As a prot pally main who has been playing the class for over 10 years, I can say on beta, I love it so far. As a tank, your job is not DPS which is something most tank players forget.
Glad to hear you're loving it! I'm glad there's multiple playstyles on the different tanks that appeal to different players. I agree mostly that DPS is not a tank's job, but there are some scenarios where tank damage can make a difference. But if you're dying or not properly controlling the pull, then it doesn't matter how much damage you do.
When you Bonestorm, and lose all your Bone Shield stacks, you're only really in danger for 1-2 secs. Because losing a bone shield has an internal cd of 2.5 sec, so you can't instantly lose multiple stacks and die randomly if you have more than 1. The problem is that the 4set wants you to have max bone shield at all times, so losing all when you're doing big aoe is pretty counter productive.
After playing with it a lot over the weekend I think I was overestimating how much danger using it puts you in. I'm going to talk about it in my video on Blood DK (which I'm hoping to finish tonight). It does have the unfortunate downside with the tier set that you noted, and there's an issue (possibly a bug) where it doesn't give you any CDR on Dancing Rune Weapon for the charges it consumes. I suspect that may be intended because getting 50 seconds lopped off the CD of DRW every time you use Boneshield would be insanely broken, but I've reported it anyway.
Monk and DK have very different playstyles and feel very different. If you want a change of pace, Brewmaster would definitely provide that. It has a very smooth incoming damage profile, pretty much the opposite end of the spectrum compared to Blood. Blood has much stronger self healing though, so if you like the way Death Strike keeps you fully in charge of your survival, Monk doesn't quite have that. Monk's self healing is generally good but not great, and tbh it feels a bit underpowered in the beta right now. But that could be due to gear scaling--gear is set to ilvl 580 in keys, which is equivalent to heroic dungeon drops.
Yes that's true and fine, I more meant that having an interesting tier set is a big point in favor of Monk for me because of that context. Thanks for the comment!
very good video. can you do a brewmaster whole key video with your thoughts on top as well as explanation of the details hps and dps at the end? i think brewmaster deserves some highlighting due to being last for the past forever.
I'll definitely consider this! I'm working on videos giving a deeper look at each of the tank specs right now starting with Blood DK, but doing things like a key overview + discussion is interesting to me for sure if there's demand for it!
So assuming you're talking about the part when I was talking about the Bonestorm changes; using the ability consumes all (up to 12) of your charges. It does refund all of the charges you spent at a rate of 1 per second, but that puts you in a spot where you have to choose to either spend runes on Marrowrend immediately to generate some charges (and then waste the last few charges that get refunded from Bonestorm once you're back up to 12), or sit on low charges and wait for them to be refunded 1 at a time, which is very dangerous in large pulls. I think it's an improvement overall and at the end of the day you probably just opt to have the "wasted" refunds at the end of it, but I also think it could use another look from a balancing perspective because it feels weird as it is.
@@ThordrenekGaming I agree that the design isn't great, but my confusion comes from: with the fact that you can't lose a charge of bone shield more than once every 2.5sec, isn't it fine to just sit at low bone shield charges and let them go up second by second? I don't think having the extra RP cost to death strike and having a tiny bit less hp (if you are even playing that) is that bad?
I'm not sure, the racial feels very awkward to use for Brew and I haven't directly tested if you can still avoid damage while using it. I would guess not but I'll try to intentionally test it at some point.
Blizz is reworking almost all class trees (left side) and some specs are already reworked or being reworked (right side) and blood DKs are one the most remade I think thats why they look good. Prot warr still untouched I think - still bloated imo, it needs more passive options to active abilities. Guardian druid untouched and has pathing issues with arcane build which forces you to go right side and still pick some talents on the left side and there is not enough talent points for this. Prot paladin looks good, feels more modern. I on the other hand like the aesthethics and blocking mechanic, compared to warrior prot paladin feels like a complete spec. DH is already OP as hell and has full toolkit so not much reaosn to change anything there. Im interested in monk now that its simplified a bit.
Prot Warrior's spec tree has received one change and it was slapping Dance of Death and Storm of Steel into a choice node instead of being separate nodes under Ravager. I don't think either will see much use because the spec tree does indeed feel hard to path down. The class tree did get some good changes even though it's not perfect; but moving Shockwave up significantly in the tree was a great move at least. I think if they made the 2-point nodes that block access down the capstone tier into 1-point nodes the class tree would feel much better but I don't think they want you taking all three of Thunderous Roar, Avatar, and Champion's Spear, so I don't see that happening. The Guardian spec tree feels pretty bad and needs a lot of work. When they gave it a look early in Dragonflight (sometime around 10.1.5 I think?) they did NOT improve it IMO. But then Bear was busted that season because of it's tier set and rage generation scaling, which was then nerfed, so it's been overlooked since then :/ The Druid class tree is very much improved but it's still in a very "meh" state where you have to take a lot of talents you can't even make use of to path down to things that are mandatory. That bit needs some big changes. Thanks for the comment and the feedback! :)
If you go to the details page on curseforge then the Files section, there's an option to "Show alpha files". I downloaded the latest version for 11.0.0 and it's worked. I've heard some other people were having trouble with it but I haven't had any errors related to it. Hope that helps!
well looks like i can actual play Prot war again and not feel like im being bullied by every thing tho hope they give us a lil more to help with magic def thats our biggest drawl back currently is very lil in respect of magic stop "ik ik we have spell reflect but lets be real its barely half a def vs some things lol"
Spell reflect feels amazing for one spell and then you're back to being squishy. There's the Spell Block talent too but taking it feels rough and then it goes on CD too.
I want to move away from DH I think, even though I've been maining it since Shadowlands and I'm not a fotm reroller. I think my old main of Guardian might come back. Lunar bear looks fucking sick!
@@ThordrenekGaming just thought it is strange to give yourself a bad look at the start. Some may take that as a "you don't know what you are talking about" and stop there. But its a really good video
Prot pally and Bear both feel awful on beta. If i main bear again i will play bear without hero talents both are dull and boring along with the spec tree is pathetic. The class tree to have to pick Cyclone and soothe just to be able to get stamp roar is stupid blizz have no idea and continue to make bear dull. They could do some amazing things with pulverize or something like that which is a dead talent but dont.
Yeah the spec tree is in a terrible state for Guardian. While I think the class tree is much improved from the current Dragonflight iteration, it still needs a very serious look as there's way too many wasted talent points, and I think a tree as bloated as the Druid tree is should have no two-point-nodes at all.
They realy should fix prot pali heal , cause the scaling with the current hp doesnt do it , they messed it up , pali right now just need haste and world of glory heal increase and it can compete again with other tanks , i hope they adress this issue cause the class feel very fun to play specialy cause of the amount of utility you can bring , i was able to heal people and myself in DF , and felt completly in control on my runs , if someone mess up or everyone got very low i could easily top my healer so he can focus on others , thats the best thing about pali , i don't realy care about the rotation , i just love the utility it can bring to every scenario.
@@Jisei13 thats the nature of prot paladin , always was , its a fantasy game not a job , all other tanks have self heal , what u on about lol , dh can self heal with orbs , dk can self heal to full also , monk have tons of shields and sustain , warrior is very bulky that he takes almost no physical damage with ignore pain and critical block , and paladin have 60k increased armor ? yeah sounds fair, also forgot that druid that have also huge heal %
@@sharkstaint1373 I didn't mention self heal for palas but all tanks so half your paragraphs irrelevant but also tanks shouldn't heal DKs maybe as it's their entire mitigation but there's no reason for tanks to heal at all.
@@Jisei13 so your telling me my runs depends on how good a healer is ? its a very bad take lad , look at tanks in gw2 and ff 14 , all have self heals and none need healing almost , i respect your opinion , but its very wrong.
As a prot pally main who has been playing the class for over 10 years, I can say on beta, I love it so far. As a tank, your job is not DPS which is something most tank players forget.
Glad to hear you're loving it! I'm glad there's multiple playstyles on the different tanks that appeal to different players.
I agree mostly that DPS is not a tank's job, but there are some scenarios where tank damage can make a difference. But if you're dying or not properly controlling the pull, then it doesn't matter how much damage you do.
@@ThordrenekGaming agreed. The keyword you nailed was "control".
Thanks, reaffirming my decision to give a monk a shott this expac with a simplified toolkit
I'm in between BDK and BRM for a tank alt.
When you Bonestorm, and lose all your Bone Shield stacks, you're only really in danger for 1-2 secs. Because losing a bone shield has an internal cd of 2.5 sec, so you can't instantly lose multiple stacks and die randomly if you have more than 1. The problem is that the 4set wants you to have max bone shield at all times, so losing all when you're doing big aoe is pretty counter productive.
After playing with it a lot over the weekend I think I was overestimating how much danger using it puts you in. I'm going to talk about it in my video on Blood DK (which I'm hoping to finish tonight). It does have the unfortunate downside with the tier set that you noted, and there's an issue (possibly a bug) where it doesn't give you any CDR on Dancing Rune Weapon for the charges it consumes. I suspect that may be intended because getting 50 seconds lopped off the CD of DRW every time you use Boneshield would be insanely broken, but I've reported it anyway.
What are your thoughts on dk vs monk? I usually swap between dps and tank and am thinking of switching off my dk for the first time ever.
Monk and DK have very different playstyles and feel very different. If you want a change of pace, Brewmaster would definitely provide that. It has a very smooth incoming damage profile, pretty much the opposite end of the spectrum compared to Blood.
Blood has much stronger self healing though, so if you like the way Death Strike keeps you fully in charge of your survival, Monk doesn't quite have that. Monk's self healing is generally good but not great, and tbh it feels a bit underpowered in the beta right now. But that could be due to gear scaling--gear is set to ilvl 580 in keys, which is equivalent to heroic dungeon drops.
I agree a lot of tier sets are underwhelming but blizzard also said this was intentional because they want more focus on hero talents in season 1
Yes that's true and fine, I more meant that having an interesting tier set is a big point in favor of Monk for me because of that context.
Thanks for the comment!
very good video. can you do a brewmaster whole key video with your thoughts on top as well as explanation of the details hps and dps at the end? i think brewmaster deserves some highlighting due to being last for the past forever.
I'll definitely consider this! I'm working on videos giving a deeper look at each of the tank specs right now starting with Blood DK, but doing things like a key overview + discussion is interesting to me for sure if there's demand for it!
@@ThordrenekGaming how about a tier list?
I go for prot warrior i was main prot pala but the hammer fucked up and the consecration
Why would you not be able to sit at 3-4 bone shield charges? Because of Ossuary and Foul Bulwark?
So assuming you're talking about the part when I was talking about the Bonestorm changes; using the ability consumes all (up to 12) of your charges. It does refund all of the charges you spent at a rate of 1 per second, but that puts you in a spot where you have to choose to either spend runes on Marrowrend immediately to generate some charges (and then waste the last few charges that get refunded from Bonestorm once you're back up to 12), or sit on low charges and wait for them to be refunded 1 at a time, which is very dangerous in large pulls.
I think it's an improvement overall and at the end of the day you probably just opt to have the "wasted" refunds at the end of it, but I also think it could use another look from a balancing perspective because it feels weird as it is.
@@ThordrenekGaming I agree that the design isn't great, but my confusion comes from: with the fact that you can't lose a charge of bone shield more than once every 2.5sec, isn't it fine to just sit at low bone shield charges and let them go up second by second? I don't think having the extra RP cost to death strike and having a tiny bit less hp (if you are even playing that) is that bad?
Thoughts on demon hunter after sigil nerf? If you've tested of course.
I haven't tested DH since the sigil nerf. I'm planning to do a full video on VDH after I do the Brew and Guardian videos though!
sadly unless they make bonestorm do what Abomb use to do or make it work with shatter passive I just don't see it being used in high keys.
Yeah it's very high risk. It does a lot of damage but if you can't live when using it that doesn't really matter. We'll see how balancing goes!
As someone planning to main warrior I initially got worried when I saw it had very little time dedicated to it 😂
I'll be doing a full video for each tank and Warrior will be near the beginning of that :) (maybe even the first)
@@ThordrenekGaming awww so cool. I’m new to your content and I love your style. Will be subscribing and looking out for that vid.
Thor!!! 💪💪
I saw you played BM monk as earthen, can you dodge/parry while channeling their racial? For some reason I cant create earthen characters on beta.
I'm not sure, the racial feels very awkward to use for Brew and I haven't directly tested if you can still avoid damage while using it. I would guess not but I'll try to intentionally test it at some point.
@@ThordrenekGaming please test it of you have time. 10% armor passive is clearly tank oriented and active damage racials have been bad since forever
Blizz is reworking almost all class trees (left side) and some specs are already reworked or being reworked (right side) and blood DKs are one the most remade I think thats why they look good. Prot warr still untouched I think - still bloated imo, it needs more passive options to active abilities.
Guardian druid untouched and has pathing issues with arcane build which forces you to go right side and still pick some talents on the left side and there is not enough talent points for this.
Prot paladin looks good, feels more modern. I on the other hand like the aesthethics and blocking mechanic, compared to warrior prot paladin feels like a complete spec.
DH is already OP as hell and has full toolkit so not much reaosn to change anything there.
Im interested in monk now that its simplified a bit.
Prot Warrior's spec tree has received one change and it was slapping Dance of Death and Storm of Steel into a choice node instead of being separate nodes under Ravager. I don't think either will see much use because the spec tree does indeed feel hard to path down.
The class tree did get some good changes even though it's not perfect; but moving Shockwave up significantly in the tree was a great move at least. I think if they made the 2-point nodes that block access down the capstone tier into 1-point nodes the class tree would feel much better but I don't think they want you taking all three of Thunderous Roar, Avatar, and Champion's Spear, so I don't see that happening.
The Guardian spec tree feels pretty bad and needs a lot of work. When they gave it a look early in Dragonflight (sometime around 10.1.5 I think?) they did NOT improve it IMO. But then Bear was busted that season because of it's tier set and rage generation scaling, which was then nerfed, so it's been overlooked since then :/ The Druid class tree is very much improved but it's still in a very "meh" state where you have to take a lot of talents you can't even make use of to path down to things that are mandatory. That bit needs some big changes.
Thanks for the comment and the feedback! :)
they need to make bonestorm heal you so much that u dont die while using it
They need to do something about it for sure.
how can I have details in beta?
If you go to the details page on curseforge then the Files section, there's an option to "Show alpha files". I downloaded the latest version for 11.0.0 and it's worked. I've heard some other people were having trouble with it but I haven't had any errors related to it.
Hope that helps!
well looks like i can actual play Prot war again and not feel like im being bullied by every thing tho hope they give us a lil more to help with magic def thats our biggest drawl back currently is very lil in respect of magic stop "ik ik we have spell reflect but lets be real its barely half a def vs some things lol"
Spell reflect feels amazing for one spell and then you're back to being squishy. There's the Spell Block talent too but taking it feels rough and then it goes on CD too.
@@ThordrenekGaming yea unfort i dont think war will ever be able to tank magic sense we are such good meat shields for melee swings lol
Prot paladin feels extra bad on the beta because the gear has hardly any haste on it, so getting 5 holy power for Templar feels like such a struggle.
This is a good point, I'll take that into consideration when I review it for sure!
I want to move away from DH I think, even though I've been maining it since Shadowlands and I'm not a fotm reroller. I think my old main of Guardian might come back. Lunar bear looks fucking sick!
Yeah Lunar Bear was suuuper fun to play. Really looking forward to giving that more time!
don't worry, i think im pretty far from prot paladin right now
It's okay our raid will be 55% Rets anyway.
@@ThordrenekGamingis ret looking good?
Looking better than it is now,and its currently a beast in mythic+@@stephenmaitland2228
@@stephenmaitland2228 ret is looking amazing as of right now. not as good as the other bad friendly class tho. hunters are looking SSS tier
Why did you start the video with you failing the tank mechanic in mists?
Eh, I hadn't run Mists since Shadowlands. Not trying to pretend I don't make mistakes.
@@ThordrenekGaming just thought it is strange to give yourself a bad look at the start. Some may take that as a "you don't know what you are talking about" and stop there. But its a really good video
That's fair. I do think it's useful to know how hard that ability hits if you don't kick it!
@@ThordrenekGaming hard enough that you might even die on heroic?
Prot pally and Bear both feel awful on beta. If i main bear again i will play bear without hero talents both are dull and boring along with the spec tree is pathetic. The class tree to have to pick Cyclone and soothe just to be able to get stamp roar is stupid blizz have no idea and continue to make bear dull. They could do some amazing things with pulverize or something like that which is a dead talent but dont.
Yeah the spec tree is in a terrible state for Guardian. While I think the class tree is much improved from the current Dragonflight iteration, it still needs a very serious look as there's way too many wasted talent points, and I think a tree as bloated as the Druid tree is should have no two-point-nodes at all.
They realy should fix prot pali heal , cause the scaling with the current hp doesnt do it , they messed it up , pali right now just need haste and world of glory heal increase and it can compete again with other tanks , i hope they adress this issue cause the class feel very fun to play specialy cause of the amount of utility you can bring , i was able to heal people and myself in DF , and felt completly in control on my runs , if someone mess up or everyone got very low i could easily top my healer so he can focus on others , thats the best thing about pali , i don't realy care about the rotation , i just love the utility it can bring to every scenario.
I definitely expect a big tuning adjustment for that. Prot Paladin doesn't really have an identity with very weak healing.
They should fix a tank so it can heal people in the group. Literally the antithesis of a tank.
@@Jisei13 thats the nature of prot paladin , always was , its a fantasy game not a job , all other tanks have self heal , what u on about lol , dh can self heal with orbs , dk can self heal to full also , monk have tons of shields and sustain , warrior is very bulky that he takes almost no physical damage with ignore pain and critical block , and paladin have 60k increased armor ? yeah sounds fair, also forgot that druid that have also huge heal %
@@sharkstaint1373 I didn't mention self heal for palas but all tanks so half your paragraphs irrelevant but also tanks shouldn't heal DKs maybe as it's their entire mitigation but there's no reason for tanks to heal at all.
@@Jisei13 so your telling me my runs depends on how good a healer is ? its a very bad take lad , look at tanks in gw2 and ff 14 , all have self heals and none need healing almost , i respect your opinion , but its very wrong.
PP, guards, PW’s, monks and dh’s are all shit 👍🏼
I think I know which one you prefer then, haha :)
@@ThordrenekGaming What’s dead may never die! 🩸