How to Calculate Spring Back
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- Опубликовано: 7 авг 2024
- "Spring Back" is a measurement of how much elasticity a metal has when it reaches a point of deformation. It is not a universal number. Anyone with a bender can easily calculate spring back with these extremely easy steps.
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Awesome, man. Thanks for recommending these products. There is a lot of crap on Amazon, but you can find quality products as well. It gives amateurs like me confidence to buy something when someone with experience is recommending it. I just got a bender and am looking forward to using it. One of these protractors will help.
If I was just going to buy one which would you recommend? I can see how the 7 inch would fit into spaces the 20 inch wouldn't, but which do you use most?
Great episode 👏 is there a universal link to Amazon, one can click on to show support for your channel. I don't need the protractors but I'm going to be ordering a inch/pound torque and a couple other tools.
I feel sad you've had to make a video on this...
Loved watching all your tips and tricks ;)
Don't forget to have a holiday sometimes eh? ^.^
Good stuff!
Fun fact; (I just learned this from a different creator on a different channel) If people use your Amazon link, it will track their next handful of purchases regardless of what they may be, and you get your kickback from them. It's not exclusive to just the product you link to. Pretty easy way for someone to support your channel without it really costing them a cent.
Hot rolled and cold rolled also has different spring backs as well. And for measuring the angle you can also spread your protractor out to 180 and zero it and than the angle will read as bent.
Sam Harper you should make some videos like this as well.
dude, you're a fantastic and humble instructor. Thanks for doing what you do.
For anyone who didn't watch, he says there's a universal number for all benders and pipes. that number is dependent on the season though. And obviously they're on an opposite seasonal spring back calendar in the southern hemisphere.
byw - lol
You forgot to mention the phase of the moon and whether or not it's a leap year
HaHaHa Definitely something to consider. Lol
Hey thanks man I’m a fabricator myself 15 plus years of experience, I enjoy your videos and appreciate seeing how other people do things. You never quit learning🤘
Lovin the series. The frame building, to me, is the funest part of the build.
U laid that one out pretty simple man lol hell ya. Very useful information brother! Glad you've stayed trucking through all this man. I knew you would
“Let me place these on my only table” roll the fastcut plasma sponsor clip 😂
(Love your work man! Thanks for so many tips over the years!)
i have been binge watching almost all of your videos over the past couple weeks and feel like im learning alot wanting to take a class but im on the east coast and trying to save up for home shop tools lol so unlikely but the youtube videos help alot!
Sweet build man you have shown me a lot! always like watching your vids.
Your great at explaining things. Keep the good work up
Some really useful info Justin, thanks!
Thats a really handy looking bender , great video too .
Great video! thanks for the clear explanation
Thanks for the valuable lesson
I wish I could attend a year of classes from you.
That was very helpful. Thank you
Great explanation! Thanks
Thanks a lot my friend..
Great video ❤
Great teacher
Good video, thank you!!!
Great tip...Thanks!
Great tip!
Hi Justin, I've almost calculated the spring back on a tube when my son gives me the shits on our projects.
It depends on a couple of things like, how angry he gets me,
How long the tube is that I use,
What type of material it is,
Did I let go of the bar and let fly,
Did the situation deserve a double tap
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
Just joking brother, your videos are very helpful, informative and easy to follow. Much respect brother. God bless from down under, Australia.
Thanks Justin
Hiya thanks for sharing that's good stuff
Dude! Merrill Performance! You were my neighbor! You did my exhaust on my blue BMW years ago! Good to see you’re doing well!! I still remember that Cummins mod you made for your buddies 6.7 Cummins man! Talk about it to this day how that’s the only diesel I seen with a BOV!
Thats crazy to see you here! Haha.
Birch is actually sitting next to me right now working on our latest build.
The Fabrication Series dude that’s sick! Say hell to Birch for me! Keep up the great work man! Again it’s nice to see you doing better! Your videos are interactive and informative bro!!
Thanks! Birch actually remembered your car when I asked if he remember his old next door neighbor haha. Hope you stick around for a bit. Swing by if you're ever in Vegas!
The Fabrication Series you bet man! I’m out right now, not sure when I’ll be around again.
Thank You Justin. Because of your wisdom and channel I'm expanding my fabrication skills. I'll be building my first cage soon. I would love to support you through a Tig machine purchase if someone has one in stock. I'm not ready for the Fronius purchase yet. Can you benefit from a bender purchase? Is that bender a different one than the one you build in previous video as I notice the sweet graphics on it? Seriously keep up the good work!!!
Great video as always, really useful info to have! After watching you for a long time I have just taken delivery of my JD squared model 32 bender and two sets of dies to play with! Many thanks for all the amazing advise! Great respect from Ben in the uk!
I'm waiting on my 600 XHD to come so I can begin bending. Thanks for all your instructional videos....very helpful.
Awesome!
I love you man you ar the best
Awesome...
Again I learn something
Justin can I mig chrome molly? Or a tig only? & what rod & tungsten to use?
Having trouble finding a respectable answer .
Been wondering how ya figure that angle instead of "by guess and by gum". Thanks! JD
do you need to do the same when you are using the mandrel with your bender, Im about to order the mandrel attachment and have been curious about it
For anyone whos been curious about what happened to the evo that justin did the time attack cage in. Adam LZ now owns that car!
Do you have any advice or videos using handbenders like swagelok benders on smaller tubes such as 1/2 in
Cheers for the video bud :-)
Is spring back consistent? In your example, 3 degrees at 45, would that still be 3 degrees at 90?
Bend a lot if pipe. Different trade though. Manual, mechanical/ratcheting and hydraulic. Every bender and every material is different. Even the same model there will be a difference. Set up is critical. If one has limited material don't make the desired bend first. Make half the bend or like is suggested anything over 10 degrees. Measure that bend. Now you know and continue to the full bend. Justin does a great job.
But if I do half a bend, will springback be the same, or double?
You are correct. It is never the same when you change your tube. i crawl up on it until I get there. Once you have it your good, until you change to a different tube, type, size, or thickness. In the middle of a build, type change would be weird. If I start with 4130 I stay with 4130. I never mix types.
Don't mean to complicate the process, Just for some of your viewers to understand how correct you really are... Never a rule of thumb. It's that I've learned to prepare for a bit of an 'Oops' pile when you begin with a new material and/or diameter. Small springback take-up measurements, such as these are in the material you are using, are negligible. However dimensions on some material, Such as 4's stainless, can have springbacks that increase incrementally up to 30 degrees but then begin decreasing beyond that bend.
What?
Great video Justin! I always thought that the steeper the angle the more SnapBack it will have... do you find this to be true or no?
Actually it's true ! and the more troubeling that the relation is not linear, I've experienced bending over angles like 20 and 80 and both are not springing with the same rate !
@@MrAli015 that's what I was curious about if it was linear and if it was percentage or a set amount of angle. I figured it would be non-linear but a lot of things aren't as I would expect them to be.
Good video, thank you. Interesting how many times you have to repeat the instruction to drum it into some viewers... Les in UK
Try dirt lifestyle lol, 20 min videos that could've been 8 mins lol
As an electrician I have to bend all different diameters and thickness of pipe. We have percentages that we have to multiply our spring back by. 30s require between 33 and 35 degrees, 45s require roughly 47-50 degrees. 90s require roughly 93-95, thin wall conduit requires less overbend to compensate for springback, thick wall requires more because of springback. Also these numbers change from bender to bender because of 0 degree take up along with shoe slop.
Justin, Help? Trying to Decide between the Weldpro
2020 Weldpro Digital TIG 200GD ACDC 200 Amp Tig/Stick Welder with Pulse CK and the Primeweld (the one your already reviewed) I believe both are made by the same manufacturer, Linlong. A little help is greatly appreciated, thank you very much for all you do from one Veteran to another!
Should springback not be measured as a percentage or atleast some kind of variable measurement depending on bending degree? Like 45° might have 3° springback but to use that rule on a 10°bend and say a 90°bend I would think that that value would be inaccurate?
you will also find that 2 pipes of similar size from 2 different batches will have different spring back due to the different material properties,
Great Vid thank you . Will the spring back angle increase the bigger the angle bent ??
Yes. In my experience we have a cheat sheet we have built over the years at work. And the more angle the more spring back you will get. We use the cheat sheet as an educated guess. Spring back can change from getting the same size tubing from different suppliers. At least in my experience of bending tube for only 10 years now. Stainless and chromoly spring back ridiculous amounts but HREW DOM tubing springs little in comparison.
It depends. It is not a 100% yes or no. If you have a bender - find out. It only takes a couple pieces to get the correct answer.
Just getting into basic fab, and wonder why you don't heat the outer bend to relax the joint or leave it in the bender an extra few minutes to "set the bend".. just curious. Thanks
may I ask please, where does that grease gun tubing reach to? cuz I got a similar one that's not installed and I need to know, thank you
That bender is a lot nicer than the manual one you use to have lol damn.
To easy!
Now dose that change if I order the same material? Ie I run out and order another shipment of it do I need to recalculate?
hi Justin, I have been a long time follower of your channel, I am a retired sheet metal worker and boilermaker ( steel fabricator, ( Australia ) have built a couple of drag race cars, back in the late 70's early 80's, and I was impressed with your tube bender, can you send me info on this unit, did you build it yourself or is it an off the shelf purchase ?? :-) thank you, John
John, Justin did a video on that bender in season 3. It’s under bender upgrade. There are links in there. It can be bought as a kit from rougefab. The website says under FAQ they will ship to Australia. Hope this helps.
@@shanekirkwood7234 thank you :-) for your reply :-)
I prefer using a digital protractor that has flat vertical sides. It's easier than the thin blade type used in the video for keeping it flat against the pipe.
Hopefully this camera crew thing works out for you man. Quality is nice
I know this video has nothing to do with the harness bar you Installed a while back..... But do you have any tips for me to make a harness bar for my 90’ single cab c1500?
Just curious, if you have 3deg of spring-back for a 45deg bend in your setup with your material on your machine, do you treat that as a constant for all bends, or do you treat that as a relative spring-back? Like, would you add 3 degrees to a 90deg bend, or would you add 6deg because you're bending twice as far?
Its more of a constant. There may be a few decimals of difference. With enough material you can get really technical and graph it, but this will ballpark it.
@@TheFabricatorSeries I usually bend a 45 and a 90 and check both. More often than not, it's consistent (if 2* at 45, it'll be close to 4* at 90) but I've had some that are wildly different so I always check both. Over 90 I usually will just bend to the number I'm looking for and release pressure and just watch what it springs back to, then I can eyeball the overbend required and release pressure again to see if I got there.
Whats the bender you have please?
What software do you use when cutting parts on your plasma cutter?
Do you need to recalculate this for different bend angles? Will a 90° need to be bent at 93° or 96°?
yes. do a 45* and 90* test bend and you can interpolate between them
In my experience the offset changes depending on what angle you're bending. If you need to offset a 45° bend by 3° that might not necessarily be what you need to offset a slighter or heavier bend. I always do a test bend at whatever angle I'm shooting for, measure the angle and adjust accordingly. Taking a little extra time on the outset and knowing where you need to be beats trying to adjust bends after the fact.
I spent years and years as a tool maker. I made a whole lot of 4-slide tooling. A Four-Slide Machine has bending dies that come in from four different directions to form a piece of wire or tube etc. Most 4-slide machines have been replaced by CNC bending machines. They are much faster and easier to set up.
The first thing you learn in making 4-slide dies is that Spring back is never the same for the same material from batch to batch.
The Smelter alloys and pours a batch of metal and that metal has to go to the factory where the tube or wire is fabricated and it all has to be done all at once from the same pour in the same drawing ( if it’s wire) or forming process (for tube) using the same tooling and settings. Otherwise the bending shop can not bend the material and get reliable geometries.
Yes you read that correctly. Each shipment of any given size wire or tube from will all be the same BUT not the same as the exact same size and alloy of tube or wire from a subsequent batch.
So you always order all you could possibly need for any job. It is important that the seller understands that it all be from the same pour of metal and from the same job of the drawing process. If you ordered too little. ordering more means you need new Bending Dies. This is because any given run of metal will have differences from another run and the surface tensions even alloy can be sufficiently different from run to run that the dies made for one run just won’t produce the same result on an other.
Spring back is different for each pour of the Smelter’s metal.
On the up side it kept us employed. Now with CNC benders they can accommodate those differences with a few strokes on a keyboard.
Great video. Well explained. My question isn’t about spring back. It’s about the chrome molly tube itself. Since it’s a tool steel 4130 or 4140, when it’s welded doesn’t that weaken the tube? Should it be heat treated and tempered? Im just a little confused about this. I do know that hammers, sockets, gas bottles, gun barrels, and many other things are made from chrome molly and when you get them hot they are ruined until they are heat treated again. Maybe you could do a video about this and explain.
41XX is an alloy steel, it is not tool steel.
I canott weig for your Videos Man pls Upload
Is figuring spring back angle solely an empirical angle arrived at by experimentation? Or is there a table of spring back angles and compensation factors for various materials? It would be nice to be able to calculate that compensation factor before bending up a bunch of material.
If you want the exact number for the material and machine being used, you have to bend some material up. There are more factors than just the material itself. It is not universal.
@@TheFabricatorSeries Thanks. I was wondering if there was a "ball park figure," but it seems not.
So springback will always be a set number of degrees, and not a percentage? IE a 120* bend would need 3* extra, just like the 45* bend? (using your example for illustration, of course)
Excellent video.
So can you say that with 3 degrees of spring back at 45 degrees, can you assume 6 degrees of spring back at 90?
No. Every piece of material is different. Best way to do it is to bend to your target and check.
@@bradywilliams2666 So you are saying for every different bend if the same material, and size, you have to bend it to each angle you have to use and add the spring-back?
I bend tubing all day, a trick I found out if you bend .75 over your target. You can stick it in a oven and it will retract almost to your target angle.
I've even seen the same-spec material from differing countries of manufacture have different working characteristics. i.e. chinese tube bends differently than taiwanese tube.
Make a sandblasting cabinet!
I have a friend who made his own pipe benderand it works really well on square tubing, doesn't wrinkle on the inside diameter. He's been a welder for like fifty years and he's cool as f***
But each angle will have a different response i really feel like. Add 3 degrees for a 45° bend but for a 12.5° bend the spring response seems it should be more because of less heating in the metal.
will be interesting to see diy bender project ,of course dies is not diy
So... what you are saying I can take the numbers that you got on your bender and apply them to my bender and everything should be hunky Dory? :-D
Jk great video! If I didn't already have digital protractors I would definitely purchase using your links.
The spring back on most 2” tubing is 1.5 degrees
Everything affects bend angle. The material, in the case of a tube, the diameter, the thickness, the temper, etc. in the case of a plate in a bender, the material, the thickness, the width. With anything you want to bend, even the angle you want to bend it at matters. The greater the angle you bend it to, the greater the spring back. If you’re serious about metal work, you need to buy some books on the subject. Machinery’s Handbook is the premier book on the subject. It’s expensive. But think about how much expensive metal you will be throwing away over time, and the price will seem like a lot less. You can buy an older version on eBay. For basic metalwork, even a 50 year old copy is fine.
👍😎👍
If I don't have the bender, I have to wait? I hate waiting!
I dont have a bender but if I run it over with a car how many ° do have to compensate for
Justin did you go into lockdown before they finished cutting your hair 💇🏼🤷🏼♂️ 👍👍🏴
I thought you were gonna do an actual calculation involving Young's modulus, OD, thickness, angle delta etc.😂😅
how did any one ever get it done back in the day .;]
Digital does not mean accurate.
The digital bit is only a display.
The resolution of the encoder or glass/magnetic scale they are using in the device is what produces the accuracy.
Analog is not inaccurate ie vernier protractor is just as good as your "digital" one. it has to do with the resolution of the actual measuring system.
Just being pedantic here, but DOM is not a material but a forging procedure. And I really hope your chrome-moly tubes were in fact formed by being drawn over a mandrel, otherwise they would be useless for a roll-cage.
You are correct about DOM not being a material. However, its a lot easier to understand when you speak the same language that everyone knows.
This chrome moly tubing was not manufactured using the DOM process. It's manufactured using CDS.
But DOM will have a different springback angle than ERW will, simply because wall thickness changes affect it.
1:20 cheap tube(not tooob) eh?
Only 2 suppliers is aus, $26 a meter. If its so cheap start exporting it
You live in a penal colony, one of the way you're punished is by paying more for goods. The other way you're punished is by having to deal with leftists lunatics that seem to occupy much of the country.
Remove the human error of doing the math from the supplementary angle...zero your protractor with the arms open so that it reads "0" degrees fully open, like a straight piece of tubing. Then measure your bend angle.
Sooo... I need to have a bender?
Cool video, easy and practical. Thanks for sharing.
Dude u didn't said the formula
Luv your videos but you’re kinda talkin about percentage of loss.
I'm completely talking about spring back.
So chromoly at 1.5" .120 wall has a different spring back than chromoly 1.5" at .083?.....just want to make sure. I would most likely check the differences anyways but want to be sure that its also different between the same materials with different thicknesses.
Yes. Every material, diameter, size, thickness, etc. has its own spring back. That also changes with every tool (or bender) you use. It even changes as you use it over time.
@@TheFabricatorSeries makes sense, thanks.
FWIW, think you misunderstood that the 1.5" .120 wall tubing was mild steel HREW, not chromoly, so different metal composition, different process forming the tubing (chromoly would be drawn over mandrel), and different thickness.
@@LonersGuide i didnt mistake anything, im making sure and asking that even across the same material but different thicknesses that the spring back is and will be indeed different based upon everything mentioned in the video.
@@LonersGuide Chrome moly is not manufactured using the DOM process. DOM is actually flat, rolled, and welded. CDS is the process with this chrome moly.