Replace it with a PSS Stew. Had broze stuffing boxes on my boat. Added nipples to stop them leaking, but eventually went with PSS. Bloody great move. Have not had one drip since. 20 years of service and 7000hrs of running now. Carry some silicone tape to cover bellows failure. Replaced mine at 10 years and kept the replaced ones as spares. The other benefit is no shaft wear. Good to see you back on The Tube dude.
Hey Norm. Yes, I think it is worth the upgrade. Great to hear you've had such long reliable service out of yours. I do keep quite a few rolls of different waterproof tape on boat so good point about doing the dodgy repair to get home. Always a nice feeling to know that is an option.
On our Stern Glands (Large Sea Going Tugs of 6,000 hp with a stern draft of between 18-22 feet of water) we had an Air Bladder that could be filled to stop the flow of water and allow you to replace the packing. I never really trusted those bladders enough to remove all of the packing rings, so I would usually pull a ring or two and then add new rings. What I was taught was to pound the ring almost flat then grease the hell out of it before putting it in. One of the most important things is to make sure that you put the ends of the rings at different positions, I usually tried to install them with the ends 180 deg apart.
And of course cut the rings when the rope is turned around the shaft (or a round object of similar size). I once got a seal (on a pump, not a boat) where they had cut the rope lying flat so the ends didn't meet up when formed into a ring. Very poor seal.
Typical Danger marine video - Stu in an almost impossible position hitting something with a big hammer - just what I need on this rainy Sunday morning! Glad it's you and not me Stu!
This man is a living encyclopaedia of boat knowledge and I can’t believe he just shares it all for free in his own time. I’ve been inspired to buy a project boat and literally rebuilt the whole thing using nothing but 800 hours of stu explaining things so my primate brain understands laced with grade A dad jokes. This man is a modern day hero. Thanks stu.
Hello Stu. I work at Nordic Tugs Inc in Burlington, Washington. USA. We use the PYI PSS on our boats. The PYI PSS uses a spring loaded bellows to push a carbon ring, which is mounted to the bellows, against a stainless collar that is mounted to the shaft. Once bedded in to each other the carbon face against the face of the stainless ring creates a drip free seal, unlike a traditional packing based seal which is, as you said, required to drip. The things to know about a carbon face style seal is that 1) If you throw something in to the bilge that lands on, or across the seal, it can hold the carbon face out of square with the stainless bushing, and cause a serious leak. 2) In your case you would need to provide pressurized water off of the sea water system to the PSS to keep the seal system cool. 3) After initial install, and before leaving the boat unattended in the water, you must take it out and run it around for about an hour to surface the carbon face to the stainless bushing. 4) If the seal were to fail catastrophically, I don't know if it can be repaired with the shaft in place. That said, there has not been a case of that happening on any Nordic Tugs boat for the entire time we have used the system. The advantages are that, if you have no leakage from the deck, you can have a completely dry bilge, and the seal requires very minimal service beyond periodic inspection. I am very glad to see you back on RUclips.
Hey Scott. I guess my biggest fear with those types of seal is that failure is almost complete, but I do love the idea of a completely dry bilge. Having said that, I've heard other stories about boats sinking because the bilge pumps failed when needed so I do also like seeing them going off periodically so I know they are spinning and pumping. Not too often though! ;)
Not really about the boats for me to be honest, but I must say that I have learned a lot from you across the series with "Renko", so thankyou for your time and effort Stu, very much appreciated.
I had worked for a stern seal company for some years back. Gland packing to me is the most reliable piece of equipment compare to any other sterntube mechanical seals and lipseals. The reason why water is not gushing in probably is that your boat had a low draft. For vessel with deep draft, usually I will try and blanket outside with a canvas and run the bilge pump or even the additional pumps to join in to get rid of the water. But nothing is better than in the dock itself and I agree with you but costly to most. As for the grease nipples to slow down the water ingress, I would think it is totally unnecessary bcos it will not work from experience so dun bluff yourself JMHO. Stern tube working space is always tight and I dun like it anymore than you do. But do consider the danger that if the water were to rush in, have a back up plan to run and not to be drown in the bilge. Great video as always.
I agree, as tech that used to repair boats I used to replace alot of dripless style stuffing box setups. The lip seal ones wear out and leak or burn up if anything happens to the feed water. I did like the pss that uses the collar and graphite face better than the lip seal setup but those also require attention, mineral deposits build up and can gunk up the face which requires using fine sand paper to resurface in place if no hauled out to perform work. I also think that traditional packing is more reliable and easier to deal with whether your local or taking trips where if you fail a seal it's hard to replace in the field in the water. You typically are unhooking the driveshaft to make repairs. Hell I've even seen the dripless seal burn up from the boat being towed without the driveshaft being blocked. The lack of water lubrication while being towed burned them up. I've been a viewer for a long time and like your channel and love seeing it progress into what it is now. I used to watch to learn outboard stuff when I was a inboard mechanic. Keep up the great work.
My experience involves mechanical seals in liquid pumps, and I thought a properly designed mechanical seal setup would have been a better system for boats too. Looking at your comment, it is obvious why this centuries old sealing system is still used. I wonder what type of sealing system big ships employ.
@@akhtarkh Big ships uses big mechanical seal too. The biggest that I have seen is 1.5metre shaft diameter. They uses oil lubricating sealing system and the system is leaking oil into the sea. it was a general norm that losing 10% of oil in the sterntube is acceptable in normal circumstances. Ship engineers try to pacify the low oil level alarm in the sterntube by adding more oil which added to the pollution. The shore based pump can do laser alignment and are on fix ground. Ship hull are not that rigid.
Stu, greetings from Atlanta. Loved watching from the first when the yard guy said, "cheer up....I've seen worse." Loved watching you recover your car, your hand, and your equanimity. Loved the sand blasting, loved the steel prep and then the painting. Laughed for joy with you when the cabin burned (been there.) Loved Eddie's antics. Loved the hen updates (it's a bird's life, don't you know.) Loved you mates, loved your fishing and (heresy) loved all of your electronics. Especially your electronics. Loved the humor. Loved the engine rebuild. Laughed at the launch, I couldn't look away. Loved the story of you trip south in your friend's boat in the dark with engine trouble and the anchor rope broke, followed by such an unselfconscious self assessment, the spirit of the show. Love your trip up north for the sole purpose of bothering Damien. It was good of you to help him build some character. Loved the sketches, loved the navigating, loved it all. Thanks
I am very glad to see you are still producing videos. Thank you for the video, and especially for the drawing, which really helped make it comprehensible.
oh my! that would give me grumpy face right away! I was just thinking about that woman you met with the wood boat, she was repairing the hull and I think you met her again on the water. I hope she is doing well. I liked her spirit.
Well done Stu, nothing like working under pressure. Had a through fitting fail before while at sea, nothing more heart pumping then a bilge alarm and all bilge pumps on simultaneously certainly woke me up 😂.
Your summary at the end makes perfect sense to me. Stuffing boxes may leak a bit but never let go altogether where I have heard of some major disasters with rubber boots failing completely in the "dripless" type of seal.
Often old school is the best. These sorts of stern glands have been around for decades and then some. The fibre seal material used to be asbestos so beware if you take an old one out when it is dry and "dusty". Keep them wet at all times. Picking out an old gland seal can be a very long and laborious job so the patience of Job is needed.
G’day Stu, given that you are a diver, in the past, I’ve gone over the side and pushed a ring of plasticine into the outboard end of the shaft to staunch the flow of water, then pulled the gland and replaced the packing. I like to precut the packing flax and have where they meet cut at a 45* angle. Definitely not simply pushing in a coil, it ends up unevenly loaded and hard to maintain a steady pressure on the gland and packing. When you are done, simply start up and steam away, the plasticine throws off in no time. I’ve heard of bread dough being used but I think the fish might foil your cunning plan. Regardless, it’s always a bugger of a job and might encourage language that your mother might not be proud to hear.
Nothing like working deep in the bilge on a hot summer day. I spent many hours in uncomfortable positions like that. I couldn’t get into those contortions now if you held a gun to my head. Too old and a bunch of hardware holding my spine together. Your comment about drowning while stuck in the bilge brought back a memory. One time while working in an especially cramped spot between the hull and the overhead deck I accidentally pressed against a small seasick with my foot. The darn thing snapped off and immediately water came rushing in! There was only perhaps one foot (30 cm) between the hull and deck above and I had taken me a good 10 minutes to craw into where I was. I tried not to panic, but if the water rose too much in the bilge I’d drown unless I could get out pretty quick. Needless to say, I lived, but it was a very scary experience.
Hi Stu,as a retired marine engineer I have repacked a lot of stern tube glands whilst afloat,but given the size of your boats shaft ,that is the longest gland I have ever seen.thanks for the video,cheers Roly 🇬🇧.PS it is always better to keep even when slacking or tightening up nuts.
Hey Stu, Nothing wrong with stuffing boxes, they've proven themselves for 100's of years. As a fitter we'd service these all the time. What I suggest is a brass "H" ring. It would be the cheapest and easiest fix. A small machine shop or maybe even Adrian can make one for you. They don't have to be precise in measurement and can be cut in half and retro fitted. The "H" ring replaces or added to the middle packing ring and you drill and tap a hole above it on the outside of the stuffing box for a grease nipple. Once it's in situ tighten the gland and pump in the grease. The grease helps seal out the water and increases the life of your packing because you don't have to keep over tightening the gland to seal it. The only thing you must do if you make one is make sure you drill and tap two holes on the side of each half of the "H" ring so you can remove it when you need to replace the packing. If you don't know what a "H" ring is and want to know more just comment here and I'll explain more in detail. PS. Mechanical seals are expensive and break easily.
Agree about stuffing boxes, they are simply and reliable, this one just isn't done very well. If I'm understanding correctly I think the H ring you are talking about is what I know was a latern ring and I think if I add one, along with a grease nipple with a remote pump, and then make the stern gland stainless steel the whole setup should work really well.
@@DangarMarine Hey Stu, don't panic. From what I can see there's nothing usual about your set up except that your box is deep 😬 which is an advantage. Making it all out of stainless won't really do much except make you feel better but somewhat lighter in the pocket. Stuffing boxes are a pain because they are usually in hard to get places and hard to work on but they're not set and forget so I would make up some specialty tools for tapping in your packing and modify what you have and become friends with it and it'll give you many years of service. Lantern ring is exactly what I mean and I think it'll make all the difference. Just don't forget to drill and tap some holes on the side for extraction otherwise you'll be stuck in shitsville.
Hi Stu, that was me that stepped up to your boat and said hi at the fuel dock at the Southport Yacht Club. Sorry to have intruded. I felt really bad afterwards. Anyway, hope you had a good trip wherever you were off to.
Very insightful learning here. It smashes the thought that you can buy a boat and just have fun. You have much more thought and ability and money, even more than a small house. If a boat fails your in the drink. If your house fails, you call a friend. Of course I knew this but it's still eye opening.
I renewed my packing when I put a new engine in my boat. It is a delicate job getting the packing and the end joins to seal properly. They are so flexible at the start and the weep and drip and it is maddening getting in there and tweaking the tension. You want the occasional drip but then it drips all over then it stops and things get hot. Once you have it seated it correctly it is so satisfying.
Good to see you're at home even if Renko Isn't. Looked at the PSS video and think that looks like the way to go when you replace the shaft and prop. Great video either way.
Hi Stu I've worked on pumps quite a bit many with gland packing they have to leak a bit even when running otherwise the packing will melt or burn up. There are some different packing materials available for different applications. I think I remember you installed it in a spiral fashion, we used to do individual rings and cut them at an angle then offset them 180 degrees. But the real thing is to adjust them while they are running it has to drip a bit if you tighten them too much it will either atomize or steam off and you can tamp the rings in a bit as you install them. Sometimes they also have a lantern ring in the middle and that is typically where the grease or pressurized wash water is injected as lubrication.
Great video and explanations. We liveaboard narrowboaters on the canals also seem to have this intimate relationship with packing glands. Three drips a minute - fine! Ten drips a minute - do something! They all have grease pumps for that after-cruise routine, but sometimes people get cocky, go away for a couple of weeks and come back to a sinking boat. Not fun and not at all trivial!
Your videos are immensely helpful, and I thank you for every bit of knowledge you’ve given out throughout the years. You’ve helped me gain the confidence to tackle many projects that I would’ve sent right off to the shop. Cheers Stu, don’t know where my boat would be without you lol
Stu, I love your videos. You are a master of explanations and I love your humor. I've had similar nasty work experiences and I could feel your pain. Hurry with more please.
Stu, it’s really great to see you doing the hard yards on the old girl, Reno will always be my favourite steel boat recon job as that little girl has got great lines and a real heart and when I see you tending to her needs it’s a marriage made in a boat yard. Champion video mate, took us back a few months for sure
Jeebus, you are having some water coming at you, according to the Guardian newspaper here in the UK. Heres hoping that you and yours are all safe and ok, and that no one dies this time around or loses their livelihood! All the best from Old Mid Wales ;)
Hey stu might be good if you are revisiting that area again later to have a captive nut on the stuffing box, you could then use really long bolts and use a ratchet spanner making the job a lot easier than messing with spanners and jam nuts?
Have you considered using a single piece spiraled instead of multiples of single rings? When I was on the inland tug boat we used a roll/spool of packing material and fed it in as one piece...spiraled around the shaft...instead of single pieces like you have. It made it really easy to remove the old & re-stuff it with new.
A mate of mine got some shaft logs and all stern gear fromolds engineering, there's a collar at the backend thats close to the stern bearing, then they completely fill the stern tube with grease mobil 222 special, then every 4 to 8 hours give them a pump, the packing never sees water but can be set uo soft to just hold back the grease... Kind of like bearing buddies for your shaft. Was apparently recomended for shallow water ops as keeps grit etc out of the stern bearing to greatly reduce wear.
The fishboats I was on had the same style glands as Renko but they had the grease fittings on them as well. We could tell when they needed grease by how often the bilge pump cycled. 4 or 5 pumps of grease would bring it right down to about 8 to 10 drips a minute while running but only maybe 1 drip every minute or two when sitting.
It's good to see you Stu - You needed Coopers for lubrication 🤔 not for the stern gland but for you to replace the liquid you were sweating out. The job would have seemed to have gone so much quicker 👍👍😂 Great video - Take care best wishes Clay
I’m sure someone else will have already said this, but I used to cut the ends of the stuffing at 45 degrees so there was an overlap, plus staggering the joins as you do on piston rings. 👍🙂
Add a 1/2 inch connection to the sterntube then run a pipe from the downstream side of the cooler raw water ,this will provide gland cooling without dripping into the bilge , operating temp not greater than 60c
Good luck with the incoming flood Stu. Best wishes for your friends and family. We got smashed in brisbane. I hope it's not as bad as what we had up here.
"...... before I drown trapped in the engine bay. That will be exciting." That's T-shirt material right there!! Looks like a miserable job. I'm glad it worked out. Keep up the good work.
Hi Danger stew, Thanks for showing us how to fix that problem hope you enjoy your trip up the Queensland to Damien and Jess in Bundaberg hopefully the Damian will be alright After his operation on his appendix Cliff from Logan city Queensland Australia
A bit like piston rings Stu, if you scarf the ends with a sharp knife they leak less. Have a piece of wood turned up to the same size as the shaft, take a few turns of packing on it and then you can mark and cut the scarfs, Have a few pre cut rings of packing standing by always. Make sure your gland pusher is square to the shaft and not touching it. May I suggest a remote greaser to avoid the grovelling? Does the gland pusher have a cone shaped recess to its face where it meets the packing?
Yes, had a few pre scarfed rings ready to go. I like the idea of turning up a block of wood the exact diameter of the shaft to help make future ones. 👍🏼
Stu, as a boat engineer, I can say, a propshaft which is not worn and greased should not leak too badly. Looking at your leak I would say the propshaft must have worn your tube pretty badly. It appears to be in a state where tightening the stuffing box is just sending the packing back down the tube.
Another good presentation. Unfortunately the flat-blade screwdriver would've mashed your gland packing, but at least it works for now.. I'd have used the gland to push it down evenly and whenever adding packing, make neat, angled cuts (rather than square) and stagger them 180 degrees apart, like you would do with piston rings. The grease nipple is a great idea. I'd consider two of them.
Three rings of packing’s is the minimum. Five is probably the right amount which leases you the option of being able to to add more as they wear out, as they do during wear.
It would be interesting to see if I could replace the aft-most packing ring with a lantern ring to help facilitate the installation of a grease nipple.
Hi Stu, mate of mine just had the same drama on her yacht and I didn't understand what she was trying to do, but u come along and soughted it out for me. Thanks mate enjoy the way u explain and diagrams are easy to follow top vlog, Daffy n Daisy are looking very well, see ya next week🇦🇺💜😀
The next upgrade to the old girl new Volvo D6 installed with a stern drive, you've developed a need for speed along with a fondness for quiet exhaust. The stuffing box is old school its worked for many decades, its serviceable why reinvent the wheel.
Geez you do it hard mate bloody hell if I was near you I would've given you a hand for nothing that's the trouble with having too much knowledge sometimes hey we got to fix everything our selves Bloody good work mate
Stu, when I first saw that, I was wondering how long that would last. I got my answer. Actually longer than I thought. Your stuffing box is rigid and not free to self align/center on the shaft. A traditional stuffing box-hose-stern tube(shaft log) should last 10 to 20 years or more. What probably happened is, your engine mounts settled and misaligned the shaft in the stuffing box. The packing tore up and that sleeve is just a rusty p.o.s. I’d probably cut the stern tube 2” away from the bulkhead and clamp the rubber hose around it. The stuffing box will be close to the coupling. You will have several hose clamps around the hose. Just be sure covers the end of the tube inside. You want NO water between the metal tube and hose. If there’s a small void around the tube it’ll just rust away. I would paint the stern tube with a high quality two part epoxy paint before clamping the hose on. The packing you want to use is Gore-Tex or GFO. Very very long lasting! If you hauled out and you have a good packing and it’s not water fed (water lines) it very important to burp(temporarily loosen) the packing to get any trapped air out right after you splash the boat. Dry packings burn up quick. They say several drips a minute while running is the target but that’s sometimes difficult. Lots of water or none at all is very common with GFO packing. My rule of thumb if you have it lightly adjusted, it’s not leaking and it’s not warm, don’t worry about it. When setting in the packing rings stagger the ends and should come together at a 45 degree. Don’t jump on the “dripless” frenzy. I’ve converted many back to traditional and will not touch, service or install any brand “dripless” glands. I know of several yachts that have had catastrophic failure. Periodically check the engine alignment to the prop shaft for flange face parallelism and shaft centering in the log. As the engine mounts settle you may have to do this less frequently. This must be done regardless of what kind of packing/gland you have. Fair Seas!
I have the old fashioned drip stuffing box, with a grease nipple. I must say a pump of grease without tightening the gland does slow water ingress. Then I control the amount of drip by tightening or loosening.
Hey Stu! An automatic greaser hooked up to that grease nipple your going to add will mean you can set it up to fire one shot of grease per day so the longer you leave the boat the more sealed it will be … start using it again and the grease will work it’s way out the shaft… I’m a lube tech here in QLD and have been thinking Renko and Brupeg could do with a few of these
Hey man! Unrelated to this video (although the video was great, as always). I have a couple videos of my outboard that I’d like to send you to see if you can help diagnose an issue. Do you have a way I can do that? I’ve broken it all down and done all the basics, can’t figure the issue though! I’d appreciate your opinion
We had a crew replacing fire hydrant standpipe valves at work a while back. They made a small dam on the pipe, filled it with liquid nitrogen and when the water froze into a plug they could then unscrew the valve head, still with full mains pressure in the line, and replace it. If you knew someone with a dewar or just made a box and filled it with dry ice it may be an option for a full packing change. You'd want all your gear ready to go though. If you mucked around for too long and ran out of the cold stuff it could get messy in a hurry. Displacing the oxygen in the hull would also be a hazard you'd want to address.
Great Save Stu! Why is the MOST Critical thing in the tightest place?? Speaking of Stainless, I have experienced brittle bolts and lots of thread galling. How do you overcome?
And it is a lovely closure to the vlog to see them. Stu, when I first found your site seeing Daffy and Daisy soon became the expected conclusion. A very tranquil transition… to the end of your vlog. Please don’t let anyone talk you out of showing us the girls. Thank you for your sensibilities and … now for something completely different… finished with boat stuff now we’re going to talk to the birds. 🤣 And BTW I really like your instruction, dialog and explanations. In my opinion you would make a great teacher… well, duh me! That’s why I watch you channel. And for the girls too of course! Thanks for the vlog and your time too David
I should ask what may be a stupid question - Could you throw a bag, some plastic wrap, or similar around the propshaft and gland on the outside of the boat to temporarily seal it up while you tear apart the interior side of the packing gland? The water pressure should help keep it sealed (or at least slow the water ingress) while you service the interior packing gland.
Hi Stu, have a look at Manecraft seals. See the web for Aust distributors. I have used both brands of "dripless seals" but Manecraft have been the best for me over the the last decade. Well done on frolicking in the bilges, character building stuff! Cheers, Jim
Get a Deep Sea Seal (D.S.S.) from Halyard in the UK, if they are still around. I worked for them and didn't realise at the time, what an amazing opportunity I had there (was a stupid kid). Amazing set of people.
buy some extra nuts and put them on both sides of the flange and packing gland. then you can use them to jack the gland out. best practice is to adjust the gland with the shaft turning.
I have to say you make boat ownership look so glamorous!
Thank you Stu. I’m so glad you’re still putting out videos. I’ve seen every single one. Your channel is the best thing on the Internet. 🙏🏻
Glad you like them!
I couldn’t agree more! Always eagerly waiting for the next installment! Thanks Stu!!
Replace it with a PSS Stew. Had broze stuffing boxes on my boat. Added nipples to stop them leaking, but eventually went with PSS.
Bloody great move. Have not had one drip since.
20 years of service and 7000hrs of running now. Carry some silicone tape to cover bellows failure. Replaced mine at 10 years and kept the replaced ones as spares. The other benefit is no shaft wear.
Good to see you back on The Tube dude.
Hey Norm. Yes, I think it is worth the upgrade. Great to hear you've had such long reliable service out of yours. I do keep quite a few rolls of different waterproof tape on boat so good point about doing the dodgy repair to get home. Always a nice feeling to know that is an option.
On our Stern Glands (Large Sea Going Tugs of 6,000 hp with a stern draft of between 18-22 feet of water) we had an Air Bladder that could be filled to stop the flow of water and allow you to replace the packing. I never really trusted those bladders enough to remove all of the packing rings, so I would usually pull a ring or two and then add new rings. What I was taught was to pound the ring almost flat then grease the hell out of it before putting it in. One of the most important things is to make sure that you put the ends of the rings at different positions, I usually tried to install them with the ends 180 deg apart.
And of course cut the rings when the rope is turned around the shaft (or a round object of similar size). I once got a seal (on a pump, not a boat) where they had cut the rope lying flat so the ends didn't meet up when formed into a ring. Very poor seal.
Did not know you needed a drip of water to pass so gland does not overheat.cheers from over hear in LONDON
Yes, it's a bit of a quirk of these systems. If you crank them up too tight they will get hot and burn up and then you will have a huge leak.
Typical Danger marine video - Stu in an almost impossible position hitting something with a big hammer - just what I need on this rainy Sunday morning! Glad it's you and not me Stu!
Enjoy! ;)
This man is a living encyclopaedia of boat knowledge and I can’t believe he just shares it all for free in his own time. I’ve been inspired to buy a project boat and literally rebuilt the whole thing using nothing but 800 hours of stu explaining things so my primate brain understands laced with grade A dad jokes. This man is a modern day hero. Thanks stu.
Hello Stu. I work at Nordic Tugs Inc in Burlington, Washington. USA.
We use the PYI PSS on our boats. The PYI PSS uses a spring loaded bellows to push a carbon ring, which is mounted to the bellows, against a stainless collar that is mounted to the shaft. Once bedded in to each other the carbon face against the face of the stainless ring creates a drip free seal, unlike a traditional packing based seal which is, as you said, required to drip. The things to know about a carbon face style seal is that 1) If you throw something in to the bilge that lands on, or across the seal, it can hold the carbon face out of square with the stainless bushing, and cause a serious leak. 2) In your case you would need to provide pressurized water off of the sea water system to the PSS to keep the seal system cool. 3) After initial install, and before leaving the boat unattended in the water, you must take it out and run it around for about an hour to surface the carbon face to the stainless bushing. 4) If the seal were to fail catastrophically, I don't know if it can be repaired with the shaft in place.
That said, there has not been a case of that happening on any Nordic Tugs boat for the entire time we have used the system. The advantages are that, if you have no leakage from the deck, you can have a completely dry bilge, and the seal requires very minimal service beyond periodic inspection.
I am very glad to see you back on RUclips.
Hey Scott. I guess my biggest fear with those types of seal is that failure is almost complete, but I do love the idea of a completely dry bilge. Having said that, I've heard other stories about boats sinking because the bilge pumps failed when needed so I do also like seeing them going off periodically so I know they are spinning and pumping. Not too often though! ;)
Nothing like the pain and relief of a successful bodge. Well done.
Not really about the boats for me to be honest, but I must say that I have learned a lot from you across the series with "Renko", so thankyou for your time and effort Stu, very much appreciated.
You're most welcome. :)
What are you watching a boat channel for then?
@@neondemon5137 whatever I like, for then!
I had worked for a stern seal company for some years back. Gland packing to me is the most reliable piece of equipment compare to any other sterntube mechanical seals and lipseals. The reason why water is not gushing in probably is that your boat had a low draft. For vessel with deep draft, usually I will try and blanket outside with a canvas and run the bilge pump or even the additional pumps to join in to get rid of the water. But nothing is better than in the dock itself and I agree with you but costly to most. As for the grease nipples to slow down the water ingress, I would think it is totally unnecessary bcos it will not work from experience so dun bluff yourself JMHO. Stern tube working space is always tight and I dun like it anymore than you do. But do consider the danger that if the water were to rush in, have a back up plan to run and not to be drown in the bilge. Great video as always.
I agree, as tech that used to repair boats I used to replace alot of dripless style stuffing box setups. The lip seal ones wear out and leak or burn up if anything happens to the feed water. I did like the pss that uses the collar and graphite face better than the lip seal setup but those also require attention, mineral deposits build up and can gunk up the face which requires using fine sand paper to resurface in place if no hauled out to perform work. I also think that traditional packing is more reliable and easier to deal with whether your local or taking trips where if you fail a seal it's hard to replace in the field in the water. You typically are unhooking the driveshaft to make repairs. Hell I've even seen the dripless seal burn up from the boat being towed without the driveshaft being blocked. The lack of water lubrication while being towed burned them up. I've been a viewer for a long time and like your channel and love seeing it progress into what it is now. I used to watch to learn outboard stuff when I was a inboard mechanic. Keep up the great work.
My experience involves mechanical seals in liquid pumps, and I thought a properly designed mechanical seal setup would have been a better system for boats too. Looking at your comment, it is obvious why this centuries old sealing system is still used. I wonder what type of sealing system big ships employ.
@@akhtarkh Big ships uses big mechanical seal too. The biggest that I have seen is 1.5metre shaft diameter. They uses oil lubricating sealing system and the system is leaking oil into the sea. it was a general norm that losing 10% of oil in the sterntube is acceptable in normal circumstances. Ship engineers try to pacify the low oil level alarm in the sterntube by adding more oil which added to the pollution. The shore based pump can do laser alignment and are on fix ground. Ship hull are not that rigid.
Stu, greetings from Atlanta. Loved watching from the first when the yard guy said, "cheer up....I've seen worse." Loved watching you recover your car, your hand, and your equanimity. Loved the sand blasting, loved the steel prep and then the painting. Laughed for joy with you when the cabin burned (been there.) Loved Eddie's antics. Loved the hen updates (it's a bird's life, don't you know.) Loved you mates, loved your fishing and (heresy) loved all of your electronics. Especially your electronics. Loved the humor. Loved the engine rebuild. Laughed at the launch, I couldn't look away. Loved the story of you trip south in your friend's boat in the dark with engine trouble and the anchor rope broke,
followed by such an unselfconscious self assessment, the spirit of the show. Love your trip up north for the sole purpose of bothering
Damien. It was good of you to help him build some character. Loved the sketches, loved the navigating, loved it all. Thanks
I am very glad to see you are still producing videos.
Thank you for the video, and especially for the drawing, which really helped make it comprehensible.
Thank you too!
oh my! that would give me grumpy face right away! I was just thinking about that woman you met with the wood boat, she was repairing the hull and I think you met her again on the water. I hope she is doing well. I liked her spirit.
Suzi, yes she is very cool. She helped me bring Renko down from the Gold Coast back to Coffs Harbour. Her boat is in the water now.
Well done Stu, nothing like working under pressure.
Had a through fitting fail before while at sea, nothing more heart pumping then a bilge alarm and all bilge pumps on simultaneously certainly woke me up 😂.
Probably the best packing job I have seen explained!
Thanks Eric, glad you liked it.
Your summary at the end makes perfect sense to me. Stuffing boxes may leak a bit but never let go altogether where I have heard of some major disasters with rubber boots failing completely in the "dripless" type of seal.
Often old school is the best. These sorts of stern glands have been around for decades and then some. The fibre seal material used to be asbestos so beware if you take an old one out when it is dry and "dusty". Keep them wet at all times. Picking out an old gland seal can be a very long and laborious job so the patience of Job is needed.
G’day Stu, given that you are a diver, in the past, I’ve gone over the side and pushed a ring of plasticine into the outboard end of the shaft to staunch the flow of water, then pulled the gland and replaced the packing. I like to precut the packing flax and have where they meet cut at a 45* angle. Definitely not simply pushing in a coil, it ends up unevenly loaded and hard to maintain a steady pressure on the gland and packing. When you are done, simply start up and steam away, the plasticine throws off in no time. I’ve heard of bread dough being used but I think the fish might foil your cunning plan. Regardless, it’s always a bugger of a job and might encourage language that your mother might not be proud to hear.
Stuffing box…. What a bastard job! Great video. Keep up the good work. Hope all is well during this amazing rain/flood on the coast!
Yes, it definitely isn't the best job in the world. Surviving the rain so far but I think we are going to get it more over the next couple of days.
Thanks for posting another video Stu. We know you got a lot going on right now, but those of us out here have really enjoyed your videos!
Thanks mate, more to come soon! :)
Nothing like working deep in the bilge on a hot summer day. I spent many hours in uncomfortable positions like that. I couldn’t get into those contortions now if you held a gun to my head. Too old and a bunch of hardware holding my spine together. Your comment about drowning while stuck in the bilge brought back a memory.
One time while working in an especially cramped spot between the hull and the overhead deck I accidentally pressed against a small seasick with my foot. The darn thing snapped off and immediately water came rushing in! There was only perhaps one foot (30 cm) between the hull and deck above and I had taken me a good 10 minutes to craw into where I was. I tried not to panic, but if the water rose too much in the bilge I’d drown unless I could get out pretty quick. Needless to say, I lived, but it was a very scary experience.
That would have got the heart racing. It goes to show how it can happen, and very fast under some circumstances.
Hi Stu,as a retired marine engineer I have repacked a lot of stern tube glands whilst afloat,but given the size of your boats shaft ,that is the longest gland I have ever seen.thanks for the video,cheers Roly 🇬🇧.PS it is always better to keep even when slacking or tightening up nuts.
Hey Stu,
Nothing wrong with stuffing boxes, they've proven themselves for 100's of years. As a fitter we'd service these all the time.
What I suggest is a brass "H" ring. It would be the cheapest and easiest fix. A small machine shop or maybe even Adrian can make one for you. They don't have to be precise in measurement and can be cut in half and retro fitted.
The "H" ring replaces or added to the middle packing ring and you drill and tap a hole above it on the outside of the stuffing box for a grease nipple. Once it's in situ tighten the gland and pump in the grease. The grease helps seal out the water and increases the life of your packing because you don't have to keep over tightening the gland to seal it.
The only thing you must do if you make one is make sure you drill and tap two holes on the side of each half of the "H" ring so you can remove it when you need to replace the packing.
If you don't know what a "H" ring is and want to know more just comment here and I'll explain more in detail.
PS. Mechanical seals are expensive and break easily.
Agree about stuffing boxes, they are simply and reliable, this one just isn't done very well. If I'm understanding correctly I think the H ring you are talking about is what I know was a latern ring and I think if I add one, along with a grease nipple with a remote pump, and then make the stern gland stainless steel the whole setup should work really well.
@@DangarMarine Hey Stu, don't panic.
From what I can see there's nothing usual about your set up except that your box is deep 😬 which is an advantage.
Making it all out of stainless won't really do much except make you feel better but somewhat lighter in the pocket.
Stuffing boxes are a pain because they are usually in hard to get places and hard to work on but they're not set and forget so I would make up some specialty tools for tapping in your packing and modify what you have and become friends with it and it'll give you many years of service.
Lantern ring is exactly what I mean and I think it'll make all the difference. Just don't forget to drill and tap some holes on the side for extraction otherwise you'll be stuck in shitsville.
Hi Stu, that was me that stepped up to your boat and said hi at the fuel dock at the Southport Yacht Club. Sorry to have intruded. I felt really bad afterwards. Anyway, hope you had a good trip wherever you were off to.
Hey Phil, no problem, nice to say g'day. :)
Hope you and yours are safe from the flooding
Thanks mate.
I'm glad you have a good bilge pump.
Me too!
Phew, I felt that repair, Stu. Great little video and explanation of how the part works.
Thanks Cody! :)
Great video! Thanks Stu
Glad you enjoyed it
Very insightful learning here. It smashes the thought that you can buy a boat and just have fun. You have much more thought and ability and money, even more than a small house. If a boat fails your in the drink. If your house fails, you call a friend.
Of course I knew this but it's still eye opening.
Yes, there is definitely a lot to owning a boat. Modern shaft seals are a lot more maintenance free but then you pay more for a modern boat.
I renewed my packing when I put a new engine in my boat. It is a delicate job getting the packing and the end joins to seal properly. They are so flexible at the start and the weep and drip and it is maddening getting in there and tweaking the tension. You want the occasional drip but then it drips all over then it stops and things get hot. Once you have it seated it correctly it is so satisfying.
It is a delicate balance with the cooling water that's for sure.
Good to see you're at home even if Renko Isn't. Looked at the PSS video and think that looks like the way to go when you replace the shaft and prop. Great video either way.
Yes, it is temping to go with something a bit more modern, that's for sure.
Hi Stu I've worked on pumps quite a bit many with gland packing they have to leak a bit even when running otherwise the packing will melt or burn up. There are some different packing materials available for different applications. I think I remember you installed it in a spiral fashion, we used to do individual rings and cut them at an angle then offset them 180 degrees. But the real thing is to adjust them while they are running it has to drip a bit if you tighten them too much it will either atomize or steam off and you can tamp the rings in a bit as you install them. Sometimes they also have a lantern ring in the middle and that is typically where the grease or pressurized wash water is injected as lubrication.
Great video and explanations. We liveaboard narrowboaters on the canals also seem to have this intimate relationship with packing glands. Three drips a minute - fine! Ten drips a minute - do something! They all have grease pumps for that after-cruise routine, but sometimes people get cocky, go away for a couple of weeks and come back to a sinking boat. Not fun and not at all trivial!
Yes, they are something you need to keep an eye on that’s for sure!
Your videos are immensely helpful, and I thank you for every bit of knowledge you’ve given out throughout the years. You’ve helped me gain the confidence to tackle many projects that I would’ve sent right off to the shop. Cheers Stu, don’t know where my boat would be without you lol
You're very welcome!
Submarines give you that feeling too......good job Stu !
Indeed they do...
Stu, I love your videos. You are a master of explanations and I love your humor. I've had similar nasty work experiences and I could feel your pain. Hurry with more please.
Thanks Wally. More soon!
Watching that job made my back hurt!
Thanks Stu, another very informative vlog. Can imagine it’s a bit stressful when water is coming through!
Thanks glad you enjoyed it. Yes, I certainly feel a lot more relaxed about leaving the boat for a couple of weeks now the leak has stopped.
Stu, it’s really great to see you doing the hard yards on the old girl, Reno will always be my favourite steel boat recon job as that little girl has got great lines and a real heart and when I see you tending to her needs it’s a marriage made in a boat yard. Champion video mate, took us back a few months for sure
Jeebus, you are having some water coming at you, according to the Guardian newspaper here in the UK. Heres hoping that you and yours are all safe and ok, and that no one dies this time around or loses their livelihood! All the best from Old Mid Wales ;)
Sure is a lot of rain at the moment, huge flooding up north with a couple of fatalities sadly.
Hey stu might be good if you are revisiting that area again later to have a captive nut on the stuffing box, you could then use really long bolts and use a ratchet spanner making the job a lot easier than messing with spanners and jam nuts?
Reminds me of the old rope rear main seal on old automotive engines.
Wow - I need to do this on my boat sooner or later - and was worried it was a bit complex. But - you made it simple - thanks.
Thanks Mick!
Have you considered using a single piece spiraled instead of multiples of single rings?
When I was on the inland tug boat we used a roll/spool of packing material and fed it in as one piece...spiraled around the shaft...instead of single pieces like you have.
It made it really easy to remove the old & re-stuff it with new.
With spirals it is possible to grab the shaft and expand the packing causing damage. It is generally considered safer to cut rings.
A mate of mine got some shaft logs and all stern gear fromolds engineering, there's a collar at the backend thats close to the stern bearing, then they completely fill the stern tube with grease mobil 222 special, then every 4 to 8 hours give them a pump, the packing never sees water but can be set uo soft to just hold back the grease... Kind of like bearing buddies for your shaft. Was apparently recomended for shallow water ops as keeps grit etc out of the stern bearing to greatly reduce wear.
The fishboats I was on had the same style glands as Renko but they had the grease fittings on them as well. We could tell when they needed grease by how often the bilge pump cycled. 4 or 5 pumps of grease would bring it right down to about 8 to 10 drips a minute while running but only maybe 1 drip every minute or two when sitting.
Great job
Thanks Terry.
Good to see you back Stu🛥
It's good to see you Stu - You needed Coopers for lubrication 🤔 not for the stern gland but for you to replace the liquid you were sweating out. The job would have seemed to have gone so much quicker 👍👍😂 Great video - Take care best wishes Clay
I agree, stainless gland, grease fitting, then lube with Permatex super lube , clear Teflon silicone based grease.
Yes, I don't mind the old school system, just need a better version there of.
I admire your perseverance! And learn a lot from your videos.
Amazing video and explanation! Hats off
I’m sure someone else will have already said this, but I used to cut the ends of the stuffing at 45 degrees so there was an overlap, plus staggering the joins as you do on piston rings. 👍🙂
Add a 1/2 inch connection to the sterntube then run a pipe from the downstream side of the cooler raw water ,this will provide gland cooling without dripping into the bilge , operating temp not greater than 60c
Your explanation is great, thanks.
I replaced my stuffing box on Detroit 6-71 with 2.5” shaft with a PSS pro dripless and have have been very satisfied. A little spendy but worth it.
I was wondering we leave our boat in the water for the winter at - 38 or more how do you get the water out of those for winter storage before freez up
Good luck with the incoming flood Stu. Best wishes for your friends and family. We got smashed in brisbane. I hope it's not as bad as what we had up here.
From what my Sydney bro in law said, 'want a submarine'. Leaves nothing to be added.
"...... before I drown trapped in the engine bay. That will be exciting." That's T-shirt material right there!! Looks like a miserable job. I'm glad it worked out. Keep up the good work.
Thanks mate. It was a bit a of a miserable job but I'm certainly sleeping better knowing it is done.
Hi Danger stew, Thanks for showing us how to fix that problem hope you enjoy your trip up the Queensland to Damien and Jess in Bundaberg hopefully the Damian will be alright After his operation on his appendix Cliff from Logan city Queensland Australia
A bit like piston rings Stu, if you scarf the ends with a sharp knife they leak less.
Have a piece of wood turned up to the same size as the shaft, take a few turns of
packing on it and then you can mark and cut the scarfs, Have a few pre cut rings of packing standing by always. Make sure your gland pusher is square to the shaft and not touching it. May I suggest a remote greaser to avoid the grovelling? Does the gland pusher have a cone shaped recess to its face where it meets the packing?
Yes, had a few pre scarfed rings ready to go. I like the idea of turning up a block of wood the exact diameter of the shaft to help make future ones. 👍🏼
Thanks so much Stu
You're welcome David. :)
Stu, as a boat engineer, I can say, a propshaft which is not worn and greased should not leak too badly. Looking at your leak I would say the propshaft must have worn your tube pretty badly. It appears to be in a state where tightening the stuffing box is just sending the packing back down the tube.
No HF radio yet but I have been looking.
Another good presentation. Unfortunately the flat-blade screwdriver would've mashed your gland packing, but at least it works for now.. I'd have used the gland to push it down evenly and whenever adding packing, make neat, angled cuts (rather than square) and stagger them 180 degrees apart, like you would do with piston rings. The grease nipple is a great idea. I'd consider two of them.
That's a good argument for an outboard.
New to marine engineering and I really appreciated your illustrations mate thanks big 👍
Glad you like them!
Three rings of packing’s is the minimum. Five is probably the right amount which leases you the option of being able to to add more as they wear out, as they do during wear.
Also sometimes there can be a lantern ring at the grease entry point. This will allow the grease in and not see a packing ring block the grease entry.
It would be interesting to see if I could replace the aft-most packing ring with a lantern ring to help facilitate the installation of a grease nipple.
6-10 drops per minute while running. Some glands have an emergency inflatable ring that can seal for complete failure.
That's interesting, I like the idea of an emergency seal. Very cool!
Mate that looked like a ton a fun
Hi Stu, mate of mine just had the same drama on her yacht and I didn't understand what she was trying to do, but u come along and soughted it out for me. Thanks mate enjoy the way u explain and diagrams are easy to follow top vlog, Daffy n Daisy are looking very well, see ya next week🇦🇺💜😀
The next upgrade to the old girl new Volvo D6 installed with a stern drive, you've developed a need for speed along with a fondness for quiet exhaust. The stuffing box is old school its worked for many decades, its serviceable why reinvent the wheel.
You sure have the gift of gab!
Olestra will make the stern gland leak, too!
Ive had these issues in the past with old boats Stu. My last boat had a Volvo Penta Dripless Rubber Shaft Seal that worked great
Good stuff Stu thanks for sharing
Glad you enjoyed it
A leaky stern gland on Renko was the only thing keeping me up at night for those couple of months 😂
Sorry mate! :)
Hahaha - clearly a tough job with the added pressure of it being in the water. Glad it went well!
Stu, I recommend u get a hydraulic porta power to add to your list of tools aboard Renko, not that expensive. Great video as always👍
Yes, they are very handy tools for sure.
"Last big job" haha. Oh, the lies we tell ourselves. Love the videos man.
Thanks 👍
that is about as nasty of work on a boat as it gets. well done Stu.
Geez you do it hard mate bloody hell if I was near you I would've given you a hand for nothing that's the trouble with having too much knowledge sometimes hey we got to fix everything our selves Bloody good work mate
Working in similar conditions I used a shop vac as a fan. It helped a lot, so did the earplugs.
Stu, when I first saw that, I was wondering how long that would last. I got my answer. Actually longer than I thought. Your stuffing box is rigid and not free to self align/center on the shaft. A traditional stuffing box-hose-stern tube(shaft log) should last 10 to 20 years or more. What probably happened is, your engine mounts settled and misaligned the shaft in the stuffing box. The packing tore up and that sleeve is just a rusty p.o.s. I’d probably cut the stern tube 2” away from the bulkhead and clamp the rubber hose around it. The stuffing box will be close to the coupling. You will have several hose clamps around the hose. Just be sure covers the end of the tube inside. You want NO water between the metal tube and hose. If there’s a small void around the tube it’ll just rust away. I would paint the stern tube with a high quality two part epoxy paint before clamping the hose on. The packing you want to use is Gore-Tex or GFO. Very very long lasting! If you hauled out and you have a good packing and it’s not water fed (water lines) it very important to burp(temporarily loosen) the packing to get any trapped air out right after you splash the boat. Dry packings burn up quick. They say several drips a minute while running is the target but that’s sometimes difficult. Lots of water or none at all is very common with GFO packing. My rule of thumb if you have it lightly adjusted, it’s not leaking and it’s not warm, don’t worry about it. When setting in the packing rings stagger the ends and should come together at a 45 degree. Don’t jump on the “dripless” frenzy. I’ve converted many back to traditional and will not touch, service or install any brand “dripless” glands. I know of several yachts that have had catastrophic failure. Periodically check the engine alignment to the prop shaft for flange face parallelism and shaft centering in the log. As the engine mounts settle you may have to do this less frequently. This must be done regardless of what kind of packing/gland you have. Fair Seas!
I have the old fashioned drip stuffing box, with a grease nipple. I must say a pump of grease without tightening the gland does slow water ingress. Then I control the amount of drip by tightening or loosening.
Very good explanation and drawing!
You have a banana tree? How are they? do you get a lot of production?
We had a decorative orange tree in Arizona and they were not good at all.
Yes, they have a lot of bannas on them at the moment, will show next video.
Great stuff as usual stu
Yippee yay mother’s bout stinkier love you any way! Fan Sweden 🇸🇪
Hey Stu! An automatic greaser hooked up to that grease nipple your going to add will mean you can set it up to fire one shot of grease per day so the longer you leave the boat the more sealed it will be … start using it again and the grease will work it’s way out the shaft… I’m a lube tech here in QLD and have been thinking Renko and Brupeg could do with a few of these
Hey man! Unrelated to this video (although the video was great, as always). I have a couple videos of my outboard that I’d like to send you to see if you can help diagnose an issue. Do you have a way I can do that?
I’ve broken it all down and done all the basics, can’t figure the issue though! I’d appreciate your opinion
We had a crew replacing fire hydrant standpipe valves at work a while back. They made a small dam on the pipe, filled it with liquid nitrogen and when the water froze into a plug they could then unscrew the valve head, still with full mains pressure in the line, and replace it.
If you knew someone with a dewar or just made a box and filled it with dry ice it may be an option for a full packing change. You'd want all your gear ready to go though. If you mucked around for too long and ran out of the cold stuff it could get messy in a hurry.
Displacing the oxygen in the hull would also be a hazard you'd want to address.
Great Save Stu! Why is the MOST Critical thing in the tightest place?? Speaking of Stainless, I have experienced brittle bolts and lots of thread galling. How do you overcome?
You can get an anti galling paste to put on stainless bolts. Brittle really comes down to the quality of the stainless.
Thanks to 'Micks Law' I am installing an LED indicator for my auto bilge on my dash now just for that. I should have done it years ago.
RIP Mick!
Your birds are so beautiful❤️
They are!
And it is a lovely closure to the vlog to see them. Stu, when I first found your site seeing Daffy and Daisy soon became the expected conclusion. A very tranquil transition… to the end of your vlog. Please don’t let anyone talk you out of showing us the girls. Thank you for your sensibilities and … now for something completely different… finished with boat stuff now we’re going to talk to the birds. 🤣
And BTW I really like your instruction, dialog and explanations. In my opinion you would make a great teacher… well, duh me! That’s why I watch you channel.
And for the girls too of course!
Thanks for the vlog and your time too
David
I should ask what may be a stupid question - Could you throw a bag, some plastic wrap, or similar around the propshaft and gland on the outside of the boat to temporarily seal it up while you tear apart the interior side of the packing gland? The water pressure should help keep it sealed (or at least slow the water ingress) while you service the interior packing gland.
Yes you can.
Interesting repair!! When are you going back to sleezy?? Keep safe !!
Yes, much catch up with Mike once Renko is back.
Hi Stu, have a look at Manecraft seals. See the web for Aust distributors. I have used both brands of "dripless seals" but Manecraft have been the best for me over the the last decade. Well done on frolicking in the bilges, character building stuff! Cheers, Jim
Thanks Jim, I'll check them out.
Get a Deep Sea Seal (D.S.S.) from Halyard in the UK, if they are still around.
I worked for them and didn't realise at the time, what an amazing opportunity I had there (was a stupid kid).
Amazing set of people.
buy some extra nuts and put them on both sides of the flange and packing gland. then you can use them to jack the gland out. best practice is to adjust the gland with the shaft turning.
Yes, definitely need to be adjusted turning to get the right drip rate.
Which flooded the engine room faster? Your sweat or the gland?
Coudl have been the sweat. ;)