Racism is Racism | Debate 💢
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- Опубликовано: 11 сен 2024
- edited by @soybyte
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I'm so sick of people acting like there are no solutions to the problems we face.
Just cause there’s a way to fix something doesn’t mean it’s actually possible or realistic
If problems are fixed people won’t have their protected victim status
@@6laka. You know that effectively no one wants to be a victim right? A mathematically irrelevant number of people want that. And you are likely conflating being a victim and speaking about it without knowing how to fix it with being a victim and wanting to stay a victim.
@@KeroKeroKuraido no one wants to be a *real* victim.
People like this don’t suffer from “white supremacy” they’re making a living on social media selling a grift from the comfort of their spare bedroom.
It's coz deep down, they don't want solutions...they want revenge.
"Whos having that conversation with the police"
Sir, do you know how democracy and local government works ?
And how's that been working out for us so far...?
It doesn't work
@@giloteen It's been working just fine. Got slavery banned, for example.
@@giloteenExactly how you would expect it to when the majority of people who vote in local elections are old white people whilst the left is obsessed with national issues.
Slavery wasn’t banned via the democratic process. It took a war. Wtf are you going on about? Go back to sleep… There’s explicit bias in masse that’s the problem… it’s not a matter of us not voting… How do you Joe Biden got elected? I’ll help you… YOUNG Black people flipped traditionally red areas via the work of politicians such as Stacy Abrams…
Let’s talk about how the DNC positioned two pro cop candidates in the wake of the George Floyd protests… Let’s talk zoning laws in blue areas that promote “affordable housing,” but don’t actually create any… which is why Cali & NY have the highest rent rates in the country…
The problem is that no one is actually on our side. One sells us a message allowing token progress while the other slams and demonizes us… but ultimately both are complicit in a system designed to disrupt progress in Black communities.
The only issue I’ve come across in these kinds of conversations is the person wanting to “educate” the other is unable to take and handle any push back or confused and misunderstanding without having a breakdown and getting upset.
This dude was cool. I think his natural tone of voice is just really condescending unintentionally so it kinda gets misinterpreted as what you described.
@@purplegreenandred I think he may have been talking about the people who would be sent to have the types of conversations Destiny was talking with these people.
And I agree with him to some extent. It's a hard job. You'd definitely need someone with genuine good faith and that's willing to receive push back because people's thoughts/ideas don't change overnight, etc.
I mean...im only one person but ive never seen a workplace diversity educator (or similar) break down or get upset lol. We're talking about genuinely informed people, not comment section educators. Im also kinda curious what you mean by getting upset? Theres a HUGE behavioral trend of saying and doing things specifically for the purpose of upsetting the person you are talking to, and then pretending like it's bizarre or unusual that they're upset. Like, people will say things to be mean and illicit a response, and then proceed to make fun of that person for having the very reaction their words were designed to illicit. In any case, yes, it's important to be thoroughly educated in a topic *and* prepared for pushback so as to be able to effectively navigate that mindfield while getting the information where it needs to be, but i don't want to pretend that being a friggin jerk is normal or acceptable behavior, or that the onus is completely on the educator to be stone faced and just take it. There's definitely a balance to be had.
@@nikki1400 it’s a fairly common thing for these types of people send to do the training shut down the conversation when they get pushback because it’s point they disagree with. Even yourself is shutting down the conversation by calling it “common section educators” when everyone has their own experiences and could be more education than the people send to train. Also these trainers could make reports that cause people to lose their jobs because they either didn’t pass the training for pushing back or don’t have the right opinion.
I think it's pretty rare for these people to break down or get upset from a little push back. They may be annoyed at someone bringing up random and irrelevant information that takes up their time slot, but that's more of a corporate training issue than it is about the subject.
This assumes racism is an issue of hearts and minds instead of incentive.
That’s probable what buddy on the bottom was saying
If by incentive, you mean that minority populations will always be disadvantaged, then that is true. Its a problem that no society has ever been able to solve.
Black guy here, I train bjj with police officers all the time. My bjj school regularly going to police departments for self defense. Really nice men and women who doesnt seem racist and I know some personally... But imma tell you right now Destiny is wrong here lol. These guys deny, deny and deny there is a problem structually and think its a bad apple thing. They wont listen.
Your anecdote backs up Destiny’s claim though?
You just said the individual actors don’t seem to be actively racist, just that they can’t recognize the systemic issues.
Not being able to see the issue doesn’t mean that the issue doesn’t exist and it also doesn’t mean that they’re being intentionally racist. It means they’re ignorant, not hateful.
Ignorance can be fixed simply by teaching.
Hatred can only be fixed by having positive life experiences with the people you hate (and thats not even a guarantee).
It's ABSOLUTELY important to differentiate interpersonal racism and structural racism.
Black kids get an unfair shake in our public school systems. The schools that are primarily black tend to be underfunded. This is because schools are funded generally by property tax, and because black people are typically poorer than whites and own less property, there's less taxes collected to fund the schools.
If you can't differentiate between systemic and interpersonal racism, you'd just assume that the head of the school systems (local, state, or federal) are secretly racist and just keep replacing them with whoever can virtue signal their love of equality the loudest. But knowing that the problem is structural racism, you can take the proper steps to fix the issue.
This is why Ron DeSantis has been explicitly targeting "wokeness", which his lawyers explicitly defined as discussions on structural issues. Because people like him want to keep black people in positions of weakness and disadvantage.
Underfunded? My understanding was that often these achools of funds dumped on them with no impact on performance.
@@Crimsonwhocares No, I don't believe that's the case.
@Crimson Spork no you can search it up, "black schools" do generally have less funds.
@@Crimsonwhocaresthat’s so insane to even type out. Wtf.
A married couple with kids makes more money than a Mom with three baby daddies.
"we can teach them to not be racist anymore"
😂😂😂😂
sure you can
It's also on moral grounds. If a structure has a problem, and you blame the individuals, you're actually being immoral.
Hum. That’s a very odd and unnecessary thought. Taken to the extreme, the nazi guy shouldn’t be hated and blamed because it was a structural thing?
@@rdalgeGermany had structural problems and individual problems before Hitler
@@rdalge Its like you've never heard of the Nuremberg trials.
Soo if you work at a workplace with a bad company culture where most of the management yells at employees who are lower in file, is it a company failing or each individual manager’s failing?
Well part of dismantling racist structures is individuals in them to recognize the patterns and work to change them. If an individual cop is a nice guy but also doesn’t report their coworkers excessive use of force against an unarmed black man I believe in that instance the bystander is also responsible
It doesn't help that the argument for structural racism is usually just saying "the existence of this unequal outcome is proof of racism" and there's never a spotlight shown on the mechanism.
If a system is racist, you need to be able to point to the specific part that's racist about it. If it's systemic, then you should be able to point to the law, policy, or guideline that acts differently towards members of different races and creates the racial disparity.
It’s out their, y’all just don’t care to look for confirmation bias.
Hundreds of books were written on it, from sociologists to psychologists to economists. Your willful ignorance isn't representative of the social science consensus that proves systemic racism. It only proves you're displaying your ignorance with reductive statements.
Are you for Real?
@@t-rik4583Ignorance is bliss bro. No point in explaining something to someone who doesn’t care
When people make the structural racism argument the examples are definitely there. Michelle Alexander’s “The new Jim Crow” is a book that explicitly breaks down how the prison justice system in America racially discriminates at every level including mapping the political and social changes, the legislation, and the court precedents that mechanically allow for discrimination to occur when they are combined with implicit racial biases present in the American population.
Me: watches destiny clip then checks comments
Comments: insert fake intellectual take that barely makes sense.
Now if Destiny could only tell those African American studies professors not to conflate systemic racism with the vernacular word racism. You don't need institutional power to be a racist. Looking at you Micheal Dyson...
Or you can just look at the LA riots where thousands of Korean owed businesses got destroyed due to racial hatred. I bet they don't teach that in schools either. I wonder if the CRT activists would support teaching that fun little tidbit from the "true racist history of America"? I'm betting no.
@BrandonHeat243 the cops shuffled black people into that area to spark a fight.
@@brahimdiop5506 *That's not racism.*
@@SinewRending Literally everything he named was racism 😂 im confused
@@ihateanimebutonlywhenitiso7227 *Sit down.*
I'm really starting to pull away from this structural racism concept, because it's almost used exclusively as if intent doesn't matter at all. Meaning any racial disparity should be thought of as "racism/white supremacy", which completely changes the way we view and fix these issues.
I think it can also incite division like BLM did. Even though I'd say that it wasn't the initial intentions of the movement, you see anti-police sentiment within it and because of that, now it seems like police forces throughout the country carry a more "us vs the public" mindset.
When Destiny says "the hit rates for drugs don't justify the stops", there's no real context to it.
Is there only a 2% increase for black people to possess drugs? Or are they 40% more likely to posses cops, and are 60% more likely to be stopped?
Because a cop who knows that blacks are more likely to have drugs, aren't going around asking other cops if they've stopped any black person recently, so that their "hit rates" are evenly matched.
They'll just stop them if they seem even slightly suspicious.
@@GameFuMaster like back in the 80s-90s when a blvak person found with crack would get a sentence 10× the length of a white person found with cocaine??
@@anubis8918 what year are we in?
@@GameFuMaster so racially disparities don't matter cos its not the 80s??
@@anubis8918 is it caused by the system purposefully discriminating against them, or is it because the racial group themselves are holding themselves back?
Let me use your logic for a moment and see how you respond.
Around 80% of homicide victims, and 90% of perpetrators in the USA are men. Do sex disparities not matter? Is this a systematic issue? Or maybe it's the byproduct of the sex?
Let's look at your racial issue another way. Asians on average earn the most, even more than white people. Is this because the system favors Asians? Or is it a byproduct of the group?
This was a pretty good convo, but there were a few unfortunate miscommunications right off the bat that kind of made things a bit muddy. Still very civil and hopefully the groundwork is there for better future discussions.
It’d be cool if you put where you got the clip from in the description my mans.
I get where he’s coming from in that the source of the racism means nothing to the person receiving the racism but then what do we do? Do we throw the whole person away or allow them to continue their behavior? Feeling upset and uncomfortable regardless of the intent is fine and justified but when trying to fix the problem, the intent is really important. That’s not to say that you should not feel upset for different intents.
at least he sat there and listened without interruption and remained completely respectful towards him
Can you link the full debate?
here :
ruclips.net/video/RdKQsjW0iz0/видео.html
+1
I second this
ruclips.net/user/liveRdKQsjW0iz0?feature=share it begins at 35 minutes of this vod
@@juliam530 Thanks cap! Tho, you forgot to fly away❤
Today’s racism is the obsession with skin color and not discrimination against a certain race either way it is wrong and should be called out every time!
Someone teach these people basic civics!
Who's these people? This dude was coming from a systemic analysis, and Destiny also said the systemic analysis is important. Their approach is different, but this clip doesn't do the convo justice at all
@@mr.negativenancy5751 bro outed himself with “these people”
But seriously it is concerning that people just gloss over this clear cut difference. Like what destiny said was clearly a basic thought, nothing profound he just had an example to back it up but that’s not some profound thing. I really wish people would stop doing the thing where they kind of glance over evidence or try to bunny hop over any hiccup or instance where their argument could get stopped or questioned because it just makes everyone sound stupid and almost like in a cult. The way he explained that concept was the same way I’d imagine someone in a cult trying to justify their delusion with “logic”. Even if it’s minute u gotta back it up, you cant just say it’s irrelevant. Just summarize why you think we should tackle both problems the same way if you feel that wayz
You guys done with the pearl clutching? Need a fainting couch as well? It's like being brittle is an aesthetic for you internet "activists".
Also, When did I say the systemic analysis was unnecessary?
The dude couldn't comprehend that there were differences between how we solve racism at different scales, what's wrong with saying people like him and you (Internet activists, again) should study basic civics before harming minorities with your silly attention whoring?
@@shinymew1213 yeah. I'll just say that in the full discussion (really never seemed like a debate) this dude had lots of things to back up his stances. This clip is cut very favorably for Destiny, who was demonstrating a lack of knowledge on the subject. Pretty sure this dude was saying we need to focus on the systems and institutions that perpetuate racism and that deal with most of the personal racism. Destiny argues that we didn't need history to do that which was wild to me.
the bewilderment in his question about who would be having such a conversation is what produces that strange confidence in the ideology of abolishing the police.
people think far leftists are just talking out of their backside but for a lot of them there are several layers of partitioned ideological beliefs behind their hot takes (which the person themselves might not be aware of).
and the task of breaking that down so we talk about realistic actionable solutions is first and foremost unearthing those beliefs.
a hard task!
I was today years old when these terms were officially introduced to me, before I had no way of telling because I couldn’t understand the terminology
This is so weird. I agree with the blue hair guy.
Destiny is correct because when you collapse the differences then it’s the same thing
One of the biggest signs someone is working through their own yt privilege is "idk.... Just, ya know, have someone tell them it's wrong"
Do people actually think this is something nobody else ever thought of??
I think he talks fast so he can throw shit over peoples heads i literally had to watch his videos 2 or3 time just to understand
The lower dude is “just hanging around”
The individual is free to be racist as much as hw likes, and legit it doesn't matter, as long as the system that institutionalized this racism is not fix, no real change can come to the affected comunities
racism bad, what is this song called ?
pleeaaaseee
Why would you come on the channel and argue about the state of racism with a blue haired black Queen and act like you have the answers? The audacity.
I think it's always easy to judge when you're not the one in the situation. Where it's their life or your life? And just because you believe the officer involved shooting was because of the perpetrator's race in every case that has not even been proven was not even a. Issue in the court when they did go to court? Then you're just not honest with what you saw on the videos
This person seems to be ok while hearing attentively at someone whose opinions differ, haven't seen the original entire video but as per this clip he's got my respect
Racism is racism, people are people, crime is crime, none connect with the other. They are independent issues that are causing the other sure, but they *stop* the *cause*
Stats don’t show people a lot of rich people think they are helping when they are hurting. Hate is hate. If your hateful I can’t put it on your family. Hate the sin love the sinner,
Tf u talking about?
Damn that’s crazy. I pray for all his fans😂
Another clear example of where both sides are wrong and clueless
That is also why even calling it systemic or institutional racism has caused so much backlash, because you're bringing all the - rightly so - highly morally loaded baggage of 'racism' as a set of ideological beliefs or as a bigoted sentiment to the discussion of: How can we draft policies which reduce harm disadvantageously directed at one racial/racialised group, which exist either due to reasons rooted in an actually racist historical policy, other historical contingencies or current systemic failures? Most people are generally sympathetic to anti-racist policies and can be convinced to relieve racial groups of these disadvantageous policies. You won't reach many of them, though, if you tell them America is systematically racist and, since you as an individual white person are the benefactor of said system, you are eternally racist yourself; and all you can really do is shut up, be a good ally and help topple the system, so that one day we might actually not have to call you a racist anymore.
Lol. Yall really need to understand the difference between racism, bigotry and prejudice. You just described two racists officers but gave cover to ignorance for the second cop. Smh
Damn kurtis was higher then method man 😢
full video?
What’s this from? I don’t recognize the bottom guy
Anyone have the link to the full debate
Is this Tyler1's dad?
song title pllleeeasseee
Question is.. . Was his dentist racist??
I would choose to be blue too
Do they skip civics classes in some states? We had 3 years of it and a whole bunch of drills where these people were the mayor or the senator or the president and who you went to for each of your problems etc etc
Az doesn’t have civics
Audacity
So there is a study out there but he can’t cite it. This is why we build universities. You would not take seriously the diagnosis of a doctor who can’t reference the supporting research let alone the opinions of a college drop out.
Destiny had some weak stances in this debate. Things like history not being necessary to teach about racism because people stop listening when you talk about slavery, ignoring Jim Crow. Then turning around and not understanding the difference between colorism and discrimination 500 years ago vs racism now.
I struggle to listen to destiny debate anyone who isn't a full fledged red piller or racist. He can dismantle a right wingers alright, but I see very little value to what he adds in debates he clearly knows less about.
I would disagree a bit with this take, because it really isn't necessary to point out flaws that can currently be addressed. It would be good and certainly helpful to know the history but it isn't a need. Kind of like buying a used car that needs work done to it. You don't need to know the entire history of the car to fix the lights, brakes, whatever it needs to get it running right again but it certainly is a bonus.
@@FattyMcJigglez the people who know it's broken don't need to know its history, but if you have a misfiring cylinder in your first car, you may not realize the car is not supposed to jerk around and occasionally shut off. But yeah if everyone knows exactly what's broken and what's possible, we can make it work. History helps with that.
@@FattyMcJigglezthe history is very important.
Thats why you can always find a documentary about the holocaust and hitler coming out every year.
The history is very important because some of those historical opinions still stand today
Wtf how can you read someones mind and assume a cop is racist
Most harbor some type of racial animus or racial bias. I'll reference a quick study that analyzed the body camera audio between white officers and African American members of the public. White and Hispanic would use a louder tone of voice in conjunction with slang whenever interacting with an African American as opposed to interactions with whites, which saw a lower tone of voice in addition to proper English being used.
Blue man bad
The Smart Brother evolution tree only branches in 3 directions.
- talks like a karen, tone/cadence
- dashiki/black power fist
- nice suit/muslim
But it makes me feel better if I believe problems have no solutions and thus we need to annihilate society and rebuild identical institutions from the ground up! /s
Destiny steve on addys look at his pupils
The white guy is on point.The black guy does not have a clue.
So destiny's general point was there is way bias and everyone need "re-education" to stop them from seeing whats blatantly in front of tgem
No, the general point was when someone holds a biased belief based on faulty information that person’s mind is more easily changed with better information; whereas a person that genuinely hates another group of people is harder to convince of the opposite to what they believe regardless of quality of information. This distinction changes the way in which the problems within institutions can be fixed. Fire the hateful people and educate the misled. You have to be wildly disingenuous to view this argument as “HUR DUR PUT THEM IN RE-EDUCATION CAMPS TO HIDE TRUTH.” Yikes dude.
@@ColmanRetro ok scooby, your just repeating what he said, you people like to do that.
both his examples are based on the premise that the person/people are either inherently racist which we can all agree is disgraceful or they are unintentionally discriminating based on bad information.
one has no hope the other needs ''re-education'' therefor the ONLY outcome is ''re-education''
this whole argument is also based on the premise that the information is bad and look maybe stop and searching more black people because black people statistically are more likely to be involved in criminal activities is the wrong way to go about it or maybe it isn't but in London they banned the stop search tactic because of supposed discrimination and what do you think happened? stabbings skyrocketed and 90 - 95% of all victims and offenders were.........you guessed it black.
so when you see things like this does it mean you need ''re-education'' because what your seeing is the fact that for whatever reason the black community is committing a majority of the violent crime or if your logical, not racist but just trying to do your job by focusing your limited resource on tackling the issue which unfortunately involves more attention being spent on the black communities that inevitably will involve innocent people being profiled?
@@HEKTIKx you're*
I stopped reading after that, good day.
@@Cat_Magic811 of course you did.
The grammer police only ever turn up when they have nothing else to say.
@@HEKTIKx education is the reason for the racist people in the 1st place.
The education system is biased and the misinformation taught for over 100 years has never been addressed.
As for london...the vast majority of people that where being stopped where not the people carrying knives and involved in gangs.
When Scotland was the stabbing capital of Europe it was treated as a health crisis and the problem was addressed and fixed.
The stabbings in london are treated as a criminal race issue and it got worse
This guy has to be related to beetlejuice
haha BLUE HAIR, he looks like a girl. Which makes sense because even his names a GIRLS name. BLM ✊🏾
You do realize that saying this has not achieved anything, right? All you did was attack him on his name and hair. This has nothing to do with the argument he made. At all.
Bro he is literally a better advocate for blm causes than black aiden ross over there
@@KobKoboldcry lol
Most nuanced BLM argument.
@@pillowboy7995yea were crying😢
Hahaha
This obsession with anti-rascism makes no sense
Just like the conservatives obsessing over trans. It makes no sense.
I hate when people whitesplain to black or brown people about racism.
the guy literally didn’t know what the difference was, it’s not “whitesplaining” if he doesn’t know
I hate it when people womensplain about what someone can or cant talk about.
Nuke em!
Its called diminishing returns. After a while the hit rate would drop but that doesnt mean it isnt working. That means the drug dealers got smarter.
What? That has nothing to do with their discussion.....
WHAT IS BLUD TALKING ABOUT
Mans off the perc
@@benjamink2398 i was talking about destiny's example of systemic racism. He brought up hit rates not justifying rates of police stops.
🤣🤣🤣 bro needs testosterone or he may be put on life support
When did a diversity commissar achieve anything Destiny?