A week ago before the first major change I was something like 460 and in every Cat C race I was getting destroyed because even though my FTP is 316, I'm at 97 kg. On the flats I could keep up but at the inclines it was obvious how much heavier I am. I had started in Cat C just based off of my FTP, but it didn't feel like zwift was accurately accounting for how weight would impact scores. I would just get dropped by the fast group in the first climb (fairly) and then finish somewhere in the middle. Since the change I got placed in D and won first in the first race I took part in, which was a very competitive finish of the lead Peloton separated by tenths across the finish. That felt good and right as I really had to push the entire time to win. It felt like what Zwift is going for. But that single win put me barely back into C. In the newest change I moved back down to D. Now to try to perform my way out of D and keep grinding.
I believe in small gradual tweaks rather than changing the whole system - up until now I viewed the score system favorably but it's getting annoying My score massively jumped up since I recently did a 5 min max effort outside of racing. It may be more accurate than it was before putting me as a low B, but I was still getting whooped as a mid C.
Mine went from 414 to 400. Used to be the old cat c. Just did a race where the top did 6w/kg up Zwift KOM and around 2min both times. In september when with cat, same route, the best up Zwift KOM were 20sec slower both times. Thats a BIG gap on a 1km climb. Wish they would bring back the categories.
Yes, mine went from 780 to 715. Kinda hoping it drops down to the old B category as that's where I'm a great fit. Been rough being forced into A grade races but good training.
I was mainly a D-rider when Racing Score was first introduced. I quickly improved from 170 to 220 points. A formula change set me back to 180, and despite increased efforts over the last two months, I slowly remained around 195. Surprisingly, I jumped to 210 points last week and then to 240 after a hard midweek ride. Yesterday, I reached 274 points after a medium-effort race. I'm now definitely in a higher category, even though I was nearly a top 20 rider in my races. It seems Zwift needs to spread riders out more evenly across categories.
I joined Zwift back in DEC 2023, started racing in 4/24 and was in CAT C . Now 131 races later went from C, TO D back to C , all all of my numbers went hay wired . As well as ranking . I was fine riding without racing, but once I did race it was fun to see my rankings and scores get better. Then everything went upside down . Ranking score, ZPOINTS, and now just confused and that fire to race has been stopped . I like steady improvement , been riding since 1985 the roller coaster effect was not how I train or race.My race segment score was 1545, now 411 .Race score was 426 , now 535 . I'm thinking if I race alot my score and ranking will show it .Then I hear they take 5 best 5 min efforts .So why race alot?Because after 5 mins of racing, it really does not matter much .
I still can't figure out how someone on zwift can kick my trash, but that same person in life can't. I'm sure I'm an outlier for zwift as I'm 100kg and 6'3". There are still racers that have a higher score racing down in events and causing on road dynamics, only to be booted later from the results, but the damage was done in the race. I don't really think Zwift will ever get it right for racing. So I've resigned to the idea its just for sport not competition on zwift
I went from the middle of the B cat to the top of the C cat, result? First race, 2nd place… Easy easy! I used the drafting half of the race, then I attacked the peloton bringing other 4 riders with me (all b cat riders). The new seed is shameful, I can imagine how the B cat is now, full of A riders.
Ditto, lost almost 150+ points, dropped from B's to C's. I haven't raced a C race yet given I'm doing Ladder and ZRL but another teammate this also happened to and he's podiuming left right and center.
Yeah B is full of A riders. I jumped from 596 (where i Could go top 5 some times) to 511. I tried racing in B cat and BOY that was awfull, got dropped so hard
I think what you said about where you think you should be - for me I like it so far - with the old system I was always last place and or riding by myself and because of that did not want to race much it was not fun. With the first release of the new score I placed 2nd place in 2 races - it moved me up and now I am finishing in around the top 15 - 20 riders and riding in a pack the entire race - way more fun and interesting. Realistically that is probably correct I know I am not winning races in real life so this seems to have me where I need to be. Year placing top 3 feels good, but I know if I grabbed a race outside I would not be top 3.
It is an unsolvable problem. No matter how it is designed people will complain. There will always be racers who are at the bottom of their designated group. They will get crushed in the races they enter because most of the riders in that race will have a higher ability. Secondly, there will always be racers with a score lower than their actual ability because they haven't raced for a while, have been sandbagging, or are new to Zwift. Because the universe of Zwift racers is so large there will probably be at least one of these racers in every race. More categories with smaller ranges could help with racers at the bottom of their category, but it would reduce the number of racers in each race and that could be a new problem.
Exactly. Someone has to lose. It’s generally those people that complain about ZRS. It’s not a perfect system, and hopefully Zwift will improve it overtime. But I think it’s better than the old category system based only on power numbers.
As a previously decent C rider with a ZRS of c390 I did an analysis of my previous C races versus the ZRS 350-520 races and the distribution of performances is WAY bigger in the latter. What does this mean? It means that in the old C category a large proportion of riders, if they were having a good day, could be competitive right to the final sprint. In a ZRS 350-520 race a far smaller proportion of total riders are genuinely competitive.
Since I started Zwift in November, my racing score went from 281 to 530 then 414. Everything over 281/D category is ridiculous. I’ve complained to no avail. I weigh 115 lbs and am 57 years old with asthma and two replaced knees. My category, pace group, and racing score are way too high. I am doing group rides by myself because I can’t hang with the group more than a few minutes. This is not fun, and I regret buying the expensive trainer that I bought to be able to use Zwift. If my issue is not resolved soon, I’ll just drop my subscription.
I'm an Enduro Racer, fairly new to Zwift. I started 2 Months ago.. after throwing away my old rollers. Zwift first gave me an ZRS of 357 (I have no Road riding or XC racing Experience, neither do i own a road bike or a Gravel). After 4 Races with 2 Podiums, one off them was a win. Always against 40+ Riders, my ZRS was at 467. 2 Months later, with no race inbetween my estimaded 20 Minute Watt is 4,33 and my FTP is 259. Now the ZRS changed. Suddenly like 3 days ago, my ZRS was 608, then i raced cat B for the first time, went 9th out of 60, ZRS went to 612, a day later it was 475, then 520 and now it's 535, it was super trippy holy shit. But okay, now it has settled. I'm happy with the system. Cat-B is a challenge, i'm still learning to race on Zwift. I think the absolute majority on Zwift consists of Roadbikers and a minority of XC-Racers. (Maybe some Roadies do MTB in Winter, but Enduro-Racers are quite a rare sight). I Don't know how strong the average Roadbiker is, but what i'm looking at is quite a skill gap (Power-Gap) in every Categorie. But that's racing. IRL-Racing is not fair, so is Zwift. I don't see a way Zwift can come up with an ZRS-System that works 100% as people want it. 174 cm, 62 kg an 25 years old.
While i am ok with 5 minute power, they should equally weight 30 sec to 1 minute power in there. Thats how sprint or short hill punch effort is winning and this should further reduce more sandbagger as they cannot hide their sprint effort to win.
@@benjapolcycling I am pretty sure they will continue to tweak this. It doesn't look like they are too sure about what's correct at this point. Short durations might be beneficial, but with lower weight than it was previously when the 30s effort was really overemphasized.
@@RoadtoA i think seed is settled now. As to why 30 second and 1 minute power don't need to be in seed, I can answer that. Seed is not meant to predict winners and losers - that was part of the problem with v1 and v2 of how Zwift was choosing the correct algorithm - they were trying to pick a seed formula that matched the best with who was winning and losing. We see where that ended. All seed needs to do is get riders in a pen that is competitive to their abilities. This 5 minute compound score does that. Score movement will take care of people that sprint for the win - if they are successful at that, their score will go up accordingly. Anti-tanking will have to take care of sandbaggers dropping their score back down. But the seed formula - it's job isn't to do everything but rather just get people to an initial starting place that is competitive.
They need to stop fiddling and just let racing adjust the score. In golf if you play under your handicap your handicap reduces a little (lower is better), if you play over your handicap, it doesn't immediately go up, over time if you keep play badly it creeps up. If you place highly in Zwift your score should go up by a reasonable amount, if you place badly, it should decrease ever so slowly. It will sort itself out if they just stop fiddling. As for sandbaggers, under this scheme, they will have to endure lots of boring middle pack rides for their score to come down before enjoying one glorious sandbag when it goes back again...
I am new to Zwift in the past two months. I joined after 3 years' worth of real-world cycling. I'm six races in; my score went: 325 --> 215 --> 232 (no races during the chaotic scoring changes) In every race I have taken part in, I have stuck with the lead group for 7 to 8 miles and then dropped, finishing completely alone and squarely between the lead group and a group well behind. I don't know how to interpret my racing score change given this consistent race finish pattern.
@@kurtrankin I would say that if you didn't win by a mile every time or wasn't like 10 minutes behind the leader in a standard race, your score was in the ballpark.
Racing score is good, but still not sure what in the world it's doing with me. Truth be told, most of my races are with wtrl TTT and ZRL so still using the old system. I did a race last Tuesday however with the new ZRS and finished in the top 1/4 of the field with a racing score of 540'ish. After all the changes the last week it's been reduced to 518. How does that compute when I finished well above the top half, many of those riders at the edge of the category.....
I find it somewhat unusual that the only announcement of this, initially, was only in a forum post. People's scores were swinging up and down wildly through the day causing understandable confusion. Only last night did they put a banner about the v3 change in the companion app. I can understand that the vastness of data means it takes a while to do any recalculation but updating the live data of user profiles as it is in progress makes no sense. My own scored went 529 - 475 - 502. Only managed to do only one B race, didn't get relegated and now am back to trying to break into that B pen once more :D Back to training, I guess :D
Good to see you being actually critical about the implementation, initially you seemed overly confident that Zwift had got it right and riders were the ones at fault for just not giving it time to settle down. I know I personally bumped heads with you as I knew I had been seeded stupidly. Will be be better overall? probably yes but they have ruined 6 weeks of racing for a lot of people and that's not great.
@@talonlan I was mainly advocating for patience because every ELO system needs time. If you are going to reset the score of all chess players, even Magnus Carlsenn will be stuck at 1500 for a while. I also feel that despite all the quirks the new system has been an improvement over the old one. That said, what happened in the past few days is strange and it wouldn't be transparent from me if I didn't say so.
I strongly dislike the talks about the category borders. That sounds for me like falling into the same category problems as before. Why dont we think in way that uses the advantages of a digital plattform: get rid of the zRacing Events and implement a racing ladder with a queue, that lets you queue up anytime you want and lets you race against opponents with similar zrs.
@@TheSmarki1 Interesting idea, though I am not sure if there is enough riders on Zwift for that. I however think we should have dynamic pens that would adjust based on the number of riders who signed up.
Thanks to Zwift weighting watts/kg so much while only hosting flat and rolling races I’m back to winning podium every single race doing 0.5w/kg less than everyone else.
Still surprised to see my score reduced by 100+ points 😅 My immediate reaction is a bit of frustration since I was placing well on B cat races just a week ago.
@@RoadtoA for sure! Still, I'm a bit surprised that Zwift is struggling so much with this since an elo ranking system isn't really new. Though, in their defense they are certainly trying something unique with our power data, maybe making this more complicated than it needs to be 😅
Still super confused by it all… Was at 120 when I came into the winter… Did the base line workouts tests and some chilled rides went upto 484 then down to 320 and now 376 But zwift power shows no data at all for efforts just activity’s that I have done 🤷🏻♂️🤷🏻♂️🤷🏻♂️ I don’t wanna be that guy that goes and does D/E races and looks like I’m sandbagging
How can Zwift give a Cat D and a Cat B the same ZRS and think they are equal? I don't understand why Zwift has scored old Cat B's from around 300 to over 700. The only bandwidth without any B's is 0-180. Zwift could easily have changed D to 0-250, C to 250-500, B to 500-750, A to 750-1000. They could have then set the racing bandwidths as 0-150, 150-300, 300-450, 450-600, 600-800, 800-1000 or any other range that allows some crossover between the old categories. They could have just swapped FTP w/kg to a number and gone from there (2.25wkg would become 225 and 5.45wkg becomes 545) as another option. I'm aware that there probably wouldn't be anyone starting with a score over 800 but as scores change based on results so this bandwidth would get more racers.
Different criteria lead to different categorization. That in itself I don't consider bad, especially since I wasn't over the moon about the previous rating system.
@RoadtoA I'd rather race in a one category, mass start race like ToW than ZRS. I'm never going to win but after a couple of KM's I'll be racing people with similar abilities to myself.
Absolutely no way you and I are in the same category now, you are such a stinger racer than I!!!! I don’t see you staying long in this category. I know you’ll level up quickly. Also, I’m near the bottom of the category now, though I know I will get back to the middle in no time.
They are 100% throwing things at the wall and seeing what sticks. I'm nearly certain, you (Adam) are an engineer as well (just the way you speak and analyze things). While I accept that this is a hard problem, what should never, ever, ever be a surprise to a team with good process, tooling, timelines, etc... is how the *seeding* affects Zwifters. They managed to get that wrong. Twice. They are also choosing not to be transparent. Zwift could CrowdSource this, open up some APIs for us to pull data and design a better system for you
@ i have Not raced jet, i will see. But i think it is more accurate. I did some raced where I became 2nd with better watts/kg then riders around me. I am a light rider 50 kg , so my 5 sec power is not as good compared to 5 min or 20 min power.
Mine started off at 570, then went to 686, then went allllllll the way down to 320. Now it's gone back up to 389. And, I have done zero racing in the last 2-3 months. Just the benchmarks and group rides, workouts, etc. I've always been a cat C rider - no idea how they're getting these values.
![Felix "Unfair" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Oswujxm2Ag0/mqdefault.jpg)
![I.N "HALLUCINATION" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/n5B5q1Hwt_U/mqdefault.jpg)
How did your racing score change? Do you feel it is at the correct place now? Share below!
From about 650 to 500 :D lets see if this is the right direction, cause i got way better than at the last races 😅
A week ago before the first major change I was something like 460 and in every Cat C race I was getting destroyed because even though my FTP is 316, I'm at 97 kg. On the flats I could keep up but at the inclines it was obvious how much heavier I am. I had started in Cat C just based off of my FTP, but it didn't feel like zwift was accurately accounting for how weight would impact scores. I would just get dropped by the fast group in the first climb (fairly) and then finish somewhere in the middle.
Since the change I got placed in D and won first in the first race I took part in, which was a very competitive finish of the lead Peloton separated by tenths across the finish. That felt good and right as I really had to push the entire time to win. It felt like what Zwift is going for. But that single win put me barely back into C.
In the newest change I moved back down to D. Now to try to perform my way out of D and keep grinding.
Mine was 547, it dumped me out of cat B, down to 500pts.
I was pissed, so entered a
I believe in small gradual tweaks rather than changing the whole system - up until now I viewed the score system favorably but it's getting annoying
My score massively jumped up since I recently did a 5 min max effort outside of racing. It may be more accurate than it was before putting me as a low B, but I was still getting whooped as a mid C.
Mine went from 414 to 400. Used to be the old cat c. Just did a race where the top did 6w/kg up Zwift KOM and around 2min both times. In september when with cat, same route, the best up Zwift KOM were 20sec slower both times. Thats a BIG gap on a 1km climb.
Wish they would bring back the categories.
Yes, mine went from 780 to 715. Kinda hoping it drops down to the old B category as that's where I'm a great fit. Been rough being forced into A grade races but good training.
I hope there won't be another change for some time now. 😅
Ah crap, just checked and I'm at 749. Bugger lol
Holly cow, my scored dropped over 100 points! Thanks for covering this!
@@ryankarr7109 do you feel it's more accurate now?
I was mainly a D-rider when Racing Score was first introduced. I quickly improved from 170 to 220 points. A formula change set me back to 180, and despite increased efforts over the last two months, I slowly remained around 195.
Surprisingly, I jumped to 210 points last week and then to 240 after a hard midweek ride. Yesterday, I reached 274 points after a medium-effort race.
I'm now definitely in a higher category, even though I was nearly a top 20 rider in my races. It seems Zwift needs to spread riders out more evenly across categories.
I joined Zwift back in DEC 2023, started racing in 4/24 and was in CAT C . Now 131 races later went from C, TO D back to C , all all of my numbers went hay wired . As well as ranking . I was fine riding without racing, but once I did race it was fun to see my rankings and scores get better. Then everything went upside down . Ranking score, ZPOINTS, and now just confused and that fire to race has been stopped . I like steady improvement , been riding since 1985 the roller coaster effect was not how I train or race.My race segment score was 1545, now 411 .Race score was 426 , now 535 . I'm thinking if I race alot my score and ranking will show it .Then I hear they take 5 best 5 min efforts .So why race alot?Because after 5 mins of racing, it really does not matter much .
I still can't figure out how someone on zwift can kick my trash, but that same person in life can't. I'm sure I'm an outlier for zwift as I'm 100kg and 6'3". There are still racers that have a higher score racing down in events and causing on road dynamics, only to be booted later from the results, but the damage was done in the race. I don't really think Zwift will ever get it right for racing. So I've resigned to the idea its just for sport not competition on zwift
Outside bike handling matters, inside heat resistance matters.
I wouldn't compare the two, they are two different sports.
@RoadtoA Not really when climbing up a hill it's pure power
@ But you are using different muscles when climbing outdoors compared to climbing on Zwift (unless you have Wahoo Kickr Bike or something similar).
I went from the middle of the B cat to the top of the C cat, result? First race, 2nd place… Easy easy! I used the drafting half of the race, then I attacked the peloton bringing other 4 riders with me (all b cat riders). The new seed is shameful, I can imagine how the B cat is now, full of A riders.
Thank you for sharing your experience!
Ditto, lost almost 150+ points, dropped from B's to C's. I haven't raced a C race yet given I'm doing Ladder and ZRL but another teammate this also happened to and he's podiuming left right and center.
Yeah B is full of A riders. I jumped from 596 (where i Could go top 5 some times) to 511. I tried racing in B cat and BOY that was awfull, got dropped so hard
I think what you said about where you think you should be - for me I like it so far - with the old system I was always last place and or riding by myself and because of that did not want to race much it was not fun. With the first release of the new score I placed 2nd place in 2 races - it moved me up and now I am finishing in around the top 15 - 20 riders and riding in a pack the entire race - way more fun and interesting. Realistically that is probably correct I know I am not winning races in real life so this seems to have me where I need to be. Year placing top 3 feels good, but I know if I grabbed a race outside I would not be top 3.
It is an unsolvable problem. No matter how it is designed people will complain. There will always be racers who are at the bottom of their designated group. They will get crushed in the races they enter because most of the riders in that race will have a higher ability. Secondly, there will always be racers with a score lower than their actual ability because they haven't raced for a while, have been sandbagging, or are new to Zwift. Because the universe of Zwift racers is so large there will probably be at least one of these racers in every race.
More categories with smaller ranges could help with racers at the bottom of their category, but it would reduce the number of racers in each race and that could be a new problem.
Exactly. Someone has to lose. It’s generally those people that complain about ZRS. It’s not a perfect system, and hopefully Zwift will improve it overtime. But I think it’s better than the old category system based only on power numbers.
As a previously decent C rider with a ZRS of c390 I did an analysis of my previous C races versus the ZRS 350-520 races and the distribution of performances is WAY bigger in the latter. What does this mean? It means that in the old C category a large proportion of riders, if they were having a good day, could be competitive right to the final sprint. In a ZRS 350-520 race a far smaller proportion of total riders are genuinely competitive.
Since I started Zwift in November, my racing score went from 281 to 530 then 414. Everything over 281/D category is ridiculous. I’ve complained to no avail. I weigh 115 lbs and am 57 years old with asthma and two replaced knees. My category, pace group, and racing score are way too high. I am doing group rides by myself because I can’t hang with the group more than a few minutes. This is not fun, and I regret buying the expensive trainer that I bought to be able to use Zwift. If my issue is not resolved soon, I’ll just drop my subscription.
I'm an Enduro Racer, fairly new to Zwift. I started 2 Months ago.. after throwing away my old rollers. Zwift first gave me an ZRS of 357 (I have no Road riding or XC racing Experience, neither do i own a road bike or a Gravel). After 4 Races with 2 Podiums, one off them was a win. Always against 40+ Riders, my ZRS was at 467.
2 Months later, with no race inbetween my estimaded 20 Minute Watt is 4,33 and my FTP is 259. Now the ZRS changed. Suddenly like 3 days ago, my ZRS was 608, then i raced cat B for the first time, went 9th out of 60, ZRS went to 612, a day later it was 475, then 520 and now it's 535, it was super trippy holy shit. But okay, now it has settled.
I'm happy with the system. Cat-B is a challenge, i'm still learning to race on Zwift. I think the absolute majority on Zwift consists of Roadbikers and a minority of XC-Racers. (Maybe some Roadies do MTB in Winter, but Enduro-Racers are quite a rare sight). I Don't know how strong the average Roadbiker is, but what i'm looking at is quite a skill gap (Power-Gap) in every Categorie. But that's racing. IRL-Racing is not fair, so is Zwift. I don't see a way Zwift can come up with an ZRS-System that works 100% as people want it.
174 cm, 62 kg an 25 years old.
@@david_der_master_ofchicken5209 nice to see enduro rider in the game! Give road biking a go, it might surprise you how fun it can be!
While i am ok with 5 minute power, they should equally weight 30 sec to 1 minute power in there. Thats how sprint or short hill punch effort is winning and this should further reduce more sandbagger as they cannot hide their sprint effort to win.
@@benjapolcycling I am pretty sure they will continue to tweak this. It doesn't look like they are too sure about what's correct at this point.
Short durations might be beneficial, but with lower weight than it was previously when the 30s effort was really overemphasized.
@@RoadtoA i think seed is settled now. As to why 30 second and 1 minute power don't need to be in seed, I can answer that. Seed is not meant to predict winners and losers - that was part of the problem with v1 and v2 of how Zwift was choosing the correct algorithm - they were trying to pick a seed formula that matched the best with who was winning and losing. We see where that ended. All seed needs to do is get riders in a pen that is competitive to their abilities. This 5 minute compound score does that. Score movement will take care of people that sprint for the win - if they are successful at that, their score will go up accordingly. Anti-tanking will have to take care of sandbaggers dropping their score back down. But the seed formula - it's job isn't to do everything but rather just get people to an initial starting place that is competitive.
They need to stop fiddling and just let racing adjust the score. In golf if you play under your handicap your handicap reduces a little (lower is better), if you play over your handicap, it doesn't immediately go up, over time if you keep play badly it creeps up. If you place highly in Zwift your score should go up by a reasonable amount, if you place badly, it should decrease ever so slowly. It will sort itself out if they just stop fiddling. As for sandbaggers, under this scheme, they will have to endure lots of boring middle pack rides for their score to come down before enjoying one glorious sandbag when it goes back again...
I am new to Zwift in the past two months. I joined after 3 years' worth of real-world cycling.
I'm six races in; my score went:
325 --> 215 --> 232 (no races during the chaotic scoring changes)
In every race I have taken part in, I have stuck with the lead group for 7 to 8 miles and then dropped, finishing completely alone and squarely between the lead group and a group well behind.
I don't know how to interpret my racing score change given this consistent race finish pattern.
@@kurtrankin I would say that if you didn't win by a mile every time or wasn't like 10 minutes behind the leader in a standard race, your score was in the ballpark.
Racing score is good, but still not sure what in the world it's doing with me. Truth be told, most of my races are with wtrl TTT and ZRL so still using the old system. I did a race last Tuesday however with the new ZRS and finished in the top 1/4 of the field with a racing score of 540'ish. After all the changes the last week it's been reduced to 518. How does that compute when I finished well above the top half, many of those riders at the edge of the category.....
I find it somewhat unusual that the only announcement of this, initially, was only in a forum post. People's scores were swinging up and down wildly through the day causing understandable confusion. Only last night did they put a banner about the v3 change in the companion app. I can understand that the vastness of data means it takes a while to do any recalculation but updating the live data of user profiles as it is in progress makes no sense.
My own scored went 529 - 475 - 502. Only managed to do only one B race, didn't get relegated and now am back to trying to break into that B pen once more :D Back to training, I guess :D
@@__-fu2dn EXACTLY! The news about this should be pinned everywhere, imo.
I am a Zwift beginner. Recently I did my first race. It gave me a score of 11. But after the changes my score was raised to 174.
Good to see you being actually critical about the implementation, initially you seemed overly confident that Zwift had got it right and riders were the ones at fault for just not giving it time to settle down. I know I personally bumped heads with you as I knew I had been seeded stupidly. Will be be better overall? probably yes but they have ruined 6 weeks of racing for a lot of people and that's not great.
@@talonlan I was mainly advocating for patience because every ELO system needs time. If you are going to reset the score of all chess players, even Magnus Carlsenn will be stuck at 1500 for a while.
I also feel that despite all the quirks the new system has been an improvement over the old one.
That said, what happened in the past few days is strange and it wouldn't be transparent from me if I didn't say so.
Why do they not use an existing score system as vELO rating? Much better than anything I have seen so far.
I strongly dislike the talks about the category borders. That sounds for me like falling into the same category problems as before.
Why dont we think in way that uses the advantages of a digital plattform: get rid of the zRacing Events and implement a racing ladder with a queue, that lets you queue up anytime you want and lets you race against opponents with similar zrs.
@@TheSmarki1 Interesting idea, though I am not sure if there is enough riders on Zwift for that.
I however think we should have dynamic pens that would adjust based on the number of riders who signed up.
Mine went up even though I haven’t had a top ten is any race so far in the cat below now I don’t have a chance.
@harrygraham2028 ouch
Thanks to Zwift weighting watts/kg so much while only hosting flat and rolling races I’m back to winning podium every single race doing 0.5w/kg less than everyone else.
@@dylanl9532 Are you talking about racing post both those changes?
Still surprised to see my score reduced by 100+ points 😅
My immediate reaction is a bit of frustration since I was placing well on B cat races just a week ago.
@@Me_Hall You'll get back up in no time I'm sure!
@@RoadtoA for sure! Still, I'm a bit surprised that Zwift is struggling so much with this since an elo ranking system isn't really new. Though, in their defense they are certainly trying something unique with our power data, maybe making this more complicated than it needs to be 😅
@ I am a little baffled by what just happened, too. Still hoping that the five minute system us going to improve racing though.
Mine tanked by 200 points but I honestly was happy about this.
My score only went down 5 points, so I am still just a hair over 690 but in the B category.
Still super confused by it all…
Was at 120 when I came into the winter…
Did the base line workouts tests and some chilled rides went upto 484 then down to 320 and now 376
But zwift power shows no data at all for efforts just activity’s that I have done 🤷🏻♂️🤷🏻♂️🤷🏻♂️
I don’t wanna be that guy that goes and does D/E races and looks like I’m sandbagging
@@rodstevens7452 Don't worry about about it. :-)
How can Zwift give a Cat D and a Cat B the same ZRS and think they are equal? I don't understand why Zwift has scored old Cat B's from around 300 to over 700. The only bandwidth without any B's is 0-180.
Zwift could easily have changed D to 0-250, C to 250-500, B to 500-750, A to 750-1000. They could have then set the racing bandwidths as 0-150, 150-300, 300-450, 450-600, 600-800, 800-1000 or any other range that allows some crossover between the old categories.
They could have just swapped FTP w/kg to a number and gone from there (2.25wkg would become 225 and 5.45wkg becomes 545) as another option. I'm aware that there probably wouldn't be anyone starting with a score over 800 but as scores change based on results so this bandwidth would get more racers.
Different criteria lead to different categorization. That in itself I don't consider bad, especially since I wasn't over the moon about the previous rating system.
@RoadtoA I'd rather race in a one category, mass start race like ToW than ZRS. I'm never going to win but after a couple of KM's I'll be racing people with similar abilities to myself.
Absolutely no way you and I are in the same category now, you are such a stinger racer than I!!!! I don’t see you staying long in this category. I know you’ll level up quickly. Also, I’m near the bottom of the category now, though I know I will get back to the middle in no time.
You are way too nice about my abilities hehe.
They are 100% throwing things at the wall and seeing what sticks.
I'm nearly certain, you (Adam) are an engineer as well (just the way you speak and analyze things).
While I accept that this is a hard problem, what should never, ever, ever be a surprise to a team with good process, tooling, timelines, etc... is how the *seeding* affects Zwifters. They managed to get that wrong. Twice.
They are also choosing not to be transparent.
Zwift could CrowdSource this, open up some APIs for us to pull data and design a better system for you
@@RideItBetterCycling hehe, not an engineer;)
But I work with numbers, yea.;)
I’ve gone from 470 to 390 😮
Similar drop to mine!
mine dropped from 562 to 503
Does that feel right to you?
i sit about 3.9 w/kg, so maybe the score is a bit low
Mine went from 155 to 244
@@christinasimon6149 do you feel it's more accurate now?
@ i have Not raced jet, i will see. But i think it is more accurate. I did some raced where I became 2nd with better watts/kg then riders around me. I am a light rider 50 kg , so my 5 sec power is not as good compared to 5 min or 20 min power.
Mine started off at 570, then went to 686, then went allllllll the way down to 320. Now it's gone back up to 389. And, I have done zero racing in the last 2-3 months. Just the benchmarks and group rides, workouts, etc. I've always been a cat C rider - no idea how they're getting these values.
That's hell of a rollercoaster.
@@RoadtoA Side note: just did the Stage 2 Fresh out of 24 (350-520) - 90% of the top 20 finishers were category B riders.