Before rivals came out I was so tired about hearing how it was going to destroy overwatch. Now I won't even touch ow, they lost their chance to make it up to the community. The biggest wasted opportunity ever
If Wolverine was in 5v5 Overwatch. Tank would die as a role 💀 rivals’s format allows for extremist designs to thrive where they couldn’t in a 5v5 format
@@pixavier9746 yeah I swear ever since s9 I don't think I'm even scared of reaper anymore as a monke main. Even in the 6v6 tests when I get jumped by a reaper I take the duel 90% of the time
Honestly this is visible in Overwatch 1 as well with Wrecking Ball. Wrecking Ball is an extremist design that functions very dissimilarly to the expectations that the “tank” role usually has, and he was really fun and good at his unique role back in the first game. But unless you are a one-trick hamster, Ball has basically been a throw pick for the entirety of OW2’s life cycle because he can’t do shit to protect his team without someone else there to pick up the slack.
@@raivo1768trust me, man. It’s heart breaking. What a wonderful game gone down the drain. But I guess everything comes to an end. For me at least, I’ve retired that game (mentally) and appreciate it for what it was. Marvel rivals is a great replacement.
I had fun playing doomfist in overwatch time to play wolverine now I still enjoy overwatch it is just sad how the devs just ruined there own game if overwatch goes back to 6v6 and gets like a new logo branding I might go back but I will still also play rivals
My biggest issue outside of gameplay design in OW is no content I feel like the shop update is just re colors, the arcade modes are fine for a few matches and there is no incentive to grind ranked. I've always wanted to earn something like skins or unique banners emblems charms for hitting a certain rank
Yes they should at least let one lootbox to reward in competitive and finish the battlepass per season where you can get a free skin (every skins, without the possibility to get a duplicate)
Also need to bring in server selection for consoles and crossplay without the need to have atleast one player on PC just to queue for quick play cross play. Spent hours waiting for a game at night. Console, Asia.
True but the meta in it sucks and it's still lacking all the features rivals has. Even if ow was in a really good meta rn it wouldn't matter since the past 6+ years has seen no improvement on the core gameplay (hero bans, team ups, breakable environment, etc.) That's not even mentioning the fact ow has been doing nothing with its lore (cinematics, shows) whilst rivals has hundreds if not thousands of hours worth of the stuff. It's sad to say but even if ow wakes up and starts realizing its potential it will just be labeled as copying rivals.
Wrong, TF2 was actually the original 6v6 hero competitive shooter. All comp matches are 6v6 except highlander which is 9v9 with one of every character on each team. OW stole all their ideas from TF2, and Marvel rivals stole from OW and did it way better. So wake up
@Punchbadguy i don't disagree with anything you've said. I think I've put 40 hours into rivals and 15 min into OW since launch. My point was that you don't even have to go to another game to realize the 6v6 format is better. Now i completely agree that if OW wants a way back, they have to copy Rivals, and it may not even work. Blizzard is notorious for stealing other people's ideas so I don't know if the copying thing would matter. With that said I don't think OW comes back from this unless they improve markedly and Rivals fumbles.
@ Paladins was the better game, the out of combat and start healing OW stole that from them. Hi-rez just don’t have the funding blizzard does that’s it.
@@JamirQuest not only is paladins a dead game hirez is almost as bad as blizzard with game design they just care about money idk if you’ve played smite 2 yet but that shows how bad they are at game design and doing what the fan base asks marvel rivals take an existing concept and made good gameplay sorry but 6v6 is the better format for options and fun gameplay loops
Facts I never heard of Jeff until Rivals . Crazy because I was watching a short of Iron man watching Jeff and when he left to go on a mission he made sure the cage was locked so Jeff couldn’t get out. Plot twist : the little fucker got out💀💀💀 and hopped straight in the Hulkbuster Lmfao just doing sht
Same I think the comics people always expected people knowing about these mascot like characters. Same thing happened with Howard the Duck. But the thing is marvel comics in general is about superheroes and superhero teams so a regular person reads the most known comics and main ones prob for the most part so they won't have any idea about these characters that appeared in their own separate comics or spinoff teams.
Having no role lock is such a blessing, I can flex when needed. I was able to solo carry until diamond then fill necessary roles when teammates were on par with skills
Forget that . Look at how good the ranked system is. If you contribute more than your teammates and you still lose you only lose like 11 points. Your individual performance matters
Yeh and when you fail your first min of dps ( can happen) you switch and can be more usefull for your team. And most of time a gealer is enough so no excuse, case all hero have survavibilty kit, no one shot. Installation had more tank healer and the game is close to perfection. And optimisation plz i still have my 3050 4gb, i need to wait 6 month for 5090 so plz
All I can say is thank you for being a voice for us 6v6ers. Should 6v6 finally fully return, I hope to see you back on the OW leaderboard. We will carry on the fight!
I played it and noticed instantly that the characters weren't just designed to fill a spot in team comp. I could stay back as Squirrel Girl, or go in, or flank. The same on Moonknight. I felt like I had options just within one character even before adding in team-ups. "It's not balanced" It doesn't have to be, since the premise wasn't ass.
Its crazy that even my friends who quit OW a long time ago and weren't as invested as I was said after a week or two of playiny Marvel Rivals that they have not had so much fun in a competitive game since the original overwatch release. We played overwatch 2 and they all quit after a few weeks saying it just felt bad and wasn't fun. Role queue was a fumble, but 5v5 was Justin Herbert throwing 4 interceptions into the Texans defense. It cost Blizzard everything they built up.
Same w my friend group. No one stuck around for more than a week of OW2 except me, and now they’re ALL back for Rivals. Time will tell if they stick around this time.
The thing I currently appreciate is that 6v6 is in arcade. It was evident that people enjoy the format. Doom, hanzo, genji feels amazing. It just makes OW2 moronic for going 5v5
Patch notes: Soldier 76 primary fire damage is increased from 19 to 20. Helix rocket cool down is increased from 9 to 10 seconds. Okay. Does anyone give a crap? They could've tweaked tanx like that until people started playing tanx. That game jumped off the cliff. I don't think it'll ever come back from the rocky shore it landed on 7:50 I thought it was hilarious. Force feed bracardi silver to a cat and see what happens.
whenever i play overwatch with my friends we only play 6v6 in arcade, and they started playing from ow2 and all agree that 6v6 is just more fun to play on all roles
Idk how blizzard expects us to go back to playing genji after playing ironfist. Also wooo! 6v6 but we have to play it thru every shit wonky meta when we all know what meta it should have been. That 6v6 still hasn’t dropped. And im done huffing the cope you could just load marvel rivals and just have fun and stop hoping to have fun
As someone who doesnt care about role queue or 6v6, i prefer marvel rivals because its easier to earn cosmetics and they let you do missions vs ai so you can clear them fast
Hero bans only work when you have an enormous rooster of very interesting characters. It is the case for Rivals. It was never the case for OW. OW is a game of one-tricks.
@ One-tricks were a thing since day one lmao. That’s just straight up not true. And bans weren’t POSSIBLE at day one just out of how few heroes there were.
i feel like hero bans work for rivals because most characters have alternative characters who play similarly not because each character is very interesting lol, almost every character has a somewhat similar alternative so u can just play the other projectile or melee character if they ever get banned... in OW for example monkey and ball are both dive tanks but play very differently from eachother most of the time. genji n tracer r both dive characters but have very different kits etc etc
@@LFanimes333all they had to do was give each team one hero ban then they can scale up to two when they get more heroes. With hero bans there’s no set meta. For example GOATS wouldn’t work if you ban either Lucio, Brig, or DVA
@@tobe.moemeka One hero ban per team could work with open queue. It would absolutely never work with role lock, tho, per obvious. That’s a decent enough compromise. I am still conflicted about doing this at lower elos for OW (unlike Rivals, since the rooster will be so much larger). Also, I hate Luna Snow that much.
My first online shooter was MW3 for the Nintendo Wii. Due to hardware limitations, it was only 5v5 instead of 6v6. At the time, I didn’t think anything of it, because it was all I knew. Then I got BO2 for the PS3, which actually had 6v6, and I couldn’t imaging going back to 5v5. You can see where I’m going with this. After playing OW1 since before Orisa came out, 5v5 feels so much emptier. I was against it since they revealed it. I still think there’s a lot of balancing that needs to be done, but my heart belongs to 6v6.
I've been playing the hell out of the OW 6v6 mode, I've been having a great time. Rivals is fun, but it just can't match what Overwatch is in 6v6. When these 6v6 tests end, I'm probably going to be playing a lot more Rivals.
What enough people aren't talking about is, it's not just OW.. I have played Apex since season 0. For the past year I have been saying that I think im tired of Apex. im just playing it because it's the best multiplayer game imo at that time. Since Rivals came out I havent touched Apex and I don't think im going back.. we needed a new FUN, mutliplayer game that doesn't feel like it's just after my Wallet
Honestly, it depends on what game we are talking. LOL is 5v5 and it's the biggest game. But in shooters there's much more going on. So I'd say it depends on how much team based it is and how much clutter going on
Don't know much about LOL and mobas in general but having 3 distinct roles in hero shooters (tank, dps, support) makes 5v5 really awkward. Open que is another story but with role lock, you're only gonna have 1 player on one of the roles. And that they'll need to be super buffed to be any relevant to the match. That's where 5v5 fails.
I don't think 6v6 is necessarily better than 5v5, but rather that 6v6 OPEN QUEUE is better than 5v5 ROLE LOCK. Open Queue just lends itself better to more players on the team as it promotes diversity. Rivals plays into this very well with the team ups too. On the other hand, 5v5 is already a restrictive format because it has 1 less player on each team, and on top of that role lock makes it even more restrictive. 5v5 Role lock exists purely because of the fact no one wants to play Tank. It's a bandaid solution to flawed hero design and balancing. It's a cheap, brute force solution that treats a symptom rather than a problem. THAT is the difference between Rivals 6v6 and Overwatch 5v5.
5v5 is just a terrible choice for a hero shooter, it only worked for Paladins cause you could build into survivability and the other playstyles on any class. Also no role queue last time I played.
Yeah paladins went the full mile on 5v5 with the tactile kind of shop they have, different loadouts as well like tf2. it was naive and foolish to copy them when people called them a rip off to begin with. Ow had already went the full mile with 6v6 having fun off tanks and mains, it was challenging in an iq kind of way and; without the implementations paladins has, 5v5 is challenging in a cod deathmatch, mechanics, adderall sweat-fest kind of way.
@@tyrantla7120I'm biased because I'm a wanda main but without a doubt. She has the most skilled aoe ult in the game. So much you have to worry about when ulting. Ccs (penny can literally miss a cc when your mid ult and get it before you pop) Shields / other invulnerability abilities Getting taken out out the sky because 5 seconds is easily enough time even with 1 person seeing you. Even then half the roster has crazy movement abilities and they can simply outrun you
@lunatic417 all good points. I'm just not a fan of AOE ultimates in general. I play Thor, and his ult makes me feel cheap even though I get CC out of it like 1/2 the time.
Marvel overall is just a better game. I didn't realize how soulless Ow2 was with zero depth. The game is so good we don't need roll que. They have bans like any game like this should have no questions asked. Wide cast of characters with decent release windows. Ow2 never stood a chance with how bad American developers have become. They couldn't balance ow in general, but somehow this game has balance. Make it make sense. I hope they keep their foot on their necks and erase ow2 from our memories for our sake. My wish list btw is Gambit, silver surfer, night crawler, Dr. Doom maybe Rogue and Ghost Rider. All harder characters to make but can be done seeing what I've already seen. If the game ever starts to get stale they can already add to preexisting characters like Magneto and Reed Richards. For example Magneto just holds jump to go straight into the air and float down, while Reed can just stretch his legs out to move a little further with 2-3 extra strides. They got em boys OW is cooked.
Cable and Nick Fury would be cool as well. Obviously we will get Deadpool at some point. Hell, Jean Grey might possibly be like Cloak and dagger Jean and Phoenix, wow
It’s so weird to see how many people outright despise OW. Like don’t get me wrong, Blizzard is an awful company, which is directly responsible for the downfall of OW, and the game is totally cooked after the release of Rivals, at least for a long, long, time. And Blizzard totally deserves whatever aftermath they’ve brought upon themselves. But to me it’s just sad to see a franchise beloved by so many people (including myself) die like this. I’m not happy about it like so many others are, just disappointed at Blizzard and wishing that things could’ve gone differently for the game I used to love.
@@aidanrowland611 It all starts with how they handle ow2. I'm from the days before role q. If they didn't start off telling blatant lies this game would have been received better. 4-5 years of development for what? To release the same exact characters with worse tweaks and even worse balancing. Maybe 1-2 new characters on release. Not a PVE player but that was a straight up lie. They deserve everything that is happening to them. They made enough money and it's time for that game to die. Its clearly outdated. Just the tip of the ice berg btw
It is actually my opinion that every single rank in Rivals should have hero bans. Everyone in every rank is going to ban something different. I can almost guarantee that to you. I think they can take a lesson from R6 Siege and do what's GOOD with the ban system. I hate the way bans work in Rivals. It's like playing mystery bans and I think that's stupid. It limits what you can do to make that experience better. It needs to be a back and forth system like what Siege does. Or at the very least give extra for bans and make it so you can change your ban / see what the enemy wants to ban. They desperately need to inprove that. You also don't even get to experience bans until you hit D1 or even GM3 because at D3&2 you STILL get lumped into games with Plat players. They need a hard cutoff at Diamond and deal with the increase in queue times, or give every rank the ban system. It's genuinely so frustrating that Rivals is right there on the cusp of greatness but isn't quite there yet.
lower ranked people just want to play what they want to play. you have to "earn" hero bans becuase otherwise you're going to play with pissbabies who want to one trick. of course that happens at every elo to some degree, but far less at higher ranks. banning reaper or moira in bronze (typical problem characters) would make the game unplayable for a large segment becuase they're also the highest picked characters. higher ranks are more about what works than just playing your favorite hero all the time.
When it came to the anti healing bit I think they should add more anti heals to the game One thing my friend told me was that a potential buff to widow ult is that when fired at maxed charge it applies antiheal or a reduced healing debuff to targets hit as well as any that walks on the lingering effect on the ground. Stays in line with her ult being a semi utility ult
Ive been saying that overwatch didn't release with 6v6 out of any random thought process. It was all tested and tried before release. Im sure they tested 5v5 along with other variations but 6v6 was chosen for a reason.
I do like Rivals better currently, but I think in time the new toy syndrome will wear off and people might start picking at the game’s kind of atrocious ultimate balance. In overwatch most ults are at least somewhat skillful or require some semblance of gamesense to execute without being instantly punished, but Rivals just has a slew of huge damage AOE nonsense that feels like you don’t even have to put a single braincell into, which is pretty irritating cause the core teamfight gameplay is fun as hell
@@Larg_Manso most DPS heroes can have a "All team dies" button and that's fun. But some support heroes having a "All team lives (unless they get one shot by one of the DPS Ult)" button, is not ok? I'm all in on nerfing the ults a bit (mainly their charge rate) but just saying that they aren't fun just because they serve they're purpose at countering your attack is dumb. Fun is subjective, and support players can also have fun being (not) inmortal from time to time.
Overwatch seasons should be 3 months instead of 2, we should get a new hero every season, and we should get an Overwatch Archives style mission every season or every other season so that we still get story even though the OW2 PvE was cancelled (OW Archives missions would all be permanently playable). They can use pre-existing maps for Overwatch Archives like they did in OW1.
Content isn’t even the main issue for OW. They cancelled PvE in order to “focus more on PvP”, but the balance and hero design of the game has just deteriorated since release. Tank doom has so much less skill expression than dps doom. Mercy got whatever skill expression she had left gutted season 0. Ball was dumbed down with more maneuverability, the retractable grapple, ammo increase (the part of his kit which goes against what makes him fun), and no grapple cooldown without fireball. Roadhog vape is resource based instead of cooldown based, so you don’t have to think as hard about when to use it. Oh, and let’s give him a trap for some reason. Dva and Zarya lost her hero identity. Sombra was given infinite stealth Rein 1v1s are completely dependent on who has the better supports. Zenyatta was made more self reliant against dives. Season 9 literally made AIMING EASIER by both increasing projectile sizes AND hitbox sizes. And Orisa got reworked to be even more obnoxious and unkillable. Add all that to some VERY questionable new hero kit choices which they refuse to rework, like Mauga, Kiriko, Illari, and Lifeweaver, and you have a game where all of the fun and skill expression has slowly disappeared.
The biggest flaw for ow when they started to listen to the silver support mains compliance and whining in reddit abt dps .. they added moira + breg and added immo abilities and killed off the best hero they ever designed and turned him to a tank at the end the silver support mains still stuck there to this day and on the other hand 90% of dps mains left the game completely bc u cant kill shit
honestly, just let people play what they want to play and have fun with the game(s) you want to. not everything has to be about this > that. Rivals is so fun though, I tried playing ow and personally it felt so slow to me. But I'd never judge anyone for enjoying one over the other tbh
If they'll release Dracula maybe heal reduction and steals the reduced healing for personal or team heal via passive, increased when he ults? Just a suggestion 😅
Thank you for not being an elitist and saying that hero bans should be allowed to every rank. As skill level varies so does the difficulty or ease to deal with certain heroes and abilities, every rank has the right to decide for themselves what they want to go against.
When there are few heroes in a game, people become gods at them very quickly and dominate on the majority of the playerbase, making casual players leave the game. The constant stream of heroes means that people wont ever have the proper time to master the majority of the hero pool, which opens up opportunities for more casual players to have an element of surprise. Hero bans should also come to all ranks, I agree 100% on this. This game does almost everything right.
Lowkey the support ults aren’t that bad you just have to know how to counter them. I think some of them are just a little overtuned with how much healing they do like cloak and dagger and Luna. Once people get better though they’ll design comps that have team wiping ultimates like Groot+Moon knight
Rivals is going to become the Fortnite of hero shooters when marvel rivals when down for maintenance the other night me and my buddies went back to play OW and holy shit it was not it
I love the fact that Rivals has no role queue. I went up against a 6 strategist comp and we were getting wrecked til we went with a 5 strategist and one dualist (they refused to mirror) setup and had to play at our peaks on each of our characters. The fact we only barely won shows that any comp can work if you play your characters well enough.
I think the anti-heal abilities should be given to vanguards, not other strategists. Strange's E, Magneto's full powered right click, Thor's E, it makes sense that these abilities have some built in anti heal. It makes sense too as it puts the vanguard in the healing equation. Strategists heal, duelists DPS through the healing, and vanguards cut the healing.
Thousands of hours on overwatch. Haven’t been back to it since rivals dropped. Never going back, even deleted it from my console. OW had its chance to give ppl the game they wanted w/ 6v6 acted like it couldn’t be done for 2 years. Then boom rivals comes out and all of sudden they can do it. Too late for me rivals is a lot better imo and I hope blizzard learns from their mistakes. Let’s go rivals!
The open queue format is so nice. I usually instalock Mantis because she is broken but can play anyone that doesn't require too much tech (this game is pretty easy if you played OW1) but one time had a game filled with the worst DPS players because I think they were all support mains so I liked how I was able to go Psylocke myself and carry. I think role lock is actually the decline of OW for sure, and it was only implemented because they couldn't listen to the community's advice on how to fix GOATS.
Imo Overwatch has more polish and Marvel Rivals is more wacky and hectic. I prefer the balance and simplicity Overwatch has more over Marvel rivals but I can see how people can have more fun with marvel rivals.
8:40 !!! Thank you for sharing this opinion. We know how difficult it balance these games, thats why they gave us hero bans. But if thats true why give it to only a small percentage of the player base and not just give it to everyone. Each rank has issues with different character designs.giving everyone hero bans allows, again, everyone! to curate each game for a more enjoyable experience.
I LOVE MARVEL RIVALS!!! I'm so down to play it alone, unlike Ow where I had to play with friends to enjoy it! Hope more and more people keep joining and that the game keeps having incredible stuff in its future!
I’m glad rivals is not shooting for balance but instead fun. Most games that have a big comp scene were never meant to be balanced I do wish the healing is a bit tuned down though
you can feel it off the smile on your face when you play in 6v6. were 5v5 you loose that smile. just have hero ban's in comp only. quick play open don't need ban's. if a character gets banned a lot over time than the devs know what characters need to be looked at. The original devs said the foundation of overwatch is 6v6, what happens to the building on top of a foundation once you remove part of the foundation? it slowly crumbles an falls. just takes a while.
Honestly glad Rivals devs are not entirely listening to only big OW creators look how the game is now some characters have lost their soul due to certain changes.
I've had more fun (in OW2) playing the 6v6 test (3max 1min) mode. It's just more fun period. For the banning in MR, I'd like to see it one at a time. Where Team1 bans, Team 2 bans 2, Team1 bans -vs- simultaneous banning
11:40 It's crazy that they still have a ton of characters they can add like Galactus, Captain Marvel, Gambit, Nightcrawler, Thanos, Deadpool, etc. They're just getting started.
I only go on Overwatch to play 6v6. It's just so much infinitely better than 5v5. Role lock is sadly the way to go though. I remember how horrendous open q was, and until I try out an open q w/ bans system, I'm 100% for 2-2-2 role lock.
Role lock is what killed ow along side other factors. I know some metas were cáncer to play against but the players had the chance choose whatever to make it work. Most of the issue was a character balance issue. If that was fixed then ow1 would have been still going.
Since the launch of rivals. For the first time since 2016, my desire to play OW is ZERO. it feels so good to finally move on. OW had their chance, and they kept blowing it.
Heroes being released in high volume like that makes a lot of sense for them to do because of the ip they are working with. There are still tons of highly anticipated characters like members of the X-men, ghost rider, Deadpool and many more. There are still so many team up opportunities along with those characters as well. Drip feeding content like overwatch would hurt this game mainly because of the team ups. It wouldn’t make sense to add Mr fantastic one season and then two seasons later add invisible woman then two seasons later the thing, two seasons later the human torch. one year later we have the fantastic four and still missing all of those anticipated characters and team ups not properly being implemented as well. They know what they’re doing.
1:32 tbh is is kinda wild you never made a vid on the 6v6 playtest all that “i genuinely love the game” overwatch talk and you dropped it like a HOT POTATO
Why should he be expected to come back when there is a better alternative. It was too late. It isn't his fault that the devs have such bad decision making, after 2 years, they decide to retry 6v6 a WEEK after their biggest potential competitor. If I was blizzard and the devs, I'd be fast tracking 6v6 to the earliest we could. And it doesn't help that the devs also accompanied it with what mist have been one of the most 'nothing' patches ever without even addressing the 1 character that was causing so many problems. So let me ask YOU, why should blizzard be entitled to us coming back to OW2 when they themselves do not care about the players OR their game.
If OW keeps 5v5 I have one piece of personal advice 4 roles. The Paladins strategy 1 dps 1 tank 1 flank 1 healer 1 remaining player that can just pick there best character(s)
How times have changed. I’ve opened Overwatch about 5 times since MR released… and I haven’t played a single match. I sit in the menu then question why I’m playing this and not MR. It’s Crazy how many people are saying we turned our backs on OW… no, THEY turned their back on US. I’ve been playing since the OW1 beta, you don’t think I love this game? I do and it hurts to see what it is now.
I much prefer 6v6 but I think it's a big stretch to say the cool things about marvels (bans, team ups, etc) have anything to do with it being 6v6, especially because of the real lack of tank synergies. 6v6 is better but idk that marvel would be less successful rn if it was 5v5.
I played 2 matches of OW2 last night when I was drunk at 3am. Accidentally queued for 5v5. Left the match when I noticed. Then went to Arcade and queued for 6v6. Had a fun 2 matches, then I was like "ehhhhh, I am going to bed. This still isn't as good as Rivals" lmao. Oh well. It's sad tho, I can barely get through 2 OW matches before I wanna log off. Rivals ruined OW for me :(
I've made the same decision myself sam. I love overwatch but after playing the 6v6 test and confirming my assumption of just how much better that format is I've decided I won't play it until 6v6 is the main mode and they add comp and bans. Rivals is simply better than overwatch atm. 6v6 and bans might be the only thing that could change that.
I think the overwatch 6v6 test proved 6v6 was better but I guess we can't go a day without "Rivals shows up overwatch by -". Dont get me wrong the game is doing it, but Rivals is literally showing up most live service games right now. Heck, apex legends deserves to get dunked on more than overwatch but here we are.
Apex and rivals are entirely different games in every way lol. But yes apex, is god awful. I use to play it and check on it every now and then and it has not gotten better
@necrosis6037 the main things rivals is beating overwatch out on are: roster size, microtransactions, friendlyness to players not spending any money, character release rate. All of those can also apply to apex legends. The only one that wouldn't is how bad blizzard balances for a hero team fps.
Never should have went to 5v5. Marvel Rivals listened to every complaint about OW and they improved on it, and they didn’t take steps around it. They knew role lock hurt not only queue times for all players, casual and competitive, it took away FUN. Their answer? Remove a member of the team and do a mass rebalance, rather than mass rebalance 3-4 heroes. Even some of the mass reworks they did are pretty much hated by either a casual or a competitive player. Zarya bubble rework is annoying for lower ranks, Orisa is annoying, doomfist is still broken. it’s been 2 years, lock tf in.
I quit Overwatch when they started the neverending see-saw of balance. I loved playing Dva but them constantly overbuffing and overnerfing her drove me crazy and I put the game down and never went back.
I think being in support of a return to open queue is jumping the gun. Like OW had issues and matchmaking problems that persisted for 3 years before the feature came out. The community had time to solve the game. Rivals is in it's infancy. I'm not rushing for a role lock in Rivals but we don't know what things are going to look like for another few years. At this time in OW1's life role lock would have been unimaginable. It wasn't until the issues became systemic within the player base themselves. Something the devs can never patch.
Nah hero bans should not exist in lower ranks for the exact reason you mentioned. Ranked is still a learning experience and if you struggle against bad Iron Fist or Scarlet Witch players so you ban them every game, then you don’t deserve to rank up.
I unistalled overwatch. And there is almost NO CHANCE I EVER touch it again. Played it for 8 years man . . . Rivals took a shyt on overwatch. Better game - better experience - better content - they LISTEN TO THEIR PLAYERS - on and on and on. GOOD riddance overwatch.
once i had a game as tank in season 1 of ow2 and my team died 4 min in a row and i played 3 different tanks and we couldnt walk passed the choke i stoppped playing tank
Hero bans to all ranks are de answer to the most difficult question on hero shooters, How can we buff/ nerf the characters at X elo, without hurting the other elos. There u go, let bronze players ban scarlet witch and let GM players ban wolverine
I love how people hate on third person like Fortnite wasn’t the most played game in gaming ever, and there’s never been a marvel game in history that released in first person
Luna Snow, Jeff the Landshark and Magik, were the only characters i hadnt known of. This game has done so many heroes right, in design, kit expression, and personality. It jumped from the foundation Overwatch laid, with game design and concept; then did amazing work on the heroes. On the topic of hero bans, if it comes to lower ranks, im quiting comp. I hate hero bans. I hate it in mobas, and its one of the reasons i dont play them. If the pros, tournaments, scrims, and high levels want it, fine; but not in my level. At mid to low levels, it breeds toxicity, and adds more limits. I shouldnt have control over what other people can or cannot play. Learning to play around your counters or the meta is a part of improving. Adding rails does not improve the game. It will be the "role lock" of Marvel Rivals.
I know it’s a unpopular opinion but I’m not a huge fan of marvel rivals I much prefer overwatch. Now 6v6 tho is indeed better, been playing 6v6 overwatch. I just wish role Que was a thing in rivals to many insta lock dps players.
They did a test to prove they were right about 5v5. Turns out they were horribly wrong and 6v6 popped off. Despite them trying to ruin the damn play test!
banning heroes in comp and getting demoted in rank in every new season is such an Asian thing. I played mobile legends (yeah I know) and this is the exact same design we have. We had way too many dps (range), decent number of tanks, few healers and same w/ junglers. But now the hero pool is soo large the ban pick is part of the strat where you need to ban the hero that will counter your pick or ban a hero thats meta or etc.
I'd like you to make a video explaining in depth (without constantly repeating the same thing) why role queue is a bad thing. From my perspective, role queue is the most needed thing in any game which has these 3 roles. There's not 2 ways about it. I'd really like to know why you think this. Because when you say "there's more creativity, more combinations" etc. doesn't make any sense to me, because people just want to play DPS. People being creative or whatever must only happen in high ranks. And I feel like people should understand that the game is only good without role queue at the high end.
it would simply feel restricting. If i play casual i obviously dont care that much about team composition or about winning. And in ranked people know what is a good team composition already. And this game is gonna be huge dude. It will surely hit 100 characters in no time. Who knows what kind of kits they will have and what kind of funny combos you can make. Not to mention the whole team up mechanics making things a bit complicated. Maybe a team will want 2 or 3 team ups at the same time but the format wont allow it. It seems like a knightmare to implement and personally i wouldn't bother if i were a dev. I dont want a streamlined experience, i want a fun one
@mirius4665 I don't feel the restriction. Because there's nothing restricting you from queueing all 3 roles, or just the 1/2 you feel like playing. The matches in both games arent long. If I get tired of 1 role it's not long til the games over. The game is huge and is doing amazingly! I'm not doubting it at all. But I seem to be someone who can dissociate from all the hype of marvel rivals.. AND overwatchs bad history. I look at both games as objectively as I can, and I'm probably in the minority again here too, but I'd prefer the game to be fun all of the time for a longer time, than it be super mega ultra fun sometimes, and just straight up terrible at others. I'd prefer the fun ceiling to be lowered slightly, if it means increasing the consistency of the fun. Sorry I just prefer a more streamlined experience, over a more inconsistent one. That's just the way I see it :/
Before rivals came out I was so tired about hearing how it was going to destroy overwatch. Now I won't even touch ow, they lost their chance to make it up to the community. The biggest wasted opportunity ever
I felt the same way played one game of release rivals and deleted overwatch instantly blizzard seems to be purposefully killing their game
Bought a new console so I could play Rivals. Haven’t even downloaded OW and never will. They fumbled and took us all for granted
Only reason why OW is adding 6v6 is cause of MR. It’s not a coincidence overwatch droped 6v6 three days before Marvel came out
Facts @@caseparker9389
Yeah but look what was made because of Overwatches failure. Marvel Rivals.
If Wolverine was in 5v5 Overwatch. Tank would die as a role 💀 rivals’s format allows for extremist designs to thrive where they couldn’t in a 5v5 format
Wow ur totally right I didn't think of this
Reaper is just wolverine in overwatch form
@@fuerte1300 not half as good at killing tanks, he doesn't deal % damage.
@@pixavier9746 yeah I swear ever since s9 I don't think I'm even scared of reaper anymore as a monke main. Even in the 6v6 tests when I get jumped by a reaper I take the duel 90% of the time
Honestly this is visible in Overwatch 1 as well with Wrecking Ball. Wrecking Ball is an extremist design that functions very dissimilarly to the expectations that the “tank” role usually has, and he was really fun and good at his unique role back in the first game. But unless you are a one-trick hamster, Ball has basically been a throw pick for the entirety of OW2’s life cycle because he can’t do shit to protect his team without someone else there to pick up the slack.
Overwatch was probably one of the best games to ever get released. It’s time to pass the torch to Rivals.
Too bad they killed it for a greedy cash grab “sequel.”
@@raivo1768trust me, man. It’s heart breaking. What a wonderful game gone down the drain. But I guess everything comes to an end. For me at least, I’ve retired that game (mentally) and appreciate it for what it was. Marvel rivals is a great replacement.
I had fun playing doomfist in overwatch time to play wolverine now I still enjoy overwatch it is just sad how the devs just ruined there own game if overwatch goes back to 6v6 and gets like a new logo branding I might go back but I will still also play rivals
@@si3ge856for me, the damage has been done. It’s like trying to make amends with an ex after they’ve cheated on you lol too far gone, in my opinion.
@@si3ge856 same the only way I could enjoy ow2 was mostly playing only doom but I've been playing magik and ironfist and wolverine and loving it lol
My biggest issue outside of gameplay design in OW is no content I feel like the shop update is just re colors, the arcade modes are fine for a few matches and there is no incentive to grind ranked. I've always wanted to earn something like skins or unique banners emblems charms for hitting a certain rank
Yes they should at least let one lootbox to reward in competitive and finish the battlepass per season where you can get a free skin (every skins, without the possibility to get a duplicate)
If Overwatch wants to compete against Rivals in any way, they're gonna have to bring back 6v6. It's not an option anymore.
Also need to bring in server selection for consoles and crossplay without the need to have atleast one player on PC just to queue for quick play cross play. Spent hours waiting for a game at night. Console, Asia.
@@SweetSourPickle Ngl. I've been an advocate for a feature like this for a while now.
Too little too late after all the other lies imo
That would require blizzard to back track and admit their wrong. Given the choice die or admit you were wrong, they might choose death.
I think the only way to compete os to make a new game. New graphics, new machanics, new everything. OW2 name is too tarnished to make a comeback.
I mean the OW 6v6 test also proved that 6v6 was the better format
I’m loving it. Rivals looks good too
True but the meta in it sucks and it's still lacking all the features rivals has.
Even if ow was in a really good meta rn it wouldn't matter since the past 6+ years has seen no improvement on the core gameplay (hero bans, team ups, breakable environment, etc.) That's not even mentioning the fact ow has been doing nothing with its lore (cinematics, shows) whilst rivals has hundreds if not thousands of hours worth of the stuff.
It's sad to say but even if ow wakes up and starts realizing its potential it will just be labeled as copying rivals.
Wrong, TF2 was actually the original 6v6 hero competitive shooter. All comp matches are 6v6 except highlander which is 9v9 with one of every character on each team. OW stole all their ideas from TF2, and Marvel rivals stole from OW and did it way better. So wake up
@Punchbadguy i don't disagree with anything you've said. I think I've put 40 hours into rivals and 15 min into OW since launch. My point was that you don't even have to go to another game to realize the 6v6 format is better. Now i completely agree that if OW wants a way back, they have to copy Rivals, and it may not even work. Blizzard is notorious for stealing other people's ideas so I don't know if the copying thing would matter. With that said I don't think OW comes back from this unless they improve markedly and Rivals fumbles.
@@twistedaddiction you couldn't have missed the point more of you tried. Stop being weird.
Samito looks so happy to be playing 6v6 5v5 was clearly dog poop
5 v 5 is cool, Paladins do it…they just have open que so you can go two tanks or whatever you like.
@@JamirQuestthat's why people hate on paladins
@ Paladins was the better game, the out of combat and start healing OW stole that from them. Hi-rez just don’t have the funding blizzard does that’s it.
@@JamirQuest not only is paladins a dead game hirez is almost as bad as blizzard with game design they just care about money idk if you’ve played smite 2 yet but that shows how bad they are at game design and doing what the fan base asks marvel rivals take an existing concept and made good gameplay sorry but 6v6 is the better format for options and fun gameplay loops
@ I don’t play Smite I play Paladins. Which is actually a good game, just don’t have funding. Though I get it
No one i know knew who Jeff the freakin shark was before Rivals. Promise you that
I only knew jeff before rivals because of marvel snap the phone game n no one plays that
Facts I never heard of Jeff until Rivals . Crazy because I was watching a short of Iron man watching Jeff and when he left to go on a mission he made sure the cage was locked so Jeff couldn’t get out. Plot twist : the little fucker got out💀💀💀 and hopped straight in the Hulkbuster Lmfao just doing sht
Jeff was already known about in the comic sphere
Yeah he came out in 2018 in the comics, I was like whooo? When i saw him the first time lol
Same I think the comics people always expected people knowing about these mascot like characters. Same thing happened with Howard the Duck. But the thing is marvel comics in general is about superheroes and superhero teams so a regular person reads the most known comics and main ones prob for the most part so they won't have any idea about these characters that appeared in their own separate comics or spinoff teams.
Having no role lock is such a blessing, I can flex when needed. I was able to solo carry until diamond then fill necessary roles when teammates were on par with skills
Yeah I love how when I get better at a character I don't get stuck in elo hell I actually progress as I get better on my group of ppl I play
Forget that . Look at how good the ranked system is. If you contribute more than your teammates and you still lose you only lose like 11 points. Your individual performance matters
Yeh and when you fail your first min of dps ( can happen) you switch and can be more usefull for your team. And most of time a gealer is enough so no excuse, case all hero have survavibilty kit, no one shot. Installation had more tank healer and the game is close to perfection. And optimisation plz i still have my 3050 4gb, i need to wait 6 month for 5090 so plz
All I can say is thank you for being a voice for us 6v6ers.
Should 6v6 finally fully return, I hope to see you back on the OW leaderboard.
We will carry on the fight!
I played it and noticed instantly that the characters weren't just designed to fill a spot in team comp. I could stay back as Squirrel Girl, or go in, or flank. The same on Moonknight.
I felt like I had options just within one character even before adding in team-ups. "It's not balanced" It doesn't have to be, since the premise wasn't ass.
Its crazy that even my friends who quit OW a long time ago and weren't as invested as I was said after a week or two of playiny Marvel Rivals that they have not had so much fun in a competitive game since the original overwatch release. We played overwatch 2 and they all quit after a few weeks saying it just felt bad and wasn't fun. Role queue was a fumble, but 5v5 was Justin Herbert throwing 4 interceptions into the Texans defense. It cost Blizzard everything they built up.
Same w my friend group. No one stuck around for more than a week of OW2 except me, and now they’re ALL back for Rivals. Time will tell if they stick around this time.
The thing I currently appreciate is that 6v6 is in arcade. It was evident that people enjoy the format.
Doom, hanzo, genji feels amazing.
It just makes OW2 moronic for going 5v5
sustain is annoyingly OP
Patch notes:
Soldier 76
primary fire damage is increased from 19 to 20.
Helix rocket cool down is increased from 9 to 10 seconds.
Okay. Does anyone give a crap?
They could've tweaked tanx like that until people started playing tanx.
That game jumped off the cliff. I don't think it'll ever come back from the rocky shore it landed on
7:50 I thought it was hilarious. Force feed bracardi silver to a cat and see what happens.
That soldier primary fire is actually a pretty good buff
whenever i play overwatch with my friends we only play 6v6 in arcade, and they started playing from ow2 and all agree that 6v6 is just more fun to play on all roles
Idk how blizzard expects us to go back to playing genji after playing ironfist. Also wooo! 6v6 but we have to play it thru every shit wonky meta when we all know what meta it should have been. That 6v6 still hasn’t dropped. And im done huffing the cope you could just load marvel rivals and just have fun and stop hoping to have fun
Crazy how they don’t even need colab events. All of the IPs Overwatch2 had collabed with are smaller than the Marvel IP
As someone who doesnt care about role queue or 6v6, i prefer marvel rivals because its easier to earn cosmetics and they let you do missions vs ai so you can clear them fast
Hero bans only work when you have an enormous rooster of very interesting characters.
It is the case for Rivals.
It was never the case for OW. OW is a game of one-tricks.
What created one tricks was the lack of bans, it's time to let them go through some rough matches so the game can evolve
@
One-tricks were a thing since day one lmao. That’s just straight up not true.
And bans weren’t POSSIBLE at day one just out of how few heroes there were.
i feel like hero bans work for rivals because most characters have alternative characters who play similarly not because each character is very interesting lol, almost every character has a somewhat similar alternative so u can just play the other projectile or melee character if they ever get banned... in OW for example monkey and ball are both dive tanks but play very differently from eachother most of the time. genji n tracer r both dive characters but have very different kits etc etc
@@LFanimes333all they had to do was give each team one hero ban then they can scale up to two when they get more heroes. With hero bans there’s no set meta. For example GOATS wouldn’t work if you ban either Lucio, Brig, or DVA
@@tobe.moemeka
One hero ban per team could work with open queue. It would absolutely never work with role lock, tho, per obvious.
That’s a decent enough compromise.
I am still conflicted about doing this at lower elos for OW (unlike Rivals, since the rooster will be so much larger).
Also, I hate Luna Snow that much.
My first online shooter was MW3 for the Nintendo Wii. Due to hardware limitations, it was only 5v5 instead of 6v6. At the time, I didn’t think anything of it, because it was all I knew.
Then I got BO2 for the PS3, which actually had 6v6, and I couldn’t imaging going back to 5v5.
You can see where I’m going with this. After playing OW1 since before Orisa came out, 5v5 feels so much emptier. I was against it since they revealed it. I still think there’s a lot of balancing that needs to be done, but my heart belongs to 6v6.
Blast from the past, totally forgot they had to limit it to 5v5 on Wii lol
Mine was Halo 3 then Halo Reach been into crazy chaotic online shooters ever since.
I've been playing the hell out of the OW 6v6 mode, I've been having a great time. Rivals is fun, but it just can't match what Overwatch is in 6v6. When these 6v6 tests end, I'm probably going to be playing a lot more Rivals.
What enough people aren't talking about is, it's not just OW.. I have played Apex since season 0. For the past year I have been saying that I think im tired of Apex. im just playing it because it's the best multiplayer game imo at that time. Since Rivals came out I havent touched Apex and I don't think im going back.. we needed a new FUN, mutliplayer game that doesn't feel like it's just after my Wallet
COD players as well.
Now let them optimize their coding so that it's actually fluently playable for more than 10% of the population and we are golden
Honestly, it depends on what game we are talking. LOL is 5v5 and it's the biggest game. But in shooters there's much more going on. So I'd say it depends on how much team based it is and how much clutter going on
It's only for hero shooters, other genres have different fundamentals so it doesn't apply the same way
i think map size is one of the main factors. And maps are decently big so 6v6 is alright on them. with 5v5 the game feels basically empty
Don't know much about LOL and mobas in general but having 3 distinct roles in hero shooters (tank, dps, support) makes 5v5 really awkward. Open que is another story but with role lock, you're only gonna have 1 player on one of the roles. And that they'll need to be super buffed to be any relevant to the match. That's where 5v5 fails.
Hes obv refering to hero shooters einstein
I don't think 6v6 is necessarily better than 5v5, but rather that 6v6 OPEN QUEUE is better than 5v5 ROLE LOCK. Open Queue just lends itself better to more players on the team as it promotes diversity. Rivals plays into this very well with the team ups too. On the other hand, 5v5 is already a restrictive format because it has 1 less player on each team, and on top of that role lock makes it even more restrictive. 5v5 Role lock exists purely because of the fact no one wants to play Tank. It's a bandaid solution to flawed hero design and balancing. It's a cheap, brute force solution that treats a symptom rather than a problem. THAT is the difference between Rivals 6v6 and Overwatch 5v5.
6v6 is better
SAMITO THE GOAT
5v5 is just a terrible choice for a hero shooter, it only worked for Paladins cause you could build into survivability and the other playstyles on any class. Also no role queue last time I played.
Yeah paladins went the full mile on 5v5 with the tactile kind of shop they have, different loadouts as well like tf2. it was naive and foolish to copy them when people called them a rip off to begin with. Ow had already went the full mile with 6v6 having fun off tanks and mains, it was challenging in an iq kind of way and; without the implementations paladins has, 5v5 is challenging in a cod deathmatch, mechanics, adderall sweat-fest kind of way.
I hope they do something about the no skill AOE ults.
I’m ready to put on a show!
@Le_andre2k puuure chaos!!!
@@tyrantla7120I'm biased because I'm a wanda main but without a doubt. She has the most skilled aoe ult in the game. So much you have to worry about when ulting.
Ccs (penny can literally miss a cc when your mid ult and get it before you pop)
Shields / other invulnerability abilities
Getting taken out out the sky because 5 seconds is easily enough time even with 1 person seeing you.
Even then half the roster has crazy movement abilities and they can simply outrun you
@lunatic417 all good points. I'm just not a fan of AOE ultimates in general. I play Thor, and his ult makes me feel cheap even though I get CC out of it like 1/2 the time.
Doctor strange, Luna snow, Mantis, Sue, Jeff
Marvel overall is just a better game. I didn't realize how soulless Ow2 was with zero depth. The game is so good we don't need roll que. They have bans like any game like this should have no questions asked. Wide cast of characters with decent release windows. Ow2 never stood a chance with how bad American developers have become. They couldn't balance ow in general, but somehow this game has balance. Make it make sense. I hope they keep their foot on their necks and erase ow2 from our memories for our sake. My wish list btw is Gambit, silver surfer, night crawler, Dr. Doom maybe Rogue and Ghost Rider. All harder characters to make but can be done seeing what I've already seen. If the game ever starts to get stale they can already add to preexisting characters like Magneto and Reed Richards. For example Magneto just holds jump to go straight into the air and float down, while Reed can just stretch his legs out to move a little further with 2-3 extra strides. They got em boys OW is cooked.
Cable and Nick Fury would be cool as well. Obviously we will get Deadpool at some point. Hell, Jean Grey might possibly be like Cloak and dagger Jean and Phoenix, wow
It’s so weird to see how many people outright despise OW.
Like don’t get me wrong, Blizzard is an awful company, which is directly responsible for the downfall of OW, and the game is totally cooked after the release of Rivals, at least for a long, long, time. And Blizzard totally deserves whatever aftermath they’ve brought upon themselves.
But to me it’s just sad to see a franchise beloved by so many people (including myself) die like this. I’m not happy about it like so many others are, just disappointed at Blizzard and wishing that things could’ve gone differently for the game I used to love.
@@aidanrowland611 It all starts with how they handle ow2. I'm from the days before role q. If they didn't start off telling blatant lies this game would have been received better. 4-5 years of development for what? To release the same exact characters with worse tweaks and even worse balancing. Maybe 1-2 new characters on release. Not a PVE player but that was a straight up lie. They deserve everything that is happening to them. They made enough money and it's time for that game to die. Its clearly outdated. Just the tip of the ice berg btw
It is actually my opinion that every single rank in Rivals should have hero bans. Everyone in every rank is going to ban something different. I can almost guarantee that to you. I think they can take a lesson from R6 Siege and do what's GOOD with the ban system. I hate the way bans work in Rivals. It's like playing mystery bans and I think that's stupid. It limits what you can do to make that experience better. It needs to be a back and forth system like what Siege does. Or at the very least give extra for bans and make it so you can change your ban / see what the enemy wants to ban. They desperately need to inprove that. You also don't even get to experience bans until you hit D1 or even GM3 because at D3&2 you STILL get lumped into games with Plat players. They need a hard cutoff at Diamond and deal with the increase in queue times, or give every rank the ban system. It's genuinely so frustrating that Rivals is right there on the cusp of greatness but isn't quite there yet.
lower ranked people just want to play what they want to play. you have to "earn" hero bans becuase otherwise you're going to play with pissbabies who want to one trick. of course that happens at every elo to some degree, but far less at higher ranks. banning reaper or moira in bronze (typical problem characters) would make the game unplayable for a large segment becuase they're also the highest picked characters. higher ranks are more about what works than just playing your favorite hero all the time.
There’s a brand new 5v5 hero shooter that just came out. It’s called Concord. Yeah.
When it came to the anti healing bit I think they should add more anti heals to the game
One thing my friend told me was that a potential buff to widow ult is that when fired at maxed charge it applies antiheal or a reduced healing debuff to targets hit as well as any that walks on the lingering effect on the ground. Stays in line with her ult being a semi utility ult
Ive been saying that overwatch didn't release with 6v6 out of any random thought process. It was all tested and tried before release. Im sure they tested 5v5 along with other variations but 6v6 was chosen for a reason.
I do like Rivals better currently, but I think in time the new toy syndrome will wear off and people might start picking at the game’s kind of atrocious ultimate balance. In overwatch most ults are at least somewhat skillful or require some semblance of gamesense to execute without being instantly punished, but Rivals just has a slew of huge damage AOE nonsense that feels like you don’t even have to put a single braincell into, which is pretty irritating cause the core teamfight gameplay is fun as hell
This is rivals main weak point imo, the ultimates (especially support ones)
Still great though
Yeah but besides support's you will definitely be punished for messing up an alt...what?
time and time again whenever I hear balance, I hear lets optimize the fun out of the game.
@@lostvayne9146 in this case, the support ultimates are the unfun part
@@Larg_Manso most DPS heroes can have a "All team dies" button and that's fun. But some support heroes having a "All team lives (unless they get one shot by one of the DPS Ult)" button, is not ok?
I'm all in on nerfing the ults a bit (mainly their charge rate) but just saying that they aren't fun just because they serve they're purpose at countering your attack is dumb. Fun is subjective, and support players can also have fun being (not) inmortal from time to time.
Overwatch seasons should be 3 months instead of 2, we should get a new hero every season, and we should get an Overwatch Archives style mission every season or every other season so that we still get story even though the OW2 PvE was cancelled (OW Archives missions would all be permanently playable). They can use pre-existing maps for Overwatch Archives like they did in OW1.
Content isn’t even the main issue for OW.
They cancelled PvE in order to “focus more on PvP”, but the balance and hero design of the game has just deteriorated since release.
Tank doom has so much less skill expression than dps doom.
Mercy got whatever skill expression she had left gutted season 0.
Ball was dumbed down with more maneuverability, the retractable grapple, ammo increase (the part of his kit which goes against what makes him fun), and no grapple cooldown without fireball.
Roadhog vape is resource based instead of cooldown based, so you don’t have to think as hard about when to use it. Oh, and let’s give him a trap for some reason.
Dva and Zarya lost her hero identity.
Sombra was given infinite stealth
Rein 1v1s are completely dependent on who has the better supports.
Zenyatta was made more self reliant against dives.
Season 9 literally made AIMING EASIER by both increasing projectile sizes AND hitbox sizes.
And Orisa got reworked to be even more obnoxious and unkillable.
Add all that to some VERY questionable new hero kit choices which they refuse to rework, like Mauga, Kiriko, Illari, and Lifeweaver, and you have a game where all of the fun and skill expression has slowly disappeared.
The biggest flaw for ow when they started to listen to the silver support mains compliance and whining in reddit abt dps .. they added moira + breg and added immo abilities and killed off the best hero they ever designed and turned him to a tank at the end the silver support mains still stuck there to this day and on the other hand 90% of dps mains left the game completely bc u cant kill shit
honestly, just let people play what they want to play and have fun with the game(s) you want to. not everything has to be about this > that. Rivals is so fun though, I tried playing ow and personally it felt so slow to me. But I'd never judge anyone for enjoying one over the other tbh
I remember at one point blizzard saying people thought they wanted classic WOW but they actually don't. Guess they still haven't learned their lesson
If they'll release Dracula maybe heal reduction and steals the reduced healing for personal or team heal via passive, increased when he ults? Just a suggestion 😅
Thank you for not being an elitist and saying that hero bans should be allowed to every rank. As skill level varies so does the difficulty or ease to deal with certain heroes and abilities, every rank has the right to decide for themselves what they want to go against.
When there are few heroes in a game, people become gods at them very quickly and dominate on the majority of the playerbase, making casual players leave the game. The constant stream of heroes means that people wont ever have the proper time to master the majority of the hero pool, which opens up opportunities for more casual players to have an element of surprise. Hero bans should also come to all ranks, I agree 100% on this. This game does almost everything right.
Lowkey the support ults aren’t that bad you just have to know how to counter them. I think some of them are just a little overtuned with how much healing they do like cloak and dagger and Luna. Once people get better though they’ll design comps that have team wiping ultimates like Groot+Moon knight
Brother I am thrilled to see you enjoying yourself and having fun. The voice of reason
Big dub 6v6 comes out on top no surprise to true OG overwatch players 🎉
Rivals is going to become the Fortnite of hero shooters when marvel rivals when down for maintenance the other night me and my buddies went back to play OW and holy shit it was not it
I love the fact that Rivals has no role queue. I went up against a 6 strategist comp and we were getting wrecked til we went with a 5 strategist and one dualist (they refused to mirror) setup and had to play at our peaks on each of our characters. The fact we only barely won shows that any comp can work if you play your characters well enough.
lmao or supports are just busted in marvel rivals. Gotta love ultimates that make you unkillable for 8sec or longer.
I think the anti-heal abilities should be given to vanguards, not other strategists.
Strange's E, Magneto's full powered right click, Thor's E, it makes sense that these abilities have some built in anti heal.
It makes sense too as it puts the vanguard in the healing equation.
Strategists heal, duelists DPS through the healing, and vanguards cut the healing.
Even in marvel rivals people want 2 2 2 and then start to throw when rhey dont get it
Thousands of hours on overwatch. Haven’t been back to it since rivals dropped. Never going back, even deleted it from my console. OW had its chance to give ppl the game they wanted w/ 6v6 acted like it couldn’t be done for 2 years. Then boom rivals comes out and all of sudden they can do it. Too late for me rivals is a lot better imo and I hope blizzard learns from their mistakes. Let’s go rivals!
The open queue format is so nice. I usually instalock Mantis because she is broken but can play anyone that doesn't require too much tech (this game is pretty easy if you played OW1) but one time had a game filled with the worst DPS players because I think they were all support mains so I liked how I was able to go Psylocke myself and carry. I think role lock is actually the decline of OW for sure, and it was only implemented because they couldn't listen to the community's advice on how to fix GOATS.
Not only 6v6, Marvel Rivals is just BETTER than Overwatch. Blizzard had time and wasted it.
Imo Overwatch has more polish and Marvel Rivals is more wacky and hectic. I prefer the balance and simplicity Overwatch has more over Marvel rivals but I can see how people can have more fun with marvel rivals.
@Masher64 no shit Overwatch is more polished it had 9 years to develope...
@@Zharphonix OW was more polished from day 1 dummy. OW never had the performance issues, crashes, and huge game breaking bugs that rivals does.
@@doublel8617 and where is OW now?
@ What was the point again? I think you sidestepped it.
I think more is always better. I'd be happy with 12 vs 12 or 9 vs 9 but I'll compromisse with 6 vs 6 if its all I can get.
8:40 !!! Thank you for sharing this opinion. We know how difficult it balance these games, thats why they gave us hero bans. But if thats true why give it to only a small percentage of the player base and not just give it to everyone. Each rank has issues with different character designs.giving everyone hero bans allows, again, everyone! to curate each game for a more enjoyable experience.
I LOVE MARVEL RIVALS!!! I'm so down to play it alone, unlike Ow where I had to play with friends to enjoy it!
Hope more and more people keep joining and that the game keeps having incredible stuff in its future!
I’m glad rivals is not shooting for balance but instead fun. Most games that have a big comp scene were never meant to be balanced
I do wish the healing is a bit tuned down though
you can feel it off the smile on your face when you play in 6v6. were 5v5 you loose that smile. just have hero ban's in comp only. quick play open don't need ban's. if a character gets banned a lot over time than the devs know what characters need to be looked at. The original devs said the foundation of overwatch is 6v6, what happens to the building on top of a foundation once you remove part of the foundation? it slowly crumbles an falls. just takes a while.
Honestly glad Rivals devs are not entirely listening to only big OW creators look how the game is now some characters have lost their soul due to certain changes.
As a 6v6 fan and tank player I haven't even felt the desire to play Overwatch since Marvel came out.
You are cooking with this one
I've had more fun (in OW2) playing the 6v6 test (3max 1min) mode. It's just more fun period. For the banning in MR, I'd like to see it one at a time. Where Team1 bans, Team 2 bans 2, Team1 bans -vs- simultaneous banning
11:40 It's crazy that they still have a ton of characters they can add like Galactus, Captain Marvel, Gambit, Nightcrawler, Thanos, Deadpool, etc. They're just getting started.
idk how they'd add galactus when his defining trait is big enough to eat worlds almost immediately
They really did try to gaslight the entire player base absolutely wild 😅
I only go on Overwatch to play 6v6. It's just so much infinitely better than 5v5.
Role lock is sadly the way to go though. I remember how horrendous open q was, and until I try out an open q w/ bans system, I'm 100% for 2-2-2 role lock.
Role lock is what killed ow along side other factors. I know some metas were cáncer to play against but the players had the chance choose whatever to make it work. Most of the issue was a character balance issue. If that was fixed then ow1 would have been still going.
Since the launch of rivals. For the first time since 2016, my desire to play OW is ZERO. it feels so good to finally move on. OW had their chance, and they kept blowing it.
Heroes being released in high volume like that makes a lot of sense for them to do because of the ip they are working with. There are still tons of highly anticipated characters like members of the X-men, ghost rider, Deadpool and many more. There are still so many team up opportunities along with those characters as well. Drip feeding content like overwatch would hurt this game mainly because of the team ups. It wouldn’t make sense to add Mr fantastic one season and then two seasons later add invisible woman then two seasons later the thing, two seasons later the human torch. one year later we have the fantastic four and still missing all of those anticipated characters and team ups not properly being implemented as well. They know what they’re doing.
so we all can agree its heartbreaking about what happened to overwatch 😭
I can team wipe with storm or Moonknight ult but on genji i spend the whole ult swiping at people with immorts and double pocketing
Beating a dead horse at this point. Move on.
1:32 tbh is is kinda wild you never made a vid on the 6v6 playtest all that “i genuinely love the game” overwatch talk and you dropped it like a HOT POTATO
Why should he be expected to come back when there is a better alternative. It was too late. It isn't his fault that the devs have such bad decision making, after 2 years, they decide to retry 6v6 a WEEK after their biggest potential competitor. If I was blizzard and the devs, I'd be fast tracking 6v6 to the earliest we could. And it doesn't help that the devs also accompanied it with what mist have been one of the most 'nothing' patches ever without even addressing the 1 character that was causing so many problems. So let me ask YOU, why should blizzard be entitled to us coming back to OW2 when they themselves do not care about the players OR their game.
It’s called: too late
Sweet background loop screen
If OW keeps 5v5 I have one piece of personal advice
4 roles. The Paladins strategy
1 dps
1 tank
1 flank
1 healer
1 remaining player that can just pick there best character(s)
Supports will be the downfall of mr? ig so
I honestly hope they don't add anti-healing, even as an ult. I like Ana's design, but that doesn't make me need the nade specifically.
If they’re gonna keep adding ults like Luna or mantis, then we need anti heal
How times have changed. I’ve opened Overwatch about 5 times since MR released… and I haven’t played a single match. I sit in the menu then question why I’m playing this and not MR.
It’s Crazy how many people are saying we turned our backs on OW… no, THEY turned their back on US. I’ve been playing since the OW1 beta, you don’t think I love this game? I do and it hurts to see what it is now.
I much prefer 6v6 but I think it's a big stretch to say the cool things about marvels (bans, team ups, etc) have anything to do with it being 6v6, especially because of the real lack of tank synergies. 6v6 is better but idk that marvel would be less successful rn if it was 5v5.
I played 2 matches of OW2 last night when I was drunk at 3am. Accidentally queued for 5v5. Left the match when I noticed. Then went to Arcade and queued for 6v6. Had a fun 2 matches, then I was like "ehhhhh, I am going to bed. This still isn't as good as Rivals" lmao. Oh well. It's sad tho, I can barely get through 2 OW matches before I wanna log off. Rivals ruined OW for me :(
blizzard ruined ow
I hate how halo and gears went to 4v4 sorry off topic lol
I've made the same decision myself sam. I love overwatch but after playing the 6v6 test and confirming my assumption of just how much better that format is I've decided I won't play it until 6v6 is the main mode and they add comp and bans. Rivals is simply better than overwatch atm. 6v6 and bans might be the only thing that could change that.
Can’t wait for Sam to be back next season.
I think the overwatch 6v6 test proved 6v6 was better but I guess we can't go a day without "Rivals shows up overwatch by -". Dont get me wrong the game is doing it, but Rivals is literally showing up most live service games right now. Heck, apex legends deserves to get dunked on more than overwatch but here we are.
Apex and rivals are entirely different games in every way lol. But yes apex, is god awful. I use to play it and check on it every now and then and it has not gotten better
@necrosis6037 the main things rivals is beating overwatch out on are: roster size, microtransactions, friendlyness to players not spending any money, character release rate.
All of those can also apply to apex legends. The only one that wouldn't is how bad blizzard balances for a hero team fps.
@@lesliejacoby9137 I was more referring to their gameplay and format, but yeah I agree
Never should have went to 5v5. Marvel Rivals listened to every complaint about OW and they improved on it, and they didn’t take steps around it. They knew role lock hurt not only queue times for all players, casual and competitive, it took away FUN. Their answer? Remove a member of the team and do a mass rebalance, rather than mass rebalance 3-4 heroes. Even some of the mass reworks they did are pretty much hated by either a casual or a competitive player. Zarya bubble rework is annoying for lower ranks, Orisa is annoying, doomfist is still broken. it’s been 2 years, lock tf in.
I quit Overwatch when they started the neverending see-saw of balance. I loved playing Dva but them constantly overbuffing and overnerfing her drove me crazy and I put the game down and never went back.
I think being in support of a return to open queue is jumping the gun. Like OW had issues and matchmaking problems that persisted for 3 years before the feature came out. The community had time to solve the game. Rivals is in it's infancy. I'm not rushing for a role lock in Rivals but we don't know what things are going to look like for another few years. At this time in OW1's life role lock would have been unimaginable. It wasn't until the issues became systemic within the player base themselves. Something the devs can never patch.
Nah hero bans should not exist in lower ranks for the exact reason you mentioned. Ranked is still a learning experience and if you struggle against bad Iron Fist or Scarlet Witch players so you ban them every game, then you don’t deserve to rank up.
That’s a good point actually. Noobs will never learn if they just keep banning easy to counter characters and will struggle later ranks
I turn on overwatch once a day see no one that I play with is online and then go play marvel rivals for a couple of hours.
This is my 1st hero shooter also 1st shooter on pc it has been a big learn curve but im having a blast
If overwatch reverts to what it used to be I’d want to play it so much more than marvel rivals but I have 0 faith that it will ever happen.
It could happen if the player base simply cut the game and stop paying for anything UT good luck trying to convince the moth main
You look so happy when proven right
I unistalled overwatch. And there is almost NO CHANCE I EVER touch it again. Played it for 8 years man . . .
Rivals took a shyt on overwatch.
Better game - better experience - better content - they LISTEN TO THEIR PLAYERS - on and on and on.
GOOD riddance overwatch.
once i had a game as tank in season 1 of ow2 and my team died 4 min in a row and i played 3 different tanks and we couldnt walk passed the choke i stoppped playing tank
Hero bans to all ranks are de answer to the most difficult question on hero shooters, How can we buff/ nerf the characters at X elo, without hurting the other elos. There u go, let bronze players ban scarlet witch and let GM players ban wolverine
What if we giga buffed magneto to be like he was in the show 🤯
I love how people hate on third person like Fortnite wasn’t the most played game in gaming ever, and there’s never been a marvel game in history that released in first person
Luna Snow, Jeff the Landshark and Magik, were the only characters i hadnt known of. This game has done so many heroes right, in design, kit expression, and personality. It jumped from the foundation Overwatch laid, with game design and concept; then did amazing work on the heroes.
On the topic of hero bans, if it comes to lower ranks, im quiting comp. I hate hero bans. I hate it in mobas, and its one of the reasons i dont play them. If the pros, tournaments, scrims, and high levels want it, fine; but not in my level. At mid to low levels, it breeds toxicity, and adds more limits. I shouldnt have control over what other people can or cannot play. Learning to play around your counters or the meta is a part of improving. Adding rails does not improve the game. It will be the "role lock" of Marvel Rivals.
I know it’s a unpopular opinion but I’m not a huge fan of marvel rivals I much prefer overwatch. Now 6v6 tho is indeed better, been playing 6v6 overwatch. I just wish role Que was a thing in rivals to many insta lock dps players.
Queue times make the game kinda boring, and I think it’s a bit better in rivals especially in higher ranks where people have common sense
They did a test to prove they were right about 5v5. Turns out they were horribly wrong and 6v6 popped off. Despite them trying to ruin the damn play test!
banning heroes in comp and getting demoted in rank in every new season is such an Asian thing. I played mobile legends (yeah I know) and this is the exact same design we have. We had way too many dps (range), decent number of tanks, few healers and same w/ junglers. But now the hero pool is soo large the ban pick is part of the strat where you need to ban the hero that will counter your pick or ban a hero thats meta or etc.
I'd like you to make a video explaining in depth (without constantly repeating the same thing) why role queue is a bad thing. From my perspective, role queue is the most needed thing in any game which has these 3 roles. There's not 2 ways about it. I'd really like to know why you think this. Because when you say "there's more creativity, more combinations" etc. doesn't make any sense to me, because people just want to play DPS. People being creative or whatever must only happen in high ranks. And I feel like people should understand that the game is only good without role queue at the high end.
it would simply feel restricting. If i play casual i obviously dont care that much about team composition or about winning. And in ranked people know what is a good team composition already.
And this game is gonna be huge dude. It will surely hit 100 characters in no time. Who knows what kind of kits they will have and what kind of funny combos you can make. Not to mention the whole team up mechanics making things a bit complicated. Maybe a team will want 2 or 3 team ups at the same time but the format wont allow it. It seems like a knightmare to implement and personally i wouldn't bother if i were a dev.
I dont want a streamlined experience, i want a fun one
@mirius4665 I don't feel the restriction. Because there's nothing restricting you from queueing all 3 roles, or just the 1/2 you feel like playing. The matches in both games arent long. If I get tired of 1 role it's not long til the games over.
The game is huge and is doing amazingly! I'm not doubting it at all. But I seem to be someone who can dissociate from all the hype of marvel rivals.. AND overwatchs bad history. I look at both games as objectively as I can, and I'm probably in the minority again here too, but I'd prefer the game to be fun all of the time for a longer time, than it be super mega ultra fun sometimes, and just straight up terrible at others. I'd prefer the fun ceiling to be lowered slightly, if it means increasing the consistency of the fun. Sorry I just prefer a more streamlined experience, over a more inconsistent one. That's just the way I see it :/
Ow1 already proved that 6v6 is better, all their doing is not acknowledging it