I've had my players ask if they could take a long rest in a dungeon before, and I basically tell them that they can try if they think it's safe enough. Usually that amounts to "lets try to take a short rest, and maybe that can develop into a long rest". Usually short rest is the best they can reasonably get, but sometimes not even that depending on the state of the dungeon.
That that is so right on. LOL. I have one player that every time he sees an enemy or I describe a monster he's he yells Eldritch blast. I got to the point where I almost ignore him so that I can give the rest of the players a chance to role play with the things that they encounter in dungeons. And I've explained it to him and why I do that. It's not become a joke. He'll shout Hills shout out I attack or something and I just ignore him. We all laugh about it.
DM: I gonna interpret that as you retconning severe narcolepsy into your character sheet. That sound cool to you? Player: sure, I love refreshing all my cooldowns as often as possible DM later on: aaaaaaand you just collapsed in front of the boss who deals extra damage on your weakest point, ignoring armor class with a sneak multiplier. You didn't actually think narcolepsy is an active skill did you?
I feel there's a lot of GMs that forget to RP the intelligence of a creature. Sure a Zombie will just keep going until it physically cannot continue fighting. A goblin? well it'd rather scurry away if half it's companions have been cut to ribbons, rather than just continue firing arrows. Wolves? pack animals that are.... animals. They act according to instinctual needs. are they not hungry and does not feel territory-wise threatened? they wouldn't really attack to begin with. Let alone fight to the death.
One of my favourite things the books mention iirc is different enemies reacting differently, for example if you're fighting Goblins or Orcs who aren't smart they'll cut down whoever's nearest and move on, but Hobgoblins, who are smart and trained for battle would target 1 player and when they're down stab them for good measure before moving on
One encounter I can think of was fighting a Lich. He threw all of his Zombies at the rouge to try to keep him pinned while sending 2 tanky ones at our Archer while he dealt with me personally. Leaching most of my health away.....almost died that fight for real. Level 7 with a max health of 8 was scary. I burned all of my AP (keybearer class) and just beat into him. I did just enough to knock him out. (To this day i dont know if my DM let him die. He said no but oh well i survived.)
@@HexQuesTT to be fair, sometimes you just get fucked. I've walked into a dungeon with a level 6 party, optimized for the area and had to retreat after the first battle.
My players once ended a session by taking a Long Rest in the middle of a Kobold Warren. I asked Reddit for help making devious traps for them to build during the night. The next session was fun. :3
yeah I have a party that pretty much said "we can use tiny hut." other said "yeah but we are in the dungeon!" and another "it's okay we can bottle neck them in this door and if they want to come and line up for us they can do that as well". Well guess what fella's, there is someone here who can cast dispel magic... Had most of the dungeon swarm over the bubble, around it and on top of it. Then the enemy mage cast dispel magic on the bubble from around the corner since the players couldn't see him they couldn't counter it and whammo bammo. lol fun times.
You are totally right of course. My pronunciation of the English language is lacking at times. I've also been known to make up words from time to time.😂
Don't see how the long rest could take a positive effect any more than a short rest in an area not comfortable enough to rest at nor do the pcs have an opportunity to do the tasks that of which is described in the phb. Especially not without catching a staff infection or risking to fall asleep in a dark place full of monsters.
Just had this exact situation pop up in my game.... a group of four level 3 characters were seriously hurt taking out 5 HobGoblins that were guarding Jail Cells full of slaves with only 1 entrance to the guard room.....They were smart(?) and barricaded the door from the inside trapping themselves with no way out.......3 hours into their long rest a patrol of HobGoblins found bodies from a previous fight in another room and sounded the alarm, unable to get into the Slave Cells the HobGoblins pounded at the door..... HobG: "Someone has invaded our caves, open up!" Ranger (who spoke goblin): "We know they attacked us and ran out toward the exit. We barricaded the doors so they cant come back" DM: Roll Performance for trying to pretend to be one of the Guards you just killed....... Ranger: (rolls a 19, HobG rolls a 5 to catch the bluff) Ranger: "Go kill the intruders and let us know when you do!" DM: Now roll Deception to convince the patrol that you are safer inside without their help......... Ranger: (rolls a 20) "Dont come back till you find them" DM: (rolls a 2 for the HobG Insight) HobG: "ok, we will be back " DM "Feel free to enjoy uninterrupted Long Rest......" (Face Palms )
Good tactics. Three Bugbear teams, two engage, delaying the party while the third hauls ass and reports their location so the rest of the teams can converge on that one spot with brutal efficiency.
You are very friendly and kind; I would have sent the all monsters in at night, bearing smoke-bombs and molotov-cocktails, reinforced by the Chieftain and his pet dire-wolves.
So you are telling me, I can avoid the whole levels of the dungeon by staying at one place inside the Dungeon, so they come to me. This means I should just set up traps and become the Dungeon boss and the DM becomes the player? I mean, it'd be pretty hilarious to tell the DM "roll for saving throws", or "you take x damage".
Yeah, but Strahd is also arrogantly polite and would probably let them have the long rest...as they wake up in a bunch of cells or bound to chairs at a dinner table or something.
The instant I see the title, I flashback to the first time my party took a long rest in a dungeon. We barricaded ourselves in a room with only one entrance, and I was set on guard duty due to having taken no damage in the previous fight. Lo and behold, I fall asleep at my post and the goblins decided to set a fire outside our room. Two of our players (including the one cleric) burned to death as they tried to get out, I was taken prisoner and the other two were badly wounded. Fair to say that we never sleep in dungeons again.
Depending on the languages your party knows you can also have them communicating their tactics. If they don't know the language they just hear them in their garbled language. If they do and one starts running off while having the others give presupposing attacks, could be an issue. Or their could be a chase scene that ends up like Han Solo in the Death Star.
my personal favorite spell TINYYYYY! HUT!!! love that spell... can be used for resting yes but it can also be used for hold out battles where you know where the fight will be before it happens as well as setting traps.
@@twilightgardenspresentatio6384 yes! "you all enter the cult leader's chamber after the the battle the alarm still howling and the first thing you see when you enter is 2 tall plate armored figures with greatswords, 4 people with longbows and heavy crossbows a ways behind them, and in the center between the archers is a shimmering blue dome that you can hear several voices barking orders and chanting from. roll initiative." the dreaded hidey healy buffy bubble! how will you hope to counter!?
@@Rembanspellsong not everything in the game has that and theyll have to do it through the party turtled up around and in it in a fight. counterspell waiting to happen its not like im dumb enough to put it up and say "ok everyone now we wait here until everything goes away or dies of old age~" tactics my boy! tactics!
@@freakyskull516 yes, but when the casters are preoccupied with the ritual inside the bubble, or are busy casting buff spells they can't counterspell the dispel magic (because you can only cast 1 leveled spell and a cantrip per round unless you are house ruling differently) and the hut goes away. And in your example the party would be the ones with dispel magic, and if they don't have it they are either too low for it, exhausted their spell slots earlier, or don't have a caster that picked it which is unwise for most adventuring parties.
My favorite is when the party takes a long rest.... all together.... leaving no one as a guard. You better believe something is going to happen. I don't always throw encounters in, but I do have them roll to see if they notice or hear anything. Meanwhile, someone or something is going through their bags and trying to steal something. I've had parties get mad because a member fell asleep and lost a massive diamond they had found.
@@theDMLair It only happened a few times, but it was whenever the party says they are taking a long rest, and never sets up a watch. Or I'll roll Stealth (without modifiers) against the watchers Passive Perception.
That's funny. I usually prompt my players to describe how they take a long rest. That's their chance to describe any precautions they are taking. If they don't state it, they didn't do it. 😈
"So these 5 wolves have gotten crits and we're now all bleeding internally... Can we rest?" Me: *rolls dice* "Nope, the wolves' dying cries attracted the rest of the pack."
"Roaming Monsters, their our heroes, their gonna take the party down to Zero. No more Spell slots, broken armor, no more time to...Loot and Plunder!!!" In the Song type of Captain Planet.
To quote what has somehow become my Warlock's catchphrase, "Well that was a _terrible_ idea." Stuff like this is why it's good to have a (mostly level-headed) instigator in the group. Sometimes you need someone to push the party a little bit further than they might otherwise go in order to save the day. Granted, other times he just knocks on the front door of the theives' guild you're raiding, causing a massive and deadly brawl in broad daylight, in the course of which the guild building catches fire and you only narrowly manage to avoid setting the entire district ablaze, so I guess it evens out. What? Hey, it wasn't my fault- the Wizard is the one who started chucking firebolts around all willy-nilly. In any case, just discovered the channel today and really love the videos. Looking forward to your next one.
That's really funny dude because in one of my games I had almost the same situation happen. They were going into like a Thieves Guild type building and they literally Set Fire to the building with a fireball I think it was. And they had to deal with putting it out. Anyway glad you're liking the channel dude! The next video will actually be a livestream this Friday. 😁
@@Nukestarmaster Alexander actually. We've had some conversations since then regarding the ethical use of fire magic in a populous environment, but I rather doubt he was listening. A somewhat unorthodox inspiration for a Warlock, but Alsen (my Hexblade) has a good bit of Sherlock in him I think. Not in that he's overly partial to investigation, but in that he always wants to be the most clever person in the room. Luckily, he normally is- or at least close enough to fake it. Impulsive or arrogant aren't really words I'd use to describe him, but his bravado can sometimes outweigh his good sense. Such as knocking on the front door of a thieve's guild for instance.
I love this. Instant sub. Far better content than some of these other elitist "DM guides" constantly complaining about that the players are doing wrong. This was informative and helpful and I'm looking forward to watching more of your content. Oh 1. Year old DM here 😁
Awesome! Glad you like it. Feel free to join us on Discord, too! Link in description somewhere. New and veteran DMs there with the goal of helping each other out.
thank you. my group wanted to rest but they are also in a dungeon and I wasn't sure the dungeon would still hold danger if I let it happen. With this reminder that the enemy is plotting to help. thank you again
The GM in my last game handled this really well. The first dungeon I joined in was an ancient temple to a dark force. The ancient guardians were all mindless zombies, constructs that activated when we got too close, etc. resting there wasn’t a problem. The NEXT section, deeper into the mountain, was a cavern full of Duregar. We had to use Wall of Stone spells to seal ourselves in a room to rest, then deal with the ambush outside. Finally, when we emerged from the far side of the mountain, we came out to a full-scale war between giants and dwarves. Every time we stopped to breathe, lives were lost.
This is why its good to have someone who can cast tiny hut, granted then all the enemies could surround the tiny hut, but you'll still safely get a long rest
Probably my favorite part of these videos (other than the actual story) is the various personas that Luke has to describe the dialogue with the players lol
Yes, I second that; always role-play your monsters according to their intelligence. For the hill-giant chieftain, a pretty good plan with a flaw in it like you outlined was right on target. My favorite monsters to roll-play are demons and vampires because I reason that the combination of chaotic-evil and highly intelligent means I can (and should) use any dirty trick I can think of. My players know that and will be paranoid whenever they know there is a demon or vampire about. Of course, in the case of demons, sadistic pleasure also plays a roll - so instead of killing the paladin, I tricked him into falling from grace while systematically killing all those he was sworn to protect (and in a few cases framing him for the murders then offering a huge bounty on his head, forcing him to fight good-aligned but misguided bounty-hunters).
I have a similar story from the first game I ran. One of the characters had just run into the big bad by accident and was running back to the others. They decided to hole up behind a bottleneck entrance, and after dispatching a few probing teams (zombies with bombs strapped to them), they manage to get a long rest as both sides plan their next move. The big bad commands an army of undead + elite faithful warriors. Every single enemy awaits them outside as they finish their rest. The pc's had to play it smart and the arcane tricskter casts an illusion of a huge dragon. The illusion isn't hard to see through, but the distraction gives them just enough time to burst through the wall of undead warriors. The pc's make their escape to the entrance, enemies close behind. Once they're outside they disappear into the jungle. First game and although memorable, I would've done a few things different, if I had the experience I have now. The escape should be more akin to a skill challenge and I would have the enemies try parleying or taunting them. You know, if the situation arose again.
if proper precautions are taken, you can take a long rest inside a dungeon. 1. does the rest of the dungeon know they are coming, or have they managed to relatively quietly fight in the dungeon and not have anyone run off alive? if they managed to stay quiet and not make themselves known to the rest of the dungeon, then you have to roll random encounters unless you can justify patrols inside the dungeon area they are in. 2. Are they hiding their campsite? I have seen groups that were able to disguise their campsite with magic and other skills so well that monsters with good perception walked right by the campsite and were unaware of it being there. mordenkains magnificent mansion is great for this, as I believe no one can even see the door to the extradimensional mansion unless the caster allows them too, and even if they can see it they can not enter it with out the casters permission and would have to have another caster dispel it to get the party out. if the players are smart about taking a rest, allow them to take the rest unless the dice decide that the monsters in the dungeon find them despite their precautions. if they are dumb and don't take any precautions, feel free to smash into them full force and either kill them or make them run with their tails between their legs
Assuming they can see the door to the mansion but lack a dispel magic spell, they could always just wait out the spells duration. This is assuming the spell can't be renewed from inside the mansion, even then it's just waiting for the players to get desperate for sunlight or fresh air or any other number of things.
@@novaiscool1duration is 24 hours and can't be recast from the inside if I remember right, and comes fully stocked with mundane supplies if the caster wishes it like food, water, and alcohol
This reminds me of my first campaign. I had to throw every enemy on the party at the end of the game because of how the party played their cards. It was LMOP. The Party had gone through the cave of Wave Echo and avoided the Black Spider and his bugbears. They also cleared out all enemies on the other side apart from the ghost in the library, and they also figured out how to make their gear magical for a hour. When they reached the Black Spider, the Black Spider wanted to fool them so he asked them for a deal. The Black Spider claimed all he wanted was the magical knowledge of the forge, but was unable to get it. If the party cleared the forge out he will share what he finds with them. The players also pointed out the ghost which added him to listed. They locked the Rockseeker brother back into his cell, rested and together with the bugbears cleared out the cave from enemies. It was now the Black Spider sprung his trap. He offered them a last smoke from his pipe, and then ordered remaining bugbear to kill the party. it was a total of the Black Spider, One Giant Spider, A doppleganger and seven Bugbears against 4 players. One of the players had also eaten poisoned mushrooms before the fight for the lols, but he also got 1 hit killed in the suprise attack that followed. But the players had informed The Black Spider how to make weapons and armor magical so all bugbears had magical weapon and armor now. Thats right. I TPK the whole party at the end of the campaign........ They deserved it to be honest. Greedy bastereds the whole lot.
@@garretttalbot9700 Actually. Their characters was ALL ABOUT greed. It was two players. A bard, a Rouge and two NPC followers. The Bard was all about grabbing as muhc money as possible. The Rouge was the same. His name was Looter. He even refused to rent a room in a inn to save money and rather slept on the street. There was constant fights on how to share the 100 gold they earnt. Pretty much went 70% towards the bard and Rouge and everyone else got what was left. They had to debate if they should stick with leather armor or studded leather armor because of how greedy they were. Getting some splint armor for their cleric was out of the question. I had to make the NPC's steal some loot before they took it all to afford some of the needed equipment. Trust me dude. As the DM I can justify it as much as I want as they built their characters around that concept. It had almost killed them once already. The Rouge had already been thrown into jail for 1 year and a month and only continued to be with the party to lower his sentence. In the end. It was them and not me that struck a deal with the BBEG. They had been given physical letters with orders to kill them. They had found a murdered dwarf at the entrence. They had found a tortured Dwarf that told them everything about the campaign. Didn't change anything. They didn't even try to lower the number of bugbears in each combat. Their TPK was caused by their decisions. Not mine. Their best interest was to survive. But they rather get as much gold as they can to the point they trust in the guy that wants them dead. Harry Potter does not just walk up to Voldemort and strike a deal with him without expecting to get stabbed in the back. Those characters were greedy sadists until the point they died. Trust me dude. You do not want to know what they did with the dragon cult leader after they had chased away the dragon. That is better left unsaid.
Woah woah woah! An 'adventuring day' scenario enforced? You mean the expected amount of encounters that should be able to happen before rest abuse? If you can't make it, maybe the party should rethink? A party that doesn't try and ignore that exists and tries resting every 2-3 battles to never feel taxed and abuse long rest capabilities? Because everyone forgets about HD? That's crazy talk!! I freakin love you man! Great vid. That said, there also has to be a better way than the 'first battle noises brings entire dungeon" scenario. Kind of kills how dungeon crawls work in those regards.
My group has a player that only show every other session. Which is fairly common over the years in my experience. RL happens to everyone. So, our druid and cleric decided that they would camp out for a short rest and use our missing player’s rogue to scout an unexplored corridor. (I had a mechanical swinging blade trap about halfway down, with torch sconces tilted as hints) I’m not sure if it was sneaky, or unintentional, but without any random encounters left (an almost 100% clean sweep of the dungeon) they went ADnD old school, and tried using rope lasso’s to tie off via the torches, and thoroughly tapped each 5’ square on all sides with the 10’ pole. Burning time with a purpose, and as I let it play out, I couldn’t help but laugh to myself. Of course it was devious, and tricksy on their part, so I let them burn off almost an hour before throwing the last random encounter at them. They almost got the rogue killed with the trap, and sat out the last encounter, leaving the barbarian and warlock to deal with the interruption. That’s my group…
Oh heck yeah. I was in SCA back in college. University of Michigan Ann Arbor Michigan. I don't remember all of the names and all that kind of stuff that we had because it's been so long ago. But I have several times considered going over to Michigan State University which is near me and getting involved in it again cuz it was so much fun. The helmet that I have though is horrible. It's completely connected and so when you get hit in the head it rings like a bell it's it's legitimately horrible. I think that's because it's connected into a solid Bell shape and the visor isn't on a hinge. But the shield works great. I still have my ratan 2. With like the basket Hilt and all that cool stuff.
We did this once...but had Rope Trick or some such hidden extra dimensional space to hide and rest in. We found a store room, where we could somewhat hide the rope and then rested there before continuing on.
Yeah the problem is for me making sure the situation is too dangerous for a long rest. It's very annoying when they find a safe space and just sleep. They did this twice in the same dungeon
jokes on you, we have tiny hut. that spell really screws our DM a lot, because he has two options: throw monsters at us that can dispel magic (which would probably lead to a TPK given our party is not really high enough level to deal with that) or let it happen. we also use it very sparingly, to prevent him nerfing it.
This I can get behind. Long while back before video games, players would not expect passive dungeon monsters. But video games gave people this misconception that monsters should wait “AI-off” until the players enter. Even a short rest is tricky. If I want my players to know they can rest I add a room or area in a dungeon that is clearly a “rest here” room, like a secret room or an island in a lake or a magic portal. I usually have “wandering monsters” that are effectively patrols - not the same as a random encounter - and the party running into a patrol is a big hint that this area is going to be dynamic. Even an undead area is not static - quite the opposite because the undead are attracted by noise, light and the smell of blood. I do make dungeons that tend to loop around rather than have dead ends, to avoid the easy tpk scenario. But my players know not to push their luck with taking a long rest.
Ideally, the players technically will always outsmart us... my group runs with 8 or so people. Personal favorite i ever saw was a gnome using a massive area of reproggramable illusion, to slowly wipe a camp of hill giants and hobgoblins, around... 200 in all, but only 3 giants. Worked rather well, only failing when a tower scout happened to see through it... cue flying boulders and 3 downed people inside the first round, but the horde that was about to overwhelm the frontline folks evaporated before a pair of ice storms.
Our DM had a huge dungeon we were going through. Giant labyrinth. We, as players, wanted to take a long rest, but there were some hearty roaming monsters. So, we went through and would get in hidden little rooms, nooks and crannies, and were basically making stealthy rests. However well we hid ourselves changed how likely we were to be seen.
I remember one time I was listening to a friend DM over discord (he was with players physically but his group likes to have everything heard in a special voice chat, like a podcast). The way his players set up the long rest was by using a spell to make themselves appear dead. In reality, they're sleeping comfy and all that, but from the outside it looked like 5 people had been stabbed to death. They also, cleverly, all put on what were essentially poor-mans rags to decieve any would-be thieves or mages who might get suspicious. "A mage happens by, and he sees the corpses of 5 'adventurers' who were down on their luck. He continues on".
I should clarify that this was part of a quest to free a fort from essentially bandit-mages, so there weren't any enemies besides the mages, according to the DM anyway. They took him at his word and it paid off.
Our dm let us take a long rest in a dungeon. The way we did it was having people keep watch but, more than that, since my character has a point of madness that made them a touch paranoid (honestly? Kinda within reason type of reaction given the context), so my character, the rogue and scout subclass MADE traps with all their relevant items so that they group could neither be surprised nor unable to react in time. I described the type of traps I was setting and we had a defensible area to rest within but still escape if needed. We made absolutely sure it was cleared before coming to this section. Add to that my rogue is very high for wisdom and has expertise in it and also nature and survival and dm basically just waved it all after a high roll. Nothing came for us that night. That’s how my group got a long rest in the dungeon. My character is almost always the high perception and survival character and I make sure to always try to ask questions regarding the space with an eye for good areas to take rests so my party won’t suffer. That’s how I like playing and one of the ways I enjoy contributing. It worked very nicely in this case.
in the old days of basic i seem to recall iron spikes being a regular part of adventuring equipment with the purpose of being able to jam doors for safety
This reminds me of when my players took a short rest in a kobolds warren that had already been alerted. Key differences being that it was only a short rest and that they basically barracaded themselves in a small room in a far off corner of the dungeon. I still role played the kobold leader thusly deploying groups of dragon shields from the den in the heart of the warren outward, slowly scanning the dungeon for intruders with the assistance of their giant weasels. Had my players taken a long rest I'd likely have had the groups of kobolds find the blocked room the pcs were hiding in and try to break their way in to swarm the pcs
I just decided to have any enemies that come by attack em, and after learning the party was inside the boss sent waves at them every so often during the long rest. They got a small portion of health back, but only enough to barely fight the boss, two went unconscious during the fight and the other 2 were bloodied- both under 10 health. They only won because the fighter could tank and spank just as well as the boss.
I just discovered (and subscribed) to this entertaining channel, as a long time DM, it's always nice to see other intelligent perspectives on this craft. ....Plus Lucas is pretty hot as well! Lol....
I remember when there weren't no "short rest" "long rest" stuff, and you just had to hole up someplace in the megadungeon. If the PCs had been sneaky enough, fortified the place, set watches, it might turn out okay. In the circumstances you described here, yeah no way would that work, I would have done exactly what you did. Similar situation arose in a recent campaign i was DMing, but it's on hold, so they won't get to find out if it works for them or not. In their case, they haven't really earned a long rest yet, but also it's not terribly likely their presence has put the dungeon on high alert yet. I'll probably allow it, but it won't provide much benefit as only a few spells have been cast and relatively minor injuries sustained (by the PCs anyway - their NPC companion was killed by stirges).
Not only has my group taken long rest inside dungeons before, we also split the party and did it. Half of us stayed in the dungeon while the other half camped right outside of it. We all lived and there was a small quake and that was it.
My players did the (almost) same thing. They had woken up like 10 minutes ago from a fight. I said that they could because I would throw an encounter that was very difficult at them, you see, there was a black dragon wyrmling in the next room, they had just defeated 2 mimics, which was rather easy for them. The black dragon sneaks in the room unnoticed by the bard taking watch, the bard that used shatter a few hours ago. The dragon then uses it's breath weapon against the bard and fighter. The fighter then wakes up and obliterates the dragon, he does like 80% of the dragons HP, then uses an action surge and does nearly max damage.
Once me and my group took a long rest in the hallway leading to a vampire lair. It was stupid enough, even with taking shifts, but on their shift, our rogue made the wise decision of running into the cave shouting. This is the same rogue that crit themselves with a great axe and died to a mushroom.
At one point my group had finished a section of a dungeon and decided to take a t least a short rest, because most of our spells were out, and all but 1 of us had between 2 and 4 health(I was weaakest) anyway I decided to wander off and explore because I thought it was clear. A companion ( the pretty healthy one) decided to join me. We go to a section, turn the corner, and see about 10 ish monsters in there. My companion literally just went in and assaulted them. They had an npc we needed, after all. I couldn't do anything cause my second wind ability was depleted and I couldn't regain health. I have to run all the way back, alert my teammates about the problem. We found 2 healing potions luckily , me and 1 other took it, ran all the way back ( the whole thing took about 5 turns) and realize he has somehow not only single handedly taken out the whole area, but also not taken a single scratch, even though he had mediocre armor. It could have gone much worse though... wow long comment lol plz don't report as spam
pretty much what my party did one time. Tiny Hut is an awesome tool. Not nearly as good when you are fighting smart enemies that have a caster with dispel magic lulz. My players tried this multiple times and ended up that to make it from being a "thing" I had to check them. Last time they did it in a dungeon, it had a lot of small smart enemies in there and a couple casters and when they put up the hut, they blocked the room and only the door was open. Well the Kolbolds swarmed around the bubble, and on top of the bubble, and the players were getting nervous "why would they do that, we can just kill them through the bubble" which they did a couple of them. But it was like 16 kobolds and then the caster cast dispel magic and the bubble went down, with around 5 to 6 kobolds falling on the party and them being surrounded. It was pretty interesting, they went to zero and were captured "but survived" with an important lesson that just because they think they are smart doesn't mean they are lol.
My party had an encampment system where you could gain a short rest bonus and build small fortifications over a period of 4 hours given you had the resources and the smarts to have people keep watch.
LOL You get all your hit points back, spell slots, half your maximum hit dice, and you feel fully rested and ready for another adventuring day's worth of RUclips.
Depends on the style of dungeon. I did the redone tomb of horrors (return, not ToA)... you can't do a mega dungeon like that without resting... It took us weeks in game time to finish off Acererak.
It really depends on if there's a bottleneck and taking watch shifts. Theoretically they could even take water breaks and whatnot or a method to draw the enemy out into a trap.
OOOOh my GAAAWD.... I have dealt with this SO much with one group. Sadly in none of the instances where they rested in a dungeon they never get out alive because of thoughtful planning, they got out because they got over 20 on their rolls to be alerted and just utter squashed even my sneakiest monsters chances of sneaking up on them. And yes as time went on I started giving them higher bonus' for stealth only to still utterly fail. I fudged the roll one time and it prematurely ended the session because all the players lost their shit over it.
At first, I thought that you would have obliterated them out of spite, but seeing as how they they wiped the floor with their enemies, I think you’ve handled this well.
2nd edition rope trick did the trick, no one would have any idea what happened to the party if they pull the rope up. My party had two rogues in Against the Giants, the Giants would be hit with all kinds of traps. But in that parties case, ddoor or teleport would be more appropriate.
I don't care if you said it wrong, at least you were consistent. It makes for more interesting ideas for monsters, can't just throw stuff from the monster manual all the time. Especially if you have players that have played for a long time who meta game knowing how to fight every monster.
@@theDMLair My DM started giving enemies different things, resistances or powers from other monsters and what not. Makes it more of a pain to fight some things, but keeps us guessing. It's not horribly punishing just different.
they should've set a watch assuming their party has a large enough size. I played with a party of six friends and we would make long rests over 12 hours so there were three watches comprised of teams of two and the teams of two could rouse the other players if we were attacked but because each team covered 4 hours everyone could get a long rest. my favorite thing to do when attacked while we were resting was to wake the others with the thaumaturgy cantrip, our barbarians favorite thing to do was kick people awake. Given we were playing in a world with almost no dungeons so the watches were generally set during night time somewhere in the wilderness and maybe a dungeon is a whole other affair
First session with new players in new country. Takes a long rest 2 minutes after entering a dungeon (entered to save a old man who was kidnapped to be used in a ritual). Started to panick and just said screw it. The now half dragon veteran goblin is waiting to see who was trying to stop the ritual. What happend was the ritual was to turn a tactical genius crazy goblin into a half dragon veteran. It would take 3 hours to finish the ritual. The rest was 8 hours. So halfway through 1 goblin scouted their position and ran away. The players continued to rest. After it was finished the continued. It went normally till the end. The now dragon veteran was sitting on a chair infront of the ritual blood bath while playing with a skull of a old man while facing the door. The dragon veteran played with them. Holding out on attacks till everyone wasn't able to move. I rolled a dice and the dragon veteran got bored. Killed 2 party memebrs then teleported out
good. when the party is on a clock for a ritual and decide to ignore said clock, punish them for it. monsters aren't going to just sit around and wait for the adventurers to knock down their door. They have their own timetable.
This is when you have a druid with the circle of dreams, basically giving leomund's tiny hut without any issues and giving buffs to perception and good stuffs
We had just finished the big bad in the dungeon but we were out of spells heals and had just had our fighter die. With only myself, a cleric, and a ranger left. We had no way of getting back to the surface without running into more hanieous creatures. Luckily we were both elves so we found a room and barricade the door with the corpses of our fallen and the evil necromancer plus a few redead zombies. We managed to make it through the rest and survive the ghouls that attacked us on the way up.
My problems with the Short/Long Rest aside (short version: houseruled that Long Rests do not full heal HP, but allow the use of Hit/Recovery DIce, and Medicine checks with a Healer's Kit is required for the use of one - and only one - Hit/Recovery Die during Short Rests), I really like how *Adventures in Middle Earth 5E* handles the Long Rest; during an adventure, including dungeon crawls and while traveling, the party cannot take Long Rests as a general rule. They can only do so in a place of safety (such as a town or non-hostile fortified location). EDIT: I'm honestly surprised that the players didn't assume the fleeing bugbears were going to get help. My 20+ year group has almost always left no quarter with fleeing enemies, paranoid that they would only get more help, and if even one managed to escape, they'd quickly relocate. Of course, they're also usually camping OUTSIDE the dungeon and not IN it when they have to camp, but that's a different subject... :)
I really like the idea of only being able to take long rests in safe places such as towns. It would require, of course, that I be much more careful to make sure a dungeon is doable without resting. How would you handle modules that are designed with a couple levels? It almost seems the assumption is the players would rest.
the DM Lair If it's absolutely vital that the party will need a Long Rest during a particular dungeon, you can always provide a "sanctuary" within the dungeon itself. Maybe it's an old shrine devoted to a long-forgotten Good deity where undead can't enter, or an old alchemy lab where superstitious goblinoids refuse to go into, or even something as simple as a forgotten "secret" area (super easy for nosy PCs to find, but not so easy for content, oblivious, or mindless creatures) that the current dungeon denizens never knew about. It wouldn't stop more intelligent foes from setting an ambush outside the area if they know the PCs rested there, of course, nor will it guarantee multiple nights of free rest - for example, if the superstitious goblinoids get their shaman to "uncurse" the area on the second or third day, alleviating their fears: actual magic isn't even needed as the shaman just dancing ritualistically might be enough for the other goblinoids to think that magic has been used to cleanse the room. However you decide to set up the sanctuary's lore and narrative, the PCs can be guaranteed some bit of safety within the dungeon for at least one night, or more if you feel generous. :)
I think that having an area the enemies are superstitious about is a cool idea, but how would you convey that? A lot of creatures often do not speak a language the party understands.
J Mass One way off the top of my head, at least if we're using the exact examples I sort of just threw out there, is to set it up early on by showing that the goblinoids fear magic, especially magic not under the control of their shaman. Whenever a PC casts a spell or even just drinks a potion, have the closest goblinoids react in horror, maybe causing them to suffer some penalties such as the Frightened condition. Then, when the PCs make it to the abandoned lab that clearly has been untouched (layers of dust on everything including alchemical formulas and notes scrawled in a non-Goblin language, warnings scratched on the entrance in Goblin and in rough illustrations, maybe even a goblin-made barricade of sorts preventing entry into the lab, have a Magic Mouth suddenly appear at the door and repeat its usual warnings to stay away, etc.), the PCs should be able to figure it out. If not, they'll likely have to come up with creative alternate ideas for finding a safe place nearby, but if you plan out your hints well and describe things so that the PCs can interpret the scenes the way they are meant to be understood, they are unlikely to miss the hint of a potential place for a Long Rest. Forgotten Undead-repelling temples are easier to hint at: iconography, murals, even part of a holy text (all more dust-covered than the rest of the dungeon, of course) can all but spell it out for the players. The most obvious hint would be having the undead chase them into the temple, then stopping right before the threshold and refusing to enter even if attacked at range. Use creative description to your advantage. There are countless ways to offer hints to the players that, if figured out and followed, can lead them to a reward such as a sanctuary within a dungeon.
I was running the forge of fury from tales from the yawning portal and my players wanted to take a long rest after the first two encounters in which they only fought a total of 4 monsters. In response to this, I made them be discovered and gave them a chance to role play it out as one of them was a half orc and they boarded up the door but they didn’t so I sent a party of 3 orca and an orog at them. After 1 round, they melted all but 1 monster who fled and set of over half the base while running. After this, the players followed and ended up fighting 3 more orcs and the orog followed by an ogre and 4 orcs later in the fight as they came as reinforcements that the orog called. At the end of the fight stood the monk and the fighter with a lot of orcs and an ogre at their feet, as well as 4 other players. Needles to say I let them take their well deserved long rest after this. (Note: these players were new to 5th edition as we played 2nd edition and I was teaching them 5th edition and weren’t fully aware of all they’re ability’s, but we’re still experienced enough to strategize properly in the combat). The players ended up loving the fight and were at the edge of their seat. Was it a bit much, probably, but I feel as though it was a good learning experience for them not to long rest in dungeons when they are more than capable of going on, as well as to not chance a monster deep into a populated dungeon.
We took a long rest in a dungeon once, in a room with one entrance that we blocked up and we kept watch. So our DM sent a ghost after us and it nearly killed my character (took me down to about 75% negative health with a single shot). No matter how careful you think you're being it's probably not enough unless you have some high level magic you can protect yourself with beforehand.
Yeah i like this dm style more than oh now they start hunting players. Like 2 floors? Oh well now all the monsters are waiting at the entrance of the 2nd floor cause you long rested. You lose initiative and get swarmed instantly.
@@madhatten00 6 small encounters worth of enemies mob the PCs from 2 directions. Hammer and anvil. this keeps the spellcaster from being able to AoE all of the enemies at once.
His pronunciation of chieftain makes me think of chief chin. In the R. A. Salvatore books there's a frost giant called Big Grin. Now I just picture some cyber chase hacker looking giant boss. And I like it.
Enemies know the hut shouldn't be there. They investigate and then set up a perimeter to keep an eye on it. Maybe bring in reinforcements just in case. Tiny hit isn't a long rest for free pass. Even average intelligence enemies are going to do something.
I probably wasn't clear about it, tbh. They were working together as a sort of giant kind versus little folk arrangement. But the hill giant wasn't their chief as that would be against the Ordening.
The video glitched with the wizard choking, but the audio kept playing. I was thinking that's a strong choice making the players (and viewers) stare at the now motionless wizard. Once it got to you, I backed it up to see the reactions. Mighty DM Mojo working through the internet?
This is where spells like *catnap*, *healing spirit* and *rope trick* really come into their own. Being able to take a secure short rest or get a full heal in the middle of a dungeon is invaluable. My question - how did these guys try to hide from their enemies? And did the initial skirmish interrupt the long rest?
Oh, healing spirit. You mean the crazy OP spell that is so broken it's amazing that the designers didn't see that the out of combat use of it would make even 9th level healing spells suck by comparison. That the spell we talking about? 😁
That's totally cool dude I respect that. After all I'm just one man with his own opinions like everybody else. If you all dig that stuff and you're all cool with it then Rock on. 👊
Healing spirit is supposed to heal enemies as well as allies if they are in range it is a double edged sword that may not hit it's intended target the all creatures in range part most people miss
How would the enemies know where it is? If I saw my enemy cast a spell that did something strange I would assume it would be bad for me to go through it right?
Yeah they might be lazy but the hill giant Chieftain motivated them sufficiently. Motivated as in beat half to death and threatened them with their lives. That sort of thing always seems to motivate monsters I feel. And players...😈
"Yeah, what's he gonna do? Throw the whole dungeon at us?" Famous last words.
upvoted to 69, applaud me
Mmmm maybe???
All at once
Wow, someone failed a Spot check.
Upvote at 666 likes
This is when a long rest can turn into a final rest
True that! 😈
Can't get a long rest any longer than that.
Mor like a....
*Rest In Peace*
Just a reeeeaaaally long rest
Long rest. In peace.
Step one, give them the benefits of a short rest
Step 2 roll Initiative
Gabe Parada hell yeah!
I can't wait to use this on my players.
Great idea
Roll initiative against a big ol fun encounter! 😈
I've had my players ask if they could take a long rest in a dungeon before, and I basically tell them that they can try if they think it's safe enough. Usually that amounts to "lets try to take a short rest, and maybe that can develop into a long rest". Usually short rest is the best they can reasonably get, but sometimes not even that depending on the state of the dungeon.
DM: a bunny hops out from a-
Players: *Alpha Strike!!*
DM: really..?
Players: long rest to replenish?
DM: You Just Woke Up 30 Seconds Ago!!
That that is so right on. LOL. I have one player that every time he sees an enemy or I describe a monster he's he yells Eldritch blast. I got to the point where I almost ignore him so that I can give the rest of the players a chance to role play with the things that they encounter in dungeons. And I've explained it to him and why I do that. It's not become a joke. He'll shout Hills shout out I attack or something and I just ignore him. We all laugh about it.
Hey at least there's a rule about only being able to long rest once every 24-hour cycle.
DM: I gonna interpret that as you retconning severe narcolepsy into your character sheet. That sound cool to you?
Player: sure, I love refreshing all my cooldowns as often as possible
DM later on: aaaaaaand you just collapsed in front of the boss who deals extra damage on your weakest point, ignoring armor class with a sneak multiplier. You didn't actually think narcolepsy is an active skill did you?
I feel there's a lot of GMs that forget to RP the intelligence of a creature. Sure a Zombie will just keep going until it physically cannot continue fighting. A goblin? well it'd rather scurry away if half it's companions have been cut to ribbons, rather than just continue firing arrows.
Wolves? pack animals that are.... animals. They act according to instinctual needs. are they not hungry and does not feel territory-wise threatened? they wouldn't really attack to begin with. Let alone fight to the death.
Totally agree.
One of my favourite things the books mention iirc is different enemies reacting differently, for example if you're fighting Goblins or Orcs who aren't smart they'll cut down whoever's nearest and move on, but Hobgoblins, who are smart and trained for battle would target 1 player and when they're down stab them for good measure before moving on
Yes, hobgolins are reknowned for their military strategy and tactics.
One encounter I can think of was fighting a Lich. He threw all of his Zombies at the rouge to try to keep him pinned while sending 2 tanky ones at our Archer while he dealt with me personally. Leaching most of my health away.....almost died that fight for real. Level 7 with a max health of 8 was scary. I burned all of my AP (keybearer class) and just beat into him. I did just enough to knock him out. (To this day i dont know if my DM let him die. He said no but oh well i survived.)
@@theDMLair "The only good Goblins are the ones who never come out of their stinking holes."
-Goblin Slayer
Taking long rests in dungeons is stupid!
Darkest dungeon: Am i a joke to you?
No mister Dungeon. No joke at all.
*snores contentedly*
Darkest dungeon is all about bad luck
@@francescospuntarelli7369 if you're bad at it
@@HexQuesTT to be fair, sometimes you just get fucked. I've walked into a dungeon with a level 6 party, optimized for the area and had to retreat after the first battle.
@@bongosmcdongos4190 and the narrator talks more shit
My players once ended a session by taking a Long Rest in the middle of a Kobold Warren.
I asked Reddit for help making devious traps for them to build during the night.
The next session was fun. :3
Can I get a link to that thread? This sounds like something my group would do.
Oh that sounds awesome! 😁
Link it!
That sounds awesome!
Leomunds tiny hut... they get their long rest but are completely surrounded by enemy after their rest
Oh yeah! 😈
yeah I have a party that pretty much said "we can use tiny hut." other said "yeah but we are in the dungeon!" and another "it's okay we can bottle neck them in this door and if they want to come and line up for us they can do that as well". Well guess what fella's, there is someone here who can cast dispel magic... Had most of the dungeon swarm over the bubble, around it and on top of it. Then the enemy mage cast dispel magic on the bubble from around the corner since the players couldn't see him they couldn't counter it and whammo bammo. lol fun times.
@Mitchell As Kramer would say, giddy up! 😂
That's why a wise (paranoid) wizard also cast alarm on the door leading to where they are camping.
@@mitchelltyner5670 that's why you drop all your glyph of wardings with fire balls
Chieftain = "Chief-Ten" Not "Chief-jun". Thats not a word.
You are totally right of course. My pronunciation of the English language is lacking at times. I've also been known to make up words from time to time.😂
was wondering what he was talking about.
Whade say? Whade say? 😶
I like Chief Chin. Sounds like a boss.
A boss with a big strong CHIN. 😁
I mean, if they want a long rest, they'l get a _looooong_ rest
You're not wrong...
Don't see how the long rest could take a positive effect any more than a short rest in an area not comfortable enough to rest at nor do the pcs have an opportunity to do the tasks that of which is described in the phb. Especially not without catching a staff infection or risking to fall asleep in a dark place full of monsters.
Just had this exact situation pop up in my game.... a group of four level 3 characters were seriously hurt taking out 5 HobGoblins that were guarding Jail Cells full of slaves with only 1 entrance to the guard room.....They were smart(?) and barricaded the door from the inside trapping themselves with no way out.......3 hours into their long rest a patrol of HobGoblins found bodies from a previous fight in another room and sounded the alarm, unable to get into the Slave Cells the HobGoblins pounded at the door.....
HobG: "Someone has invaded our caves, open up!"
Ranger (who spoke goblin): "We know they attacked us and ran out toward the exit. We barricaded the doors so they cant come back"
DM: Roll Performance for trying to pretend to be one of the Guards you just killed.......
Ranger: (rolls a 19, HobG rolls a 5 to catch the bluff)
Ranger: "Go kill the intruders and let us know when you do!"
DM: Now roll Deception to convince the patrol that you are safer inside without their help.........
Ranger: (rolls a 20) "Dont come back till you find them"
DM: (rolls a 2 for the HobG Insight)
HobG: "ok, we will be back "
DM "Feel free to enjoy uninterrupted Long Rest......" (Face Palms )
petitemonstre87 lululul
lol
I'd allow it in that case. They earned it.
Good tactics. Three Bugbear teams, two engage, delaying the party while the third hauls ass and reports their location so the rest of the teams can converge on that one spot with brutal efficiency.
V Star 1300 Adventures yes
If the enemies KNOW they're there and they're resting inside it... the enemies should be barricading, or looking, searching, planning.
Yep, my thoughts exactly. I chose to hunt them down. 😈
@@theDMLair it also doesnt but for them to have dogs or such with them for such occasions, bears, anything with good perception skills
Just barricade the doors, flood the room with oil and burn the party :) Why risk lives of your precious monsters :)
@@MrOdrzut "just be player characters to kill the player characters"
Who is this Chief Chin you speak of?
Related to the Crimson Chin?
Chief Chin is...well let us just say you never want to run into him in a dark alley late at night.
Well at least I know who I'm rolling next D&D session... PRAISE THE CHIN!
Bruce Campbell
"I'm just gonna take a nap in this puddle of blood that's not mine."
You are very friendly and kind; I would have sent the all monsters in at night, bearing smoke-bombs and molotov-cocktails, reinforced by the Chieftain and his pet dire-wolves.
Lmao... I do have a soft spot hidden away somewhere in my heart...
Xorn Xenophon I would use Bugs to harass them so they never get even a short rest but all the monsters rest just fine
Bugs, then bears, since they wouldnt fight the bugbears
Cheif-chan? Yep, it's cheif-chan now I will accept nothing else
I will endevor to say nothing but Cheif Chan in future videos. 😂
@@theDMLair *Chief Chan... his name is Jackie.
If you don't go to the second level, the second level comes for you.
In giant Russia, chieftain come to you
So you are telling me, I can avoid the whole levels of the dungeon by staying at one place inside the Dungeon, so they come to me. This means I should just set up traps and become the Dungeon boss and the DM becomes the player? I mean, it'd be pretty hilarious to tell the DM "roll for saving throws", or "you take x damage".
Finally I don't have to make dungeons! My players do it! 😂
The second level had the high ground!
In the middle of the dungeon? Pff, rookies
My players entered castle Ravenloft and decided to take a long rest at the entrance hall...
Yeah, but Strahd is also arrogantly polite and would probably let them have the long rest...as they wake up in a bunch of cells or bound to chairs at a dinner table or something.
The instant I see the title, I flashback to the first time my party took a long rest in a dungeon. We barricaded ourselves in a room with only one entrance, and I was set on guard duty due to having taken no damage in the previous fight. Lo and behold, I fall asleep at my post and the goblins decided to set a fire outside our room. Two of our players (including the one cleric) burned to death as they tried to get out, I was taken prisoner and the other two were badly wounded. Fair to say that we never sleep in dungeons again.
Depending on the languages your party knows you can also have them communicating their tactics. If they don't know the language they just hear them in their garbled language. If they do and one starts running off while having the others give presupposing attacks, could be an issue. Or their could be a chase scene that ends up like Han Solo in the Death Star.
my personal favorite spell
TINYYYYY! HUT!!!
love that spell... can be used for resting yes but it can also be used for hold out battles where you know where the fight will be before it happens as well as setting traps.
freakyskull516 a tiny hut ambush by npc!
@@twilightgardenspresentatio6384 yes! "you all enter the cult leader's chamber after the the battle the alarm still howling and the first thing you see when you enter is 2 tall plate armored figures with greatswords, 4 people with longbows and heavy crossbows a ways behind them, and in the center between the archers is a shimmering blue dome that you can hear several voices barking orders and chanting from. roll initiative."
the dreaded hidey healy buffy bubble! how will you hope to counter!?
@@freakyskull516that is what dispel magic is for :)
@@Rembanspellsong not everything in the game has that and theyll have to do it through the party turtled up around and in it in a fight.
counterspell waiting to happen
its not like im dumb enough to put it up and say "ok everyone now we wait here until everything goes away or dies of old age~" tactics my boy! tactics!
@@freakyskull516 yes, but when the casters are preoccupied with the ritual inside the bubble, or are busy casting buff spells they can't counterspell the dispel magic (because you can only cast 1 leveled spell and a cantrip per round unless you are house ruling differently) and the hut goes away. And in your example the party would be the ones with dispel magic, and if they don't have it they are either too low for it, exhausted their spell slots earlier, or don't have a caster that picked it which is unwise for most adventuring parties.
My favorite is when the party takes a long rest.... all together.... leaving no one as a guard. You better believe something is going to happen. I don't always throw encounters in, but I do have them roll to see if they notice or hear anything. Meanwhile, someone or something is going through their bags and trying to steal something. I've had parties get mad because a member fell asleep and lost a massive diamond they had found.
Well that's hilarious dude. How do you role-play the party member who falls asleep? Does he have to roll to like stay awake and stuff?
@@theDMLair It only happened a few times, but it was whenever the party says they are taking a long rest, and never sets up a watch. Or I'll roll Stealth (without modifiers) against the watchers Passive Perception.
That's funny. I usually prompt my players to describe how they take a long rest. That's their chance to describe any precautions they are taking. If they don't state it, they didn't do it. 😈
"So these 5 wolves have gotten crits and we're now all bleeding internally... Can we rest?"
Me: *rolls dice*
"Nope, the wolves' dying cries attracted the rest of the pack."
Physics book, java book, c/c++ books. Fellow software engineer senses tingling
I took the classes but I'm a tech writer who works in the IT department. 😁
We must defeat the Chiefchin!
LOL, good luck!
Surprise , Bruce Campbell’s chin has gained sentience and made a pact with Asmodeus
"Roaming Monsters, their our heroes, their gonna take the party down to Zero. No more Spell slots, broken armor, no more time to...Loot and Plunder!!!"
In the Song type of Captain Planet.
"You'll pay for this rolling initiative!"
@@snatchadams69 hahahahahhahaha well done good sir.
Static vs dynamic dungeon - the next level of DMing.
They gave me no choice...
To quote what has somehow become my Warlock's catchphrase, "Well that was a _terrible_ idea."
Stuff like this is why it's good to have a (mostly level-headed) instigator in the group. Sometimes you need someone to push the party a little bit further than they might otherwise go in order to save the day.
Granted, other times he just knocks on the front door of the theives' guild you're raiding, causing a massive and deadly brawl in broad daylight, in the course of which the guild building catches fire and you only narrowly manage to avoid setting the entire district ablaze, so I guess it evens out.
What? Hey, it wasn't my fault- the Wizard is the one who started chucking firebolts around all willy-nilly.
In any case, just discovered the channel today and really love the videos. Looking forward to your next one.
That's really funny dude because in one of my games I had almost the same situation happen. They were going into like a Thieves Guild type building and they literally Set Fire to the building with a fireball I think it was. And they had to deal with putting it out.
Anyway glad you're liking the channel dude! The next video will actually be a livestream this Friday. 😁
My party's fey warlock's catch phrase is "It'll be fine". Also was that wizard's name Harry Dresden?
@@Nukestarmaster
Alexander actually. We've had some conversations since then regarding the ethical use of fire magic in a populous environment, but I rather doubt he was listening.
A somewhat unorthodox inspiration for a Warlock, but Alsen (my Hexblade) has a good bit of Sherlock in him I think. Not in that he's overly partial to investigation, but in that he always wants to be the most clever person in the room. Luckily, he normally is- or at least close enough to fake it. Impulsive or arrogant aren't really words I'd use to describe him, but his bravado can sometimes outweigh his good sense. Such as knocking on the front door of a thieve's guild for instance.
I love this. Instant sub. Far better content than some of these other elitist "DM guides" constantly complaining about that the players are doing wrong. This was informative and helpful and I'm looking forward to watching more of your content. Oh 1. Year old DM here 😁
Awesome! Glad you like it. Feel free to join us on Discord, too! Link in description somewhere. New and veteran DMs there with the goal of helping each other out.
I like how you reply to comments and interact with your fan base! You seem like a great DM, and I think this is a cool channel
Thanks dude! I try to reply and interact as much as possible. Sadly there is only one of me and thousands of folks leaving comments. 😂
I think your PCs were actually geniuses luring the enemy into an ambush only to turn it back on them.
thank you. my group wanted to rest but they are also in a dungeon and I wasn't sure the dungeon would still hold danger if I let it happen. With this reminder that the enemy is plotting to help. thank you again
The GM in my last game handled this really well.
The first dungeon I joined in was an ancient temple to a dark force. The ancient guardians were all mindless zombies, constructs that activated when we got too close, etc. resting there wasn’t a problem.
The NEXT section, deeper into the mountain, was a cavern full of Duregar. We had to use Wall of Stone spells to seal ourselves in a room to rest, then deal with the ambush outside.
Finally, when we emerged from the far side of the mountain, we came out to a full-scale war between giants and dwarves. Every time we stopped to breathe, lives were lost.
They got the Elder Wand they will be fine :D
This is why its good to have someone who can cast tiny hut, granted then all the enemies could surround the tiny hut, but you'll still safely get a long rest
Probably my favorite part of these videos (other than the actual story) is the various personas that Luke has to describe the dialogue with the players lol
You wished for a long rest! Now it is time for the longest rest of all!
Lol. 😈
"you shouldn't take a long rest in the middle of a dungeon"
Leomund: *laughs in tiny hut*
Tizzandor that’s just asking to get a trap built on top of you
Yes, I second that; always role-play your monsters according to their intelligence. For the hill-giant chieftain, a pretty good plan with a flaw in it like you outlined was right on target. My favorite monsters to roll-play are demons and vampires because I reason that the combination of chaotic-evil and highly intelligent means I can (and should) use any dirty trick I can think of. My players know that and will be paranoid whenever they know there is a demon or vampire about. Of course, in the case of demons, sadistic pleasure also plays a roll - so instead of killing the paladin, I tricked him into falling from grace while systematically killing all those he was sworn to protect (and in a few cases framing him for the murders then offering a huge bounty on his head, forcing him to fight good-aligned but misguided bounty-hunters).
I have a similar story from the first game I ran. One of the characters had just run into the big bad by accident and was running back to the others. They decided to hole up behind a bottleneck entrance, and after dispatching a few probing teams (zombies with bombs strapped to them), they manage to get a long rest as both sides plan their next move.
The big bad commands an army of undead + elite faithful warriors. Every single enemy awaits them outside as they finish their rest. The pc's had to play it smart and the arcane tricskter casts an illusion of a huge dragon. The illusion isn't hard to see through, but the distraction gives them just enough time to burst through the wall of undead warriors. The pc's make their escape to the entrance, enemies close behind. Once they're outside they disappear into the jungle.
First game and although memorable, I would've done a few things different, if I had the experience I have now. The escape should be more akin to a skill challenge and I would have the enemies try parleying or taunting them. You know, if the situation arose again.
if proper precautions are taken, you can take a long rest inside a dungeon.
1. does the rest of the dungeon know they are coming, or have they managed to relatively quietly fight in the dungeon and not have anyone run off alive? if they managed to stay quiet and not make themselves known to the rest of the dungeon, then you have to roll random encounters unless you can justify patrols inside the dungeon area they are in.
2. Are they hiding their campsite? I have seen groups that were able to disguise their campsite with magic and other skills so well that monsters with good perception walked right by the campsite and were unaware of it being there. mordenkains magnificent mansion is great for this, as I believe no one can even see the door to the extradimensional mansion unless the caster allows them too, and even if they can see it they can not enter it with out the casters permission and would have to have another caster dispel it to get the party out.
if the players are smart about taking a rest, allow them to take the rest unless the dice decide that the monsters in the dungeon find them despite their precautions. if they are dumb and don't take any precautions, feel free to smash into them full force and either kill them or make them run with their tails between their legs
Assuming they can see the door to the mansion but lack a dispel magic spell, they could always just wait out the spells duration. This is assuming the spell can't be renewed from inside the mansion, even then it's just waiting for the players to get desperate for sunlight or fresh air or any other number of things.
@@novaiscool1duration is 24 hours and can't be recast from the inside if I remember right, and comes fully stocked with mundane supplies if the caster wishes it like food, water, and alcohol
This reminds me of my first campaign. I had to throw every enemy on the party at the end of the game because of how the party played their cards. It was LMOP.
The Party had gone through the cave of Wave Echo and avoided the Black Spider and his bugbears. They also cleared out all enemies on the other side apart from the ghost in the library, and they also figured out how to make their gear magical for a hour. When they reached the Black Spider, the Black Spider wanted to fool them so he asked them for a deal. The Black Spider claimed all he wanted was the magical knowledge of the forge, but was unable to get it. If the party cleared the forge out he will share what he finds with them. The players also pointed out the ghost which added him to listed. They locked the Rockseeker brother back into his cell, rested and together with the bugbears cleared out the cave from enemies. It was now the Black Spider sprung his trap.
He offered them a last smoke from his pipe, and then ordered remaining bugbear to kill the party. it was a total of the Black Spider, One Giant Spider, A doppleganger and seven Bugbears against 4 players. One of the players had also eaten poisoned mushrooms before the fight for the lols, but he also got 1 hit killed in the suprise attack that followed. But the players had informed The Black Spider how to make weapons and armor magical so all bugbears had magical weapon and armor now.
Thats right. I TPK the whole party at the end of the campaign........ They deserved it to be honest. Greedy bastereds the whole lot.
Imagine feeling justified on a TPK because your players acted in their character's best interests then calling them "greedy"
@@garretttalbot9700 Actually. Their characters was ALL ABOUT greed. It was two players. A bard, a Rouge and two NPC followers. The Bard was all about grabbing as muhc money as possible. The Rouge was the same. His name was Looter. He even refused to rent a room in a inn to save money and rather slept on the street. There was constant fights on how to share the 100 gold they earnt. Pretty much went 70% towards the bard and Rouge and everyone else got what was left. They had to debate if they should stick with leather armor or studded leather armor because of how greedy they were. Getting some splint armor for their cleric was out of the question. I had to make the NPC's steal some loot before they took it all to afford some of the needed equipment.
Trust me dude. As the DM I can justify it as much as I want as they built their characters around that concept. It had almost killed them once already. The Rouge had already been thrown into jail for 1 year and a month and only continued to be with the party to lower his sentence.
In the end. It was them and not me that struck a deal with the BBEG. They had been given physical letters with orders to kill them. They had found a murdered dwarf at the entrence. They had found a tortured Dwarf that told them everything about the campaign. Didn't change anything. They didn't even try to lower the number of bugbears in each combat. Their TPK was caused by their decisions. Not mine. Their best interest was to survive. But they rather get as much gold as they can to the point they trust in the guy that wants them dead. Harry Potter does not just walk up to Voldemort and strike a deal with him without expecting to get stabbed in the back.
Those characters were greedy sadists until the point they died. Trust me dude. You do not want to know what they did with the dragon cult leader after they had chased away the dragon. That is better left unsaid.
Woah woah woah! An 'adventuring day' scenario enforced? You mean the expected amount of encounters that should be able to happen before rest abuse? If you can't make it, maybe the party should rethink? A party that doesn't try and ignore that exists and tries resting every 2-3 battles to never feel taxed and abuse long rest capabilities? Because everyone forgets about HD? That's crazy talk!! I freakin love you man! Great vid. That said, there also has to be a better way than the 'first battle noises brings entire dungeon" scenario. Kind of kills how dungeon crawls work in those regards.
I know, not allowing rest abuse?!? Crazy talk. What DM would dare enforce such rules? LOL.
Glad you like the video. 😁
My group has a player that only show every other session. Which is fairly common over the years in my experience.
RL happens to everyone.
So, our druid and cleric decided that they would camp out for a short rest and use our missing player’s rogue to scout an unexplored corridor.
(I had a mechanical swinging blade trap about halfway down, with torch sconces tilted as hints)
I’m not sure if it was sneaky, or unintentional, but without any random encounters left (an almost 100% clean sweep of the dungeon) they went ADnD old school, and tried using rope lasso’s to tie off via the torches, and thoroughly tapped each 5’ square on all sides with the 10’ pole.
Burning time with a purpose, and as I let it play out, I couldn’t help but laugh to myself.
Of course it was devious, and tricksy on their part, so I let them burn off almost an hour before throwing the last random encounter at them.
They almost got the rogue killed with the trap, and sat out the last encounter, leaving the barbarian and warlock to deal with the interruption.
That’s my group…
Fire Giants, Hill Giants, Bugbears and a Chief Djin? Sounds like the party was screwed from the start.
I mean, the party did win...
An SCA helmet and shield just got you another subscriber.
Muirghein Seabaistian Tarot of House NOVA and Clan Confused, at your service.
Oh heck yeah. I was in SCA back in college. University of Michigan Ann Arbor Michigan. I don't remember all of the names and all that kind of stuff that we had because it's been so long ago. But I have several times considered going over to Michigan State University which is near me and getting involved in it again cuz it was so much fun. The helmet that I have though is horrible. It's completely connected and so when you get hit in the head it rings like a bell it's it's legitimately horrible. I think that's because it's connected into a solid Bell shape and the visor isn't on a hinge. But the shield works great. I still have my ratan 2. With like the basket Hilt and all that cool stuff.
@@theDMLair glue your padding in and it will reduce the bell noise... a bunch of my friends like Sir Felix were all from the MSU area.
Cool. Will need to try that... Although the ringing did motivate me to NOT get hit in the head... 😁
The answer to needing a long rest in a dungeon is to abandon it. Saves so much trouble, and is usually better than character death.
However, it takes away from the chracters free will. I say let people do what they want, and suffer the consequences.
We did this once...but had Rope Trick or some such hidden extra dimensional space to hide and rest in. We found a store room, where we could somewhat hide the rope and then rested there before continuing on.
Yeah the problem is for me making sure the situation is too dangerous for a long rest. It's very annoying when they find a safe space and just sleep. They did this twice in the same dungeon
jokes on you, we have tiny hut. that spell really screws our DM a lot, because he has two options: throw monsters at us that can dispel magic (which would probably lead to a TPK given our party is not really high enough level to deal with that) or let it happen. we also use it very sparingly, to prevent him nerfing it.
This I can get behind. Long while back before video games, players would not expect passive dungeon monsters. But video games gave people this misconception that monsters should wait “AI-off” until the players enter. Even a short rest is tricky. If I want my players to know they can rest I add a room or area in a dungeon that is clearly a “rest here” room, like a secret room or an island in a lake or a magic portal. I usually have “wandering monsters” that are effectively patrols - not the same as a random encounter - and the party running into a patrol is a big hint that this area is going to be dynamic. Even an undead area is not static - quite the opposite because the undead are attracted by noise, light and the smell of blood.
I do make dungeons that tend to loop around rather than have dead ends, to avoid the easy tpk scenario. But my players know not to push their luck with taking a long rest.
Ideally, the players technically will always outsmart us... my group runs with 8 or so people.
Personal favorite i ever saw was a gnome using a massive area of reproggramable illusion, to slowly wipe a camp of hill giants and hobgoblins, around... 200 in all, but only 3 giants. Worked rather well, only failing when a tower scout happened to see through it... cue flying boulders and 3 downed people inside the first round, but the horde that was about to overwhelm the frontline folks evaporated before a pair of ice storms.
Our DM had a huge dungeon we were going through. Giant labyrinth. We, as players, wanted to take a long rest, but there were some hearty roaming monsters. So, we went through and would get in hidden little rooms, nooks and crannies, and were basically making stealthy rests. However well we hid ourselves changed how likely we were to be seen.
I remember one time I was listening to a friend DM over discord (he was with players physically but his group likes to have everything heard in a special voice chat, like a podcast). The way his players set up the long rest was by using a spell to make themselves appear dead. In reality, they're sleeping comfy and all that, but from the outside it looked like 5 people had been stabbed to death. They also, cleverly, all put on what were essentially poor-mans rags to decieve any would-be thieves or mages who might get suspicious. "A mage happens by, and he sees the corpses of 5 'adventurers' who were down on their luck. He continues on".
That's a clever ruse!
Mice beetles and grubs won’t be fooled by that one. Nobody gets sleep, everybody gets chiggers
Goblins would loot them and cook them anyways.
I should clarify that this was part of a quest to free a fort from essentially bandit-mages, so there weren't any enemies besides the mages, according to the DM anyway. They took him at his word and it paid off.
Our dm let us take a long rest in a dungeon. The way we did it was having people keep watch but, more than that, since my character has a point of madness that made them a touch paranoid (honestly? Kinda within reason type of reaction given the context), so my character, the rogue and scout subclass MADE traps with all their relevant items so that they group could neither be surprised nor unable to react in time. I described the type of traps I was setting and we had a defensible area to rest within but still escape if needed. We made absolutely sure it was cleared before coming to this section. Add to that my rogue is very high for wisdom and has expertise in it and also nature and survival and dm basically just waved it all after a high roll. Nothing came for us that night. That’s how my group got a long rest in the dungeon. My character is almost always the high perception and survival character and I make sure to always try to ask questions regarding the space with an eye for good areas to take rests so my party won’t suffer. That’s how I like playing and one of the ways I enjoy contributing. It worked very nicely in this case.
in the old days of basic i seem to recall iron spikes being a regular part of adventuring equipment with the purpose of being able to jam doors for safety
First video I've seen on this channel. Definitely subscribing. :)
Thanks! Welcome to the Lair! 😁
That's when Tiny Hut or Galder's Tower comes in handy. Safe long rest.
Super great story telling. I look forward to watching more.
Thanks! 😁
I've done this before as a player. If you think about it having half the monsters from the next floor come up to territory you control isn't too bad
This reminds me of when my players took a short rest in a kobolds warren that had already been alerted.
Key differences being that it was only a short rest and that they basically barracaded themselves in a small room in a far off corner of the dungeon.
I still role played the kobold leader thusly deploying groups of dragon shields from the den in the heart of the warren outward, slowly scanning the dungeon for intruders with the assistance of their giant weasels.
Had my players taken a long rest I'd likely have had the groups of kobolds find the blocked room the pcs were hiding in and try to break their way in to swarm the pcs
I just decided to have any enemies that come by attack em, and after learning the party was inside the boss sent waves at them every so often during the long rest. They got a small portion of health back, but only enough to barely fight the boss, two went unconscious during the fight and the other 2 were bloodied- both under 10 health. They only won because the fighter could tank and spank just as well as the boss.
I just discovered (and subscribed) to this entertaining channel, as a long time DM, it's always nice to see other intelligent perspectives on this craft. ....Plus Lucas is pretty hot as well! Lol....
LOL
I dance in one of my videos...
the DM Lair Lol, I will have to find that one.
jarandus I completely agree, especially with that last part😈
I remember when there weren't no "short rest" "long rest" stuff, and you just had to hole up someplace in the megadungeon. If the PCs had been sneaky enough, fortified the place, set watches, it might turn out okay. In the circumstances you described here, yeah no way would that work, I would have done exactly what you did. Similar situation arose in a recent campaign i was DMing, but it's on hold, so they won't get to find out if it works for them or not. In their case, they haven't really earned a long rest yet, but also it's not terribly likely their presence has put the dungeon on high alert yet. I'll probably allow it, but it won't provide much benefit as only a few spells have been cast and relatively minor injuries sustained (by the PCs anyway - their NPC companion was killed by stirges).
Not only has my group taken long rest inside dungeons before, we also split the party and did it. Half of us stayed in the dungeon while the other half camped right outside of it. We all lived and there was a small quake and that was it.
My players did the (almost) same thing. They had woken up like 10 minutes ago from a fight. I said that they could because I would throw an encounter that was very difficult at them, you see, there was a black dragon wyrmling in the next room, they had just defeated 2 mimics, which was rather easy for them. The black dragon sneaks in the room unnoticed by the bard taking watch, the bard that used shatter a few hours ago. The dragon then uses it's breath weapon against the bard and fighter. The fighter then wakes up and obliterates the dragon, he does like 80% of the dragons HP, then uses an action surge and does nearly max damage.
Once me and my group took a long rest in the hallway leading to a vampire lair. It was stupid enough, even with taking shifts, but on their shift, our rogue made the wise decision of running into the cave shouting. This is the same rogue that crit themselves with a great axe and died to a mushroom.
At one point my group had finished a section of a dungeon and decided to take a t least a short rest, because most of our spells were out, and all but 1 of us had between 2 and 4 health(I was weaakest) anyway I decided to wander off and explore because I thought it was clear. A companion ( the pretty healthy one) decided to join me. We go to a section, turn the corner, and see about 10 ish monsters in there. My companion literally just went in and assaulted them. They had an npc we needed, after all. I couldn't do anything cause my second wind ability was depleted and I couldn't regain health. I have to run all the way back, alert my teammates about the problem. We found 2 healing potions luckily , me and 1 other took it, ran all the way back ( the whole thing took about 5 turns) and realize he has somehow not only single handedly taken out the whole area, but also not taken a single scratch, even though he had mediocre armor. It could have gone much worse though... wow long comment lol plz don't report as spam
My party and I took a long rest in a dungeon. We used a room with only one entrance and used Leopold's tiny hut to barricade the door.
If only m y players had been half as prudent... lol
pretty much what my party did one time. Tiny Hut is an awesome tool. Not nearly as good when you are fighting smart enemies that have a caster with dispel magic lulz. My players tried this multiple times and ended up that to make it from being a "thing" I had to check them. Last time they did it in a dungeon, it had a lot of small smart enemies in there and a couple casters and when they put up the hut, they blocked the room and only the door was open. Well the Kolbolds swarmed around the bubble, and on top of the bubble, and the players were getting nervous "why would they do that, we can just kill them through the bubble" which they did a couple of them. But it was like 16 kobolds and then the caster cast dispel magic and the bubble went down, with around 5 to 6 kobolds falling on the party and them being surrounded. It was pretty interesting, they went to zero and were captured "but survived" with an important lesson that just because they think they are smart doesn't mean they are lol.
My party had an encampment system where you could gain a short rest bonus and build small fortifications over a period of 4 hours given you had the resources and the smarts to have people keep watch.
The camp could be returned to again for more secure short rests provided goblins hadn't moved in behind you.
That sounds really cool and interesting man!
I took a long rest in the middle of this video...
LOL
You get all your hit points back, spell slots, half your maximum hit dice, and you feel fully rested and ready for another adventuring day's worth of RUclips.
I find it crazy that we have to have videos like this when I went into role playing expecting this kind of response to be the norm!
Depends on the style of dungeon. I did the redone tomb of horrors (return, not ToA)... you can't do a mega dungeon like that without resting... It took us weeks in game time to finish off Acererak.
It really depends on if there's a bottleneck and taking watch shifts. Theoretically they could even take water breaks and whatnot or a method to draw the enemy out into a trap.
OOOOh my GAAAWD.... I have dealt with this SO much with one group. Sadly in none of the instances where they rested in a dungeon they never get out alive because of thoughtful planning, they got out because they got over 20 on their rolls to be alerted and just utter squashed even my sneakiest monsters chances of sneaking up on them. And yes as time went on I started giving them higher bonus' for stealth only to still utterly fail. I fudged the roll one time and it prematurely ended the session because all the players lost their shit over it.
At first, I thought that you would have obliterated them out of spite, but seeing as how they they wiped the floor with their enemies, I think you’ve handled this well.
I mean I tried to obliterate them within the constraints of the enemies present within the dungeon. That counts for something, right? 😁
2nd edition rope trick did the trick, no one would have any idea what happened to the party if they pull the rope up. My party had two rogues in Against the Giants, the Giants would be hit with all kinds of traps. But in that parties case, ddoor or teleport would be more appropriate.
That Hill Giant Chieftain must have had one hell of a chin.
I don't care if you said it wrong, at least you were consistent. It makes for more interesting ideas for monsters, can't just throw stuff from the monster manual all the time. Especially if you have players that have played for a long time who meta game knowing how to fight every monster.
I often inentionally avoid saying the monsters name and I rarely show pictures of them anymore. I just describe them. It helps prevent metagaming.
@@theDMLair My DM started giving enemies different things, resistances or powers from other monsters and what not. Makes it more of a pain to fight some things, but keeps us guessing. It's not horribly punishing just different.
What about leomunds hut? *plays Illuminati theme song or whatever it’s called*
Edit: One of my teammates are also warforged... damn sentry’s rest.
they should've set a watch assuming their party has a large enough size. I played with a party of six friends and we would make long rests over 12 hours so there were three watches comprised of teams of two and the teams of two could rouse the other players if we were attacked but because each team covered 4 hours everyone could get a long rest. my favorite thing to do when attacked while we were resting was to wake the others with the thaumaturgy cantrip, our barbarians favorite thing to do was kick people awake. Given we were playing in a world with almost no dungeons so the watches were generally set during night time somewhere in the wilderness and maybe a dungeon is a whole other affair
First session with new players in new country. Takes a long rest 2 minutes after entering a dungeon (entered to save a old man who was kidnapped to be used in a ritual). Started to panick and just said screw it. The now half dragon veteran goblin is waiting to see who was trying to stop the ritual.
What happend was the ritual was to turn a tactical genius crazy goblin into a half dragon veteran. It would take 3 hours to finish the ritual. The rest was 8 hours. So halfway through 1 goblin scouted their position and ran away. The players continued to rest. After it was finished the continued. It went normally till the end. The now dragon veteran was sitting on a chair infront of the ritual blood bath while playing with a skull of a old man while facing the door. The dragon veteran played with them. Holding out on attacks till everyone wasn't able to move. I rolled a dice and the dragon veteran got bored. Killed 2 party memebrs then teleported out
The clock is always ticking! :D
good. when the party is on a clock for a ritual and decide to ignore said clock, punish them for it. monsters aren't going to just sit around and wait for the adventurers to knock down their door. They have their own timetable.
New players and you pull that? Good job asshole
Not sure what edition they played but why not use leomands tiny hut plus alarm plus greater invisibility?
LEDs are looking sick mate :)
Thanks dude! 👊
This is when you have a druid with the circle of dreams, basically giving leomund's tiny hut without any issues and giving buffs to perception and good stuffs
We had just finished the big bad in the dungeon but we were out of spells heals and had just had our fighter die. With only myself, a cleric, and a ranger left. We had no way of getting back to the surface without running into more hanieous creatures. Luckily we were both elves so we found a room and barricade the door with the corpses of our fallen and the evil necromancer plus a few redead zombies. We managed to make it through the rest and survive the ghouls that attacked us on the way up.
My problems with the Short/Long Rest aside (short version: houseruled that Long Rests do not full heal HP, but allow the use of Hit/Recovery DIce, and Medicine checks with a Healer's Kit is required for the use of one - and only one - Hit/Recovery Die during Short Rests), I really like how *Adventures in Middle Earth 5E* handles the Long Rest; during an adventure, including dungeon crawls and while traveling, the party cannot take Long Rests as a general rule. They can only do so in a place of safety (such as a town or non-hostile fortified location).
EDIT: I'm honestly surprised that the players didn't assume the fleeing bugbears were going to get help. My 20+ year group has almost always left no quarter with fleeing enemies, paranoid that they would only get more help, and if even one managed to escape, they'd quickly relocate. Of course, they're also usually camping OUTSIDE the dungeon and not IN it when they have to camp, but that's a different subject... :)
I really like the idea of only being able to take long rests in safe places such as towns. It would require, of course, that I be much more careful to make sure a dungeon is doable without resting. How would you handle modules that are designed with a couple levels? It almost seems the assumption is the players would rest.
the DM Lair
If it's absolutely vital that the party will need a Long Rest during a particular dungeon, you can always provide a "sanctuary" within the dungeon itself. Maybe it's an old shrine devoted to a long-forgotten Good deity where undead can't enter, or an old alchemy lab where superstitious goblinoids refuse to go into, or even something as simple as a forgotten "secret" area (super easy for nosy PCs to find, but not so easy for content, oblivious, or mindless creatures) that the current dungeon denizens never knew about. It wouldn't stop more intelligent foes from setting an ambush outside the area if they know the PCs rested there, of course, nor will it guarantee multiple nights of free rest - for example, if the superstitious goblinoids get their shaman to "uncurse" the area on the second or third day, alleviating their fears: actual magic isn't even needed as the shaman just dancing ritualistically might be enough for the other goblinoids to think that magic has been used to cleanse the room. However you decide to set up the sanctuary's lore and narrative, the PCs can be guaranteed some bit of safety within the dungeon for at least one night, or more if you feel generous. :)
I think that having an area the enemies are superstitious about is a cool idea, but how would you convey that? A lot of creatures often do not speak a language the party understands.
J Mass
One way off the top of my head, at least if we're using the exact examples I sort of just threw out there, is to set it up early on by showing that the goblinoids fear magic, especially magic not under the control of their shaman. Whenever a PC casts a spell or even just drinks a potion, have the closest goblinoids react in horror, maybe causing them to suffer some penalties such as the Frightened condition. Then, when the PCs make it to the abandoned lab that clearly has been untouched (layers of dust on everything including alchemical formulas and notes scrawled in a non-Goblin language, warnings scratched on the entrance in Goblin and in rough illustrations, maybe even a goblin-made barricade of sorts preventing entry into the lab, have a Magic Mouth suddenly appear at the door and repeat its usual warnings to stay away, etc.), the PCs should be able to figure it out. If not, they'll likely have to come up with creative alternate ideas for finding a safe place nearby, but if you plan out your hints well and describe things so that the PCs can interpret the scenes the way they are meant to be understood, they are unlikely to miss the hint of a potential place for a Long Rest.
Forgotten Undead-repelling temples are easier to hint at: iconography, murals, even part of a holy text (all more dust-covered than the rest of the dungeon, of course) can all but spell it out for the players. The most obvious hint would be having the undead chase them into the temple, then stopping right before the threshold and refusing to enter even if attacked at range.
Use creative description to your advantage. There are countless ways to offer hints to the players that, if figured out and followed, can lead them to a reward such as a sanctuary within a dungeon.
In the old dayz, we had to sleep in the dungeon! Spike the doors, set watches, pray!
How do you do this in tomb of the nine gods? Just checking for ideas thanks
I was running the forge of fury from tales from the yawning portal and my players wanted to take a long rest after the first two encounters in which they only fought a total of 4 monsters. In response to this, I made them be discovered and gave them a chance to role play it out as one of them was a half orc and they boarded up the door but they didn’t so I sent a party of 3 orca and an orog at them. After 1 round, they melted all but 1 monster who fled and set of over half the base while running. After this, the players followed and ended up fighting 3 more orcs and the orog followed by an ogre and 4 orcs later in the fight as they came as reinforcements that the orog called. At the end of the fight stood the monk and the fighter with a lot of orcs and an ogre at their feet, as well as 4 other players. Needles to say I let them take their well deserved long rest after this. (Note: these players were new to 5th edition as we played 2nd edition and I was teaching them 5th edition and weren’t fully aware of all they’re ability’s, but we’re still experienced enough to strategize properly in the combat). The players ended up loving the fight and were at the edge of their seat. Was it a bit much, probably, but I feel as though it was a good learning experience for them not to long rest in dungeons when they are more than capable of going on, as well as to not chance a monster deep into a populated dungeon.
We took a long rest in a dungeon once, in a room with one entrance that we blocked up and we kept watch. So our DM sent a ghost after us and it nearly killed my character (took me down to about 75% negative health with a single shot). No matter how careful you think you're being it's probably not enough unless you have some high level magic you can protect yourself with beforehand.
I dont consider 4 giants and a bunch of lesser monsters to be "The whole dungeon" that only really seems like 1 group our of maybe 3 or 4...
It was literally every combatant left in the dungeon, so I can assure you, it was everything the dungeon had left to throw at them.
My players that take a long rest in the middle of the dungeon will often find a mob of enemies waiting for them
Cold hearted and ruthless. I love it. 😸
Yeah i like this dm style more than oh now they start hunting players. Like 2 floors? Oh well now all the monsters are waiting at the entrance of the 2nd floor cause you long rested. You lose initiative and get swarmed instantly.
@@madhatten00 6 small encounters worth of enemies mob the PCs from 2 directions. Hammer and anvil.
this keeps the spellcaster from being able to AoE all of the enemies at once.
His pronunciation of chieftain makes me think of chief chin. In the R. A. Salvatore books there's a frost giant called Big Grin. Now I just picture some cyber chase hacker looking giant boss. And I like it.
I have a video that gives the story of Chief Chin acrually...
Love Salvatores books btw. And i remember Big Grin. 😁
What do you do of they use spells like tiny hut? I can never find a way to ambush them because of this
Enemies know the hut shouldn't be there. They investigate and then set up a perimeter to keep an eye on it. Maybe bring in reinforcements just in case. Tiny hit isn't a long rest for free pass. Even average intelligence enemies are going to do something.
I'm still trying to figure out how a hill giant is chief to multiple fire giants.
Is the hill giant their chief?
@@theDMLair Maybe I misunderstood, but it sounded like you said the Hill Giant Chieftain was ordering around the Fire Giants.
I probably wasn't clear about it, tbh. They were working together as a sort of giant kind versus little folk arrangement. But the hill giant wasn't their chief as that would be against the Ordening.
The video glitched with the wizard choking, but the audio kept playing. I was thinking that's a strong choice making the players (and viewers) stare at the now motionless wizard. Once it got to you, I backed it up to see the reactions. Mighty DM Mojo working through the internet?
The powers of the DM do transcend the table after all... 😈
Let no wizard question my power!!! [Insert evil laughter here]
@@theDMLair Those uppity wizards, can't live with 'em...
No, but you sure can DM force choke them. 😈
@@theDMLairas long as you don't make a habit of force choking them for trying to be clever
This is where spells like *catnap*, *healing spirit* and *rope trick* really come into their own. Being able to take a secure short rest or get a full heal in the middle of a dungeon is invaluable. My question - how did these guys try to hide from their enemies? And did the initial skirmish interrupt the long rest?
Oh, healing spirit. You mean the crazy OP spell that is so broken it's amazing that the designers didn't see that the out of combat use of it would make even 9th level healing spells suck by comparison. That the spell we talking about? 😁
@@theDMLair I hold a somewhat...contrarian view on healing spirit, both as a player and a DM. :)
That's totally cool dude I respect that. After all I'm just one man with his own opinions like everybody else. If you all dig that stuff and you're all cool with it then Rock on. 👊
Healing spirit is supposed to heal enemies as well as allies if they are in range it is a double edged sword that may not hit it's intended target the all creatures in range part most people miss
How would the enemies know where it is? If I saw my enemy cast a spell that did something strange I would assume it would be bad for me to go through it right?
There was one flaw in this plan the giant chieftain tried to do.
Bugbears are lazy af.
Yeah they might be lazy but the hill giant Chieftain motivated them sufficiently. Motivated as in beat half to death and threatened them with their lives. That sort of thing always seems to motivate monsters I feel. And players...😈