dude I don't know what your problem is but you may have never noticed that you had always enough time lurking around to play it sufficiently but I totally agree with this tier list here of The god Gamer
Last Epoch over Grim Dawn bricked me. Grim Dawn is rated higher than Elden Ring on Steam (all reviews, much higher for recent reviews) and Last Epoch is literally sitting at around 60% post-launch. If that's not overwhelming evidence that they don't belong on the same tier (let alone LE be ranked higher), the fact that LE up to level 90 is easier than D4 should do it. Everything else I can understand (from Quon's point-of-view, not mine) but that is just HOLYY DIESOFCRINGE yap yap for real for real _paranoid old man noises_
@@metamon2704 Don't let me get in the way of your copes but offline players are also leaving negative reviews with campaign-breaking bugs, awful performance on high-end hardware and braindead-easy, shallow gameplay.
"d1 started everything but im gonna rate it based on how it feels to play now d2 im gonna pump it cuz it started everything d3 changed my life (not meme)"-quin
@@RitamBuchwald What are you on? D2 [in the current year] is so mid. The story and builds are alright, but the build diversity is low, inventory management is god awful, it is easy to brick a character, immunities are terrible, difficulty spikes are nuts (eg can kill diablo blindfolded on normal then struggle with act 1 on nightmare). It is definitely legendary and creatd the genre, and it is still fun for a run through here and there, but it is in no way S Tier
titan quest was very mediocre even on release. people remember it fondly probably haven't even finished the campaign. good last 1/4 of the game could be created overnight these days.
Torchlight I is like Diablo I but without cooI aesthetics or story. Also Fishing is dоgshit. Gets extremely boring after a few hours. Torchlight II is decent but again, aesthetics, the world and the story are super bland, which personally prevents me from sinking hundreds of hours into it. Also the quality in the later half the the game takes a nosedive. Torchlight III is an abomination. Also I think there's a mobile game.. who cares. Overall, honestly, it's a mid series. Titan Quest is pretty good, tho there're not many reasons to play it, since Grim Dawn is a direct upgrade over Titan Quest in every single aspect, unless you're super into Greek Mythology.
I dare anyone to play poe without looking a single thing up about the game and then tell me how great it is. i love poe because i started early but that game is a convoluted mess now and it does right at zero to explain any of it....play it without all of the add on programs, spreadsheets, pob, ect. Your opinion will 100% change
True but i don't see how that makes a game worse. As a matter of fact, i do like the games that have so much depth and content that you feel overwhelmed and forced to study the game on forums. It's a unique feeling that at least for me helps to involve myself more into the game. I enjoy reading forums and learning new things on the wiki, installing programs and what not to read builds and so on is something not every game offers. Pretty sure that if PoE didnt have all the mechanics and concepts it has, it would have a lower player-base and less rating from the community than it has today. Though i completely understand whoever despises it
Diablo 4 will never be good. It was developed with the wrong intent. It should have been made with the intent to make a good game, but it was instead made with the intent to milk the franchise for everything it's worth, tick as many boxes as possible to appear to as many people as possible, which resulted in a shit game with no depth or fun even.
It can't be good because the core is so bad - the skill trees are such a joke. Compare to last epoch, it's even worse! Last epoch so much more creative and interesting - the depth just so much better
Investors and normie gamers playing 30-minute sessions per week are happy. Blizzard is done to me. Never buying any of their product. They are soulless and disrespectful towards their loyal customers with the products they make today. They used to be pioneers in all genres they touched. Not anymore.
I also forgot the Sacred games, however I haven't played them either. As for Lost Ark. It is an arpg in a mmo format similar to how Blizzard made the new Diablo 4.
The Sacred games did open world ARPG way before D4 and imo they did it better, tons of cities, tons of quests, funny dialog/writing. The worst part about the sacred games is the combat feels more like MMO games, but other then that they were excellent gems in the ARPG genre.
@@christophersanders7877right? it's been 20 years and i still have to find a game like this but i agree that the combat is terrible for current standards
his take on grim dawn is so autistic,that game is so loved because its not live shitvice,some people hate it some people like it,yeah very few hate it considering its sitting on 95% on steam,always shifting around top 1-3 in its genre
For me being a live service game is not a pre, I love Grim Dawn because we will be able to play that game in 50 years and most of the games on this list will be dead and buries because the servers stopped or the companies died.
grim dawn in C is criminal imo, but i understand theres a lot of live service andies out there, its still better than current LE though, in almost all aspects. it is, what it is bois.
last epoch is better in the gameplay aspect,it does feel better,skils feel impactful and awsome,grim dawn wile a top 2-3 easily,is showing its age and the limitations of the ancient engine it was made on
@@deenman23 LE is a buggy mess, pick a skill and theres probably something that doesnt work correctly, has 0 balance, frame drop city with floaty movement and "ok" combat Not much diff than grim dawn, except grim dawns skills function
Yep grim dawn is the goat. I would rather support the indie devs from crate than any other big company. They really care about their game. In my oppinion its also way better that grim dawn has not much live service or online content. You can even play the game when your offline, holy s. Maybe I am just getting old but I am so sick and tired of all this live service online only bullshit. I just want to fucking grind, build my character and try some cool things. Grim Dawn is the perfect arpg when you are sick of all this nonsense bs.
@@punjabigaming146shit take tbh. D2 has the better itemization, the better skill tree (D3 doesnt even have a real skill tree lol) and the much better atmosphere and design. the only things D3 has going for it is that it has more content and better combat - both of which are solely bc it released over 10 years later.
@@dIggl3r Me too, I had fun time in D2, I'd say like 12 years ago so I was pretty late to the party (before I just played offline garbage builds as a kid, never even beat hell) but I just completed my lightning sorc, got perfect shako, perfect infinity that I made myself, all around cranked stuff, then I farmed hammerdin stuff with that sorc and then I was like, okay I have two most OP and versatile characters in this game, now what? And I quit lol. But I played D3 for like 1500 hours later. But still, that time with D2 is one of my most memorable gaming experiences, I'm very fond of that.
Methinks you need to give Grim Dawn another go. The skill system is top 3 in the genre, add in a cool constellation system, cool itemization, and a deep story that I actually felt a part of.... I won't put it god tier, but a high A is not out of the question.
Plus, the most clearly "heavy metal" satanic atmosphere. You entered the dungeon and the first thing you saw was skeletons on crosses - who then caught fire. The place was "evil" through and through. The sanctity of that place had been fouled, indeed.
Yea Lost ark is mmo not arpg, but it has the best combat, boss design, raids in an mmo ever… Imagine how great all these Kr mmos would be if they took a ounce of inspiration from their western counter parts
@@jgsource552 "mmo" is not a genre; it's like saying "first person" is a genre arpg doesn't mean dungeon crawler/hack & slash /diablo-like dark souls is arpg as well lost ark is mmo-arpg, but not diablo-like.
Is it not? If yes, then it should be reminded every day every hour for the hype it got from everyone and the millions of dollars in sales it got the the greedy company Blizzard
I want to love Last Epoch but i just cant get into in the leveling part is just so boring im basically forcing my way through it just to find the end game to be pretty meh too
@@TheFunkloft it just came out of early access and already has like 20 different QOL that diablo 4 does not have on its what 4-5th season? stop the cope, it does not need to be a ''diablo killer'' it can just be a better game, which well.. it is
@@romofin i mean wile LE's story isnt done,it has a cool gimmick with time travel....d4 is just.....shit,its the same tropes as in wow,literaly,bad man(woman) wants to make us stronk but we reject them,ow has done it a few times now
@@davidmccauleyytwasn't really blizzard though. It was made by a studio called Condor that blizzard bought and changed name to Blizzard North, which after D2 expansion got shut down by blizzard and every developer left.
Plays last epoch for 5 days at launch, gently experiences empowered monos and the other endgame systems...considers last epoch in the same tier as D3. Sorry, hes no longer an avid arpg gamer anymore. He plays POE, usually about two weeks with the exception of the current league. More variety more react streamer than an arpg streamer, but an arpg expert no longer. The dude gave last epoch a quick college try. Got through the campaign, got to the true endgame of empowered mono's and maybe got knee deep. Didnt push corruption high at all (did he even fight oro??). Hopped into a few dungeons and arena for a bit. and then said "I've seen what I wanted to see". You could tell he just wanted to go toe deep in all systems so he can say "I did everything" when in reality, you didnt really grind anything out like you would have if the game were called path of exile. You didnt give it the attention you would have or tried to find OP gear. With POE he will farm heist for days for GG gear, but doesnt really try to do that here. No target farming for gg gear. But will have the stones to compare LE to POE and say it needs more, where POE has 10 years of leagues. Jesus christ lol
Taking down D1 a notch because it matters not that it started everything but then putting D2 so high because "it started everything" must be the dumbest take on ARPGs i've ever heard.
For me GD, LE, and Van Helsing are all A Tier. D3 is B tier (I last played in like season 7 so not sure current state), and PoE is S Tier due to end game alone. I actually hate a lot about the game but build diversity and end game is just so good. Give PoE target farming, a ssf drop rate boost, and get rid of unfair enemies and no game would ever be better
Easy Ranking 1:POE Pro: content++,best bosses,crazy crafting,housing,transmog,builds,big skilltree,online, constantly big updates Con: no beginner,casual friendly, only cashshop gear looks dope, looting gear feels mid cause currency is taking over, hard to respec 2:LAST EPOCH Pro: decent content, crafting easy but fun, many builds(skill tree per active skill), fun endgame, online, looting feels good, easy respec, ingame filter Con: body armor looks ass, bosses meh, no wall/highground jumps or teleports, acts are confusing and mid 3: GRIM DAWN Pro: decent content, crafting easy but fun, many builds (double class),easy respec, by far best loot system dropping uniques actually feels good, ingame filter Con: not online like LE and POE, graphic meh, endgame could be better, gameplay feels very slow, killing big groups feels unsatisfying ah and fuck Diablo btw peace ✌
Diablo 2 had somewhat fun PvP at least back in the day. Lost Arc has a dedicated PvP mode I think. And PoE had one as well when I tried it a few years ago. But honestly it's not a great genre for PvP.
People have been saying this for years😂 not a D4 fan but it’s exhausting to hear morons like you act like a billion dollar company has put any nail in their coffins 😂😂😂😂😂
Playing Titan Quest now would probably end up C tier, it plays worse than Grim Dawn. Titan Quest at release was great, but it didn't age well. TorchLight 1 and 2 are good, solid B's. Didn't play 3 and Infinite I didnt play enough of (but probably B tier too). Missing Sacred 1 and 2 as options, both probably C tier. Personally would rank D2 God Tier but under PoE.
Yeah, Lost Ark C Tier TOTALLY AGREE. Combat is quite good but you have to choose between p2w and doing shitty homework for EVERY SINGLE DAY. I missed mmo's days...
Quins takes on ARPGs are not great imo because he did not play 99% of the classics to know why people liked the genre in the first place, nor does he really try to like any modern ARPG outside of POE or games that are hyped up for no reason (like LE). Quin was a WOW nerd who came into the ARPG genre (mostly with D3 of all games lol) with that same MMO/live-service mindset when most of the great ARPGs of the past were offline/peer-to peer co-op lol, his perspective of the genre is dependent on something most ARPG lovers did not care about back in the day (online) and that was mostly relegated to Blizzard games not ARPGs in general. I believe most of these modern POE/D4 streamers are mostly into online interactive MMO-lite ARPGs (POE, D4, D3,...etc) because most of them seem to have a WOW/MMO background, not a ARPG background (outside of D2). Sorry but the ARPG genre is more then just Diablo and POE. People act like Diablo was the only ARPG people enjoyed back in the day but there were tons of other great ARPGs and sleeper hits around the time too. There was Sacred 1-2 (did open world better them D4 imo and had mounts and everything), Dungeon Siege 1-2 (Party based ARPG no other game has replicated from my knowledge), Titan Quest (one of my favorites), The Divinity ARPGs (before Original Sin 1 and 2), FATE (predecessor to TL series), Silverfall, BG:Dark Alliance games (on the console side) ....etc. Then you have more modern indie ARPGs like Van Helsing, 40k Inquisitor, Chronicon, Ghostlore, Soldak ARPGs (Din's Legacy, Drox Operative 2 probably the most unique ARPG games I have played in a while), Hero Siege, Slormancer, Torchlight 1-2 ...etc and then the KING of the modern ARPG genre Grim Dawn and all of its expansions. I just like the ARPG genre as a whole and not just POE only hivemind that most of these streamers seem to have.
Ain't no F'ing way he ranked a game that has no dmg numbers option and the most generic bosses, the best ARPG (but expected he'd do it). Also, hit stuns from monsters is an absolute trash mechanic that unfortunately got into LE. Also too many options don't make a difference in this day and age (everyone will just copy a guide/build and that's it). Unless you're a no life or streamer.
There can be, depends on the context and perspective you are looking from. For example from a new and/or not experienced players in the genre eyes these factors can be way too overwhelming and repulsive.
From a pure gameplay perspective and given it's a mobile game, for me Immortal is A tier, there is actually no other mobile ARPG that can compare. Ironically enough i quit it not because the p2w but because you are forced to group to do anything above normal difficulty and i'm ssf since basically forever in these games. But again, if you forget the p2w shiet for a moment and judge the "game" part of the game, it's genuinely fun up to a certain point.
I think the ability to brick your build and inability to fix it aside from literally creating a new character. Keeps me from giving PoE the god tier rating. Stat requirements on gems and gear is dogshit. Not being able to experiment at all, is dogshit. Needing a folder of 3rd party apps just to play the game sub optimally, is dogshit. Game is not S tier. It is the best on the market for sure, but it isn't my preferred game anymore.
I'm an old school player of ARPG and I have never met any one that would not put Grimm Dawn on on the A list. Even Diablo players will admit that it's one hell of a game. And your idea of a live service is ridiculous, and goes against what about 99% of the players complain about.
The only adjustment I'd make there is to place Undecember in either category A or perhaps B, and Last Epoch in B. Undecember serves as a Path of Exile version for mobile, featuring monetization, thus it's somewhat of a meme, but its gameplay is quite solid. As for Last Epoch It's quite likely(maybe...idk) that this game will fade in relevance when Path of Exile 2 is released. From a developer's perspective, the game received an unusually high level of anticipation, to be honest. The gameplay is engaging, yet, coming from a Path of Exile background, I found many aspects that still require refinement. The narrative is somewhat underwhelming, and the graphics are hit or miss-either outstanding or subpar compared to Diablo 3 and Grim Dawn. The characters lack appeal, and the skill system feels disjointed and not well-aligned with the respective classes. The end-game content is lackluster, nothing extraordinary. The servers are inadequate. The only redeeming quality of the game is its gameplay, yet even that is significantly hampered by bugs. Returning to Path of Exile seems like the preferable option.
Putting D3 up with D2 that'll be a nah from me, D3's only influence was a dumbing down of the whole genre. Also where are games like Sacred that pushed the genre, Champions series that were a blast on console, Divinity series which helped propel Larian and a game that a lot of ARPG players have probably never even heard of and an old favorite of mine Shadowflare which sadly is not sold anywhere these days.
How has Quin not played Van Helsing? I played the first one on the hardest difficulty and it was a legit challenge but fun time. Maybe it is too hard for Quin and that's why he hasn't touched it
completely agree with your list. D4 has absolute 0 chance to get to got tier, the base game is just tooo bad, without any customization. I cannoot see how D4 can become more than A
Not played any torchlight games? I liked torchlight 2. But I suppose it's a bit like Grim Dawn, offline game. I've never actually gotten through Torchlight 2 cause my character just gets weaker the longer I play till I can't kill anything.
Decent list D3 one tier too high for sure Agreed with both D4 and LE having potential to be S tier. D4 has the foundation. Do the devs have the ability. We will wait and see after a year or 2. LE will be S tier by next year I have no doubt
Never played Titan Quest??? Diablo III is A tier??? Never played Titan Quest???
Says : ranking for current year
Putting the game in A: "cause to me i remember the glory days"
Integrity at its finest
It's the best but no one plays it. Not even at start of seasons. What gives?
Also put D4 in C: D4 has a chance in the future WTFF
@@notaweeb6513 tbh he was to kind on D4 as it currently is
@@Celantus D4 is 100% gutter trash as of the current state
Streamers love poe because theyre the only ones with enough time to play it.
dude I don't know what your problem is but you may have never noticed that you had always enough time lurking around to play it sufficiently but I totally agree with this tier list here of The god Gamer
Exactly. That plus streamer client RNG.
The integrity of this 'tier list' changed so very quickly 😂
Last Epoch over Grim Dawn bricked me. Grim Dawn is rated higher than Elden Ring on Steam (all reviews, much higher for recent reviews) and Last Epoch is literally sitting at around 60% post-launch. If that's not overwhelming evidence that they don't belong on the same tier (let alone LE be ranked higher), the fact that LE up to level 90 is easier than D4 should do it.
Everything else I can understand (from Quon's point-of-view, not mine) but that is just HOLYY DIESOFCRINGE yap yap for real for real _paranoid old man noises_
A significant amount of the negative reviews for last epoch are not about the game itself but about the horrible servers@@tukkek
@@tukkek You are putting too much faith into Steam ratings, Last Epoch got many bad reviews because of the server issues it had the first days.
How?
@@metamon2704 Don't let me get in the way of your copes but offline players are also leaving negative reviews with campaign-breaking bugs, awful performance on high-end hardware and braindead-easy, shallow gameplay.
"d1 started everything but im gonna rate it based on how it feels to play now
d2 im gonna pump it cuz it started everything
d3 changed my life (not meme)"-quin
d4 has massive potential, so its not gutter trash classic
@@toranksu2751a pile of dogshit has potential too
I don't know non blizzard games so I can't rank stuff XD
@@toranksu2751doubt
@@zalard6896 rip your gamer's life
No way D2 and D3 are in the same tier....
D3 more of a b tier, D2 is S tier though.
yeah D3 should be higher Clueless
D3 is easy D tier, D2 S+ tier.
Diablo 3 should be in utter trash.
@@RitamBuchwald What are you on? D2 [in the current year] is so mid. The story and builds are alright, but the build diversity is low, inventory management is god awful, it is easy to brick a character, immunities are terrible, difficulty spikes are nuts (eg can kill diablo blindfolded on normal then struggle with act 1 on nightmare). It is definitely legendary and creatd the genre, and it is still fun for a run through here and there, but it is in no way S Tier
arpg veteran never played titanquest, thats crazy
i mean he would play it and place it in C tied below Diablo 1. Because that is where it belongs.
That's cause he's clearly talking shite.
Not playing Torchlight or Titan Quest is a travesty.
Torchlight is a below mid for a current year, and Grim Dawn better in almost every aspect than TQ
@@Fodragon Obvious bait.
titan quest was very mediocre even on release. people remember it fondly probably haven't even finished the campaign. good last 1/4 of the game could be created overnight these days.
@@fartloudYT As could D1 or D2, and those are pioneers in the industry. What a trash take.
Torchlight I is like Diablo I but without cooI aesthetics or story. Also Fishing is dоgshit.
Gets extremely boring after a few hours.
Torchlight II is decent but again, aesthetics, the world and the story are super bland, which personally prevents me from sinking hundreds of hours into it.
Also the quality in the later half the the game takes a nosedive.
Torchlight III is an abomination.
Also I think there's a mobile game.. who cares.
Overall, honestly, it's a mid series.
Titan Quest is pretty good, tho there're not many reasons to play it, since Grim Dawn is a direct upgrade over Titan Quest in every single aspect, unless you're super into Greek Mythology.
I dare anyone to play poe without looking a single thing up about the game and then tell me how great it is. i love poe because i started early but that game is a convoluted mess now and it does right at zero to explain any of it....play it without all of the add on programs, spreadsheets, pob, ect. Your opinion will 100% change
Doesn't matter, POE is so far ahead of everything else that the annoyances are easily worth enduring.
True but i don't see how that makes a game worse. As a matter of fact, i do like the games that have so much depth and content that you feel overwhelmed and forced to study the game on forums.
It's a unique feeling that at least for me helps to involve myself more into the game. I enjoy reading forums and learning new things on the wiki, installing programs and what not to read builds and so on is something not every game offers. Pretty sure that if PoE didnt have all the mechanics and concepts it has, it would have a lower player-base and less rating from the community than it has today.
Though i completely understand whoever despises it
Who tf puts Grim Dawn below D3? are you mad?
Worst tier list I've ever seen
D2 on the same level as D3 lmao
Diablo 4 will never be good. It was developed with the wrong intent. It should have been made with the intent to make a good game, but it was instead made with the intent to milk the franchise for everything it's worth, tick as many boxes as possible to appear to as many people as possible, which resulted in a shit game with no depth or fun even.
The sad truth is blizzard could not give a single fuck if the game is a scam as long as it sold well, which it did
It can't be good because the core is so bad - the skill trees are such a joke. Compare to last epoch, it's even worse! Last epoch so much more creative and interesting - the depth just so much better
Cool. Don't play it then. What's the point of crying about it endlessly? Its not gonna make it better that's for damn sure.
@@JustChill-zd4ib found the D4 player 😆😆😆 calling it out for how trash it is is why people are still talking about it
Investors and normie gamers playing 30-minute sessions per week are happy.
Blizzard is done to me. Never buying any of their product. They are soulless and disrespectful towards their loyal customers with the products they make today. They used to be pioneers in all genres they touched. Not anymore.
Missing *Sacred* and *Sacred 2* in there, how did people forget? Isn't *Lost Ark* an mmo?
I also forgot the Sacred games, however I haven't played them either. As for Lost Ark. It is an arpg in a mmo format similar to how Blizzard made the new Diablo 4.
right? they were so fking amazing
The Sacred games did open world ARPG way before D4 and imo they did it better, tons of cities, tons of quests, funny dialog/writing. The worst part about the sacred games is the combat feels more like MMO games, but other then that they were excellent gems in the ARPG genre.
@@christophersanders7877right? it's been 20 years and i still have to find a game like this but i agree that the combat is terrible for current standards
his take on grim dawn is so autistic,that game is so loved because its not live shitvice,some people hate it some people like it,yeah very few hate it considering its sitting on 95% on steam,always shifting around top 1-3 in its genre
Grim dawn at B tier is crazy
For me being a live service game is not a pre, I love Grim Dawn because we will be able to play that game in 50 years and most of the games on this list will be dead and buries because the servers stopped or the companies died.
Grim dawn should be higher up tbh.
Grim dawn should be C 1. Grim is depressing 2. Dusk is more interesting than dawn
grim dawn in C is criminal imo, but i understand theres a lot of live service andies out there, its still better than current LE though, in almost all aspects.
it is, what it is bois.
last epoch is better in the gameplay aspect,it does feel better,skils feel impactful and awsome,grim dawn wile a top 2-3 easily,is showing its age and the limitations of the ancient engine it was made on
@@deenman23 LE is a buggy mess, pick a skill and theres probably something that doesnt work correctly, has 0 balance, frame drop city with floaty movement and "ok" combat
Not much diff than grim dawn, except grim dawns skills function
Yep grim dawn is the goat. I would rather support the indie devs from crate than any other big company. They really care about their game.
In my oppinion its also way better that grim dawn has not much live service or online content. You can even play the game when your offline, holy s. Maybe I am just getting old but I am so sick and tired of all this live service online only bullshit. I just want to fucking grind, build my character and try some cool things.
Grim Dawn is the perfect arpg when you are sick of all this nonsense bs.
Grim dawn looks terrible and the combat has zero weight
@@hornysanders6244 zoomer brain go brrrrrrrr
why is this guy rating games, he only played 1 game
Lets share some love for grim dawn
Imagine someone putting D2 and D3 on the same tier lol. What a time to be alive
only if you are a clown
i invested a ton of hours in both of the games and D3 is just way much more better than D2 and yes before you ask i played D2 then D3
@@punjabigaming146shit take tbh. D2 has the better itemization, the better skill tree (D3 doesnt even have a real skill tree lol) and the much better atmosphere and design. the only things D3 has going for it is that it has more content and better combat - both of which are solely bc it released over 10 years later.
Freaking blasphemy
grim dawn to me is god tier for sure. D3 in A? hell no!
Grim Dawn combat is floaty trash, somehow feels worse than D2.
Grim dawn is the goat
D2 and 3 in the same tier, this list should be entirely disregarded
Not sure it should be on the same level, but in reality I did play WAY more hours of D3 then D2, and I bet a fuckton of people did too.
@@dIggl3r Me too, I had fun time in D2, I'd say like 12 years ago so I was pretty late to the party (before I just played offline garbage builds as a kid, never even beat hell) but I just completed my lightning sorc, got perfect shako, perfect infinity that I made myself, all around cranked stuff, then I farmed hammerdin stuff with that sorc and then I was like, okay I have two most OP and versatile characters in this game, now what? And I quit lol. But I played D3 for like 1500 hours later. But still, that time with D2 is one of my most memorable gaming experiences, I'm very fond of that.
Based.
Or the fact that Grim Dawn is below both of them, when it is literally the successor of D2... lmfao.
Methinks you need to give Grim Dawn another go. The skill system is top 3 in the genre, add in a cool constellation system, cool itemization, and a deep story that I actually felt a part of.... I won't put it god tier, but a high A is not out of the question.
It's too ugly.
@@jprice_ PoE is also ultra ugly and considered the best arpg out there.
@@renancampos7947 it's not as ugly though.
@@jprice_ D3 is maybe the ugliest of them all, but it's still up there.
@@girthpapi Maybe if you have no taste. I'd didn't age a bit.
Instead of clowning and putting on C, I would create an OG spot and put Diablo in there. It was phenomenal for its time. Godfather of its genre.
Plus, the most clearly "heavy metal" satanic atmosphere. You entered the dungeon and the first thing you saw was skeletons on crosses - who then caught fire. The place was "evil" through and through. The sanctity of that place had been fouled, indeed.
Short video
D1 in C was kinda painful
D3 in A was the nail in the coffin
d2 should be in b as well
@@aska221 It's okay to be wrong
@@girthpapi you're right, i forgive quin for being wrong
@@aska221 viljken bja comeback Emilj
@@pobopower average quin meat rider
POE is on another planet.
Chris Wilson approves it. But not joke, it's behemoth which I will always return to play new league
And PoE2 might need a new tier added at the top..
@@dfasdfgdsfdf588 Ironic that only PoE2 can beat PoE1, and I am sure it will.
God I hope so. POE2 is gonna be the first POE with a great graphics engine. It can't be bad.@@dfasdfgdsfdf588
poe2 can only beat poe1 if they continue not doing battle pass crap
Lost Ark gets an S for combat/raid design and a D in like everything surrounding those two things. Dunno if I'd call it an ARPG though.
lost ark got good combat and etc but it hold lost ark back is p2w and have no respect your time. steam tagged lost ark as ARPG and MMO
@@Butcherza01 wtf did you just say bro
Yea Lost ark is mmo not arpg, but it has the best combat, boss design, raids in an mmo ever… Imagine how great all these Kr mmos would be if they took a ounce of inspiration from their western counter parts
@@xiexiexiexiexiex? what you dont understand?
@@jgsource552 "mmo" is not a genre; it's like saying "first person" is a genre
arpg doesn't mean dungeon crawler/hack & slash /diablo-like
dark souls is arpg as well
lost ark is mmo-arpg, but not diablo-like.
D4 BAD (obviously)
No, d4 bad
Trash game bro
Bro couldn't get to level 30 @@luQ89
fr
Is it not? If yes, then it should be reminded every day every hour for the hype it got from everyone and the millions of dollars in sales it got the the greedy company Blizzard
saying lost ark has bad combat is criminal
It is also not an arpg. Only similarity is the pov. Besides that its an hardcore raiding mmo
the combat might be bad in the hands of quinn tho
Grim Dawn underrated.
I want to love Last Epoch but i just cant get into in the leveling part is just so boring im basically forcing my way through it just to find the end game to be pretty meh too
Yeah, people have the tendency to blindly hate on D4. Last Epoch isn't the Diablo killer people claim it to be.
@@TheFunkloft it just came out of early access and already has like 20 different QOL that diablo 4 does not have on its what 4-5th season? stop the cope, it does not need to be a ''diablo killer'' it can just be a better game, which well.. it is
@@TheFunkloft you must huffing some serious paint to think it didnt clown on d4,it has everything d4 lacks,literaly everything
@@deenman23 Everything but the story and polish
@@romofin i mean wile LE's story isnt done,it has a cool gimmick with time travel....d4 is just.....shit,its the same tropes as in wow,literaly,bad man(woman) wants to make us stronk but we reject them,ow has done it a few times now
Diablo 1 was God Tier in it's time.
@@davidmccauleyytwasn't really blizzard though. It was made by a studio called Condor that blizzard bought and changed name to Blizzard North, which after D2 expansion got shut down by blizzard and every developer left.
@@NoksivsAnd the devs who left made Torchlight 1 & 2
no doubt. quinn said he didn't play it on release, but neglected to mention why. He wasn't born yet.
poe bad
- forsen 2024
Plays last epoch for 5 days at launch, gently experiences empowered monos and the other endgame systems...considers last epoch in the same tier as D3. Sorry, hes no longer an avid arpg gamer anymore. He plays POE, usually about two weeks with the exception of the current league. More variety more react streamer than an arpg streamer, but an arpg expert no longer.
The dude gave last epoch a quick college try. Got through the campaign, got to the true endgame of empowered mono's and maybe got knee deep. Didnt push corruption high at all (did he even fight oro??). Hopped into a few dungeons and arena for a bit. and then said "I've seen what I wanted to see". You could tell he just wanted to go toe deep in all systems so he can say "I did everything" when in reality, you didnt really grind anything out like you would have if the game were called path of exile. You didnt give it the attention you would have or tried to find OP gear. With POE he will farm heist for days for GG gear, but doesnt really try to do that here. No target farming for gg gear. But will have the stones to compare LE to POE and say it needs more, where POE has 10 years of leagues. Jesus christ lol
d3 was trash
Taking down D1 a notch because it matters not that it started everything but then putting D2 so high because "it started everything" must be the dumbest take on ARPGs i've ever heard.
For me GD, LE, and Van Helsing are all A Tier. D3 is B tier (I last played in like season 7 so not sure current state), and PoE is S Tier due to end game alone. I actually hate a lot about the game but build diversity and end game is just so good. Give PoE target farming, a ssf drop rate boost, and get rid of unfair enemies and no game would ever be better
Classic Quin "Integrity" 69 tier list.
lost ark the only game on this list that takes skill to play he doesnt like the combat 🤣
Easy Ranking
1:POE
Pro: content++,best bosses,crazy crafting,housing,transmog,builds,big skilltree,online, constantly big updates
Con: no beginner,casual friendly, only cashshop gear looks dope, looting gear feels mid cause currency is taking over, hard to respec
2:LAST EPOCH
Pro: decent content, crafting easy but fun, many builds(skill tree per active skill), fun endgame, online, looting feels good, easy respec, ingame filter
Con: body armor looks ass, bosses meh, no wall/highground jumps or teleports, acts are confusing and mid
3: GRIM DAWN
Pro: decent content, crafting easy but fun, many builds (double class),easy respec, by far best loot system dropping uniques actually feels good, ingame filter
Con: not online like LE and POE, graphic meh, endgame could be better, gameplay feels very slow, killing big groups feels unsatisfying
ah and fuck Diablo btw peace ✌
Noob question whats the best arpg with pvp?
D2
trick question, they don't exist
Diablo 2 had somewhat fun PvP at least back in the day. Lost Arc has a dedicated PvP mode I think. And PoE had one as well when I tried it a few years ago.
But honestly it's not a great genre for PvP.
D4 is the final nail for blizzard. Moving on to better games. Hopefully made by people who love and/or play video games.
People have been saying this for years😂 not a D4 fan but it’s exhausting to hear morons like you act like a billion dollar company has put any nail in their coffins 😂😂😂😂😂
Should have watched a gameplay trailer of those he haven't played and rate them based on the trailer. Or play each for an hour next stream
Totally not biased tier list. lel
The whole idea behind a tier list is subjective right, so yeah biased.
@@RitamBuchwald but he can't even stay to his own restrictions for literally more than 1 game
god gamer plays 4 games properly out of the 23 listed and does a tier list. That take true skill😂
Grim Dawn below LE is omegalol tier
Funny he rated LE in A tier and then says the game was 6/10 boring 2 hours later when he kept dying in SC
Ye and played D4 more hours
Cannot and will not see the rest of this video after that first ranking. Should have not expected much from this man.
Playing Titan Quest now would probably end up C tier, it plays worse than Grim Dawn. Titan Quest at release was great, but it didn't age well. TorchLight 1 and 2 are good, solid B's. Didn't play 3 and Infinite I didnt play enough of (but probably B tier too). Missing Sacred 1 and 2 as options, both probably C tier.
Personally would rank D2 God Tier but under PoE.
D4 sucks hard
i think this is the one thing we can all agree on.
This is a dog tier tierlist
Lmao😂
Make your own then, it's his opinion, he didn't claim to be objective.
@@metamon2704 alotta words to say you'll blow him any day
The ARPG gods are looking at this in rage
"best crafting system" - poe
Lol, I'm out.
Poe has no melee, last epoch does.
Me too I love Chris Wolcen.
shame he put him in dog tier.
Current Year?
D2 cannot be anything but god tier, tons of people are still playing it 24 years after release. It literally defined this genre.
Potion Collecting Simulator 1999
0 QOL =/= god tier.
*entirety of chat saying god tier or A tier* "Its not live service always online, its a C tier game but I'll bump it up to B"
The only honorable thing left to do for blizzard is to give ggg the diablo IP.
torchlight games and Mythos were a lot of fun.
This tier list and the arguments for it are dog tier
I was ready to hate this tier list, but it's not that bad. Switch D3 with Grim Dawn and I could endorse it.
LE and D3 in the same category is crazy. If you judged D2 by today's standard then judge D3 by today's standard.
true, d3 should be way above d2
I really wonder if LE will get to God tier. I have a feeling they are going to be slow on the content.
he played 20 hours and got bored
no way it will reach god tier
what about champions of norrath
never forget
Yeah, Lost Ark C Tier TOTALLY AGREE. Combat is quite good but you have to choose between p2w and doing shitty homework for EVERY SINGLE DAY. I missed mmo's days...
Quins takes on ARPGs are not great imo because he did not play 99% of the classics to know why people liked the genre in the first place, nor does he really try to like any modern ARPG outside of POE or games that are hyped up for no reason (like LE). Quin was a WOW nerd who came into the ARPG genre (mostly with D3 of all games lol) with that same MMO/live-service mindset when most of the great ARPGs of the past were offline/peer-to peer co-op lol, his perspective of the genre is dependent on something most ARPG lovers did not care about back in the day (online) and that was mostly relegated to Blizzard games not ARPGs in general.
I believe most of these modern POE/D4 streamers are mostly into online interactive MMO-lite ARPGs (POE, D4, D3,...etc) because most of them seem to have a WOW/MMO background, not a ARPG background (outside of D2). Sorry but the ARPG genre is more then just Diablo and POE.
People act like Diablo was the only ARPG people enjoyed back in the day but there were tons of other great ARPGs and sleeper hits around the time too. There was Sacred 1-2 (did open world better them D4 imo and had mounts and everything), Dungeon Siege 1-2 (Party based ARPG no other game has replicated from my knowledge), Titan Quest (one of my favorites), The Divinity ARPGs (before Original Sin 1 and 2), FATE (predecessor to TL series), Silverfall, BG:Dark Alliance games (on the console side) ....etc. Then you have more modern indie ARPGs like Van Helsing, 40k Inquisitor, Chronicon, Ghostlore, Soldak ARPGs (Din's Legacy, Drox Operative 2 probably the most unique ARPG games I have played in a while), Hero Siege, Slormancer, Torchlight 1-2 ...etc and then the KING of the modern ARPG genre Grim Dawn and all of its expansions.
I just like the ARPG genre as a whole and not just POE only hivemind that most of these streamers seem to have.
Vrising and LostArk ARPG?
so what is it? mmos?
@@slick3996 Lost ark is an mmo, & vrising a survival game.
Ain't no F'ing way he ranked a game that has no dmg numbers option and the most generic bosses, the best ARPG (but expected he'd do it). Also, hit stuns from monsters is an absolute trash mechanic that unfortunately got into LE.
Also too many options don't make a difference in this day and age (everyone will just copy a guide/build and that's it). Unless you're a no life or streamer.
I started poe I'm garbage but I can't stop playing
Overall not a bad tier list but I can't believe that last epoch is below Diablo 3, the itemization alone places it miles above D3.
lol, the game barely works
@@sonnyankau9239how was Diablo 3 it's first week? Exactly.
@@sonnyankau9239somebody obviously never played d2 or d3. So many game breaking bugs, dupes, ect
@@drumpunk100 typical brainless arpg player that thinks "game gud bc diablo bad"
game is sitting at mixed reviews for a reason. stop dickslurping.
@@rockygillman6404 played both for years and encountered less bugs than i have playing last epoch in a year. nice try though.
Has an asian mmo and a survival game on the list. Isometric=arpg
Grim Dawn B - what the absolute fk dude
Poe is god tier in jankiness, but it's A+ at best. basic QoL missing, p2w, stale meta, currency/h, crafting is gambling, heavy RMT
There are not such things as "too much customization" or "too much content".
There can be, depends on the context and perspective you are looking from. For example from a new and/or not experienced players in the genre eyes these factors can be way too overwhelming and repulsive.
God tier and most people hate the game. Interesting :D
Australian brain....this is all...what else?😂
From a pure gameplay perspective and given it's a mobile game, for me Immortal is A tier, there is actually no other mobile ARPG that can compare. Ironically enough i quit it not because the p2w but because you are forced to group to do anything above normal difficulty and i'm ssf since basically forever in these games.
But again, if you forget the p2w shiet for a moment and judge the "game" part of the game, it's genuinely fun up to a certain point.
An ARPG needs to be always online to be A Tier lmaooooo
Man, Undecember would be up there if you played it. It's mobile PoE.
I think the ability to brick your build and inability to fix it aside from literally creating a new character. Keeps me from giving PoE the god tier rating.
Stat requirements on gems and gear is dogshit. Not being able to experiment at all, is dogshit. Needing a folder of 3rd party apps just to play the game sub optimally, is dogshit. Game is not S tier.
It is the best on the market for sure, but it isn't my preferred game anymore.
Yeah you can't rate games in a vacuum that have taken place over a few decades and then rate other games for their peak. D3 is absolute trash
I'm an old school player of ARPG and I have never met any one that would not put Grimm Dawn on on the A list. Even Diablo players will admit that it's one hell of a game. And your idea of a live service is ridiculous, and goes against what about 99% of the players complain about.
Up the Kiwi's my brother!
Been playing POE for a month...its fun AF cant wait for next league, but yeah thrs so much things to learn
The only adjustment I'd make there is to place Undecember in either category A or perhaps B, and Last Epoch in B. Undecember serves as a Path of Exile version for mobile, featuring monetization, thus it's somewhat of a meme, but its gameplay is quite solid. As for Last Epoch It's quite likely(maybe...idk) that this game will fade in relevance when Path of Exile 2 is released. From a developer's perspective, the game received an unusually high level of anticipation, to be honest. The gameplay is engaging, yet, coming from a Path of Exile background, I found many aspects that still require refinement. The narrative is somewhat underwhelming, and the graphics are hit or miss-either outstanding or subpar compared to Diablo 3 and Grim Dawn. The characters lack appeal, and the skill system feels disjointed and not well-aligned with the respective classes. The end-game content is lackluster, nothing extraordinary. The servers are inadequate. The only redeeming quality of the game is its gameplay, yet even that is significantly hampered by bugs. Returning to Path of Exile seems like the preferable option.
Missing Nox. Rip Westwood
damn the dislikes... imagine taking this guy seriously after he put hollow knight in C tier or whatever
Putting D3 up with D2 that'll be a nah from me, D3's only influence was a dumbing down of the whole genre. Also where are games like Sacred that pushed the genre, Champions series that were a blast on console, Divinity series which helped propel Larian and a game that a lot of ARPG players have probably never even heard of and an old favorite of mine Shadowflare which sadly is not sold anywhere these days.
How the fk is D3 the same tier as D2? The dude is nutz. Grim Dawn Tier A and D3 Tier C
How has Quin not played Van Helsing? I played the first one on the hardest difficulty and it was a legit challenge but fun time. Maybe it is too hard for Quin and that's why he hasn't touched it
Grim Dawn is the best.
why does he have in some survivals or even mmorpg games in that list xdx
Vrising thing is a bit weird, and idk if POE is that good but I get it. Pretty good list overall. Quinn should play all the Torchlights.
no Dungeon Siege 2 and Champions: Return to Arms? i'm sorry but that's not a valid ARPG tier list
completely agree with your list. D4 has absolute 0 chance to get to got tier, the base game is just tooo bad, without any customization. I cannoot see how D4 can become more than A
I couldn't watch after he put D3 in A tier
Chaosbane was more fun than Wolcen and Last Epoch
Not played any torchlight games? I liked torchlight 2. But I suppose it's a bit like Grim Dawn, offline game. I've never actually gotten through Torchlight 2 cause my character just gets weaker the longer I play till I can't kill anything.
Where are the HEALS!?
Decent list
D3 one tier too high for sure
Agreed with both D4 and LE having potential to be S tier. D4 has the foundation. Do the devs have the ability. We will wait and see after a year or 2.
LE will be S tier by next year I have no doubt