The Irony Of Being A Game Dev: Plenty Of Opportunities But Game Devs Can't Get A Job
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- Опубликовано: 8 сен 2024
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Being a gamedev working for a corpo is one of the worst experiences. (no life-work balance, lot's of unpaid overtime)
Unless you have your own indie team and get sponsorship.
Going into gaming dev is shit.
Depends on where you work, how you negotiate your obligations, your experience, and many other things. Game development is a passion industry above anything else, that's why you see a lot of software developers leaving high paid jobs to get into game dev...
@@awesometuts 100% agree with you on that - but i'd rather recommend people first get into software dev and only aftewards transition if they see fit.
Starting in gamedev gonna be harsh for 99% of the people.
Have you ever actually worked at a AAA studio?
@@litmus3742 Actually i did, yes.
@@darksidedani lol
Mostly agree here, I find where a lot of people mess up is having a demonstration of their skills (portfolio and code samples). I will say though, that Udemy courses CAN provide value, but you can't follow them blindly because you will end up with the same generic game that everyone else is making or some re-skin of it. Use what you learn to expand your prototype into something different and better and showcase that. Bad coding habits? Perhaps, but take some pure coding courses (sure they're less fun!) and see what you can improve on your own projects.
I do think that we are moving into an era where online courses actually do offer a lot of benefits and flexible learning, but you need to be picky about the ones you take and make sure you are actually learning and not just following.
Anyway, ++ Portfolio and interview readiness but it's not all doom and gloom on online courses depending which ones you choose and how you approach them :)
It's not that udemy and similar courses can't provide any value... yes you can learn something, but that's the basics of basics which you can also learn on youtube for free... in essence, udemy does not have any quality control, anyone can create and publish a course there and every single game dev instructor on udemy has never created a real world game or tried to at least or even had any contact with the industry... I'm not saying they are bad people or anything like that, there are good people who genuinely want to help, but you can't help someone if you don't know it yourself...
The problem with bad coding habits is that you don't know you have them until someone points it out to you, and most people who follow those courses try to apply for jobs, the game studios just reject them without any explanation so in the end rarely anyone of them finds out that he learned to code the wrong way and the he needs to learn how to do it the correct way... That's the issue...
@@awesometuts Gotcha 🙂and that is probably true of most of the courses, but some of them actually do work closely with industry partners. I'd just say for the prospective learner to do their homework and look at the company and teacher's credentials and history before choosing to spend time (ultimately worth a lot more than the money you can get these for). You are right though, there is no direct quality control on content from the company (Udemy) itself. The only form of quality control, and I would argue it's decent for established courses, is the user review/rating system. If something is rated anything less than 4/5 on average it's worth investigating why or if it seems to have a lot of negative reviews.
I'm not speaking from total inexperience either. I started my path with a critical selection of courses from Udemy and I do work in the industry today. But I would say what probably differentiated me from other candidates was experience in other fields and a decent demonstrable portfolio.
Also, I really like your content, I am subbed and I definitely always like to hear what you have to say :) I just wanted to say that prospective learners shouldn't be frightened away from tools that can help them :)
The problem with reviews on udemy is that udemy prompts you to give a review after 3-5 lectures in the course... that's not enough to determine if a course is good or not... a lot of people are bias when giving reviews towards instructors they like too...
But the main thing with reviews on udemy is this: you'll see people saying oh it's easy to follow course, oh I learned this, or I learned that... but you'll never see a review saying I got a job in a game studio thanks to this course...
And that's because the skill level, if you can call it that, that you get in udemy courses is not enough to get you hired in a game studio...
Not to mention that not a single course on udemy is talking about how to create a portfolio, how to apply for jobs, what to do on a job interview... and these are crucial things every game dev needs to get hired in a game studio...
So how can someone expect to get a job in a game studio by following udemy courses when they're not teaching how to actually get a job...
That's my point.
@@awesometuts This is true, I always defer the review for that reason until later but I'm guessing many don't do that. Or I re-review. I think fundamentally, people should know that a course alone won't land them the job. As you said in the video and above, there's so much more to it from having something to demonstrate and talk about to actually knowing what you are talking about in the interview to HOW you interact with the interviewer. Courses can help you learn if you use them right, but they will definitely never be enough alone to land you a job. A University degree alone won't generally do that either these days unless your interviewer and the interview process is archaic or broken.
On my point of view statement that "There are a lot opportunities to get into gamedev" is overstatement. There is no such big need of new game developers, most of vacancies are for someone who is already in industry. For someone with real good programming skills there is much more space and money in business and app software development. By the way I saw like people with crazy audio experience in different industries were trying to get into games because they were told that "there are a lot of opportunities there" and in reality very few of them did and this have nothing to do with their professional qualification. (I'm not talking about myself)
Let me tell you something. Your biggest enemy in this game e.g. getting a job in a game studio or any other job for that matter is your brain. Your brain will mess with you all the time. It will tell you things like you can't do it, there's not a lot of opportunity, why should someone pick you and so on... which is basically what you said in your comments.
If you have that kind of mindset when you approach this situation then for sure you'll never get hired...
If you just go and search for unity and unreal jobs just in US you'll find thousands... are there thousands of experienced game developers those companies will hire? I don't think so.
Anyways, first change the mindset, then apply for a job...
Well, I agree with you, but I think in my honesty that talking about a good and well made portfolio it's too abstract, when you see a portfolio, what are the characteristics of that being good? I mean, I also have a portfolio, sure I followed some Udemy courses, some yt tutorials, some articles and stuff. I tried to absorve as much knowledge I could.
I am working on a personal project and I work on a startup company for Game Development, still I find it super hard besides having a project (all made by myself) the knowledge and the experience and be well aware about the proper techniques (even though I might not know all of them) and yet, it's quite rare to get an interview and when I get it's super hard to move on to the next phase of the hiring process. Considering that the last companies I tried are european corporations in Poland, Germany, etc... On top of that when I am on interviews the interviewers never ever ask me about design patterns and also anything abt the projects I am working and shown on the porfolio.
And yet get rejected, I think the problem might be deeper than that or I might be doing something very wrong, but that's my opinion in the end.
what questions do they ask? could you give some insight
I have 6 years of experience with unreal engine and I'm even failing to get a job in some roles that request things that are so trivial for my experience. I am sure that I would do great if I ever had a chance to do the test but usually I get reject because the lack of professional experience in the industry. Looks like the best thing I can do is to stop creating portfolio (which doesn't have any follow-up tutorial) and start to make my own commercial game.
@@bonyfist Usually they start by presenting their company, that they might tell you that they have one or more projects in development. Then the typical "Tell me about yourself."
What experience I have developing games for certain platforms, for example if I apply for a company that might work on mobile games, they will ask me if I know how to make a performant game in order to run in such platform. It's kinda hard for me to remember all of them. How long I have been on the industry and so on.
The last interview I had the interviewer made some questions I didnt liked but I understand why she asked, such as "Why do you want to leave your current company?", which is dificult to answer, since you might have reasons to leave, but you also don't want to talk crap abt your current company as I find that non-ethical and not professional at all. Those kind of questions I have been asked in general.
@@luccasmachado4748 That's what I am actually doing, sometimes it's best to take stuff with our own hands, good luck dude.
@Toshito Sliba thanks for the detailed reply mate..hope u reach the places u deserve
I have been coding since 1982, graduated university in 2017 top of the class in programming. But after nothing but rejections when I apply for jobs. I no longer bother to apply. Instead, I now make money flipping houses!
Good for you... maybe you weren't passionate enough about game dev... or maybe you missed some things when you applied for the job... but all in all, if you found out what works for you I'm glad... you can always do game dev as a hobby...
Thank you so much for the video, you're the BEST 🔝🔝🔝
At 3:15, you say that "you're not going to learn [how to make games] by following [...] tutorials on youtube; forget about that... what makes you think you will learn from the next one? So, that's food for thought."
I'm not sure what you mean by this. It seems like you are saying that learning by following tutorials is ineffective. But, you don't suggest a better way of learning.
Edit: I suppose you mean that you cannot learn to make games if your ONLY engagement is following tutorials. In another of your videos ("how to get into game dev" or something like that), you explain how to get into game dev, and you recommend following tutorials as one of the first steps in the learning process, to be followed by making your own simple games from scratch.
What about tutorials... you re not uploading any tutorials regarding to unity and unreal
I found your videos very useful, so I want to ask you a question, I'm doing a game art design course, and my professor is very strict and he teaches that the road ahead of us will be even tough and harder than now, my question is; being a game designer is very hard, because you need to do all things from designing maps, writing the plot, using programs, modeling.... In my case I'm keen on writing the plot for the story of the videogame I chose: God of War set in Egypt ( yeah I'm a huge fan of the series 😀😀) but when my professor gave us the task to design the concept, I had a block and couldn't think straight away of the idea, I had in mind, I lost a lot of time because of that 😞😞 There is a way to avoid this blocks and doing everything I need in order to accomplish a result I love without losing too much time?
this might sound rude but why did you start a design course?
you study to become lawyer or doctor, not for "art" xD
Art and gamedesign is something you learn by doing, and the few books about how to use colors and geometric rules you can get from said books.
studying "art" or "gamedesign" is like studying "gender studies".
its a nice paper you get at the end with 0 worth because its a course everybody can finish with enough money thrown at it.
About the Block: get a good nights sleep, watch 1-2 documentaries about said area, play a few hours and try again.
the task you have is fairly easy.
If you ask other people "There is a way to avoid this blocks and doing everything I need in order to accomplish a result I love without losing too much time?" than you are the wrong person for the job.
for a writers block what you need to do is write from you body, don't write from your mind... you need to get in the state where you feel the words and not think about them... if you need to think about what to write then don't write because you'll get that block... instead, when you feel good, you're in good mood, then start writing and don't think too much about what you're writing... it needs to flow through you...
@@awesometuts Thank you so much for the tip, I really appreciate it.
In order to get a job in any industry, not just game design, you need to actually BE competent --- not convey the appearance of competence.
I wouldn't mind making a game one day, sure, and Udemy might get me started and teach me the baaaaaaasic fundamentals.
But until you work on your own project that you're passionate about and you've made the mistakes and understand why things are the way they are, you'll never get hired.
I've played video games for 30 years. I'm a massive nerd that spends way too much time listening to analytical podcasts on games design and analysis (and have so for the last decade). A friend of mine did a 3 and half year degree in Game Development. I took them to a job interview, and the employer thought I was the one applying to the job.
Most of the developers at this company had zero qualifications, but had a passion for what they were doing and new the ins and outs and shortcuts for their programs because they'd logged like 1000 hours toward working on and refining a single problem.
I'm a video editor by trade. I can use Premiere Pro within an inch of its life. I can use After Effects, Photoshop and Illustrator fantastically. But because I've spent an insane number of hours on Premiere, I can avoid having to use After Effects, Photoshop and Illustrator entirely to deliver the same results. That's competence (or at least I hope it is lol). But it took me years to get to this point.
And not only that, if I'm working for an organisation as a video editor, I need other skills --- communication skills, finance skills, business skills... the point is to bring as much value to the business as I possibly can.
No body is saying that you should convey the appearance of competence and not have the skills. But the fact is, you can be the most skilled game developer or programmer in the world, but if you can't show that to the game company, then you'll not get hired...
And there can be another developer, less skilled than you, but he knows how to portray himself as a better developer, then he'll get hired...
But of course, there's no question about the skill part. You need to have skills to work. Even if you convince the game studio that you're good, and you get the job, they'll see you have no idea what you're doing when they give you a task to do... so yeah... skills are a must.
I agree with much of what you say but I wish you would stop talking down about free resources there are a lot of really great "free" educators out who actually do get paid by RUclips through views and subscriptions as passive income. Paid courses are usually affordable and fun to follow (like your course) but some are way overpriced like $500 for a self-paced course. Paid courses all have structure and offer much more guidance than just randomly following free tutorials. I have paid for your platformer course (after watching a few of your "free" tuts and a few other courses from other RUclipsrs) these courses are affordable enough so I paid to access them as I wanted to learn more than just the surface of the free stuff. I can see your points but you spend a lot of time knocking down "free tutorials and Udemy" which kind of comes off as a negative, pushy turn-off ( I am still going to watch them anyway). I would have never even known I could get these programs to learn for free if it was not for all those RUclipsrs making free tutorials. Most of these courses as well as yours teach the same stuff that is already in Unity and Unreal documentation but who reads that crap, right, lol. If I wanted to follow the manuals and all the resources they offer I am sure I could figure it out without paying a dime but it is boring and impersonal. Personally, I am only learning these software programs as a hobby and as a hobbyist, RUclipsrs like Brackeys, CodeMonkey, Imphenzia, SmartPolly, UNF Games, and hundreds of others are great resources that are entertaining, easy to follow and that's what keeps me coming back to learn. If I wanted to do this professionally and master these programs I would start by writing down my goals and objectives then read cover-to-cover the manuals that are provided by the software developers, learn all the terminology (makes the manual easier to understand), and find a course that was intensive covering everything, as well as offering community support like Discord. Start making simple games that can be completed relatively quickly by myself and will reinforce my knowledge. One huge thing you mention a lot is a portfolio! I 100% agree, it is a resume and proves you know your stuff. Bla Bla Bla... anyway thanks for your Awsome Tuts.
The reason why I'm bashing free resources is that they repeat the same thing over and over again. For a hobbyst like yourself, thats probably fine, but it will not help anyone become a pro.
The same youtube channels you mentioned, I have nothing against anyone, they're all great guys, but these channels exist for 1, 2, 3, even more years, and yet you still see them posting "beginner tutorial" like how many more beginner tutorials do game devs need? What happened to the previous 1000 beginner tutorials you created? Aren't they good enough to teach people how to make games so you need to create more? That's my point.
And it's the same thing with udemy courses, and similar ones. It's always the same exact thing being taught over and over again and these things are the basics of the basics. And most of the time they teach bad coding practices, poor code structure, and never mentioned advanced things like design patterns and so on. Not to mention they never mention how to create a portfolio, how to apply for a job, what to do on a job interview and so on. That's my point.
Again, I have nothing against anyone and everyone is free to do what they wish. Same as people who take courses and watch those tutorials. I'm just letting people know, if you wanna be a pro, that will not help you. If you wanna get a job, that will not help you. If you wanna create hobby flappy bird games, then that's ok.
@@awesometuts like I said you make Awesome Tuts. I love your off the cuff remarks “Flappy Bird Games”. You are real and to the point. People should invest in a course that is like yours or similar. It brings their skills up to the next level. One of the biggest reasons I signed up for your platform game was to get an understanding of C++ and visual basics. I will most likely sign up with the Unity course too but for now just sticking with UE5. Peace.
Would you consider creating a game for someone who can give guidelines then sell it together! I don't have time to learn how to develop a game, and I don't have a budget. But, I have a cool idea and I think it will make a profit after its accomplished. I found that not only do I need to buy unity subscription as a beginner to learn but also buy a specific kind of computers. Then, I will spend years in the making! I don't have all the time in the world.
You don't need a unity subscription to learn... you can start learning for free... you can do that on my blog, as well as my channel here... as for your idea, it sounds good in your head but in reality it's not doable...
because you have to find someone willing to work for free for months, to create your game idea, and then hope for the best... if you can find someone who'll do that great, but I doubt anyone is willing to do that...
Unfortunately it's hard to find hq tutorials for people who can't buy them.
well anyone who has a computer and an internet connection can afford a $50 - 100 course... the problem is people want everything for free like they're entitled to it...
Sorry to break it down for ya but if you want good things to happen in your life, you'll have to sacrifice something... it's not gonna fall from the sky just because you want it...
@@awesometuts Totally agree.
There are torrents and plenty of pirates bro ;) I wont point to where, if you have a brain required to be a gamedev, you will find everything you need online for free.
Of course, but people with that mentality rarely succeed because they only want to take, take, take and not give anything and it comes back to you in the form of you not suceeding.
@@oddozx I personally think it is unfair to steal someone's course for example. Of course if i see a really good course on youtube and in the comments they say it's leaked I'm gonna take a look at it but it's nasty to go and search for something like that.
Hey Awesome Tuts i bought your unreal game dev pro course today and i dont where to see the course all i get to see is blog tutorials and when i click unreal game dev pro it asks me to purchase it again im confused
We already replied to your email. You already have an account on our platform and maybe you forgot the password. We already provided all the credentials you need to login and we gave you guides to change your password after that.
@@awesometuts Thanks man i got it.
awesome. glad we fixed it.
@@awesometuts How to reach out to you if i have doubts. You have the best channel in the last few months i have watched your few tutorials i really liked the way you spoke thanks man it motivates everyone who wants to become Game Developer
there's a comment section below every lecture inside Game Dev Pro... just ask anything that's not clear... we have guides inside game dev pro that will show you all that... watch the fist intro video inside and it will give you all the info you need.
What do you think about MVC, UniRx and Zenject?
As far as I saw, MVC in unity is not such a good idea, but my philosophy is if you can make it work for your project, go for it... I didn't use UnirX or Zenject so I can't say about that...
Zenject is pretty good, for making large architectural game, mvc or any mv pattern is more for web dev, unity with its self created with Entity Component pattern, UniRx use it if you want to use declarative style of programming, you can use it also with simple Unity classes, like inside monobehaviour
First off all you are my teacher because of you I find a job before 2.5 years ago, thanks )) but to became real game dev and apply a job you need to know this thinks, how I see it.
1 good vector math
2 understand how work c# inside - compiler level and deeper
3 be gamer )
4 understand how unity works from inside - what is rendering, how works light and lot of other thinks
5 architectural and design patterns, SOLID
6 always be ready learn something new, and improve skills
The meaning of this message is be ready for going deeper, passing only few tutorials cant make you real game developer
Is there a way I can contact you via email? Or you contact me via email on developer@awesometuts.com and mention this comment so I know its you...
if youre a competent developer, working at a huge gamedev company isnt usually the best. may as well work at any other company that needs a developer, ideally finance sector, and then just make a game in your own time. as a gamedev at a AAA studio youre overworked and underpaid, with only a handful in the industry being the exception. its weird that you keep peddling this as a key point in many of your channel vids. what AAA studio do you work at full time? wheres your resume?
It's not a secret that there's crunch time in game dev... but it's the same as in any other software company.... Look at twitter now... and many other examples... the way you said it, it's like you know every single game developer in the world and every single on of them told you yes we're overworked and underpaid... As for my portfolio, just go on my website and you'll see everything you need :)
@@awesometuts theres crunch time, and then theres perpetual crunch with lower average salary compared to those working in fintech. "work at a game studio" is a trap for grads with a lot of passion but little experience. these studios are notorious for burning out talent and high churn rate. i dont need to know every dev because theres plenty of data there supporting it.
and yeah ive seen your site. its a funnel to buy your course. didnt see anything about what studios or companies youve had all this industry experience with.
Yes of course there's plenty of data... how many developers were interviewed to get that data? every developer? and every single one of them complained? Again, I'm not saying that there's no crunch time, there is, same as how there's crunch time in software development...
Yes, you only saw a "funnel" to buy my course... you failed to see the blog with all the free resources... and you also failed to see all the people I've helped learn game dev, and get jobs in game studios like Rockstar Games, Azur Games, Utomik and many others... you also failed to see that my students are working on gamers like official terminator RPG and even created their own games and so on.
How can i reach you by mail ?
developer@awesometuts.com
First