Eliminating RFI and Ground Loops - Sound Speeds
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- Опубликовано: 9 ноя 2024
- A buzzing microphone can drive you crazy and when it buzzes when touched, you have to do something about it! Unfortunately the cost of repairing a buzzing microphone can run you over $100 but in this video I'll show you different options to eliminating your microphone RFI and ground loop issues including an option that won't cost you a cent!
Join me as a troubleshoot the RFI and ground loops issues present in my AKG C535EB microphone.
To purchase the Faraday material I use, click this affiliate link: amzn.to/2JaSrDp
To watch my video about the Neutrik EMC connector:
• Neutrik EMC XLR Connec...
For more info on the Audio Engineering Society:
www.aes.org
For more info about electrical ground loops:
en.wikipedia.o...)
For info about eliminating ground loops:
web.mit.edu/jha...
www.audioholics...
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Oh my god THANK YOU! I bought a whole $550 mic set up and it I kept researching why and no one can tell me why... until I searched up ground loop sounds and THIS VIDEO WAS PERFECT! thanks brother
Glad to help
Awesome trick
It works well for me. Let me know if you try it.
@@SoundSpeeds Yep, your trick worked too!! I tried in my other cable with amphenol connectors and it was a little bit harder to create a "jumper" between the pin 1 and the metal housing but i got it. You deserve 1 million of subs lol
Next build i'm gonna try the EMC connector as you said.
I love the EMC!
I cannot WAIT to dig in to this one.
Booth Junkie Still cranking out videos every 3 days. It's difficult. You'll appreciate the video I'm releasing on March 2. Stay tuned!
As expected great video and super helpful. Thanks for sharing this info with us!
Thanks Mike! Means a lot coming from you.
I had the exact same problem when I began using my SM57 connected to a fethead (without the fethead, it'd never had any issues). The ground loop was a pain in the neck, driving me mad, until Bandrew from Podcastage suggested during one of Lo's live stream that I should unplug my laptop and record on battery. Guess what? The static went off. I know that the problem is still there, living inside the microphone, but it is a quick fix that at least allows me to record in peace.
Z Alves That's most certainly a ground loop issue. Solder a jumper between pin 1 and the ground shell and your issue will be resolved.
I have the same problem with the SM57 and wrote about it to Shure.
They replied with:
"The metal grill will act as a mini-faraday cage; interrupting the EMI signals in the room and making the mics get a cleaner signal. The SM57's grill is plastic, so in these high-gain situations, it could be more likely to pick up hum than a Beta 57A for example.
To best reduce hum, try to place the mics away from sources of EMI, place the mic closer to the sound source to need a little gain as possible."
but it didn't really help me.
I've decided to unplug everything in my room from power and listen to the audio with a battery powered audio interface and found out that every power strip starts buzzing when I plug into it anything that drains a lot like my PC or another power strip.
I took a smaller one and plugged in only my PC and preamp. All of the noise problems I had disappeared. Well, the 50Hz still exists but like 30-40dB lower, which doesn't bother me at all!
[edit again]
I have the jumper soldered as you say and it helped with harmonics of the 50hz (100, 150, etc.) in my case but the 50 still existed. It was ~10dB quieter but still was there.
Daniel Leszczak It wouldn't bother me either especially being a dynamic.
Andrew M. Sheppard there're only five or six channels all over RUclips that are exclusively dedicated to home recording and as I get involved in all those, I may look omnipresent sometimes ^_^ stop stalking me, Andrew!
Andrew M. Sheppard He's everywhere alright.
Thank you, didn't know about that. As to reducing noise floor by EMC connector I just think you've increased the resistance by longer cable and connectors and shelfed the high end a bit :)
You'll be surprised then. I test that and go into great detail in this video: ruclips.net/video/9dZs6N1lJkY/видео.html
Funnily enough, I think this is the first RUclips video that I've watched with a loudness of 0.0dB... Anyway, you've sold me on those Neutrik EMC XLR connectors haha
darkmew64 LOL! I like a hot, slightly compressed audio track so you don't have to crank it up or constantly adjust level. Although not technically standard practice, I prefer it.
Great video, these methods are tried and tested; I've discovered a lot of "lower quality" cheap condenser mics (you know the ones I'm talkin about) actually have similar issues with earthing internally too.
Caloss2 Channel Yep, many videos about this topic online but I've never seen anyone physically route the wires the way I did on video before so I thought it had value.
It's been done before, but I've not seen it on youtube either and I think it's a great thing to see an industry professional like yourself doing it; that alone has real value.
Caloss2 Channel Thanks dude. I'm fully expecting someone to lecture me on how bad it is for my recorder and microphone to play with the phantom power like that. I've seen some people get really hot over unplugging and plugging in condenser mics before.
Thanks, this is very useful. I'm really surprised NO ONE before has ever mentioned to me that EMC connectors exist and are available. We could have used them - a very small cost for the security and upgrade in cable quality.
I wonder if there is an "emc inline connector" that could plug in front of my XLR cables to give me the same effect without me having to customer order cables.
THanks - very useful video!
I think someone in the comments mentioned one but I haven't tested or used them. I may have even put it in the description. Check it out.
Edit: I'm not seeing it right now but in my EMC Connector video someone in the comments mentions a Sescom connector. I have no experience with it but found the link: www.markertek.com/product/ses-inline-emcf/sescom-ses-inline-emcf-inline-rf-filter-3-pin-xlr-male-to-neutrik-emc-female-ground-lift
You're supposed to connect only one side of the shielding: think about the Faraday's cage, it works because electromagnetic waves cannot go trough metal. But, if you connect the other side too, then it's an electrical connection, meant for electricity to flow through, where it may cause another ground loop/issue
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Thank you Sir, You solved a big headache very simply. 🥰🥰🥰
Sure thing! Glad to help.
Hi Allen. Great video, examples and solutions. Your test cable is awesome. Thanks for the generous credit. Cheers, Dave.
David Harry Thank you for letting me use the excerpt. I need to watch more of your videos. I've enjoyed every one I've seen. Thanks again.
I found that using Star Quad Optima mic wire will eliminate almost 98% of RF noise....it has 6 wires instead of 3. Pin 1 , pin 2 and 3.
Conquest is the only company that I know makes it.
Awesome! It's great to have quality cables you can trust.
seeing as touching my headset microphone keeps giving out massive noise I can atleast deduct that the grounding issue is what is causing my noise... thanks for confirming.
Glad to help
I have a question, I have an issue with USB noise. I have a PC with Interface, Pedal Board, and Amplifier. I run a stereo signal from Boss GT-100(pedalboard) to Interface and it sounds great NO noise) The problem starts when I run a SEND line from pboard to amp. From the amp i get a high pitch squeal that disappears when i disconnect the usb from GT-100. Commercially available USB isolators will eliminate the noise, but they also stop communication between GT100 and the Computer. I remedied this problem a long time ago with a cable mod by severing the #4 ground inside the cable. Lost that cable. Cannot replicate the success i had before. Ive cut numerous USB Cables and none of them will allow communication or eliminate the noise. I realize this is alot to absorb, and i apologize, however out of desperation, and 4yrs of wrecking cables, and wasting money on isolation gadgets I am ready to admit i need help lol -Lou
I'm sorry to say that I have no experience with guitar pedals and such. I could guess but would probably be wrong. Try Dave Rat or someone else on RUclips that is a musician. Sorry. Try other cables would be my only troubleshooting suggestion.
Hey Allen! I love the video, but I have a quick question. I wanna try using that EMC connector, but I don't have soldering equipment. Is there any way I can just buy a cable that already has that connecter installed?
The closest I'm aware of is an adapter. www.markertek.com/product/ses-inline-emcf/sescom-ses-inline-emcf-inline-rf-filter-3-pin-xlr-male-to-neutrik-emc-female-ground-lift
Stay tuned here though because I've been toying with the idea of making cables for viewers again. I use them on the cables I make.
@@SoundSpeeds Aye will do. Thanks!
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@SoundSpeeds, we are all very grateful for your dedicated video review, thank you!! I am sorry that you had to go through something like this, that too coming from a reputable audio engineering company.
If I may have a moment of your time:
I am using a USB mixer (without AC power). The 5V needed to power the device directly flows from the device into the computer via USB . I hear a lot of hissing going on in the background when I monitor using headphones.
My query is the following:
Could I theoretically speaking, buy a USB extension (male to female) and cut into the USB wire casing, locate the ground wire and cut that as well? Would that solve the ground loop issue, if at all the issue is the grounding..?
Thank you!
I wouldn't. By the time the audio gets to the USB cable, it's digital and won't get a buzz from a ground loop acoustically the same way as it would a digital artifact. It's likely something on your mixer or an analog mic or cable. I'd disconnect everything except the XLR cable and listen on headphones. If it's there, you may have a bad mixer unless it's an issue with the model and a Google search would tell you that. If it's clean, connect up one mic and listen... then two and so forth. Change out cables and mics to see where the issue first shows up.
Really great video Allen. And thanks for the info on the EMC connectors. So I'm listening here in my studio and I couldn't help but notice some frequency loss when you demonstrated the EMC connectors versus your custom connector cable. I bounced back and forth a couple times just to be sure I was hearing that correctly, but then I noticed you we're slightly more off axis during that portion of your video which I can only assume is what I'm hearing.
Michael Wynne I'm sure that's it. EMC connectors don't change the sound
Is that 4th cable soldering to the outer metal part of the xlr connector?
Yes
Than you so much, it really helps me a lot, can you make another video regarding Radio Frequency Interference from router (wifi) affecting my sennheiser wireless microphone.
Which Sennheiser is it? Which WiFi router? They shouldn't step on each other unless the Sennheiser is 2.4GHz
Hey Allen, thanks for this video. I have radio interference coming through when I use my audio snake. if i plug the mic into my interface it's fine, but into the snake the radio sounds come in. would this work for this issue?
There's a chance it will. Sounds like a bad snake though.
I have a cheap logitech mike plugged into my computer. I'd like to record little sound snippets for some projects into audacity, but I get this religious radio station as background noise. Any cheap way I can eliminate it?
Hey a better cable. One that grounds properly. Could be the cheap mic
Would you recommend connecting a mic’s pin1 to the interior of the mic chassis to help this problem?
It may help, it might not. Can't hurt if you connect up the female pin 1 to the chassis. On a rare occasion I've run into RF if you connect up the male pin 1 to chassis though.
@@SoundSpeeds Thanks! So your recommendation would be done to a cable, not the mic itself?
Yes. I wouldn't mod a mic for this reason. A cable is far cheaper to replace if you mess up and if you ever sent your mic in for repair, the warranty would be void. The cable could also be used with multiple mics. I always do my cables.
They have a stunning set of balls to send that back to you as "Fixed"....... what company was that?
Huh? I'm sorry, I'm not following. Harmon fixed the 535A then refixed it.
Thanks to Kevin for sending me here.
Yes indeed. Thanks for coming by and checking out the channel.
i have a similar issue wirh a usb mic, the difference is that it is completely noiseless until i touch the back (and only the back) of the grid, that's when a buzzing sound starts to creep in. is this the same issue? and can it damage the mic if not fixed?
That's a great question. I'm not 100% certain because I don't deal with USB mics. I'd try a different USB cable though just in case although I doubt that's the issue. If you're hearing a buzz, that's an audible sound meaning it had to occur before the analog sound was converted to digital and went down the USB line. I don't know that a floating ground on a USB mic is something you can fix.
@@SoundSpeeds it only happens when i touch it though, otherwise its 100% usable, the thing that's bothering me the most its not knowing if it can break the mic.
Anyway, thanks for the quick answer i'll check with another cable
I understand completely. It sounds like a floating ground issue but with a USB mic, there's no fix. Actually, you can try making a copper cable with alligator clips on both ends and clipping one end to the microphone and the other end to metal on your computer but no guarantees that will work.
Great Video and Very informative!
LoneRaptor Thank you. Be sure to check out the Neutrik EMC video if you haven't seen it.
Will do!
I get a lot of humming while using my phone through the mixer ,, what device ,, which way is the best way around .. which isolator is the best one to use .. (inexpensive)
Wow... coming out of your phone... TRRS 1/8" connector?
@@SoundSpeeds 2.5mm to 3.5mm adapter connected to headset of phone , then to 3.5mm to 1/4 phono (,mono) then inserted to mixer using aux send and mic input,, ,, dial does not hum but when you try to dial a number, a loud humming comes up,,, how do I fix this ?
Your phone likely outputs via a TRRS and you're likely shorting it with a TRS adapter.
@@SoundSpeeds I plug the 2.5mm male to headset input of the phone,, then at the other end is 3.5 female,, I plug the 3.5 mm male to two phono male jack unbalanced to the mixer aux send going out to caller and the other end of the phono jack goes to mic or line input .. dial tone dos not hum but when you try to dial the number there is loud buzzing/humming coming through the sound from the mixer .. how do I fix this problem?
The connector going out of your phone. I know the size, 2.5mm, but not the pinout and that's critical info. Just because it plugs into your phone doesn't mean it's the right connector. Your phone accepts a 2.5mm miniplug and since it's a phone, it probably is designed for you to plug in a stereo headset with microphone for phone calls, right? The connector you're plugging in is probably stereo only and that means the audio is shorting to the mic. That is my first suspicion. Twice now I've asked about that connector and three times now you've told me the signal chain but not answered my question. 3rd and last time... is the 2.5mm a TRRS or TRS?
Hi Allen,I’m trying to build a kick drum subwoofer mic for my drum kick,but I would like to ground the xlr Ground to my 12” inch speaker chassis.What do you think I should do?I’m a perfectionist,most guys on RUclips who built them just soldering the positive and the negative just leave the ground blank.
It's not electrical or part of a redundant or EMI eliminating system so a third line isn't necessary nor will it do anything. You can try to tie the XLR ground and neutral together and it seem if it helps but honestly, speakers only use two unshielded wires so a third is unnecessary.
Sound Speeds Think you very much for your help!
Certainly
I’ve fixed samson c02 buzzing by connecting front metal protective mesh to metal mic body, enormous hissing happens in case of approaching to mesh with any part of body. Made video about also.
It’s possibly not really floating ground (relate to capacitor mics) it’s more of additional capacitance area that adds more pots from approaching to it (electrostatic potential) feeds one pole of capacity and influence sound quality more than sound wave you send it
Sound like something a Neutrik EMC connector would be a great to try on.
I've not heard of this as an issue across the board on C02s. Are you sure yours isn't broken?
@@SoundSpeeds Sure, I fixed issue after assembling and because I simplified front air pop filter inside it’s sensitivity increased
ruclips.net/video/ot1NOesV6pg/видео.html here more details, on dissasm it, little boring )
I'll check it out. Thanks
I really think a better way (rather than just boosting audio sections) would be to kill your dynamic range (on post) to be able to properly hear the noise floors through youtube's lossy/crappy audio compression. Heh, I guess "Normalizing" would finally have some use.
Javier Paya Normally I do compress my audio somewhat but chose to boost this way because it's much cleaner to raise only certain places as much as I want and when.
I know/understand. The problem is that the (codec) compression still kills most of it (noise), so viewers have to quickly play with their volume knobs in their headphone amps if we want to hear "in detail" what's this noise's all about. My idea is that by 'squashing' (technical term?) the range in such sections the codec would have no choice but to keep the detail in, and the volume stays relatively the same. AAC is a pain.
Javier Paya Good points but my concern with squashing the dynamics is that it lowers the quality of the recording in much the same way as reducing bit depth does. With RUclips compression, it does me no favors.
That is kind of the point, imagine a blurry image where you want to better discern a shape: up the contrast a bunch and you will start to see where shapes differ, while also burning out a lot of color gradients (aka detail).
In any case, "the right way" would be to have links to uncompressed samples, at least when listening for different 'sound flavors'. Not worth all that trouble just for noise.
To anyone else reading, another trick is to *really* lower your ambient noise while listening. When hunting for background noise it's not the same outcome when doing it 2am while your city sleeps versus doing it at 1pm on a Monday. Even with closed back headphones... that is while also trying to not to kill your ears by maxing out the volume, heh.
Javier Paya That's happened to me. I tested the mic on a noisy set and it sounded fine but as soon as it wasn't noisy, active noise floor.
informative stuff, thank you.
Glad to help
Hello I bought a cheap audio interface, sometimes it works fine but sometimes it does weird grounding noises when I touch the knobs, how can I possibly fix that?
That's a grounding issue. Make sure everything connected to your interface is powered off the same outlet (including computer peripherals, TVs, etc) and that you're using good audio cables. Keep audio cables away from power cables. If it's still happening, unplug everything from your interface and plug in headphones to listen. If it's clean, add a microphone and listen. If not, try a different mic or cable to figure out where the issue is. If it's clean, turn on the computer. Test one thing at a time and see at what point it starts giving you issues. You can also go at it backwards and start with the way it now and start removing cables until the badness goes away.
@@SoundSpeeds I tried different solutions to fix this, I tried changing cables, reinstalling drivers etc. The sound is good after few minutes after I turn it on but every time I play a minus one there is suddenly buzzing noise. I tested if it's my mic but the mic is good and no buzzing sound, to power this device and for the PC to detect it, it needs to be connected to the computer via usb cable so I can't plug it to another power source.
@@SoundSpeeds This is weird, whenever I record at night time the humming or buzzing noise is not present.
What do you mean "Every time you play a minus one?" If it's only happening during the day, run a few tests to see if it goes on or off any a specific time. Could be poor grounding on another thing in your house and that thing is causing dirty ground. For example, if it stops buzzing at 6PM every day and that is the exact same time as your thermostat turns off for the day, it's probably related to that. If it happens between 5 and 5:30 everyday and that's when your automatic outdoor lighting turns on for the night, check the timer for that lighting. That kind of thing.
@@SoundSpeeds Every 11:00PM up to 4:00 AM it stops grounding, but after that the grounding goes on and off. We are not using circuit breaker currently because our circuit breaker is struck by lightning this might be the cause of the issue?
man why dont you just change the title and add more tags like" Noise, Buzzing sound, static noise fix, ect..." because this video deserve more than a million views and people really looking into this video, only crappy videos shows on youtube when you search for fix microphone noise.
I'm slowly going back and changing some of my earlier video titles. I'll make sure this one is done. Thank you.
Now if only we could have similar tech for electric guitars... My hatred towards that electric buzzing when you're not touching the strings knows no bounds.
Ahhhhhh, yes. If only I were a musician and knew that world. I'd play.
Hi. I'm new to recording and stuff. I have a focusrite 2i2 3rd gen bundle. When I touched the mic, I can hear a loud buzzing noise that sounds like a razor. Is it a grounding issue or there's a problem with my mic? When I'm recording a guitar, I can also hear a noise on my headset monitor but it decreases when I touch the interface.
What mic is it? It's very likely a floating ground on the mic or a bad/unbalanced cable otherwise.
@@SoundSpeeds the condenser mic that is included in the bundle. If you're not busy, can I email you the vid so you can actually hear it? It'll be highly appreciated. I don't know what to do anymore :(
Sure thing!
Thanks! How can I possibly contact you?
My email address is in the description of every video and the end of each too.
Sir my sansui led tv aux port humming alot while playing anything through tv to music towers..
I'm sorry. It's a high impedance output and not designed for high fidelity.
@@SoundSpeeds sorry i didn't understand can you elaborate how can i fix that
If you're using premium quality cables, it's the aux port's noise itself. No way to fix it unless it's defective. Try a different cable and if it sounds the same, try a different port.
@@SoundSpeeds but my tv has only aux port don't even has Audio out ports..
I watch many videos where people Use Isolation transformer 1:1 between cable in Bridge
I must have misunderstood. I don't know then. Yours is a consumer A/V question and that's out of my area of expertise. From your comment, it sounded like your question was about an aux out used for audio and going into a receiver to be amplified thru towers. In that circumstance I would presume that the output wasn't very clean because usually they aren't. If you have other advise about this, take it over mine.
how about if my mic has permanent cable or doesnt have xlr??
It's likely inexpensive. Clean what you can or try a different USB cable.
samsung owns AKG since 2017
Samsung owns Harmon International who owns AKG, yeah.
I live next to a radio station and my mic makes a noise like this but 10x worse
Very understandable. A lot of excitement in the airwaves.
@@SoundSpeeds I'm really struggling to understand what to do, how should I try and manage it. Is it even possible
@@SoundSpeeds I've got to sleep but hope for a response tomorrow :D
My recommendation would be to use star quad XLR cables preferably with EMC connectors on the female end (ruclips.net/video/zc3cbLncmp0/видео.html) for anything analog in your signal chain. You might also get some faraday cloth and spot treat things like the wall that's facing the antenna and maybe even the ceiling if it's a tall antenna. Make sure your audio cables are as short as possible and run away from all power cables. Make sure all of your audio equipment, computer and everything connected to the same outlet are on a premium power conditioning power strip. That should do as good as possible. The premium star quad cables with EMC connectors should help as much as possible.
@@SoundSpeeds thank you very much ,you're a life saver
Hi! I notice out of sync with audio and video half way through. Experieced it befor on Otter of your videos 4-6 videos back.
Any one else notice that?
Love your channel!
Marty Oakvally If it's only slightly out of sync for a cut or two then it's my mistake. I have a dual recording system where I record sound on a Sound Devices MixPre-6 and the video on my computer. I sync them but often edit late at night and may doze. The white circular transition requires me to move around the video clips but not the audio and if I doze while moving them, I may be up-to 3 frames off for that one cut. I usually catch it but I am human and make mistakes. If this is the case, it will always go back in sync once the next circle transition appears because it'll resync. Does this sound like the sync issue you see?
Yes it does. Not my intention to be patronizing to your videos. As I said before I love your videos! Keep up your great work on delivering these great educational videos.
Marty Oakvally Cool! Good to know. I appreciate the feedback.
Sounds like the joint is haunted.
Kinda does
I bought a condenser mic, unfortunately my mic audio sounds bad, I always hear a static hiss so strong it sounds like it is raining inside my mic, I found out about a ground loop isolator, could my issue be about the grounding of my mic?
For reference, I uploaded a video: ruclips.net/video/RGf0yb0CL8Q/видео.html
It's hard to tell knowing no details but tour BM-800 could be defective. It's weird that the audio track looks like it's stereo and both sides are moving differently though. Is this the only mic connected? Tell me about your signal flow.
Try another cable. Usually it's the 3.5mm jack that buzzes
@@SoundSpeeds Im not an expert but can you enlighten me about "signal flow"
Well, XLR microphones that connect directly into a PC bypassing interfaces are usually problematic. Condenser mics won't likely power up at as the power from the mini Jack isn't enough to power one. Dynamic mics are low sensitivity so you'd need to gain up a lot to get a decent level out of it. That could lead to buzz too. You should get a USB audio interface to plug your lock into so that your computer can get the audio in good quality.
@@SoundSpeeds I currently have my Condenser Mic onto a Phantom power then XLR to 3.5mm, btw I noticed it has been 2 years since you have uploaded this video and you are still replying, Thanks King!
But its krrrrrkkkkkkk ing now nieuw noise coming in place
?
Christ, get to the point
Settle down Mr Attention Span.