Sun and Moon’s Toxic relationship in the sun and moon show// SAMS analysis
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- Опубликовано: 31 авг 2023
- I really like sun. I’m dealing with shit right now and I can’t deal with all this lore shit. Sun is good, sun isn’t a goddamn war criminal, sun needs therapy
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Not fucking doing this right now fuck off Julia and finish this description after you do the common Apps
I’m keeping that because it’s funny.
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Idiot screams about the Sun and Moon show for 30 minutes.
Look, I like the SAMS, but it’s too fucking much right now. Sun and Moon’s relationship was bad for both of them and I tried really really hard to be fair to both but- Moon’s actions are so significantly worse than Sun’s.
I like Moon but he’s such a dick and no one else seems to acknowledge it. I feel like I’m just repeating what I’ve said in the video at this point.
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LINKS TO CLICK ON!!
Twitter (idk how to link Twitter accounts this is the best I could do): derpy__duck/statu...
Instagram: the_derpy_duck_...
Reddit: www.reddit.com/u/The_Derpy_Du...
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(Some) Sources:
(Toxic sibling dynamics)
eggshelltherapy.com/toxic-sib....
themindsjournal.com/signs-you...
• 8 Signs You Have A Tox...
www.learning-mind.com/toxic-s...
(Solitary confinement)
afsc.org/solitary-confinement...
www.prisonpolicy.org/blog/202...
knowablemagazine.org/article/...
What did Julia watch today? Well still Cybertron but I’m going to watch Critical Roll soon. I’ve started playing a campaign with my best friend and two other people. I want to start making animatics for my character.
I also do have a SAMS pmv in the works. It’s taken a long time but I’m getting close to it being done. It’s in a completely different style to the one I normally use but it’s a little faster for me to make.
I’m gonna try to change my upload schedule a bit. I want to start uploading a video on the Wednesday on the week I don’t upload anything on. It’ll probably be a short video but uhh- I want the algorithm to like me so yeah.
Also fun fact about the thumbnail, I drew it 11 hours before the video went live lol. So that’s why it isn’t in the speedpaint parts of the video. Also like- I still need to link shit as I’m typing this so Imma go do that soon
#sunandmoon #sams #characteranalysis 
Кино
the whacking sticks were also really bad, Moon would hit Sun, just because Sun joked about him, being bold. like yeah, sometimes siblings hit each other but if it's at the point you have weapons, it's crossing a line. also Moon once said, the computer thinks like Moon does, and the computer goes out of his way, to hurt Sun. he even once trapped him in another dimension, Sun is begging to be pulled out, and the computer does nothing. it's also made clear that whenever the new Moon, is worried about Sun the computer doesn't take it seriously.
Yeaaahhh
I didn’t bring up some things because the narrative mostly treated it as a joke, like in one of the fanart videos Sun mentions he has a list of things moon has done to him (which moon remembers fondly) and one of those things is he submerged him in a bathtub underwater. Well in one of the “SAM fight the witherstrom” episodes Sun is talking about all his fears and he mentions being afraid of being underwater. So, if we assume both that this was supposed to be taken seriously and that the authors remembered this, than at best Moon unknowingly caused his brother an extreme amount of distress for ????. And worst case he traumatized his brother. The fact Sun has an extensive list is also really weird but it’s mostly treated as a joke so I didn’t mention it.
@@The_derpy_duck__J.E.CI only just realised that now and that makes me really sad because I don’t think that experience would have helped his fear of being underwater, especially being in that situation because of the one person he trusted, his own brother
@@The_derpy_duck__J.E.C what episode was the list thing? I been searching for it for a while
THIS!!! ALL OF THIS!
You're so right at how toxic and unhealthy their relationship was, and it's super refreshing to see an entire video addressing this. Especially the parts about Sun not being given a choice regarding Lunar, and Moon's final message to Sun before his death
I'm glad that the show itself has begun to address this as well via New/Post-reset Moon. Not only does he treat Sun far better than old Moon did, but he also calls out the toxic behavior between both siblings: Saying how terrible his old self was, and that what he saw when he watched all the videos on the channel "disgusted" him. He also calls Sun out on not trusting him and lying to him about KC teaching him Star power and training in secret (despite the physical harm Sun was putting himself in by doing so).
Meanwhile the show is also showing the lasting effects old Moon's behavior are having on Sun, and his mental state in general: The way New Moon acts when mad reminding Sun of Old Moon, Sun's entire interaction with the hallucination of Old Moon, the fact Sun admitting out loud to himself that he sometimes WISHES HE WAS DEAD.
Luckily Earth and New Moon have not only been made aware of the mental issues and lingering trauma Sun is going through (minus his thoughts abt wanting to die), but there's been several episodes focused on them helping him deal with the hallucinations and intrusive thoughts. Also the episode where Earth helps Sun and New Moon talk to each other abt Sun lying and the both of them learning to communicate better as a result.
Overall, I'm super glad you made this video, cause like you said, this is something that needs to be talked abt more
It always bothered me that no one ever seemed to acknowledge how little choice sun had and how much of his autonomy was taken away by a person who constantly mistreated him.
I’m so happy that New Moon is nicer to Sun and the others-
Doesnt help that recently we learned moon put sun as a testing subject in his computer. Like wtf old moon. The fact new moon also has said that he doesnt like how old moon treated him. That told me enough.
Also, the fact that certain times when Old Moon has told Sun that he loves him. And, to me, Sun never really believes him. Which I don’t blame him. Every time my brother has ‘apologized’ after emotionally abusing me and saying he loves me, then doing it all over again the next day makes it worthless honestly.
It’s ✨sibling abuse✨! It really screws you up.
Oh My Goodness! I finally found someone who has also personally experienced sibling abuse. For me it was my Older Sister, she has Npd...
I didn't realize how toxic Moon was until New Moon started pointing it out.
I remember thinking "noooo! moon just loves in his own way!" which is partially true but that doesn't make it ok... I see where Sun comes from where "things could be a lot worse! At least cares for me now! I have to help him, I've just been useless to him our whole lives!" I'm happy New Moon is starting to help Sun (and me i guess lol) realize how degrading Old Moon was being...
I always knew Moon was cruel to Sun but never thought much of it, i always thought "ah yes, ✨ siblings✨" but after a while I paid attention and thought of Moons actions. Moon is probably the worst character out of SAMS. He's worst than Eclipse, BloodMoon, ruin and even the creator. He hurt his brother to point where Sun is afraid of his own brother..
One thing I don't think was mentioned is that at some point the computer mentioned Sun being on a list of test subjects or something like that, new Moon was confused and angry at this. The old Moon used his own brother as an experiment
We all see Sun and we expect him to be the happy optimistic one all the time as if life is perfect, Sun has a right to be upset and he has a right to have an outburst of anger.
Moon is the villian. Sun and Eclipse are the victims of moons actions.
I love seeing your videos. Its nice to see someone who speaks out on the things people are too afraid to even think about. I'm happy someone spoke about the toxic and abusive relationship between sun and moon.
Yes! Doesn't help that Lunar didn't go through half of what sun did and is... Well... Um... Needs therapy... A ton of it... They both need professional therapy😅
@@denyelherting9202 definitely
From my point of view Moon had a lot of trauma from the beginning causing him too lash out in these ways being directly abusive, but Sun is also indirectly abusive towards Moon, as in putting a lot of pressure on him, like the Eclipse situation Sun didn’t help at all when trying to find a solution, also a couple times Moon has worked himself too collapsing which was hard for them both equally, I feel it’s unfair to say Moon was the worst character in sams because he was not mentally stable, and when he left the code in Sun was not with malicious intent, he wanted too be better and ok in general. This is just my opinion but personally I like both of the characters a lot, and this seems (no offence!) too be a lot of people who are a big fan of sun, I get it though I’m detail oriented so I can’t help but see this relationship equally toxic because of the negative affects on both characters
Sorry about the novel tho 😅
EXAAAAAACTLLLLLYYYY
FINALLY. I'VE BEEN SO MAD AT THIS FANDOM BC I THOUGHT I WAS THE ONLY ONE WHO ACTUALLY THOUGHT THIS- THANK YOU
I’ve been so surprised with this videos response haha 😅
I knew I wasn’t the only person who felt weird about the relationship but I didn’t expect for this video to have so much support
Ok I know this is a serious video but the sped up sound effect at 2:43 just KILLED ME it was so random in that serious moment
We love the random sound effects and we love them even more when everyone sounds like a chipmunk, including the sound effects lol
I’m SO glad that they reset moon so they could have a healthier relationship, new moon is so wonderful and I love how they call out old moon for being a piece of garbage as they should, it’s so nice to see
Same I'm so happy that Moon was Reprogrammed! ❤
I think you should've also mentioned the Monty and Puppet podcasts, Sun's always brought up in them and they're always bullying him. In the Lunar one, they call him dumb and strongly imply that he's stupid and acknowledge his anxiety, but just joke about it. Even Lunar joined in on the bullying.
I never realized this. At all. Until I found this video.
I think this is because I am Sun when it comes to my close 'friendships.'
Not only does this video deep dive until a toxic relationship between two brothers in a fictional show, it also is kind of an eye opener for people who don't even realize they aren't being treated like a friend or sibling.
Also we could mention the time Moon chloroform sun, and moon made him do a video, I know it’s played for laughs but I feel like it still happen and it left an odd taste in my mouth, also the whacking stick, it’s told to us that moon has multiple and even made Sun choose which one he’d rather be hit by and one of those choices was “an invisible stick” which was just moon punching him, Sun reaction to it showed me this happens often and that he’s used to it, which is bad very bad.
Honestly I think Sun needs the most therapy, he’s been going through this since day one for years and is suicidal because of all of it. And I feel like people victim blame him way to often I’ve gotten into arguments with people in the comments before when it came to Sun’s relationship with Roxy and Sun not telling Moon about the star power he had. It’s hard for Sun to trust the new Moon, heck even Monty points it out and why that is, Sun is deeply traumatized and it’s hard to look at someone that shares the face of a person that did all those things to you, and with Sun and Roxy’s relationship, she was toxic, a “motherly chip” or whatever it’s called doesn’t make you cheat and you’re pan to marry your ex, even golden said “a toxic relationship with a wolf” when looking into his head and Glamrock Freddy said that his relationship with her in the past was also toxic because she was a narcissist and only cared about herself, and I saw people say “he’s only mad because he wasn’t treated high and mighty” he was the one treating her like she was some queen, a relationship goes both ways and she didn’t just fail to do that, she planned a whole wedding behind his back with her ex, Sun had every right to wanna fuck up that wedding to bad he was stuck in his head, I was glad Circus baby did, I also feel like G Freddy was taking advantage of the situation which is a whole nother conversation.
(I feel like I written to much, sorry if you read this)
you don't have to apologize! i like reading long comments like these
@@MariaIsStupid420 ok, glad this wasn’t to hard to read, I go on a lot of rants and can get carried away :)
@@glitchhoffe1293 lol listening to peoples rants is what i'm here for! i sniff up those paragraphs like the stuff that makes me see funny colors. i have been wanting for a very long time to write a long ass paragraph on Tumblr about the show, it's story and just make myself do five courses of mental gymnastics while trying to analyse the characters mental developments and the thought process behind their actions. though i think i would have a brain fart half way through and give up :,)
@@MariaIsStupid420 lol, I love rants too there my favorite, it helps get stress out surprisingly.
I’ve been thinking that everyone sidelines sun the most with everything going on and I’m glad that SOMEONE actually, finally addresses it! So thank you for all of this!
I agree with all this, Sun always seems to get the short end of the stick both in the show and in the fanbase. I’m pretty new to watching but I’ve caught up, but I keep thinking about how little time Sun has had to just calm down. The time where he was breaking down over Bloodmoon hallucinations (when Earth found him), then suddenly discovering his brothers both died and one came back with no memory, to the other animatronics memories’ wiped to hate him. Then he’s dealt with trying to bond with his brother all over while being the only one who knows what’s going on, even Earth doesn’t know too much. Since then he hasn’t really gotten the chance to just slow down, there’s always something new like killing Eclipse, dealing with Ruin and the Mimic and now the memory-wiped computer. Someone needs to do something nice for him for once😭I’m hoping the other animatronics at least make it up to him for hating him, even if it was against their own will
When i think of Sun & Moon's relationship one of the first things that come to mind is a song called "Alarm call" by the Correspondents and i went back to listen to it just now & it is still very fitting.
👍
Wait a minute-
Davis?! 👍🏼✨☀️
BRO WHY IS YOU HERE-
😦
LOKI AND DAVIS ARE HERE????
May or may not have made an account just to comment this. I could not have put this into words any better, and this video summarizes my thoughts and feelings around this wonderful mess of a show. Sun and Moon are horribly toxic and I honestly felt like I was imagining it with how little it was talked about, but on a rewatch I would go as far as saying the two were abusive (mainly moon). I’ve also been struggling an insane amount to make a video about SAMS, and this is a huge inspiration. I wish there was more content like this genuinely analyzing the show. With all the victim blaming happening in and around the show’s characters it’s so nice to have someone finally stick up for Sun in more than a short comment (I’m definitely biased towards him too lol). Honestly this is overall one of my favorite videos on RUclips at the moment :)
Ahhh thank you so much! I’m so glad I could inspire someone
honestly, I agree with you, and Moon has become much better now in the most recent episodes! He started to worry more about Sun, he got angry when Sun lied about using the power of the star, he became super protective of Sun, and he hates the old Moon exactly for the exact reasons you pointed out in this video! Moon constantly blames himself for Sun's mental state, no longer bullies him, and becomes extremely defensive towards Sun. In "Sun is kidnapped by Ruin", Moon becomes extremely aggressive when Ruin kidnaps Sun, and becomes even more so when it's all because they wanted to play SB with him. New Moon for me, is exactly what Moon expected, he is much better with Sun than the old Moon was. One thing to point out too, is that the computer was created to act like Moon, and he is completely toxic and horrible towards Sun, but the new Moon starts to lose respect for the computer because of this, trying to change the programming and losing the computer's respect as well.
im so happy someone acknowledges their toxic relationship! I think you missed the part about the whacking stick (im not sure if you mentioned it) But overall this video is really amazing, and so are your other videos!
I definitely should of mentioned it and the only reason why I didn’t was because I felt I was being too unfair to Moon and I’m a bit of a coward. I didn’t bring up some of what Sun did because it was also in a more joking tone, but even if the waking stick was a joke it’s not a very funny one.
YES YES YES OH MY GOD I AGREE WITH ALL OF THIS
thank you for making this
i swear, people victimblame sun so god damn much so it's refreshing to see someone defending him omg
Ima agree with you on all of this i do like moon as a character but also I think it’s more of the fact I like the VA 😅 uhh anyways I kinda miss how moon use to be like before he learned magic and when he was more like the old fan fics where moondrop/moon was always good and just had a virus but than it became this whole… thing ;-; and it’s come to the point where I’m just mad at how the lore went down and this brought me to write down all my ideas on how I would change TSAMS lore… ofc I keep up with the lore but I don’t really like it… (unless earth is there LOL) …me and my older sister use to have not the best relationship.. but now we’re like really close and I was hoping they would do that with sun and moon like when moon dies, but all moon is now is more chaotic when it comes to humor and ima say all my favorite moments were the ones where moon would say “I love you too brother/sun” but than both sun and moon soon say “oh we only hug each other and say we love each other (as Brothers) when we’re going through something BAD” like yeah that makes sense but I feel like it just kinda shows that yes they are close but I feel like is also shows they don’t really treat one another as siblings unless something BAD happens idk I’m just kinda ranting
Also sun is my fave character too and I scared for his mental health as a character in TSAMS because yeah earth sun and moon have taken breaks but I feel like they’re kinda avoiding the fact sun really needs therapy and not just the therapy earth has given him but like just therapy as a whole!!
So here’s what I think…
Sun has the most trauma out of EVERYONE- and people just completely gloss over that- and it makes my blood boil, I just don’t understand why care so much for the bean but not for sun,just because he killed Bloodmoon/Eclipse doesn’t mean we can treat him like shit. Everyone in the fandom could careless if he died. And also thank you for talking abt the toxic behavior they had before bc even if everything was treated as a joke. It was serious mental and physical abuse I mean the old moon is still missed by a large part of the fandom, but I don’t and I’m pretty sure a lot of people don’t too but the new moon just can’t expect much of sun opening much to him bc sun has so much ptsd and trauma that he just can’t. And the new moon doesn’t understand that or at least from what I’ve gathered. The fandom should treat sun better, he’s been thru so much and no one talks about it 😕,thank you for talking about this. Thank you.
This comment perfectly encapsulates all my thoughts regarding Lunars popularity among fans and Suns dislikes
People like Lunar because they see him as a small bean that needs to be protected because he was hurt by his brother Eclipse, but then completely gloss over the fact that Sun was physically and verbally abused by Moon, i.e all the times Moon as shouted at, yelled at, name called and degraded Sun who also needs protection from almost everyone he used to be around, Lunar immediately got support from Moon and Monty well not really being able to connect with Sun, well Sun continued to be hit by Moon ignored by Monty, since Monty wasn't Suns friend, even when Monty has called out Moons behaviour I wouldn't call him Suns friend, and then verbally put down by the computers, and then when Sun does kill bloodmoon who very well could've still been alive if he just left, he obviously snapped in some way, then he got verbally abused by Lunar who up to this point was obviously Moons favourite, that doesn't even make up for what Moon did by not even talking to Sun about his problems but rather bringing up his own, locking him in a box and instead of talking to him he left, when he eventually did find Eclipse he immediately tried to killed him, then when Eclipse started to degrade him he finally blew up, litterly, just like Lunars head, and when he tried to fix what he had done to the magic he failed and then he finally was able to get support by the one person who he hadn't even meet before!
Sun is often portrayed as dumb, useless, awkward, anxious, cowardice, the butt of the joke, but when you actually look at his character he never got a chance to actually shine other then to be laughed at or made fun of, his life was ruined by those he trusted and became scared of, his self esteem is basically irrelevant, his emotional state is basically a house of bricks kept together by cheap tape that is slowly one by one being stripped off well things keep happening around him that he is not in control of
I'm not saying what Lunar went through is invalid, Lunar does deserve care, he does deserve help and love but the fandom often forgets that Sun deserves this too
Sun, yes he has lied, he did kill Bloodmoon, but in a case where someone is putting you down and messing with you when your obviously not mentally okay and the giving them the chance to leave and then have them advance to you well their known for hurting people and they're still verbally abusing you, don't tell me if you were sun in that position you wouldn't have blasted that barrel, then sun being haunted by hallucinations of Bloodmoon and Sun admitting he would've liked another little brother and that he is sorry shows that he felt bad, but Bloodmoon isn't in the right either, but he decided his own fate, even if he's still alive now, he still decided to annoy Sun even when he got the choice to leave, Sun gave him every chance to leave and yet he stayed resulting in the death of Bloodmoon
@@neonjoker you wanna hear another sad thing that will probably make you rage?
**the new moon even favorites earth 😃**
Also the fact that Sun’s the punching bag makes my blood BOIL I mean he has all the rights to become the villain himself at this point!?
Edit: plus he never had time to have character development because stuff just kept happening and he could not control it! And also if you saw every time the comments and also the characters thoughts you can see that when sun who’s supposed to always be perfect and happy and the goody two shoes guy becomes an outrageous scared and traumatized person, everyone just completely hates him for some reason. HE LEGIT KILLED BLOODMOON. BLOODMOON- a freaking blood psycho! He did so much worse than sun but no we gotta hate sun because he used self defense yea that’s reasonable- NO ITS NOT-😃👏 I think people should start saying that the bean in this situations are two! Sun and Lunar! Both are completely long lost from salvation. But Sun is WAY deeper in the rabbit hole, imagine getting physically and mentally abused every day by your brother who treats it as a joke! I remember that Sun said that one time MOON TRIED TO DROWN HIM- even tho Moon knew sun was afraid of water!? It’s no doubt that the old Moon was mentally ill and had a shitty thought process, after all one thing stay the same sun getting abused and underestimated and physically tortured, at the end of the day is just a joke. What a great thing don’t you say? **im being sarcastic-**
@@Ary_x I can understand why new moon would like earth a little bit more because they were both completely new to everything that was happening around then but I still think it was unfair how new moon acted towards sun considering he knew suns past from the videos and should've known sun would've been scared since new moon still has both the body and face of his abuser, but the fact that we barely see earth, the fact that new Moon got mad at Sun for lying when new moon didn't tell him about the whole earth being sent to download things into their systems or something, and then the fact that Sun is STILL being treated at the punching bag, honestly at this point I feel like Sun should've been a villan long before this, and don't even get me started on the lame excuse of a charcter that is evil lunar, I mean COME ON, even of it is a different Lunar that doesn't warrant the way that fans try and make Lunar this over hyped super villan in aus when in reality he would've just been a henchmen for Eclipse, I want to see a universe where sun has left everyone, where he didn't stick around for the abuse and instead started a whole new life, or maybe one where Sun is the evil one, because unlike almost everyone on this series Sun ***deserves*** to be a villan, he has earned the right to be upset and to want to hurt others, yet they push away that possibility and instead swap it in for him being the butt of the joke, Sun should not be the butt of the joke, he shouldn't be the punching bag, because when you actually look at it we're just making fun of a mentally damaged person with many things wrong with them who needs genuine help and is on constant danger and is often pushed to the side or left without anything to do or anyone to genuinely help him, and I think no one will because so many of these episodes are tailored to what the majority of the fans want not the minority
@@neonjoker and that’s what makes me rage!! Why can’t we see him as a villain? I would screech in JOY if Sun would finally have the revenge he does not even want! I mean you can clearly see how much Sun cares for Moon but the thing isn’t reciprocated by Moon a lot, usually sun never talked down or name called Moon he never underestimated him meanwhile Moon did the COMPLETE OPPOSITE- I mean round of applause for who thought they had a healthy relationship!? **i’m being sarcastic again-**
And don’t get me started on how they SHOULD BEG ON THEIR KNEES FOR FORGIVENESS- you want to know what would have happened if this was in the real world? ✨JAIL✨ yet everyone says sun is a piece of shit cuz he scared lunar and killed bloodmoon na na na- NO- NO THATS NOTHING COMPARED TO WHAT HAPPENED TO HIM😃 I a just hate the fact that the fandom does not treat him like he deserves to be treated after all he went thru. There’s people out there that make Moon Lunar Bloodmoon Eclipse angst, but I hardly see any…Sun angst. Maybe no one does it BECAUSE THE LIST OF TRAUMAS AND PROBLEMS MENTAL ISSUES AMD ETC IS AS LONG AS THE FUCKING BIBLE-😀👏
@@Ary_x Sun was pushed, pushed by everyone, pushed by bloodmoon to kill him after he squandered his only chance to leave, pushed by Lunar who started talking to him the same way moon did and the pushed by moon when he trapped sun in a room, on solitary confinement, in which sun developed schizophrenia and possibly a deeper abandonment issue, I'm not even going to say what Eclipse did because I believe that Eclipse too was an add on to moons abuse due to the fact that Eclipse was directly created by Moon, oh and remember when we got to see Eclipse in Suns head during the backstory or Eclipse where we clearly hear sun say that he is still not feeling well and possibly in pain and moon immediately tell him to hurry up and clean the daycare
Then there's the whole "oh you can't kill a horrible person I was already planning to get rid of but I was allowed to hurt innocent people" mentality old moon had, Sun was the only person other then lunar who loved moon, and was the one who made others kind of care about him, yet sun was also the one who suffered from all the bad things moon did, and fans still try and make sun out to be the one who needs to forgive their sweet little bean and their favourite litteral serial killer
Finally. Someone has finally said it. They're sibling relationship was toxic. I know the thing about the stick is for jokes but Moon actually hitting Sun with it is abusive and Sun has suffered the most throughout their journey. When Sun gets visions of the old Moon it's clear that despite everything a part of Sun deep down did not believe that Moon loved him . The Moon we see now shows that he genuinely cares about Sun and does not treat him like the old Moon did.
New Moon:"I'm not gonna hurt you"
And in that moment I thought Sun was going to say "I- I don’t know that" because from every behavior it'd be hard to think Sun isn't afraid that at any thing he does Moon could hurt him, wether it be emotionally or physically. I don’t remember the exact episode I'm quoting so sorry about that but thanks for this video I think you did a really good job and put in some good research👍👍👍
You mean like this?:)
*sun cleaning the barrels*
*moon walks in*
Moon: hi Sun.
Sun: ...hi..
Moon: ...
*sun accidentally drops cleaner and it spills everywhere*
Sun: oh no..
Moon: what's wrong?-
SUN: IM SORRY IM SORRY IM SORRY I'M SORRY IM SORRY IM SORRY IM SORRY-
Moon: Sun-
SUN: IM SO STUPID!-
MOON: SUN-
SUN: I'LL CLEAN IT UP I PROMISE JUST DONT HURT ME!
Moon: ...
Sun: ...
Moon: sun I-... I'm not gonna hurt you... I would never hurt you.. You know that.. right?
Sun: ...i don't know anymore..
Moon: s-sun..
*moon reaches his hand to put it on suns shoulder*
Sun: d-dont touch m-me!
Moon: I.. I'm sorry..
Sun: I-im gonna go get some t-towels..
*sun leaves*
Moon: he's still scared of me.. I hate the old me..
part 2?:)
@@User78046 what episode
@@user-sn9bo9sd6t I just made this up:) do you like it?:)
@@User78046yes
Is that an actual episode
What the show explains in a small way it one of there old reaction videos, that it was a little less one sided when they were in the same body, Moon in the show had a lot of trauma from feeling like he was trapped, also in the Q&A video it’s explained that Moon had a panic attack, so Moon has equal trauma but he deals with it in a different way than Sun does, and the build up too when Moon dies, was inevitably Sun’s fault, when he went too kill Eclipse he had no ideal plan so it was reckless and it’s not like no one told him Moon had pretty much begged him and told him too stop, sun didn’t listen, starting the chain of events leading too Moon’s death, from experience sibling often have parents too weigh there problems on each other instead, Moon was mentally ill in the majority of the episodes where he down talked too sun, so he wasn’t entirely mentally stable or there mentally too think through it like Sun was, damn my thumbs hurt, overall they are abusive too each other in different ways, Moon is more verbally aggressive and abusive towards sun, while sun is a little bit more unintentional, as in spiralling when things go wrong leaving it too Moon too solve and overall putting a lot of pressure on someone who is not mentally stable. (At the occasions I’m talking about Sun was a lot more mentally stable then he currently is)
At this point sunrise is the only one cusing
From what I've heard, deserved. Give Sun cussing rights.
I think the show didn't go into too much detail about these facts because from the POV of both title characters, this was normal behaviour for them. They really didn't know any better. There was special emphasis on episodes where they themselves knew they crossed the line like the fight videos but the lying and manipulation was just normal for them so it got glossed over. Their relationship was so horrible to start off with, Moon literally fighting with Sun for control over a shared body and causing him pain, that what they had after they separated was such a big improvement. They didn't have things like healthy coping mechanisms or communication skills. That was their regular lives.
After Moon's death, we are seeing a lot more of how Sun's mental state is and Moon is seeing his own actions from a different perspective, without all the hate and jealousy he had at the very start of their relationship and with considerably less guilt and self-hatred that old Moon had later on in their relationship.
Earth is their bridge. She's already teaching the boys more healthy communication and their moments together are a lot more akin to siblings annoying each other rather than manipulating each other. Sun's still lying to Moon but that's because he still has the memories of old Moon and the insecurity of dealing with basically a new person that has the same look, voice and some actions of his old brother, which Earth even addresses in their talk. New Moon is more attune to Sun's emotions and supportive when he has an episode with his hallucinations.
I hope the new computer will act like new Moon. He did ask Sun about how he'd like to be treated and spared him from the ear splitting anguish of Moon losing his steam achievements.
FINALLY SOMEONE ADDRESSES THIS ISSUES. THANK YOU-!!!
Something i think should be addressed about Sun specifically is that despite there being a few therapy episodes with him in it, it just FEELS like everyone is ignoring the fact that Sun has severe trauma, trauma that's worse than Lunar's and Moon's. While yes, Lunar was killed and revived, and of course that would be horrifically traumatizing, coupled with how Eclipse abused him, but remember; Sun suffered abuse WAY longer than Lunar! I remember Lunar just being abused verbally and emotionally, Sun was abused verbally, emotionally and PHYSICALLY. Everyone treats Lunar like he's the one with the worst trauma in the Pizzaplex, partly because he was bombed and is a sweetheart, but that's no excuse to just gloss over Sun.
Sun had to silently suffer as his two brothers died and got revived, i don't think anyone in the show really directly asked at all how he was coping during those times. In the podcasts, Sun is often talked about and is treated as "the stupid one", with his trauma not being taken too seriously. I think even Lunar called him stupid. That on its own is awful to say, especially about someone who's not doing mentally well. Yes, Sun's made many mistakes, but that's mainly from stress, anxiety and fear. I think the only one who actually cares the most about Sun's feelings is Earth, a bit more so than New Moon.
Sun is treated like crap by the other characters.
I absolutely adore that you brought this up I had been thinking the same thing for a while, and I’ve noticed that no one seems to ever bring up what sun has gone through and if they do they tend to undermine it and invalidate his emotions.
I also enjoyed that you brought up how similar are the effects that sun and blood moons code affects them this is something that I noticed a while ago and found it strange when I noticed no one else was bringing it up.
I also feel like moons treatment of sun is borderline abusive but I don’t know know enough of the subject to say for sure.
I was definitely angry during the episodes where Sun wanted to kill Eclipse. The way both Lunar and Moon talked to him about it. I was never a fan of the “you’re just as bad as the person you’re trying to destroy” argument especially when Sun has been through so much because of Eclipse and so has everyone else. Eclipse causing July 16th to happen for example. And I think that at the very beginning of the show, Sun was happy. But everything has gotten too much, the same for Lunar (I don’t hate him btw he’s basically a child). I worry for Earth she is sweet, kind and understanding.
NewMoon is very protective of her and I have a few ideas why. I think because he feels that he already messed up his relationship with Sun and is trying to prevent Earth from losing the “light” he saw in Sun, but also in that attempt at protecting her, he has hurt her by not telling her things. He couldn’t protect Sun when Old Moon was around. Ok I’m gonna stop here before this becomes a short story.
hitting sun and threatening to whavk him is my main reason for not liking old moon, i never really dove into how bad and toxic there brotherly relationship was (ima be honest i didn't know it was this bad either)
I definitely think new moon is better, for sun, no he isn't my favorite character (that goes the lunar and bloodmoon and sun) but i definitely like his new version
[I absolutely love the va's, and i knew davis was good at writing lore, but sams has to be my favorite project from him and ec]
This is a pretty good analysis and definitely deals with most of their issues, and I feel bad because I always knew it was toxic but never cared and still dont- or well- its not that I dont care its just I feel nothing towards it even if I try to
And off topic but I love your art!
Thank you ;u;
This was a really good analysis! You summed up their relationship pretty accurately. As much as they love each other, they go hurt each other a lot (but mostly Moon hurting Sun). It’s an interesting dynamic and I wish that the show explored it more. Literally the only possible nitpick I could find in here was using the word “intrusive thoughts” to describe “dark desires” when actual intrusive thoughts have no desire at all behind them, and the misconception that they do is actually harmful. But other then “using (1) word wrong that a lot of people have used wrong in much worse ways” is nothing really. You’re pretty good at reading characters, and making interesting analysis
I have been blind to the abuse of these two until I saw this video.
I think I've been fucked up by a loved one myself or something, because how the HELL did I not catch this?!
2:27 I'm sorry, but the voice is killing me, and the last sound effect 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
A fun hobby of mine is watching anything but speeding it up, just because the voices can get so silly. I edited this in iMovie and I think I spend it up like 150% or something.
You're so right! I think ever since New Moon came along, a lot of fans started looking back at Old Moon and realised how horrible of a brother he really was when comparing how he treated Sun back then to how New Moon treats him.
I do wish that we don't have to deal with an antagonist for a bit. We just got rid of Eclipse. Give the characters time to recover or talk about their mental state
This video reminds me of my relationship with my older sister and how she used to treat me but in a more humanly way as I was Sun and she was Moon and along with people joking about the relationship with me and her and now its like Sun's and New moons Relationship I really love how you brought up people undermining the relationship with Sun and Moon
i LOVE YOUR ART STYLE also pretty voice pls keep up the great work, u have potential 💕
Semi-off topic but the absolute joy I am feeling seeing someone actually acknowledge Moon was going way too far during that fight instead of taking his side for some bizarre reason was immaculate
Awesome video! loved watching ^^
25:25 "But even they have their own issues" ANALYZE IT/hj xd
I agree but
Just wanna say i LOVE your artstyle💜💜💜
Thank you
Your Speaking facts ✨✨✨
I honestly don’t think I realized how much of a shit brother Moon was until the episode where he trapped Sun. And here’s the thing. 67% of the comments on that video were just defending Moon’s actions. Then all I could think was, “Are you all stupid or do you have major brain damage???” Because, I have three blood siblings and two step-siblings and none of them would ever treat the other like how Moon treats Sun!
New Moon is objectively better than old Moon in every aspect. And he isn’t dependent on Sun to be happy enough for both of them. He encourages Sun to just tell him whenever he’s hallucinating or stressed, unlike old Moon where he didn’t even know Sun was hurting! All of Sun’s life people had wanted him to be the happy and mentally stable person in everyone’s life. Going back to the comments, people were also saying that they want the “old Sun” back. Which is, complete and utter bullshit. Sun was happy for a good, like, 7 minutes of his existence, but then Moon showed up and was immediately abusive. And that didn’t even seem like the killcode affecting him, that really just felt like him being normal. Basically, old Moon is a total jackass. (Not like Beelzebub kind of jackass just like an actual jackass.)
Your right old moon was a piece of shit to sun and I hate the fact that ever since they were made old moon was abusive. I hated it when moon threatened Sun with the sticks and suns tone of voice clearly sounded like he was scared moon was ACTUALLY gonna hurt him like he used to and some times his tone of voice just sounded numb like he was used to this treatment hell I thought Sun may have joined eclipse just to get away from moon! Like DAMN Eclipse may have been a better brother to sun! sun has displayed trats of being suicidal BECAUSE OF OLD MOON! New moon is definitely better than old moon but is still emotionally and verbally abusive so in full conclusion all moons are abusive! This took me a while to type PLS REPLY💀💀💀💀💀
@@User78046 yeah honestly. Like I know he was trying to improve but he didn’t try that hard. Yet Sun still loved him. And for the eclipse thing, I feel like Eclipse could’ve just emotionally manipulated Sun into trusting him and making him see Eclipse as more of a brother than Moon. Probably wouldn’t have been that hard to do. Plus, Sun would’ve gotten an early villain arc.
@@TheArtistofInsanity fr old moon was just... EW.💀
I feel like nobody talks about O.Moons bad deeds..
He literally abused Sun mentally.
The New Moon is way better after a brand new start with no fighting. Even though Moon has breakdowns doesn't mean he is bad, people deserve to take out anger, and I really love New Moon, O.Moon was just cruel, he abused others and treated Sun horribly.
going to go on a rampage ^^
Finally somebody else that noticed the wrong-doings of moon! People ignore what moon has done and take his side and I'm just glad somebody else noticed this! This may be about fictional characters but I feel I have boded with sun in a way that I relate a lot with him, even the part of being ignored! It makes me feel good inside that I'm not the only one that defends sun when he isn't at fault, so I thank you for even thinking that sun wasn't always at fault :)
HELLO MY FELLOW! I AGREE! DO YOU WANNA TALK ABOUT SUNS TRAUMA???
I've seen this video a few times also idk if you have been thinking about making another analysis on Sams if you are what are your thoughts on Solars death if you have any. I genuinely feel its just a plot device and is just constantly being exploited. Such as April fools jokes. And th. Possibility they can bring him back which yeah characters have been brought back but if thats the case whats the point of feeling bad for the characters grieving?. I've dropped watching the show because its just too much for me
Keep the good work up 💪
I actually stopped watching TSNMS bc of this dynamic
Its a fnaf role play so ofc I didn't take it too seriously, but its still incredibly icky to me just how codependent these two are
Ive been someone's stable rock for a very long time and Suns situation hits way too close to home
Im si happy someone actually made a video om tjis bc I felt dumb for wantting to comment stuff abt this under one of the videos
Can you make a one about Gemini
I am a bit late to this but I agree with EVERYTHING
Moon was so toxic to sun that we didn't really realize it.
And honestly in my opinion the old moon favorites lunar-
Like I can see the old moon ignoring sun so he can spend time with lunar(btw I don't hate lunar) and when sun and lunar were playing the school game lunar started to cry and sun tried to comfort him and sun was panicking about moon hearing lunar crying(I feel like he was scared that moon would hit him)
And I feel like he should at least talk to sun about lunar and lunar moving in and stuff
I don't think ppl take seriously the trauma he has been through eclipse was like the og moon
Eclipse took over sun's body and made him kill kids
Manipulated sun and told him awful things
And in the "if eclipse won" video
Eclipse killed everyone but Monty and sun and deleted sun memories
Sun had every right to want kill eclipse after everything he has been through bc of him
I was really sad when the old moon died but now I still kind am but I think it was for the better bc the new moon threats sun so much better and the computer even said sun was an experiment
The old moon used his brother as an experiment for different dimensions
And the whole cat thing sun didn't tell moon about them bc sun was scared that moon would take them away from him
It really shows how fucked up there relationships is-
That was really long-
I have always wanted to say this and I am happy someone else sees this too
Sun deserved better
Sun probably the most trauma out of everyone in the entirety of the SB Show, at least Moon got a fresh start but Sun has to live with all this trauma for the rest of his life and nobody even gives a shit
If Sun doesn’t get the right treatment, soon enough, he is probably gonna commit suicide
I agree 👍
But also why do I see you everywhere
@@R0TTMNT_MIKEYI am everyone and everywhere
@@-BL00DMOON- ...AHHHMFFNFHTHDGAKTJCE-💀 also I'm surprised to see bloodmoon sticking up for sun💀
Also I wrote an entire thing for him committing suicide do you want me to text it so you can read it?
Oof. I've been ranting about this for so long. If I wasn't at work rn I'd make a giant paragraph lol
Hi again, I noticed that my comment was removed? If it's because of the link, I can explain what it is.
It's a masterpost containing links to playlists of SAMS lore episodes. I separated them into arcs so people can catch up with the show's story without having to scroll through so many videos on the channel to watch or rewatch an arc.
Hello, I never saw your original comment and idk why it would have been deleted (I try not to delete any comments). RUclips might have automatically deleted the comment if it was only a link because I think they do that to try and prevent spam.
But the master post sounds really useful!
Huh. Another response was removed. I explained that I added more than a link on my original response, and told you why I think your video turned out great. I praised it for covering the times where the old Moon was a jerk to Sun.
Yes, RUclips doesn't like links. I tried providing one directly to the channel where the SAMS playlists are. Let's see if it lets me tell you what it's called, at least. @brilyoko
Uwwww!
I have a competiter!
I have my opionions on this!
I wouldn't say it is a healthy realationship but I wouldn't say toxic for there to be a fully healthy realationship is very much inpobable!
Expseashaly with their past but I will not get into this but you know for sure I will make a video on this!
Cool! I’ll make sure to watch your video when it comes out
Hey you are ok ? I think you are crying? Everything's ok ?
I’m fine don’t worry I was just laughing because some of the things I was saying was sort of silly when taken out of context
Finally Someone Said it and Realised also New Moon is Amazing and I love the Fact that I Can Finally See how Overprotective Moon Can Be over Sun! ❤ #ForgettingtheoldMoon
And I'm quite Similar to Moon himself because I used to very Rude and Cold-Hearted back then But Now I have Changed! 👏 i
20:12 Me fr