You "find that 12 point sockets seem to fit 12 point bolts better"? Great observation Capt. Obvious...I'm going to stop using my ratchets as hammers because hammers...work best for...um...hammering 😒
I rounded the engine mounting bolts with a 12 point as it was all I had.. I was quite worried I would never get it out, found a TOOLPRO extraction socket kit for $30 = 9 sockets and BINGOBONGO out she came... They have an almost diagonal profile to the bolt head and one turn later it's biting into the side of the chewed bolt flange and a few turns later it's out ; )
Have you tried SnapOn's flank drive stuff? I've always found them (both spanners and sockets) great for dealing with bolts where the corners have been smushed off. They also seem to do a good job of not ever causing that issue in the first place, basically by applying their pressure slightly away from the corners of the bolt head.
Just started the order process for a full set of 3/8'' 6 point deep Facom sockets from 7mm to 24mm excluding a 20mm and yes they're a killer in price but I'm 26 and even though I'm no mechanic I'll have them for hopefully the rest of my life. I have the rachet in a separate order as well.
Interesting topic. I'm not a professional mechanic, but enjoy simple serving of bikes/cars etc. I haven't given a lot of thought to socket faces/points in my tool set but have experienced that the 12-point (admittedly 1/4" drive trying to do a 3/8" job or a 3/8" drive trying to do a 1/2" job) flogs out quickly - and then I have to improvise or borrow a better tool. I wonder why the 12-point socket became popular, maybe a historical thing where sockets were cheaper/easier to make than precision ratchet heads.
for you rpunny tiny screws it is true, however for larger ones the 12 point socket is a dream come true. like size 42+. you see, then the point of force is further from the edge of the "hex corner" on the screw, and you can apply greater frces without messing up the screw it self.
yeah well you had a video about 2 stroke diesels right? on a bike channel. care to share witch bike has a 2 stroke diesel ? i'd be interested, sounds like it would be more than fun to drive one.
I never use my 1/4" and 3/8" 12pt sockets. However, I use my 1/2" 12pt sockets a fair bit. I do agree that there is little need for larger sockets on bikes so yeah.
Hey hi sir great post. I do think that the twelve point are fine on larger nuts n bolts like say here in the USA and 5/8 bolt or bigger I bought a 6 point wrench set for smaller than say 10 mm bolts
I've seen so many twelve point sockets crack when used on rattle guns when I was working in the mines. After seeing that I've been trying to mainly purchase six points.
6-points can crack too. /watch?v=lr1ACvz0UR4 - taken from "How It's Made", blatantly showing a Ferrari tech using a cracked deep socket to tighten down the inlet stack on an FF V12!
I bought about 100 old 1/2 dr sockets for 20 quid on a car boot, mostly 12 points, it was interesting to go through and look at the wear. Some were nearly round inside. Imagine the state of the bolts they got used on to get to that point. I kept the old W german Eloras for the 'history' and a few gedores and filled the gaps in my sets and sold them on. I know for a fact I'll barely ever use them but at least now I've got them all I'll never be tempted to waste any more money. 12 point spanners are totally mind boggling, surely it takes more effort to make one and yeah, back in the day it gave you 2x as many angles to get onto a bolt but when the first ratchet spanners came out why didn't the smart arses who's job it is to know everything there is to know about spanners go 6pt?
I fucking hate 12 point too. I fucked some bolts with them in my time and spent shit loads of time fucking around drilling bolts out cause of the fuckers. Great video. I think they should band 12 pointers lol.
These are not to badly priced at all, considering the size of the set. I bought just a TEKTON 10mm stubby with ratchet for maybe 5 bucks, and am very happy with the quality. www.amazon.com/TEKTON-WRN53170-Ratcheting-Combination-Wrench
What about 12 pointed BOLT HEADS? Those seem to be used where high torque is called for and obviously require 12 pointed sockets. What makes them stronger - is it just that they have 2x as many points of contact, so (hopefully) each gets half as much force to apply the same total torque?
i thought there were special 12 point bolts and i just never seen them, don't think i ever used a 12 point socket unless i either accidentally grabbed one or it was all there was for that size, i thought (till i got this set that has both) they were an inverted torx.
I think they make 12 pointed sockets for 12 pointed bolts and people just used them the wrong way. Well, they work on both but I don't think that was the intention. Maybe
No they didn't - 12 point socket heads are or where very specialized. They made 12 point sockets because they engage easier because of the 360/12= 30deg instead of 360/6 = 60. They've been advertised as such for donkey's years. How many people have 12 pointed sockets and how many people have seen a 12 point head bolt?
The Workshop I use the sockets on those bolts quite a bit on deutz diesel engines and shit like that, always thought thats the point of them. I mean for a spanner it's another thing obviously but with a socket you got the wrench on there so why give a fuck where the socket engages? weird
I'm pretty sure 12 pointed sockets were around long before 12 pointed bolts. My guess is along the line somewhere, bolt manufacturers decided that if wrench manufacturers were gonna make stupid wrenches, they should make bolts that worked with them rather than rounding off.
Matt is right and 12 point sockets came in picture long before 12 point bolts . However 12 point bolts are vary common now for automotive engines ,in both petrol and diesel ,across a wide array of manufacturers.
The Workshop I've actually seen a 12-point nut on a big-end bearing cap many years ago. I seem to think it was on a BMC A -series engine (the 1275GT version as fitted to Austin/Morris 1300GT of the 1960's/70's)
Already damahed bolt with a six point your going to have serious problem trying to get it off .12 point is way better to get it off but also not as strong as a six point .Normally good bolts a 6 point works best unless bolts damahed then use 12 point .Only reason this happens whatscin video is cause bolt already damaged
I find the 12 point sockets work better in 12 point nuts than a hex socket .
That's what they're designed for!
You "find that 12 point sockets seem to fit 12 point bolts better"? Great observation Capt. Obvious...I'm going to stop using my ratchets as hammers because hammers...work best for...um...hammering 😒
I rounded the engine mounting bolts with a 12 point as it was all I had.. I was quite worried I would never get it out, found a TOOLPRO extraction socket kit for $30 = 9 sockets and BINGOBONGO out she came... They have an almost diagonal profile to the bolt head and one turn later it's biting into the side of the chewed bolt flange and a few turns later it's out ; )
Have you tried SnapOn's flank drive stuff? I've always found them (both spanners and sockets) great for dealing with bolts where the corners have been smushed off. They also seem to do a good job of not ever causing that issue in the first place, basically by applying their pressure slightly away from the corners of the bolt head.
I totally agree. 6 point and a ratchet. Higher torque, better alignment, reduced chance of damage to bolt or tool.
Thoughts on spline drives?
I did a video... just can't remember what it was called
Never give it a thought till now. Nice one.
Just started the order process for a full set of 3/8'' 6 point deep Facom sockets from 7mm to 24mm excluding a 20mm and yes they're a killer in price but I'm 26 and even though I'm no mechanic I'll have them for hopefully the rest of my life.
I have the rachet in a separate order as well.
I have Facom tools and they are amazing! High quality and lifetime warranty! Doesn't get much better
This makes sense because all the impact sockets I have used all have hex patterns :)
Brilliant video thank you 😎👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍
12 points fit square bolts. 6 point does not. Just adding to the conversation.
True - but the 'catch' there being, for example, a 10 mm square-headed bolt/nut needs a 13mm (23% extra I think..)12-point socket.
@@kaceyanders6599 interesting
Interesting topic. I'm not a professional mechanic, but enjoy simple serving of bikes/cars etc. I haven't given a lot of thought to socket faces/points in my tool set but have experienced that the 12-point (admittedly 1/4" drive trying to do a 3/8" job or a 3/8" drive trying to do a 1/2" job) flogs out quickly - and then I have to improvise or borrow a better tool. I wonder why the 12-point socket became popular, maybe a historical thing where sockets were cheaper/easier to make than precision ratchet heads.
for you rpunny tiny screws it is true, however for larger ones the 12 point socket is a dream come true. like size 42+.
you see, then the point of force is further from the edge of the "hex corner" on the screw,
and you can apply greater frces without messing up the screw it self.
Yeah but who the fuck (in the bike world) uses 42+mm nuts or bolts?
i really hope no one :)
but the video seemd to be in general about 12 point sockets, not limited to bikes...
But its on a bike channel......
yeah well you had a video about 2 stroke diesels right?
on a bike channel.
care to share witch bike has a 2 stroke diesel ?
i'd be interested, sounds like it would be more than fun to drive one.
I never use my 1/4" and 3/8" 12pt sockets. However, I use my 1/2" 12pt sockets a fair bit. I do agree that there is little need for larger sockets on bikes so yeah.
Hey hi sir great post. I do think that the twelve point are fine on larger nuts n bolts like say here in the USA and 5/8 bolt or bigger I bought a 6 point wrench set for smaller than say 10 mm bolts
I've seen so many twelve point sockets crack when used on rattle guns when I was working in the mines. After seeing that I've been trying to mainly purchase six points.
6-points can crack too. /watch?v=lr1ACvz0UR4 - taken from "How It's Made", blatantly showing a Ferrari tech using a cracked deep socket to tighten down the inlet stack on an FF V12!
I bought about 100 old 1/2 dr sockets for 20 quid on a car boot, mostly 12 points, it was interesting to go through and look at the wear. Some were nearly round inside. Imagine the state of the bolts they got used on to get to that point. I kept the old W german Eloras for the 'history' and a few gedores and filled the gaps in my sets and sold them on. I know for a fact I'll barely ever use them but at least now I've got them all I'll never be tempted to waste any more money. 12 point spanners are totally mind boggling, surely it takes more effort to make one and yeah, back in the day it gave you 2x as many angles to get onto a bolt but when the first ratchet spanners came out why didn't the smart arses who's job it is to know everything there is to know about spanners go 6pt?
Metrinch all the way... Works on the flats.
Great video! Thank you!
I fucking hate 12 point too. I fucked some bolts with them in my time and spent shit loads of time fucking around drilling bolts out cause of the fuckers. Great video. I think they should band 12 pointers lol.
Only use 6 pt. sockets. No exceptions.
What I dream of is a set of spanners with 6 point eyes rather than 12. I know they exist but you need to sell your kidney to afford some of them.
I'll have to find some and do a giveaway lol
Would be awesome!
These are not to badly priced at all, considering the size of the set. I bought just a TEKTON 10mm stubby with ratchet for maybe 5 bucks, and am very happy with the quality.
www.amazon.com/TEKTON-WRN53170-Ratcheting-Combination-Wrench
crafts man makes them, they dont look too over priced.
You can easily find them on e-bay, both made in the past and made today.
What about 12 pointed BOLT HEADS? Those seem to be used where high torque is called for and obviously require 12 pointed sockets. What makes them stronger - is it just that they have 2x as many points of contact, so (hopefully) each gets half as much force to apply the same total torque?
"is it just that they have 2x as many points of contact" - yep
Sebastian Wiers yuh
Dr !!())),,*,
what about those universal sockets? even worse?
6 pt. sockets are all you need and all you should ever use.
Tommy Truth unless you work on aircraft, scientific instruments, or light truck front axles to name a few.
you probably never remove head gasket....
i have both and i use both of them but my fav is speed wrench
i thought there were special 12 point bolts and i just never seen them, don't think i ever used a 12 point socket unless i either accidentally grabbed one or it was all there was for that size, i thought (till i got this set that has both) they were an inverted torx.
"special 12 point bolts"
There are, but this isn't there initial intended use.
so they actually made something this stupid then made bolts/nuts to match it afterwards? what has this world come to.
thanks for the quick reply
Well, I needed an excuse to buy more/better tools
except for ya know flywheel bolts and the such that have twelve point bolt heads.
true but then you have no choice obviously lol
Ohhh, I guess that's why the 1/2 drive sockets are 12 pts in my kit.
And 6 pt. sockets work just fine on them.
I think they make 12 pointed sockets for 12 pointed bolts and people just used them the wrong way. Well, they work on both but I don't think that was the intention. Maybe
No they didn't - 12 point socket heads are or where very specialized. They made 12 point sockets because they engage easier because of the 360/12= 30deg instead of 360/6 = 60. They've been advertised as such for donkey's years.
How many people have 12 pointed sockets and how many people have seen a 12 point head bolt?
The Workshop I use the sockets on those bolts quite a bit on deutz diesel engines and shit like that, always thought thats the point of them. I mean for a spanner it's another thing obviously but with a socket you got the wrench on there so why give a fuck where the socket engages? weird
I'm pretty sure 12 pointed sockets were around long before 12 pointed bolts. My guess is along the line somewhere, bolt manufacturers decided that if wrench manufacturers were gonna make stupid wrenches, they should make bolts that worked with them rather than rounding off.
Matt is right and 12 point sockets came in picture long before 12 point bolts . However 12 point bolts are vary common now for automotive engines ,in both petrol and diesel ,across a wide array of manufacturers.
The Workshop I've actually seen a 12-point nut on a big-end bearing cap many years ago. I seem to think it was on a BMC A -series engine (the 1275GT version as fitted to Austin/Morris 1300GT of the 1960's/70's)
You are not accounting for flanc drive / as drive.
Already damahed bolt with a six point your going to have serious problem trying to get it off .12 point is way better to get it off but also not as strong as a six point .Normally good bolts a 6 point works best unless bolts damahed then use 12 point .Only reason this happens whatscin video is cause bolt already damaged