The 1909 VDB often looks prooflike, and that's why it's a popular type coin. Remember that it's a first year of issue and the master dies hadn't had time to deteriorate.
I collect Large Cents by collections. I crossed over a NGC MS61 1852 Jules Reiver Collection. I used the ANY designation for grade. It came back AU 58. Thats the $$ I paid for it and to be fair NGC over graded most of the Reiver coins I have seen. I would love to add the 1856 Eliasberg to my collection. I would cross it as ANY...the Pedigree on a PCGS holder would more that make up for any down grade from PCI. If your collector client wants to part with the coin please let me know!!
Why not set the minimum grade just below the current grade? Say ms60 and ms62 respectively for the large cents I have 18 coins in for crossover and set No minimum grade other than no “details coins” will be cracked out.
Sometimes I think it’s best to just crack them out. BUT then they aren’t slabbed at all. That’s why this year I am NOT rolling the dice and buying the coin, holder and grade I want for my collection. Another great video Ben!
Wondering why PCGS is reluctant to give full band status in todays grading even in cross overs when is past years they have graded many, many Mercury's with full band grades? But winning one out of two is batting .500. Thanks Ben
I am glad pcgs prevented you from cracking out the eliasberg coins from the old school holders - you would have lost the provenance and collectible holders
Can you opt for a potential downgrade in order for it to get crossed over, or will they only cross it over if it same grade or better? For example, I assume you'd rather have the 1818 and 1864 cents in MS Brown PCGS holders and drop the Red/Brown designation.
I think PCGS is so far behind they look for a reason not to grade a coin and move on. It would be interesting to send those coins to ANACS to see how they grade them.
Cracking out means you lose the grade. A 63 could come back a 61, for example. By submitting a crossover, you can opt to auto-decline if a lesser grade would result.
Yesterday I was helping out at my LCS and I got my first Ancient's question - how do you determine which coins were the ones with Marcus Aurelius on them?? I gave up eventually looking through coins....like a needle in a haystack of 500 appx :(
Hey Ben could you explain a gem and a gem proof designation on holder like PCGS please? I guess I mean the ones that have no grade labeled just gem like . Thanks either way. I do enjoy. The large one cent was beautiful. I was just talking to my dad today about my love for the large cent. He watches your videos too. Sad they didn’t cross
I'm not Ben, but I can tell you why Gem and Uncirculated designations exist. If you do a bulk submission of all the same coin you can set a minimum excepted grade, anything lower than that would be returned unholdered, or you can opt to have it slabbed and generically labeled (Uncirculated, Proof, Gem, Gem Proof ect.) For example, I buy a monster box of 97 eagles, set the minimum grade to 69 and anything under a 69 comes back labeled Gem Uncirculated (65-68+). Or I send in a bag of 1881S Morgans with a minimum of 65, anything under that comes back slabbed as Uncirculated (60-64+).
Didn't cross over because of the toning. Now interesting as NGC and PCGS say that a coin in their holders could be subject to toning over time. So does this mean that if you sent a coin in to be slabbed again, to the same company that originally slabbed the coin, due to say an ugly scratch on the face of the holder, they may reduce the grade or not put the coin in a new holder because of the toning that has taken place while in one of their slabs? Excellent video Ben.
Ben: As usual, another great video! I just do not understand PCGS these days and like others have said before, for the kind of money you pay out, they should at least give you an explanation, ESPECIALLY on the Eliasberg coins! Cheers.
I am kinda dumb and strange... I have requested that one of the largest grading companies remove my coin from public view and take down the pictures and info (about it) from their website... My logic is that since I am the owner of the coin, they have no right to publish what I consider to be "false" and misleading info to the pubic about my investment property... without my permission to do so.....(they can keep all the private files that they want) This is in response, in part, to the threats to sue me if I make public the content of the e-mails that the have sent me.. discussing my private dispute with issues over their grading and other aspects of the coin.... It seems to me that I am only asking them to do what they order me to do...or else. In any event... I will keep you posted...
That 37d does have some looks of being cleaned. Without it being in person, I can’t say obviously. But nice regardless. Could be a result of someone using too much acetone? Sometimes you can achieve a cleaned look like that
That’s a silly comment - too much acetone ? Read up on what acetone is and what it does it’s a solvent that breaks down plastics and for removing grime It’s has Zero impact on metal Zero impact on luster It leaves zero trace of it even having been there since it evaporates in minutes The holders 30+ years old If they even used acetone on the coin (for removing pvc) it was over 30 years ago I’ll put my stock into Bens credibility here The fact that Ben’s a 40 year experienced numismatist and he says it isn’t cleaned vs you looking at a video for 2 3/8 of a second
Would’ve been a Travesty to lose the old PCI And Accugrade holders Those holders are going to be downright rare in -15-20 years As they say - they ain’t making any more of em … The coins are gorgeous The holders add premium Everyone wants their PCGS and green bean It’s sad
How reliable are the PCI slabbed grades? I just watched an online auction which had a 1953-S Franklin Half Dollar in a PCI holder, purportedly graded at MS-66, with Full Bell Lines designation, that eventually sold at a bid of $1510.00, which obviously is a HUGE bargain compared to what an authentic 1953-S FBL half sells for in any MS 60+ grade. The photos of the coin for the auction weren't detailed enough to do an adequate inspection of the coin reverse to verify the FBL designation, so it was purely a matter of trusting the PCI designation. I was tempted, but couldn't pull the trigger for essentially a blind bid exceeding $1000 on an online auction. For the buyer's sake, I hope the PCI designation proved to be accurate.
@@revello103 only the oldest generation from the 80s are worth any value - the newer ones after the ownership changes are all junk The oldest ones are considered pretty conservative as a rule. But like all TPG, PCGS NGC not withstanding , it’s subjective and errors are made or disagreements happen I have a 99-S NGC AU55 dollar that was absolutely heavily cleaned Straight graded I’ve seen hundreds of dipped out coins in PCGS NGC holders that are dead. How did they get through ? Several reasons - mostly it often takes months or years for dipped out coins to retone. And often they’re ugly splotchy yellow brown They retoned and the luster died after slabbing Like everything else one is best served learning how to use their own brain. Educate yourself . Read . Study and use your own grading skills in conjunction with PCGS/NGC labels When I say you I don’t mean you. You plural. The general populace
With the large cents, it must be the color. What are the "rules" that PCGS uses for crossovers? Is it that they won't cross it over if they think it'll be a lesser grade? That would explain the cents. Perhaps better to crack them out and resubmit?
That Mercury is FB even on a dark, foggy night. The 1909 VDB Lincoln; could it possibly be a proof? Every coin I've sent to PCGS for crossover came back DNC with no clue as to what the issue was. For a company that prides itself on service, that's very disappointing. Will you consider breaking those large cents out and resubmitting as raw?
Did you set a minimum grade you were willing to accept on those large cents? Maybe that was the reason they didn't cross.!!🤔 Crack them open and resend them for straight grading, I am sure they will even grade better than their old holder grade!!
Interesting results. Those Large Cents look awesome to me. Like yourself, I don't see cleaning on the 3-legged buffalo either. It's nice to see our friend "Questionable Color" is back. lol 🤣 Are you planning on submitting those Large Cents to NGC next? Thanks
Great video as always. I was a little surprised you sent the 1909 cent to PCGS. If your client insisted then I understand, but it’s pretty obviously AT.
Hi, Ben. I like the pastel toning on the 53 Rosey. The 09 VDB Lincoln in the Accu Grade holder looks original. I like its toning, and I give it a "Questionable Grading" designation. I can't tell about the cleaning on the 37D Buffalo. I like the toning on the 1818 Cent. It has an interesting die crack. The "Did not cross" is bullshit. The grading service should explain. Bastards. It is the same thing with the 1856 Cent. PCGS hates you. Do you hate them? *TYU*
Hey Ben, Have you ever re-submitted coins that came back cleaned, questionable color or some other negative grade say a year later and given different results?
Nice coins all! Grading,,, As We know, is not an exact science. And I know having these coins in an NGC or PCGS slab adds to the value, But As "They say... Buy the Coin not the label"
That 45 Merc looked FB to me. I only have one Eliasberg coin. I want to keep in the original holder. PCGA is all over the place these days. Both cents should have crossed.
Thank you. These are some of my favorite videos.
Enjoyable and educational video; thanks.
More PCGS craziness. Thanks for sharing!
Thanks for sending the coins in for me Ben! Sucks that I went 0 for 3 especially the eliasbergs
I’m still confused as to why those large cents didn’t take
@@repunched106 me too
maybe they didn't want to cross the Eliasberg provenance
thats what I'm thinking too
The Large Cents were amazing. Many Thanks!
That 1909 looks like a proof
The 1909 VDB often looks prooflike, and that's why it's a popular type coin. Remember that it's a first year of issue and the master dies hadn't had time to deteriorate.
I collect Large Cents by collections. I crossed over a NGC MS61 1852 Jules Reiver Collection. I used the ANY designation for grade. It came back AU 58. Thats the $$ I paid for it and to be fair NGC over graded most of the Reiver coins I have seen. I would love to add the 1856 Eliasberg to my collection. I would cross it as ANY...the Pedigree on a PCGS holder would more that make up for any down grade from PCI. If your collector client wants to part with the coin please let me know!!
PCGS rookie hires must have been the ones not wanting to cross over the final 2 large cents in the video 🤔
Very informative...I agree with you on the buffalo. Love the large cents. Thank you for the share. Stay safe and peace from Kansas!!!
Do you think they didn’t cross because they couldn’t verify those coins were in the Elisaberg sale?
The documentation from the 1996 catalog was sent with the coins
@@Til_Valhalla_Art do they carry over the designation on other items like Binions or other Third party designations?
Why not set the minimum grade just below the current grade? Say ms60 and ms62 respectively for the large cents
I have 18 coins in for crossover and set No minimum grade other than no “details coins” will be cracked out.
I have heard, that on Crossover if you get a plain "DNC" most likely the coin didn't meet the minimum grade you put on the submission form.
love the die break on that 1818 cent
It would be nice to have an explanation lol. Thanks Ben
Those large cents especially the first one are very very nice🔥🔥🔥
With that pedigree it really doesn't matter which slab those last two coins are in.
I have had copper coins cross at PCGS from RB to BN.
The reason why the Eliasberg coin didn't cross is because Pcgs couldn't prove it was from that collection !!
Sometimes I think it’s best to just crack them out. BUT then they aren’t slabbed at all. That’s why this year I am NOT rolling the dice and buying the coin, holder and grade I want for my collection. Another great video Ben!
My main issue with cracking them out is that the slab is the only solid proof of the pedigree
Wondering why PCGS is reluctant to give full band status in todays grading even in cross overs when is past years they have graded many, many Mercury's with full band grades? But winning one out of two is batting .500. Thanks Ben
I am glad pcgs prevented you from cracking out the eliasberg coins from the old school holders - you would have lost the provenance and collectible holders
Can you opt for a potential downgrade in order for it to get crossed over, or will they only cross it over if it same grade or better? For example, I assume you'd rather have the 1818 and 1864 cents in MS Brown PCGS holders and drop the Red/Brown designation.
Yes you can opt for cross at any grade (can choose with or without details grade). You can actually specify designation as well if youd like
Eliasberg! If I were filthy rich and had lots of free time, I could assemble the world's greatest collection.
The three legged Buffalo doesn't look cleaned to me.
I think PCGS is so far behind they look for a reason not to grade a coin and move on. It would be interesting to send those coins to ANACS to see how they grade them.
Or NGC.
Why wouldn't you have just cracked some of those out vs. crossover? What is the benefit to doing a crossover?
Cracking out means you lose the grade. A 63 could come back a 61, for example. By submitting a crossover, you can opt to auto-decline if a lesser grade would result.
They didnt cross it because its from the eliasberg collection. is that considered a pci slab?
plz dont do it but if you broke them out and sent them for a fresh grade im sure they would grade out.
Yesterday I was helping out at my LCS and I got my first Ancient's question - how do you determine which coins were the ones with Marcus Aurelius on them?? I gave up eventually looking through coins....like a needle in a haystack of 500 appx :(
You try holding a Buffalo down and giving it a bath. no way it's cleaned.
😂😂😂😂
Beautiful 1909 , I think is better to Crack out the holders and not send nothing to crossover..
That’s my friends 1818 I think
Yep
Hey Ben could you explain a gem and a gem proof designation on holder like PCGS please? I guess I mean the ones that have no grade labeled just gem like . Thanks either way. I do enjoy. The large one cent was beautiful. I was just talking to my dad today about my love for the large cent. He watches your videos too. Sad they didn’t cross
I'm not Ben, but I can tell you why Gem and Uncirculated designations exist. If you do a bulk submission of all the same coin you can set a minimum excepted grade, anything lower than that would be returned unholdered, or you can opt to have it slabbed and generically labeled (Uncirculated, Proof, Gem, Gem Proof ect.) For example, I buy a monster box of 97 eagles, set the minimum grade to 69 and anything under a 69 comes back labeled Gem Uncirculated (65-68+). Or I send in a bag of 1881S Morgans with a minimum of 65, anything under that comes back slabbed as Uncirculated (60-64+).
@@samwazhere559 thanks for the response. I’m with you. I think I get it. No wonder I was and still am kinda confused.
Didn't cross over because of the toning. Now interesting as NGC and PCGS say that a coin in their holders could be subject to toning over time. So does this mean that if you sent a coin in to be slabbed again, to the same company that originally slabbed the coin, due to say an ugly scratch on the face of the holder, they may reduce the grade or not put the coin in a new holder because of the toning that has taken place while in one of their slabs? Excellent video Ben.
I know that PCGS will consider cross over submissions from ICG and ANACS. Is this also true for PCI?
Ben: As usual, another great video! I just do not understand PCGS these days and like others have said before, for the kind of money you pay out, they should at least give you an explanation, ESPECIALLY on the Eliasberg coins! Cheers.
I am kinda dumb and strange... I have requested that one of the largest grading companies remove my coin from public view and take down the pictures and info (about it) from their website... My logic is that since I am the owner of the coin, they have no right to publish what I consider to be "false" and misleading info to the pubic about my investment property... without my permission to do so.....(they can keep all the private files that they want)
This is in response, in part, to the threats to sue me if I make public the content of the e-mails that the have sent me.. discussing my private dispute with issues over their grading and other aspects of the coin.... It seems to me that I am only asking them to do what they order me to do...or else.
In any event... I will keep you posted...
That 37d does have some looks of being cleaned. Without it being in person, I can’t say obviously. But nice regardless. Could be a result of someone using too much acetone? Sometimes you can achieve a cleaned look like that
That’s a silly comment - too much acetone ? Read up on what acetone is and what it does
it’s a solvent that breaks down plastics and for removing grime
It’s has
Zero impact on metal
Zero impact on luster
It leaves zero trace of it even having been there since it evaporates in minutes
The holders 30+ years old
If they even used acetone on the coin (for removing pvc) it was over 30 years ago
I’ll put my stock into Bens credibility here
The fact that Ben’s a 40 year experienced numismatist and he says it isn’t cleaned vs you looking at a video for 2 3/8 of a second
Can’t you just ask why?
Unfortunately no
Would’ve been a Travesty to lose the old PCI And Accugrade holders
Those holders are going to be downright rare in -15-20 years
As they say - they ain’t making any more of em …
The coins are gorgeous
The holders add premium
Everyone wants their PCGS and green bean
It’s sad
How reliable are the PCI slabbed grades? I just watched an online auction which had a 1953-S Franklin Half Dollar in a PCI holder, purportedly graded at MS-66, with Full Bell Lines designation, that eventually sold at a bid of $1510.00, which obviously is a HUGE bargain compared to what an authentic 1953-S FBL half sells for in any MS 60+ grade. The photos of the coin for the auction weren't detailed enough to do an adequate inspection of the coin reverse to verify the FBL designation, so it was purely a matter of trusting the PCI designation. I was tempted, but couldn't pull the trigger for essentially a blind bid exceeding $1000 on an online auction. For the buyer's sake, I hope the PCI designation proved to be accurate.
@@revello103 only the oldest generation from the 80s are worth any value - the newer ones after the ownership changes are all junk
The oldest ones are considered pretty conservative as a rule. But like all TPG, PCGS NGC not withstanding , it’s subjective and errors are made or disagreements happen
I have a 99-S NGC AU55 dollar that was absolutely heavily cleaned
Straight graded
I’ve seen hundreds of dipped out coins in PCGS NGC holders that are dead. How did they get through ?
Several reasons - mostly it often takes months or years for dipped out coins to retone. And often they’re ugly splotchy yellow brown
They retoned and the luster died after slabbing
Like everything else one is best served learning how to use their own brain. Educate yourself . Read . Study and use your own grading skills in conjunction with PCGS/NGC labels
When I say you I don’t mean you. You plural. The general populace
What do you mean about cross over.
With the large cents, it must be the color. What are the "rules" that PCGS uses for crossovers? Is it that they won't cross it over if they think it'll be a lesser grade? That would explain the cents.
Perhaps better to crack them out and resubmit?
PCGS annoys the hell out of me.
Beautiful large cents, shame they didn't cross but amazing coins nonetheless
That Mercury is FB even on a dark, foggy night. The 1909 VDB Lincoln; could it possibly be a proof? Every coin I've sent to PCGS for crossover came back DNC with no clue as to what the issue was. For a company that prides itself on service, that's very disappointing. Will you consider breaking those large cents out and resubmitting as raw?
I wouldn’t crack them out because they would lose their pedigree
@@tylonnplatinumthe3rd659 exactly, and I don’t plan on it.
Saying why the coin didn't cross over is completely bogus.
Did you set a minimum grade you were willing to accept on those large cents? Maybe that was the reason they didn't cross.!!🤔 Crack them open and resend them for straight grading, I am sure they will even grade better than their old holder grade!!
Interesting results. Those Large Cents look awesome to me. Like yourself, I don't see cleaning on the 3-legged buffalo either. It's nice to see our friend "Questionable Color" is back. lol 🤣 Are you planning on submitting those Large Cents to NGC next? Thanks
Was debating sending to ngc. May send to icg because they are right next to me to get the brown designation and resub to PCGS to cross
Great video as always.
I was a little surprised you sent the 1909 cent to PCGS. If your client insisted then I understand, but it’s pretty obviously AT.
Hi, Ben. I like the pastel toning on the 53 Rosey. The 09 VDB Lincoln in the Accu Grade holder looks original. I like its toning, and I give it a "Questionable Grading" designation. I can't tell about the cleaning on the 37D Buffalo. I like the toning on the 1818 Cent. It has an interesting die crack. The "Did not cross" is bullshit. The grading service should explain. Bastards. It is the same thing with the 1856 Cent. PCGS hates you. Do you hate them? *TYU*
Hey Ben, Have you ever re-submitted coins that came back cleaned, questionable color or some other negative grade say a year later and given different results?
I can say from watching the channel for years that he’s done that many times. Some pretty inconsistent results over the years
Nice coins all! Grading,,, As We know, is not an exact science. And I know having these coins in an NGC or PCGS slab adds to the value, But As "They say... Buy the Coin not the label"
.....and BN to RB!
Next step is crackout
That 45 Merc looked FB to me. I only have one Eliasberg coin. I want to keep in the original holder. PCGA is all over the place these days. Both cents should have crossed.
This is why I don't like pcgs
Those last two cents were just stunning. I’m amazed they didn’t cross.
ACG.....bleeeccchhh
First view - Best wishes Ben