How Avianca Flight 52 Ran Out Of Fuel And Crashed | Mayday | On The Move
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- Опубликовано: 4 окт 2022
- On 25 January 1990, Avianca Flight 52 is delayed numerous times by bad weather en route and is dangerously low on fuel as it attempts a landing at New York City. Wind shear forces the crew to abort the approach just one mile from the runway. They initiate a go-around, but are directed back into a holding pattern by air traffic controllers who are unaware of the low fuel situation. The Boeing 707 then runs out of fuel, causing it to crash on Long Island.
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I wouldn't be angry knowing my flight is canceled due to bad weather, I be happy as hell
Aianca never got a weather report for NYC. Unimaginable!
However, most of those passengers want free accommodations, free transport to those accommodations, free meals, and so on - like the airline is somehow responsible for the bad weather. No going to happen, so passengers get angry.
Sadly most passengers on airlines think that their ticket is a magic spell they paid for that guarantees they arrive at their destination. Their flight gets cancelled they have a tantrum.
@ andy exactly
@@iridium5652 But it can be more complicated. Passengers may have saved and taken vacation days off from work. When a flight's delayed or cancelled, it may then cause a missed connecting flight to their final destination to Hawaii, etc., and possibly shortening their vacation. Of course they're going to get angry, even if it's due to uncontrollable weather. But you're right that a ticket does not guarantee perfection. It's just that--a ticket.
It was all completely avoidable but ironically the one thing that kept so many ppl alive was because they were out of fuel completely, no explosion or fires.
Thats exactly what i was thinking, it was a completely silent fall bc the engines ran out of fuel. No explosion, no flames, no shrapnel. This was 1000% avoidable, but their survival is because there was no fuel left.
@@triicho3261 looking at that mess, I can safely say that there was definitely a LOT of shrapnel from the impact, itself, but no shrapnel from the fuel tanks exploding.
simple maths would have avoided this, human being can be SO DISAPOINTING
85 people survived it is not common for so many people to survive a plane crash but yea good point.
@@scienceownsimposters2142 right usually every body dies!😕😪
Another issue I’ve noticed is pilots seem to be afraid to declare a emergency. Why do pilots fear this? Repercussions from the airline…ATC…FAA…the investigation…losing their jobs? This needs to be easier to do!
Sally: Or the training needs to be better.
One fine flight channel from Mentour Pilot (a commercial pilot on big jets) repeatedly points out that there should never be blame / attacking for reporting issues. It should be all about safety. After it's over, if more training is needed, FINE, but it shouldn't be about firing or punishing flight crew for trying to do the right thing.
@@rogergeyer9851as going to say, pilots generally _aren’t_ afraid of declaring emergencies/making Mayday or Pan-Pan calls thanks to aviation safety’s “Just Culture” which Petter/Mentour Pilot talks about on his channel. Pilots only get punished if they knowingly, deliberately, and flagrantly disobey rules and regulations. Otherwise they’re sent for some retraining-and that’s usually only if Pilot Error is determined to be part of the cause of the accident.
Pilots are human, and therefore, at times, they err. Everyone makes honest mistakes. The aviation industry recognises this, which I think is a _great_ culture for the industry to foster.
(And yes, Mentour Pilot’s channel is indeed a fine one!)
I noticed the same thing Sally. On one episode the captain even said "they will have our heads if this turns out to be nothing."
Same goes for missed approaches. I don't think they get in trouble so much as they have to defend themselves and justify it
Language Barrier...
Here I blame the controllers...they knew they were running out of fuel. Also the first officer should have declared a Mayday. They have some nerve saying ATC was not culpable at all. That blows my mind.
Pilot Error and ATC are to blame, but ATC management are mostly to blame for pressuring the ATC to make errors. the neighborhood street or highway would be a perfect place to crash landing if flame out due to fuel starvation.
crazy . he just said 5 minutes of fuel. did they have to cry and beg and wail for that fact sink in? lmao
@@htf5555 apparently
@@htf5555 they are also expect to remain calm and composed during an emergency while doing fuel calculations...crazy is crazy
They didn't blame the ATC because this would imply the FAA management was also at fault for trying to get them to land 33 planes an hour in inclement weather.
That crash literally was in my back yard! I remember that jet going over my house,so low,you could count rivets! The local fire department was on scene,Locust Valley,and the rest of the Fifth Battalion,including Oyster Bay,Syosset,Glen Cove,and points East and West,including Suffolk County units! As you said 37 departments,covered that disaster! Also,the overworked Guardian Angels,who made sure there was no fire!! Thank you for filling in the gaps in my knowledge,as not all the data made the newspapers and other media!! Thank you 😇 😊!
Did you do anything to try to help the survivors?
That was a airplane crash.
Oyster Bay
The Guardian Angels lol Not.
@@kellyanderson7624I sure hope not. Too many there. Tennis Court Rd is one lane. The recuers and the media inadvertently clogged the road out for ambulances. Only helicopters could get in and out easily. Was a "coordinated mess." Forever grateful for the survivors.
of all the episodes i have watched, this has been the most heartbreaking for me. For so long they circled up there in the sky yet they could have diverted them to another airport in time where they could have landed safely. Also the engineer was late to raise to raise alarm on the desperation of the fuel situation. May they rest in peace, i am so touched
I used to fly twice a week for business reasons and in São Paulo, with the main airport closing during the rainy season, it was common to be in holding pattern and stay there for long minutes.
Twice we had to divert because we were running out of fuel.
This accident is regrettable for so many reasons.
There were other airports in the region and there was a chance for all to survive. From the top of my head, Newark and Tetesboro were alternatives.
Hope there will be no more accidents due to these chain of events.
and there are 3 other airports within 10 flying minutes from JFK airport
Yes it's true poor communication 😢 with the traffic controllers
I cried watching this
Exactly I can’t believe they had them circling for so long my brother is a traffic controller and told me he would’ve told them to land at Boston or any other airport the could make it to
Avianca air crew: *describes a literal emergency*
ATC: nahhh he didn't say the magic word...
I may be wrong from the comfort of my armchair, but from what we see here, the alarm in the first officer's voice and the first mention of 'priority' came way too late.
Then again, the crew was probably already too tired from flying the plane manually to go into the circumstances that awaited them and it all snowballed from there.
No way
@@starguy2718I feel like at some point common sense should prevail, though. If the officer is saying "we're running out of fuel", I think that should be taken at face value and met with urgency on the part of the ATC.
Exactly. If ATC even wonders if a plane's fuel situation is precarious, the controller asks crew outright what exactly is their fuel situation. This crash changed a lot of communication rules and plays a part in many communications college courses.
Yep. Exactly. Was a terrible night.
I remember this day as if it were yesterday. My bestfriend who was 14 at the time and I 12 woke to news his mother had died on that aircraft. He was sitting on the front steps of our building crying uncontrollable. He sat alone when i went by and sat next to him. Unfortunately she was one of the mules for the Columbian cartel. It was the 1st and last time he ever spoke of his mother to me.
The pilot had covered the same route many times before without any incident and as a veteran internacional pilot was proficient in English in all those aviation terms. So for the traffic controllers to say that his English was poor was a way to save themselves.
There is no way I could have accepted ATC's casual response to "we are out of fuel." And then hearing "Stay calm and we'll have you on the ground in a minute." Then all the "maintain and hold altitude..." They should have said "Listen, shit ass, if we're not on a runway in 15 minutes were gonna be putting this thing into a neighborhood because we will be COMPLETELY OUT of fuel."
I agree
The proper phraseology would be a Mayday call with the word “FUEL” at the end: “Mayday Mayday Mayday, Avianca 052, FUEL!”
(Thanks for that info goes to F.O. Kelsey of 74Gear.)
@@DarkJediPrincess *"Running out of fuel" does not tell you anything - you have one hour of fuel left you can tell the control tower "you are running out of fuel";* you have 30 minutes left "you are running out fuel" you have 30% of fuel left you are "running out of fuel", it does not QUANTIFY your situation, however you see "I have a 5 minutes of fuel left" everyone can see your dire situation
@@DarkJediPrincess With all due respect to Kelsey, this was a Pan Pan situation for quite a while before it turned into a Mayday. If they had announced a Pan Pan when they first realized the fuel situation they would have been given priority and been on the ground and alive today.
@@InterTrini With conditions as deplorable as they were in NY, honestly, they should have diverted traffic to another runway. I was in the DFW airport when the Loma Prieta quake struck California. My flight was supposed to go into Long Beach but after the quake hit I had to fly into LAX. Yeah, it was an inconvenience because it was farther to get back to my base but, for safety, I'd rather err on the side of caution. And it wasn't nearly as bad as this situation as far as visibility is concerned.
That's so messed up that nobody seemed to care that they were almost out of fuel; what were they thinking, that the pilots were exagerating!!
This was an avoidable incident. These poor people. The ATCs seemed to ignore the issue of the low fuel and that does make them accountable.
False! The PILOTS are responsible for managing their fuel, not ATC. They should have declared a fuel EMERGENCY, in which case, they would have been given 1st priority on any runway. ATC's job is to ensure planes don't crash into each other, not baby sit incompetent pilots and their fuel, especially at an busy airport like JFK.
Yes, combined with the confusion of a shift change as well
They didn't ignore but they didn't use the magic words, DECLARE EMERGENCY. That gets their attention. "We need priority", "we are running out of fuel", etc won't get their attention.
@@DaveDepilot-KFRG what about "we lost two engines"?.
@invertedreality4473 get out of here. ATC was told multiple times that the plane was out of fuel. ATC failed, and then blames it on wording. They knew that they had a plane circling the airport for HOURS! They should have all been prosecuted and given a life sentence for every sole lost
The acting are incredible talented
🤣 When we're traveling down the highway and I say we have to find a gas station because we're running out of fuel, my wife has no problem understanding that - look for a gas station to stop at now. Strange the air traffic controllers in this case didn't have the same common sense.
The crew didn't even check the weather at destination. Absolutely unforgivable performance and a lesson for all pilots on how not to approach a busy airport in bad weather
@@TheRis81 this is the FIRST mess i noticed, like how tf did they not know that initially
i feel like they were just waiting to clock out and kept on passing the pilots to the next person
@@TheRis81do you think back on those days they have an iPhone like you do now to check weather, think before Making a comment and have some respect for the victims, is that USA people don’t have any idea
So saying you're low on fuel isn't the same as saying we have an emergency
GOOD TO KNOW
"Please remain calm and we'll have you on the ground shortly."
Oof, in hindsight an extremely poor choice of words... Thoughts and prayers to the victims and their families. ☹️
I have watched all episodes so many times and all of them are heartbreaking. But this one.... makes me specially nervous when i watch it. I have no other words... May you all rest in peace.
much love to all of you ! April 24th, 2023.
The ATC's appeared to handle this incident with a nonchalant manner so to speak. For Pete's sake they could here all commotion going on in the cockpit once the Captain started aggressively yelling for assistance. Then to top it off they gave instructions to go on a longer turn around after the 1st Officer notified ATC of their low fuel situation? Man, this kinda feels as if the Avianca crew was internationally set up to go down.
Air traffic controllers are at fault here. The bad weather at New York JFK should had been the first red flag to divert planes elsewhere.
It was caused by understaffed Air traffic control with too much work to do. The language barrier was a big problem, too.
No airline company wanted to just delay or cancel flights into the Northeast. It’s always all about the money.
I had to stop doing Emergency Medicine because I always had a terrible time getting out of the hospital after my ER shift if any of the patients were unstable or still undiagnosed at the end of my shift. I would always hang around until I was satisfied that the doctor relieving me understood the case, sometimes for an hour or more as new patients kept coming in.
And the pressure put on the controllers to continue the usual quota during such a storm was key to flight 52 crashing.
Thank you for your service. God bless 🙌
The pilots shouldn't have been blamed at all, but its easy to blame someone who isn't here to defend themselves...
this!!!
It's pathetic
They were intimidated by gringos
It's not hard to say three words, "Mayday, Mayday, Mayday." That's literally all they had to say for everyone to focus on them. The minute they would have said that, whether they had 20 minutes of fuel left or 20 hours of fuel left, they would have been on the ground in 5 minutes. All runways along the east coast would have been available to them. No excuse not to declare an emergency.
@@Wave_Boi You are being told lies by the airlines; millions of dollars are on the line and the airlines cannot be held accountable; they need a scapegoat. In any aviation accident; the first thing you do is go after the pilots to avoid liability. 48:43 The fact that the NTSB found aircraft controllers acted in accordance tells you everything you need to know. I don't know if you realize but the NTSB, Manufactures, and Airlines are all in this big club together and will never admit to fault.
@@skysheep747 Is that so? Is that why the entire world grounded the entire 737 Max Fleet instead of just finding an easier and cheaper scapegoat? That costed Boeing billions of dollars, surely by your logic it would be easier to blame incompetent pilots rather than ground an entire fleet. Same with the DC-10, no need to ground the fleet when there's an easy scapegoat. How about all those 737's that had an issue with their rudders getting stuck? NTSB could just write about how incompetent that pilot's are instead of fixing the problem, it'd be cheaper for Boeing.
The ATC are to blame.
The fact they were blameless is appaling
I thought that too at first, but than why the hell didn't the pilots demand priority to land sooner?? All they had to do is tell them they are in danger, and need priority to land ASAP because of the fuel. And repeat it over and over especially with weather being that bad...
I would’ve yelled PAN PAN PAN !! A long time ago to get real priority . The F/O was way too soft he didn’t make it seem much like an emergency . None of them did .
The pilot did
I think the most amazing thing would be to be in a plane crash and survive and remember it all. Just insane
Decades ago I knew a woman who traveled a lot in the 70'd. She said she survived 2 plane crashes back then, both international.
I didn't believe her until I looked up how many crashes there were. That was the era of DC-8/10, so yeah, entirely possible 😮
I still blamed the controllers first and the pilots second for not declaring an emergency.
What was the angry passenger going to do that stormed to the front? Land the plane himself??
Marv: Yes, the time to get angry and strut around (if ever) is AFTER an emergency, not during it.
I agree with the attorneys air traffic control wasn’t hearing what they were saying. They kept trying to tell them and no one seemed to care enough to pass on the info. ATC operators need to be above average communicators!
Sally Goodwin: The communication from the Co=pilot was terrible. He needed to state they were in a FUEL EMERGENCY, and NOT agreed to loop around once handed over to the other controller after missing their approach.
Also, if the flight engineer knew they needed to make the first approach to be safe, he should have TOLD the pilots that, so they'd be clear on where they stood.
Watching this kind of thing makes me glad I quit flying decades ago, even though flying is statistically safe -- there's just too many things that can go wrong from bad procedures / decisions.
Yep pilot error and bad communication causes the vast majority of crashes.
@@rogergeyer9851 *"Running out of fuel" does not tell you anything - you have one hour of fuel left you can tell the control tower "you are running out of fuel";* you have one hour left "you are running out fuel" you have 30% of fuel left you are "running out of fuel", it does not QUANTIFY your situation, however you see "I have a 5 minutes of fuel left" everyone can see your dire situation
@@mickkrever4084totally agree, they needed to specify the dire situation, sadly the comms just thought there situation was same as all of the planes stuck in the air
@@rogergeyer9851 Yeah the Captain told him several times "tell them we're in emergency" and he didn't do it eventhough he reported he did.
Should the controllers have taken more care when repeatedly being told "we're running out of fuel"? Absolutely!
But when you're in an emergency you can't rely on implication. There does need to be a clear "we are in emergency, we have 5 minutes of fuel left, we need to land immediately!"
If it got that far somehow, you would call a mayday and you would tell air traffic control that you are landing at a certain runway. You aren't asking them, you TELL them you ARE landing there, period. End of discussion. You have total authority when you declare an emergency.
The airplane crew was not aggressive enough in stating their plight
I really love to watch this type of documentary,
Very well done no doubt,
This is the best one so far, although very, very frustrating!!
Controllers are definitly at fault.
If the crew is discussing nose up attitude as not to slosh fuel and have a flame-out, they have crossed the threshold of declaring an emergency.
I thought the same thing. Ridiculous
*"Running out of fuel" does not tell you anything - you have one hour of fuel left you can tell the control tower "you are running out of fuel";* you have one hour left "you are running out fuel" you have 30% of fuel left you are "running out of fuel", it does not QUANTIFY your situation, however you see "I have a 5 minutes of fuel left" everyone can see your dire situation
Nobody ever says "we're running out of fuel". Everyone always only quantifies it. If you've gotten so low on fuel that you're not even quantifying it anymore, you're really low on fuel.
If you're driving down the highway and you're getting low on fuel, you're thinking about finding the next gas exit. If you're driving down the highway and realize you're running out of fuel, you're thinking about whether you can merge all the way to the shoulder without stopping traffic. "Running out of fuel" means you would not be surprised if your engine dies the very next second.
That's why your supposed to declare an emergency (mayday) when your that short on fuel.
I'm a Kenyan, my first encounter with Avianca flight 52 was in the book the outliers, authored by Malcom Gladwell, i had just read the story and had a question on communication, i quoted this story. watching it now changes my perception. If the discussions going on here are anything to go by, communication was but one of the many problems, the circling, the weather, it looks like everything meant for this thing to go down. But the crew did try, there just seems to have been a fateful twist of events that ended this tragically. on the flip side, lack of fuel is the reason the passengers can now tell how it all went down. It is still raw and emotive for me now, though when it happened i was very young.
2:42
The emphasis on language always got me. I read Gladwell's book also but I know that the airports in New York and New Jersey had been landing thousands of flights from all over the world with air crews with all kinds of accents. They were used to it and not beyond interrogating a pilot to get the real situation. The real issue is the same we have now with medicine in the US, bureaucrats and paper pushers direct critical operations. The ATC was overworked, angry and not really listening. The bosses cared not at all for them, the flight crews or the passengers.
God Bless the crew, passengers, and all loved ones❤ this is so heartbreaking
I'm confused.
1) 052 communicated they were in an emergency situation due to fuel levels.
2) ATC Assholes #1 and #2 pass them back and forth between each other, eventually losing track of them, knowing they lost engines.
3) They essentially *shrug* and go on with their day.
This seems like negligence on a criminal level. Only thing 052 could have done (based on the reenactment) is the co-pilot could have better communicated the urgency of their situation. Saying we're low on fuel is not "We are in an emergency! We are out of fuel and have to land NOW!" How do you keep putting a plane into holding patterns when they're nearing bingo fuel during a deteriorating weather situation where lots of planes are waving off approaches to go around again?
I think pilots needs to have a more urgent tone in their voice when they are dealing with crisis. Somtimes they seem to have such a stoic tone that a person on the other end may think it can wait a moment longer.
It makes me so mad when they try to blame the Pilot. Who has an aircraft flying for over an hour 😞 Air Traffic Control did this. When you do wrong and think you have gotten away with it life seems to make sure you get payback.
Agree
Agree
Agreed 💯
I think a pivotal moment was when air traffic control did not check on the alternate route to Boston. Had they not been pushing the required landings of 33 planes an hour while being understaffed, the air traffic controller would have had time to check on an alternate route to divert them to Boston. Sad this didn't come up in the trial. This fact borders on Titanic-like disasterous decisions where you order more demand on staff (increased quota of planes to be landed) without the proper safety precautions being taken into account (not having enough staff to handle them). Instead air traffic control made them wait, forgetting them, wasting fuel that would have gotten them safely to Boston.
Ft4
I would've thought those 19 minutes holding by Virginia that the air crew could've looked up the weather for both
They gave NY traffic control a NY accent. That's a proof of quality right there.
Should have gone Dignam on his boss
I HAVE SEEN THIS STORY BEFORE....BUT THIS TIME I LEARNED SOME DETAILS I DIDN'T HAVE THE FIRST TIME....THANK U
In the title the words "ran" and "crashed" should be replaced with "run" and "crash".
Exactly. I noticed that. They have other video titles with errors in them too.
Period goes within the comma.
Here I am watching this getting scared when I’m taking a flight in a few days
What responsibility did all of the air traffic controllers have in this disaster? It was almost as if none of them really took their job seriously. This along with lack of communication and the greediness of the airport to land 30 some odd planes an hour......wow.
I do remember this , all they had to do was stop in Miami and take on fuel but still had to do a missed approach . Doing instrument approachs I never had a miss .
I thought regs require a mayday call at 30 minutes fuel remaining. That’s mayday, mayday, mayday…no ambiguity or confusion there…
I think it's a bit more complicated than that, there's a minimum fuel, and mayday fuel call. Both of the calls are to be made based on expected fuel remaining after landing at chosen airport.
At 41:34 that part of the story was first reported by me when I was a reporter. A source who worked at the North Shore hospital called me to say that they found drugs in the “mules” at the hospital. I broke the story at my local radio station in New Jersey before giving the story to ABC News.
The language used by pilots and controllers is supposed to be very specific. Previous accidents have been caused by vague communications and miscommunications. It is for this reason you have to say "emergency" when you have one. Pilots and controllers are taught what to say.
ICAO Standard Phraseology:
> ’Fuel Emergency’ or ‘fuel priority’ are not recognised terms. Flight crews short of fuel must declare a PAN or MAYDAY to be sure of being given the appropriate priority.
Granted, that's 30 years after accident, but "emergency" is not internationally recognized term.
Although such appalling crash could`ve been avoided, it wasn`t even worse due to the lack of fuel, otherwise it`d have got on fire and killed everybody far more terribly. As for me, flight controllers are the ones to blame without a shadow of a doubt. If some of those victims were my relatives I`d fight my life to make them (controllers) spend theirs behind bars!
No….the pilots are responsible for the plane. Total failure on their part.
I definitely agree.
@@33moneyball No, it's a failure on the controller's parts. The pilots CLEARLY stated they were low on fuel and needed PRIORITY. and the controllers ignored that. The pilots are definitely not to blame here.
These pilots were too nice. That's what happen when you're too nice. People take advantage of you
What are you talking about being to nice they didn’t have a choice air traffic control is the damn problem have them on hold have them waiting until they plane run out of fuel
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As a recovering New Yorker, I can attest that the ATC staff was suffering from hubris and arrogance which unfortunately causes deaths with no accountability..
This happened a few miles away from me. I still remember the smell of oil in the air. This was huge back then!! Very interesting to hear agsin god bless the victims and survivors !
85 survivors were badly injured and 73 weren’t so lucky
You dont want to be an aircrash survivor, 3 degree burns, the PTSD, the broken bones
I am choosing death if something like this happens.
@@lawyerpanda1856 ooh?!
@@matthewhahn1132 yo 😆
@lawyerpanda1856 the interviewed passengers are probably glad to be okay again and be alive
Love aviation videos ❤
Short and sweet, if you fly into another county's airspace it would be wise to use the terminology that ATC in that country can understand, especially if you're out of fuel.
I worked 8 years at a big German airport. Passengers can be a real nightmare when flights are delayed or cancelled due to bad weather, even though the get cared for, rebooked to other flights for the next day, get train tickets for domestic distances and even a hotel room.
I’ve been a business traveler for decades, and nothing infuriates me more than angry passengers because their flight is delayed for weather or whatever reason. I find their attitude so irresponsable, childish, arrogant… I’m one that every time my flight is cancelled/delayed I can only thank the experts that put my safety above nuances, tantrums or business.
In one occasion, already boarded on a flight from Miami to Honduras. After 40+ minutes seating and delayed due to technical problem, people started to whine. I was praying for the flight not to take off because I was terrified of traveling in a defective plane. Finally the captain said we would be transferred to another aircraft and I was so happy for my prayers being heard. Yet, the passenger next to me was fuming, blaming the unions, etc. it was incomprehensible to me, how people lose focus on the REAL important things.
As my mother always said: “It’s better to lose some minutes in life, than lose life in one minute”.
I wouldn't have given a DAMN about "angry" passengers!!! They'll get OVER being angry...... They'll never get to finish living their lives!!!
*I cannot believe with all those technology we have the control tower still cannot track how much fuel is left around its airspace* or standardize the communication as exactly how much a few we left, such as "Avianca Fight 2 hours 30minutes"
With all those technology in 1990? Are you even born yet? Were you there in 1990?
It was 1990 not 1890
@@Seramicsop and the other in the comments sec are clearly ignorant younglings who don't know about each of the technological advances we made since the 90s. They clearly weren't born yet and that's okay but what looks to be worse is the lack of understanding.
Priority and emergency have slightly different meanings. Emergency is I NEED HELP NOW! But priority is more like I NEED HELP WHEN CONVENIENT AND AS SOON AS YOU CAN! Slightly different ….people can also LIE when asking fir priorities of any kind but it’s very unlikely to be lying about having an e emergency 15 thousand ft in the air. This was a fine example of communication breakdown and language barrier.
As per usual hindsight is 20/20. We can all be Monday morning quarterbacks in this scenario. Flying is stressful from every angle. They did they best they could with what and who they had to work for and with at that moment.
I was working at Kennedy Airport that night at Hanger 12 where flight dispatch was. Wr all watched in horror when the plane fell off radar. Initially the dispatchers thought the plane crashed in Lynbrook NY where my parents lived.Running out of fuel is beyond inexcusable in spite of the weather.5 major airports within 200 miles of JFK.
You know I was thinking of all the planes that did land that night despite the bad weather & they succeeded without a hitch so I question what the hell happened here.
Also seems the pilots waited as long as possible before informing the air traffic controller about there fuel situation when in fact they should’ve told them that right away
I remember this very well because my Spanish speaking friends did neighbor who worked for Avianca out of New York, was also a nurse. Without a car that particular evening, I drove her to Nassau County where she was picked up by a NCPD car to bring her to the crash site.
very poor air traffic controllers, must all have been fired, what an injustice
The pilots never declared an Emergency. If they had done that they would have lived. If they had a functioning auto-pilot they most likely would have been able to land on the first attempt
I know but the cards were stacked against the controllers. having that many planes landing in an hour is insane. and the inclement weather with poor visibility. avianca may not have been able to land at all to begin with. they should've averted to BOS.
@@algorythym They wanted to divert to Boston, they even asked the air traffic controls about Boston, but the pilots never got a response on that.
@@johnfranklin8319 I would have figured saying you lost two engines to a controller would mean an emergency.
@@MissJade805 twice!
Both English &Spanish priority and emergency mean the same, pilot had to use the right word. “EMERGENCY “ we’re running out of fuel we need to land this thing!! ASAP!!
Amazing ppl that helped
Priority & Emergency have TWO different meanings. This wasn’t on the controllers
So much negligence in so many ways!
R.i.p to all 73 victims aboard Avianca flight 52
I'm over here crying because almost all the babies and that family were okay and she's going to college and fir the other survivors
I traveled international and flights had been delayed and I had to wait 45 minutes inside the plane waiting to take offt- get out of the United States. You have to be patient it is better to get home safe. One time in January I was coming home to the USA from my international trip and the weather at my hometown airport was really bad we had to wait 20 minutes going in circle in the air to be able to land. That circle in the air make you feel exhausted.
It is hard to understand why the pilots did not share with controllers the urgency of the low fuel.
Everyone says the first officer should have used the word emergency.. But what else could have been meant by "we do not have enough fuel to go to our alternative". That was enough information (even without the word "emergency and with the communication difficulties experienced) to know that they should be a priority. There's a difference between running out of fuel (to some degree or another as some claim here) and we cannot fly another x amount of miles cause we don't have enough fuel for it.
Knowing that you have other aircraft’s coming to JFK and on the ground, you have a state of emergency why didn’t ATC instruct them to land at other airports? Why not send them to Boston? To Virginia?
They could have sent them to NJ or CT as well, even Philadephia
I've never boarded a plane, and its so unlikely that I'll ever board one. But this is too sad. To me it seems like the control towers disregarded Avianca's requests deliberately.
Actually flying is the safest way to travel. Statistically, you would have to fly every day for 1000 years before you would be in a fatal crash. Get out there and explore the world, it’s awesome.😊
I wouldn’t brag about not ever flying. Sucks for you….
I’m terrified to fly but I still get in them. You drive every day, you have a greater chance of being killed in a car wreck a mile from your home. My mom died at 85 never setting foot in a plane, never saw the world. I did not want me fear doing that to me.
Not seeing the world is terrible.
I'd rather fly everyday than drive. Driving is the most dangerous thing you can do. 1 in 125 chances of dying in a vehicle accident in your life. Airline travel 1 in 17 million
The air traffic controller just handing off a plane that was running out of fuel to the next guy because the shift was over was flat out wrong. It was a flagrant disregard of the seriousness of the situation.
The second officer did not communicate the urgency for them to land. He should have declared fuel emergency
I see both sides here. On the one hand, it seems that the performance of the duties of ATC left much to be desired, although they were/are overworked. If I were them, I would have instructed the flight to use an alternate. On the other hand, if I were the pilots, I would have requested weather information as frequently as possible and diverted the second my gut instinct said to.
Hands up to the whole production team. But please don't make us cry.
Who is responsible? Like with all air crashes, commercial or general, there is never one reason; rather a chain of events. Obviously an earlier decision by the captain to redirect to their alternate field of Boston would have been one possibility to avoid the accident. A crew request enroute for NYC weather would have been another one. Tragic.
I recall this happening many years ago. I was living on Long Island about 5 miles from the crash site and happened to be pulling into my driveway. After getting out of my car, I heard a thud. That thus was Avianca 52 crashing. Within a minute or so I heard the sirens. The next morning the crash was all over the news. Watching this documentary has me wondering what do the words "we've lost two engines and are low on fuel" mean to an ATC? Is it that difficult to put two and two together? If the audio rendition is accurate, this is clearly the fault of ATC for not asking if this was an emergency, did the plane need to land immediately and amy other questions that could have identified the severity of the situation? I also question Avianca airlines for employing a pilot who doesn't grasp the english language.
The air traffic controller are to blame. Yes the cockpit crew could have dine better but the tragic mistake came from the controller in my opinion! So so sad!
These air traffic controllers could not tie their shoelaces
its the system that fucked them, they were overloaded and dont have the information of how long a plane has been hanging around.
Why do the ATC's not ask how the aircraft on holding patterns how they are doing for fuel ?
My hat is off to this Captain and crew, who knowing they were going to crash, continued to fly the airplane after flameout in the dark and no visibility. This surely contributed to many passenger lives being spared.
Oh, I would escape the plane knowing that so bad weather conditions ahead... 😮
But this case crash problem wasn't just a weather, it was communication problems between controllers and pilots.
It’s just so frustrating even to watch
Why are pilots afraid to say “emergency” it’s part of the training. English is the language of aviation. I have seen so many of these where they don’t want to declare an emergency or mayday or pan pan pan. Is it paperwork? Is it that the pilot will be scrutinized or punished? What is the reasoning?
Pilots should have just said "Mayday, Mayday, Mayday" why didn't they declare emergency? "Priority" "running out of fuel" doesnt mean anything in a situation like this. "Mayday" makes things very clear for everybody
So ATC dude didn’t speak of the very low fuel and what happened, happened. What the hell bruh
The pilot didn't declare an emergency. Had he said "we are declaring an Emergency" they would have gotten direct routing to the runway. What has to be asked was why they didn't have a fuel stop if they didn't have the range to get to New York without a fuel reserve? Regulations require pilots to have a certain amount of fuel as reserve.
What I'm wondering what with all this cloud & the runway not being visible is that all the other planes during this time must be landing ok therefore they are having no difficulty so why is this problem only isolated to this aircraft
The key to this kind of situation is never to get in this kind of situation. The pilot should have alerted air traffic control that the plane was running out of fuel a long time ago before it even got close to this situation. Be proactive rather reactive.
I remember this, i was living in NY. So sad
Incredibile interesting facts about destinations be safe out there important airports destinations and airlines flights are
Why isn't upper mgmt blamed more & sent to jail for corporate manslaughter?
Is there no way to include data on a fuel emergency in the transponder signal that ATC receives, so warnings can be triggered on the secondary radar? Then they would not rely solely on the pilots using the correct phraseology or risk that vital infos get lost in handovers. I mean, the transponder signal does contain TCAS alerts or codes for hijacks, why not data that tells you that there is only fuel left for a few more minutes?
That air traffic controller that was handling Avianca's 52 flight, knew exactly what the pilots were dealing with, fuel starvation, and he wanted to be very technical and abide by the rules. So instead of given priority to that flight to land, he continued to be a jerk with the crew, making them to continue to hold the pattern until they ran out of fuel. That controller is the one that caused the deaths of all those people, all because the pilots didn't "declare a fuel emergency".
Whoever pushed the airlines to fly in the bad weather and insisted on such a large amount of planes to land and depart in an hours time should be held partially responsible, a big partially!
The first officer didn't relay the emergency. He kept saying over and over, "we're *RUNNING* out of fuel". Of course, that's what jets do, they run out of fuel. Every jet in the sky is _running out of fuel_ to one degree or another but this fool didn't say what was really going on: We're OUT OF FUEL and we are going to crash!!!!! So frustrating! Makes one not ever want to board an airplane at all. I'm glad I'm no longer have to fly.
U just spoke my mind. The first officer acted like a fool.
When piolts are facing crash what does priority means automatically emergency
Is it just me or does Air Traffic Control seem extremely laid back and not even attempting any haste to get this matter resolved ?? I got the impression that the workers in the ATC tower were just handing transmissions over to other designated locations and not really, for all intents and purposes, taking the fact that the second officer is relaying critical information stating that the 4 engine behemoth of a plane they were in is literally about to run completely dry. I even think before transmissions were terminated he did actually tell them that they had 2 engines flame out and then the video went to some ATC workers calmly talking about the fact that they heard something mentioned about an engine burning out and they were trying to figure out why. Are you serious ? This angers me so much. Why did it flame out??? Seriously ? Remember, ATC worker, when 2nd officer said WE ARE OUT OF FUEL??? I’m sorry folks…. I know that nobody as a human being is perfect, obviously, but in a job like this an opportunity for an event like this should not ever happen. This seems like it could have been avoided on several occasions throughout the 2 hours of extra fuel onboard for occasions like what we just watched.