Talking of launches, I've just seen an "overview" of an MSI Tomahawk X670E board from an Australia-based channel on RUclips. I can't find this anywhere (else) except a "leak" on Twitter from someone with a few hundred followers. Is it a thing? Even a rumor of a thing?
@@KitGuruTech and now Bing is returning the same link that you supplied. Evidently a timing thing. Must be announced/embargoed until today and not yet visible in Pacific time zone.
Thanks Leo all the way from North Carolina Research Triangle Park area Raleigh/Durham. I love how you get straight into it without all the misleading and big question mark thumbnails. (Sorry Gamers Nexus/Paul's Hardware...etc) I like your honest and old school mindset when it comes to these reviews. Straight, no chaser.
Apply the same power limits to the 7950x and you'll see very little performance drop. Both AMD and Intel crank the voltage WAY higher than needed to try and eek out that last 1-2% Sad part is the gaming boost is not 20% vs everything, just in cache sensitive or latency sensitive games. The choice of games here really massively favors that. SotTR LOVES cache and should be thrown out when no one plays it anymore. It inflates averages and misinforms the viewer.
I'll be ordering my 7900X 3D tomorrow. The decrease in heat will make these even more attractive for SFF builds. I plan on sizing down and putting in my new Cooler Master NRP200 MAX build this week.
Wow, Leo reminds me of John Houseman on MasterPiece Theatre! I am mesmerized by his descriptions of the 7959x3D! Good job, chum! Thanks for a solid review!
Yeah why is this channel always like that? That's a good point. Lazy, bored, mumbling all the time. Thank you for calling them out. Hopefully they get their act together.
Power consumption and temps are fantastic! that said, I am staying with my 5800X3D for now. it does what I need and paired with a 4080, it sips power while i work and fits all of my gaming needs.
Thank you very much Leo for this thorough test. It really gives an objective insight. Maybe you could also consider making a comparison of 7950X3D vs 7900 non X model.
Thanks Leo, great video. I'm upgrading from an I9-11900k and have a rtx 4080 and the same asus motherboard featured in this video. Very helpful and is going to be my go to resource for getting everything up and running 👍
Your 7950X is pulling only 36,369 in Cinibench? Something is definitely NOT right. Mine is around 39,200. Try setting -30 on curve optimizer but set your FClock max to -350 and try -325, then -300, and so on until it's unstable. Watch your CPU temps drop 20C, just like the 3D part. If you're running that low, it makes all your other numbers suspect. Thanks for including some of Luke's numbers.
For myself, someone who's worked in and around Game/Software development its interesting nobody is talking about how amazing these 3D-V Cache chips still are at UNREAL ENGINE and Unity Engine compiling and game development.
If you want peak gaming performance or want a powerful cpu with cores/threads exclusively in a small form factor build - 7950X3D is great, due to lower power consumption and temps. 13900K is limited to the bigger side of SFF that can support a 280 aio. 7950X3D on a low profile air cooler in smaller cases is a good pairing.
Intel released the 13900 non k variant this year that has a sizable lower TDP without much performance loss so it's great for SFF cases. Considering the very premium price of the 7950x 3D I believe the 13900/13900k is the better option overall since its about $120 cheaper, offers similar gaming performance and remains number 1 in content creation software. The 7950x 3D is great, but it's not the "one to rule them all" like I was hoping it would be.
@@03chrisv SFF alone is already a premium with more expensive PSU's, and Motherboards. If you're in the market for an i9/Ryzen 9 and SFF, $120 difference shouldn't be a dealbreaker. Though the i9 13900 will draw less power than the K variant, it'll perform noticably worse in gaming with its locked clocked speed(vs. K) and 5600mhz ram. The 7950X3D can undervolt better with PBO2 CO, boosting performance while reducing temps and power at the same time. You can't go wrong with either CPU, but I'd take the 7950X3D because it's faster. That extra cache greatly helps the 1% lows for 240hz/360hz high refresh rate titles - Apex legends, Valorant, R6 Siege and also it'll greatly benefit MMO games like the 5800X3D did. If you're on 4K, the 13900 makes sense. I agree it's definitely not the "one to rule them all", it's more of a niche product IMO. You're getting the fastest and power efficient gaming cpu and a high thread cpu that gets you roughly 95% the way there in productivity. It'll tick those boxes out there for someone.
What's peculiar about Tiny Tina's Wonderland? It's recently become a benchmarking staple. Has there been some controversy? P.S: 3D-CCDs-only edition when?
Even if processors are usually mostly GPU limited at 4K, I'd still like to see the results for 4K. For those like me, the most relevant results for gaming are going to be those that represent how I game-4K. I know that results are technically most interesting for lower resolutions, but there are differences in plenty of scenarios at 4K, and 4K is a future resolution even if it has been around a long time (I've been gaming at 4K for about 10 years!). This is nevertheless a great review. Thank you 👍 (Edited to add deserved kudos.)
Exactly my reaction with that block of foam when I got mine haha, yea like at least they could have at least included more free stuff.. like this stuff aint cheap
I know people like the gaming performance, but I think the best quality of this cpu is the productivity AND the gaming performance. Obviously last gen the 5800x3d took a hit to performance that didn't make it viable for serious prod work. But what do I know lol. High idle power draw as he talks about at the end is also a bit irksome, reminds me of the 7900 gpus in a way.
Thank you for this beautifully detailed content. The question on my mind is this. While playing games (1080P / 1440P), I want to stream over the GPU (RTX 4080 )and record video on the CPU at the same time. According to this scenario, should I buy 7950X or 7950X3D?
@@KitGuruTech Actually, what I'm trying to ask is, can the 7950X3D run that much performance with x264 overhead? It's really ridiculous that no one has tested this.
@@PcKolog The only way to be sure is to try it. Part of the answer will come down to parking the game on the 3D CCD however recording/streaming might go better using the IGP in which case the CPU won't be handling both tasks. Leo
The early gaming benchmarks aren't giving us the total picture of the 3d CPUs yet...wait for a few driver and BIOS updates and performance will definitely go much higher and more consistently across games.
Hi Sir thnkyou for all the videos. I always watch. I want to build a pc: but i am confused: it will this cpu: ryzen 9 7950x3d or the intel i9 14900k with the master motherboard. I will use it for heavy programming(coding) and i also want to game: think with the 4080 or 70ti Wich would you recommend? I like to hear.😊
If I am using my PC as a dedicated VR gaming rig, can just disable the non-cache cores in the BIOS and avoid all of the drivers and other software steps?
The drivers allow the system to determine how the workloads are allocated to the CPU cores. If you want to experiement, the easiest way imo is to use some new options in the BIOS to force the system to prioritise the CCD with extra cache. and then switch it to the regular CCD. No need to disable any cores at all. Leo
from what I'm seeing and hearing about this processor,... it is a throwback (in design terms) to the "Dual Pentium" processor days,... only AMD jammed them both into one socket... and is actually quite a bargain in this manner!! It's a R7 7800X3D ($449) and a R7 7700X (~$340?). So... at it's retail price of $699 You're getting the value of ~$789 (not to mention the efficiency of them being in one chip) and You only need an AM5 motherboard with one socket.
Yup, that's what I say in my conclusion. I cannot think the extra drivers will be necessary for Ryzen 7 3D and that will make the review of that CPU all the more interesting. Leo
Its also safe to assume AMD's engineers already did years of R&D and weighing the pros and cons. Hence the final result was 3D Cache only on one of them. I also think its safe to say the purchasing public is already full educated enough to know what they are getting with a 3D V-Cache cpu and are getting it for one specific reason.
I read somewhere else that they tested in both CCDs and that didnt bring anything all that great to the table, so they chose to put it only in one instead of in 2...maybe to keep prices as low as they can.
@@TSEDLE333 I mean...most games can't use more than 8 cores right now so crippling the clock on another ccd by adding vcache that won't be used as much might be worse.. Current approach can get us the best of both world for gaming and heavy workloads.
If AMD wants to increase the quality of this chiptset driver will it happen as updates to the BIOS or as updates to windows? If it's BIOS updates that will make this processor more troublesome than it's worth.
i had high hopes when i saw the older cpus getting compared then when the game graphs came out i was saddened by not seeing all the cpus at 1440p. i was like theirs hope then nope. 😂
IIRC Luke used an undervolt to make his Ry. 9 7950x more power than thermally limited to obtain his scores, while it's a sensible thing to do, the danger is golden samples being sent to reviewers who habitually overclock, so their results are rarely achievable by normal customers. Having just installed an 5800x3D upgrade, then discovering Gigabyte's BIOS utility was ignoring important new updates, I got to enjoy the amazing power efficiency of cores locked to base clock, which lead me to see 40C on Time Spy CPU benchmark and the power staying at 25-30w as if it were a laptop running on battery :)
7900xtx sent to reviewers were _absolutely_ golden samples. Very few end users have been able to hit the same boost speeds shown in reviews. For this reason alone it's important to watch small channels that have to buy their own hardware.
@@zodwraith5745 I noticed differences at the time, but the base & max boost are generally conservative. My 5800x3D runs 3.6 base and a max boost on 4 of the cores, not just the best 2 of 4.55, which is well above the advertised spec on the box 3.4 & 4.5. AMD don't advertise the theoretical max boost because it happens for too short a time to see it, which lead to complaints about Zen2. However I don't see those boosts in games, the system is just handling the demand in its stride and when ST where max boost can occur the core isn't heavily utilised, so frequency looks low. FWIW the 7950x has an official 4.5/5.7 but all core boost can briefly hit 5GHz in the right conditions and 5.85GHz max boost has been reported. That doesn't mean you'll see that frequently in normal use. Mine's generally below 50C gaming with occasional spikes to 60C. My point is under volts are over-clocking and there's no guarantee that it's reproducible on any particular untested CPU. If they meet the specs on stock settings then all is well. I've seen so many claims Zen3 was hard to cool but my experience is the absolute opposite.
@@RobBCactive I wasn't talking about Zen4, I was talking about RDNA3, which has been wildly variable. If only AMD made as good of GPUs as they do CPUs. Nvidia is the one that needs to be knocked down about 3 notches, not Intel.
@@zodwraith5745 OK, I assumed it was habit as the video and my comment was about the Zen4 CPU line. The product numbers are too similar. RDNA3 launch has had problems, either the drivers can improve alot or a silicon revision will bring the expected performance.
Not being able to review something isn't a con, is it? The upfront cost of AM5 will be mitigated over the longevity of the platform. Idle power of 100W is wrong, it seems to be dependent on the motherboard, as discussed by TechTesters, which was between 23.9 W and 56 W idle power depending on the motherboard. What's that all about? I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm saying that your data is suspect.
To be crystal clear, the 7950X3D CPU idle power draw on the Asus was 48W and system power 121W. The 7950X CPU power draw was 51W and the system power draw was 130W. Leo
@@KitGuruTech Power at the wall, I understand. But it seems that idle power could be lower based on other motherboards. Although, once you run Blender for a bit, it's all forgiven. Part of that is the cost of the chiplet design and the I/O die. Makes sense to turn it off when not in use.
Looks great. However, I decided to get 7900x + 32gb ram + B650E mobo for $600 at microcenter. I dont think x3d is worth extra $400 which is almost additional 66% of price.
I would be astonished if that were the case. I expect the 7800X3D to be 30%+ faster than the 7700X in gaming which will be a very useful increase. In pure CPU tests such as Blender and Cinebench the cache won't help. The point is that the 5800X3D is either at the top or bottom of the charts while the 7800X3D will be consistently in high in the charts and perhaps in the middle. Leo
@@KitGuruTech So from my understanding the 3d cache on the 7950x3d will have equal performance to the 3d cache on the 7800x3d? is this correct? Sorry if my wording isn't the best.
This is mainly for gaming aspects from the 3d cache, im not fussed on the cost either i don't really want to wait a month to finish my build, i started my build in november hahaha.
@@TheMessiah1337 Impossible to know for sure until we test it but in principle, yes, that seems most likely. Look at the boost for Ryzen 9 7950X3D over 7950X and add that percentage to Ryzen 7 7000. Leo
@@KitGuruTech Okay awesome and thanks that was my biggest concern, im not fussed with the cost of the product but if the 3d cache side of the cpu both perform equally from the 7800x3d and the 7950x3d thats all i care about =)
They do. Sapphire Rapids improved Intel's situation in server a lot, but Epycs are still more efficient on top of overall maintaining their perf lead (unless you consider edge cases with Intel's specialized accelerators).
0:17 I will never understand what is the point of so much empty space ... waste of space, more money spent for shipping. My Ryzen 5700X came in a huge box with 95% of it empty ...
Your skepticism is warranted. At $700 it's a joke. With how everyone is gushing over it AMD must be paying out some good marketing money while only a handful are pointing out the emperor has no clothes. The choice of games here read like they came at AMD's request. You badly need to balance out your games selection. Save $150 and buy a 13900kf for 98% of the gaming but better production. 2% average better in gaming =/= 22% increase in price. If you're concerned with production only go with the 7950x and still save $125. If you're just gaming save $300 with a 13700kf, 5800x3d, or wait a whopping month for the 7800x3d, and apply that savings towards your GPU that will give you _vastly_ more performance over your CPU. Honestly there's no one that I can see buying this outside of bragging rights for how much you spent, and we all know those guys are wankers. As a consumer trading money for a product the most important spec you should care about your purchases is performance per dollar, and this loses badly in that spec. It's not like the 4090 where there's no competition in it's class so it can demand a premium. Just like Nvidia is successfully brainwashing people into thinking 4 figures is normal for a GPU, AMD is hard at work to convince people $700 is normal for a CPU. Ironic how quickly everyone that laughed at the 13900ks stupid pricing magically think this is ok at that same price, and I don't remember any benchmarks _degrading_ with the KS over it's sibling. At least the KS could make the argument that it was only for hardcore overclockers that happily pay $1000+ for binned silicon. These OC for shit. Stop rewarding these corps' money grabs with good reviews.
AMD is in a challenging position with the X3D line. How much better will the 7800X3D be compared with the 5800X3D (which destroyed its Intel counterparts in gaming)? Theoretically, it should be better in gaming than the 7950X3D because that will be a "gaming only" CPU, and the 7950X3D, which suppose to be the "do it all", doesn't appear to be the monster that it should be in production workloads, so it doesn't justify its price. Hence, they can't let the 7800X3D be much better than the 7950X3D because it will make it pointless; it seems that AMD will purposely cripple the 7800X3D gaming performance(or maybe not???).
@@fluphybunny930 That's system power draw. The Core i9-13900K pulls 11W at idle, 100W for the system. The AMD CPUs are 43W and 51W while the AMD systems are 121W and 130W. Leo
For pure gaming the 7800X3D is great, silent and easy to keep cool, but if you want a more flexible setup go with the 14900K as it delivers in games and all applications, including single core tasks, emulation and AI. Power consumption in idle and low workload is also better, so if you surf or do light office work on the system a lot, you may even save money compared to AMD. Task scheduling is much better on a 14900k than on the 7950X3D, so Intel saves you a lot of headaches. There are a few games that also have problems with E-Cores and could profit from something like Process Lasso, but you don't need it all the time to get the best performance.
Everything I could say will sound very mean, so I won’t, lol😂 but I use to tell my gramma, of tell me about that time you, and there he goes, 2 hours later he still at it lol😂
Software is needed because as you said it's a dual CCD with 3d vcache on only one CCD. The reason the 5800x3d "just worked" without software is because it only has one CCD. So not a con Leo, you're nitpicking on that one! Better a few software hoops to jump through than all the pain that the Intel 12th gen's thread director problems had at launch. Comparatively after the AMD bios update and chipset install it all "just worked" very well, so I would consider that a pro!
AMD has always used 'slight of hand' to exagerate their CPU's performance claims. It's why I haven't bought an AMD processor since their disingenuous 'XP' range back in 2001. And they are still using trickery to compete with intel to this day!
Update: the 7950X3D will launch at retail tomorrow, 28th February. It will be sold for £749.99 at OCUK for UK buyers
Talking of launches, I've just seen an "overview" of an MSI Tomahawk X670E board from an Australia-based channel on RUclips. I can't find this anywhere (else) except a "leak" on Twitter from someone with a few hundred followers. Is it a thing? Even a rumor of a thing?
@@treyquattro It's listed on MSI's website, so i'd say it is certainly a thing www.msi.com/Motherboard/MAG-X670E-TOMAHAWK-WIFI/Overview
So right now on ocuk it's £150 more expensive and barely any faster than the 13900K.. I'll stay with my 3900X. lol
@@KitGuruTech and now Bing is returning the same link that you supplied. Evidently a timing thing. Must be announced/embargoed until today and not yet visible in Pacific time zone.
Thanks Leo all the way from North Carolina Research Triangle Park area Raleigh/Durham. I love how you get straight into it without all the misleading and big question mark thumbnails. (Sorry Gamers Nexus/Paul's Hardware...etc) I like your honest and old school mindset when it comes to these reviews. Straight, no chaser.
Thank you mr. Leo.
-20 degrees and +~20% perfomance gain??!
Good job AMD!
Apply the same power limits to the 7950x and you'll see very little performance drop. Both AMD and Intel crank the voltage WAY higher than needed to try and eek out that last 1-2% Sad part is the gaming boost is not 20% vs everything, just in cache sensitive or latency sensitive games. The choice of games here really massively favors that. SotTR LOVES cache and should be thrown out when no one plays it anymore. It inflates averages and misinforms the viewer.
I'll be ordering my 7900X 3D tomorrow. The decrease in heat will make these even more attractive for SFF builds. I plan on sizing down and putting in my new Cooler Master NRP200 MAX build this week.
@Qta And for gaming the 7800x3d is very likely to post the same gaming benchmarks as any of these.
It for sure uses 8 cores w/ the 3d v cache, correct and not just 6? That is my concern, I'm worried the 7900 might be the worst for gaming.
@@fluphybunny930 Technically. It would lise in the games that done benefit from v-Cache and would prefer higher clocks.
The 7900X3D might have a two 6-core CCD design so therefore only 6 cores would have the stacked 3D v-cache
@@ij6708 This is confirmed fact.
I own a 7900x3D now. Thanks for the review. Tech powerup has this checklist for setting up the core parking thing.
Is that complicated to do?
Wow, Leo reminds me of John Houseman on MasterPiece Theatre! I am mesmerized by his descriptions of the 7959x3D! Good job, chum! Thanks for a solid review!
A Leo review just after the weekend. My favourite for a Monday night 😊
Missed this yesterday. Great stuff Leo, many thanks for the work, its genuinely useful for what i have coming in the post soon!
Love that you aren't focused on 1080p results.
Great that Leo did this instead of luke ! New perspective and you don’t look bored out of your head like luke lately either !
Agree❤
Yep 100%
Luke is bored just.
Yeah why is this channel always like that? That's a good point. Lazy, bored, mumbling all the time.
Thank you for calling them out. Hopefully they get their act together.
@@8020Alive its only really luke JT. Leo and James and Dominic are doing great content.
A lot of work in his Leo. Well done ❤
Thanks for the in-depth info on AMDs recommendations for set up. Not seeing this info from other sources.
The setup stuff you included for this processor is extremely helpful, bookmarking for later when I get it ahah. Cheers!
I'll be booting mine up for the first time tomorrow.
Elsewhere I've seen KGL described as Known Good List.
THE ONLY HONEST, REAL WITH MUCH OF COMMON SENSE... review of 7950X 3D in all RUclips!! 🎉👍🏻🙏🏻
The reason for the discrepancy between Luke's chip and Leo's is brilliantly explained in DerBauer's recent video
Power consumption and temps are fantastic! that said, I am staying with my 5800X3D for now. it does what I need and paired with a 4080, it sips power while i work and fits all of my gaming needs.
Thanks for the review and especially that unboxing.
Thank you very much Leo for this thorough test. It really gives an objective insight. Maybe you could also consider making a comparison of 7950X3D vs 7900 non X model.
Its big difference
Amazing Leo managed to unbox this one without thowing the packaging across the room in disgust.
Thanks Leo, great video. I'm upgrading from an I9-11900k and have a rtx 4080 and the same asus motherboard featured in this video. Very helpful and is going to be my go to resource for getting everything up and running 👍
Your 7950X is pulling only 36,369 in Cinibench? Something is definitely NOT right. Mine is around 39,200. Try setting -30 on curve optimizer but set your FClock max to -350 and try -325, then -300, and so on until it's unstable. Watch your CPU temps drop 20C, just like the 3D part. If you're running that low, it makes all your other numbers suspect. Thanks for including some of Luke's numbers.
Nice review as always, I find myself coming here more and more often for that first review.
I have to say your video quality is very good.
fantastic technical analysis Kitguru - learned a lot, and will likely need to watch it again when my processor and new board arrives!
For myself, someone who's worked in and around Game/Software development its interesting nobody is talking about how amazing these 3D-V Cache chips still are at UNREAL ENGINE and Unity Engine compiling and game development.
How good is it?
@@DragonOfTheMortalKombat basically almost same perf as 7950x.. and at least 30-40% lower power consumption from other reviewers data
@@hiimcortana1568 I asked specifically for unreal/unity actually....
This was a GREAT video. Seriously the best technical analysis of this tech love it.
If you want peak gaming performance or want a powerful cpu with cores/threads exclusively in a small form factor build - 7950X3D is great, due to lower power consumption and temps. 13900K is limited to the bigger side of SFF that can support a 280 aio. 7950X3D on a low profile air cooler in smaller cases is a good pairing.
Intel released the 13900 non k variant this year that has a sizable lower TDP without much performance loss so it's great for SFF cases. Considering the very premium price of the 7950x 3D I believe the 13900/13900k is the better option overall since its about $120 cheaper, offers similar gaming performance and remains number 1 in content creation software. The 7950x 3D is great, but it's not the "one to rule them all" like I was hoping it would be.
@@03chrisv SFF alone is already a premium with more expensive PSU's, and Motherboards. If you're in the market for an i9/Ryzen 9 and SFF, $120 difference shouldn't be a dealbreaker. Though the i9 13900 will draw less power than the K variant, it'll perform noticably worse in gaming with its locked clocked speed(vs. K) and 5600mhz ram. The 7950X3D can undervolt better with PBO2 CO, boosting performance while reducing temps and power at the same time. You can't go wrong with either CPU, but I'd take the 7950X3D because it's faster. That extra cache greatly helps the 1% lows for 240hz/360hz high refresh rate titles - Apex legends, Valorant, R6 Siege and also it'll greatly benefit MMO games like the 5800X3D did. If you're on 4K, the 13900 makes sense.
I agree it's definitely not the "one to rule them all", it's more of a niche product IMO. You're getting the fastest and power efficient gaming cpu and a high thread cpu that gets you roughly 95% the way there in productivity. It'll tick those boxes out there for someone.
What's peculiar about Tiny Tina's Wonderland? It's recently become a benchmarking staple. Has there been some controversy?
P.S: 3D-CCDs-only edition when?
Interestingly in Hitman I've seen where the 7950X 3D fairs a bit better over the i9 with a 7900XTX
Even if processors are usually mostly GPU limited at 4K, I'd still like to see the results for 4K. For those like me, the most relevant results for gaming are going to be those that represent how I game-4K. I know that results are technically most interesting for lower resolutions, but there are differences in plenty of scenarios at 4K, and 4K is a future resolution even if it has been around a long time (I've been gaming at 4K for about 10 years!).
This is nevertheless a great review. Thank you 👍
(Edited to add deserved kudos.)
Same here
Exactly my reaction with that block of foam when I got mine haha, yea like at least they could have at least included more free stuff.. like this stuff aint cheap
I know people like the gaming performance, but I think the best quality of this cpu is the productivity AND the gaming performance. Obviously last gen the 5800x3d took a hit to performance that didn't make it viable for serious prod work. But what do I know lol.
High idle power draw as he talks about at the end is also a bit irksome, reminds me of the 7900 gpus in a way.
Thank you for this beautifully detailed content.
The question on my mind is this. While playing games (1080P / 1440P), I want to stream over the GPU (RTX 4080 )and record video on the CPU at the same time. According to this scenario, should I buy 7950X or 7950X3D?
A tough decision!
Leo
@@KitGuruTech Actually, what I'm trying to ask is, can the 7950X3D run that much performance with x264 overhead? It's really ridiculous that no one has tested this.
@@PcKolog The only way to be sure is to try it. Part of the answer will come down to parking the game on the 3D CCD however recording/streaming might go better using the IGP in which case the CPU won't be handling both tasks.
Leo
So high idle power consumption is still a thing? Thought it was software issues...
Thank you for the 1440p gaming benchmarks!
That was an absolutely brilliant article leo. I love the approach. Much more organic.
Great video loads of info on installing chip
A great processor and fantastic work from AMD, but surely that setup procedure has to be an issue for most people?
When are we getting a shirt with Leo on it in the store?
The early gaming benchmarks aren't giving us the total picture of the 3d CPUs yet...wait for a few driver and BIOS updates and performance will definitely go much higher and more consistently across games.
I really would like to do AM5 build but the expense is off putting.
Jeeze, that card is beastly. Nice to see the 5900x holding up well.
Nicely done
Leo😊
I was waiting for this review. :)
good job. maybe the 7950x3d will replace my 7700x but i will wait for the 7800x3d reviews
How do you have it before it release
Nice review.
Isn’t there issues with Windows picking the wrong cores for gaming?
Leo that’s a serious shift you put in there man.
Hi Sir thnkyou for all the videos. I always watch.
I want to build a pc: but i am confused: it will this cpu: ryzen 9 7950x3d or the intel i9 14900k with the master motherboard.
I will use it for heavy programming(coding) and i also want to game: think with the 4080 or 70ti
Wich would you recommend?
I like to hear.😊
How come no one checks Microsoft Flight Simulator
Indeed
Nice one Leo!
can you try turn based games like stellaris or civ 6 on these 3 chips? sim a certain number of turns and measure the time
'I still don't know what is KGL stands for' 😅😅 Me too...
Great performance from amd. But that software section melted my brain.
Luke's 7550x seems like overclocked with pbo 2, very similar results
If I am using my PC as a dedicated VR gaming rig, can just disable the non-cache cores in the BIOS and avoid all of the drivers and other software steps?
The drivers allow the system to determine how the workloads are allocated to the CPU cores. If you want to experiement, the easiest way imo is to use some new options in the BIOS to force the system to prioritise the CCD with extra cache. and then switch it to the regular CCD. No need to disable any cores at all.
Leo
if you are using your PC as a dedicated VR gaming rig, this is the wrong processor for you, and you should just buy the half you want to use.
from what I'm seeing and hearing about this processor,... it is a throwback (in design terms) to the "Dual Pentium" processor days,... only AMD jammed them both into one socket... and is actually quite a bargain in this manner!! It's a R7 7800X3D ($449) and a R7 7700X (~$340?). So... at it's retail price of $699 You're getting the value of ~$789 (not to mention the efficiency of them being in one chip) and You only need an AM5 motherboard with one socket.
since all the cores will have the 3d cache on the 7800x3d i guess all these extra steps will be pointless
Yup, that's what I say in my conclusion. I cannot think the extra drivers will be necessary for Ryzen 7 3D and that will make the review of that CPU all the more interesting.
Leo
Its also safe to assume AMD's engineers already did years of R&D and weighing the pros and cons. Hence the final result was 3D Cache only on one of them. I also think its safe to say the purchasing public is already full educated enough to know what they are getting with a 3D V-Cache cpu and are getting it for one specific reason.
I read somewhere else that they tested in both CCDs and that didnt bring anything all that great to the table, so they chose to put it only in one instead of in 2...maybe to keep prices as low as they can.
@@TSEDLE333 I mean...most games can't use more than 8 cores right now so crippling the clock on another ccd by adding vcache that won't be used as much might be worse.. Current approach can get us the best of both world for gaming and heavy workloads.
Just wait for the cheaper 7800x3D and be totally blown away by its gaming performance, beatin a 13900KS muahaha
If AMD wants to increase the quality of this chiptset driver will it happen as updates to the BIOS or as updates to windows? If it's BIOS updates that will make this processor more troublesome than it's worth.
imagine not wanting to update your UEFI firmware :v
i had high hopes when i saw the older cpus getting compared then when the game graphs came out i was saddened by not seeing all the cpus at 1440p. i was like theirs hope then nope. 😂
I don't have 3D V cache Performance Optimizer, how do I download it?
It is part of the chipset driver package
IIRC Luke used an undervolt to make his Ry. 9 7950x more power than thermally limited to obtain his scores, while it's a sensible thing to do, the danger is golden samples being sent to reviewers who habitually overclock, so their results are rarely achievable by normal customers.
Having just installed an 5800x3D upgrade, then discovering Gigabyte's BIOS utility was ignoring important new updates, I got to enjoy the amazing power efficiency of cores locked to base clock, which lead me to see 40C on Time Spy CPU benchmark and the power staying at 25-30w as if it were a laptop running on battery :)
7900xtx sent to reviewers were _absolutely_ golden samples. Very few end users have been able to hit the same boost speeds shown in reviews. For this reason alone it's important to watch small channels that have to buy their own hardware.
@@zodwraith5745 I noticed differences at the time, but the base & max boost are generally conservative.
My 5800x3D runs 3.6 base and a max boost on 4 of the cores, not just the best 2 of 4.55, which is well above the advertised spec on the box 3.4 & 4.5.
AMD don't advertise the theoretical max boost because it happens for too short a time to see it, which lead to complaints about Zen2.
However I don't see those boosts in games, the system is just handling the demand in its stride and when ST where max boost can occur the core isn't heavily utilised, so frequency looks low.
FWIW the 7950x has an official 4.5/5.7 but all core boost can briefly hit 5GHz in the right conditions and 5.85GHz max boost has been reported.
That doesn't mean you'll see that frequently in normal use. Mine's generally below 50C gaming with occasional spikes to 60C.
My point is under volts are over-clocking and there's no guarantee that it's reproducible on any particular untested CPU.
If they meet the specs on stock settings then all is well. I've seen so many claims Zen3 was hard to cool but my experience is the absolute opposite.
@@RobBCactive I wasn't talking about Zen4, I was talking about RDNA3, which has been wildly variable. If only AMD made as good of GPUs as they do CPUs. Nvidia is the one that needs to be knocked down about 3 notches, not Intel.
@@zodwraith5745 OK, I assumed it was habit as the video and my comment was about the Zen4 CPU line. The product numbers are too similar.
RDNA3 launch has had problems, either the drivers can improve alot or a silicon revision will bring the expected performance.
Kind of high priced and hard to setup to work like yours. Wait a few months it will be half price 🙂
commenting on black friday, and the processor dropped from $700 to $600 recently.
Not being able to review something isn't a con, is it? The upfront cost of AM5 will be mitigated over the longevity of the platform. Idle power of 100W is wrong, it seems to be dependent on the motherboard, as discussed by TechTesters, which was between 23.9 W and 56 W idle power depending on the motherboard. What's that all about? I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm saying that your data is suspect.
To be crystal clear, the 7950X3D CPU idle power draw on the Asus was 48W and system power 121W. The 7950X CPU power draw was 51W and the system power draw was 130W.
Leo
@@KitGuruTech Power at the wall, I understand. But it seems that idle power could be lower based on other motherboards. Although, once you run Blender for a bit, it's all forgiven. Part of that is the cost of the chiplet design and the I/O die. Makes sense to turn it off when not in use.
Please please run DCS world and MSFS....v hard to find anything for simmers
When will 7950 be replaced by new next generation and will that use 3nm technology?
That would be Zen 5 which is due 'by 2024' so either this year or next.
@@KitGuruTech when do you think zen 5 will be released in 2024, which month?
Looks great. However, I decided to get 7900x + 32gb ram + B650E mobo for $600 at microcenter. I dont think x3d is worth extra $400 which is almost additional 66% of price.
why is tiny tina a weird game choice? it the newest release in the borderlands series that came out last year
thank you i was wondering what that was like barbie's horse ranch or something? lol
Complicated install for it to work compared to the 5800X3D. Jeez that RTX 4080 is bigger then Leo.
Can someone explain to me in simple terms how/if the 7800x3d could/will be better/faster than the 7950x3d please?
I would be astonished if that were the case. I expect the 7800X3D to be 30%+ faster than the 7700X in gaming which will be a very useful increase. In pure CPU tests such as Blender and Cinebench the cache won't help. The point is that the 5800X3D is either at the top or bottom of the charts while the 7800X3D will be consistently in high in the charts and perhaps in the middle.
Leo
@@KitGuruTech So from my understanding the 3d cache on the 7950x3d will have equal performance to the 3d cache on the 7800x3d? is this correct? Sorry if my wording isn't the best.
This is mainly for gaming aspects from the 3d cache, im not fussed on the cost either i don't really want to wait a month to finish my build, i started my build in november hahaha.
@@TheMessiah1337 Impossible to know for sure until we test it but in principle, yes, that seems most likely. Look at the boost for Ryzen 9 7950X3D over 7950X and add that percentage to Ryzen 7 7000.
Leo
@@KitGuruTech Okay awesome and thanks that was my biggest concern, im not fussed with the cost of the product but if the 3d cache side of the cpu both perform equally from the 7800x3d and the 7950x3d thats all i care about =)
for the price it better be, considering its twice the cost of a 13700k and gives only a few percent more frames ill pass
But the power consumption and the cooler for 3dv is greater than intel.
@@lelouchabrilvelda1794 this is likely true, my 13700k does get rather toasty from all the power is consumes
I really like your content
If AMD has similar power draw in the server market, they'll stomp Intel.
Keeping a room full of servers cool is no joke.
They do. Sapphire Rapids improved Intel's situation in server a lot, but Epycs are still more efficient on top of overall maintaining their perf lead (unless you consider edge cases with Intel's specialized accelerators).
So, the games we thought where GPU bottlenecked on rtx 3090 in 2021 where actually CPU bottlenecked?
Put it this way; in future I shall pay MUCH more attention to the choice of CPU when I read/watch graphics card reviews.
Leo
Funny how 5800x3d is almost next to it :D
0:17 I will never understand what is the point of so much empty space ... waste of space, more money spent for shipping.
My Ryzen 5700X came in a huge box with 95% of it empty ...
Didn't the 5700X come with a cooler like all the other x700X CPUs (3700X, 2700X)? It should've came with a Wraith Prism.
@@vigilant_1934 No, it doesn't come with a cooler. I think all 8 cores and up don't come with cooler. (and CPUs who get a cooler will get the stealth)
its just some % higher than intel and intel has now lowered their prices making them the bang for the buck. but amd has crazy good tdp/performance
You can use 20$ cooler on that x3d too
I see the review and am amazed.
16 core with 3dV and using cheap cooler and get only 70c or lower.
AMD's packaging is getting slightly better too. . . Slightly. .
No. No. No. Looking at Averages is a big mistake. 1% low tells the whole story.
And that, of course, is the reason we include figures for both averages and 1% low.
@@KitGuruTech you tell him !
Your skepticism is warranted. At $700 it's a joke. With how everyone is gushing over it AMD must be paying out some good marketing money while only a handful are pointing out the emperor has no clothes. The choice of games here read like they came at AMD's request. You badly need to balance out your games selection.
Save $150 and buy a 13900kf for 98% of the gaming but better production. 2% average better in gaming =/= 22% increase in price. If you're concerned with production only go with the 7950x and still save $125. If you're just gaming save $300 with a 13700kf, 5800x3d, or wait a whopping month for the 7800x3d, and apply that savings towards your GPU that will give you _vastly_ more performance over your CPU.
Honestly there's no one that I can see buying this outside of bragging rights for how much you spent, and we all know those guys are wankers. As a consumer trading money for a product the most important spec you should care about your purchases is performance per dollar, and this loses badly in that spec. It's not like the 4090 where there's no competition in it's class so it can demand a premium.
Just like Nvidia is successfully brainwashing people into thinking 4 figures is normal for a GPU, AMD is hard at work to convince people $700 is normal for a CPU. Ironic how quickly everyone that laughed at the 13900ks stupid pricing magically think this is ok at that same price, and I don't remember any benchmarks _degrading_ with the KS over it's sibling. At least the KS could make the argument that it was only for hardcore overclockers that happily pay $1000+ for binned silicon. These OC for shit. Stop rewarding these corps' money grabs with good reviews.
They have to optimize and streamline the software….
thats OS side...they did their part, MS is the one not caring about their 'partners' all that much.
As a Brit you should know that KGL stands for King's German Legion 😂
My 5600x gets older by the second 🥲
AMD is in a challenging position with the X3D line. How much better will the 7800X3D be compared with the 5800X3D (which destroyed its Intel counterparts in gaming)? Theoretically, it should be better in gaming than the 7950X3D because that will be a "gaming only" CPU, and the 7950X3D, which suppose to be the "do it all", doesn't appear to be the monster that it should be in production workloads, so it doesn't justify its price. Hence, they can't let the 7800X3D be much better than the 7950X3D because it will make it pointless; it seems that AMD will purposely cripple the 7800X3D gaming performance(or maybe not???).
100Watts idle??? My electricity supplier will love me
They'd love you more if you bought Intel....
@@TSEDLE333 No intel is 100watts idle.
Something not right there.
learn to undervolt and stop whinging
@@stormking1973 imagine undervolting the cpu to try limiting the power consumption @ idle... dafuq dude? 😂😂
@@fluphybunny930 That's system power draw. The Core i9-13900K pulls 11W at idle, 100W for the system. The AMD CPUs are 43W and 51W while the AMD systems are 121W and 130W.
Leo
For pure gaming the 7800X3D is great, silent and easy to keep cool, but if you want a more flexible setup go with the 14900K as it delivers in games and all applications, including single core tasks, emulation and AI. Power consumption in idle and low workload is also better, so if you surf or do light office work on the system a lot, you may even save money compared to AMD. Task scheduling is much better on a 14900k than on the 7950X3D, so Intel saves you a lot of headaches. There are a few games that also have problems with E-Cores and could profit from something like Process Lasso, but you don't need it all the time to get the best performance.
Everything I could say will sound very mean, so I won’t, lol😂 but I use to tell my gramma, of tell me about that time you, and there he goes, 2 hours later he still at it lol😂
13900k yes
AMD is the best 🎉🎉🎉🎉
Space cashhhhhh
Software is needed because as you said it's a dual CCD with 3d vcache on only one CCD. The reason the 5800x3d "just worked" without software is because it only has one CCD. So not a con Leo, you're nitpicking on that one! Better a few software hoops to jump through than all the pain that the Intel 12th gen's thread director problems had at launch. Comparatively after the AMD bios update and chipset install it all "just worked" very well, so I would consider that a pro!
Scary pricy, nothing else.
someone please give leo a cookies,
anyway nice review sir
AMD has always used 'slight of hand' to exagerate their CPU's performance claims. It's why I haven't bought an AMD processor since their disingenuous 'XP' range back in 2001. And they are still using trickery to compete with intel to this day!
AMDs naming system just confuses me.
hate seeing pointless wasteful packaging like that. They can do better in that regard.