The Searchers is a brutal, beautiful, powerful film, with John Ford at his directorial best and John Wayne in perhaps his finest performance. It will always be a favorite of mine. This was an amazing account of the behind-the-scenes, making me appreciate the movie even more. Well done, TCM!
I have never seen the character of Ethan Edwards, portrayed by John Wayne, as being racist. Did he hate the Commanches, yes, but why wouldn't he after what they did to Edwards' extended family! So many people are in denial that some of the Indians were savages who committed monstrous acts.
It might be worth noting that at the film's start, before any carnage has occurred, Edwards's first comment about Martin Pawley (played by Jeffrey Hunter), after looking at him with evident distrust and distate, is to say, "You look more like a half-breed." Why does Edwards distrust Pawley? Why is his first comment about Pawley's ethnicity? Might Edwards, a former Confederate soldier, have been a racist even before the atrocities visited upon his family?
@@WestVillageCrank When Debbie hides in the cemetery, the grave-marker behind her has the name of Ethan and Aaron's mother, and it says, "killed by Comanches." So, long before the Comanches kill Martha, Aaron, and Lucy, they had already killed Ethan's mother and, perhaps, other members of his family, not to mention friends and neighbors. To be sure, the white settlers were also violent "savages" who committed atrocious acts. Scar is a mirror image of Ethan. Scar relates how his wife and children were killed by whites and that he takes scalps of whites in revenge for those killings. It was a long drawn out war between the invaders (the white settlers) and the natives (the Comanches and other tribes). Those were the times. If any one of us lived in those times, we might be the same way. Ethan's attitude toward the Comanche in this story are clearly due to a personal, revenge-fueled blood feud from a protracted war.
I don't deny that Ethan is racist, but so are most of the characters in the story. For Ethan's racism to be a defining trait of his character, his racist attitude would have to stand out when compared to the other characters. However, Ethan's attitude toward the Comanches (and other Native Americans) is exactly the same as those of the other characters, with the possible exception of Marty. In fact, Laurie even says that Martha, Debbie's own mother, if she were still alive, would want Ethan to kill Debbie. Even her own mother would want that. So, Ethan is not at all unique in his attitudes. When Ethan doesn't kill Debbie, but brings her home instead, he hasn't suddenly become tolerant and loving toward the Comanches. In fact, he and the other white men have just wiped out the Comanche village, and Ethan is holding the bloody scalp of Scar in his hand. I can't imagine him saying to Debbie when he picks her up in the mouth of the cave mere minutes later, "It's okay for you to go on living with the Comanches and to take another husband from among them. I have come to love and respect them." No, that's absurd! His attitude toward the Comanche wouldn't change that fast; it remains unchanged. He is a hard, mean character. But in the moment that he takes Debbie in his arms, compassion for his niece prevails. However, there is no evidence that he has developed compassion for the Comanches. The popular interpretation of this movie that Ethan's character arc involves going from super-racist to slightly-less-racist is not borne out by the facts of the story as presented in the movie.
@@Mike-wr7om I would not argue any of that. My point was that on meeting Martin, Ethan's reaction is distrustful and full of distaste, even though not only is it clear that Martin 7/8th "white", but by definition, Ethan is disgusted someone who is 7/8ths "white" because he is 1/8th not-white. The family embraces Martin, trusts him, likes him, but for the remainder of that scene, Ethan treats him with coldness and dismissal. On what basis? He looks like a half-breed and he is 1/8th Native American. Would that not qualify as a racist position? Again, your answer deals with the bulk of the movie; I confined my comment to the scene where Ethan and Martin meet. I would add that Ethan spends most of the remainder of the movie putting Martin down, and most of the comedy of the movie is at the expense of Martin.
It has been suggested that Scar is supposed to be mixed race, no attempt was made to hide Henry Brandon's bright blue eyes, as with Jeffrey Hunter. And Wayne's character knows the Comanche language and customs. Fascinating film, so much depth that's never stated, there's complexity and turmoil bubbling and raging under the surface. Powerful lesson in storytelling, know your characters intimately but only hint at things.
Some people are just aggressively ignorant in their efforts to feel morally superior. Because, sure, in 1956, a major Warner Brothers film is going to cast an utter unprofessional, random person who happens to be native in a KEY villain role...? Riiighhht. The speaking roles were assigned to ACTORS. And there were few, if any, actors to be found residing in Monument Valley.
Both Sargent Rutledge and The Searchers were memorable films. One actor not mentioned who had significant parts in both films was Jeffrey Hunter. Thought he should have been.
"The Searchers" has been one of my top, favorite, films, since I first saw it a young kid living in Oklahoma. I was too young to understand certain elements of the characters and situations, and I would be confused about John Wayne's character seemingly having a moment when he didn't seem like he wanted to help his niece. It reminded me of southwest Texas, and New Mexico, where I had lived during the ages of five to eight years old. I had visited the old Fort Davis, in the Big Bend country of southwest Texas, near my town of Alpine, and there was an element of the old west, with people having horse corrals in town, and there were rodeos to attend. It turns out that Fort Davis was where the Buffalo Soldiers were stationed, and another top favorite film of mine is "Sergeant Rutledge", and just outside the nearby town of Marfa was where "Giant" was filmed, although not a John Ford film, it reminds me of my childhood. What a gift we have in John Ford westerns. Listening to this sixth episode of "The Mythmaker: Decoding John Ford/The Plot Thickens", I was surprised at the telling of how John Ford played music while filming scenes in The Searchers. That is artistry. It's like an opera; having music to help direct the emotions and perceptions of the actors and crew, in their work. It makes sense for the outcome of this amazing film, "The Searchers". Thanks for your wonderful podcast series!
Ford reminds of the Commanding Officer I had (yes, including me). “Im in charge, if I want your opinion I’ll ask for it, otherwise keep your mouth shut “
While Clint Eastwood is often cited as the prototype of the anti-hero, we see a little bit of this with Ford's own evolution and re-imagining the hero character from previous films. So Wayne as Ethan Edwards is perhaps the original anti-hero trope. I also find it interesting that Ford used "mood music" to get the actors in the right frame of mind. He apparently was drawing from his silent-era days when music was added to the silent film to get the audience in the right mood ... I can hear the violins playing now.
In his reticence to explain himself, perhaps Ford didn't want to dictate the meaning of his art; he left it to us to interpret it. It's up to us. For all his authoritarian personality traits, his art can't be defined by it. In that sense, the artist's personality doesn't matter, no matter how much we want it to crack the code for us. Some of the commentators in this series seem not to understand that basic premise of artistic experience.
"Duke" didn't fight the fascists when it was time to stand up for democratic "American values," so he fought socialism - instead of fascism - in the newspapers and in committee hearings. He'd love the every-man-for-himself-neoliberalism that was bestowed on us (by both parties) after his death: cutthroat capitalism gave us Trump - whom Wayne might also have loved (hear Wayne believing way too strongly in things he did not understand at 35:02). For all his achievements as an artist, John Wayne was a dunce and a hypocrite and a failure as a citizen, by his own account. He was also a selfish careerist at best (he sat out WWII to advance his career, then made a career out of playing himself in "patriotic" wars, scolding the kids who didn't want to die in Vietnam as "soft") or, at worst, a coward. You decide. But, those aren't American values AND, as I said in my comments about Ford, bad as he was, it really shouldn't matter in our appreciation (or dislike) of his art, believe it or not.
@@geert574 I'm trying to make a broader point here about how we should judge an artist - or more specifically, his art - in light of his personality and his life. Which is to say that we shouldn't judge an artist or his art by what we (think) we know about his life. I guess you didn't dig it.
Ford's issues with Henry Brandon might have had other sources. Though married to a woman between 1941-46, Brandon was primarily homosexual, including a very long-term relationship with Mark Herron. And as noted in the previous installment, there have been persistent questions about Ford's conflicts with his own sexuality. (Maureen O'Hara, a Ford favorite and devoted actor, said she saw Ford kissing another man.)
Another application of today’s sensibilities to yesterday’s films that reflect a certain lack of understanding of the realities of that time. For example, can the commentators suggest a “native” actor of the period that would have been acceptable to the studio bosses? I’ll wait.
@@TR-yi8up Riiiiight because he doesn't toe the line he can't be in your club. Rather than a rational discussion of anything you just throw the word 'racist' out there and everyone is supposed to clear out. Since that got overplayed it lost a lot of its effectiveness. (Math is racist, being on time is racist) But you knew that.
Reel Injun explores the various stereotypes about Natives in film, from the noble savage to the drunken Indian. Some of the scenes are hilarious when translated from indigenous dialects to english... en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reel_Injun
The Searchers is a brutal, beautiful, powerful film, with John Ford at his directorial best and John Wayne in perhaps his finest performance. It will always be a favorite of mine.
This was an amazing account of the behind-the-scenes, making me appreciate the movie even more. Well done, TCM!
I have never seen the character of Ethan Edwards, portrayed by John Wayne, as being racist. Did he hate the Commanches, yes, but why wouldn't he after what they did to Edwards' extended family! So many people are in denial that some of the Indians were savages who committed monstrous acts.
It might be worth noting that at the film's start, before any carnage has occurred, Edwards's first comment about Martin Pawley (played by Jeffrey Hunter), after looking at him with evident distrust and distate, is to say, "You look more like a half-breed." Why does Edwards distrust Pawley? Why is his first comment about Pawley's ethnicity? Might Edwards, a former Confederate soldier, have been a racist even before the atrocities visited upon his family?
@@WestVillageCrank When Debbie hides in the cemetery, the grave-marker behind her has the name of Ethan and Aaron's mother, and it says, "killed by Comanches." So, long before the Comanches kill Martha, Aaron, and Lucy, they had already killed Ethan's mother and, perhaps, other members of his family, not to mention friends and neighbors. To be sure, the white settlers were also violent "savages" who committed atrocious acts. Scar is a mirror image of Ethan. Scar relates how his wife and children were killed by whites and that he takes scalps of whites in revenge for those killings. It was a long drawn out war between the invaders (the white settlers) and the natives (the Comanches and other tribes). Those were the times. If any one of us lived in those times, we might be the same way. Ethan's attitude toward the Comanche in this story are clearly due to a personal, revenge-fueled blood feud from a protracted war.
I don't deny that Ethan is racist, but so are most of the characters in the story. For Ethan's racism to be a defining trait of his character, his racist attitude would have to stand out when compared to the other characters. However, Ethan's attitude toward the Comanches (and other Native Americans) is exactly the same as those of the other characters, with the possible exception of Marty. In fact, Laurie even says that Martha, Debbie's own mother, if she were still alive, would want Ethan to kill Debbie. Even her own mother would want that. So, Ethan is not at all unique in his attitudes. When Ethan doesn't kill Debbie, but brings her home instead, he hasn't suddenly become tolerant and loving toward the Comanches. In fact, he and the other white men have just wiped out the Comanche village, and Ethan is holding the bloody scalp of Scar in his hand. I can't imagine him saying to Debbie when he picks her up in the mouth of the cave mere minutes later, "It's okay for you to go on living with the Comanches and to take another husband from among them. I have come to love and respect them." No, that's absurd! His attitude toward the Comanche wouldn't change that fast; it remains unchanged. He is a hard, mean character. But in the moment that he takes Debbie in his arms, compassion for his niece prevails. However, there is no evidence that he has developed compassion for the Comanches. The popular interpretation of this movie that Ethan's character arc involves going from super-racist to slightly-less-racist is not borne out by the facts of the story as presented in the movie.
@@Mike-wr7om I would not argue any of that. My point was that on meeting Martin, Ethan's reaction is distrustful and full of distaste, even though not only is it clear that Martin 7/8th "white", but by definition, Ethan is disgusted someone who is 7/8ths "white" because he is 1/8th not-white. The family embraces Martin, trusts him, likes him, but for the remainder of that scene, Ethan treats him with coldness and dismissal. On what basis? He looks like a half-breed and he is 1/8th Native American. Would that not qualify as a racist position? Again, your answer deals with the bulk of the movie; I confined my comment to the scene where Ethan and Martin meet. I would add that Ethan spends most of the remainder of the movie putting Martin down, and most of the comedy of the movie is at the expense of Martin.
@@WestVillageCrank Check the scene showing the family plot for a clue re: Ethan’s hatred of Comanches.
I went into this hoping to like John Ford just a little bit. Now I like him even less. He just sounded like a rotten person.
I know what you mean. He may have been a gifted filmmaker but as a person I find him repulsive. An alcoholic bully.
It has been suggested that Scar is supposed to be mixed race, no attempt was made to hide Henry Brandon's bright blue eyes, as with Jeffrey Hunter. And Wayne's character knows the Comanche language and customs.
Fascinating film, so much depth that's never stated, there's complexity and turmoil bubbling and raging under the surface. Powerful lesson in storytelling, know your characters intimately but only hint at things.
What a great story❤
Some people are just aggressively ignorant in their efforts to feel morally superior. Because, sure, in 1956, a major Warner Brothers film is going to cast an utter unprofessional, random person who happens to be native in a KEY villain role...? Riiighhht. The speaking roles were assigned to ACTORS. And there were few, if any, actors to be found residing in Monument Valley.
Now this is what we have been waiting for
Another great installment, Ben! Thanks!
I certainly have a notion to second THAT emotion!
Both Sargent Rutledge and The Searchers were memorable films. One actor not mentioned who had significant parts in both films was Jeffrey Hunter. Thought he should have been.
This has been the best season yet. Fantastic job, as always, TCM team!
"The Searchers" has been one of my top, favorite, films, since I first saw it a young kid living in Oklahoma. I was too young to understand certain elements of the characters and situations, and I would be confused about John Wayne's character seemingly having a moment when he didn't seem like he wanted to help his niece. It reminded me of southwest Texas, and New Mexico, where I had lived during the ages of five to eight years old. I had visited the old Fort Davis, in the Big Bend country of southwest Texas, near my town of Alpine, and there was an element of the old west, with people having horse corrals in town, and there were rodeos to attend. It turns out that Fort Davis was where the Buffalo Soldiers were stationed, and another top favorite film of mine is "Sergeant Rutledge", and just outside the nearby town of Marfa was where "Giant" was filmed, although not a John Ford film, it reminds me of my childhood. What a gift we have in John Ford westerns. Listening to this sixth episode of "The Mythmaker: Decoding John Ford/The Plot Thickens", I was surprised at the telling of how John Ford played music while filming scenes in The Searchers. That is artistry. It's like an opera; having music to help direct the emotions and perceptions of the actors and crew, in their work. It makes sense for the outcome of this amazing film, "The Searchers". Thanks for your wonderful podcast series!
TCM is the greatest. Great video 📸📷🎬🎥👏
Ford reminds of the Commanding Officer I had (yes, including me). “Im in charge, if I want your opinion I’ll ask for it, otherwise keep your mouth shut “
While Clint Eastwood is often cited as the prototype of the anti-hero, we see a little bit of this with Ford's own evolution and re-imagining the hero character from previous films. So Wayne as Ethan Edwards is perhaps the original anti-hero trope. I also find it interesting that Ford used "mood music" to get the actors in the right frame of mind. He apparently was drawing from his silent-era days when music was added to the silent film to get the audience in the right mood ... I can hear the violins playing now.
In his reticence to explain himself, perhaps Ford didn't want to dictate the meaning of his art; he left it to us to interpret it. It's up to us. For all his authoritarian personality traits, his art can't be defined by it. In that sense, the artist's personality doesn't matter, no matter how much we want it to crack the code for us. Some of the commentators in this series seem not to understand that basic premise of artistic experience.
"Duke" didn't fight the fascists when it was time to stand up for democratic "American values," so he fought socialism - instead of fascism - in the newspapers and in committee hearings. He'd love the every-man-for-himself-neoliberalism that was bestowed on us (by both parties) after his death: cutthroat capitalism gave us Trump - whom Wayne might also have loved (hear Wayne believing way too strongly in things he did not understand at 35:02). For all his achievements as an artist, John Wayne was a dunce and a hypocrite and a failure as a citizen, by his own account. He was also a selfish careerist at best (he sat out WWII to advance his career, then made a career out of playing himself in "patriotic" wars, scolding the kids who didn't want to die in Vietnam as "soft") or, at worst, a coward. You decide. But, those aren't American values AND, as I said in my comments about Ford, bad as he was, it really shouldn't matter in our appreciation (or dislike) of his art, believe it or not.
🤡
@@geert574 I'm trying to make a broader point here about how we should judge an artist - or more specifically, his art - in light of his personality and his life. Which is to say that we shouldn't judge an artist or his art by what we (think) we know about his life. I guess you didn't dig it.
Waiting for episode 7
Is she a kidnapped niece or a daughter of Ethan he Clearly is in love with the mother his actions Speak so loudly a great film.
Ford's issues with Henry Brandon might have had other sources. Though married to a woman between 1941-46, Brandon was primarily homosexual, including a very long-term relationship with Mark Herron. And as noted in the previous installment, there have been persistent questions about Ford's conflicts with his own sexuality. (Maureen O'Hara, a Ford favorite and devoted actor, said she saw Ford kissing another man.)
Maureen O'hara is Mr. Ford least like actress, he said in a interview.
@@lilyzhang5127 Then it is odd that he featured her in five movies. Were there no other leading actresses available?
It’s kind of shitty to slander John Ford based on shit a scorned woman made up and no one else corroborated. Do better TCM.
I don’t know about anyone else but I haven’t been getting the notifications for this podcast season
Another application of today’s sensibilities to yesterday’s films that reflect a certain lack of understanding of the realities of that time. For example, can the commentators suggest a “native” actor of the period that would have been acceptable to the studio bosses? I’ll wait.
perhaps Jay Silverheels. Maybe he was too typecast as Tonto at this point but he was a very good actor who maybe could have pulled it off.
Most Excellent ¿
❤❤❤🇨🇦
34:44 Whatever point you think you're making, in this quote John Wayne sounds more like Thomas Sowell today.
It’s fun when racists find their Thomas Sowells’
@@TR-yi8up Riiiiight because he doesn't toe the line he can't be in your club. Rather than a rational discussion of anything you just throw the word 'racist' out there and everyone is supposed to clear out. Since that got overplayed it lost a lot of its effectiveness. (Math is racist, being on time is racist) But you knew that.
@@FIREBRAND38 he’s the Herschel Walker of black, conservative thinkers
Reel Injun explores the various stereotypes about Natives in film, from the noble savage to the drunken Indian. Some of the scenes are hilarious when translated from indigenous dialects to english... en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reel_Injun