Personally I enjoyed watching the World Cup today. Not only is it impressive to see players execute these tracks on a high level, but crashes and DNFs make for more drama and excitement. I do feel bad for the players though.
Exactly, a lot of people seem to be complaining because it’s too difficult for the average player to drive but these tracks are not meant for the average player to drive. If the maps were easy then World Cup would be boring as fuck and the players would get bored
@@cadentrombone5345 i understand what you mean but there is a difference between difficult and "it's so bad mapping we pray that the physics will be on your side or you are out". i understand that cashual players should have a hard time to even finish but the first two maps in the video are just badly done.
It kinda depends. I like Secrets, especially since the shortcuts get harder towards the end of the map (incentive to play safe if you have a lead... but with a substantial risk), but Rollcage just looks awful. Even the WR looks scuffed in several places, despite excellent lines, which isn't something you want to see from a map you're expecting people to watch. Edit: And Castle. Several of those turns suck ass.
The big issue for professional players is the maps are not only insanely hard, but they have no time to learn them, it becomes a shitfest because any player with a life does not have the time to actually practice the maps. Its going to be a mess on who is actually going to qualify because it becomes a 'who has the most free time'
personally as a pure spectator I really love the whole map pack - especially the whiskey one. Only doubts are: if all the pros are complaining it might endanger esports even more
These maps are amazing! So excited to see them played live by the pros. They look so difficult but they are really exciting and full of surprises. Honestly, seems like the single thing Nadeo did right for the world cup was pick these maps lol
I guess that's what happens with every competitive Sport/Game. The longer it exists (or the more popular it gets), the higher the average players skill gets, thus the difficulty for the best of the best also increases. The difference with TM is that most other Sports/Games are PvP, so this increased difficulty comes naturally from the opponents. In TM, the maps have to become harder.
@@the0neskater Except it's not. It's a time trial and you compare who's the fastest. Nothing your opponent does can affect your lap in any way. So how good your opponent is has no influence over the difficulty of the game. *_HUH?_*
I have to say, I have been watching TM for like 3-4 years now, this game always looks so fun and satisfying. Now these maps on the other hand, they look like something that would get a 2/10 rating if you would come across it randomly and had to rate it. This doesnt look fun to watch or play, or even practice for hundreds of hours. These maps look like they were generated by an AI that had 70% Bonk Cup maps, 20% Viewer Troll Speedmapping and 10% some maps from some tournaments to balance things out as training data. Edit: Map 3 looks genuinely fun and nice to play and watch.
Might be a hot take: it was better with a format like fall 2021. Easy to follow, only have to watch 1h 15m (ish) and you're caught up with what happened in the top 16, no need to constantly switch between streams. Idk about the multiplier of course but either way it was just way friendlier to the viewer. I have hockey games i wanna watch and i have Rocket League games i wanna watch, etc. I don't even know where i can watch the vods after the races are done now. It's just way, WAY harder to follow
My thoughts on each track: Track 1 Castlemania: With a slightly more space and less corners to clip, could be a good track for the competitive tech players. That style is a bit outdated though. Overall, not a great map, but I think this use of castle blocks on a stadium car map is as good as it could be. In general, I think castle blocks should be used sparingly or mainly for the original cars, not for a full on stadium car map. Track 2 Rollcage: This track is awesome. Seems wicked on a first run but players like granady and pako prove that it can be driven at a very high level. Great track, not much else to say. Track 3 Secrets: Really fun to watch everyone discover this map, its a good balance between risk and difficulty. The main downside I can see is the jump landings, sometimes a slight nose down angle will save huge time but isn't feasible to replicate consistently Track 4 SpinOff: Whisky has a lot of creativity, and I like most of this track. The wet wheels into plastic turn around is the worst part as far as I can tell, and I agree with most other people's opinions that this one is too wicked in a few spots. I think this track is very close to being good, and could have more potential if some parts were made easier to drive regularly. Track 5 Wave Control: This map is pretty wicked in a discovery but ends up being the most "normal" competitive map in the pack. Tracks 2-4 are very wicked and have some inconsistent tricks. Track 1 is comparatively easy, but has bad mapping elements with the corner clips. This track is somewhere in the middle, I like it. but don't love it Overall solid map pack. Brings out many player's strengths and weaknesses and emphasizes being an all around player than can execute on every trick that is thrown at them. The severe increase in difficulty over the last 3-4 years in competitive trackmania is warranted to an extend, and I hope that we can revive the scene in the future. We all know there is a lot of potential here if the events are hosted properly
Those maps are intense. I can't wait to see the one or two good rounds on each where the race is close with both teams actually pulling off all of the tricks at full speed... Definitely going to be a lot of rounds with multiple players failing out early/mid run... Probably a few where everyone has multiple respawns...
They aren’t meant to be playable for most people, just the pro players. If the maps were easy then rounds would not be fun to watch. he is just driving completely wrong lines and then complaining when they don’t work 😂
Like cadentrombone said, these maps are meant for just the pro players, and those pros being the top 32 players in the world and top 8 in the finals. Completely reasonable for them to be this hard imo.
This makes me want to become a mapper because holy shit, if this is world cup-tier, I don't have much to learn. These tracks feel like Mario Maker's troll level speedrun races at AGDQ.
We will have to see how it pans out but honestly these players will have the most stressfull time of their life and imo for that pricepool money its not worht it. Hope the best for them
And that's exactly the point. These maps are not meant for the "regular player" If they were all the pro matches would be mostly boring with maybe one or two surprises the whole match. Maps like these really push the pros to choose between risk/reward
For me, peak TM (2020) eSports was the mappack with parkour, freestyle etc. Imo it had a good balance between dankness and drivability. The newer maps are only dank, no wonder no known streamer wants to put in 100+ hours to learn the maps. Sad to see this awesome game getting fvck3d by ubisoft so much😂
very hard maps like these are exactly what everyones been wanting this whole year tbh. Spin off is the only map thats maybe a little too 'dank'. Also scrapie is the only big streamer that would be good enough to compete with pros who doesnt - no matter how much time they put in
Yeah idk man, watching these maps feels like watching top level valorant/pubg/fortnite (when building was a thing). Maybe the spectator mode will be better but I think there's just way too much going on
So you can hear them too? Cause if you're saying that the voices are in our heads, it means that you know it and it's impossible to know it if you don't hear them, it means that they are inside of your head too😂🤣😂🤣
Judging by the first two maps, this is too dank for me to have any interest in driving, and it makes watching pro players driving it less interesting as well. The new campaign maps feel superior in design, both visually and gameplay wise, to whatever AI-inspired challenge mapping this is. I get that crashes can separate the best players from each other, but I'd rather see players crashing into a wall because they didn't control a drift properly than crash into a wall because the map has a million speed and precision checks.
The maps aren’t meant for casual players to drive, so it doesn’t really matter if you are interested in driving it or not. I assure you pro players will not have issues with the speed checks, scrappie only struggles because he is discovering the maps for the first time, pros have weeks to practice and will have no problem driving the tracks
@@cadentrombone5345 Regardless of whether or not I'm personally able to drive them, for competitive driving, I prefer tracks actually looking like tracks and not AI generated RPG challenges. I think the current campaign maps accomplish this far, far better than the pro maps here.
@@SpiceChterrible take, pro players could complete the campaign maps in their sleep, and if the maps are not interesting and fresh like these ones they are completely boring. You are judging the quality of the map based on discovery runs that don’t showcase the correct lines very well. When driven well the maps are very smooth and make sense. Nobody wants to see boring tracks in the World Cup idk what’s so hard to understand about that
You mean the maps that are supposed to whittle down to the top 8 players in the world are hard???? NO way! Who would have thought?? Dude, they're supposed to be difficult. You seriously want to watch players of that caliber play a TOTD map over and over and they're all finishing within .2 of each other every round? What a stupid take.
@@SpiceCh The current campaign maps are way to easy for pros. Please use your brain. Why does your opinion of what the tracks LOOK like determine how good the competition is? Like wtf is that kind of logic. So stupid
For me personally this isn't even enjoyable to watch. Its to "random" or to wild. They also just dont feel like well made maps (although they obviously are).
They're not well-made to be fun. They're made to challenge player skills. Half of those transitions would be cool if they were the only one in a map, but when chained, it becomes massively frustrating unless you work at it. So perfect for a competition where everybody gets paid. Not so great otherwise. And I don't think everybody joining gets paid, so....
Great to see one minute long lol maps on world cup in this trackmania. Seems like it is the current state of this bu****it xd Second map is the definition of this whole cancer trackmania became.
all the maps are great apart from castlemania, the second being probably the best and a really good comp map overall. Scrapie drove completely wrong lines and expected to understand them in 10mins. go watch cotd if thats what you think comp should be
Wait, the current state of trackmania is extremely difficult but exciting and well-made maps that pro players love and that look incredible to watch when played at the highest level? Mind blowing. But hey, I guess if Scrapie, who isn't a pro player, struggled with them on his discovery runs, they must be shit.
@@benjt8680 i dont even mind Scrapies runs, i mean the trajectory and style of the game with all these weird blocks and trial add ons. Im used to old styled tech cup maps and i guess im just f**king old now, because it's tough for me to even drive normal maps when i barely can see the block borders because of the colors and style in general :) Im just pi*sed off because i can't really play the game i used to love for 16 years
Watch the actual pro players play them and you will change your mind. The difference in reactions between Scrapie and players like Massa and Granady is so big. They are excited for these maps because they are difficult but very fun and extremely satisfying when you get them right.
crazy how the actual players are mostly positive about the maps except for the castle one, they only dislike how little time they have to practice them
Personally I enjoyed watching the World Cup today. Not only is it impressive to see players execute these tracks on a high level, but crashes and DNFs make for more drama and excitement. I do feel bad for the players though.
The "Secrets" map is fantastic!
I like that the difficulty is so high, because you can risk more to catch up and its more satisfying.
Exactly, a lot of people seem to be complaining because it’s too difficult for the average player to drive but these tracks are not meant for the average player to drive. If the maps were easy then World Cup would be boring as fuck and the players would get bored
@@cadentrombone5345 i understand what you mean but there is a difference between difficult and "it's so bad mapping we pray that the physics will be on your side or you are out".
i understand that cashual players should have a hard time to even finish but the first two maps in the video are just badly done.
It kinda depends. I like Secrets, especially since the shortcuts get harder towards the end of the map (incentive to play safe if you have a lead... but with a substantial risk), but Rollcage just looks awful. Even the WR looks scuffed in several places, despite excellent lines, which isn't something you want to see from a map you're expecting people to watch.
Edit: And Castle. Several of those turns suck ass.
@@dovos8572 none of it is RNG. Watch the world tour and you will see players driving fast times consistently
The big issue for professional players is the maps are not only insanely hard, but they have no time to learn them, it becomes a shitfest because any player with a life does not have the time to actually practice the maps. Its going to be a mess on who is actually going to qualify because it becomes a 'who has the most free time'
personally as a pure spectator I really love the whole map pack - especially the whiskey one. Only doubts are: if all the pros are complaining it might endanger esports even more
25:01 the timing of the song ending 😂😂😂
I agree, that was perfection 😁
these are imo really really good maps (except for maybe castle). but giving players only 10 days for such insanely difficult maps is crazy
0:00 Map 1
10:20 Map 2
22:46 Map 3
35:00 Map 4
48:04 Map 5
These maps are amazing! So excited to see them played live by the pros. They look so difficult but they are really exciting and full of surprises. Honestly, seems like the single thing Nadeo did right for the world cup was pick these maps lol
I guess that's what happens with every competitive Sport/Game. The longer it exists (or the more popular it gets), the higher the average players skill gets, thus the difficulty for the best of the best also increases.
The difference with TM is that most other Sports/Games are PvP, so this increased difficulty comes naturally from the opponents. In TM, the maps have to become harder.
Except TM is PvP, you are racing each other. huh?
@@the0neskater Except it's not. It's a time trial and you compare who's the fastest. Nothing your opponent does can affect your lap in any way. So how good your opponent is has no influence over the difficulty of the game.
*_HUH?_*
Harder is fine, but just add some arrows.
maps so difficult they turned to abstract art 😭
I was not planning on watching WC, but after this discovery, i am tempted to see how pros fail in WC on this maps xD
I have to say, I have been watching TM for like 3-4 years now, this game always looks so fun and satisfying.
Now these maps on the other hand, they look like something that would get a 2/10 rating if you would come across it randomly and had to rate it. This doesnt look fun to watch or play, or even practice for hundreds of hours.
These maps look like they were generated by an AI that had 70% Bonk Cup maps, 20% Viewer Troll Speedmapping and 10% some maps from some tournaments to balance things out as training data.
Edit: Map 3 looks genuinely fun and nice to play and watch.
There is no map more fun to watch a streamer play than Secrets. Truly he does not sabe.
I love how much fun you have while performing for us, your joy is inspiring
In Map 4 why was the backwards booster red in Scrapie's run, yet yellow in the video he showed after?
Might be a hot take: it was better with a format like fall 2021. Easy to follow, only have to watch 1h 15m (ish) and you're caught up with what happened in the top 16, no need to constantly switch between streams. Idk about the multiplier of course but either way it was just way friendlier to the viewer. I have hockey games i wanna watch and i have Rocket League games i wanna watch, etc. I don't even know where i can watch the vods after the races are done now. It's just way, WAY harder to follow
Map 1
0:16 Start
7:42 PB
9:04 WR
Map 2
20:03 WR
21:20 PB
Map 3
22:46 Start
32:36 PB
33:49 WR
Map 4
34:59 Start
44:46 PB
46:50 WR (I think?)
Map 5
48:03 Start
53:28 PB
My thoughts on each track:
Track 1 Castlemania: With a slightly more space and less corners to clip, could be a good track for the competitive tech players. That style is a bit outdated though. Overall, not a great map, but I think this use of castle blocks on a stadium car map is as good as it could be. In general, I think castle blocks should be used sparingly or mainly for the original cars, not for a full on stadium car map.
Track 2 Rollcage: This track is awesome. Seems wicked on a first run but players like granady and pako prove that it can be driven at a very high level. Great track, not much else to say.
Track 3 Secrets: Really fun to watch everyone discover this map, its a good balance between risk and difficulty. The main downside I can see is the jump landings, sometimes a slight nose down angle will save huge time but isn't feasible to replicate consistently
Track 4 SpinOff: Whisky has a lot of creativity, and I like most of this track. The wet wheels into plastic turn around is the worst part as far as I can tell, and I agree with most other people's opinions that this one is too wicked in a few spots. I think this track is very close to being good, and could have more potential if some parts were made easier to drive regularly.
Track 5 Wave Control: This map is pretty wicked in a discovery but ends up being the most "normal" competitive map in the pack. Tracks 2-4 are very wicked and have some inconsistent tricks. Track 1 is comparatively easy, but has bad mapping elements with the corner clips. This track is somewhere in the middle, I like it. but don't love it
Overall solid map pack. Brings out many player's strengths and weaknesses and emphasizes being an all around player than can execute on every trick that is thrown at them. The severe increase in difficulty over the last 3-4 years in competitive trackmania is warranted to an extend, and I hope that we can revive the scene in the future. We all know there is a lot of potential here if the events are hosted properly
The second track seems like it came out of one of your mapping competitions. Holy dank
Those maps are intense. I can't wait to see the one or two good rounds on each where the race is close with both teams actually pulling off all of the tricks at full speed... Definitely going to be a lot of rounds with multiple players failing out early/mid run... Probably a few where everyone has multiple respawns...
i like the fact that the editor cuts half of the times scrapie finds a new cut
19:56… “the ending is something like this” boing boing boing boing.
Wild how in 2024 we have World Cup maps that are less playable than Bonk Cup maps.
They aren’t meant to be playable for most people, just the pro players. If the maps were easy then rounds would not be fun to watch. he is just driving completely wrong lines and then complaining when they don’t work 😂
😂😂😂
Like cadentrombone said, these maps are meant for just the pro players, and those pros being the top 32 players in the world and top 8 in the finals. Completely reasonable for them to be this hard imo.
Very nice vid Mr Editor👌
The chat fully gaslighting the streamer on the 3rd map is hilarious
The booster on map 4 at the end backwards was red for you but yellow in the wr did they change it
It sound weird but i always watch your videos to calm down and sleep in the afternoot
Think it would be kind of cool to for Scrapie to be like the Tony Romo to Wirtual's Jim Nantz for commentary on the finals!
I like these discoveries, thanks !
This is the best video i have seen on this channel
I have not laughed this hard in a long time. Thank you for making this video.
Whoever made spinoff watched too much deep dip...
loved the video. Maps were a bit extreme, but the video was enjoyable to watch
Cool maps. I think they are good for the competitive players
Nice timing haha
Secrets be so fine then boom
shenanigans and tomfoolery
random observation: if you compare Scrapie's screen at 45:37 to the Twitter video at 47:45, the boosters were different... 🤔
Yeah, some parts of the maps get changed based on player feedback (like the start of secrets as well, it didn't have no-steer before)
What's scrapies club name on trackmania
This makes me want to become a mapper because holy shit, if this is world cup-tier, I don't have much to learn.
These tracks feel like Mario Maker's troll level speedrun races at AGDQ.
Only for me that the video is 360p with no quality change available? I know it can happen on new videos but this is almost 1 day old.
We will have to see how it pans out but honestly these players will have the most stressfull time of their life and imo for that pricepool money its not worht it.
Hope the best for them
These maps are AWESOME
24:59 (jazz music stops)
The second map is like having a stroke in map form
Let me be totally honest, I'm sure at my current level I couldn't finish even a single one of those maps ... not even talking about any medals at all.
And that's exactly the point. These maps are not meant for the "regular player" If they were all the pro matches would be mostly boring with maybe one or two surprises the whole match. Maps like these really push the pros to choose between risk/reward
Castlemania is not that difficult to finish, its the easiest in terms of getting to the finish my miles, but other 4 god damn
Every first time chatter: Nahh I don't start playing this game.
(Respect to the pros!)
This looked like me trying to play the fall campaign as a noob.
next worldcup maybe on deep dip 2 to make it just a tiny bit harder
This reminds me of when Scrappy has chat build him tracks and they all suck. LOL.
Rollcage looks like as if Zerator mapped a pro map.
I love TrackMania eSports!
Hi Scrapie :D i watch a lot of your videos
5€ price money for training these maps is crazy
Would pay to watch you grind Rollcage for AT
For me, peak TM (2020) eSports was the mappack with parkour, freestyle etc. Imo it had a good balance between dankness and drivability. The newer maps are only dank, no wonder no known streamer wants to put in 100+ hours to learn the maps. Sad to see this awesome game getting fvck3d by ubisoft so much😂
very hard maps like these are exactly what everyones been wanting this whole year tbh. Spin off is the only map thats maybe a little too 'dank'. Also scrapie is the only big streamer that would be good enough to compete with pros who doesnt - no matter how much time they put in
@benjt8680 valid. It's to dank for my taste tho xD
Don't forget about Spam. A trained Spam is a menace
@@jonasklemm9885 well it’s a good thing that you won’t be competing on the tracks so it doesn’t really matter if the maps are too dank for you or not
Yeah idk man, watching these maps feels like watching top level valorant/pubg/fortnite (when building was a thing). Maybe the spectator mode will be better but I think there's just way too much going on
Looks like "e" in "e-sport" stands for "extreme"🧐
Huge W mappack
10:19 end of boring map 1
The maps are creative non the less.....
Looking for ward to World cup
Banano FTW!
So you can hear them too? Cause if you're saying that the voices are in our heads, it means that you know it and it's impossible to know it if you don't hear them, it means that they are inside of your head too😂🤣😂🤣
10:40
This map pack looked miserable. Secrets looked cool but the rest looked like torture to play.
and they didnt change the car yet
1 step closer to a world cup kacky map
W
what a RNG Cancer... that's not TM anymore...
who let the mappers cook
hidden paths were nice touches but overall these are horse sh*t
Map 3 "discovery" rigged or what
Naice
33 sec ago is crazy!!!!!
Judging by the first two maps, this is too dank for me to have any interest in driving, and it makes watching pro players driving it less interesting as well. The new campaign maps feel superior in design, both visually and gameplay wise, to whatever AI-inspired challenge mapping this is. I get that crashes can separate the best players from each other, but I'd rather see players crashing into a wall because they didn't control a drift properly than crash into a wall because the map has a million speed and precision checks.
The maps aren’t meant for casual players to drive, so it doesn’t really matter if you are interested in driving it or not. I assure you pro players will not have issues with the speed checks, scrappie only struggles because he is discovering the maps for the first time, pros have weeks to practice and will have no problem driving the tracks
@@cadentrombone5345 Regardless of whether or not I'm personally able to drive them, for competitive driving, I prefer tracks actually looking like tracks and not AI generated RPG challenges. I think the current campaign maps accomplish this far, far better than the pro maps here.
@@SpiceChterrible take, pro players could complete the campaign maps in their sleep, and if the maps are not interesting and fresh like these ones they are completely boring. You are judging the quality of the map based on discovery runs that don’t showcase the correct lines very well. When driven well the maps are very smooth and make sense. Nobody wants to see boring tracks in the World Cup idk what’s so hard to understand about that
You mean the maps that are supposed to whittle down to the top 8 players in the world are hard???? NO way! Who would have thought??
Dude, they're supposed to be difficult. You seriously want to watch players of that caliber play a TOTD map over and over and they're all finishing within .2 of each other every round? What a stupid take.
@@SpiceCh The current campaign maps are way to easy for pros. Please use your brain.
Why does your opinion of what the tracks LOOK like determine how good the competition is? Like wtf is that kind of logic. So stupid
5th
--
What are you playing and what am I watching?!
First
haha what a shit show to try an discover. looks fun bt i dont think i could complete a single one. secrets was cool af
For me personally this isn't even enjoyable to watch. Its to "random" or to wild. They also just dont feel like well made maps (although they obviously are).
They're not well-made to be fun. They're made to challenge player skills. Half of those transitions would be cool if they were the only one in a map, but when chained, it becomes massively frustrating unless you work at it. So perfect for a competition where everybody gets paid. Not so great otherwise. And I don't think everybody joining gets paid, so....
++ forezz
Great to see one minute long lol maps on world cup in this trackmania. Seems like it is the current state of this bu****it xd Second map is the definition of this whole cancer trackmania became.
Least obvious rage bait
all the maps are great apart from castlemania, the second being probably the best and a really good comp map overall. Scrapie drove completely wrong lines and expected to understand them in 10mins. go watch cotd if thats what you think comp should be
Wait, the current state of trackmania is extremely difficult but exciting and well-made maps that pro players love and that look incredible to watch when played at the highest level? Mind blowing. But hey, I guess if Scrapie, who isn't a pro player, struggled with them on his discovery runs, they must be shit.
@@JoshNpublicgplus scrapie used to be a pro player and is good at fast learning, but the maps aren't made for that anyway
@@benjt8680 i dont even mind Scrapies runs, i mean the trajectory and style of the game with all these weird blocks and trial add ons. Im used to old styled tech cup maps and i guess im just f**king old now, because it's tough for me to even drive normal maps when i barely can see the block borders because of the colors and style in general :) Im just pi*sed off because i can't really play the game i used to love for 16 years
Normally watching Scrapie despair is ++ but these maps are just not it. 03 is cool but the rest are just Yek.
Watch the actual pro players play them and you will change your mind. The difference in reactions between Scrapie and players like Massa and Granady is so big. They are excited for these maps because they are difficult but very fun and extremely satisfying when you get them right.
crazy how the actual players are mostly positive about the maps except for the castle one, they only dislike how little time they have to practice them
these maps are trash lmao
Bro got skill issued