Thanks for doing this video. Autopilot in my 2019 Model 3 in Australia has been degrading over the years. The disabling of the radar is the most defining point in the degradation, the car used to be smooth and comfortable when following traffic using TACC or autopilot,now it brakes hard and late and is just nerve wracking to be a passenger. So I drive manually much more than I previously would have. Very dissapointing.
2019 model 3 owner here as well. What do you mean disabling radar? Did Tesla disabled radar on older models with software update? You must be kidding. I have not noticed any difference in autopilot in my car
Bedankt Steven voor de moeite die je doet om deze video’s te maken, ik rij zelf met een Tesla Model Y met autopilot en vind het ook vaak frustrerend dat een wagen die eigenlijk bijna autonoom kan rijden zo gelimiteerd wordt door trage wetgeving. Toch bedankt voor je updates, ik blijf het volgen!
Dat klopt David, maar dat heeft alles te maken met Europese wetgeving en restricties en niets te maken met de vooruitgang die Tesla zelf boekt. Als je kijkt naar video's in Amerika met FSD Beta dan kan een Tesla Model Y van 2 jaar oud zoals de mijne met exact dezelfde hardware wel degelijk zo goed als autonoom rijden en dat heeft dus enkel met de software te maken. Dus de reden waarom autopilot buiten Amerika niet deftig werkt heeft niets met Tesla te maken maar alles met de burocratie en de wel zéér trage Europese wetgeving@@DavidDeblaere
Ik ben een andere mening toegedaan. Het naderen van rotondes, kruispunten, het zoeken naar het midden van een brede weg ipv rechts aan te houden, niet tijdig vertragen als een snelheidsbeperking eraan komt... Allemaal zaken waar mijn BMW het stukken beter doet dan mijn Tesla. De wegen in Amerika zijn rechter, breder, kruispunten ruimer, rotondes zijn onbestaande... Dat maakt het gemakkelijker. Uiteraard is wetgeving wel een vertragende factor voor zaken als lane change, afritten nemen... Dat is bijzonder jammer.
Ja da kan wel zijn dat BMW nu beter is dan Tesla maar ik geloof toch meer in het tesla systeem op lange termijn dat sowieso toch ooit naar Europa komt, en dan is het kwestie van tijd tot wanneer een Tesla in Europa rijdt zoals een Tesla in Amerika, en dat lijkt me toch nog iets anders dan dat waar wij nu tevreden moeten mee zijn. Een jaar geleden kon een Tesla in Amerika ook geen rondpunt nemen en nu doen ze dat keer op keer perfect, het systeem wordt gewoon beter met de tijd omdat alle Tesla's data sturen om het systeem te voeden waardoor het steeds beter wordt. De evolutie is duidelijk als je al een tijdje FSD Beta volgt in Amerika, dat zal ook zo gebeuren in Europa@@DavidDeblaere
Here in Denmark autopilot always wants to do a lange change the first time you activate it on a highway. If you are in the first lane, it wants to go to the second lane. If you are in the second lane, it wants to go to the first. Has been that way for years and I believe there is no way Tesla does not know about it. They simply do not care enough to fix the bug. The same for speed signs. Would it be hard to adjust the speed 50-100 meters _before_ the sign? No. They just don't want to spend any time fixing the old code.
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I have just been to Denmark and driven all the way from Germany to Skagen and I did not observe that behavior with switching lanes. The slow down before signs is quite an important one though of course.
@ it only happens the _first_ time each drive on a highway. You probably need to have FSD or at least EAP otherwise the car won't suggest lane changes. It does happen every time, so there is no randomness to it. It's not the car either as I recently switched from model 3 to model Y and it is exactly the same with both cars.
@@pablollopis908 UNECE choses what Tesla can and can't provide. Tesla chose to focus on their important software stack, which is the North American FSD. Tesla obviously could have continued to update the European/UNECE nations to eventually scrap it once FSD is officially allowed in the EU, but i guess they chose not to do so. Either out of efficiency or to show the legislators their middle finger. Regardless, there is some good news on the horizon. UNECE have gotten a new proposed piece of litigation which they will have to review in a up and coming conference (most likely not the next one). It is estimated that we will see it enacted in January 2025, and it will allow much more self driving capabilities (but more nags as well). Lets look forward to that.
What exactly would you like "politicians" to do faster ? If Tesla trusts FSD would be ok in Europe, they could at least enable FSD *visualisation* in Europe, no EU regulation prohibits that.
It's also our (Europeans) specific discipline we show during driving, especially on motorways where we just relax and don't care much rather than the road ahead and our cabin distractions. If you were to use FSD like this you would definitely keep your eyes until that very last moment you see something weird on the road. That's what I think of it personally tbh
@oleost not much to do with the politician, many cars work better in Europe than Tesla. I think mostly that tesla is not interested in making the necessary adjustments. Ghost breaking and wrong speed limit recognition is smth other car figured out 10 years ago
Great vid again, Thanks! Been using AP over four years now in Finland. Had a Model 3 LR 2019 but bought a Model Y LR last month cause had to take advantake of the fsd transfer. And yeah the speed thing really push my buttons in the wrong way. It reads the signs perfectly fine but still for some god knows what reason it wont obey them. On some road sections AP lets you set the speed to anything and couble hundred meters later to max +10kph and then suddenly go back to last know higest value even if the speed limit has changed E.g. 100->60. And these also happen in perfectly streight roads outside of any citys with no intersections etc. I have found no logic in this. It just hapens always on the same spots or the spots sometimes change a little after an OTA update but they are there. Atleast on motorways its always max 140kph and no variations. But even worse is that on some roads it overwrites the pefectly fine read speed sign with some 'earth was just molten lava' old map data?!? For examble it reads a 80kph sign correctly and then after a kilometer or so it chanses the limit to 60 for no apparent reason and combine this with the situation that it wont let you set the speed limit over +10kph so now you are driving 70kph on 80kph road if you dont manualy override the speed with pedal. Drives me nuts thinking how many years this problem has been present and that somewhere in US there is a person who could fix this behaviour with couble of clicks with their mouse.... press two buttons "disable map speed data" "set speed to read value or 0-10kph over defined by driver"
Hi Steven, i drive the same version in The Netherlands, the restrictions are killing te car for now. We all know the capebillities from the car if the aprove FSD BETA here in Europe. It will be much saver when the computer can learn here with beta testers.
At the exits you should confirm the blinker sooner. Ideally immediately when the message pops up and the car will do them much smoother. At least here in NL
@@StevenPeeters maybe an exit difference between BE and NL? I always initiate the exit before the line crosses the shoulder. And yes, the 5 seconds..... sigh... But that is way more annoying on the on ramp or "wave" lanes
To my opinion it should be possible to put the blinker on from 300 meter before the exit starts. In the Netherlands this the policy. While taking an exam at CBR you should adhere to that. So FSD should adhere to it too.
Hi Steven, I drive the Model Y in the Netherlands with FSD since march. I have noticed a couple of small steps forward since then. Taking exits on the highway is now a little better, it slows you to put the blinker on before the exist start which will result in taking it from the start. I really think it should be even more early according to normal behaviour in traffic. Overtaking and then going back to the right lane drives me nuts. I have had so many times some one behind moves quicker to the right and FSD aborts the lane change abruptly. I think that is even more dangerous. Most of the time I switch FSD off (by using that steering wheel and highway icon) when there is more traffic because of this. The update on the camera views are a really improvement to me. It really seems the view is clearer and more detail is visible which helps understanding the situation more quickly.
@@paetgmeiner3620 it is legally not allowed. That is why we urgently need the DCAS regulations approved ruclips.net/video/z32IQd7HmyE/видео.htmlsi=rdJWllJhF756UnuV
The thing we call FSD here in Europe is Traffic Aware Cruise Control + Autopilot (lane keeping assistance and "automatic" lane change) + lane guidance to follow route guidance + "since a couple of months" automatic lowering of speed on highway exits. @@paetgmeiner3620
That seems to work better than in Finland. If I try AP here on country roads without the center line it will always go to the middle of the road either immediately or after a while. It also does crazy moves when lanes merge or there is wider section in the lane. However my car worked much better in Norway at similar roads staying at the right side. I have just the basic AP in Model 3. I wonder if there is some geolocation or map information that makes it work so differently?
Norway will probably have the most extensive training data set because of the sheer number of Tesla driving there. But each country has its specific situations and legislation. That is why the US is do much easier to learn as an AI system than all of our tiny countries with each a separate rulebook
I travelled about 2500km through Norway in my Model Y last august I didn't notice any different behavior compared to the Netherlands and or Germany.@@StevenPeeters
@@StevenPeeters Tesla has far enough data to fine-tune a neural network of most if not all European countries. They just did not start to work on Europe yet.
Thanks for the video, I am in doubt about buying a Tesla with auto pilot (FSD) but I live in The Netherlands. For me the auto pilot would be the functionality that would make me buy a Tesla. But if it doesn't give me any improvements over the normal cars 'Mercedes, Volkswagen, Ford' then well.... I do hope that you can do another video when the newer version is released in Europe.
Sure will. And having driven a few other systems (not yet Mercedes L3) I must say that overall Tesla is still better in the sense that it is more smooth. I use my EAP every single day
Thanks a lot! I'm considering to get a Tesla myself and was wondering about autopilot. You covered a lot of parts with a fine explanation. Would you suggest to get one with autopilot, eventually when it will be used for longer drives? So most likely for highways.
You will always get basic AutoPilot, which is lane keeping and adaptive cruise control. I would personally add Enhanced AutoPilot afterwards, when auto-park actually works. But if you want to use the auto lane change feature, it could also be worth it now. If you drive a lot on highways, I would do that, as each lane change would otherwise require you to deactivate and reactivate AP again.
@@a5tr00 check with Tesla. I can’t debug your car 😉. Are you sure you have the FSD software version? Europe still doesn’t have any real FSD feature due to regulations
@@StevenPeeters Thanks for your response! Tesla is taking ages to reply to my request. I know I have all features, because when I go to upgrades there is empty. Friends who have Tesla they can see there the options to purchase Enhanced AP or FSD. At least autoparking should work, but it doesn’t …
Thanks for the video, I just wanted to see if you were going to do another test with the latest updates in v12 Autopilot, my runs with it haven't seen any improvements from this video so you opinion would be appreciated.
@@StevenPeeters Thanks for the reply, I can only agree as I do not even have the go on green in the UK, can you confirm if this is an Autopilot, EAP, or only for FSD. Thanks.
Any idea why when i start the autopilot, it directly gives me a couple of warnings to watch out for the road? i get scared to have the autopilot disabled!
Warnings are normal. You need to ignore multiple warnings in a row to get a forced disable triggered. The system still has a few false positives from the camera, but it is already a lot better than at first. Just keep you hand on the steering wheel on one side so it van detect the weight of your hand.
Thanks for the video Steven. I'm using Autopilot. I see you can do auto lane changes and ramp-on/off on highways. These features I don't have so I assume what you're showing is EAP and not AP. Do you believe EAP is worth the upgrade when driving most of the time on highways?
I actually have bought FSD already with this one. That is not worth the money at the moment (at least outside of North-America). But EAP is well worth the money on my car. On newer cars, it is debatable. I have yet to test a pure HW4 car, but I hear AP is not good at all on those cars and lane changes are horrible because of the vision-only stuff. Also, auto-park is not yet available either on those cars. So you'd just get the auto lane change. I drove a Model Y for a year and started out with basic AP because I knew that was a temoroary car until the Plaid arrived. It took me 2 weeks before I was so frustrated with the pling-ploings for each lane change, that I bought EAP with it 🙂. That alone is worth it for me. YMMV
Wat is het verschil tussen Hw3 en hw4? Ik dacht dat het enkel de kwaliteit was van de camera. Het zou normaal juist beter moeten werken mits het een hogere resolutie is.
@@MrGangstashit666 hogere resolutie = meer rekenkracht. + cameras zijn rgb ipv gggr. Heel andere berekening. Chip in de fsd computer zou ook anders zijn.
Glad to have seen your video. I’m in doubt whether I should spend the €12000 for FSD… Until now I have only seen FSD videos that were shot in the US and they looked very promising, but seeing this I realised that we’re far from that level in Europe so now I’m much less eager to spend that amount…
@@Savaseul Incorrect. You pay 7.5k for the full FSD. If you already purchased EAP, it is only like 3.5k or something additionally. Just look at the configurator online. Or if you have EAP already, look in your app to upgrade to FSD and you'll see the correct price
Question, at this point in time right now, is it worth paying the extra 7k for full self driving over enhanced autopilot? Seeing your video really makes me doubt if I should go for it or not. Many of the features I know work in the US dont work here it seems like.
@@StevenPeeters I should've mentioned that I live in East Flanders as well 😃, I'll just get Enhanced Autopilot. Thanks for this video, very useful and it opened my eyes!
That can be found here for timeline: ruclips.net/video/TSs9UtUQttM/видео.htmlsi=lTBuG0T6MciijFCA and I have sevrral other videos on the content of the DCAS
Thank you for that! I didn't even see that video. It's unfortunate that it might get delayed. How did those meetings go? Monthly updates would be nice, or at least every time there's a new milestone. For instance you mention something they needed to finish before October. Then an update tweet or video would be nice to say if they made it. I think a lot will follow you for that.
@@mathiaslorenzen9668 the UNECE does not report on every single step. Next update will be January. That’s the milestone to watch for. All that happens in the meantime is working group meetings to finalise the document
Hello Steven, Is anyone aware of availability to have autopilot subscription in EU? In US guys can pay monthly subscription but l can’t reach this option in Germany. Is anyone can clarify? Thanks in advance
Doesn’t exist outside of North-America. I guess that will come when FSD really means something. But not even Tesla knows when this will happen at this point
@@StevenPeeters thinking about getting the model 3 with or without EAP, but doubt autopark will be there in next years.. it's lease, so now or never...
@@StevenPeeters 5 years even, so will get EAP with it I guess thanks. The SR highland with LFP and EAP will be enough for my commute and occasional city trips.
@@cyberjunkynl Then I would definitely future proof it. With FSD beta potentially coming in 2025, I might even risk that. But it is mainly the lane changes that are annoying when you have only basic AP as you have to turn off AP (or turn it off by steering) and get a pling-ploing for turning it off, then overtake a few cars on AP, with a pling-ploing for turning it on again. And then the same for moving back into your original lane. Auto park has gotten worse lately, so that needs fixing. And summon is a party trick at best and not really useful, since you have to be so close to the car you can just get in and drive it yourself ;-).
Thank you for the kind words. But I woildn’t thrive in such a bureaucratic environment of job protection. I want to move forward instead of being afraid to makeca slight mistake and expecting perfection from a system where they accept people killing people in traffic every single day. They should be held accountable for all deaths and injuries that could have been prevented
All what you need to know about FSD is the answer in the q3/23 investors conference call: "he was asked a critical question about Tesla’s plan to eventually take legal responsibility for FSD; instead of responding, the CEO complained about people “already believing that Tesla has the responsibility” because they are suing the company, then claiming that Tesla achieved “baby AGI,” which is not an answer at all." 🤣
Well, he clearly indicated they have no interest in taking responsibility, keeping FSD a mere L2 system and not even close to a self driving car, let alone a driverless robotaxi. That will take another decade
@@mrsimo7144 has nothing to do with versions, but regulations. But when it is allowed (finsllty) don’t count on it being any good with the first version for us as it needs to relearn all of our roads and signs and lights etc. Expect a same very limited beta rollout at first
@@mrsimo7144 no. Tesla rolls out in batches. Your car’s VIN needs to be in the current batch to get an update. Make sure you are connected to wifi to get it as soon as your car is up
Btw. The reason why the car aborts the autopilot at the roundabout is not because it is not allowed, but because the model is 3 years old and was not trained to drive in roundabouts.
Maybe Steven didn’t point that out clearly at the start of his video but I believe Steven was just showing its behavior. Setting the status quo like a reference point in the future. Regarding using autopilot, It is just like you can’t use regular cruise control in situations like this. Autopilot isn’t capable of following route and or joining lanes as FSD in the US is. It is more a lane keeping feature. If you paid for FSD in europe you get TACC with traffic light awareness added.
Holding the wheel does not mean I’m steering. It is a legal requirement on the one hand, but in the other hand a safety precaution in case it acts unexpectedly
Nice review again Steven, but yes general we in Europe we got a Demo version of Tesla... It is really bad the whole AutoPilot is just full of bugs and limitation. As a Person who had BMW and MERCEDES from 2021, I can say that both doing far better job than my Plaid in Autosteering... Like 2 days ago in the night I was cruising on the Highway, when a car was slower in front of me, the car asked for permission to go left lane, I gave it with the blinker on... and the car start to go, while suddenly decided to abort then go again and abort it was so uncomfortable and dangerous... It is really bad, to be honest I went for the tesla not only because it is the most fastest and economical, but also because it was the most advanced... Now I cannot say that, I can say that Mercedes EQS autopilot is far better than my Tesla one, at least in Europe...
Autopilot was not designed for off highway use. Hence you will have many issues trying to use it in your cases. Autopilot (lane keeping) and Navigate on autopilot are only for highway use. FSD would be more than capable of handling all the errors you are encountering.
If it was not designed for off-highway use, there would be no traffic light and stop sign behaviour. The whole point of my tests is to test it at the limits of its capabilities, not just what works well. Several engineers at Tesla have previously confirmed to me that my test points are very relevant and valid for the current version that we have. And that was years ago, while in the meantime it should have become a lot better, but hasn't
This is FSD in the EU 😂 I've also got FSD and in NL but you are right in a way that what you actually only get in EU is the LEGACY autopilot stack which isn't even used for autopilot in the US anymore
@@maurieezzz it's more compatible than you think We don't have 4 way stop in EU. Yield rules are the same. It's would only be the special cases like blinking orange (yield) or blinking red (stop) and right on green rules. The rest is pretty much the same
@@i.k.8868 I guess you’d rather have distracted people run over kids then. Autonomous vehicles will always be vigilant in 360 degrees, without distraction. There are no public autonomous vehicles in existence, so saying you don’t want them is a moot point and just not willing to invest in the future. But you are of vourse entitled to your opinion. As am I to disagree 😉
The EU/UK regulations around FSD/Autopilot are absolutely ridiculous. I even heard a few years ago that the UK wanted to make self-driving cars a reality, but it appears we have gone backwards. When will regulators realise that the software is a LOT safer than human drivers statistically speaking and there are fewer accidents as a result of FSD/autopilot being engaged in the US per million miles when compared to human drivers. Boggles the mind (I am in the UK btw)
Hello Steven, thank you for your videos that show the huge scam behind FSD. I have bought this option 5 year ago and still cannot use it. We should open a class action agsinst Tesla. It is a shame.
This has nothing to do with Tesl (except the speed limits), but everything with the UNECE regulations. Stop blaming tesla for this. If anyone should be sued, it is the UNECE for artificially limiting AP and FSD.
@@StevenPeeters maybe not only Tesla fault but mercedes can use level 3 in Europe. Certainly because they keep using ultrasonic sensors and radars to be safer.
@@sammoe892 Mercedes has L3 up to 60km/h and only in perfect conditions and only in Germany and only on certain sections of Autobahn. This is because Germany has adopted a specific law for this to be allowed. Not possible in other countries. Tesla could certify for that too, but that would mean that Tesla takes responsibility for every action of the car while it in in L3 mode.
@@sammoe892 I know. I've been fighting for this and trying to push the regulators ever since they limited AP in 2019. I know some of my videos have reached them and they were not happy with me exposing the parties that were against the progress and holding things back. This secrecy within the regulations is mind boggling.It shows they don't care for the end result, just for their own job protection
@@StevenPeeters Interesting take on UNECE and FSD. It’s more complex than expected, especially with the USA’s unique stance on FSD as a UNECE member. This leads me to wonder how other countries might balance their own rules with international standards to possibly accelerate FSD adoption outside the US.
@@stephanebhiri the US did not sign into the WP29 agreement tgat stipulates that all those 60-ish countries implement the same regulations. That is why they are part of the UN but do not have to follow those regulations. I have several videos on this topic on my channel in a playlist. Feel free to check them out gor more detailed info on the regulations
Very disappointing. I would have expected Tesla to better polish the normal AP and Nav on AP, but unfortunately they didn't. There are little things like heavy acceleration in stop-and-go traffic on the highway and not building an emergency lane that spoil the experience for me and the speed limit things they are so anoying. If the small problems were fixed it would be much better
Heavy acceleration? I always find it way too slow and unresponsive in those situations. Takes like 30 seconds to get to 60kph when a car in front is driving off.
@@StevenPeeters only in heavy traffic on the highway when the car in front moves 5-10 meters forward and stop again than it always takes of like a rocket and slams on the brakes again.
Tesla seems to have forgotten about Europe. In the US they replaced all RCCC-cameras for free in the older cars and here my car does not even get 2023.32.x for my old RCCC cameras.
The bus at 1m25s into the video is driving on the white line. Isn't that a no-no in your part of the world? Seriously though... The AP is doing much better than before here in the U.S. I just wish we could teach people in Miami how to drive.
Its so bad that you still have to have your hand on the wheel, a bit makes the auto drive useless. (if you look at the comfort) So cool to see itself drive tho', i HATE electric craps, but this auto drive makes it so awesome :)
It's a legal requirement, just like in the US. That is the definition of L2 ADAS. It is NOT a self-driving car, but an advanced driver assist. There are no publicly available self driving cars anywhere in the world. So yes, hand on the wheel is a legal requirement and hands-off, eyes-on systems are being developed and certified. But at that point, your every movement inside the car will be monitored
There are no regulations. It is a problem of Tesla not to implement it properly. Mercedes, Audi and BMW can changes lines fully automatically. Mercedes can make a complete overtake fully by itself.
Mercedes can do that under L3 regulations, and only in Germany. This is not L2, what AutoPilot is. There the regulations are set globally from the UNECE, with 60-ish countries all implement the same. Just watch this to understand ruclips.net/video/SxwrD0MMZxE/видео.htmlsi=V9AFXuysD_s_UthY
@@StevenPeeters Mercedes can and is doing that on every road similar to Autobahn even at 150km/h under L2. There are a lot YT videos on that. I understand that, I'm engineer and doing software for autonomous driving.
@@madmikesch2453 tead the regulations and you’ll see that individual countries are starting to make exceptions for eyes-on systems. But saying there are no regulations is false
@@madmikesch2453 driver initiated, yes, it can chanes lanes. But the dystem cannot initiate it by itself. And lane chsnges ste only allowed on roads with physical dividers between driving directions AND with no access for pedestrians and cyclists. So basicaly only highways. But I think I get now what you are referring to
Autopilot gets the legal speed wrong too often (in Belgium). Many other bugs as well. Tesla seems to put all its attention (engineers) on FSD in the US. Why complain about the regulations when Tesla doesn't care about fixing things first?
@@StevenPeeters By the way, thanks for the testing and the videos. Tesla does not communicate the legal restrictions on auto pilot and also summon, so before your videos I had no clue.
Your video is introducing confusion between FSD and autopilot, and you do not even try to correct misunderstandings in the comments. Honesty, I am not sure you are helping. The sad reality is that for now Tesla is not focused on Europe regarding autopilot and they have not even start the work regarding FSD. And I am not a hater, I own a Tesla since 2018 *with FSD* !
I don’t understand why you are confused. I mentioned many times already what the oroblem is with FSD beta, which is not the FSD option. Maybe you need to watch my other videos on the regulations to understand it?
Do you have proof of your claim about Tesla hasn’t starting to work on FSD here in europe? What is your claim based on? I thing your claim is misleading and starts confusion. 😁 But seriously where did you get this information from? And please don’t answer you saw it on youtube as I don’t believe anything that is on youtube. 🤣
@@maurieezzz I say that Tesla is not focused on AP in Europe as they are waiting for FSD to be cleared here. When asking my sources whether they can confirm that several FSDbeta-equipped cars are running under manufacturing license, they cannot answer that. So that's a yes 🙂. They are gathering data for FSD. But until the DCAS regulations are approved, we won't be getting any noteworthy improvements for AP. That is what is going gon and why we urgently need the UNECE to approve the DCAS regulations
Same sadness in Switzerland, why can't Tesla just give the responsibility to the driver if they want to use the latest FSD or not... I don't care about EU regulations in Switzerland...
Seems to remain the biggest misconception ever: the regulations are UN regulations and are valid for about 60 countries, including Switzerland, UK, South-Africa and Australia to nane a few
Europe is lagging behind. Propably to stop Tesla from further embarassing the european car manufacturers that still have no even half-decent autosteer. Tried Audi - it was tragic/laughable depending on the mood.
FSD needs to be adapted to Europe, and even to each European country, it is a *huge* work. Not to mention roads can be far more complex to navigate in Europe compare to the USA. So Tesla is focusing on FSD for the US, Europe will come later. So I am not sure Europe is to blame, I only trust autopilot on motorway with low traffic, so I understand no country in Europe will allow more from Tesla for now.
@@maurieezzz I am indeed an artificial neural network researcher, for the last 25 years. And at 53 years old I have been driving all over the US and all over Europe.
@@010falcon A new legislation will not change much. Tesla product names are more about marketing, and autopilot or FSD do not mean the same neural models in the US and in the EU. Even in Europe it is not consistent from one counties to another (naming and functionalities). I guess Tesla wants to focus on the US and expand to EU when at least the architecture will be finalised, then it will be time to train the models and adapt to each european country specificities. Or maybe Tesla will switch to China if the US becomes not so autonomous car friendly, then it could be China the the US then Europe.
Why is Europe and the UK so backward with this tech??? Are any petitions to join to campaign for Europe ans UK to allow autopilot and full self driving, maybe if we include with sensors, then we get them back!!!
What is sad is that lobbyists for the European carmakers are successful at stalling the acceptance of Teslas FSD system in EU (in order to allow them to attempt to catch up to Tesla). This is European protectionism at the cost of consumers freedom and access to technology. There is no good reason for not allowing FSD in Europe because it is still a driver assist system where the driver is responsible and must monitor what the car is doing (including holding hands on wheel at all times).
FSD US is not "junk" but a work in progress, and FSD EU does not exist at all so all comments regarding FSD in Europe are just BS (or profound ignorance). Autopilot in perfect for long distance travels on highways when traffic is low, even if weather is not perfect ; Autopilot definitely reduces fatigue and so I am sure it saves lives. But Autopilot is not designed for cities or countryside roads, even if it is possible to engage it, probably because Tesla thinks it can be helpful in traffic jams.
Thanks for doing this video. Autopilot in my 2019 Model 3 in Australia has been degrading over the years. The disabling of the radar is the most defining point in the degradation, the car used to be smooth and comfortable when following traffic using TACC or autopilot,now it brakes hard and late and is just nerve wracking to be a passenger. So I drive manually much more than I previously would have. Very dissapointing.
2019 model 3 owner here as well. What do you mean disabling radar? Did Tesla disabled radar on older models with software update? You must be kidding. I have not noticed any difference in autopilot in my car
@@ugurh5213 they did. Not kidding.
Bedankt Steven voor de moeite die je doet om deze video’s te maken, ik rij zelf met een Tesla Model Y met autopilot en vind het ook vaak frustrerend dat een wagen die eigenlijk bijna autonoom kan rijden zo gelimiteerd wordt door trage wetgeving. Toch bedankt voor je updates, ik blijf het volgen!
Ik denk dat het duidelijk is dat de wagen verre van autonoom kan rijden. Ik zie bijzonder weinig verschil met autopilot van 5 jaar geleden.
Dat klopt David, maar dat heeft alles te maken met Europese wetgeving en restricties en niets te maken met de vooruitgang die Tesla zelf boekt. Als je kijkt naar video's in Amerika met FSD Beta dan kan een Tesla Model Y van 2 jaar oud zoals de mijne met exact dezelfde hardware wel degelijk zo goed als autonoom rijden en dat heeft dus enkel met de software te maken. Dus de reden waarom autopilot buiten Amerika niet deftig werkt heeft niets met Tesla te maken maar alles met de burocratie en de wel zéér trage Europese wetgeving@@DavidDeblaere
Ik ben een andere mening toegedaan. Het naderen van rotondes, kruispunten, het zoeken naar het midden van een brede weg ipv rechts aan te houden, niet tijdig vertragen als een snelheidsbeperking eraan komt... Allemaal zaken waar mijn BMW het stukken beter doet dan mijn Tesla. De wegen in Amerika zijn rechter, breder, kruispunten ruimer, rotondes zijn onbestaande... Dat maakt het gemakkelijker. Uiteraard is wetgeving wel een vertragende factor voor zaken als lane change, afritten nemen... Dat is bijzonder jammer.
Ja da kan wel zijn dat BMW nu beter is dan Tesla maar ik geloof toch meer in het tesla systeem op lange termijn dat sowieso toch ooit naar Europa komt, en dan is het kwestie van tijd tot wanneer een Tesla in Europa rijdt zoals een Tesla in Amerika, en dat lijkt me toch nog iets anders dan dat waar wij nu tevreden moeten mee zijn. Een jaar geleden kon een Tesla in Amerika ook geen rondpunt nemen en nu doen ze dat keer op keer perfect, het systeem wordt gewoon beter met de tijd omdat alle Tesla's data sturen om het systeem te voeden waardoor het steeds beter wordt. De evolutie is duidelijk als je al een tijdje FSD Beta volgt in Amerika, dat zal ook zo gebeuren in Europa@@DavidDeblaere
Here in Denmark autopilot always wants to do a lange change the first time you activate it on a highway. If you are in the first lane, it wants to go to the second lane. If you are in the second lane, it wants to go to the first. Has been that way for years and I believe there is no way Tesla does not know about it. They simply do not care enough to fix the bug. The same for speed signs. Would it be hard to adjust the speed 50-100 meters _before_ the sign? No. They just don't want to spend any time fixing the old code.
I have just been to Denmark and driven all the way from Germany to Skagen and I did not observe that behavior with switching lanes. The slow down before signs is quite an important one though of course.
@ it only happens the _first_ time each drive on a highway. You probably need to have FSD or at least EAP otherwise the car won't suggest lane changes. It does happen every time, so there is no randomness to it. It's not the car either as I recently switched from model 3 to model Y and it is exactly the same with both cars.
I can confirm that behaviour, I have driven all over Europe and it's the same verywhere. Tesla just doesn't care.
@@pablollopis908 UNECE choses what Tesla can and can't provide. Tesla chose to focus on their important software stack, which is the North American FSD. Tesla obviously could have continued to update the European/UNECE nations to eventually scrap it once FSD is officially allowed in the EU, but i guess they chose not to do so. Either out of efficiency or to show the legislators their middle finger.
Regardless, there is some good news on the horizon. UNECE have gotten a new proposed piece of litigation which they will have to review in a up and coming conference (most likely not the next one). It is estimated that we will see it enacted in January 2025, and it will allow much more self driving capabilities (but more nags as well).
Lets look forward to that.
Thanks again Steve, you confirm so much of what I experience with my Model 3 here in Ireland.
Great video. Thank yiu
Thanx for your your video, keep on going👍
This is so sad. The politicians are way to slow and seems like it’s something they are working on 1 day every 1 month.
What exactly would you like "politicians" to do faster ? If Tesla trusts FSD would be ok in Europe, they could at least enable FSD *visualisation* in Europe, no EU regulation prohibits that.
It's also our (Europeans) specific discipline we show during driving, especially on motorways where we just relax and don't care much rather than the road ahead and our cabin distractions. If you were to use FSD like this you would definitely keep your eyes until that very last moment you see something weird on the road.
That's what I think of it personally tbh
@oleost not much to do with the politician, many cars work better in Europe than Tesla. I think mostly that tesla is not interested in making the necessary adjustments.
Ghost breaking and wrong speed limit recognition is smth other car figured out 10 years ago
Great vid again, Thanks! Been using AP over four years now in Finland. Had a Model 3 LR 2019 but bought a Model Y LR last month cause had to take advantake of the fsd transfer. And yeah the speed thing really push my buttons in the wrong way. It reads the signs perfectly fine but still for some god knows what reason it wont obey them. On some road sections AP lets you set the speed to anything and couble hundred meters later to max +10kph and then suddenly go back to last know higest value even if the speed limit has changed E.g. 100->60. And these also happen in perfectly streight roads outside of any citys with no intersections etc. I have found no logic in this. It just hapens always on the same spots or the spots sometimes change a little after an OTA update but they are there. Atleast on motorways its always max 140kph and no variations. But even worse is that on some roads it overwrites the pefectly fine read speed sign with some 'earth was just molten lava' old map data?!? For examble it reads a 80kph sign correctly and then after a kilometer or so it chanses the limit to 60 for no apparent reason and combine this with the situation that it wont let you set the speed limit over +10kph so now you are driving 70kph on 80kph road if you dont manualy override the speed with pedal. Drives me nuts thinking how many years this problem has been present and that somewhere in US there is a person who could fix this behaviour with couble of clicks with their mouse.... press two buttons "disable map speed data" "set speed to read value or 0-10kph over defined by driver"
Great to see this test drive I'm on the same version as you and its exactly what I'm finding its regressed as you say 2 or so years
Hi Steven, i drive the same version in The Netherlands, the restrictions are killing te car for now. We all know the capebillities from the car if the aprove FSD BETA here in Europe. It will be much saver when the computer can learn here with beta testers.
There is no "FSD Europe", so want do you want authorities to approve ?
Great video, thanks for sharing
At the exits you should confirm the blinker sooner. Ideally immediately when the message pops up and the car will do them much smoother. At least here in NL
It's a fine line between doing it soon enough and too soon so you'll get a timeout after 5 seconds. It also depends from exit to exit
@@StevenPeeters maybe an exit difference between BE and NL? I always initiate the exit before the line crosses the shoulder. And yes, the 5 seconds..... sigh... But that is way more annoying on the on ramp or "wave" lanes
To my opinion it should be possible to put the blinker on from 300 meter before the exit starts. In the Netherlands this the policy. While taking an exam at CBR you should adhere to that. So FSD should adhere to it too.
Hi Steven, I drive the Model Y in the Netherlands with FSD since march. I have noticed a couple of small steps forward since then. Taking exits on the highway is now a little better, it slows you to put the blinker on before the exist start which will result in taking it from the start. I really think it should be even more early according to normal behaviour in traffic.
Overtaking and then going back to the right lane drives me nuts. I have had so many times some one behind moves quicker to the right and FSD aborts the lane change abruptly. I think that is even more dangerous. Most of the time I switch FSD off (by using that steering wheel and highway icon) when there is more traffic because of this.
The update on the camera views are a really improvement to me. It really seems the view is clearer and more detail is visible which helps understanding the situation more quickly.
Camera updates are great, but at night they leave a purpla ghost image that seems to lag a few frames behind on moving objects
I am really interested in FSD beta and would like to know how to enable it in europe?
As far as I know it is officially not available...
@@paetgmeiner3620 it is legally not allowed. That is why we urgently need the DCAS regulations approved ruclips.net/video/z32IQd7HmyE/видео.htmlsi=rdJWllJhF756UnuV
The thing we call FSD here in Europe is Traffic Aware Cruise Control + Autopilot (lane keeping assistance and "automatic" lane change) + lane guidance to follow route guidance + "since a couple of months" automatic lowering of speed on highway exits. @@paetgmeiner3620
Netherlands with FSD ? Are you a Tesla employee ?
How about Vision Park?
It works now, also on HW4
@@StevenPeeters thank you.
After the latest updates I’m thinking about getting EAP for my model S.
That seems to work better than in Finland. If I try AP here on country roads without the center line it will always go to the middle of the road either immediately or after a while. It also does crazy moves when lanes merge or there is wider section in the lane. However my car worked much better in Norway at similar roads staying at the right side. I have just the basic AP in Model 3. I wonder if there is some geolocation or map information that makes it work so differently?
Norway will probably have the most extensive training data set because of the sheer number of Tesla driving there. But each country has its specific situations and legislation. That is why the US is do much easier to learn as an AI system than all of our tiny countries with each a separate rulebook
I travelled about 2500km through Norway in my Model Y last august I didn't notice any different behavior compared to the Netherlands and or Germany.@@StevenPeeters
Oh yeah fun fact, avg energy consumption was 143 Wh/km with hammering on the autobahn (a lot of yoyo-ing) included.
@@StevenPeeters Tesla has far enough data to fine-tune a neural network of most if not all European countries. They just did not start to work on Europe yet.
Thanks for the video, I am in doubt about buying a Tesla with auto pilot (FSD) but I live in The Netherlands. For me the auto pilot would be the functionality that would make me buy a Tesla. But if it doesn't give me any improvements over the normal cars 'Mercedes, Volkswagen, Ford' then well.... I do hope that you can do another video when the newer version is released in Europe.
Sure will. And having driven a few other systems (not yet Mercedes L3) I must say that overall Tesla is still better in the sense that it is more smooth. I use my EAP every single day
Thanks a lot!
I'm considering to get a Tesla myself and was wondering about autopilot. You covered a lot of parts with a fine explanation.
Would you suggest to get one with autopilot, eventually when it will be used for longer drives? So most likely for highways.
You will always get basic AutoPilot, which is lane keeping and adaptive cruise control. I would personally add Enhanced AutoPilot afterwards, when auto-park actually works. But if you want to use the auto lane change feature, it could also be worth it now. If you drive a lot on highways, I would do that, as each lane change would otherwise require you to deactivate and reactivate AP again.
Nice vid thanks!
I have 1 month FSD in new M3 2024, however non of the FSD features are working, any idea?
@@a5tr00 check with Tesla. I can’t debug your car 😉. Are you sure you have the FSD software version? Europe still doesn’t have any real FSD feature due to regulations
@@StevenPeeters Thanks for your response!
Tesla is taking ages to reply to my request. I know I have all features, because when I go to upgrades there is empty. Friends who have Tesla they can see there the options to purchase Enhanced AP or FSD.
At least autoparking should work, but it doesn’t …
@@a5tr00 where do you live?
Thanks for the video, I just wanted to see if you were going to do another test with the latest updates in v12 Autopilot, my runs with it haven't seen any improvements from this video so you opinion would be appreciated.
@@teetubbie7697 except for go on green there is no improvement worth mentioning. The latest one is even a couple of steps backwards
@@StevenPeeters Thanks for the reply, I can only agree as I do not even have the go on green in the UK, can you confirm if this is an Autopilot, EAP, or only for FSD.
Thanks.
@@teetubbie7697 traffic light reactions are only for FSD afaik
What package do you have? Basic, Enhanced or FSD?
@@radeklukas FSD, but what you see here is nothing more than EAP, since FSD doesn’t mean much outside of North-America
@@StevenPeeters I know 🙂, but there are some differences still and it is important to distinguish it. Thanks.
Any idea why when i start the autopilot, it directly gives me a couple of warnings to watch out for the road?
i get scared to have the autopilot disabled!
Warnings are normal. You need to ignore multiple warnings in a row to get a forced disable triggered. The system still has a few false positives from the camera, but it is already a lot better than at first.
Just keep you hand on the steering wheel on one side so it van detect the weight of your hand.
Thanks for the video Steven. I'm using Autopilot. I see you can do auto lane changes and ramp-on/off on highways. These features I don't have so I assume what you're showing is EAP and not AP. Do you believe EAP is worth the upgrade when driving most of the time on highways?
I actually have bought FSD already with this one. That is not worth the money at the moment (at least outside of North-America). But EAP is well worth the money on my car. On newer cars, it is debatable. I have yet to test a pure HW4 car, but I hear AP is not good at all on those cars and lane changes are horrible because of the vision-only stuff. Also, auto-park is not yet available either on those cars. So you'd just get the auto lane change. I drove a Model Y for a year and started out with basic AP because I knew that was a temoroary car until the Plaid arrived. It took me 2 weeks before I was so frustrated with the pling-ploings for each lane change, that I bought EAP with it 🙂. That alone is worth it for me. YMMV
Wat is het verschil tussen Hw3 en hw4? Ik dacht dat het enkel de kwaliteit was van de camera. Het zou normaal juist beter moeten werken mits het een hogere resolutie is.
@@MrGangstashit666 hogere resolutie = meer rekenkracht. + cameras zijn rgb ipv gggr. Heel andere berekening. Chip in de fsd computer zou ook anders zijn.
Glad to have seen your video. I’m in doubt whether I should spend the €12000 for FSD… Until now I have only seen FSD videos that were shot in the US and they looked very promising, but seeing this I realised that we’re far from that level in Europe so now I’m much less eager to spend that amount…
It’s not 12k but 7.5k. Still not worth it though. And you can always buy it when it will mean something
@@StevenPeeters that is IF you have bought Enhanced AP…
@@Savaseul Incorrect. You pay 7.5k for the full FSD. If you already purchased EAP, it is only like 3.5k or something additionally. Just look at the configurator online. Or if you have EAP already, look in your app to upgrade to FSD and you'll see the correct price
@@StevenPeeters You are right! I bought my Y three weeks ago and then it was €12000. Lucky me ☺️
@@Savaseul It has never been €12k in Europe at any point in time. Only in North-America it has increased in price
Question, at this point in time right now, is it worth paying the extra 7k for full self driving over enhanced autopilot? Seeing your video really makes me doubt if I should go for it or not. Many of the features I know work in the US dont work here it seems like.
Not worth it at all at the moment, especially with the limitations of HW4 currently. And you can always add it when it becomes available in your area.
@@StevenPeeters I should've mentioned that I live in East Flanders as well 😃, I'll just get Enhanced Autopilot. Thanks for this video, very useful and it opened my eyes!
@@Parrot4859 if you still need a referral code, feel free to use mine 😉
Great video, but I was hoping for an update on the UNECE regulations and what the latest draft of that contains, as well as a new time horizon.
That can be found here for timeline: ruclips.net/video/TSs9UtUQttM/видео.htmlsi=lTBuG0T6MciijFCA and I have sevrral other videos on the content of the DCAS
Thank you for that! I didn't even see that video. It's unfortunate that it might get delayed. How did those meetings go? Monthly updates would be nice, or at least every time there's a new milestone. For instance you mention something they needed to finish before October. Then an update tweet or video would be nice to say if they made it. I think a lot will follow you for that.
@@mathiaslorenzen9668 the UNECE does not report on every single step. Next update will be January. That’s the milestone to watch for. All that happens in the meantime is working group meetings to finalise the document
Can you cancel lane change proposal without touching the screen? Thanks for the video. Hope it will be discussed by US guys.
No, but it auto-cancels after 10s or so
Hello Steven,
Is anyone aware of availability to have autopilot subscription in EU? In US guys can pay monthly subscription but l can’t reach this option in Germany. Is anyone can clarify?
Thanks in advance
Doesn’t exist outside of North-America. I guess that will come when FSD really means something. But not even Tesla knows when this will happen at this point
Is this about Enhanced Autopilot or standard/free one?
Both, except for the lane changes/exits
@@StevenPeeters thinking about getting the model 3 with or without EAP, but doubt autopark will be there in next years.. it's lease, so now or never...
@@cyberjunkynl within 6-12 months the feature will be there. I guess your lease is 3-4 years?
@@StevenPeeters 5 years even, so will get EAP with it I guess thanks. The SR highland with LFP and EAP will be enough for my commute and occasional city trips.
@@cyberjunkynl Then I would definitely future proof it. With FSD beta potentially coming in 2025, I might even risk that. But it is mainly the lane changes that are annoying when you have only basic AP as you have to turn off AP (or turn it off by steering) and get a pling-ploing for turning it off, then overtake a few cars on AP, with a pling-ploing for turning it on again. And then the same for moving back into your original lane.
Auto park has gotten worse lately, so that needs fixing. And summon is a party trick at best and not really useful, since you have to be so close to the car you can just get in and drive it yourself ;-).
Steven, you should get a job at UNECE, your forensic attention to detail would be welcome. tesla would benefit.
Thank you for the kind words. But I woildn’t thrive in such a bureaucratic environment of job protection. I want to move forward instead of being afraid to makeca slight mistake and expecting perfection from a system where they accept people killing people in traffic every single day. They should be held accountable for all deaths and injuries that could have been prevented
All what you need to know about FSD is the answer in the q3/23 investors conference call: "he was asked a critical question about Tesla’s plan to eventually take legal responsibility for FSD; instead of responding, the CEO complained about people “already believing that Tesla has the responsibility” because they are suing the company, then claiming that Tesla achieved “baby AGI,” which is not an answer at all." 🤣
Well, he clearly indicated they have no interest in taking responsibility, keeping FSD a mere L2 system and not even close to a self driving car, let alone a driverless robotaxi. That will take another decade
Thanks for this. The main reason I bought a Tesla 3 with FSD was because of the features. It's nowhere near the same as the US, is it?
Indeed. Maybe after the January meeting we can have hope again
@@StevenPeeters Thank you for the quick response. Perhaps v12 release will be the one?
@@mrsimo7144 has nothing to do with versions, but regulations. But when it is allowed (finsllty) don’t count on it being any good with the first version for us as it needs to relearn all of our roads and signs and lights etc. Expect a same very limited beta rollout at first
@@StevenPeeters Is there anyway you can force the update? Change cars location or settings?
@@mrsimo7144 no. Tesla rolls out in batches. Your car’s VIN needs to be in the current batch to get an update. Make sure you are connected to wifi to get it as soon as your car is up
Btw. The reason why the car aborts the autopilot at the roundabout is not because it is not allowed, but because the model is 3 years old and was not trained to drive in roundabouts.
Maybe Steven didn’t point that out clearly at the start of his video but I believe Steven was just showing its behavior. Setting the status quo like a reference point in the future. Regarding using autopilot, It is just like you can’t use regular cruise control in situations like this. Autopilot isn’t capable of following route and or joining lanes as FSD in the US is. It is more a lane keeping feature. If you paid for FSD in europe you get TACC with traffic light awareness added.
Correct, this is the counterweight to all the happy US FSD owners that have no clue how lucky and privileged they are to have what they have
I am not sure what we are doing here, while you always held the steering wheel.
Holding the wheel does not mean I’m steering. It is a legal requirement on the one hand, but in the other hand a safety precaution in case it acts unexpectedly
@@StevenPeeters Ohhh all right then
Nice review again Steven, but yes general we in Europe we got a Demo version of Tesla... It is really bad the whole AutoPilot is just full of bugs and limitation. As a Person who had BMW and MERCEDES from 2021, I can say that both doing far better job than my Plaid in Autosteering... Like 2 days ago in the night I was cruising on the Highway, when a car was slower in front of me, the car asked for permission to go left lane, I gave it with the blinker on... and the car start to go, while suddenly decided to abort then go again and abort it was so uncomfortable and dangerous...
It is really bad, to be honest I went for the tesla not only because it is the most fastest and economical, but also because it was the most advanced... Now I cannot say that, I can say that Mercedes EQS autopilot is far better than my Tesla one, at least in Europe...
Autopilot was not designed for off highway use. Hence you will have many issues trying to use it in your cases. Autopilot (lane keeping) and Navigate on autopilot are only for highway use.
FSD would be more than capable of handling all the errors you are encountering.
If it was not designed for off-highway use, there would be no traffic light and stop sign behaviour. The whole point of my tests is to test it at the limits of its capabilities, not just what works well. Several engineers at Tesla have previously confirmed to me that my test points are very relevant and valid for the current version that we have. And that was years ago, while in the meantime it should have become a lot better, but hasn't
This is FSD in the EU 😂 I've also got FSD and in NL but you are right in a way that what you actually only get in EU is the LEGACY autopilot stack which isn't even used for autopilot in the US anymore
Well that software is based on really different scenarios and not suitable here in Europe that's way it is not that easy as plug and play.@@RamonSmits
@@maurieezzz it's more compatible than you think
We don't have 4 way stop in EU. Yield rules are the same. It's would only be the special cases like blinking orange (yield) or blinking red (stop) and right on green rules. The rest is pretty much the same
Is autopilot legal in Europe?? :(
Yes, very much so. But in sn extremely limited version that artificially renders the software more dangerous than it actually is
@@StevenPeeters It should never be allowed in any capacity on urban or residential streets, especially in the Netherlands.
@@i.k.8868 that is your personal opinion. I couldn’t disagree more. If you know what it does and doesn’t do, there is no problem.
@@StevenPeeters Well, I am an urban designer and preferably I wouldn't let any cars in the city. But especially not self-driving vehicles.
@@i.k.8868 I guess you’d rather have distracted people run over kids then. Autonomous vehicles will always be vigilant in 360 degrees, without distraction. There are no public autonomous vehicles in existence, so saying you don’t want them is a moot point and just not willing to invest in the future. But you are of vourse entitled to your opinion. As am I to disagree 😉
The EU/UK regulations around FSD/Autopilot are absolutely ridiculous. I even heard a few years ago that the UK wanted to make self-driving cars a reality, but it appears we have gone backwards. When will regulators realise that the software is a LOT safer than human drivers statistically speaking and there are fewer accidents as a result of FSD/autopilot being engaged in the US per million miles when compared to human drivers. Boggles the mind (I am in the UK btw)
This a UN regulation, not related to EU/UK. But things will hopefully change next month ruclips.net/video/TSs9UtUQttM/видео.htmlsi=JVVE6VIy-LZdCnD2
Hello Steven, thank you for your videos that show the huge scam behind FSD. I have bought this option 5 year ago and still cannot use it. We should open a class action agsinst Tesla. It is a shame.
This has nothing to do with Tesl (except the speed limits), but everything with the UNECE regulations. Stop blaming tesla for this. If anyone should be sued, it is the UNECE for artificially limiting AP and FSD.
@@StevenPeeters maybe not only Tesla fault but mercedes can use level 3 in Europe. Certainly because they keep using ultrasonic sensors and radars to be safer.
@@sammoe892 Mercedes has L3 up to 60km/h and only in perfect conditions and only in Germany and only on certain sections of Autobahn. This is because Germany has adopted a specific law for this to be allowed. Not possible in other countries. Tesla could certify for that too, but that would mean that Tesla takes responsibility for every action of the car while it in in L3 mode.
@@StevenPeeters you are right. But the frustration as a customer is real.
@@sammoe892 I know. I've been fighting for this and trying to push the regulators ever since they limited AP in 2019. I know some of my videos have reached them and they were not happy with me exposing the parties that were against the progress and holding things back. This secrecy within the regulations is mind boggling.It shows they don't care for the end result, just for their own job protection
If Switzerland, a non-EU country, first allows Full Self-Driving, it may inspire or motivate European countries to follow suit
Regulations apply to Switzerland too. These are UN regulations, and have nothing to do with the EU.
@@StevenPeeters Interesting take on UNECE and FSD. It’s more complex than expected, especially with the USA’s unique stance on FSD as a UNECE member. This leads me to wonder how other countries might balance their own rules with international standards to possibly accelerate FSD adoption outside the US.
@@stephanebhiri the US did not sign into the WP29 agreement tgat stipulates that all those 60-ish countries implement the same regulations. That is why they are part of the UN but do not have to follow those regulations. I have several videos on this topic on my channel in a playlist. Feel free to check them out gor more detailed info on the regulations
Can’t wait to check out your videos! You seem to really know your stuff about this - excited to gain more insights!
Very disappointing. I would have expected Tesla to better polish the normal AP and Nav on AP, but unfortunately they didn't. There are little things like heavy acceleration in stop-and-go traffic on the highway and not building an emergency lane that spoil the experience for me and the speed limit things they are so anoying. If the small problems were fixed it would be much better
Heavy acceleration? I always find it way too slow and unresponsive in those situations. Takes like 30 seconds to get to 60kph when a car in front is driving off.
@@StevenPeeters only in heavy traffic on the highway when the car in front moves 5-10 meters forward and stop again than it always takes of like a rocket and slams on the brakes again.
Tesla seems to have forgotten about Europe. In the US they replaced all RCCC-cameras for free in the older cars and here my car does not even get 2023.32.x for my old RCCC cameras.
They haven't replaced any cameras here, because that is not necessary for the limited functionality we are getting.
The bus at 1m25s into the video is driving on the white line. Isn't that a no-no in your part of the world? Seriously though... The AP is doing much better than before here in the U.S. I just wish we could teach people in Miami how to drive.
This is how small the lanes are here. A bus takes up more space than the lane width. 😲
Its so bad that you still have to have your hand on the wheel, a bit makes the auto drive useless. (if you look at the comfort)
So cool to see itself drive tho', i HATE electric craps, but this auto drive makes it so awesome :)
It's a legal requirement, just like in the US. That is the definition of L2 ADAS. It is NOT a self-driving car, but an advanced driver assist. There are no publicly available self driving cars anywhere in the world. So yes, hand on the wheel is a legal requirement and hands-off, eyes-on systems are being developed and certified. But at that point, your every movement inside the car will be monitored
@@StevenPeeters Thats what i thought too, but would be cool, if you could just release your hands
@@drakeblackk the upcoming DCAS regulation might just enable that. But probably takes another year before it is activated and allows fsd in Europe
@@StevenPeeters That would be interesting, even if i just watch it on yt :)
There are no regulations. It is a problem of Tesla not to implement it properly. Mercedes, Audi and BMW can changes lines fully automatically. Mercedes can make a complete overtake fully by itself.
Mercedes can do that under L3 regulations, and only in Germany. This is not L2, what AutoPilot is. There the regulations are set globally from the UNECE, with 60-ish countries all implement the same. Just watch this to understand ruclips.net/video/SxwrD0MMZxE/видео.htmlsi=V9AFXuysD_s_UthY
@@StevenPeeters Mercedes can and is doing that on every road similar to Autobahn even at 150km/h under L2. There are a lot YT videos on that. I understand that, I'm engineer and doing software for autonomous driving.
@@madmikesch2453 tead the regulations and you’ll see that individual countries are starting to make exceptions for eyes-on systems. But saying there are no regulations is false
@@StevenPeeters Regulations in EU are the same in all countries. There is no regulation not allowing to change the line.
@@madmikesch2453 driver initiated, yes, it can chanes lanes. But the dystem cannot initiate it by itself. And lane chsnges ste only allowed on roads with physical dividers between driving directions AND with no access for pedestrians and cyclists. So basicaly only highways. But I think I get now what you are referring to
Hope you get some comments from the US guys, they’ll probably say ‘just move to the US’ lol
Probably. 🤣
Autopilot gets the legal speed wrong too often (in Belgium). Many other bugs as well. Tesla seems to put all its attention (engineers) on FSD in the US. Why complain about the regulations when Tesla doesn't care about fixing things first?
Because FSD will fix most of these issues (not the speed limit though)
@@StevenPeeters
By the way, thanks for the testing and the videos. Tesla does not communicate the legal restrictions on auto pilot and also summon, so before your videos I had no clue.
Your video is introducing confusion between FSD and autopilot, and you do not even try to correct misunderstandings in the comments. Honesty, I am not sure you are helping. The sad reality is that for now Tesla is not focused on Europe regarding autopilot and they have not even start the work regarding FSD. And I am not a hater, I own a Tesla since 2018 *with FSD* !
I don’t understand why you are confused. I mentioned many times already what the oroblem is with FSD beta, which is not the FSD option. Maybe you need to watch my other videos on the regulations to understand it?
Do you have proof of your claim about Tesla hasn’t starting to work on FSD here in europe? What is your claim based on? I thing your claim is misleading and starts confusion. 😁 But seriously where did you get this information from? And please don’t answer you saw it on youtube as I don’t believe anything that is on youtube. 🤣
@@maurieezzz I say that Tesla is not focused on AP in Europe as they are waiting for FSD to be cleared here. When asking my sources whether they can confirm that several FSDbeta-equipped cars are running under manufacturing license, they cannot answer that. So that's a yes 🙂. They are gathering data for FSD. But until the DCAS regulations are approved, we won't be getting any noteworthy improvements for AP. That is what is going gon and why we urgently need the UNECE to approve the DCAS regulations
Same sadness in Switzerland, why can't Tesla just give the responsibility to the driver if they want to use the latest FSD or not... I don't care about EU regulations in Switzerland...
Seems to remain the biggest misconception ever: the regulations are UN regulations and are valid for about 60 countries, including Switzerland, UK, South-Africa and Australia to nane a few
@@StevenPeeters I don't care, should be drivers responsibility as much as speeding is.
even without FSD I have the same issues with standard autopilot. it's dumb in Europe and it's a shame. Even mercedes does better !
It's all just sad and clearly Tesla be like 🤷
To bad Europe is not allowing FSD /autopilot.
The UNECE is not allowing it. EU is only a small part of that WP29 agreement
The autopilot is totally retarded on German streets 😢 a complete downgrade from my Skoda Octavia iV. Its ACC was insanely good.
Europe is lagging behind. Propably to stop Tesla from further embarassing the european car manufacturers that still have no even half-decent autosteer. Tried Audi - it was tragic/laughable depending on the mood.
FSD needs to be adapted to Europe, and even to each European country, it is a *huge* work. Not to mention roads can be far more complex to navigate in Europe compare to the USA. So Tesla is focusing on FSD for the US, Europe will come later. So I am not sure Europe is to blame, I only trust autopilot on motorway with low traffic, so I understand no country in Europe will allow more from Tesla for now.
@@didierpuzenat7280 how are roads far more complex? How do you know how much work it is? Do you work for Tesla? Are you a neural network engineer?
Early 2024 it should be fixed with new Legislation
@@maurieezzz I am indeed an artificial neural network researcher, for the last 25 years. And at 53 years old I have been driving all over the US and all over Europe.
@@010falcon A new legislation will not change much. Tesla product names are more about marketing, and autopilot or FSD do not mean the same neural models in the US and in the EU. Even in Europe it is not consistent from one counties to another (naming and functionalities). I guess Tesla wants to focus on the US and expand to EU when at least the architecture will be finalised, then it will be time to train the models and adapt to each european country specificities. Or maybe Tesla will switch to China if the US becomes not so autonomous car friendly, then it could be China the the US then Europe.
Why is Europe and the UK so backward with this tech??? Are any petitions to join to campaign for Europe ans UK to allow autopilot and full self driving, maybe if we include with sensors, then we get them back!!!
We tried a petition many years ago, but they don’t care. If all goes well at the end of the month, we might get it in 2025
What is sad is that lobbyists for the European carmakers are successful at stalling the acceptance of Teslas FSD system in EU (in order to allow them to attempt to catch up to Tesla). This is European protectionism at the cost of consumers freedom and access to technology. There is no good reason for not allowing FSD in Europe because it is still a driver assist system where the driver is responsible and must monitor what the car is doing (including holding hands on wheel at all times).
Watch my videos on the DCAS regeluation and what it means. WE think there are no reasons, but kegally there are
Buy junk , get junk.
Exept for the driving assist features, all other brands are junk compared to Tesla. Including ICE.
In my opinion you can't buy any car if you strife for perfection. What do you own?
FSD US is not "junk" but a work in progress, and FSD EU does not exist at all so all comments regarding FSD in Europe are just BS (or profound ignorance). Autopilot in perfect for long distance travels on highways when traffic is low, even if weather is not perfect ; Autopilot definitely reduces fatigue and so I am sure it saves lives. But Autopilot is not designed for cities or countryside roads, even if it is possible to engage it, probably because Tesla thinks it can be helpful in traffic jams.