How to get your first sourdough loaf to explode with oven spring
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- Опубликовано: 30 сен 2024
- In this second beginner's episode, I'll show you how to bake an amazing sourdough loaf with great oven spring using your brand-new sourdough starter.
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(Dimensions: 24cm x 15cm x 8cm)
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#sourdoughbaking
Personally I don't think there is any bullet proof recipe unless you can really control room temp, humidity etc on top of using the same good brand of dough once you have nail your recipe.
Not really. You have to know tour flour and to know what to look for. That’s it. I’ve been using the same recipe for 4 years and get the same results every time. Same everything but some times i add some new ingredients just to make it taste different.
@@greganikin7003 - so no diff in rise times with room being at 40 im winter vs 90 plus in summer? Hard to believe unless you use temp controlled chamber.
Totally agree! Room temp and humidity affects my recipe one way or another. During winter months my dough is left to bulk ferment for HOURS AND HOURS. And then I leave it in the ridge for 72 hours. Summer time, 36 deg C days, it bulk ferments in an hour on the bench top. And that’s using the exact same recipe and flour every single time. Somehow, Phil’s kitchen is at a constant 25 deg C. How?
Great video Philip! I'm glad you stress the protein percentage after you say "strong bread flour". I can imagine a first time baker going bonkers try to find a bag labeled "STRONG BREAD FLOUR". It's like someone looking for the ANY key on a keyboard after IT tells them to hit "any" key!
I've tried downloading the calculator but I go from inputting first name and email, checking my email to confirm and then when I try to get the calculator in starts the cycle again! Trapped!
My bulk fermentation ends around 4.5 - 5 hours at 25C. You did 8 hours of bulk and perfect crumb. I quess thats because of low hydration and no whole wheat added to mixture
The bulk fermentation was six hours and the dough was left to proof at ambient temperature in the basket for two hours before going into the fridge for a cold retard. BF times vary depending on many factors, but the flour/flour blend, hydration and temperature play a big part.
64% hydration? must be different flour, because if i do 64% , my dough its so hard and loaf crust its so thick
I've tried 75% and 70% and it's far too sticky. I don't get much of a spring. My starter and levain are both excellent. It's simply the heat and humidity here in Thailand. Resting, mixing and shaping in such heat and humidity is a problem.
Hey there. Try dropping the hydration to 65%, that will help. I was baking in Thailand for a couple of months. Due to the heat and humidity I kept the hydration lower than I would normally. But I also used a cool box with an ice brick to create a cool space for fermenting my dough. It takes a little experimenting to understand how many ice bricks you need to use to regulate the temperature. Aim for 25C and you should be good. Hope this helps and keep me posted, Phil
I've been struggling with the fermentation part, I assume its mostly underproofed (big holes, rise ripping the surface) eventho I control the temps, tried 30% rise @ 27°C but it's still not perfect and took way too long... did you laminate only once? your loafs always look spot on, its something i'd love to achieve! keep up the great work :)
Delicious and good recipe
I'm your new subscribe 😊😊
Awesome, stay tuned :)
Can you comment on baking at altitude (6000')?
Not with any confidence, I haven't had any hands-on experience baking at altitude. I hope to organise a trip soon to put some ideas into practice, so stay tuned :)
Ok. So, after I create the bread dough, rest 30 min, kneed lightly and let rest 1 hr, I stretch out, do the folds, shape into bowl and LET REST SIX HRS at room temp before shaping into a banneton and proofing overnight. Do I have that right????
I was confused with that also.
Good looking loaf, especially for the hydration! I think all the tension you built and having a good active starter go a long way in that spring
Followed this recipe and super happy with the results. Thank you
Awesome! I'll be sharing some more beginner recipes very soon. The next one in the series will be a waste not want not sandwich loaf, using up the discard that was generated by creating the starter.
Can’t wait
Hi Phillip, so good to find a UK teacher on here showing off some epic skills.
I tried to sign up for the course but sadly it’s closed for now, do you know when or if registration will re open ?
In the meantime is there anywhere I can get the Magnus calculator prior to the course re opening?
Keep up the great work.
Steve
Hey Steve, can you drop me an email using the address on the website and I'll let you know the details for Sourdough Unchained (the course/community) and I'll give you all the details you need for Magnus. Looking forward to touching base.
@@CulinaryExploration done 👍
What brand of flour do you use?
I'm using an All purpose flour by Robin Hood. Although it's called AP it does have a high prtein content - 13.2%. But you need to adpapt your sourdough baking to suit the flour that you have available. Starting with a sensible hydration works wonders. Then you can slowly increase the hydration to suit the flour.
Thank you so much for piece of advice
👌👍
I really need your advice, it doesn’t open very well for me (out of 4 attempts it opened only once like yours, everything seems to be the same for me
Thank you
* I've answered your question on your other comment on this post :)
I really need your advice, it doesn’t open very well for me (out of 4 attempts it opened only once like yours, everything seems to be the same for me
Thank you
Hey there. It's really good news if one of your loaves sprung and opened up like mine. That means your starter is strong enough to fuel the fermentation and you managed to judge the fermentation process well. Now it's time to build on that success. Make sure you track the method every time you bake. Note down the temperature of your kitchen, how long you left the dough to bulk ferment for, how long the ambient proof in the basket took, how long you cold retarded the dough for, the oven setup, baking temperature and duration. This way you'll be able to compare the process for the loaves that worked against the ones that didn't and tweak the process. Unfortunately I can't tell what went wrong without understanding the process you used but I hope you follow my advice and start tracing your progress. You can also sign up to my email community by downloading the sourdough calculator linked in the description. I share instructions on baking sourdough and my experiences trying new recipes and methods. All my best, Phil
Hi Phil , the weather has changed in the Caribbean and it’s very humid! I am having a lot of problems creating a reasonable sourdough bread . Can you tell what is the problem? I am still using the box cooler with a thermometer but I’m getting a heavy sourdough bread. Help!
🙏❤ Россия.
Спасибо за честность и искреннее желание помочь другим научится печь хлеб. Вы замечательный учитель -
все просто и понятно!!
Если получится моя закваска, я обязательно испеку эту буханочку!!
Awesome! Keep me posted 👍
Love your work. What kind of oven stones do you use or recommend for baking?
You can use a baking pan or a dutch oven if you are only going to be baking one loaf at a go. I use a lava rock baking stone (cut from Mt Etna) most of the time because it gives me the flexibility to bake multiple loaves if I want. I had it cut to the dimensions of my oven shelf to maximise the baking surface. It's 20mm think so it retains the heat well. There also no heavy lifting as my stone lives in the oven. If I'm baking one loaf I tend to use a large lightweight enamel pot to cover the dough. If I'm baking multiple loaves I use a steamer pod instead of the pot. Hope this helps. Phil
What do you think about Milk kefir starter? I was thinking of making some, but I am worried about botulism or the milk going bad.
Why does my bread in when cooking in the oven not cook evenly? It’s always doughy near the bottom so heartbreaking
Can you please share what brand of flour you used for this recipe?
I use Robin Hood all purpose flour. While it's labelled as all purpose it has a protein content of 13% making it nice and strong. It also produces a great loaf. Protein content is a good indicator as to the strength of the flour but you don't really know how the flour will behave until you use it to feed your starter and/or bake with it. Don't be afraid to test different flour to see what works best for you. If you are a beginner I'd suggest sticking with strong (protein content upward of 12%) white bread flour until you've got to grips with the process. Then it's time to have some fun and experiment with wholewheat flour and different grains. Happy baking 😀🍞
Hi! I see in every method I see not to add the salt to the autolysis phase. Have you seen any differences?
Hey Laura, I always dissolve the salt into the water before mixing. The salt doesn't interfere with the fermentation and I manage to get great spring and crumb structure. You should try a comparison and see which you prefer. Have you tried adding the salt to the water before mixing?
What do you do with the jar of discard? Do you have a video on that? Thanks
I'm going to show you how to make an amazing sandwich loaf with the discard. That will be in the fourth video of this series. The next video (3) will show you how to transition your starter to a discard-free maintenance program. Stay tuned :)
Should I follow the amount of water you've used if the humidity lvl in my loc is 60-80 or should I use less water?
Follow the recipe as it is and then make adjustments based on the results if necessary. This recipe is 65% hydration so I don't think you'll have nay issues. Keep me posted.
I will and I really appreciate your response..just gathering my equipment, I don't have a dutch oven and looking for that kind of pot like what you've used..is that a stainless or what kind of pot should I look for😅
@@yabjiyabji5789 I use the pot along with a good quality baking stone that retains a lot of heat. I've found this combination to work well. The pot is enamel and came free with my oven so unfortunately I don't have a link. But I can tell you that it measures 15cm deep, 28cm wide x 38cm long.
Strong Bread Flour is not really a thing here in New Zealand, they use High Grade which isn't really strong enough IMHO therefore I make my own from plain flour (10.3% protein) and add 5g of gluten per 100g of plain flour (it's actually called Bakers Flour from the cash n carry I buy it from). UK has amazing strong bread flours although I realise you are in Hellas (opa)! Efharisto poli, have been following you for a while now and making great sourdough.
Sending a big hello over to NZ (my next favourite country after Greece!). It sounds like you are doing well. You need to be able to work with what you can get. If adding vital wheat gluten works for you, then stick with it. Don't rule out softer AP flour. I use one here that has a protein content of 10% and it works well with lower hydrations.
@@CulinaryExploration OK I will think about using it then and make some notes in my book!! Actually my local poncy bakery use the same flour as me as I have seen the sacks stacked up in their shop, however I don't know whether they add anything to it to make their breads etc but they are quite costly (the products), which is understandable as they have overheads, however their Sourdough didn't have a sour taste at all and I think for $9 (5 Euros) my homemade one was better. I did actually make sourdough soft dinner rolls using AP flour and I must admit they were good.
@@sarahdavis1198 With a bit of practice and time I think it's possible to beat the loaves we can find at an artisan bakery. For a start, we can tweak the ingredients to suit our tastes. I love using AP flour for dinner rolls, they turn out super soft! Happy baking and keep me posted!
@@CulinaryExploration Well I took your advice and used AP flour to make sourdough dinner rolls and they were pretty damn good ie nice and soft - Νόστιμο - cheers!
@@sarahdavis1198 Bravo! I'm pleased you enjoyed them :)
Do I alter the ratio of flour to water when the flour is 10 protein?
So no bulk fermentation on this recipe? Can you use this method with mature starter? I’m always intrigued with the new things you come up with! Thank you for sharing👍🏻
Hey there! There is a bulk fermentation in this method. It spans from when the dough is mixed to when it is shaped and popped into the basket. This formula will work perfectly with a mature starter. You'll get great results :)
@@CulinaryExploration So 30 mins, 1 hour, laminate another hour, shape, 2 hours in the basket and retard overnight?
@@wdjones4735 The dough was mixed, rested for 30m, quickly kneaded, rested for an hour, and laminated. The dough is then left to complete the BF properly. Then it's shaped, proofed at room temp and then retarded in the fridge overnight.
Thanks Phil! I’m doing a bread workshop with my sister-in-law today. We are going to try this method🙂
@@wdjones4735 Give it a whirl, Whitney, I think you'll both like it! Keep me posted :)
What's the point of covering the dough in the oven? Why not just heat the DO and then the dough in it? Would'nt it yield better results?
Without the cover the skin of the dough will get hard within minutes and the dough has no chance to expand/rise. If you don‘t cover it you have to use steam to prevent it from getting hard. I did the mistake of not covering my very first dough in the oven and the result was so disappointing.
@@marcotronic I understand. But why not use dutch oven all together then.
@@adriangrzymski3847 good question :) I'm using "the Brovn" - a dutch oven with a glas top. Awesome but expensive.
You can use a dutch oven if you prefer. I've used the challenger pan and budget Amazon DO with great success. But I prefer using a baking stone with a lightweight cloche. The stone produces an awesome crust on the bottom of the loaf and I can bake bigger loaves that wouldn't fit in either DO.
I don't get it !!!
I have been trying to bake sourdough for 15 years , I still cannot get a consistent loaf !!!
So you are saying a starter that has been fed daily for 30 days is better than one fed weekly, even though it triples in volume ?
Hey Mark, I think it's best to feed your starter daily when you first create it. Once it's nice and strong you can switch to a low-maintenance method by leaving the starter in the fridge between baking sessions (coming in the next vid). If your starter is tripling I doubt you've got any issues with the strength. Have you tried a simple formula like this?
Do you use the 9 or 10 inch banneton?
I use these baskets: www.culinaryexploration.eu/proofing-baskets-bread-tins - (Dimensions: 24cm x 15cm x 8cm)
@@CulinaryExploration For those of us on this side of the pond, 24cm=9.45inches. Not sure if that qualifies as 9" or 10"!!! Although it round down to 9
@@DrRockower To be honest there is a variance between all of my baskets. No two are exactly the same. As long as you are in the ballpark the recipe should be fine. You can always use a dough/recipe calculator to tweak the dough weight to suit.
I am using king Arthur brad flour and with the ratios my dough is so sticky I can not kneed it at all. 😢
@@RebeccaC2024 Hey Rebecca, I'd suggest double-checking you've got the recipe spot on and baking again. Several of our Sourdough Unchained members use King Arthur bread flour with great results. The hydration of this recipe is 65% which should be well in the range for the King Arthur bread flour. Failing that you can try to reduce the water a little (you can use my calculator available on the website - www.culinaryexploration.eu). You can always drop me an email if you want any pointers. Phil
Thanks for this series I made the mistakes you said trying my first loaf about a month ago. Too eager to bake ! I then found this series and my starter is now 14 days old and looking great, im going to continue feeding like you recommend. The hardest part for me living in an old Scottish stone house is getting a high enough room temp. Now we’ve had sun for a week it’s really helped 😂. Looking forward to the results of my first proper loaf in a couple of weeks Thanks again for sharing your knowledge
It takes a while for the starters to get going. If you follow the instructions you shouldn't have any issues. I LOVE Scotland!!! I spent a fair bit of time on the West coast in Glencoe, it's one of my favourite places on the planet! You could create a DIY chamber for next to nothing. A cool box with a good old fashioned hot water bottle will work wonders. (just make sure the starter/dough container doesn't get too close to the bottle). You can control the temperature by mixing cold water with boiling water from the kettle. I'd suggest getting yourself a little thermometer to monitor what's going on. I saw the biggest improvements in my baking when I removed temperature from the equation. Happy baking and keep me posted :)
Thanks for all your help during this. I started this out because I enjoyed bread and was trying to "master" it, but so much was about sourdough, however I was sure I didn't like sourdough as I tried it once years ago. But with so many recipes, so many people liking it, maybe there was something off with what I tried. Nope. It's vile. I can't believe anyone would want bread with that taste in it. It's the antithesis of bread, the freshness, the warmth, the complimentary softness that is a vehicle for so many flavours. Sourdough just..ergh.
It made me think of all that weird fermented fish stuff and just weirdly gross flavours of things. At least now I know though, and can take the things I learned and just transplant em into my yeasted bread. Getting a banneton seems to be the last step of my journey as the loaf I made came out great, I was using a silicone one previously and it was utter shite
Anywho enough waffling. Thanks for your help, a lot of your info is helpful because I like slowly risen yeasted bread, so I'll just swap out levain for poolish and a small bit of yeast!
Awesome-looking crumb structure. I don't know if you baked this one w/ 100% strong white bread flour. My go-to loaf always has 10% whole wheat, 5% dark rye flour. My crumbs are never that open. I'm still using your pate fermentee 'levain' method and it's really cut down on the amount of discard I generate. I'm glad to see you're putting out some new videos. And, BTW, I just figured out what "I See Bread People" means. I'm guess I'm a bit slow this morning (in USA). More coffee needed. LOL.
Hey Daniel, this was baked with 100% strong white bread flour. I think it's easy for beginners, especially on the first loaf. I'm pleased you are enjoying the pate ferment method. It's super simple once you get going. Did you find that the pate ferment took a while to find a rhythm?
@@CulinaryExploration As long as I bake at least every 2 weeks or so and sometimes up the feeding, I’ve had good results. Much easier than preparing a levain. I need to play around with/ my flour combinations to see if I can get a better crumb structure.
@@danielnichols3594 Keep me posted!
Sending you many thanks, from mountains of Colorado!
Living in high altitude, 9800 miles above see level, I will be so grateful, if you can make video of your vision and tips, baking in this area.❤
Keep you amazing work!
Sending a big wave over to Colorado! 👋 Please tell me you're not really 9800 miles above sea level ;) - I've not had the chance to bake at altitude but it's on my baking bucket list so stay tuned!
Ooo yes I am, 9800ml above!
It is beautiful small town named Frisco, wild nature just out of your door, you can’t beat it, if you like mountains, snow and have dogs!
Come visit! ❤
@@marinaisaeva4024 That sounds like my cup of tea! You can't beat the great outdoors.