62 a hip and knee?? Yikes. I'm 63 - all original equipment - and love my lightweight XC hardtail. No need for an ebike - it's all about the sweat and grind doing those climbs!! Take care of yourself!!
Around me it's a lot of climbs, and I am working on getting to the top of climbs, but it can be off-putting to some to even try. If an e bike gets you out there then i say more power to you (no pun intended). If I can afford one, I will be getting one in the next couple of years.
The satisfaction once you make it all the way to the top of a climb under your own effort though cannot be beaten. Even more so when you come back to it the next time and can do it faster or be consistent.
The conclusion purely based on the data acquired is wrong, ebike will obviously be lesser workout for given track and time. If you prolong your ebike ride in proportion to what is the assistance of the motor, you can absolutely get good workout out of ebike. So again, conclusion presented was wrong because on a same distance ride, normal bike will always be harder workout.
For me one of the main upsides of an E-MTB is that it allows you to go easy if you want/need to and still get to the destination in a useful time. If I want to cruise, it's Turbo mode, if I want a hard workout it's Eco mode. If I simply want to preserve my knees at a steep climb, it's Turbo and afterwards back to Eco. In other words, more versatility and choice.
And in another set of words, laziness. Biking is already a non-weight bearing activity. It's so easy on joints that it is recommended for people with arthritis or post-surgery. E-bikes are for the injured, old, or lazy folk.
@@shadiestone2949 Or people want to spend more time on the downs than they do struggling on the ups. Don't be an asshole and gatekeep riding a fucking bike.
@@shadiestone2949 Or maybe those that aren't ruled by their overinflated egos and grew out of the sufferfest mentality ? Let's face it, 95% of all "real" (wannabee)mountain bikers I see out and about in the real mountains spend more time walking than biking, better off in hiking boots....
@@shadiestone2949 Don't see anything wrong with laziness, it's my personal hobby which I can execute like I want. Life doesn't need to always be a race. But if you want to race (with an E-MTB) you're free to do so and absolutely can.
@@barriobarranco It's no ego, it's common sense. Strapping a motor to something for propulsion, no matter how slight the assist level, makes propulsion easier than using your own muscles. Those "wannabe's", as you put it, are building up endurance and strength. They are walking the bike because their strength and endurance was not good enough for the hill at that particular time you encountered them. The same can also be said for e-bikes. Y'all want more distance, propulsion/speed, and easier on the joints, so why not just get a motorcycle? I mean hell, atm, they're close to the same price ranges. To make things clear I'm not saying that e-bikes aren't fun, they are. I'm just saying the reasons I hear for using e-bikes over a normal bike is; age, injury, or laziness.
I ride a light weight e bike an Orbea rise and it definitely helped me get back to enjoying riding after about a year out for a shoulder re attachment operation. When I ride with my sons or other mates I would burn about a third less calories unless I get a few more loops in.
I have an Orbea Oiz MTB and get a good workout for sure. I have been contemplating a second EMTB but was worried about the workout results. This comparison came at the right time. Looks like I can get a decent workout with an EMTB. Thanks Rich and Chris for this!!
@@seanflorian4653 Dictionary: envy a feeling of discontented or resentful longing aroused by someone else's possessions, qualities, or luck or the fact that someone owns an e-bike and you don't have one
Yes fair point. The video was entertaining no doubt, but I think we are having the wrong conversation about E-Bikes especially E-MTBs. I recon the question is who is an E-Bike actually for and not about cheating, laziness and so on
after 60 miles of ebikes on a trip to bentonville, the ebike exercise felt about as rewarding as running in place, The bike I was on only helped if I kept a high cadence regardless of how hard I was pedaling. so the only way to get the motor to really kick in was to sit and spin in an easy gear anything else just felt like riding a really heavy bike.
My hip flexers were completely knackered and riding my standard MTB was no fun anymore I bought an emtb and was back like I was 21 again,I only ride ego 90% of the time and get a massive cardio workout every ride but no more does it feel like I've smashed both hips 😂 In the immortal words of Rob Warner "Best think since mountain biking"
chris's ride time was just under 5/6ths the time of rich's ride, if you times his calories and time by 1.2 which gives the the same ride time (if it was exactly 5/6ths instead of just under) he would have burned 796.9 calories meaning for the same riding time he burns more than rich
Stop this, this is clickbait and stoking a fire that should have been extinguished years ago. I'm not going to watch to see how this pans out because the thumbnail caption and the video title is alienating. Instant dislike.
emtb were designed to rip down hill and fly back up with no car or lift. its not for fat people its for people to have even MORE fun and time on the trail. my general mtb skills improved x10 by using my ebike. i can session jumps over and over again. gain skills. gain confidence. i did not buy it to go fast in a straight smooth line. i bought it because my life is so busy, when i do have time to ride, i need to be 10000% worth my time and with a emtb i can ride more, longer, hit more jumps, fly down more narley decents, and go back up with ease and have all the energy needed, WHERE its needed: on decents, jumps and features. it overal improved my skills WAYYY more in the same amount of time than with my non emtb. my emtb has hands down been vital to improving my skills so much so that i can hit things on my non emtb that i would have never even thought of before becuase i was able to practice at the speed needed for the feature and do it 100000 times in a short amount of time... perfecting said given skill it saves time and increases skill and fun. win win and none of us have time! and you cant put a price on time so an emtb is priceless!! does not affect my endurance does not defect the trail literallty ZERO negative things about an emtb.
I think there will just be a divided riding community - and that’s the time it takes to climb the hills nothing else. Down hill isn’t gonna matter as much as you can wait a couple of mins at the bottom for your mates. Climbing though - the big climbs could be 30 mins or more saved on the E-bike… no one’s gonna be waiting for the standard climber at the top of the hill are they…
In terms of workout - you can also go to a spinning session. In that sense, an ebike is no different than a motorbike with an exercise bike strapped on...
Off course the e-bike rider is fatter.. It uses less energy, look at them in a e-bike his heart is making more bpm a more simple bike you really have to push to go... The normal bike wins
Thanks for the video, I’m also disabled and couldn’t make it around the block with my old bike, now have an ebike doing an avg of 20 miles out. I’m getting stronger and my assist levels are going down, even power off.
You need to do the runs with the same rider, once on a bike once on a e-bike then you can compare numbers. This is fun to watch but not an actual test :)
Or you send them out together with the ebike behind the mtn bike. At the end you see the numbers with identical pace times and you will see that the ebike rider barely broke a sweat. Or do two laps together and swap bikes after the first lap so they each ride each style of bike for more info. This test they did is pretty much meaningless and their conclusion is mind boggling….
Agreed. Comparing power, calories etc between riders means nothing - as they basically said - "yeah but you're fitter", "yeah but I'm older". Also, Is it a coincidence that the fitter guy is the one on a push bike?
I ride without a motor and will Canute to do so, until I slow down. I think ebikes allow you to ride further and some riders to get out more. Let’s just encourage as many people as possible to get out on a bike, whatever it is
I agree. But one thing I have noticed is that ebikers generally rely on speed to clear features like gap jumps etc rather than decent technique. This is fine if the trail gives you the space required for that extra speed but often it doesn't. Also I notice ebikes land very heavy after jumps which saps your speed & can ruin the flow of a trail. But of course they do have certain benefits too as others have mentioned.
@@45graham45 I have concerns about ebikes doing damage to tight , switchback-laden climbing trails where I ride. With their on-demand extra torque they seem to be creating ruts which make it even more difficult for standard mtbs to negotiate.
Come on guys, to say that there is no difference between the workouts (as long as you ride the same amount of time) is a bit of a stretch. Nobody's going to do a 20km ride with their mates and then continue to ride for an extra ten minutes so they can burn the same amount of calories as a standard bike. There's nothing wrong with e-bikes, but when you've got a little motor helping you, there is just no way that the calories will ever be the same.
The key point for me is riding time. Since I got my e-bike I doubled my average time on the trails, and I have been ridding more frequently. I love both conventional and the e-bike, but my ridding ratio has been 80% on the ebike now
Yeah I only have en ebike now and I keep thinking about getting a natural bike again but when the ebike stops working and you have to pedal it it's just no fun to crawl on the normal trails. Normal bikes are better for downhill they are just more maneuverable. But that small advantage is dwarfed by the ebike making every other part of riding actually fun. I'm riding a lot more distance now. And I'm riding trails I normally wouldn't because flat land isn't too exciting with a normal bike. You get to actually get lost in the ride.
Re; riding time. That is why I do not want an ebike (atm at least). I don't have the extra time required to ride an ebike. I already ride 20+ hours a week. Not many have more time than that available to them.
@@45graham45 I don't think the time is extended, you just fit more riding into the time allocated. Less time spent catching breath, having a break etc. With an ebike you can just keep going and going for the period
The only conclusion from this video is that this experiment was lazy. Why would you not switch bikes for a lap to draw at least some comparable data? Just baffling that the writers thought this test had any real legitimacy.
Sorry to say but if ridden for training purposes An Emtb will provide a far better workout. Once you factor in that an emtb will cover 3x to 4x the ground. So your hitting rough terrain 3x to 4x compared to a standard mtb this has a massive effect on upper body and grip strength.
Yes, you CAN get an equivalent workout on an e-bike, but the reality is 90%+ of the people riding them are on them to keep exertion down on the climbs.
I race Masters XC and use a lightweight e-MTBfor long Zone2 workouts and recovery rides. The terrain where I live is straight up and straight down so it would be impossible to do Zone2 on the bike, and it's a hell of a lot more fun on the e-MTB than being inside on the trainer in front of a TV on a nice day.
67 yrs old with two knee replacements - I just don't have the strength in my knees anymore to climb the big hills; downhill, of course, there's no difference. But having an e-bike lets me keep up with my friends so they will continue to keep asking me to join them!
The logic they employ at the end of the video is neither here nor there and is presented to promote E-Bikes and EMBN. This entire video is a rhetorical question. For clarity, please recognize that when you are using an electric motor vs. your own legs to climb a mountain, you are getting less of a workout every time without question and without exception.
My father has lung and heart diseases that don't allow him to put in much effort so ebikes allow him to ride with a good pace. In my case, after tearing my meniscus and ACL badly, I don't know if I will be able to do everything I used to do before so an e bike starts to look like an option because I don't want to stop exercising and going places
If an eBike helps keep you in the game because of age, health issues, injuries, etc., then I don’t have a problem with them. But I cannot stand perfectly healthy and young people “e-powering” their way up a climb that I can do on my pedal-powered whip at 51. I wonder if those same young and healthy guys riding on batteries also use Viagra to impress their partners…🤔
I've never ridden an e-bike and I can honestly say at no point have I considered them to be "cheating". Just because it has a motor that doesn't mean the rider can't just keep putting the same amount of effort in. You'd just go further and faster for any given effort.
Y'all have some creative ideas! For myself, I couldn't care less about all those numbers. What drives me is if I can have a good experience out there. The Nature Of The Beast dictates that I'll probably be putting out as much as I can manage -- that's the price we pay AND part of the joy. But the fun is important too! There information that you are posting on ebikes is a great help and an inspiration. Thanks.
The animosity is 100% from the acoustic bike riders that think they are something special. Those of use that ride ebikes know that they are more fun and that is the bottom line for us.
Sorry guys but wrong . As humans we will always take the easy route and yes as a competition as done yes they will be very similar but on the whole the guy on the E-bike will turn power up to make life easier . I say this as I ride in a group of mixed bikes and some of the guys have moved back to conventional bikes as they say they are losing fitness . E- bikes are very good but do have a specific place ie great for exploring and commute etc
Since I've gotten my emtb, I ride 2-3x longer per ride, more days per week, more elevation on rides and my resting heart rate is lower. Ride what YOU want, it's not anyone's business what you do.
I ride both, and was hesitant about what your conclusion might be watching your video until at the end where you suggested, that if ridden for the same amount of time, calories burnt would possibly be similar, but more distance gained on the ebike. I genuinely find my calorie burn is very similar for a 1 hour ride on my acoustic bike and ebike as I ride as hard as I can each time I go out. I just end up going further in that time on my ebike.
I ride a third if not half the time/distance further on my SL ebike, so I get more of a work out on it!😀 SL bikes aren’t much different from normal MTB’s! Ideal choice for me!👍🏻
You can definitely get a good workout in on an E-bike. I am 51 and have been riding mountain bikes for decades. I have a turbo levo sl and I can can get more laps in on it in the same amount time on my analog mtb. My wife used to hate hills and now on her Trek Rail she can pass me up hill. I feel like I can ride like I did in my 20's and 30's on an e-bike. I like the feel of the SL, but on some hills I wish I had the regular turbo Levo. I see more "older" people on e-bikes as well as people that look less fit, but isn't that aswesome they are out riding and having fun. Less fit will become fit and older people will continue to ride. As long as you are out riding is the point whether it is an e-bike or an analog bike.
All good points- the biggest problem with "real" mountain bikers is the massive egos they all have....hopefully they will all evolve and move on, as the bikes have already have...
I think what piss most people off about ebikes is that dudes put their abnormally fast climbing data on Strava and pretend like they are elite athletes and ruin the KOM for everyone. Nothing against ebikes themselves, but don’t be douchebags.
I ride both types of MTB and I can honestly say that when I first started riding my Ebike my legs have never ached as much . Even when I was racing and training . Personally I love both and can see the pros and cons BUT for me as long as your getting out and enjoying it it doesn't matter what you ride just get out and enjoy the experience . Thanks for all your videos ( GMBN and EMBN) keep up the good work 👍
Bit in both camps here! Do like the eeb but found the lightweight ones where my favourite. I got a shortish travel trail bike for my locals and a kenevo sl for park days. Mostly on the normal bike but nothing beats some laps on the kenevo sl, which provides a active recovery style workout with a bit more of a light feel than the full fats. My friends ride FF and I don’t think I’ve ever seen one out of breath.
If you choose to push it on the ebike then the bike workouts are similar. Do an ebike ride where you push it and do the same ride where you ride it like most people ride an ebike.
The biggest ebike haters come from mtb riders who consider them selves good up hill riders. Its ego all day long. Some of my fittest mtb friends are the biggest ebike haters, they hate being passed up hill by anyone. Interestingly the same riders are not that great at downhill.
@@derekharper6031 biking is already low-impact on joints, so much so that it's recommended for people with arthritis and even post-surgery (and thats just a regular pedal bike). If someone is so worried about their joint health, even while on an e-bike, then maybe they shouldn't go biking. I mean it is literally endorsed for people who just had someone cut into their body not long ago. E-bikes are for the injured, old, or lazy. 100%.
@@shadiestone2949 Mate your obviously anti ebike.. Yes riding a bike is good for joints as you said but not MTB climbing massive hills which was my point.. That wouldnt be endorsed or recommended for arthritis or post surgery. Ask any joint surgeon on the sports that causes early joint wear and MTB is amongst those they dont recommend, as is long distance running, martial arts. I didnt say bike riding was bad for you. What I did say is that ebikes allow ascending without the excess joint load that non ebikes creates and its cumulative... So actually ebikes help you exercise and continue to MTB without the negative impact of joint load.
@@derekharper6031 If you are trying to be more fit and use it as an exercise, I'm anti e-bike. Just to enjoy nature and scoot around? By all means, just don't try to pull excuses as facts. Of course a person whose job to specifically treat joint issues is not going to recommend mountain biking or other high impact activities. That's just logical and part of their duties as a surgeon. And I'm saying if joint health is that much of an issue for you/others, then mountain biking may not be a great activity. The wear and tear is still there even with a motor. I didn't say you said it was bad. You mentioned joint health for damage reduction. I just pointed out that biking comes recommended for people with joint issues. Would you attach a motor to a boat and then say to someone rowing the same boat (but without a motor) that your boat can go faster, farther, and for longer?
@@shadiestone2949 wow some pretty interesting statements you make. So an ebike won't help with a level of fitness, mentally or physically but you say just good to enjoy nature and scoot around. Wow! Clearly someone who has never smashed trails in eco on an ebike 😉. Pretty closed mindset.
I’m just getting in to trails in the Surrey hills. I went with a friend a couple of weeks ago, we were 75 minutes in and he was done. I knew we’d spent a lot of time chatting and resting as the hills were a bit tough for him but when I looked at Strava and total moving time was like 20 minutes. My mates since been testing ebikes and is out for hours. It’s getting him fit so I think as a jumping off point it’s fantastic. I can hardly keep up.
@@tc8066 id agree he didn’t want to work at it. But the motivation to ride will mean he’s getting on it. And the video shows if you pedal you can get something out of it.
If you are both giving it max effort then of course your effort results are going to be similar. The difference being that the E-Bike will do it faster. The point is that on a long route that has hard climbs the E-bike rider has the option to put little effort in where as the normal bike rider does not. Therefore you can be lazy on a E-bike but on a normal bike you don't have that option.
On my emtb, my avg heart rate is 130-140, high 160-170. I get about the same on mtb, the difference is I've ridden longer and more elevation on the emtb.
I switch between both my enduro bike and E bike on a weekly basis and always hit more calories burnt on the eeb. In eco it’s the weight that burns you as soon as your over that limiter. Plus my dad who has a brain tumour and limited mobility burns around the same calories just from having an E bike, which is either that or no bike at all….. so getting those miles in whether it’s normal or assisted keeps those joints mobile 👌🏼👌🏼👌🏼👌🏼
Just for calories burned Chris burned 13.72 calories per minute on the emtb and you burned 12.69 calories per minute on your regular mtb. Both of you guys did fantastic. But I thought I would just throw that out for you guys to know that extra fact. I ride a emtb myself because I have bad knees and a bad back and I need that extra support from the motor to be able to keep up with my son on the trails, he’s 17 and I am 48. I built my own emtb hard tail, but just purchased a 2021 Giant Trance E Pro and love it. I am planning on getting some pictures together for the uploader soon. Love the channel. Keep up the good work.
Qualified olympic level strength coach here. The upside to ebikes is a lower intensity workout but its just not going to produce muscle growth in the same way. Ebikes are an amazing tool but not a fitness tool(outside of the physical injury/disability equation) for the average person. This debate is more akin to the weights vs cardio argument. Cardio burns calories in system weight training creates more muscle which always need/use more energy(calories in layman). There is just more physical systems in play/being used on a normal human powered bike. Thats just fact that doesn't mean one is "more betterer" if you are riding for fun ride whatever gets you on a bike and moving. But if you want a beneficial vs efficient workout go normally aspirated everytime
@@neon_necromunda what you are totally forgetting to factor here is that conventional bikes put a hell of a lot more load on various joints particularly when ascending steep climbs. The ebike massively reduces that joint load by assisting on the climbs. Your only young for so many years and the cumulative damage, std bikes do to your joints on climbs and long distance rides will not go unaccounted for later in life. It's not all about muscle and cardiovascular fitness that seems to be the focus of these tests....
@@derekharper6031 my grandparents and great grandfather rode bikes with arthritic knees into their mid 80's so I understand but also have seen many more examples of it heping more than hindering into old age
I just bought an ebike recently (Devinci Spartan AC) because when using my friend's dad's ebike I found I'd have more fun on the trails than I would using my full sus or hardtail.
Dictionary: envy a feeling of discontented or resentful longing aroused by someone else's possessions, qualities, or luck or the fact that someone owns an e-bike and you don't have one
62 years old, one hip and one knee replaced. My E bike has kept me in the game, persevered my sanity, and allowed me to keep doing something I love.
62 a hip and knee?? Yikes. I'm 63 - all original equipment - and love my lightweight XC hardtail. No need for an ebike - it's all about the sweat and grind doing those climbs!! Take care of yourself!!
This is where E-Bikes make sense. When age or injuries come in to play.
That's too bad for you. But then EMBN is the right channel for you.
This is valid use, when otherwise you couldn't really ride.
Some ebikers though, really need to put the effort in. 🤣
@@chrisjones7281 exactly when injuries and persistant issues are in play
Ebike is the reason I can now get out of the house and ride again after a couple of operations and recovery from a sepsis infection
both you boys pushing some big power! you guys should both be very proud of your fitness level. those would be solid numbers for a cat5 roadie crit!
Around me it's a lot of climbs, and I am working on getting to the top of climbs, but it can be off-putting to some to even try.
If an e bike gets you out there then i say more power to you (no pun intended). If I can afford one, I will be getting one in the next couple of years.
The satisfaction once you make it all the way to the top of a climb under your own effort though cannot be beaten. Even more so when you come back to it the next time and can do it faster or be consistent.
The conclusion purely based on the data acquired is wrong, ebike will obviously be lesser workout for given track and time. If you prolong your ebike ride in proportion to what is the assistance of the motor, you can absolutely get good workout out of ebike. So again, conclusion presented was wrong because on a same distance ride, normal bike will always be harder workout.
For me one of the main upsides of an E-MTB is that it allows you to go easy if you want/need to and still get to the destination in a useful time. If I want to cruise, it's Turbo mode, if I want a hard workout it's Eco mode. If I simply want to preserve my knees at a steep climb, it's Turbo and afterwards back to Eco. In other words, more versatility and choice.
And in another set of words, laziness.
Biking is already a non-weight bearing activity. It's so easy on joints that it is recommended for people with arthritis or post-surgery.
E-bikes are for the injured, old, or lazy folk.
@@shadiestone2949 Or people want to spend more time on the downs than they do struggling on the ups. Don't be an asshole and gatekeep riding a fucking bike.
@@shadiestone2949 Or maybe those that aren't ruled by their overinflated egos and grew out of the sufferfest mentality ? Let's face it, 95% of all "real" (wannabee)mountain bikers I see out and about in the real mountains spend more time walking than biking, better off in hiking boots....
@@shadiestone2949 Don't see anything wrong with laziness, it's my personal hobby which I can execute like I want.
Life doesn't need to always be a race. But if you want to race (with an E-MTB) you're free to do so and absolutely can.
@@barriobarranco It's no ego, it's common sense. Strapping a motor to something for propulsion, no matter how slight the assist level, makes propulsion easier than using your own muscles.
Those "wannabe's", as you put it, are building up endurance and strength. They are walking the bike because their strength and endurance was not good enough for the hill at that particular time you encountered them.
The same can also be said for e-bikes. Y'all want more distance, propulsion/speed, and easier on the joints, so why not just get a motorcycle? I mean hell, atm, they're close to the same price ranges.
To make things clear I'm not saying that e-bikes aren't fun, they are. I'm just saying the reasons I hear for using e-bikes over a normal bike is; age, injury, or laziness.
EMTB’s are no where near the work out but loads of fun even if you aren’t feeling up for a ride.
The only way this makes sense to compare would be for the same riders to swap rides and measure the averages.
I ride a light weight e bike an Orbea rise and it definitely helped me get back to enjoying riding after about a year out for a shoulder re attachment operation. When I ride with my sons or other mates I would burn about a third less calories unless I get a few more loops in.
I have an Orbea Oiz MTB and get a good workout for sure. I have been contemplating a second EMTB but was worried about the workout results. This comparison came at the right time. Looks like I can get a decent workout with an EMTB. Thanks Rich and Chris for this!!
Get a proper bike
@@seanflorian4653 Dictionary: envy
a feeling of discontented or resentful longing aroused by someone else's possessions, qualities, or luck or the fact that someone owns an e-bike and you don't have one
Problem is that 90% of Ebike riders are just passengers 😁
Yes fair point. The video was entertaining no doubt, but I think we are having the wrong conversation about E-Bikes especially E-MTBs.
I recon the question is who is an E-Bike actually for and not about cheating, laziness and so on
The problem is that you have absolutely no idea of what you're talking about.
after 60 miles of ebikes on a trip to bentonville, the ebike exercise felt about as rewarding as running in place, The bike I was on only helped if I kept a high cadence regardless of how hard I was pedaling. so the only way to get the motor to really kick in was to sit and spin in an easy gear anything else just felt like riding a really heavy bike.
You were riding a spoilt bike then
Sounds like you had a cadence motor not a torque motor like the one in the video
My hip flexers were completely knackered and riding my standard MTB was no fun anymore I bought an emtb and was back like I was 21 again,I only ride ego 90% of the time and get a massive cardio workout every ride but no more does it feel like I've smashed both hips 😂
In the immortal words of Rob Warner
"Best think since mountain biking"
You still have to pedal an e-bike!
Nice video, but could you please always add a blank space between value and unit?
chris's ride time was just under 5/6ths the time of rich's ride, if you times his calories and time by 1.2 which gives the the same ride time (if it was exactly 5/6ths instead of just under) he would have burned 796.9 calories meaning for the same riding time he burns more than rich
Impressive max power of both of you. Congrats
It would be better test to show that one rider ride first normal bike, then one day rest and then ride e-bike on same route...
Hardest training is achieved on E Bikes. Just don't load that battery and take the heaviest one you can find.
Amount of time and power input decides the work done regardless of assistance.
I keep hoping for a final Blake builds Van episode. But alas, here we are. Please give me closure🤣🤣
Stop this, this is clickbait and stoking a fire that should have been extinguished years ago. I'm not going to watch to see how this pans out because the thumbnail caption and the video title is alienating. Instant dislike.
Fragile
Wow im surprised how similar that data was!
emtb were designed to rip down hill and fly back up with no car or lift. its not for fat people its for people to have even MORE fun and time on the trail. my general mtb skills improved x10 by using my ebike. i can session jumps over and over again. gain skills. gain confidence. i did not buy it to go fast in a straight smooth line. i bought it because my life is so busy, when i do have time to ride, i need to be 10000% worth my time and with a emtb i can ride more, longer, hit more jumps, fly down more narley decents, and go back up with ease and have all the energy needed, WHERE its needed: on decents, jumps and features. it overal improved my skills WAYYY more in the same amount of time than with my non emtb.
my emtb has hands down been vital to improving my skills so much so that i can hit things on my non emtb that i would have never even thought of before becuase i was able to practice at the speed needed for the feature and do it 100000 times in a short amount of time... perfecting said given skill
it saves time and increases skill and fun. win win
and none of us have time!
and you cant put a price on time
so an emtb is priceless!!
does not affect my endurance
does not defect the trail
literallty ZERO negative things about an emtb.
Not sure ablazy if you have all day to ride then e-bike might be the ticket I have a few hours to ride so regular bike is fine for me
We are not lazy, we just like to ride on places where you usually walk 😜It's nice to see Chris in the channel too.
I went to the Forest of Dean yesterday and I’m sure there were mor e bikes and hard tails
Great one fellas!
Also. Chris and Rich look like they are related
@gmbn @embn Where’s the Komoot ride link?
Hey Robert, Here you go! 👉 www.komoot.com/tour/857124514
Those trails look terrible!
I think there will just be a divided riding community - and that’s the time it takes to climb the hills nothing else. Down hill isn’t gonna matter as much as you can wait a couple of mins at the bottom for your mates. Climbing though - the big climbs could be 30 mins or more saved on the E-bike… no one’s gonna be waiting for the standard climber at the top of the hill are they…
E-bikers are lazy if they are cycling with people not on an ebike.
In terms of workout - you can also go to a spinning session.
In that sense, an ebike is no different than a motorbike with an exercise bike strapped on...
Givin' it the beans!
yes
Off course the e-bike rider is fatter.. It uses less energy, look at them in a e-bike his heart is making more bpm a more simple bike you really have to push to go... The normal bike wins
Nothing in it really, just proof we are all one big family 👪
Used to race xc and downhill then got muscular dystrophy E bike means I can still ride with my mates
That is what e bikes are for, it is when perfectly healthy people use one that they just seem lazy as they could just ride a push bike and get fitter.
But this is valid usage.
Nice 😃
Thanks for the video, I’m also disabled and couldn’t make it around the block with my old bike, now have an ebike doing an avg of 20 miles out. I’m getting stronger and my assist levels are going down, even power off.
This right here. I have plenty of Soldiers that were seriously injured, now they can get back into the outdoors and enjoy the wilderness again.
You need to do the runs with the same rider, once on a bike once on a e-bike then you can compare numbers. This is fun to watch but not an actual test :)
Yeap, they always do tests that make no sense tbh.
Or you send them out together with the ebike behind the mtn bike. At the end you see the numbers with identical pace times and you will see that the ebike rider barely broke a sweat. Or do two laps together and swap bikes after the first lap so they each ride each style of bike for more info. This test they did is pretty much meaningless and their conclusion is mind boggling….
I think being fun to watch is the main goal not a real accurate experiment
Completely agree
Agreed. Comparing power, calories etc between riders means nothing - as they basically said - "yeah but you're fitter", "yeah but I'm older". Also, Is it a coincidence that the fitter guy is the one on a push bike?
Surely almost meaningless unless they did a lap on each bike!
Rich would have absolutely obliterated him they kept that in mind 😂
I ride without a motor and will Canute to do so, until I slow down. I think ebikes allow you to ride further and some riders to get out more.
Let’s just encourage as many people as possible to get out on a bike, whatever it is
I agree. But one thing I have noticed is that ebikers generally rely on speed to clear features like gap jumps etc rather than decent technique. This is fine if the trail gives you the space required for that extra speed but often it doesn't. Also I notice ebikes land very heavy after jumps which saps your speed & can ruin the flow of a trail. But of course they do have certain benefits too as others have mentioned.
@@45graham45 I have concerns about ebikes doing damage to tight , switchback-laden climbing trails where I ride. With their on-demand extra torque they seem to be creating ruts which make it even more difficult for standard mtbs to negotiate.
Come on guys, to say that there is no difference between the workouts (as long as you ride the same amount of time) is a bit of a stretch. Nobody's going to do a 20km ride with their mates and then continue to ride for an extra ten minutes so they can burn the same amount of calories as a standard bike. There's nothing wrong with e-bikes, but when you've got a little motor helping you, there is just no way that the calories will ever be the same.
The key point for me is riding time. Since I got my e-bike I doubled my average time on the trails, and I have been ridding more frequently. I love both conventional and the e-bike, but my ridding ratio has been 80% on the ebike now
Yeah I only have en ebike now and I keep thinking about getting a natural bike again but when the ebike stops working and you have to pedal it it's just no fun to crawl on the normal trails. Normal bikes are better for downhill they are just more maneuverable. But that small advantage is dwarfed by the ebike making every other part of riding actually fun. I'm riding a lot more distance now. And I'm riding trails I normally wouldn't because flat land isn't too exciting with a normal bike. You get to actually get lost in the ride.
But is it 80% more effort?
Re; riding time. That is why I do not want an ebike (atm at least). I don't have the extra time required to ride an ebike. I already ride 20+ hours a week. Not many have more time than that available to them.
@@45graham45 I don't think the time is extended, you just fit more riding into the time allocated. Less time spent catching breath, having a break etc. With an ebike you can just keep going and going for the period
This. This is what people don’t get about ebikes.
The real cheater is the unimaginative repetitive exercise of making videos about e-bikes being cast as cheating.
The only conclusion from this video is that this experiment was lazy.
Why would you not switch bikes for a lap to draw at least some comparable data? Just baffling that the writers thought this test had any real legitimacy.
I love both. Both are fun for different rides for sure🤘🏽
Sorry to say but if ridden for training purposes An Emtb will provide a far better workout.
Once you factor in that an emtb will cover 3x to 4x the ground. So your hitting rough terrain 3x to 4x compared to a standard mtb this has a massive effect on upper body and grip strength.
Yes, you CAN get an equivalent workout on an e-bike, but the reality is 90%+ of the people riding them are on them to keep exertion down on the climbs.
I think 90% of the people riding them are on them because they're f-ing FUN! 🙂
Agree with both. Also they're great alternatives to a car or motorcycle. I have all four, I worship transport, always lived on a hill.
Plus point for me. I use my emtb a lot more . From a quick evening blast to a weekend adventure . Truly a time machine for a busy week .
I race Masters XC and use a lightweight e-MTBfor long Zone2 workouts and recovery rides. The terrain where I live is straight up and straight down so it would be impossible to do Zone2 on the bike, and it's a hell of a lot more fun on the e-MTB than being inside on the trainer in front of a TV on a nice day.
67 yrs old with two knee replacements - I just don't have the strength in my knees anymore to climb the big hills; downhill, of course, there's no difference. But having an e-bike lets me keep up with my friends so they will continue to keep asking me to join them!
The logic they employ at the end of the video is neither here nor there and is presented to promote E-Bikes and EMBN. This entire video is a rhetorical question. For clarity, please recognize that when you are using an electric motor vs. your own legs to climb a mountain, you are getting less of a workout every time without question and without exception.
Yes, but this channel is all about marketing bull.
And the answer is......... if you put the same effort in..... it's just further & faster!
Ebike riders dont ride to "work out" lol
My 2hr, 20mile, 1800ft ascent ride today all in Eco suggests otherwise to my OAP body 😁
DONT WANT TO WATCH?
Answer: yes
😆
My father has lung and heart diseases that don't allow him to put in much effort so ebikes allow him to ride with a good pace. In my case, after tearing my meniscus and ACL badly, I don't know if I will be able to do everything I used to do before so an e bike starts to look like an option because I don't want to stop exercising and going places
If an eBike helps keep you in the game because of age, health issues, injuries, etc., then I don’t have a problem with them. But I cannot stand perfectly healthy and young people “e-powering” their way up a climb that I can do on my pedal-powered whip at 51. I wonder if those same young and healthy guys riding on batteries also use Viagra to impress their partners…🤔
I've never ridden an e-bike and I can honestly say at no point have I considered them to be "cheating". Just because it has a motor that doesn't mean the rider can't just keep putting the same amount of effort in. You'd just go further and faster for any given effort.
I'm here now a year later as an ebike owner! I can confirm my own comment is true! LOL
Y'all have some creative ideas!
For myself, I couldn't care less about all those numbers. What drives me is if I can have a good experience out there. The Nature Of The Beast dictates that I'll probably be putting out as much as I can manage -- that's the price we pay AND part of the joy.
But the fun is important too!
There information that you are posting on ebikes is a great help and an inspiration.
Thanks.
Regardless of your opinion, this is just stoking the animosity
The animosity is 100% from the acoustic bike riders that think they are something special. Those of use that ride ebikes know that they are more fun and that is the bottom line for us.
If you guys could see some of the people riding citybikes on my daily ride, you'd think 'lazy asses'. 20mph with barely a pedal stroke! Lololol
Sorry guys but wrong .
As humans we will always take the easy route and yes as a competition as done yes they will be very similar but on the whole the guy on the E-bike will turn power up to make life easier .
I say this as I ride in a group of mixed bikes and some of the guys have moved back to conventional bikes as they say they are losing fitness .
E- bikes are very good but do have a specific place ie great for exploring and commute etc
Since I've gotten my emtb, I ride 2-3x longer per ride, more days per week, more elevation on rides and my resting heart rate is lower. Ride what YOU want, it's not anyone's business what you do.
Well said, 2-3x the fun in the same amount of time. 😎
I ride both, and was hesitant about what your conclusion might be watching your video until at the end where you suggested, that if ridden for the same amount of time, calories burnt would possibly be similar, but more distance gained on the ebike. I genuinely find my calorie burn is very similar for a 1 hour ride on my acoustic bike and ebike as I ride as hard as I can each time I go out. I just end up going further in that time on my ebike.
The question asked should be: Are E-bikes more fun? And heck, yes they are!!!!
E-Bikes is just like making excuses, it's not for winners.
Short answer is ... Yes. Long version some need e.bikes or will not be into mtb. But please, you have a e-bike channel, keep this clean.
I ride a third if not half the time/distance further on my SL ebike, so I get more of a work out on it!😀 SL bikes aren’t much different from normal MTB’s! Ideal choice for me!👍🏻
The answer is hidden in the presenters body types. Every GMBN cat is super fit. Even Martin. Chris is a bit of a doughboy.
Not the most scientific test. Try swapping bikes now, fit guy on the ebike....
i just ride an emtb for fun. finding a way up the steepest tech climbs is my thing.
When are you coming to Blue Derby 🙂
You can definitely get a good workout in on an E-bike. I am 51 and have been riding mountain bikes for decades. I have a turbo levo sl and I can can get more laps in on it in the same amount time on my analog mtb. My wife used to hate hills and now on her Trek Rail she can pass me up hill. I feel like I can ride like I did in my 20's and 30's on an e-bike. I like the feel of the SL, but on some hills I wish I had the regular turbo Levo. I see more "older" people on e-bikes as well as people that look less fit, but isn't that aswesome they are out riding and having fun. Less fit will become fit and older people will continue to ride. As long as you are out riding is the point whether it is an e-bike or an analog bike.
Did you try a 29er first? I find that helps to eat hills. 🤣
@@user-yv2cz8oj1k Yes, Stumpjumper 29er was one of my primary bikes that I rode, and still ride. It was definitely an improvement over 26ers.
All good points- the biggest problem with "real" mountain bikers is the massive egos they all have....hopefully they will all evolve and move on, as the bikes have already have...
I think what piss most people off about ebikes is that dudes put their abnormally fast climbing data on Strava and pretend like they are elite athletes and ruin the KOM for everyone. Nothing against ebikes themselves, but don’t be douchebags.
100% this.
Need both! Building my ebike right now in fact.
need to cover more miles on e bike , for same result
Why is it xc bike Vs an enduro. Surely it should be enduro Vs e-enduro??
I ride both types of MTB and I can honestly say that when I first started riding my Ebike my legs have never ached as much . Even when I was racing and training . Personally I love both and can see the pros and cons BUT for me as long as your getting out and enjoying it it doesn't matter what you ride just get out and enjoy the experience . Thanks for all your videos ( GMBN and EMBN) keep up the good work 👍
Bit in both camps here! Do like the eeb but found the lightweight ones where my favourite. I got a shortish travel trail bike for my locals and a kenevo sl for park days. Mostly on the normal bike but nothing beats some laps on the kenevo sl, which provides a active recovery style workout with a bit more of a light feel than the full fats. My friends ride FF and I don’t think I’ve ever seen one out of breath.
If you choose to push it on the ebike then the bike workouts are similar. Do an ebike ride where you push it and do the same ride where you ride it like most people ride an ebike.
Great vid. Instead of riding the same distance why not make a comparison on riding for the same time.
Useless experiment if the same raider is not testing both bikes.
Yes they are !
The biggest ebike haters come from mtb riders who consider them selves good up hill riders. Its ego all day long. Some of my fittest mtb friends are the biggest ebike haters, they hate being passed up hill by anyone. Interestingly the same riders are not that great at downhill.
Yes
As someone who own both an EMTB and normal MTB I can say EMTB is a proper workout but I don't dig as deep into my muscles as on an normal bike
Don't forget the load on the joints that an ebike reduces, which is a huge benefit to long term damage reduction.
@@derekharper6031 biking is already low-impact on joints, so much so that it's recommended for people with arthritis and even post-surgery (and thats just a regular pedal bike). If someone is so worried about their joint health, even while on an e-bike, then maybe they shouldn't go biking. I mean it is literally endorsed for people who just had someone cut into their body not long ago.
E-bikes are for the injured, old, or lazy. 100%.
@@shadiestone2949 Mate your obviously anti ebike.. Yes riding a bike is good for joints as you said but not MTB climbing massive hills which was my point.. That wouldnt be endorsed or recommended for arthritis or post surgery. Ask any joint surgeon on the sports that causes early joint wear and MTB is amongst those they dont recommend, as is long distance running, martial arts. I didnt say bike riding was bad for you. What I did say is that ebikes allow ascending without the excess joint load that non ebikes creates and its cumulative... So actually ebikes help you exercise and continue to MTB without the negative impact of joint load.
@@derekharper6031 If you are trying to be more fit and use it as an exercise, I'm anti e-bike. Just to enjoy nature and scoot around? By all means, just don't try to pull excuses as facts.
Of course a person whose job to specifically treat joint issues is not going to recommend mountain biking or other high impact activities. That's just logical and part of their duties as a surgeon.
And I'm saying if joint health is that much of an issue for you/others, then mountain biking may not be a great activity. The wear and tear is still there even with a motor.
I didn't say you said it was bad. You mentioned joint health for damage reduction. I just pointed out that biking comes recommended for people with joint issues.
Would you attach a motor to a boat and then say to someone rowing the same boat (but without a motor) that your boat can go faster, farther, and for longer?
@@shadiestone2949 wow some pretty interesting statements you make. So an ebike won't help with a level of fitness, mentally or physically but you say just good to enjoy nature and scoot around. Wow! Clearly someone who has never smashed trails in eco on an ebike 😉. Pretty closed mindset.
I’m just getting in to trails in the Surrey hills. I went with a friend a couple of weeks ago, we were 75 minutes in and he was done. I knew we’d spent a lot of time chatting and resting as the hills were a bit tough for him but when I looked at Strava and total moving time was like 20 minutes.
My mates since been testing ebikes and is out for hours. It’s getting him fit so I think as a jumping off point it’s fantastic. I can hardly keep up.
He's not getting fit, he's just riding a bike with a motor - let's be honest, he just didn't want to work at it.
@@tc8066 id agree he didn’t want to work at it. But the motivation to ride will mean he’s getting on it. And the video shows if you pedal you can get something out of it.
If you are both giving it max effort then of course your effort results are going to be similar. The difference being that the E-Bike will do it faster. The point is that on a long route that has hard climbs the E-bike rider has the option to put little effort in where as the normal bike rider does not. Therefore you can be lazy on a E-bike but on a normal bike you don't have that option.
On my emtb, my avg heart rate is 130-140, high 160-170. I get about the same on mtb, the difference is I've ridden longer and more elevation on the emtb.
calories burned should match with intensity over time. for similar athletic intensity, if e-bike finishes faster, that's fewer calories
E-bikes just look really fun, and for some people they are the reason they can still ride bikes.
I switch between both my enduro bike and E bike on a weekly basis and always hit more calories burnt on the eeb. In eco it’s the weight that burns you as soon as your over that limiter. Plus my dad who has a brain tumour and limited mobility burns around the same calories just from having an E bike, which is either that or no bike at all….. so getting those miles in whether it’s normal or assisted keeps those joints mobile 👌🏼👌🏼👌🏼👌🏼
Just for calories burned Chris burned 13.72 calories per minute on the emtb and you burned 12.69 calories per minute on your regular mtb. Both of you guys did fantastic. But I thought I would just throw that out for you guys to know that extra fact. I ride a emtb myself because I have bad knees and a bad back and I need that extra support from the motor to be able to keep up with my son on the trails, he’s 17 and I am 48. I built my own emtb hard tail, but just purchased a 2021 Giant Trance E Pro and love it. I am planning on getting some pictures together for the uploader soon. Love the channel. Keep up the good work.
Would be interesting to see behind the scenes of these vids like how many camera crew and stuff
Most all have been on an episode or three. Just watch the older stuff.
Calorie burning isnt the same as improving strength/health by gaining muscle.
Qualified olympic level strength coach here. The upside to ebikes is a lower intensity workout but its just not going to produce muscle growth in the same way. Ebikes are an amazing tool but not a fitness tool(outside of the physical injury/disability equation) for the average person. This debate is more akin to the weights vs cardio argument. Cardio burns calories in system weight training creates more muscle which always need/use more energy(calories in layman). There is just more physical systems in play/being used on a normal human powered bike. Thats just fact that doesn't mean one is "more betterer" if you are riding for fun ride whatever gets you on a bike and moving. But if you want a beneficial vs efficient workout go normally aspirated everytime
Literally no one cares
@@neon_necromunda what you are totally forgetting to factor here is that conventional bikes put a hell of a lot more load on various joints particularly when ascending steep climbs. The ebike massively reduces that joint load by assisting on the climbs. Your only young for so many years and the cumulative damage, std bikes do to your joints on climbs and long distance rides will not go unaccounted for later in life. It's not all about muscle and cardiovascular fitness that seems to be the focus of these tests....
@@derekharper6031 my grandparents and great grandfather rode bikes with arthritic knees into their mid 80's so I understand but also have seen many more examples of it heping more than hindering into old age
@@elliottstreet7687 about your opinion
The conclusion made little sense...
I just bought an ebike recently (Devinci Spartan AC) because when using my friend's dad's ebike I found I'd have more fun on the trails than I would using my full sus or hardtail.
Dictionary: envy
a feeling of discontented or resentful longing aroused by someone else's possessions, qualities, or luck or the fact that someone owns an e-bike and you don't have one
With my ebike it's all about choice. Eco for the gainz or trail mode for the distance. I save turbo for silly steep climbs and if I run out of time.