Back in 2012 when I built my 6.0. A Holley rep said they would never build a harness to plug the Terminator TBI into their LS harness. So we made it to work. I was likely one of the first in the world to install a Terminator TBI / HP ECU/ Edelbrock dual plane combo on an LS. Around 2015 Holley started making the harness to do that.
@@bentleyclouse3311 It looks cool but the intake performs no better than a truck intake. If I was to do it again I’d go with a FAST intake. 50 hp more.
@@generalsixty2133 wow 50hp is huge. I actually believe your story and I'm impressed. Wished you was my neighbor!!! Lol in middle Tennessee no one does LS stuff. Not in my area.
@@bentleyclouse3311 You can always buy a GM that came with an LS from the factory. Then do bolt on upgrades. Easier than a swap into an old car. It’s all just time, money and space to do it. Have fun!
Every time I come back to this video, I realize more and more that this is VERY far from a budget build. Those valve covers alone are over $400, and those coil pack brackets are 179. That harness is 1k+. No idea how they come up with budget when there's nearly $5,000 in new parts alone here.
I know what you mean brother. Also own a 5.0 and since I love LS power also own a single cab Silverado with a 448 stroker. And for last project I jst bought a 6.0 with tranny for complete swap on a mustang 2005 v6..... Why hate when you can own both!!
An Aussie living in Spain. Love watching your vids, guys 🙌🏼 I love watching your work, Tommy, Joe, Mike, Pat, Ryan, Kevin, LT, Austin... I know I'm missing a few 😅 keep it up
Put another shrimp on the barbie eh Kangooroo sport eh you wanna beer mate FOSTERS is the one u want eh champ watch out for drop bears and crocodiles eh mate
I've built a 16.51 to 1 compression British Ford Essex V6, 3L swept volume. I think it will make more HP on E100 than any comparable I-6s and many V8's and still have better Emissions
Luv the show guys! I have an '06 aluminum block, aluminum head, 8th digit "B", 5.3. Supposedly 340 h.p. 170,000 miles. Runs excellent! Would really appreciate some h.p. upgrade suggestions. Thanks...
The LS with the Holly TBI and MSD box is a really nice set up. Pretty trick having a mounting point on the intake for the MSD box. It would be a clean looking install. I can see this being a nice swap for the GMT400 trucks.. allowing an easy stock computer delete. Tying it into the dash harness wouldn't be that difficult either. It would be on the expensive side.. but dropping this into a cherry or restored car/truck would be worth it. LS power and reliability with a simple self learning TBI.
Ooooor you could just use the factory fuel injection and intake manifold. Sending your harness and ecu out to get cut down and reprogrammed for stand alone only costs around $500.
@@raymondguzman5083 Life sort of got in the way, I moved to Manhattan from Connecticut for my job, sold my '71 Z28 and here I am 40 years later watching this channel and dreaming about a nice '69 Camaro with a big block. I will say I missed the rush of my race car every day of my life.
@@scottgas1299 Might as well keep the stock small block if you're not willing to learn something new. The LS efi fuel system is as simple as SPFI systems get, plus the reliability aspect is amazing.
Richard Holdener is THE man when you are interested in the before and after installation of performance parts. I think he has covered everything I have wanted to know.
They set this dyno test up to sell Holley EFI systems. They crutched this motor using 570 and 600 cfm carburetors. I don't care what the carburetor cfm formula says, an engine with heads that breathe as well as the LS6 heads is going to choke on a 600 cfm or smaller carburetor. That's one reason why the 1000 cfm throttle body made 17 more horsepower!
when I was racing under sponsorship I had my pit crew swap my qualifying engine to race engine. In 36min in a competition we had. Just to be clear I wasn’t involved with it. I just had to watch and hope we won. It was a competition to give our crews lime light for once. It’s actually a lot difficult than people think. They had to work around the ridiculous amount of pipe that’s all one giant piece connected into the roll bar to withstand 180mph impacts.
Where do you guys get your parts and prices from? I have not been able to find that first Holly...the 570 for anything less than close to 500 bucks!!! You guys are quoting 370, please enlighten me on this!
@@thomasdaddio741 113 LSA. Plus that cam is for the 1800 to 6800 RPM range. If they would have gone to 7000 I think 410 to 420 HP would have been the result.
This setup is great for wowing with the open hood at a cruise night. But it'll be only old dudes who aren't familiar with LS engines and high school kids who haven't seen the other hundred RUclips videos where people are making way more power with a $500 junkyard pulled motor set.
@@ragimundvonwallat8961 the bottom ends in these things crazy strong and the 4.8 is the best out of all of the truck motors for high rpm use bc of its short stroke
@@eternalthread7846 if id be a gm guy i would swap one of those puppies into a 80's camaro instead of figthing with those useless 305.... dont tell me those dont suck, they always have and always will lol =P those 4.8 look like gold in comparison
They said 10.5:1 compression but, the 243 heads that were installed have an extra 3.3cc combustion chamber volume. They are closer to 9:1. I have a 4.8 with a slightly milder cam, but milled 706 heads and .040” head gasket. It makes 10.2:1 compression and I was over 380hp. Can’t remember the torque. At the tires it made over 280hp/280tq at 4700rpm. Had to shut down early due to high wheel speed on street tires.
For budget reasons just use the stock EFI. Get the harness and computer when you pull the motor at the junk yard. Modifying the harness to be a stand alone is not that difficult, but does take some time and care. But it save s you a but load of coin.
Thats basically what they came with stock, give or take and come stock with efi. I dnt understand the point of all the money spent on parts. I love the three carb/efi comparison though
I think the idea is grabbing an LS out of the yard, and still adapt it without the stock harness that's probably going to be more of a headache then its worth.... which is really the best way to do it. The intake having a mounting point for the MSD box is trick and clean, and will allow wire management that wont look like a plate of spaghetti.
well...stock its 255-285 depending on the years...so that would be a big no to ''Thats basically what they came with stock, give or take'' yeah give or take, only a 45% increase
@@ragimundvonwallat8961 stock 4.8/5.3 LS truck engines come with a horrible tune. The factory Dyno numbers are with all the accessories attached and a tune for economy. If you put a stock 4.8 on the Dyno without all the accessories and gave it a good tune those numbers would be well over 300.
@@ragimundvonwallat8961 Those are factory numbers (net) and there are inhibitors built into the PCM to limit output to help the rest of the drivetrain live to 200,000 miles. Open up the intake and exhaust and any 4.8 and it will make 330-340hp, 5.3's average 370-375hp. Add a cam and that number jumps to 430-450hp and up, you can see up to a 70hp increase with a decent cam in a stock motor. Sometimes more. Over the last 10 years I've swapped lots of them.
Can you guys please start using the word "NOW" more often in your dialog, because you only used it 937 times in this episode alone!!! Thanks!! FFS!!!!!!!!!!! P.S. If it's not a big block, it's just a boat anchor!! I've never seen anyone so excited over less then 400hp in my life!! ROFLMFAO!!! Little secret guys... it's no longer 1955!! ha ha ha
how easy is it to get these engines from junkyard complete with stock ECu and harness? and how hard is it to get those complete engines running in an old pre fuel injection chevy car/truck?
It's decently easy. You have to figure out if the junkyard you go to will nickel and dime you for each accessory. Normally it'd cost 500 ish full dress if you pull it yourself and 800 full dress if it's already pulled. The engine is a decent bit shorter than gen 1 and 2 small block chevy's. The mount location is also different. If you use adapter plates than you can keep the stock transmission location and even use the old small block chevy engine mounts. The only thing I advise to watch out for is to make sure you have enough room at the back of the engine. Like I said the ls engine family is shorter and the engine will sit closer to the firewall. So make sure you have at least an inch or two of clearance behind your stock gen 1 or 2 sbc. Also have to pay attention to flexplates. The dished one will need a little adapter piece. It's like 30$ not a big deal. Then there is the computer. You can opt for MSD 6014 box and intake which will set you back 750$ ish depending on sales. This will allow you to use a carburetor. However it gives full ignition tuning capability. If you want EFI and full ignition and fuel tuning capability there is holley terminator x for 1,000$. This is good for forced induction and larger injectors. If you are doing a mild cam with the same injectors and keeping the MAF sensor then you can just tune the stock ECU. If you are doing no cam, no injectors, naturally aspirated, with stock MAF, you can just use the stock computer with the "Vehicle Anti Theft" system disabled (cost like 60~70$). If you do a carbureted set up you would need a low pressure electric fuel system, if you are doing efi you would need a higher pressure electric fuel pump/system. This can be as simple as a bosch 044 ziptied near your fuel tank with rubber efi line to the rails, or as complex as a sumped fuel cell with -10 hard lines and a magnafuel 4303. Depends on how much you want to spend and how neat you want it done. If you are serious about it check out Sloppy Mechanics, A21 Bravo, Driveway Engineer, Squirrel Tuned, Night Wrencher, Richard Holdener (for combos), and LS1Tech.
@@lucysmith4242 Thats a comprehensive response especially from a "girl" ? Ive since already bought 2 -5.3LS engines. One came w/o ecu, alternator, starter or manifolds but it was a mere 200 cdn with another 80 if he comes up with ecu and manifolds[and maybe starter but he sold alternator. ] My second LS is a complete cutout inc all accesories, starter, manilfold and even maf sensor intake all for 445 cdn BUT it had 2 broken manifold bolts, one he showed me and one i twisted off rather easily. the one he showed me came out easy as it had 1/2 inch sticking out but one i broke i spent a few hours yesterday with mig and easy outs and failed with both methods to get it out. So i will try again today with fast freeze 6013 stick welding to remoe it but failing that i may have to swap the other LS head on there :-( which im guessing will be new head gaskets, maybe intake gaskets....might even Balloon into a new CAM[elgin 1840p or summit 8712] which require no new rods or rockers anything.] but will still be almost the same price as i paid for entire cutout.
@@kravmaga7070 yeah it always kind of snow balls out of control. If you still through the bolt/stud, all the way through with a drill bit about half the diameter it will relieve most of the pressure. That's how I used to do them in the Machine Shop. Sounds like you got good deals on those engines!
@@kravmaga7070 Oof, that is tough tough. Beyond my level of expertise. Most machine shops should be able to extract it through creative means for maybe 30$
I have a blown engine 944 that was supposed to get an LS swap. But, I turn 70 this year and have to many other projects to do. The 944 weighs 2600 lb, but the 928 weighs in at about 3800lb. But, I will admit that the 928 is a really nice Hiway cruiser.
LOL!! Quadrascrap lol they are good for daily drivers but if you want performance Edelbrock or Holley is the way to go and besides many of the late 70's and 80's quads have all the emission junk on it and the air fuel screws capped off
I realize this show may have aired before Holley had the terminator X system out but there is no way I would trade my factory injection and Terminator X on my LS swap for what they ran on the dyno. Plus, it would have made more average HP and torque with the factory injection system!
This is probably 15 years old so long before what is available today. If you bought something without an intake setup because it was super cheap or wanted simplicity a carb still works. I would take the additional work involved to run EFI.
I seconded what Bill said. In my case I got a 4.8 long block with a 3.9 crank So I was on my own in terms of intake and field management. So for simplicity and cost effectiveness for me TBI is definitely the way to go with a carb intake
@@bigboreracing356 I suppose if you want a 7000 rpm top end race car. But for ripping around town below 7k the factory injection is the way to go in my opinion.
@@bigboreracing356 because I have watched enough Richard Holdner videos to know that the short runner on that carb style intake will not match the torque curve of a factory TBSS or even truck intake from idle to 5k RPM. Above that and the short runner will have slightly more and peak out with more. But that isn’t where most people do their driving on the streets unless you are roll racing or have a car with a really low gear ratio to utilize those RPM. Notice how they didn’t show the entire curve of the dyno pull and only the peak numbers? The bottom end was probably lower then even the stock cam motor would be.
AGAIN...none of these projects can be done here in California(even though this show is filmed here). you can't put a TRUCK engine in a car ..and the Holly EFI is not CARB complaint.. (not an issue if you are putting this in a car that is older than 1976) ..but you still can not use a truck engine (5.3 or 4.8 or 6.0 iron block into any car...even older ones) unless you have no plans of registering or driving your vehicle on the streets...the DMV is fairly strict on this
I have a 71 Camaro that i did a 4.8 ls swap in im using the self tunning efi im Makin a tad over 440 hp i did a full rebuild 30 over bore long tube headers i used aftermarket heads
Y'all ever notice that whenever they do a carb vs EFI compare, they'll try to compare, for example, a 650cfm carb, then a 900 to 1000cfm throttle body system? For once in my frickin life I'd love to see a direct, apples to apples comparison!😕
@@portnut7610 I feel like the cfm difference between the two, the carb being 750, and the EFI being like 880, would explain that difference. Had the carb been the EXACT same cfm as the EFI, I'd bet the power levels would match exactly. At least this test was reasonably close, in that every other component was unchanged, down to the last detail, making it about as close to "Apple's to apples" as ive seen so far
I always like more cubes because the numbers are always better but this 4.8 is impressive
The Holley Terminator is a self-learning system; a learning computer, sent back in time to save John Connor!
@@mctigmctiggy1475 It's not a TOOMA!
We got skynet by the balls now
Torque wrench...
Phased Plasma rifle in 40 watt range.
Bring me the Holly if you want to live,the machines are coming
Joe nice work , miss the shows on TV . I am a oldman not real up on this new stuff, keep up the good work.
Back in 2012 when I built my 6.0.
A Holley rep said they would never build a harness to plug the Terminator TBI into their LS harness. So we made it to work.
I was likely one of the first in the world to install a Terminator TBI / HP ECU/ Edelbrock dual plane combo on an LS.
Around 2015 Holley started making the harness to do that.
Thats frigging awesome
@@bentleyclouse3311 It looks cool but the intake performs no better than a truck intake. If I was to do it again I’d go with a FAST intake. 50 hp more.
@@generalsixty2133 wow 50hp is huge. I actually believe your story and I'm impressed. Wished you was my neighbor!!! Lol in middle Tennessee no one does LS stuff. Not in my area.
@@bentleyclouse3311 You can always buy a GM that came with an LS from the factory. Then do bolt on upgrades. Easier than a swap into an old car. It’s all just time, money and space to do it. Have fun!
Great video. I find my self now at 37 years with a 68 AMX looking for a motor option. This video was very helpful
572 Crate motor with high rise Holly Port Fuel Injection Hedman Headers long tube . 1060 hp in a 1975 GMC pickup . I love it.
....and about 5 miles per gallon driving like a granny.
@@joshtheking1772 and $17,000!!
Would love to have their rock bottom budget lol
Same. And their skill. I dont know much so it would be nice to have a fraction of their knowledge
Don't forget installed power is going to be quite a bit less than those dyno numbers.
Every time I come back to this video, I realize more and more that this is VERY far from a budget build. Those valve covers alone are over $400, and those coil pack brackets are 179. That harness is 1k+. No idea how they come up with budget when there's nearly $5,000 in new parts alone here.
@@MazzaFiveOneFourbudget for the guys running 60k engine builds
will probably never even touch an american engine, but god dam do i enjoy watching this show. so well presented, well done boys!
I'll send you one
THIS WAS FILMED 🎥 IN 2013
they never tell you that so I will 🤫😁
how do you know that
I'm a Ford guy currently driving a coyote V8, but I admit I've got a big love for pushrod chev V8s 🤫
I know what you mean brother. Also own a 5.0 and since I love LS power also own a single cab Silverado with a 448 stroker. And for last project I jst bought a 6.0 with tranny for complete swap on a mustang 2005 v6..... Why hate when you can own both!!
@@mikec9112 yes you are right. It is a subaru boxer...
An Aussie living in Spain. Love watching your vids, guys 🙌🏼 I love watching your work, Tommy, Joe, Mike, Pat, Ryan, Kevin, LT, Austin... I know I'm missing a few 😅 keep it up
Put another shrimp on the barbie eh Kangooroo sport eh you wanna beer mate FOSTERS is the one u want eh champ watch out for drop bears and crocodiles eh mate
Not much muscle or pony in Spain I'd imagine.
@@billyhellboy6138 Victoria Bitter is drank more than Fosters
Red team looked clean and organized in appearance, I knew they were whipping the two hillbillies
Good ol' Joe. I always liked him.
Same
I started watchin horse power as a kid!! Always liked Joe, he has done afew other tv programs aswell!
He's a prick in person
I've built a 16.51 to 1 compression British Ford Essex V6, 3L swept volume. I think it will make more HP on E100 than any comparable I-6s and many V8's and still have better Emissions
Luv the show guys! I have an '06 aluminum block, aluminum head, 8th digit "B", 5.3. Supposedly 340 h.p. 170,000 miles. Runs excellent! Would really appreciate some h.p. upgrade suggestions. Thanks...
Stock 4.8 that breaths. I wonder where the fall off would be. They didn't really zing it that far. Farther than you'd need on the street but still.
The LS with the Holly TBI and MSD box is a really nice set up. Pretty trick having a mounting point on the intake for the MSD box. It would be a clean looking install. I can see this being a nice swap for the GMT400 trucks.. allowing an easy stock computer delete. Tying it into the dash harness wouldn't be that difficult either. It would be on the expensive side.. but dropping this into a cherry or restored car/truck would be worth it. LS power and reliability with a simple self learning TBI.
Hey that’s me @ 14:13. Before RUclips fame! Lol
Ooooor you could just use the factory fuel injection and intake manifold. Sending your harness and ecu out to get cut down and reprogrammed for stand alone only costs around $500.
I'm have to stop watching this channel, it's going to get me back into my old hobby.
Why did u stop?
This Makes me wanna start a new hobby lol
@@raymondguzman5083 Life sort of got in the way, I moved to Manhattan from Connecticut for my job, sold my '71 Z28 and here I am 40 years later watching this channel and dreaming about a nice '69 Camaro with a big block. I will say I missed the rush of my race car every day of my life.
Keeps me out of trouble
"Gets efi" uh bud, the ls came with mpfi lol
Yeah they pulled off a better system to put on some junk efi conversion kit. wtf
Was just thinking the same thing
not everyone likes the look of the factory intake manifolds. A lot of people don't want to "mess" with efi so they go carbs bc it's what they know.
@@scottgas1299 Might as well keep the stock small block if you're not willing to learn something new. The LS efi fuel system is as simple as SPFI systems get, plus the reliability aspect is amazing.
@@scottgas1299 its cheaper to buy a holley efi that is self learning tuneing than put a carb, intake and msd box. Take steps forward not backwards.
Come on guys, y'all know that engine is good to 7,000 rpm if you have the right fuel in it
91 or 92 octane maybe? They used 89.
this site is my "gold standard" for real and accurate info
You must have never heard of Richard Holdener....
It shouldn't be
@@xekret the guy that runs vs segments and doesnt even match the engines equally? mhm...no thanks. i used to like him, but he got stale quick.
Watch out when those "Secont Dairies" open up. They're known to make much more power than regular ol' secondaries!
😎
The 600 CFM carb only cost three hunnert and ninety fi' dollars
Just tuned back in after a while away. When did the ‘blonde’ conversion happen? 😂
Hey guys, I wish you would do a dyno video showing how having improperly adjusted valves (too loose, too tight) affects performance.
I believe Richard holdener does something like that check it out.
Richard Holdener is THE man when you are interested in the before and after installation of performance parts. I think he has covered everything I have wanted to know.
Nice power but do you plan on doing a 4.6 l sohc pi motor
If the EFI setup costs almost $2K, how is a more expensive LS junkyard engine, with existing EFI, not a better option?
All ls engines need is CAM I bet the (right)cam would ad 60 or more
Sometimes lots more.
LMAO let take a already fuel injected engine carb it then put it back on a fuel injection system wow it made more power.. goofy
The efi is pretty much fuel injected
@@danielcasillas1133 EFI stands for Electronic Fuel Injection... I'm not understanding your comment saying *"efi is pretty much fuel injected"* lol
But what was the rattle/knock when you shut it off? Didn't sound healthy
Another ls, how great. Man are these motors ever getting boring
@@thomasdaddio741 yeah only Chevy guys could wish they could make power like fords do. If you haven’t noticed fords are holding all the records.
@@thomasdaddio741 my shit makes more power with iron heads then your aluminum ones do
@@thomasdaddio741 my animals aren’t dumb like yours
@@thomasdaddio741 be sure to put all that small block power threw a Ford rear as well
for real.
How is it a budget build if you pay 600 dollars or more to remove power by carbureting it?
The Static Compression ratio on this 4.8 is between 8.80-1 to 9.15-1 I have no idea where they fabricated 10.50-1. Simply not possible. JD
ls6 heads
@@wildbill6976 LS6 would have larger combustion chambers, therefore the CR would be lower.
Ford 300 build part two next???!!!
Love the Gen 2 Camaro
They set this dyno test up to sell Holley EFI systems. They crutched this motor using 570 and 600 cfm carburetors. I don't care what the carburetor cfm formula says, an engine with heads that breathe as well as the LS6 heads is going to choke on a 600 cfm or smaller carburetor. That's one reason why the 1000 cfm throttle body made 17 more horsepower!
I’ve done it in 24 hr and thought I was the shiznit. 1h41m is impressive 👍
It took my brother and I a week for a clutch job and I thought the same.
when I was racing under sponsorship I had my pit crew swap my qualifying engine to race engine. In 36min in a competition we had. Just to be clear I wasn’t involved with it. I just had to watch and hope we won. It was a competition to give our crews lime light for once. It’s actually a lot difficult than people think. They had to work around the ridiculous amount of pipe that’s all one giant piece connected into the roll bar to withstand 180mph impacts.
Where do you guys get your parts and prices from? I have not been able to find that first Holly...the 570 for anything less than close to 500 bucks!!! You guys are quoting 370, please enlighten me on this!
This episode is from like 7 years ago...inflation
@@monikhushalpuri I see! My apologies for not thinking of that!
Miss Mike. Anyone know where he went?
I never understood why people put carbs on LS engines...
Anyone else notice that he hooked up the negative terminal before the positive?
Great Video. Can anyone tell me what cam duration @ 050 plus lift this motor ran???? I take it was a Roller cam.
@@thomasdaddio741 113 LSA. Plus that cam is for the 1800 to 6800 RPM range. If they would have gone to 7000 I think 410 to 420 HP would have been the result.
I thought the Ls builds needed some kind of crank case ventilation system.
This setup is great for wowing with the open hood at a cruise night. But it'll be only old dudes who aren't familiar with LS engines and high school kids who haven't seen the other hundred RUclips videos where people are making way more power with a $500 junkyard pulled motor set.
They should have raised the timing more with the carb 24 degrees seems low
They could've went a bit higher but the gains would have been minimal. These engines are a lot more efficient than the old SBC
Wong on the knock sensors location and 24x/58x. Some were still 24x with the knock sensors on the side of the block.
Put a Holley high ram intake and sent it to 7k+ rpm and you’ll be in the 400+hp range, 4.8s love to rev
would they last in a street application shifting 7k everyday???
@@ragimundvonwallat8961 yes as long as upgrade the valve train
@@eternalthread7846 oh well if the bottom end can handle it all stock thats a great cheap little set up
@@ragimundvonwallat8961 the bottom ends in these things crazy strong and the 4.8 is the best out of all of the truck motors for high rpm use bc of its short stroke
@@eternalthread7846 if id be a gm guy i would swap one of those puppies into a 80's camaro instead of figthing with those useless 305.... dont tell me those dont suck, they always have and always will lol =P
those 4.8 look like gold in comparison
What truck and year was that ls pulled from?😮
They didn't say what the final timing amount was. If it's only 24, that's very much
I’d love to see this tossed into a built truck
They said 10.5:1 compression but, the 243 heads that were installed have an extra 3.3cc combustion chamber volume. They are closer to 9:1. I have a 4.8 with a slightly milder cam, but milled 706 heads and .040” head gasket. It makes 10.2:1 compression and I was over 380hp. Can’t remember the torque. At the tires it made over 280hp/280tq at 4700rpm. Had to shut down early due to high wheel speed on street tires.
You didn't show an increase of fuel pressures switching to efi, is it not necessary with this Holley application
The Holley kits come with the needed fuel pump, aswell as all the hoses and fittings.
89 octane = fart ? that is lawn mower fuel ! your joking .
10.5:1 CR? I don’t think so. Not with a standard bore/stroke 4.8, flat top pistons, and 64cc 243 heads.
i was just thinking that lol i think this setup would actually drop it to 9.1:1 cr
I wont daily drive my LS so for budget reasons, I might go with a carb.
@@mctigmctiggy1475 ^^^
Why not drive it. Thats what its for. Drive it.
@@joshtheking1772 Oh it will be driven no doubt!
For budget reasons just use the stock EFI. Get the harness and computer when you pull the motor at the junk yard. Modifying the harness to be a stand alone is not that difficult, but does take some time and care. But it save s you a but load of coin.
Shouldnt a msd be kept cool. Like on the fender well or fire wall.
$275 my ass boys. The day one of your builds costs that ill give u the $275. Im calling Shenanigans
Thats basically what they came with stock, give or take and come stock with efi. I dnt understand the point of all the money spent on parts. I love the three carb/efi comparison though
I think the idea is grabbing an LS out of the yard, and still adapt it without the stock harness that's probably going to be more of a headache then its worth.... which is really the best way to do it. The intake having a mounting point for the MSD box is trick and clean, and will allow wire management that wont look like a plate of spaghetti.
well...stock its 255-285 depending on the years...so that would be a big no to ''Thats basically what they came with stock, give or take''
yeah give or take, only a 45% increase
@@ragimundvonwallat8961 stock 4.8/5.3 LS truck engines come with a horrible tune. The factory Dyno numbers are with all the accessories attached and a tune for economy. If you put a stock 4.8 on the Dyno without all the accessories and gave it a good tune those numbers would be well over 300.
@@nsmturbo5902 gross vs net is nowhere near 45%
@@ragimundvonwallat8961 Those are factory numbers (net) and there are inhibitors built into the PCM to limit output to help the rest of the drivetrain live to 200,000 miles. Open up the intake and exhaust and any 4.8 and it will make 330-340hp, 5.3's average 370-375hp. Add a cam and that number jumps to 430-450hp and up, you can see up to a 70hp increase with a decent cam in a stock motor. Sometimes more. Over the last 10 years I've swapped lots of them.
Your low on the timing, im running a 4.8 with a hp 650 carb and 30 degrees timing eith a stage 4 cam
boy I wish I could find the same deals they are finding, priced the same build significantly higher
Can you guys please start using the word "NOW" more often in your dialog, because you only used it 937 times in this episode alone!!! Thanks!!
FFS!!!!!!!!!!!
P.S. If it's not a big block, it's just a boat anchor!! I've never seen anyone so excited over less then 400hp in my life!! ROFLMFAO!!! Little secret guys... it's no longer 1955!! ha ha ha
john brouchard was cool what happened to him
He went on to start his own shop. He came back for a show to help on a shootout build, but that’s the last we saw of him.
how easy is it to get these engines from junkyard complete with stock ECu and harness? and how hard is it to get those complete engines running in an old pre fuel injection chevy car/truck?
It's decently easy. You have to figure out if the junkyard you go to will nickel and dime you for each accessory. Normally it'd cost 500 ish full dress if you pull it yourself and 800 full dress if it's already pulled.
The engine is a decent bit shorter than gen 1 and 2 small block chevy's. The mount location is also different. If you use adapter plates than you can keep the stock transmission location and even use the old small block chevy engine mounts. The only thing I advise to watch out for is to make sure you have enough room at the back of the engine. Like I said the ls engine family is shorter and the engine will sit closer to the firewall. So make sure you have at least an inch or two of clearance behind your stock gen 1 or 2 sbc. Also have to pay attention to flexplates. The dished one will need a little adapter piece. It's like 30$ not a big deal.
Then there is the computer. You can opt for MSD 6014 box and intake which will set you back 750$ ish depending on sales. This will allow you to use a carburetor. However it gives full ignition tuning capability. If you want EFI and full ignition and fuel tuning capability there is holley terminator x for 1,000$. This is good for forced induction and larger injectors. If you are doing a mild cam with the same injectors and keeping the MAF sensor then you can just tune the stock ECU. If you are doing no cam, no injectors, naturally aspirated, with stock MAF, you can just use the stock computer with the "Vehicle Anti Theft" system disabled (cost like 60~70$).
If you do a carbureted set up you would need a low pressure electric fuel system, if you are doing efi you would need a higher pressure electric fuel pump/system. This can be as simple as a bosch 044 ziptied near your fuel tank with rubber efi line to the rails, or as complex as a sumped fuel cell with -10 hard lines and a magnafuel 4303. Depends on how much you want to spend and how neat you want it done.
If you are serious about it check out Sloppy Mechanics, A21 Bravo, Driveway Engineer, Squirrel Tuned, Night Wrencher, Richard Holdener (for combos), and LS1Tech.
@@lucysmith4242 Thats a comprehensive response especially from a "girl" ?
Ive since already bought 2 -5.3LS engines. One came w/o ecu, alternator, starter or manifolds but it was a mere 200 cdn with another 80 if he comes up with ecu and manifolds[and maybe starter but he sold alternator. ]
My second LS is a complete cutout inc all accesories, starter, manilfold and even maf sensor intake all for 445 cdn
BUT it had 2 broken manifold bolts, one he showed me and one i twisted off rather easily. the one he showed me came out easy as it had 1/2 inch sticking out but one i broke i spent a few hours yesterday with mig and easy outs and failed with both methods to get it out.
So i will try again today with fast freeze 6013 stick welding to remoe it but failing that i may have to swap the other LS head on there :-( which im guessing will be new head gaskets, maybe intake gaskets....might even Balloon into a new CAM[elgin 1840p or summit 8712] which require no new rods or rockers anything.] but will still be almost the same price as i paid for entire cutout.
@@kravmaga7070 yeah it always kind of snow balls out of control. If you still through the bolt/stud, all the way through with a drill bit about half the diameter it will relieve most of the pressure. That's how I used to do them in the Machine Shop. Sounds like you got good deals on those engines!
@@lucysmith4242 not sure i can dril it now since an extractor is broke off in hole. ?
@@kravmaga7070 Oof, that is tough tough. Beyond my level of expertise. Most machine shops should be able to extract it through creative means for maybe 30$
It’s funny how they budget it cause nobody has the shop equipment they do unless the bills engines on the side
Is there an EFI for a GM 572?
Man...a 944 or 928 with a blown motor plus one of these equals tons of fun and a decent sleeper. Or a Regal :-)
I have a blown engine 944 that was supposed to get an LS swap. But, I turn 70 this year and have to many other projects to do. The 944 weighs 2600 lb, but the 928 weighs in at about 3800lb. But, I will admit that the 928 is a really nice Hiway cruiser.
@@johnherdener6801 928 were nice, i wish i could own a fully stock one
Now his Wife says “why did it take you three months to swap engines when you just did it in an hour?”
Nothing like EFI 😎
No Quadrajet? :(
LOL!! Quadrascrap lol they are good for daily drivers but if you want performance Edelbrock or Holley is the way to go and besides many of the late 70's and 80's quads have all the emission junk on it and the air fuel screws capped off
@@79tazman wouldn't make the RPM. Small fuel bowl
I realize this show may have aired before Holley had the terminator X system out but there is no way I would trade my factory injection and Terminator X on my LS swap for what they ran on the dyno. Plus, it would have made more average HP and torque with the factory injection system!
This is probably 15 years old so long before what is available today. If you bought something without an intake setup because it was super cheap or wanted simplicity a carb still works. I would take the additional work involved to run EFI.
I seconded what Bill said. In my case I got a 4.8 long block with a 3.9 crank So I was on my own in terms of intake and field management. So for simplicity and cost effectiveness for me TBI is definitely the way to go with a carb intake
@@bigboreracing356 I suppose if you want a 7000 rpm top end race car. But for ripping around town below 7k the factory injection is the way to go in my opinion.
@@bigboreracing356 because I have watched enough Richard Holdner videos to know that the short runner on that carb style intake will not match the torque curve of a factory TBSS or even truck intake from idle to 5k RPM. Above that and the short runner will have slightly more and peak out with more. But that isn’t where most people do their driving on the streets unless you are roll racing or have a car with a really low gear ratio to utilize those RPM. Notice how they didn’t show the entire curve of the dyno pull and only the peak numbers? The bottom end was probably lower then even the stock cam motor would be.
@@bigboreracing356 i wouldn't run any of them. The EFI setup on this is $2000 and the XP your talking about is $900. Both of them are wasted money.
On the 570 carb what were the jets sizes and squirter size? What was the timing curve on that run? What was the AFR also?
AGAIN...none of these projects can be done here in California(even though this show is filmed here). you can't put a TRUCK engine in a car ..and the Holly EFI is not CARB complaint.. (not an issue if you are putting this in a car that is older than 1976) ..but you still can not use a truck engine (5.3 or 4.8 or 6.0 iron block into any car...even older ones) unless you have no plans of registering or driving your vehicle on the streets...the DMV is fairly strict on this
Yes, and we follow All of California road laws😉👍. I get you you meant legally
Try 750
Just Tune that bad boy, and save money
Too much talking, can't hear the engine rev on the dyno.
not a whole lot engine there to listen to.
Best Engineering Workshop The Power Nation*🌠✓ ..,... Cheerio .🌠👍👍👍🌠🌠🌟🌠🌠.
I have a 71 Camaro that i did a 4.8 ls swap in im using the self tunning efi im Makin a tad over 440 hp i did a full rebuild 30 over bore long tube headers i used aftermarket heads
That last closed loop kit must have had some serious problems with torque... They wouldn't show those numbers. 🤔
For the amount of time and money thrown at this build, those numbers are terribly disappointing. On a positive note, the build looks really sharp.
Y'all ever notice that whenever they do a carb vs EFI compare, they'll try to compare, for example, a 650cfm carb, then a 900 to 1000cfm throttle body system? For once in my frickin life I'd love to see a direct, apples to apples comparison!😕
@@portnut7610 I feel like the cfm difference between the two, the carb being 750, and the EFI being like 880, would explain that difference. Had the carb been the EXACT same cfm as the EFI, I'd bet the power levels would match exactly. At least this test was reasonably close, in that every other component was unchanged, down to the last detail, making it about as close to "Apple's to apples" as ive seen so far
I got an 81 camaro, and we just started our engine swap a couple days ago, we got the old 267 out and we got a rebuilt and bored over 305
While your building it you might as well go with 350
@@kenlutter2065 the 305 took a crap last year😂 its got a 350now😂
Let me bring you a real carburetor and let’s see what it does
Is a 570 too small for a 5.3 with cam upgrade
Yes. 750cfm 34'timing
That’s not a 5.3
When you pay 1000 ford the carb manifold and Holley mpgi wiring harness it 1100 ish it’s not cheaper to go carb
Can get a carb and intake for like 600-700$ depending
Should have at least used a 750cfm carb
Kind of lame hp output
1.35 horse power to CI is excellent actually
I'm about sick of seeing this engine swap challenge! Gettin OLD!
Why does that kid keep saying "Secentaries" instead of, Secondaries? 😒
hour and 41 minutes for an ls swap!! Insane, can I hire these guys?
THANK YOU SO MUCH!!!! A MUST-WATCH!!!! I LOVE MY HOT ROD FAMILY!!!! SO MUCH FUN!!!!! THANKS FOR SHARING & I LEARNED SO MUCH!!!!
Nothing against the nerdy older engine guy (not in this episode) but I like the young men better and it seems they are both gone now :(
They need to spin that thing 7,500 rpms
Weak torque numbers pitiful 😮
How much would I have to pay for them to do that to my car? Shit could be done on my lunch break
What are the specs for the 'Comp Cam'? You guys post all the other parts used...
The carb spacer is for that shitty box to carb clearance I see
efi had too many cables scattered around
Shame they didn’t give it more timing.
Anyone else surprised that the 4.8L ran like that
No
I expected more actually. Plenty dyno proof these motors bone stock with a ss2 cam will make over 400 at the crank
@@nicksaj1797 they didn't rev it out that thing should make hp out to 7000+
@@nicksaj1797 Nah not with the 4.8L too small
@@williamsanders468 not too small. Ever see sloppy stage 2 vs the world? 4.8l lr4 with the ss2 cam making 416hp on the engine dyno