a bug in airmode. So rather than adding this to betafight, they should just fix airmode. What JB has shown here is a workaround.
@@mikenomatter Airmode should do as its description says - keep attitude control during zero throttle. Not attach whoops to walls - that is a bug in the way they've implemented the attitude control part of it.
Hi Joshua, Zeus f722 v2, when throttle is little up one motor going too high rpm, not able to matches other motors spin. Please make a explanation on zeus f722 v2 complete setup & flash, possible troubleshoot.
Thank you very much. I was hoping that this solves the problem I have with my bumblebee V2 with T-Motor 2203.5 (2850kv) on 6s. But how can I set this up using the DJI digital FPV Transmitter? How can I set up the Throttle stick position as switch in betaflight? The quad sometimes just winds up the motors to full power eventhough the throttle stick is back at ZERO! And than with full throttle it has desyncs. Could it be possible that what I am experiencing has something to do with airmode? I have set permanently enable Airmode to on, airmode_start_throttle_percent = 25, idle_min_rpm = 5. Any idea why I am eyxperiencing this? (btw. I already changed the aio fc to a t-motor mini F7 stack bat still experiencing the exact same problem... so I put back the original aio fc) Thank you very much.
But what when I use dji remote controller 2 ? I flying with dji fpv and its superb flight, but with my pavo pico I cant fly well :/ idk why And ... whats is AntiGravity in betaflight?
Would it be possible to configure this when using the DJI controller with the HD version of say the Beta95x v3? Since the controller does not have a screen...
Sadly that way you still get that horrible bounce and overreacting to ground-effects when landing. That's why I put Airmode on a switch in the first place, so I can land my quad precisely and gently where I want it. That's a tough one... Also would there be a way to do all that without wasting that channel just to switch airmode? (I use your all-modes-on-one-channel technique to just taper that into my other flight modes but still I think a betaflight setting should be able to do all that by itself...)
Umm... There's a Betaflight parameter called airmode_start_throttle_percent , doesn't this do the same?
No. That controls where air mode first activates. When the throttle first goes over that percent. After it activates, it stays active at all throttle positions.
@@JoshuaBardwell Thank you, I learned something today! Now this got me thinking and unless I'm mistaken, this means that airmode NEVER gets activated with the special solution you described. I checked the source code and the activation of airmode ONLY happens when its enabled and the throttle goes above airmode_start_throttle_percent (which is 25% by default). But it's NOT enabled above 10% so it won't get activated above 25%...
@@l0stb1t hi, I see nobody answered you, did you find a response of you interogation or did you test it to see if it is activated?
@@l0stb1t Yeah, i'm also very interested. This video is starting to be shared in the community as an answer to air mode problems, but if what you're saying is true, then it's very wrong
@@ThranMaru It's only the *first* time you raise the throttle that it's only enabled when you go over 25%... Normally, once you've taken off, it's permanently on until you disarm. Now, it won't enable when you go over 25% on the first take off, but after that, any time throttle goes under 10% (eg flip, power loop etc), airmode is turned on.
It makes sense, and it's useful for the problem he mentioned of flying through scraggle etc, but it doesn't help my use-case: I'm a very new pilot so I crash-land a lot, often on uneven stuff. And then the quad freaks out every time. So I've just turned airmode off (since I'm not gonna be doing flips any time soon anyway).
Probably some people have already mentioned this, but I just copied my Throttle to the free 11 channel and now my AUX7 follows my Throttle. Then just set Air Mode to be enabled if the AUX7 is less than 1050.
That's an expedient solution, bravo! Fighting air mode on a cinewhoop now
Your impression of a quad stuck to a wall is uncannily good!
Actually when I first discovered this with a cinewhoop the quad hopped and stuck to my thigh and gave it a nasty case of "road-rash". I screamed WTF!?
Then I learned. Sometimes learning hurts.
@@sadkingbilly4531 Having just gotten my first tinywhoop, I thought he was exaggerating with the "stuck" to the wall. I thought it would just momentarily "stick" and then come off but no: I literally had to disarm to get it off.
@@Vousie I disarmed as well to get it off of my thigh's flesh as it chopped away. But hitting disarm could've just been self preservation. It all happened so fast! ;) I've got a nice scar there now as a reminder. I've now switched to EmuFlight and never turn on Airmode.
As a point of reference the quad that jumped me was the Beta95x v3 with their stock Betaflight tune.
I guess they call the effect "wall suck" for a reason.
@@sadkingbilly4531 Yikes. That's nasty. I've been playing with ArduPilot a lot - running test flights of pull-requests that haven't even been merged to master and haven't had any dangerous issues - the worst it gets is just flipping over when it tries to takeoff, and that's when we've messed with the EKF.
The whoop I recently got is my first Betaflight quad. Literally with in 1 minute of flying it, I had already run into this issue - every time it lands on something not perfectly flat it just goes full throttle against whatever it landed on... I'm so glad this is a harmless whoop and not a 5 inch...
It is possible with just 1 logical switch: "Func=a
I'd like to extend this great comment a bit with my full settings on Taranis X9D+ as an example:
1) On the Logical Switches page add a logical switch ("L01") using: Function: "a
I think you and I both watched this and thought "why did he make it so complicated?!" but we came to different simpler methods. I thought to do it with just one logical switch and one global function:
Logical switch:
L01 a
I tested this on my 75mm whoop and it is amazing!! Thanks JB (and the guy that came up with it)
You can also do this on the Betaflight side! Just get an extra transmitter mix to mirror your throttle mix, then set it up to control air mode in the modes tab.
how i can set a mix with the throttle that i can see at bf ? i only see the Throtlle moving but not an Aux Channel (this i would like to use for Air Mode)
@@manuato you can add one more aux in mix tab and source it from throttle stick
Can you do it completely in Betaflight?? As in do nothing in controller? I like the idea of using the throttle to activate airmode at low percentage but I can’t fathom how that’d be accomplished!
@@alloutofdonuts3998 I think you'd just need to set an aux channel to mirror the throttle channel or simply use the throttle value. Then in Betaflight's modes tab assign the channel you've just set up to toggle Airmode. Then use the "grab handles" and select only the lower range (you can try experimenting by moving the throttle and seeing it's channel position on screen).
@@jasio77mega hmm, good idea. Would this work w/dji v1 Tx tho?
I've had Air Mode on my mode switch for a while, and I love the throttle idea.
I frickin LOVE this idea! I already have Airmode on a switch, but this makes it soooo much sweeter! Thanks JB - I know that you didn't "create" this per se, however, YOU planted this seed in my head! " DYNAMIC AIRMODE" 😎
Can do this with one mixer line, one logical switch line and one special functions line.
Mixer line for ch7, set source SD and then in BF Modes tab define your range so that Airmode is ON when AUX3 is middle or low switch position and off in upper position.
Logical switch L01 is active when X
It's not just on throttle cut that airmode does its magic... it allows the PIDs to use the full range of the RPM no matter what your throttle setpoint is... Without airmode, airmode at say 50% throttle, your PIDs can only use RPM up to 50%. This means that the PIDs can only really decelerate motors rather than adding RPM to some motors and decelerating others.
Can't this be done in the modes tab of betaflight?
...like reusing the throttle channel as an input in the modes tab, great idea.
Great idea that is 👍
@@breakflight That would be the easiest to do but unfortunatley you can only use aux channels as source and not the throttle channel.
Great feature and another excellent tip on using OpenTX and BF. Thanks Joshua, have a safe trip.
I used a simpler method, in my opinion:
Channel 6 controls the modes angle - acro trainer - acro in my case.
So, I used the same logical switches as JB (actually only L02).
Only thing in the mixer tab that I did is that I subtracted an extra 25 points/percent from channel 6 when L02 is active (so no replace but just a ADD) in case throttle goes OVER -80 (so over 10% throttle input). In that case (dynamic) air mode should turn off.
Then I set air mode to channel 6 also, and defined it over the range 75-100 (the most upper range when L02 is inactive). In the range 50-75, it is turned off, but acro mode is still active. When going in the direction of 0 value, acro trainer mode is activated, and when going in the direction of -100 angle mode is activated. So only 2 extra lines of code, one in the mixer tab and one in the logical switches tab.
In both acro trainer mode and angle mode air mode is now turned off. You could inverse that by defining a new extra range for the airmode tab… .
Would be awesome if this was implemented into Betaflight. Airmode below X% throttle (setting in GUI would be best, or at least a CLI command line for the percentage).
Totally agree! I fly some of my drones with an FS-i6s which doesn't have OpenTX
I just got done testing this and I LOVE it, no more bouncing landings. Super
So i have air mode on a switch so i can slide easily.
So here is my setup, i put air mode on a momentary button on my radio. I have the rotor riot skids on the bottom, but in the back i have 2 foam pads. So now, when you slide on the ground, it should stay straight, because the back feet are dragging. So now i'll grab the momentary switch, no throttle and land/slide and it won't freak out. this works really well on slides (playground slides) as if you do it while armed its freaking out.
honestly i'm not great with it, but its so fun.
So take this with a grain of salt since I am still pretty new to the hobby:
I'm on a flysky i6 flying a mobula 6 on 75mm frame conversion. The way I've done this in my mixes is:
Master: ch3
Slave: ch6
Pos. Mix: -100%
Neg. Mix: -15%
Offset: -15%
(The rest can be fine tuned in betaflight)
I was experimenting with idle up and acro indoors but found I wasn't getting the low throttle manuvers I wanted. So I tried this mix thinking it wouldn't work but it did first try! (Some of my newly obtained computer science degree helped me out a little probably).
So what I've found is that it doesn't completely eliminate the problem but it makes it significantly better. It also seems the quad is flying more smoothly and predictably now. It feels way easier to hit gaps (I usually fly through folding table legs and a small hexagonal table with about ~1.25ft gaps on all sides). When bumping into things whether on accident or purpose with me testing it, it makes it way easier to recover and correct any bumps. And now when I crash the quad doesn't fly across the room like it used too. It more or less falls right where it hit. One of the only downsides I've been noticing is that when arming for turtle mode there is a slight delay. Don't know what it is from yet but I'll find it hopefully.
It is also a little weird feeling when setting up for my bookshelf dives and whole room wall surfs but I think I will get used to it with time.
It definitely boost confidence with the predictability and it feels like I'm getting faster lap times around my little house course.
His performance was the best part of the video. Greetings from Brazil.
We want to see the rampage vlog!!
This sounds perfect for my cinewhoops. But i think I will set my T18 switch differently. Switch front=airmode on, middle=taking off airmode is on but turns off after 10% throttle, switch down=airmode off.
Awesome content. Hopefully this will fix my issues with my cini whoop sucking walls lol
Joshua, this is content that isn't specifically pertinent to me (I fly DJI controller), but that I find very interesting. I would love to see a short follow-up video where you try it out on a whoop and see if the results work 'as intended' and if so, if it is generally useful.
Was just going to ask this, if possible with dji controller…
There is also the crash_recovery option in the cli that has a different approach for this
I was wondering how these two differ, but it seems to me they really are different. One is trying to self level quad on crash (like in horizon mode), and one is just allowing usable motor range for maneuvers. Seems like crash_recovery really *wants* to have airmode on, I would think??? So, maybe a better way of phrasing this is, crash recovery *REALLY* needs to have airmode!
Nice one!... In Deviationtx it's real easy to setup. Just select a channel in the mixer and set THR as source and then in betaflight set that aux channel to airmode. Done.
Interesting, cheers. I was thinking this could be an alternative.
Nice to see another deviation user
@@calumrichings7967 :-) DeviationTX is a hidden gem... I'm flying expresslrs right now with it and it's just too simple... OpenTX scares me.. ;-)
Have they made any other improvements with this "dynamic airmode" feature in Betaflight 4.3?
I think, I made it simpler. I only set 1 LS x
Just tested now and my meteor65 is not a Woo girl anymore 😂😂😂
Flying at home under the trampoline my Shen Drones Squirt sucked up to the bottom and began its spiraling dance, funny video. Had to disarm, then arm and resume flight. Thanks again JB 😊!
It seems to me like the quicker way to test this would be to just set air mode on the throttle in BetaFlight. Can’t wait to give this a try but am going to have to make it work with the all modes on one channel tip.
JB thanks works like a charm with some changes. I have my modes set on the 6 position buttons (actually just a 6 position switch), with the first (default on radio startup) position set so the quad will not arm even if the arm switch is on and the throttle down.
6P4 previously turned on Air Mode, which it still does with other qualifications. Set as Aux 3, with a value of 50%, ADD
Aux 3 also includes a logical switch when the throttle is above -85, with a value of 50%, ADD
So when both values are on, Betaflight goes to 2,000 and turns Air Mode on. Throttle down, Air Mode off.
!6P4, with a value of -100, REPLACE
so when the 6 position is on any other mode, air mode is turned off.
Not flown it into anything to see how it acts but is does now land without bouncing at zero throttle, still armed. Looks good.
hey JB! I have had this idea as well but it is bad. The solution does not do anything at all to eleviate the problem. You might think that it is a good idea, but if you think about it, you see that it does not change anything: If you are below your 20% your air mode is active, so same as air mode. If you are above 20% it does not really matter if you are in air mode or not. So you might as well have it active, or if you are without air mode the FC does almost the same to maintain its authority. It makes no difference, i tried it out. On the other hand, whenever you cross the threashold - which you do all the time - the thrust ever so slightly changes which is deadly if you are edging through tight opening with your 65er. You might not even notice it but you will perform worse!
On my crtus x I've updated remote (literadio3) to just duplicate throttle to the channel. And set smaller range on drone.
It is not as precise as my elrs channel has small number of stops, however it works similar
What is the difference if you use just "set crash_recovery = on" ?
@Rebellion Above But if you crash faster into this wall, crash recovery kicks in and makes you crash just into the opposite wall as well. :D
On my Tinyhawk II, both Airmode and crash recovery where turned on and it made this little whoop practically unflyable. And I was a total rookie. And it took me a week to figure out why that friggin thing isn't even remotely behaving like that simulation... gosh....
I did this and now I can bang into gates without crashing! Thanks JB
Interesting idea, might have to play with it. I usually run airmode and prearm on the momentary switch, so I can just disable it whenever I'm doing touches, landings or proximity stuff.
this sounds interesting, i hope you make another demonstration like this using tango 2. thank you so much
It's exactly the same on any opentx radio including Tango 2.
thank you Joshua birtwell I found your video I got tired of being planted up against the walls and trees😊😊😊😊🎉🎉
Couple of questions my modes are all on one switch. SD up is angle, SD middle is Hor, SD down is Air Mode.
I'm on Open TX ,via a Tara is X9 Plus. The menus look different than on your radiomaster. I understand mixes somewhat. When. You want to set up a situation where throttle is down you still habe airmode enabled and when you have throttle on Airmode is off. Are the other flight modes on a different switch? Laslty on the x9D plus is there a tutorial to achieve what you'd showed here. Thanks for all your patience and kindness.
I prefer this to be a feature in Betaflight itself.
Im always set manually my diatone taycan 3 inch and beta95x, acro mode when cruising, and switch air mode when needed, whew.. so sure this is method will help alot! ^_^
Now that's a great idea! 💡
I will try this!
Thank you and safe travels.
It work good?
Hi Joshua, is there an updated way to do this now or still the same please?
I’m looking to fly my Cinebot30 indoors for work and cinematics and want to implement this. I want it on the switch so default is air mode on, then when switched up it’s “dynamic” like you have done. But is this the same method you would still use to do this or does this need an updated video before I start to make all these changes?
I’m thinking of mine just having air mode on all the time but when flying in tight spaces or indoors for work use it where it only comes on when at zero throttle.
Just imagine, constant speed governor and variable pitch. Zero time wasted stopping or reversing motors. 4 tail booms of a high end heli and off to the races.... Welcome to the 3D heli world.... I fly SAB w Mikado VControl.... It seems my Jeti Duplex was made for multirotors bc this window switch setting is a menu driven piece of cake. I found this "airmode thingy" in the middle of my first build bench test "throttle freak out" seemed pid related then laughing my ars off when i grabbed the quad and lifted it up quickly then throttle cut..... no response.... then wth is airmode..... then search search.... then walla.... TY Joshua Bardwell for such a great job here and all of your very helpful videos. 👍
Hey Joshua, thanks for the video. I use Tango 2, is it possible to skip the mixers and just do the logical switches?
I've got an airmode type issue on a 1s brushed (0720) 75mm whoop that isn't exactly what is talked about here, but I thought someone might have a comment.
Flying acro, after a straight at high throttle, come to a sharpish turn, and the result of a bit of pitch up plus roll and throttle reduction can cause it to suddenly tumble to the ground. I get the feeling from OSD videos it happens when roll exceeds 45 degrees.
Then I found turning on airmode stopped this happening, BUT (1) on a friend's similar 85mm 8520 whoop it improved but didn't solve it and (2) airmode generally makes it very sluggish - like flying with a nearly flat battery, and flight time is reduced.
The throttle in the turns is not much backed off, only to about 50%, so don't really see why airmode makes any difference.
Tried betaflight and emufight, made PID/feed forward changes. Nothing affects it except airmode, and as above that has downsides.
We are at our wits end on this.
i like this, in my case i add another logic to check AIL or ELE not in center (> 10 or < -10) also .. so in center stick and no throttle air mode still off, but add little AIL / ELE air mode will be enable. and no jumpy whoop during landing
Hello joshua i am having a problem with my quad , i cant do dives (when i lower the throttle to 0 the motors keep up spinning and the quad doesn’t fall ) i had this problem over two weeks ago and I can’t find any solution
Hi, have you solved this?
Ohhhhhh. That’s so smart. I’ve put Airmode on a switch but this sounds so much better. Can’t wait to try.
Is there an easy way to setup the transmitter stick for this in the TX configuration for those of us without screen on controller?
I wish it was available for the DJI remote controller :/
For the L01 and L02 does the multiplex have to be set to “replace” also?
Yes.
I noticed something weird with this method on at least one quad (7incher), but probably also on some other quad.
I got some sort of "dynamic" air mode set up on my radio like in this vid. So airmode only kicks in above a certain throttle percent value. So during flight it constantly switches on and off. Throttle rised, dynamic air mode kicks in, and then: the motors start going back and forth between 15-50 percent several times in a window of 10-20 ms. Causing really hot motors. Mostly front 2 motors in my case.
Any idea why this might happen? Got the blackbox log file available.
I wonder if there's a way to do this with the DJI controller
Gracias por el video, me ha sido de mucha ayuda. por fin puedo activar AIRMODE sin que mi PAvo30 se vuelva loco cuando choca con algo.
Worked fine on my tinyhawk II. I can bump in to walls and get out from it without motors going wiiiiiiieeeee
I'd really like this function / feature setup on my DJI transmitter.
Cheers for that I've just done this on my 5inch racers to hopefully stop the quad going mental when I clip a gate
It work good?
De los mejores videos que he visto! muchas gracias por ayudar tanto a la comunidad
Is there any way to do the same for DJI FPV Remote v2 ?
Thank you!
Is it ok to turnoff airmode for freestyle drone? I cant find airmode in current betaflight version except turn on it permanently in configuration tab
Thanks, It's much better!
Happy Rampage Joshua!
Hello Joshua. Very interesting post. My question is are you able to do this on a dx8 spektrum ?
Great video, but you didn't mention that after making the logic switches you have to add those lines to the mixes. Got it working though. Great job.
which way do they multiplex?
I think there's a slight bug in the logical switches that you have setup.
When the throttle is exactly -80, neither logical switch will be true. This would then set the airmode channel to the middle which luckily will then either turn airmode on or off.
Sadly OpenTX doesn't support = operators, but you can do this with a single logical switch. Create one logical switch which is triggered when SC is down and the throttle is less than -80, then for your mixer lines set one to the logical switch and set the other to the inverse of the logical switch. It also means that if you want to change your threshold from -80, you now only have to do it in a single place.
I tried using a single logical switch but the combination logic with SC did not work as needed. The flaw in the logic means that air mode status is undefined when the throttle is at exactly -80 but I don't think this matters. Either it'll be on or off, which means the actual threshold is effectively either -79 or -81, but who cares?
@@JoshuaBardwell You're right, I forgot that a logical switch is just a single operation so you do indeed need two. It doesn't matter in this case because the Betaflight modes will handle it but it may be an issue in order similar cases where logical switches are used for mixers - I just wish OpenTX supported the = operators.
Was nice to meet you at rampage was definitely an honor.
god forbid anyone look at their blackbox data, but.... you can absolutely relate the throttle position to whatever quad is in question hover point. air mode kicks in just below the quads hover point or over the quads over point or whatever... I usually set the TPA (Throttle - PID Attenuation) breakpoint around the hover point (throttle position) anyways....
Air mode is not active on 1st arming to prevent motor windup. But then after the throttle goes above a certain position, air mode activates. Then it is always active at every throttle position. This is a common misconception about air mode--that it deactivates when the throttle goes back down. The whole point of air mode is to improve low throttle stability so it would make no sense for it to deactivate at low throttle.
@@JoshuaBardwell Yes, but to take everything you mentioned in your video and use the hover point as a reference for when/where along the throttle to apply your video...
@@JoshuaBardwell as an example... maybe 50% between 0 throttle and hover (wherever that may be) you apply what was said in your video.... just a thought
Man I love this channel 🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏❤❤❤❤❤thank you so much for what you do Joshua your amazing
thanks, but i ve a problem. All setup is ok, betaflight to, but when i'm engage auto air mode with throtle, it does not stop air mode of my whoop when throtle is under -80 (try with -70 same) but when i m test in BF modes it's look ok to disable air mode when throttle low... so what's wrong ? thanks ... ( in case of ask , yes, and air mode setup BF is disable on config and it s ok when i fly throtle zero motors stop good on switch position off but not on switch position auto ...)
how to set line 2 on tbs mambo (5:25)?
It should be exactly the same except the Mambo has a smaller screen so the menu doesn't look the same.
@@JoshuaBardwell you need to copy line 1?
thanks JB, will try for this
1:02 im just here to say before the video...airmode on a switch? Seems to work for me
Yeah, but the solution in the video might be much smarter. You do not have to move any switch.
Hey Joshua, just a question:
I followed up the video but for my tinywhoops model on the tx16s I do want it 100% of the time activated and not having to flip a switch for it.
I did everything exactly like you said but instead of having the switch up like in the video, in my case I left SD↓ and !SD↓ at the mixes tab, and then did the opposite at the logical switches tab, l01 if ax thr -80 SD↑
That would be correct? Haven't had the time to test it, but I would like to confirm I did the right thing because I think I don't fully understand the logic of it.
Thanks!
Someone mentioned this and I’m not sure if I understand correctly but could you do this only in Betaflight, using the throttle ch in modes, to activate airmode at or below a certain rpm?? I can’t fathom how it’d be accomplished but seems like it’d be kind of automatic version of what JB did here. I’d still like to have it on a switch to turn off/on as well tho, maybe not possible??
why doesnt betaflight see the throttle switch over the threashold as an input?? looks to me like it doesnt work.
my first flight Air Mode activated. sad to say that my flywoo firefly went heywire and flew too high and it was screwed. thanks for this video and i will try this
Wow... Computers! Great idea! I have been thinking the having air mode off was MUCH better than having it on, especially when you bump a branch and think you are going to get stuck BUT air mode kicks in, launches you as you disarm... *sigh*.
Joshua, may you pleeeeeeease tell us again how the quad behaves when it falls with air mode off??? 😅😅😅😅
uncontrollable I think
yes, please! I still did not get it 🙈🤣
I think it goes a little like *Bleh* LOLOLOL
If air mode is off, then what mode are we flying??
AGREED 💯 PERCENT! Ima gona do dis now. Thanks!
Would there be any benefit to doing this on a larger quad like a 5inch? Just curious.
@Grim FPV hmmmmm interesting. My landings could use some grace. Guess I'm gonna try it out!
Ive done the setup as shown on my 85mm 2s whoop. It doesnt work sadly. Looks like the Flying Performance is worse when airmode is Switched on and off
Nice josh I’m on it 👍thanks buddy
Would increasing the motor idle value in betaflgiht help achive someting similar?
Thats a very good representation of what a whoop does against the wall 😆
Isn't what crash mode recovery mode is for? would be nice if this would disable air mode automatically in addition to switching to angle mode.
I am kind of curious to try this. All last winter we did a lot of indoor racing with 75mm-2S type ducted "whoops." Slightly larger gates and rip around full stick acro in a huge barn. Basically flying like a full 5" track with inverted dives, split S, etc. One of the issues we ran into occasionally, is if there was a large inverted maneuver resulting in a potentially prolonged period of time at zero or near zero throttle, the quad would almost "fly away" on its own. My guess is that its a problem with the gyro/FC not understanding what is going on. Ducts probably causing it to wobble while its free-falling, and then either the PID loop or air mode trying to spool up motors to account for it. I am curious if this might get rid of that, or if the issue is completely independent.
ruclips.net/video/b1vAcI3d-EU/видео.html
While that video doesn't show it, its in that situation where after the line along the barn's ceiling and dropping to the blue circle, probably about 50% of the time the quad would spool up its motors by itself because its essentially in a partially inverted freefall with 0 throttle input.
I think I accomplished this with only 2 Logical Switches and a single line Mix. I don't know enough about drones or the way they fly to tell if this helps - I'm still in the several crashes per pack phase. But if JB says it's good then I'm trying it.
Interesting, someone smarter than me should build this into the betaflight configurator modes, and use throttle channel as the input.
Would that many it simpler to setup than opentx mixers?
Well, this shouldn't be neccesary - it's essentially a bug in airmode. So rather than adding this to betafight, they should just fix airmode. What JB has shown here is a workaround.
@@Vousie there is no bugs in airmode, this is just the way how it works
@@mikenomatter Airmode should do as its description says - keep attitude control during zero throttle. Not attach whoops to walls - that is a bug in the way they've implemented the attitude control part of it.
@@Vousie github.com/betaflight/betaflight/blob/master/docs/Modes.md#airmode - I don't see anything you said in AM description
@@Vousie if you know where they implemented a bug and how to fix it - just do it, it is opensource, feel free)
Digging this up. How does one remove air mode on an 85x if betaflight doesn't show the mode at all?
If air mode is not in the Modes tab, it's enabled in, the configuration tab.
Is there a way to set this up on Betaflight without the fancy radio transmitter? I have the standard big black DJI FPV radio.
Unfortunately, no.
Uh thanks for the video? Mailing it in
Hi Joshua, Zeus f722 v2, when throttle is little up one motor going too high rpm, not able to matches other motors spin. Please make a explanation on zeus f722 v2 complete setup & flash, possible troubleshoot.
ruclips.net/video/xBaefeQtA1c/видео.html
"Tomorrow I'm leaving for Rotor Riot Rampage and I really want to get this video out."
Scratch that plan I guess.
Surprise! The day I record and upload the video is not always the same day it publishes.
@@JoshuaBardwell 🤣🤣🤣
I am going to try this!
@@JoshuaBardwell your Instagram feed made up for it
Thank you very much. I was hoping that this solves the problem I have with my bumblebee V2 with T-Motor 2203.5 (2850kv) on 6s.
But how can I set this up using the DJI digital FPV Transmitter? How can I set up the Throttle stick position as switch in betaflight?
The quad sometimes just winds up the motors to full power eventhough the throttle stick is back at ZERO! And than with full throttle it has desyncs. Could it be possible that what I am experiencing has something to do with airmode? I have set permanently enable Airmode to on, airmode_start_throttle_percent = 25, idle_min_rpm = 5. Any idea why I am eyxperiencing this? (btw. I already changed the aio fc to a t-motor mini F7 stack bat still experiencing the exact same problem... so I put back the original aio fc) Thank you very much.
Do you solve the problem? I having the same experience
let me think about....it should also stop the quad from stupidly bouncing on the ground while landing?!
But what when I use dji remote controller 2 ? I flying with dji fpv and its superb flight, but with my pavo pico I cant fly well :/ idk why
And ... whats is AntiGravity in betaflight?
Would it be possible to configure this when using the DJI controller with the HD version of say the Beta95x v3? Since the controller does not have a screen...
No it's not possible unfortunately.
@@JoshuaBardwell thank you. That's a real pity...
Did someone try this with the tango 2 ? Great remote but not enough switches....
Sadly that way you still get that horrible bounce and overreacting to ground-effects when landing. That's why I put Airmode on a switch in the first place, so I can land my quad precisely and gently where I want it. That's a tough one...
Also would there be a way to do all that without wasting that channel just to switch airmode? (I use your all-modes-on-one-channel technique to just taper that into my other flight modes but still I think a betaflight setting should be able to do all that by itself...)
Would this be more for Acro or Angle mode?