Video Poster is a failure at researching: vgsales.fandom.com/wiki/Sonic Shadow the Hedgehog actually sold more than most Sonic Games after it (Forces, Lost worlds, 4, True sonic games always fail (since the first the sales have been halfing with each new installment) Sonic games like racing etc. are a huge success and sell 10-20x as much. Also, if you think the controls are bad in this game you suck at videogames. I'm sorry, but it's true.
21:26 "When a new idea fails, Sega scraps the idea instead of refining the execution." That sums it up brilliantly. It's why Sega are reluctant to utilize other Sonic characters as playable, because according to overly critical whiners "Sonic's stupid friends are always bad and nothing that you do with them can ever make them good!" Sega won't go back and refine the Adventure style because "those games were never good!" This attitude really is hurting the series more than helping it.
I enjoyed many games people thought are bad and to be honest, I hardly had any issues others had but I won't say it didn't get frustrating, I just know the games got better the more I keep playing and I'm noticing Sonic Team saved the best for last, I'm sure they made it hard not out of hate but to show if we deserve to see the end and if you do the hard challenges, you do get something exciting to play because Super Sonic in the Sonic Riders series is tough to obtain which him being overpowered in the first is when the difficulty is higher, the second is easier as Super Sonic isn't as overpowered and the third is far more difficult even if you have motion controls and Super Sonic is like how he is in the first but has huge improvements making him better and he automatically pulls off S+ Tricks for you during his Super Sonic Boost but while Rings drain, the Unlimited Air which is him having the Special Mode mechanic everyone gets when falling behind to use their Special Abilities like in SRZG which gives you a full Tank of Air when returning as Sonic and it is something they really did care about. It seems as if Sonic Team knew they couldn't prevent issues with controls and gave a character who can make it less of a headache and given how Super Sonic is meant to be special and exclusive, they made him feel like a relief and rewarding.
@@nmr7203 Well, yes actually! Where do you think this defeatist mentality came from? After years of people constantly nitpicking so many different aspects of the Sonic series, the people behind these games seem to have developed this "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em" attitude! "Oh, people keep complaining about Sonic's characterisation, that he comes across as a cocky a***hole, then screw it, let's just make him a cocky a***hole!" "People have hated Tails since day one and say that he's always been annoying and pointless, so let's just write him as annoying and pointless!" "People keep making fun of Knuckles because they think he's an idiot for getting tricked by Eggman, so let's just write him as a complete brain dead moron who can barely read!" "People won't shut up with their idiotic 'Shadow the EDGE-LORD, EDGY THE HEDGY, OW THE EDGE' memes, so it only makes sense to just write him a moody Emo who's trying too hard to be cool, since that's all people see him as!" "Oh and look at this! People keep saying 'No one plays Sonic games for the plot or characters!' So there you go! We could just go down the Teen Titans Go! route and just have all the characters going 'HERPY DERP, AIN'T WE SILLY, KIDS?' And no one would care! Sonic shouldn't be taken so seriously, it's just a stupid series about a silly blue hedgehog, right?"
Its not a Good Game, but its a Fun Game, because as kid you love the over edginess of Shadow (even if the story s*cks) and as adult because its just too much you cannot take it seriously because its ridiculous
@@Freedmoon44 It was my first Sonic game, and I loved this character. I never saw alot of Shadow and as a kid he was so mysterious to me. I would see the trailers with him for Sonic X and would be so intrigued...then I never got to see him in the actual show for one reason or another. I love the game so much. So so much.
Same, I just like playing it for the fun and nostalgia also for how ridiculous it is at times. It was one of my first sonic games and because I played it on my friends ps2 and she didn't have a memory card we never were able to finish it, so it was just a loop of few stages. Also Shadow as character has just so much meaning for me, and it's shame how badly he has been treated over the years cuz once I got to play SA2 I was so happy to see justification for his character, even 06 does fucking manage to write him better than what came after that what strikes me so much concidering how big of a mess 06 is. Ow the edge is from critical standpoint trash but it just has it's own magical edgy nostalgia filled charm what makes me enjoy it.
How hacking looks in movies: Lithe goth maniacally hammering at the keyboard How hacking looks in real life: Hedgehog goth karate chomping the keyboard.
We don't know enough about that moment so let's not jump to the conclusions and actually analyze it, you'll understand better if you slow down the scene in a video and see what he did because there's things you'll understand if you slow down a cutscene, heck you can know how a character homing attacks and what it takes, there's actual movement made in animation.
Fun fact: When Shadow says "This is like taking candy from a baby, which is fine by me" they weren't actually trying to be edgy. In the Japanese script of the game, he says something along the lines of "This is ridiculously easy, but I'm still okay with it"
Yeah, the part that's "fine by him" is the fact that it's easy, not the idea of taking candy from a baby. Still, it sounds ridiculous, and probably should've been changed (or hammed up to go for ironic comedy, but this game lacks the self-awareness to do that).
It would have been better for the overall structure of the game if the endings were divided among 3 categories once you go to the third level. Hero in 3-3 (Eggman's Casino or whatever it was called)? You get locked into the hero or semi-hero path. It would have avoided scenarios were Shadow is both confirmed to be Gerald's creation and an Android at the same time.
Interestingly enough, the story and the game makes a lot of sense in a poetic way when you reach the last story. Because Shadow is searching for his past the entire game, but in the end, none of this is canon and doesn't matter after Heroes and the Shadow intro, until the last story. He accomplished what he promised to Maria to protect the world and used the ARC weapon Gerald built to destroy Black Doom as intended, which were the same objectives since Sonic Adventure 2. In the last scene he says: "Good bye Shadow the Hedgehog" and Never Turn Back plays. Which means he left his past behind him and it makes you realise that the purpose of the game itself was useless and doesn't matter. He is who he is now and must move forward. It's like a message to say: "the past is pointless, look forward." And that's pretty much what the path of this game is. Now yeah, from a video game perspective, that's pretty bad and there is no point but the way the game is and the end makes a lot of sense about the ideas the game conveys when you think about it.
Fun fact: Two of the CGI directors of this game would end up being involved with the Sonic Movies years later. Tim Miller (who also directed Deadpool and Terminator: Dark Fate) is the producer of the movies and Jeff Fowler is the director of both. You can see their names at 1:04:20. Guess they have some experience with the series before.
"Shadow begins to wonder if he himself is a robot and instead of poking himself to see, he with the help of Omega confronts Eggman." I found that funny for no reason lol.
Whenever Shadow was questioning if he was an android I said to myself "Do you not eat, drink or sleep? Cus that'd answer your question." I mean, it'd be more believable if he thought he was a clone but an android?
@@OnePolishMoFo I don't think the Ultimate Lifeform needs to eat, drink, or sleep. He was frozen for 50 years and came out peachy fine, I'm 100% sure he doesn't need any of that.
On the 'Vector's line when Shadow seems suicidal' thing; that's actually plot-relevant. In fact; the Chaotix missions all are, as they lead to the Gerald video recording in the Last Story; that's what they were looking for. Vector says 'things may not be as you think' because he's GOT THE FILE from the Computer Room.
@@JsReviews also the reason Shadow the hedgehog was well... Shadow the hedgehog, was because people were emailing Sonic team to have Sonic with guns Be careful what you ask for
The story really falls apart when you realize that all shadow had to do was talk to Sonic, Amy, Tails, or any of his friends about his past. Especially Rouge considering she’s the one who was sent by the government to do research on project shadow and she’s the one who started team dark. Even if they didn’t know about the aliens, what they knew of his past in adventure 2 would’ve saved him a lot of grief. But nope. Nobody bothers to explain anything to him and Shadow doesn’t bother asking. Instead the only people he turns to for answers are Eggman and Black Doom, two obvious villains who aren't even trying to hide the fact that they're just using him.
I think Shadow has trust issues in this one because he legitimately doesn't remember anything about himself and the only things he's finding are things that make less sense than "I am the real one" or "I'm a clone. The real one died in battle." Like imagine if the answer to who you are is "an alien/scientist test tube baby" or "an actual robot (even though the ones you fight are clearly more robotic than free-willed Shadows)." If the writing for MY backstory was that messy, I'd have trust issues too lmao
21:06 He went from Lawful Neutral in SA2(Lawful because he had strict "must do what Maria does" code and Neutral since he only cared about keeping the promise) to Neutral Good in Heroes(He lost his moral code but he was actually a proper hero this time since he fought Eggman and Metal Sonic) to True Neutral in his own game to briefly Lawful Good in 06(follows GUN orders as a good guy) and finally turned into Chaotic Evil or Chaotic Idiot in other games
@@misterboogcn1288 Sega said the only reason this game exists is because they received a lot of fan mail, requesting that Sonic wielded a gun. Yuji Naka knew that Sonic using gun would be out of character for sonic, but maybe it can work for Shadow??????
1:02:45 I think the logic is that they recognize his evil stage was their own damn fault. They thought he was already a mad scientist and went to take him down, but that ironically is what _made_ him a mad scientist. This is them going "oh... yeah, that was entirely our fault, we should have left him alone".
Yeah, I think the writing was just off- but that's to be expected I mean... the writing in the rest of the game is a little weird at times. I agree with the idea that the scene was probably supposed to be trying to convey the idea that the President and the G.U.N. dude realized that the government had made a mistake in the past. They realize that the reason the Ark project was shut down was because they thought Gerald was working with Black Doom when, in reality, he accepted the initial offer in order to stabilize the Shadow project which was supposed to help mankind, and then he devoted the remaining time on the ARK building a super weapon capable of stopping Black Doom when he eventually returned to the planet. So they should be saying, "We were wrong to have labelled him as a mad scientist from the beginning, He was only trying to help mankind with the ARK and we shut down his project and murdered his granddaughter." I don't know that I would label somebody a hero after what Gerald did do trying to kill all of humanity like that in SA2, but it's something like... If I were to be heralded as a great hero today but got dementia later on in life which completely altered me and made me a different person, should I be seen in a different light or not? Does the bad stuff invalidate the good stuff I did before I lost my mind? Kinda a hard concept to quantify I think.
@@m0002856I feel that there are a few interpretations as to either side being right. Gerald before GUN invading and Gerald after might as well be two different people. He was insane from his grief and was not rationally sound, made evident by his desire to destroy all human life. The same humanity he had worked so hard to save.
In fairness he made the biolizard and made a deal with alien leader called black doom. If that was my boss I'd be telling yhr CIA about that stuff too.
I think the most egregious example of this is Andrew Rannells going on to star in the original Broadway production of The Book of Mormon. No, really, moving on from kiddy butcherings of various anime is one thing, getting famous from that next step is exemplary, but still yet another thing, but going from THE most infamously nannying dubbing company in the biz to the lead role in the Broadway debut of TV's most notorious shock jocks? That's brassy, REAL brassy.
Funny how that cast is mostly responsible for many kid friendly anime english dubs. The voice of knuckles sounds like Yu-gi-oh, both of them. And I'm pretty sure Shadow himself is the same voice as Seto Kaiba.
Oh man, this game forever cemented Shadow as the series' most controversial character lol. Even to this day, people are up in arms over his portrayals.
Yeah. I'm not a fan of Shadow at all. But even I admit that it is sad seeing Shadow getting butchered from his character development. In fact, some of the characters starting in Shadow got butchered ( such as Knuckles & Tails for example ). But Shadow definitely gotten hit the hardest.
The idea of a Shadow based game having a “darker” tone can certainly work, Shadow certainly didn’t need more to his story as Heroes already wrapped that up pretty well I think but the general idea of a story based on Shadow focusing on his moral ambiguity’s and delving into many hypothetical scenarios Shadow could take could definitely work, but the execution was just dreadful. Shadow was already a cool character and a great contrast to Sonic, while Sonic is upbeat, extroverted, fun and charismatic, Shadow is more reserved and introverted, but still has a charming sense of charisma to him with the occasional quip and one liner which helps him bounce off Sonic well. This game ditched that entirely in order to make him “cool” and “edgy” by giving him guns and motorcycles and adopting an “I don’t give a fuck” personality... all of this surprisingly makes him laughable to watch and he ultimately becomes very difficult to take seriously, which was clearly the opposite of their intended goal. Shadow always struck me as the type not to use guns, because he has his own natural abilities which require skill, and he would view them the same way Batman does, “a weapon for a coward”. Although i’d be lying if I said my inner 8 year old doesn’t find the intro to this game cool as all hell.
I agree with you but when I think story created around different moral discisions from the player that lead to many different paths is good thing in term of replayability and allowing player choices it is also bad in term of making cohesive narrative that doesn't contradict it is many elements SA1 style is the best playing different campagnes to understand the whole story and get to the final episode as you defeat perfect chaos and put an end to the game sonic games already have replayability by memorizing level layouts and mastering the mechanics SA2 did add different alteration of levels emblems to collect chao garden and ranking system and it is propably one of the most replyeble sonic games ever made I don't get why sonic team add unnecessary mechanics to pad the length of their games to appeal to gaming market when making game that demand mastery and execution enjoyable level design will be infinitely replayable I don't think shadow is good game even in paper through my present 18 year old still think the intro to this game is cool as hell and I feel guilty because of that
When i got a hold of the OST i always felt like "Never turn back" (by Crush40) was a much more "fitting" super theme than "I am all of me" , it sings about his struggles and how he had to overcome major hurdles to get to this point, to fulfill Maria's wish, to let the people of the planet live in happiness and peace.
so fun fact: the japanese version of this game's dialogue is infinitely better and is more in line with shadow's characterization in sa2 and heroes, and shadow overall seems less irritated by everything, he's not saying "damn" every 5 seconds like a kid who just learned how to swear, and is overall more natural, there's also less stupidity in the japanese version like shadow's "stealing candy from a baby" line not existing, as well as the president not saying to pay homage to gerald, among other things. the game was originally going have a T rating and give the aliens red blood instead of green, but the ESRB just came up with the E10+ rating, so sonic team went for that instead, and according to one screenshot, the game was originally going to feature an enemy radar system at the bottom of the screen, it's a half circle with red dots to show enemies, it was removed because sonic team are known for their good decision making/s. now for my own opinions, i hate the guns in this game, like, why would you give us a game starring the ultimate lifeform, and instead of letting us use said ultimate lifeform's chaos energy projectiles, you just give him guns that literally any other sonic character can use? i mean could imagine a vergil style shadow game? with chaos spears as summoned swords and teleporting and explosive punches? or even a megaman zero style shadow game? those would've awesome! but we get this nonsense instead. at the very least try to tie this stupid decision to the story, like, say shadow just doesn't remember most of his chaos powers due to his amnesia, like maybe have a cutscene going. sonic: "hey shadow, why are you using guns instead of your chaos spear thingies?" shadow: "chaos spears? okay, how do i use them?" sonic: "uh? on second thought nevermind." see? simple. and the multiple pathways nonsense is garbage, encore mode should've just been the default mode of the game and the man power that was spent on all those non-canon cutscenes should've gone to making a better and more cohesive story.
@@milesstorzillo1039 ruclips.net/video/HGonkFXk_GU/видео.html "hmph, how incredibly stupid of those guys. leaving a chaos emerald out in the open in front of me like that."
@@alimowla3204 That’s... pretty much the same thing. The translation for that line wasn’t the issue, it was the line existing in the context of the “story’s” progression. Remember, you are on the HERO path when this scene plays. Stealing a chaos emerald like a selfish jackass from the people you are helping isn’t “hero-like” at all.
@@Deoxys_Used_Mimic i'm sorry, but no, claiming to have no issue with stealing a candy from a baby and calling your teammates stupid are not the same thing, what world do you live in where it's the same thing? i do agree everything you said afterwards, but that doesn't change the fact the line is dumb and _especially_ unfitting for shadow.
43:58 Man why does everyone hates the idea of branching path/choice matters in Sonic games? The problem is poor writting. If writers were actually good, this would be a great game story vise with a fresh idea
More like in shadow the hedgehog there are TOO MANY brancing Path If instead on ten we had 4 (like Evil, sub Evil, Sub Hero, full Hero i dunno) and more coesive storyline yeah, this game would be good Especially since Shadow past and development are great as we see in 06
@@Mepphy99 I actually think the game could've worked better without branching off the levels. There's a total of 22 levels. I felt that instead of having the mission choice affect the level path, it should've just caused cutscenes to alter with characters and whatnot slightly changing how they behave towards Shadow after choosing the same side for a few levels. Maybe have like 3-4 major events throughout the story that can be caused/prevented depending on the side you choose. I'm basically suggesting something similar to Detroit: Become Human but in Sonic game form.
I think the main issue, is the fact that you can switch sides at any point. I feel like after about the third stage, they should have just removed the evil missions from the hero side, and removed the hero missions from the evil side. Maybe remove both from the neutral side if you're feeling particularly spicy
I can't believe Never Turn Back's piano was I am all of me! That's such a good detail thanks for bringing it up!! Anyway great review man! I was not expecting this one so soon but I enjoyed it. Can't wait to hear your opinions on 06 as I know it will be interesting to see the least.
Part of me wishes omega and rouge were more prominent characters in this games story. Since the 3 of them became friends in heroes. It would have been nice to see them work together to help shadow figure things out.
I hate my 14 year-old self for being stupid enough to be hyped for this abysmal game. The way Shadow was written stings, the story shoots itself in the foot every step, and the gameplay isn't fun at all. After 15 years, it's still haunting Shadow's characterization to this day.
You were young. Most of us look back on somethings we liked and shake our heads. I’ve played and enjoyed my share of terrible games and didnt care because I was super young.
When I was younger I just liked Shadow coz he was "cool and edgy", I never noticed a difference between SA2 Shadow and 05 Shadow, they were all the same to me and I love the character regardless. As I got older however I came to appreciate how good of a character Shadow (amongst other characters) really is when depicted in games like SA2, Heroes, and 06... which also led me to absolutely despise how he was depicted in his spin-off game, and fucking sigh at the way Shadow is still being currently depicted.
Shadow's main writing issues of being nothing more than aggression and edge here stem mostly from Takashi Iizuka's interpretation of the character, which has been the same interpretation he's had since the meta era started, so that's why it seems like Shadow is such a castrated asshole in the new games. This is also why he's so much better in 06 because he's the Shiro Maekawa interpretation, which is the same as he is in SA2 and Heroes and all the other games up until Black Knight.
@@sonicsucks20 yep it's a common trend no one likes sonic 4, so sega won't mainline make any more 2.5D games no one likes sonic boom, so sonic's model won't be majorly experimented with anytime soon no one likes 06, so shadow would lose his best characterization
@@theredguy4043 Sega said the only reason this game exists is because they received a lot of fan mail, requesting that Sonic wielded a gun. Yuji Naka knew that Sonic using gun would be out of character for sonic, but maybe it can work for Shadow??????
This game was ahead of its time. I mean it in the sense of developers had something in mind but couldn't do due to hardware limitation so had to reduce it to this. If this game was to be remade full on for this generation it'd be crazy. Levels could be bigger and mechanics/graphics would be amazing
If sega were to do this again they need to learn a lesson. Stop crapping out half baked games. With dread it was delayed for 20 years just because the hardware wasn’t ready. It’s better to not release something than to let it be released half baked
Personally, I feel like there's an oddly canon path to the game. If you take the Expert Mode as canon (multiple characters make note that this is training, some sort of VR G.U.N simulation? But Black Doom starts talking at one point so who knows), then you'll hear Cream mention Shadow saved her and have the G.U.N Commander apologize for what happened during that one cutscene trying to shoot Shadow. From this, we can infer that Shadow had to save Cream during Cryptic Castle's Hero Mission and he had to meet with the G.U.N Commander meaning Cosmic Fall is the final level. There's a path that fits just that, Dark Westopolis, Hero Digital Circuits, Hero Cryptic Castle, Hero Sky Troops, Neutral Space Gadget, then Hero Cosmic Fall. This path leads Shadow through both of the aforementioned events that happened, and it makes sense cause it ends on the ARK and it could lead into The Last Story. Filling in the blanks, Black Doom could get away while Vector is comforting a depressed Shadow (Shadow straight up walks away in that ending, Black Doom could leave if he wants to) and then Shadow travels from the ARK to The Black Comet with all Chaos Emeralds in hand to confront him, while Sonic and the gang take the extra time from Cosmic Fall to The Last Way to get on the Black Comet too. You don't help the Chaotix gather data at all in this route though, but I guess you can say they took the spare time to get the data themselves (and Vector's at the computer room in Cosmic Fall, he must've found something there or had some sort of data that would lead him there in the first place). I think that all fits together quite nicely, but I think SEGA said Pure Hero is canon, so this is outta the picture. There's a path on Pure Hero where you help the Chaotix gather all the data (except helping Vector get to the computer room) so that probably works out too. I just find it odd if this were canon because Shadow goes from fully understanding who he is and backing Black Doom into a corner with Sonic with seven Chaos Emeralds in the Black Comet to chasing him down on the Black Comet again during The Last Way despite already beating him in The Final Haunt. Cosmic Fall -> The Last Way just makes more sense to me than The Final Haunt -> The Last Way. Also just want to note a bizarre little detail with Vector, whenever he jumps he still has his special sound effect from Sonic Heroes. I'm sure it's just a carryover from Heroes and it's small enough that it didn't take much effort, but I'm surprised it's still here.
I would add Iron Jungle to that path, as during the final battle against Devil Doom, Eggman mentions how he lied about Shadow being an android that he created, which only happens in Iron Jungle. Also, Mad Matrix could be important to have as it connects the hacking scene the Chaotix have in that level and then in the Ark, where Charmy replicates what Shadow does in the intro to Mad Matrix to get the Ark computer working (although that can't happen alongside Cryptic Castle). It even naturally connects with Prison Island by helping Charmy get that data needed to start their process to the Ark (of the three, Charmy would most likely need the most help), and it makes sense for Shadow to help as he is trying to learn more about his past, with Prison Island being central to that. Personally, I always thought Hero Black Comet made the most sense as the level to lead into The Last Way, as the setting and Shadow's conclusion (that he knows best and no one will tell him what to do) fit the most with how The Last Way starts, and even though Eggman seemingly dies, Shadow has no reason to kill him and he even says "Never show your face around me again!", which might imply that he simply knocked the doctor out. Plus, it would also explain why Eggman is on foot during The Last Way without any mechanical help; Shadow destroyed his machines and he needed to stay by Sonic and co. for protection. It even fits with the three aforementioned levels, although the expert mode dialogue doesn't really suit it. Through as you said, Black Doom can still talk to Shadow despite being dead, so I don't know how canon Expert mode would be. TL;DR: My canon path would be: Neutral Westopolis, Neutral Glyphic Canyon, Hero Prison Island, Dark Mad Matrix, Dark Iron Jungle, Hero Black Comet.
@@JinzoFiter Oh shoot, you're right. Well you can just do Dark Digital Circuit and end up with the same route I think. I guess I just wanted some involvement with Rouge in this route lol
@@davidvazquez8225 no. It wouldn’t have. It would look nice, but it wouldn’t change the fact the story is horrendous and possibly the worst pre meta era story in the whole franchise.
I used to be a Shadow fangirl when I was like 12, so this game was my favorite from the franchise, I tought it was so cool and stayed that way because I didn't touch it again since i finished, and now I''m starting to realize how cringy it is. Shadow had his own game but we never got to see him like a person with complex emotions, just edgy the hedgy saying "damn"
And doing nearly nonsensical tasks while going through a bunch of asinine stories that won`t matter since most of them would be non-canon, and even the ones that are canon are equally stupid
To me, the story of Shadow the Hedgehog is more like a crappy choose-your-own-adventure book, where you have all these different story paths, only for there to end up being only one “true” “canon” path, making all the others pointless in the end.
Idk not all of the endings suck to me. Some of them are nice. Like the pure hero, semi-hero, semi-dark, and the one where he betrayed Black Doom at the end. That ending is funny.
The dreamcasts downfall is really one of the saddest things in gaming history for me. It was a powerful console for its time, so much wasted potential.
It was a powerful system, but strategically it was too soon. If they maybe would have waited one more year. I'd love to see Sega rebuild their empire and maybe release a system one day. It could happen MC world.
It really was an incredible console for the era, a shame nobody besides Sega and Acclaim really took advantage of it. That PowerVR chip has a lot more to give than 2D platformers and top-down shooters, or in modders' case, another Doom source port.
Crazy thing is. Sega has enough properties and exclusives to enter the console market again. They'd actually be decent competition, especially with the console shortage. They'd sell like hotcakes.
This game’s story feels like a “choose your own adventure book” with the ability to jump to later pages to continue the story left out. You have to read the whole thing page by page like a regular book, whether it makes sense or not.
Underrated comment right here. The comment in the video about the main story not being relevant to the Last Story felt off to me because, as you said, the main story needs to be taken as a front-to-back amalgamation of events, even if it doesn't make linear sense. It's not that none of these things happened, it's that all of them happened, just maybe not quite as the game depicted.
I was born in ‘98 and this was the first game I ever owned. Sure I played old classic Mac games before, but Shadow was the first my dad bought only for me thinking it would be another happy childlike Sonic game. Now I know this bad boy had a deep impact in my personality, from the edginess I went through my teens to the gothic-industrial-esque musical preferences that still remain.
I’ve noticed that too many Sonic retrospectives on youtube are done by dudes in their 30s who all grew up with the adventure era so I think it’s really nice and refreshing to hear opinions from someone with a different experience with the franchise.
the final cutscene where shadow says "goodbye, shadow the hedgehog" is oddly prophetic, like sonic team knew that they pretty much ruined his character and how he's perceived by the masses for the foreseeable future.
Honestly now knowing all the company turmoil that went on during this time with the merger with Sammy, creative warfare with Yuji Naka, and basically forcing Iizuka to develop huge portions of the game alone, it’s actually amazing that anything released at all during that period.
I was a big fan of Sonic after finishing up Sonic X, and I was desperate for more Sonic action. This lead me to buying Shadow the Hedgehog for the PS2. And while I struggled to get through it, I soon found myself having a blast with it...after using a gameshark for infinite health ammo and stuff. Yes I enhanced the game, but it allowed me to have so much fun. I guess my advice is if you want to enjoy this game use a game shark and it's a blast.
Me before the video: Where's that DAMN fourth 3d Sonic review. Me now: O, here it is. That was easy, like stealing candy from a baby, wich is fine by me. *Proceeds to use a karate key on my device in order to watch the video.*
I do sincerely hope one day Shadow may be able to get another game that is great, and keeps his character great as it was in SA2, Heroes & 06. A Shadow The Hedgehog game is not bad, and some of their ideas had potential even if their presentation in Shadow The Hedgehog made them seem very bad. I just don’t want to see what could be such a great game thrown to the wayside like so many other things in the gaming industry and especially in Sonic.
I think they're making one. A few months ago, Sega was announcing a darker toned game, and everyone thought it was gonna be Shadow the Hedgehog 2. Unfortunately, it wasn't, and people were so upset that they got Shadow The Hedgehog trending on Twitter, so i think they'll make another one since the demand is high
@@cerebralassassin2185 there is certainly a possibility, but the problems lay within Sega itself which has some sort of rules or restrictions in place that might hurt things (came sometime after 06 I believe?), and so that may just make for another flop of a game. I can’t say for sure. However, there may also be a problem in Sega relating to fears of a character like Shadow overtaking Sonic in popularity. I don’t know how widespread that fear may be, and how much it has influenced things over time so take that part with a grain of salt, but I am still just skeptical and almost feel that the unfortunate and unnecessary shroud of Sonic 06 hanging over the Sonic Team and Sega may just make any Shadow the Hedgehog 2 a flop.
your wish is Sega's Command! 🧞♂️ a sequel to Shadow the Hedgehog (in which Black Doom returns) is due to be released in, "Autumn 2024". Just Search, "Sonic x Shadow Generations"
I enjoyed this game enough to not only get all A Ranks and all keys on every stage and complete Expert Mode, but I've fully completed all the library sequences TWICE.
Also, I can easily buy Shadow being evil in this game. Remember he lost his memory and in the game Doom manipulates him by telling him what GUN did to Maria. This was literally the same motivation he had to nearly destroy Earth in Sonic Adventure 2.
I also could buy it if Black Doom somehow mixed the facts about his past but the thing is, in the last stages of Heroes he says "Even if I'm not real, I'm still the Ultimate Life Form, Shadow the Hedgehog!" So in the end he doesn't care if he's fake or not, he decides to just keep moving and doing the right thing, not to say he showed an heroic nature by saving Rouge in SA2 and Heroes But here he keeps asking about his past, straight up doesn't care that the city is being attacked, just shows interest when Black Doom offers info about his past and the idiot just believes him The intro cutscene is just dumb and out of character for Shadow
@@ayrtonjoga Yes but for a while Shadow in SA2 was willing to destroy Earth. Shadow on the Dark path in this game is basically like SA2 Shadow. Its not hard to believe that Doom could manipulate his memories, lie to him about his friends (Sonic, Rouge, Omega, Amy, etc.) and put him on the same path he was on in SA2 all the way until Amy was in the right place at the right time. Also, the intro scene was before he really showed any concern for humans specifically outside of maybe existential threats to humans and anthros alike like Metal Sonic. At the onset of the intro, he just saw basically a battle between humans and aliens and thought "That's their problem"-unless you go down the path to change Shadow's mentality.
@@shadowthehedgehog3113 Yes, the awakened Shadow from SA2 would be manipulated by Doom just like how Gerald did to his memories(not *pure* evil tho, he still showed some compassion for Rouge) But in Heroes despite initially going with intent of discovering his past, he ignored it over time, created a bond with Rouge and Omega, still helped to defeat Metal Sonic's final forms, and just kept moving All I'm saying is: If Shadow from SA2 was awakened by Doom, I believe he would *be* evil and obey to his command, but I think him instantly believing Doom and acting all evil *after* the events of Heroes is not on character
@@ayrtonjoga Sega said the only reason this game exists is because they received a lot of fan mail, requesting that Sonic wielded a gun. Yuji Naka knew that Sonic using gun would be out of character for sonic, but maybe it can work for Shadow??????
@@orangeslash1667 The thing is that I don't mind certain Sonic characters using guns, like Eggman or even Tails (if it has a cartoonish look) because they both use mechs But it just doesn't make sense for Shadow, like, how the self-entitled "Ultimate Life Form" would need guns?? He is already very powerful with his chaos powers, especially in his Super form
Yes, that's right. Shadow one of the characters without drawing from previous works. In the original comics, games, and series, there wasn't Shadow. This is a character that is mostly associated as the anti-Sonic from the developments. Despite his large fan base, Shadow was merely an addition and had no connection to sustaining the franchise.
This games OST is awesome in my opinion. There’s ton of unused songs. Just look them up. Magna-fi has an album released in 06 or 07 and the first track was intended to be in the game. Check them out.
The part where he explains that the Shadow game has no backbone with its tone and "darker" moments, sums up a HUGE issue I had with Sonic Forces. It's just as many crappy copouts with no lasting commitments in its narrative in that game too, its like Sega doesn't learn sometimes.
It’s bc forces was written by people who know nothing about sonic, literally. If we had the unleashed/ black knight writers, forces would’ve been much better. Have the gameplay be more of a mix between unleashed and generations and you’ve got a good game
Shadow being an android would be the only way this character assassination would make any sense. Like, Robotnik created new life for this shadow, as an android, and he's experiencing new problems and issues like a child would and it shapes him into a different person because it's all he really experienced up until that point. I think the main problem is that this game makes shadow the driving force in the story instead of the story happening to shadow. Choices in games are supposed to put you into a position that would make your choice matter, but limit options and maybe even knowledge of each choice, and make you carefully consider each option and understand the respective pros and cons. Who in their right mind would choose Black Arms aside from, "Do I wanna do an evil playthrough?" Also, a funny note, the only guy I knew who had this game was my best friend in elementary school. He is black and had absolutely no problems with the names of the aliens. In fact, I don't even remember him acknowledging it at all. I guess the whole seeing racism thing just goes over the head of 3rd/4th graders unless it's painfully blatant. I mean, you can argue that this is, but it definitely wasn't the intention. I never owned this game, but I had SA2. We would talk about the different plots in this game and piece together it with the only Sonic game he and I mutually owned, Sonic Heroes. I really miss those days.
The game does make sense if you reformulate it like this: A character study of Shadow, by observing him in a bunch of what-if scenarios. Or at least it would, if it wasn't a character assassination instead as you pointed out.
Sometimes I wish they'd remake these games and make a coherent canon and refine the gameplay to be better but I know that's definitely not gonna happen lol
I unironically would love a Shadow the Hedgehog remake. As embarrassing as the plot/dialogue was, I had enough fun with it to try going for all 326 routes. Switching to more Sonic Adventure-based movement system, redesigning the level design to accommodate it, as well as ironing out the shooting would be awesome.
I think the scenes where Shadow finds a Shadow Android in Heroes & Shadow offers a perfect comparison between the two. In Heroes Shadow finds an android, and at most is mildly concerned before brushing it off to continue the mission. In Shadow, he’s flabbergasted at the sight of the damn thing and decides to go full lunatic and take over the world. One is Shadow the Hedgehog, the other is a drooling idiot who doesn’t know what to do with himself.
Its just a bad translation. The line isn't good in the Japanese, but its much less vague/misunderstandable. It was like, "This is easy, which is fine by me", English just used an idiom which kinda doesn't work in the line. Not defending the writing. Just saying it still fits with a Heroic path.
@@Laurmachi no problem. And also, translating it like that was likely purposeful, in order to sound more edgy. But yeah, was just bad translation of an already not-the-best line.
The game had its many flaws but there is an underlying theme to the story and I still liked it. If they were to try doing it again I bet it would be amazing. It's not as great as the other games, but it had too much potential and I wish it had more love.
Same, I think this game had a lot of potential, and I even enjoy playing the end result in small bursts over the years, but if you condensed the level amount, reworked the morality system and how the npc's act upon it, and tweaked the bugs in the controls like the homing attack and such, you'd have a pretty solid game.
@@Birzt and, seeing as how Sega and Sonic Team are on good terms with them, get the fanbase, the ACTUAL fanbase, not those whiny 12 year olds who think Shadow is just edgy and nothing more, to help out on multiple fronts, like gameplay, level design, story, etc.
@@paperluigi6132 I would argue to do what Mania did. Can't get people who don't know what they are doing. An idea is worthless on its own. Definitely get people who are fans though. Never make something you don't care about.
I had fun playing Shadow the Hedgehog on the GameCube. It took me forever to beat the game. I know most people didn't really care for the game, but I actually loved it! I always liked nuking my enemies with Chaos Blast.
Also, tbf, that scene in Death Ruins with Black Doom was not Shadow actually working with him-he was helping Rouge spy on him. Black Doom figures this out and that's why he sends Black Bull after them.
@@rockwarestar4670 Well, I don't really thnk that it's that good or good at all, I just like it for other reasons. You can still have fun or like bad games. That how I think at least.
@@rockwarestar4670 Except why would he say it’s good when it’s not good nor does he think it is good? Just because you personally like something doesn’t mean it’s any good. It’s okay and possible to like something that’s bad. That’s why they’re called “guilty pleasure”. They’re stuff you enjoy despite you knowing fully from an objective standpoint, that they aren’t very good.
@@craftymasterproductions4218 Exaclty. Alot of people nowadays really blur the line between “objective” and “subjective”. Subjectivity is your personal enjoyment, whilst objectivity is just fact, in terms of the objective quality of the actual product. You’d be surprised how many people don’t understand this (and I’ve met alot of them in my time 🙄)
@@SM-th7pw true. But the terms "good" and "bad" aren't objective because you describe good and bad differently based on what the standard is. and objectivity requires consistentcy.
It sucks though because it kinda isn't even a spin off. The events all taking place after and continuing shadows story from Sa2 makes this much closer to a main series game.
I feel like this is one of your best reviews in the Sonic retrospective. Looking at the history of video games during the era in which Shadow The Hedgehog was released is REALLY important context as to how it even came to being, and you did a great job with that.
This was the one that got me into his channel, so I’ll always have it as one of my favorites, right behind 06 which is maybe my favorite video he’s ever made besides the TMNT stuff
The most troubling thing about this game is its troubling legacy. This one game still overshadows the character despite being over a decade old. Every IP has its share of missteps, but rarely do you see its continuing legacy. It makes you wonder what could have been if this game was of the same quality as the Adventure series.
I feel like this game was too ambitious for it's own good. It had a good idea with the "choose your own adventure" gimmick but the execution wasn't done well. The mission structure is easily the game's biggest flaw. Instead of kill X amount of enemies they should have just had different paths to take depending on the alignment you wanted with a corresponding goal ring. Also fix the controls to be like SA1 and 2, make the story more cohesive, fix Shadow's personality, and this game could have been one of the highlights of the series. Instead it is seen as a joke and the game that started the Dark Age, ruined Shadow's reputation as a character, and led to all the "Ow the Edge" memes. Despite all the controversy though I still really enjoy playing this game despite its flaws.
I think they wanted to remember Gerald as who he was before Maria's death made him snap. But he did snap, and the reason for that should not be forgotten.
I think the following could've improved the game: * As you do the good, neutral, & evil missions, the connections on the map light up. * Instead of automatically following connections as you play, let you select any level you've created a connection to. This means you don't have to keep restarting, and you don't have to replay any particular mission, but you'd still need to do each level 2-3 times (total) to do each mission. * Once all of the connections are lit up, pick a particular track as the canon, highlight that particular path, and unlock the final piece of the story. The other paths are theoretic possibilities that Shadow considered, as part of his search for who he is, but didn't ultimately choose, because that's not who he is. (To prevent confusion, allow the player to replay the cutscenes of this path if they so choose, to jog their memory, as an option.) * Better voice acting direction (The example you referred to as "word salad" can actually make perfect sense if some of the lines (especially the first one) had a sarcastic tone, for example.) * A few bug fixes.
This is the first time someone actually praised the music in Shadow the hedgehog, I feel like everyone just write it off as edgy trash when it actually has great tracks especially the vocal tracks, although I might be tad bias considering my 2 favorite songs from the game that I love to bits are Chosen one and Broken (yeah I know Broken didn't make into the game but still). Never turn back isn't my favorite Crush 40 song, it is on my top 3 though, my favorite is Knight of the wind, while I don't like black knight as a game (I borrowed it from a friend didn't like the gameplay at all) the vocal tracks, specifically the Crush 40 songs and covers, are their best collection of songs in a Sonic game ever imo.
If you do some research about the behind the scenes of this game’s production, there’s actually a rather funny reason why this game’s tone tries soo hard for the edginess. And that’s because, Izuka and co had no clue how to write dark stories. Their solution? Binge watch a bunch of dark emo vampire shit from the mid 2000’s, like the Underworld and Blade movies. Yeah, they took notes and copy pasted the dark tone from a superficial level. That’s where the weird use of guns, motorcycles alien with cults and Karate Chop action comes into play. It was just Izuka and co mimicking terrible vampire slaying flicks of the time assuming this was what westerners were into. DYKG made a video detailing this a few years back! You can look it up where they cite their sources and such! Crazy shit!
this is exactly why you should never pander to an audience. pandering only leads to a superficial product. create what you truly think is good and the audience will come to you.
Damn, I didn't know that. The reason why it's so edgy was they took their main inspiration from UNDERWORLD (And Blade, but Blade is the second most important comic book movie ever made, so...) The Lesson of Shadow the Hedgehog? Never take influence from Underworld for your big budget action platformer title! You'll never know what you'll do if you take influence from the wrong stuff.
@@spinballproduction9678 Ah woops. For some reason I thought this was his Heroes video and my timed clip didn't make it obvious until I skipped back a bit. You're onto something though. It seemed like in Heroes he was perplexed by the thought of someone who looked just like him while acting totally different. He was just confused and didn't know how to act beside him but he respected him in the Final Fight; him and Knuckles. In his solo spinoff, I guess he just treats him like the annoying kid brother who won't leave him alone. Thanks Sonic Team.
Shadow the Hedgehog was my first "proper" Sonic game besides Sonic Riders. While I understand how bad this game is compared to the earlier 3D games but I unapologetically love how fucking weird and edgy it is.
Huh... You know, this game does the "kill your past" better than The Last Jedi. Shadow is constantly trying to figure out if he's real or just an android. He's told different things depending on which story you go through. But at the end, he casts aside his need for a past and focuses on defeating the villain. That clip at the 9 minute mark of the final boss, where Eggman tells Shadow he's the same one from SA2, comes after he's made up his mind. He is the Ultimate Life Form. All of it. ...Damn, I didn't expect to think this when watching the video.
In 06 he dropped this whole "what is muh past?!?" and he got a new threat to fight against, it's part of the reason why he worked in the later game and not here lol
@@maude7420 That's what happens when you insert an equally edgy character. Mephiles threatened his edge. Same with Infinite or whatever from Sonic forces.
I'm 30. It's kind of fascinating seeing how people that are younger than me view the series. I was born in 90 and I got a Genesis in 92-93 with Sonic 2. My Godkids are all big Sonic fans from seeing Boom or X on Hulu. So it's been a real treat showing them the games I grew up with or Mania for example. It just makes me happy. For better or worse, Sonic's still an icon and it's nice that something so pivotal to my childhood is still a thing today.
I’m 25 and I’ve always been secret sonic fan so has my boyfriend I’ve been a fan since I was 5 when I got my own sega mega drive and sonic the hedgehog 2 and Ecco the dolphin 🐬
On the subject of ages, I am waiting for someone to comment about the part around 47:10 where I say “I was in a discord call back in high school.” Can’t imagine a lot of youtubers have said that lol
The way this game's story was handled makes me think of the trainwreck that was Phantasy Star III, a game which multiple story paths, often contradicting each other's lore-wise and the series' lore as a whole. It has so many different timelines and boils down to...4 endings, I guess? But everything is a mess. And the translation, at the time, was also pretty bad. Sega was notorious for their bad English translation for a very long time.
it still baffles me how they decided to make such a huge amount of stages and then for some godforsaken reason to split them in 10. the mere thought decreases my IQ out of sheer wasted potential.
Your channel should be in the millions with subscribers. I usually hate review channels cause they always nick pick on the bad and is very annoying at that. But I love how in depth your are with your reviews. I've seen your jak reviews, tmnt, batman beyond, and sonic 06 so far. While just starting this one. You love what you do and I love that. Keep up the good work
20:50 And? The only reason he might join Black Doom is because he has amnesia. Just look at him! He literally knowns nothing about the past . If he did he would never join BD since he destroys humans. The real flaw in writting is the fact that it breaks the entire continuity of Sonic Heroes. There are a l o t of evidence that Shadow in Heroes is actually an android/clone. However ShTH has a snippet dialogue 10 min into final boss where Eggman says he "caught Shadow and saved him" Which also makes absolutely NO sense. How?(He was on the arc when Shadow fell, how tf was he able to even save him???) Why?(from his pov Shadow is either on Sonic side or is dangerous loner why tf would he save him???) When?(He was shown being surprised and then mourning his and Grandfather's passing. When did he find the time to even save him?) Even if we assume it's canon, that doesn't explain why tf he knows nothing about past or Sonic Co in ShTH even tho he learned about them n team dark in Heroes. It would make SO much sense if heroes shadow was android/clone and ShTH Shadow was real one. Because if that's not the case then how tf did he got a *second* amnesia? Only this one seems to be even stronger in some cases to the point he's ok with evil acts. Did he fall off Eggman ship in Heroes????
also im pretty sure Amnesia doesnt make you change personality that drastically. (talking about all the various endings.) To me its like a split personality thing lol
I mean I feel personality is quite dependent on events transpired in life and how they shape us, people aren't born good or evil, they become that So if Shadow lost all memory except the death of a close friend then I think Shadow could be turned evil if the influence, Black Doom, is there That's just my take tho
Actually, that part about Eggman saving Shadow was somewhat(poorly) explained. I don't remember where did exactly I saw it(either in ShTH itself or in some podcast or somesuch), so I can't provide actuall proof right now(maybe later), but it goes like this: When Eggman saved Shadow? Somewhere after SA2. How did Eggman saved Shadow? If I remember correctly, ARK was damaged a bit while it was on the crash course to Earth. Some of it's damaged parts fall on earth. After SA2 Eggman tried to find those broken parts of ARK to use them for his robots, but, instead, found unconscious Shadow. Why did Eggman saved Shadow? He thought to research Shadow to try and make something similar to him. In the end he made Shadow Android series with collected data. And funny thing about Shadow in Heroes being an actual android - it was NEVER confirmed. The end in the dark story was made quite ambigiuos. There is many hints that Shadow in Heroes is an adroid, that is true, but then many detailes aren't quite fit: like, why did that particular Shadow was stored ALONE, not with the other androids? Why did he was hidden on the SECRET base? And why the hell Omega was put to secure that particular exemplar? Amnesia from ShTH is the same amnesia from the Heroes. The misunderstanding about amnesia problem rises from a few things: 1. Many people are suprisingly forgetful of the fact that Shadow, actually, didn't learned much from Sonic Heroes. The only thing he learned was that Eggman made androids that looks like him. And that's, basicaly, it. He didn't remembered ARK or any events of SA2. He didn't even found out if he was an android or not. He just decided to not care about that for the time being. "I am what I am" or somesuch. 2. The other thing - Shadow never was suprised about seeing any of the characters we meet durning the game. Interestingly, all characters that we meet in the game, exept for the Commander and Black Doom for obvious reasons, are from Sonic Heroes and Sonic Heroes ONLY. Shadow met them all before. But he never adresses them like they are friends either. It's like they are an acquaintances at most. And from Shadow's perspective that is actually the truth! Because he don't remember them that much anyway(exept for Rouge and Omega). He only remembers a few facts here and there, but not everything. So after Heroes, Shadow decided to try and find his lost memories on his own (without looking back on that android crap in Heroes) but then Black Doom appeared. All that doesnt excuse the bad, sloppy and very lazy writing, but still - continuity of Sonic Heroes wasn't broken. And... uhmmm... I'm sorry for this giant essay. X)
i honestly can't believe people think shadow saying "this is like taking candy from a baby, which is fine by me" means he's fine taking candy from babies. i'm pretty sure he just means it's really easy, and _that's_ fine by him.
You know what destroys the morality system even further than the fact you can switch morality at a whim? The fact that there is a last story. If players wanted a villainous shadow which is part of the point of the game, then the game is basically saying to screw off. What’s the point of having multiple endings if all of them are non canon and we just have a hero ending?
If I had to sum this game`s story up with a single sentence, it would be: ``It all starts with this... a game containing the ultimate character assassination`` --Me & other people who may have come up with this
@@alptugraakan7490 Yes, the character assassin is Shadow the hedgehog (Also called by the unofficial but much more suitable name of "ow the edge") and the one assassinated is Shadow the hedgehog
I think I'm the only one who LOVED this game as a kid. Shadow was my favourite character and I loved the 3D sonic games so Shadow was like a dream come true.
@@alysssabear Maybe it's just the angle of how shadow was drawn that makes it look weird, but to me his nose just looks a bit small and very slightly off centered.
So this whole time I thought that as a 10 year old playing this game that I was just too stupid to understand the storyline & got frustrated to the point where I never finished the game but that wasn’t really the case!? It was just an entirely poorly made game!?? 🤦🏾♂️
0:40 Interestingly, we used to have "anti-exclusives" in that gen. After the Dreamcast failed, Sony said "If you don't port Sonic on our PS2 right now, we'll never let you put another Sonic game on our consoles", and that's why there are some bad Sonic ports such as Sonic Heroes being extremely glitchy.
In my opinion, the word “damn” isn't edgy at all. I think it's ok for Sonic characters to throw light swears like that. Besides, kids today swear like sailors anyways.
Glad to see a new video in retrospective! This might be one of my favorite series on youtube. As for this game, I've never played it, but it leaves of sour taste for me simply because what it did to the series and for Shadow's character. I'm sure there are people who do legitimately like it though, and that's cool. After all, I think Secret Rings is a very flawed, yet still decent game (Can't wait for that episode). Keep the great work J!
_Aboard the Egg Fleet, after Sonic Heroes is over..._ *Shadow:* "Hrm... Sonic." *Sonic:* "Yo, Shadow. You're looking moody as usual - what's up?" *Shadow:* "With all this Metal Sonic business out of the way... tell me. Are you aware of the details of my past?" *Sonic:* "Oh yeah, the lot of us heard all about that back on the Ark, ha. Why, you telling me you forgot, or something?" *Shadow:* "Tsk... yes. I must've been inflicted with amnesia of some sort..." *Sonic:* "Oh man, yeah, I can see how that would've happened, with what happened to you at the end when we stopped the Ark's fall..." *Shadow:* "So tell me." *Sonic:* "Geez, cool it. I'll grab myself a chili dog and we'll have a chat! - Also, woah, did you see those vats with android clones of you...?" *Shadow:* "... tsk... what if I am one of them..." *Sonic:* "... have you tried poking yourself to see if you bleed?" *Shadow:* "... uh-"
Meaning that Shadow declared that he had all seven Chaos Emeralds twice, and that Black Doom still tried to convince Shadow to help him, despite Black Doom getting beaten up by Shadow earlier.
Honestly the most canon pathway for me is Westopolis Hero, Lethal Highway Hero, Cirus Park Neutral, Mad Matrix Neutral, Space Gadget Hero, then Final Haunt Hero
I believe there's a 11th final that you can get after you get all the other 10 finals. It's the LAST story with Super Shadow and all of that and is the canon one
@@trashmouth2020 story-wise the pure hero ending leads to the last story segment, I think Entertainer Ev is right: there's only 2 possible endings that leads to the last story segment: Pure Hero ending or Semi Hero ending, and the level choice that he suggested seems the most logical.
He had lost his memories before Sonic Heroes, and this game is a continuation of that. He never “lost them again.” I’m not sure where you’re getting that from.
I remember renting this at my mothers' request ("I know it's a sonic game but what if it's not good") and just hating it solely for the new voice actors. It didn't help that I went for the slightly good route on my first playthrough, which not only has the least engaging story but also made me experience Charmy and Vector's ear-grating new voices. I didn't do any other playthroughs and just returned it.
The start of the dark age, Shadow showed how Sega couldn't write stories any more. What sad is that this game was unnecessary since Shadow arc was done and even in Heroes Shadow said he doesnt care if he is real or not.
@@lpfan4491 I think what they mean is that, the entire game (Heroes) Shadow is trying to figure out who he is, then he ultimately concludes that he doesn’t care whether he’s real or not, because he’s still Shadow the Hedgehog and he’ll continue to carry out Shadows legacy whether he is real or not. It’s putting forth the message that Shadows past does not define who he is as a person, and as such he doesn’t bother going to all the trouble to find out his past because his past does not define who he is or who he wants to be. You could argue that it throws all the development of SA2 out the window and that would be a fair argument, however that doesn’t deny that his arc in Heroes is a pretty solid one, because it shows that Shadow isn’t a hero soley because it’s what Maria wanted (although that certainly played a big part), but rather because it’s the right thing to do, coz in SA2 Shadow was actually manipulated by Gerald into thinking Maria wanted revenge against the humans, which causes to want revenge, whilst in Heroes Shadow’s mind is completely blank, yet he still does good showing that he is a good person at heart.
I understand the basic sentiment, but for me, it is basically just going on a journey for one purpose alone....and then without any real trigger for the change in opinion, you just one day say "fuck it, I do not care anymore".
@@lpfan4491 Ah okay I get you. Yeah I agree, nothing really triggered Shadow to change his perspective, one minute he’s like “ *OMG WHO AM I* “ and next minute he’s all like “lmao nah fuck dat idc” without anything to trigger his decision.
I think one of the few story things this game does is pretty clearly implying that you're the real shadow throughout the whole game and that shadow is actually created by the aliens because he can do the thing where he travels through the alien tube things and his skin color being black and red like the aliens makes sense And for the possibility of him being an android I don't think the lower poly count of the npc androids is like lack of polish or anything I think that was actually supposed to show that they are machines but the real shadow is clearly different, and also it makes sense logically that eggman would lie about creating shadow in the hopes of controlling him And the reason I say all of this is bc I disagree that the thing eggman says 9 minutes into the final boss fight is like the only confirmation you get, I think its effectively confirmed through the game
It's hilarious how canonically, one of the most lighthearted games happens just before the edgiest game in the series.
Oof
Yeah, going from Heroes to Shadow must've been quite the whiplash with the fans
Yeah at least Sonic in the 2000s had balls
@@ayrtonjoga I tried so hard to like it lmao. It was decent but I went right back to Heroes after I beat it once 😂
@@lukahmei2000 Yeah youre right
"Sonic, don't come to Green Hill tomorrow, or do, I don't care."
-Shadow in the English release of this game, probably.
It is
Accurate
b baka
Video Poster is a failure at researching: vgsales.fandom.com/wiki/Sonic
Shadow the Hedgehog actually sold more than most Sonic Games after it (Forces, Lost worlds, 4,
True sonic games always fail (since the first the sales have been halfing with each new installment)
Sonic games like racing etc. are a huge success and sell 10-20x as much.
Also, if you think the controls are bad in this game you suck at videogames. I'm sorry, but it's true.
@@googleuser9383 Does Sega pay all of your bills for you?
21:26 "When a new idea fails, Sega scraps the idea instead of refining the execution."
That sums it up brilliantly. It's why Sega are reluctant to utilize other Sonic characters as playable, because according to overly critical whiners "Sonic's stupid friends are always bad and nothing that you do with them can ever make them good!"
Sega won't go back and refine the Adventure style because "those games were never good!"
This attitude really is hurting the series more than helping it.
I think that Adventure 1 was and still is good (Crappy cutscenes aside)
I enjoyed many games people thought are bad and to be honest, I hardly had any issues others had but I won't say it didn't get frustrating, I just know the games got better the more I keep playing and I'm noticing Sonic Team saved the best for last, I'm sure they made it hard not out of hate but to show if we deserve to see the end and if you do the hard challenges, you do get something exciting to play because Super Sonic in the Sonic Riders series is tough to obtain which him being overpowered in the first is when the difficulty is higher, the second is easier as Super Sonic isn't as overpowered and the third is far more difficult even if you have motion controls and Super Sonic is like how he is in the first but has huge improvements making him better and he automatically pulls off S+ Tricks for you during his Super Sonic Boost but while Rings drain, the Unlimited Air which is him having the Special Mode mechanic everyone gets when falling behind to use their Special Abilities like in SRZG which gives you a full Tank of Air when returning as Sonic and it is something they really did care about. It seems as if Sonic Team knew they couldn't prevent issues with controls and gave a character who can make it less of a headache and given how Super Sonic is meant to be special and exclusive, they made him feel like a relief and rewarding.
Silver was my favorite character in 06 no joke
@@nmr7203 Well, yes actually! Where do you think this defeatist mentality came from?
After years of people constantly nitpicking so many different aspects of the Sonic series, the people behind these games seem to have developed this "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em" attitude!
"Oh, people keep complaining about Sonic's characterisation, that he comes across as a cocky a***hole, then screw it, let's just make him a cocky a***hole!"
"People have hated Tails since day one and say that he's always been annoying and pointless, so let's just write him as annoying and pointless!"
"People keep making fun of Knuckles because they think he's an idiot for getting tricked by Eggman, so let's just write him as a complete brain dead moron who can barely read!"
"People won't shut up with their idiotic 'Shadow the EDGE-LORD, EDGY THE HEDGY, OW THE EDGE' memes, so it only makes sense to just write him a moody Emo who's trying too hard to be cool, since that's all people see him as!"
"Oh and look at this! People keep saying 'No one plays Sonic games for the plot or characters!' So there you go! We could just go down the Teen Titans Go! route and just have all the characters going 'HERPY DERP, AIN'T WE SILLY, KIDS?' And no one would care! Sonic shouldn't be taken so seriously, it's just a stupid series about a silly blue hedgehog, right?"
@AndyW 813 people kept on buying those games.
Sales wise they did pretty well, even 06.
I actually unironically like Shadow The Hedgehog, but I fully understand it's not a very good game and that I'm mostly nostalgic with it.
Its not a Good Game, but its a Fun Game, because as kid you love the over edginess of Shadow (even if the story s*cks) and as adult because its just too much you cannot take it seriously because its ridiculous
@@Freedmoon44 It was my first Sonic game, and I loved this character. I never saw alot of Shadow and as a kid he was so mysterious to me. I would see the trailers with him for Sonic X and would be so intrigued...then I never got to see him in the actual show for one reason or another. I love the game so much. So so much.
Same, I just like playing it for the fun and nostalgia also for how ridiculous it is at times. It was one of my first sonic games and because I played it on my friends ps2 and she didn't have a memory card we never were able to finish it, so it was just a loop of few stages. Also Shadow as character has just so much meaning for me, and it's shame how badly he has been treated over the years cuz once I got to play SA2 I was so happy to see justification for his character, even 06 does fucking manage to write him better than what came after that what strikes me so much concidering how big of a mess 06 is. Ow the edge is from critical standpoint trash but it just has it's own magical edgy nostalgia filled charm what makes me enjoy it.
It's crazy how people can't just admit to things like this when it comes to certain games
me too
How hacking looks in movies:
Lithe goth maniacally hammering at the keyboard
How hacking looks in real life:
Hedgehog goth karate chomping the keyboard.
So that was what I was doing wrong
Ohhhh, so *Thats* why I couldn’t hack the CIA: I was using the wrong martial arts move!
We don't know enough about that moment so let's not jump to the conclusions and actually analyze it, you'll understand better if you slow down the scene in a video and see what he did because there's things you'll understand if you slow down a cutscene, heck you can know how a character homing attacks and what it takes, there's actual movement made in animation.
@@artistanthony1007 lmao what're you talking about? He literally just hermit purple karate chops it
Shadow's more emo than goth. Being Goth would actually make Shadow less cringy (In this game at least).
Fun fact: When Shadow says "This is like taking candy from a baby, which is fine by me" they weren't actually trying to be edgy. In the Japanese script of the game, he says something along the lines of "This is ridiculously easy, but I'm still okay with it"
In short, stupid mistranslation.
Yeah, the part that's "fine by him" is the fact that it's easy, not the idea of taking candy from a baby. Still, it sounds ridiculous, and probably should've been changed (or hammed up to go for ironic comedy, but this game lacks the self-awareness to do that).
@@syweb2 its more that Sega America likes the edginess
@@9773an More likely is that they think _fans_ like it, probably due to the edgy kids who kept sending them fan letters about Sonic with a gun.
@@syweb2
It's not like the real translation was much better.
Being able to change Shadow's morality on a whim DESTROYS any sense of morality the game attempts.
That is such a good way to put it. Nothing in the game has consequences, so what's the point?
Ironic
It would have been better for the overall structure of the game if the endings were divided among 3 categories once you go to the third level. Hero in 3-3 (Eggman's Casino or whatever it was called)? You get locked into the hero or semi-hero path. It would have avoided scenarios were Shadow is both confirmed to be Gerald's creation and an Android at the same time.
Interestingly enough, the story and the game makes a lot of sense in a poetic way when you reach the last story. Because Shadow is searching for his past the entire game, but in the end, none of this is canon and doesn't matter after Heroes and the Shadow intro, until the last story. He accomplished what he promised to Maria to protect the world and used the ARC weapon Gerald built to destroy Black Doom as intended, which were the same objectives since Sonic Adventure 2.
In the last scene he says: "Good bye Shadow the Hedgehog" and Never Turn Back plays. Which means he left his past behind him and it makes you realise that the purpose of the game itself was useless and doesn't matter. He is who he is now and must move forward. It's like a message to say: "the past is pointless, look forward." And that's pretty much what the path of this game is.
Now yeah, from a video game perspective, that's pretty bad and there is no point but the way the game is and the end makes a lot of sense about the ideas the game conveys when you think about it.
@@kyurei4478 that's a neat way to look at it, actually... Still, gameplay should never be sacrificed if you want to tell a story like that.
Fun fact: Two of the CGI directors of this game would end up being involved with the Sonic Movies years later. Tim Miller (who also directed Deadpool and Terminator: Dark Fate) is the producer of the movies and Jeff Fowler is the director of both. You can see their names at 1:04:20. Guess they have some experience with the series before.
Huh. I was right at that part in the video when I read your comment.
That's why Fowler skipped Metal Sonic and Choas.
Shadow wants to die
Vector: “Don’t go there... yet!”
😂😂😂 tickled me that did
Shadow: 👿🔫
Vector: nonono you need to do that later
I love how Vector is just like “Finish what you started” and respects Shadows opinion to kill himself
Egauaissbeviekwsnaaaiksskswhsakja. NO
In Japanese, Vector says something like "Hey dont be so rash, dont take what they say at heart, you could be?"
Shadow the Hedgehog is the only game I've ever 100% completed
All stages at A rank, and expert mode. I achieved EdgeHog status
Rest your soul mate, you served your time :c
@@haaxxx9 no joke, worst level on expert mode is Cosmic Fall. Get through it all without dying...
👑🏆🏆🏆👑
But did you play all 326 individually recorded story routes?
@@The_Shadow_Emperor yes...
"Shadow begins to wonder if he himself is a robot and instead of poking himself to see, he with the help of Omega confronts Eggman."
I found that funny for no reason lol.
Whenever Shadow was questioning if he was an android I said to myself "Do you not eat, drink or sleep? Cus that'd answer your question." I mean, it'd be more believable if he thought he was a clone but an android?
if he was an android then how would he able to control an emerald. that was my question as a kid.
@@muscular-lr6er Metal Sonic could. So being organic doesn't seem to be a factor.
@@OnePolishMoFo You have a really good point and considering how Eggman reveals that he is the real shadow this just drives your point even further
@@OnePolishMoFo I don't think the Ultimate Lifeform needs to eat, drink, or sleep. He was frozen for 50 years and came out peachy fine, I'm 100% sure he doesn't need any of that.
Shadow the Hedgehog's Theme is still one of my favorites, as the saying goes: "There has never been any bad Sonic Soundtrack"
Did you forget sonic chronicles
@@laylathewolf no. Ur wrong 💀
@@imagery5425yeah the soundtrack isn't bad, its that they fucked up and had to rush together bad midi versions of the soundtrack.
SONIC ERASER!
@@GUNUFofficialthat game has music?
On the 'Vector's line when Shadow seems suicidal' thing; that's actually plot-relevant. In fact; the Chaotix missions all are, as they lead to the Gerald video recording in the Last Story; that's what they were looking for. Vector says 'things may not be as you think' because he's GOT THE FILE from the Computer Room.
That's a really good point.
@@JsReviews also the reason Shadow the hedgehog was well... Shadow the hedgehog, was because people were emailing Sonic team to have Sonic with guns
Be careful what you ask for
I think if he didn't add "yet" at the end, that might've been conveyed better.
@@kirbdabirb5627 We love what we got
I just think it was just sweet vector was being nice to shadow at his roughest moment
The story really falls apart when you realize that all shadow had to do was talk to Sonic, Amy, Tails, or any of his friends about his past. Especially Rouge considering she’s the one who was sent by the government to do research on project shadow and she’s the one who started team dark. Even if they didn’t know about the aliens, what they knew of his past in adventure 2 would’ve saved him a lot of grief. But nope. Nobody bothers to explain anything to him and Shadow doesn’t bother asking. Instead the only people he turns to for answers are Eggman and Black Doom, two obvious villains who aren't even trying to hide the fact that they're just using him.
Facts 💯
True
Isn't that Shadow's character? He's hard to open-up
@@takodachicookie7572 not to the point of incompetence he’s not
I think Shadow has trust issues in this one because he legitimately doesn't remember anything about himself and the only things he's finding are things that make less sense than "I am the real one" or "I'm a clone. The real one died in battle." Like imagine if the answer to who you are is "an alien/scientist test tube baby" or "an actual robot (even though the ones you fight are clearly more robotic than free-willed Shadows)." If the writing for MY backstory was that messy, I'd have trust issues too lmao
21:06 He went from Lawful Neutral in SA2(Lawful because he had strict "must do what Maria does" code and Neutral since he only cared about keeping the promise) to Neutral Good in Heroes(He lost his moral code but he was actually a proper hero this time since he fought Eggman and Metal Sonic) to True Neutral in his own game to briefly Lawful Good in 06(follows GUN orders as a good guy) and finally turned into Chaotic Evil or Chaotic Idiot in other games
At least in sonic forces he was kinda like the shadow we know
"Chaotic Idiot"
Pretty much lmao
@@misterboogcn1288
Yes
They were like "You want a good accurate Shadow , in turn you'll get a terrible story !" Oof Sega hates Shadow confirmed .
/J
@@ishratjahan406Yeah lol also all the characters were kinda like they were before (except sonic and tails they were at their WORST in that game)
@@misterboogcn1288 Sega said the only reason this game exists is because they received a lot of fan mail, requesting that Sonic wielded a gun. Yuji Naka knew that Sonic using gun would be out of character for sonic, but maybe it can work for Shadow??????
1:02:45 I think the logic is that they recognize his evil stage was their own damn fault. They thought he was already a mad scientist and went to take him down, but that ironically is what _made_ him a mad scientist. This is them going "oh... yeah, that was entirely our fault, we should have left him alone".
Yeah, I think the writing was just off- but that's to be expected I mean... the writing in the rest of the game is a little weird at times.
I agree with the idea that the scene was probably supposed to be trying to convey the idea that the President and the G.U.N. dude realized that the government had made a mistake in the past. They realize that the reason the Ark project was shut down was because they thought Gerald was working with Black Doom when, in reality, he accepted the initial offer in order to stabilize the Shadow project which was supposed to help mankind, and then he devoted the remaining time on the ARK building a super weapon capable of stopping Black Doom when he eventually returned to the planet.
So they should be saying, "We were wrong to have labelled him as a mad scientist from the beginning, He was only trying to help mankind with the ARK and we shut down his project and murdered his granddaughter."
I don't know that I would label somebody a hero after what Gerald did do trying to kill all of humanity like that in SA2, but it's something like... If I were to be heralded as a great hero today but got dementia later on in life which completely altered me and made me a different person, should I be seen in a different light or not? Does the bad stuff invalidate the good stuff I did before I lost my mind? Kinda a hard concept to quantify I think.
@@m0002856I feel that there are a few interpretations as to either side being right. Gerald before GUN invading and Gerald after might as well be two different people. He was insane from his grief and was not rationally sound, made evident by his desire to destroy all human life. The same humanity he had worked so hard to save.
In fairness he made the biolizard and made a deal with alien leader called black doom. If that was my boss I'd be telling yhr CIA about that stuff too.
How funny that only 4Kids cast gets to cross the line with curse words.
Really who voiced shredder in that
@Long-Tailed Charmander Never seen Yu gi oh
I think the most egregious example of this is Andrew Rannells going on to star in the original Broadway production of The Book of Mormon. No, really, moving on from kiddy butcherings of various anime is one thing, getting famous from that next step is exemplary, but still yet another thing, but going from THE most infamously nannying dubbing company in the biz to the lead role in the Broadway debut of TV's most notorious shock jocks? That's brassy, REAL brassy.
Funny how that cast is mostly responsible for many kid friendly anime english dubs. The voice of knuckles sounds like Yu-gi-oh, both of them. And I'm pretty sure Shadow himself is the same voice as Seto Kaiba.
Mike. Nope. That's Jason Griffith voicing Shadow. Same voice actor that played Sonic & Jet the Hawk from the Rider series.
Oh man, this game forever cemented Shadow as the series' most controversial character lol.
Even to this day, people are up in arms over his portrayals.
Ya thunk?
I don't even know what that last part means and I agree with you. (snrk)
Yeah. I'm not a fan of Shadow at all. But even I admit that it is sad seeing Shadow getting butchered from his character development. In fact, some of the characters starting in Shadow got butchered ( such as Knuckles & Tails for example ). But Shadow definitely gotten hit the hardest.
I'm never excited to see Shadow show up in an IDW comic preview on Twitter, it gets messy in the replies
@@jjc4924 How was Tails "butchered" in Shadow? If anything he's better than Heroes and every 3D game since Unleashed.
The idea of a Shadow based game having a “darker” tone can certainly work, Shadow certainly didn’t need more to his story as Heroes already wrapped that up pretty well I think but the general idea of a story based on Shadow focusing on his moral ambiguity’s and delving into many hypothetical scenarios Shadow could take could definitely work, but the execution was just dreadful. Shadow was already a cool character and a great contrast to Sonic, while Sonic is upbeat, extroverted, fun and charismatic, Shadow is more reserved and introverted, but still has a charming sense of charisma to him with the occasional quip and one liner which helps him bounce off Sonic well. This game ditched that entirely in order to make him “cool” and “edgy” by giving him guns and motorcycles and adopting an “I don’t give a fuck” personality... all of this surprisingly makes him laughable to watch and he ultimately becomes very difficult to take seriously, which was clearly the opposite of their intended goal. Shadow always struck me as the type not to use guns, because he has his own natural abilities which require skill, and he would view them the same way Batman does, “a weapon for a coward”.
Although i’d be lying if I said my inner 8 year old doesn’t find the intro to this game cool as all hell.
I agree with you but when I think story created around different moral discisions from the player that lead to many different paths is good thing in term of replayability and allowing player choices it is also bad in term of making cohesive narrative that doesn't contradict it is many elements SA1 style is the best playing different campagnes to understand the whole story and get to the final episode as you defeat perfect chaos and put an end to the game sonic games already have replayability by memorizing level layouts and mastering the mechanics SA2 did add different alteration of levels emblems to collect chao garden and ranking system and it is propably one of the most replyeble sonic games ever made I don't get why sonic team add unnecessary mechanics to pad the length of their games to appeal to gaming market when making game that demand mastery and execution enjoyable level design will be infinitely replayable I don't think shadow is good game even in paper
through my present 18 year old still think the intro to this game is cool as hell and I feel guilty because of that
100 Percent Agree with all of this
Agreed with everything you said.
Honestly, I don’t mind the guns.
P
When i got a hold of the OST i always felt like "Never turn back" (by Crush40) was a much more "fitting" super theme than "I am all of me" , it sings about his struggles and how he had to overcome major hurdles to get to this point, to fulfill Maria's wish, to let the people of the planet live in happiness and peace.
so fun fact: the japanese version of this game's dialogue is infinitely better and is more in line with shadow's characterization in sa2 and heroes, and shadow overall seems less irritated by everything, he's not saying "damn" every 5 seconds like a kid who just learned how to swear, and is overall more natural, there's also less stupidity in the japanese version like shadow's "stealing candy from a baby" line not existing, as well as the president not saying to pay homage to gerald, among other things.
the game was originally going have a T rating and give the aliens red blood instead of green, but the ESRB just came up with the E10+ rating, so sonic team went for that instead, and according to one screenshot, the game was originally going to feature an enemy radar system at the bottom of the screen, it's a half circle with red dots to show enemies, it was removed because sonic team are known for their good decision making/s.
now for my own opinions, i hate the guns in this game, like, why would you give us a game starring the ultimate lifeform, and instead of letting us use said ultimate lifeform's chaos energy projectiles, you just give him guns that literally any other sonic character can use? i mean could imagine a vergil style shadow game? with chaos spears as summoned swords and teleporting and explosive punches? or even a megaman zero style shadow game? those would've awesome! but we get this nonsense instead.
at the very least try to tie this stupid decision to the story, like, say shadow just doesn't remember most of his chaos powers due to his amnesia, like maybe have a cutscene going.
sonic: "hey shadow, why are you using guns instead of your chaos spear thingies?"
shadow: "chaos spears? okay, how do i use them?"
sonic: "uh? on second thought nevermind."
see? simple.
and the multiple pathways nonsense is garbage, encore mode should've just been the default mode of the game and the man power that was spent on all those non-canon cutscenes should've gone to making a better and more cohesive story.
This. This is why we need better localizers (we don’t need absolute *direct* translations but at least more scripts more inline with the Japanese one)
Interesting
@@milesstorzillo1039
ruclips.net/video/HGonkFXk_GU/видео.html
"hmph, how incredibly stupid of those guys. leaving a chaos emerald out in the open in front of me like that."
@@alimowla3204
That’s... pretty much the same thing.
The translation for that line wasn’t the issue, it was the line existing in the context of the “story’s” progression.
Remember, you are on the HERO path when this scene plays.
Stealing a chaos emerald like a selfish jackass from the people you are helping isn’t “hero-like” at all.
@@Deoxys_Used_Mimic
i'm sorry, but no, claiming to have no issue with stealing a candy from a baby and calling your teammates stupid are not the same thing, what world do you live in where it's the same thing?
i do agree everything you said afterwards, but that doesn't change the fact the line is dumb and _especially_ unfitting for shadow.
43:58 Man why does everyone hates the idea of branching path/choice matters in Sonic games?
The problem is poor writting.
If writers were actually good, this would be a great game story vise with a fresh idea
More like in shadow the hedgehog there are TOO MANY brancing Path
If instead on ten we had 4 (like Evil, sub Evil, Sub Hero, full Hero i dunno) and more coesive storyline yeah, this game would be good
Especially since Shadow past and development are great as we see in 06
@@Mepphy99 I actually think the game could've worked better without branching off the levels. There's a total of 22 levels. I felt that instead of having the mission choice affect the level path, it should've just caused cutscenes to alter with characters and whatnot slightly changing how they behave towards Shadow after choosing the same side for a few levels. Maybe have like 3-4 major events throughout the story that can be caused/prevented depending on the side you choose. I'm basically suggesting something similar to Detroit: Become Human but in Sonic game form.
@@TekPlayzGames that would have been much Better tho
I think the main issue, is the fact that you can switch sides at any point. I feel like after about the third stage, they should have just removed the evil missions from the hero side, and removed the hero missions from the evil side. Maybe remove both from the neutral side if you're feeling particularly spicy
@@8-bitsarda747 Not necessarily. Shadow switching sides at various points could make sense (it didn't in practice).
I can't believe Never Turn Back's piano was I am all of me! That's such a good detail thanks for bringing it up!! Anyway great review man! I was not expecting this one so soon but I enjoyed it. Can't wait to hear your opinions on 06 as I know it will be interesting to see the least.
Now I wonder which review will be longer: His, Johnny's...
...well to be fair, Clement went on for 3+ hours.
I've been listening to this song for a decade and I'd never noticed it
Same that's such a subtle thing to put in the song
Part of me wishes omega and rouge were more prominent characters in this games story. Since the 3 of them became friends in heroes. It would have been nice to see them work together to help shadow figure things out.
I hate my 14 year-old self for being stupid enough to be hyped for this abysmal game. The way Shadow was written stings, the story shoots itself in the foot every step, and the gameplay isn't fun at all. After 15 years, it's still haunting Shadow's characterization to this day.
Same, but for me it was 12.
You were young. Most of us look back on somethings we liked and shake our heads. I’ve played and enjoyed my share of terrible games and didnt care because I was super young.
@@FireBomberBassist For you. Everything you guys touch will Shit in something.
When I was younger I just liked Shadow coz he was "cool and edgy", I never noticed a difference between SA2 Shadow and 05 Shadow, they were all the same to me and I love the character regardless. As I got older however I came to appreciate how good of a character Shadow (amongst other characters) really is when depicted in games like SA2, Heroes, and 06... which also led me to absolutely despise how he was depicted in his spin-off game, and fucking sigh at the way Shadow is still being currently depicted.
I was like one when this game came out. I actually have an interest to play it
Shadow's main writing issues of being nothing more than aggression and edge here stem mostly from Takashi Iizuka's interpretation of the character, which has been the same interpretation he's had since the meta era started, so that's why it seems like Shadow is such a castrated asshole in the new games. This is also why he's so much better in 06 because he's the Shiro Maekawa interpretation, which is the same as he is in SA2 and Heroes and all the other games up until Black Knight.
But nobody like 06 so it doesn't matter in the end.
@@sonicsucks20 yep it's a common trend
no one likes sonic 4, so sega won't mainline make any more 2.5D games
no one likes sonic boom, so sonic's model won't be majorly experimented with anytime soon
no one likes 06, so shadow would lose his best characterization
@@Chillipeffer Oh, and let's not forget about 06's reception and legacy abandoning the adventure gameplay formula "for good" as well.
They gave him the vegeta treatment
@@theredguy4043 Sega said the only reason this game exists is because they received a lot of fan mail, requesting that Sonic wielded a gun. Yuji Naka knew that Sonic using gun would be out of character for sonic, but maybe it can work for Shadow??????
The games's intro is still the funniest in gaming history. The lack of self-awareness is mind-boggling.
Pump action submachine gun!
I thought it was the DOPEST SHIT EVER (when I was 7) so back off m8.
@@coltranebartlett590 Same lmao
Edge 100
@@coltranebartlett590 ditto
This game was ahead of its time. I mean it in the sense of developers had something in mind but couldn't do due to hardware limitation so had to reduce it to this. If this game was to be remade full on for this generation it'd be crazy. Levels could be bigger and mechanics/graphics would be amazing
If sega were to do this again they need to learn a lesson. Stop crapping out half baked games. With dread it was delayed for 20 years just because the hardware wasn’t ready. It’s better to not release something than to let it be released half baked
We're getting Shadow :)
I agree. And this was next level eith that many different endings. You could play this game 10 x and it be different outcomes
We aren’t gonna get a full remake of this but in Sonic X Shadow Generations hopefully can see elements of it in a modern way
"android will rule!"
Then, why you didnt destroy Apple instead of eggman
A missed potential
LOL👍😂
I don’t think Android existed back then. And even then, Apple made only computers, not phones.
Personally, I feel like there's an oddly canon path to the game. If you take the Expert Mode as canon (multiple characters make note that this is training, some sort of VR G.U.N simulation? But Black Doom starts talking at one point so who knows), then you'll hear Cream mention Shadow saved her and have the G.U.N Commander apologize for what happened during that one cutscene trying to shoot Shadow. From this, we can infer that Shadow had to save Cream during Cryptic Castle's Hero Mission and he had to meet with the G.U.N Commander meaning Cosmic Fall is the final level.
There's a path that fits just that, Dark Westopolis, Hero Digital Circuits, Hero Cryptic Castle, Hero Sky Troops, Neutral Space Gadget, then Hero Cosmic Fall. This path leads Shadow through both of the aforementioned events that happened, and it makes sense cause it ends on the ARK and it could lead into The Last Story.
Filling in the blanks, Black Doom could get away while Vector is comforting a depressed Shadow (Shadow straight up walks away in that ending, Black Doom could leave if he wants to) and then Shadow travels from the ARK to The Black Comet with all Chaos Emeralds in hand to confront him, while Sonic and the gang take the extra time from Cosmic Fall to The Last Way to get on the Black Comet too.
You don't help the Chaotix gather data at all in this route though, but I guess you can say they took the spare time to get the data themselves (and Vector's at the computer room in Cosmic Fall, he must've found something there or had some sort of data that would lead him there in the first place).
I think that all fits together quite nicely, but I think SEGA said Pure Hero is canon, so this is outta the picture. There's a path on Pure Hero where you help the Chaotix gather all the data (except helping Vector get to the computer room) so that probably works out too.
I just find it odd if this were canon because Shadow goes from fully understanding who he is and backing Black Doom into a corner with Sonic with seven Chaos Emeralds in the Black Comet to chasing him down on the Black Comet again during The Last Way despite already beating him in The Final Haunt.
Cosmic Fall -> The Last Way just makes more sense to me than The Final Haunt -> The Last Way.
Also just want to note a bizarre little detail with Vector, whenever he jumps he still has his special sound effect from Sonic Heroes. I'm sure it's just a carryover from Heroes and it's small enough that it didn't take much effort, but I'm surprised it's still here.
Very interesting.
I would add Iron Jungle to that path, as during the final battle against Devil Doom, Eggman mentions how he lied about Shadow being an android that he created, which only happens in Iron Jungle. Also, Mad Matrix could be important to have as it connects the hacking scene the Chaotix have in that level and then in the Ark, where Charmy replicates what Shadow does in the intro to Mad Matrix to get the Ark computer working (although that can't happen alongside Cryptic Castle).
It even naturally connects with Prison Island by helping Charmy get that data needed to start their process to the Ark (of the three, Charmy would most likely need the most help), and it makes sense for Shadow to help as he is trying to learn more about his past, with Prison Island being central to that.
Personally, I always thought Hero Black Comet made the most sense as the level to lead into The Last Way, as the setting and Shadow's conclusion (that he knows best and no one will tell him what to do) fit the most with how The Last Way starts, and even though Eggman seemingly dies, Shadow has no reason to kill him and he even says "Never show your face around me again!", which might imply that he simply knocked the doctor out.
Plus, it would also explain why Eggman is on foot during The Last Way without any mechanical help; Shadow destroyed his machines and he needed to stay by Sonic and co. for protection. It even fits with the three aforementioned levels, although the expert mode dialogue doesn't really suit it. Through as you said, Black Doom can still talk to Shadow despite being dead, so I don't know how canon Expert mode would be.
TL;DR: My canon path would be: Neutral Westopolis, Neutral Glyphic Canyon, Hero Prison Island, Dark Mad Matrix, Dark Iron Jungle, Hero Black Comet.
Hero Digital Circuit takes you to Prison Island, not Cryptic Castle. Interesting theory nonetheless.
@@JinzoFiter Oh shoot, you're right. Well you can just do Dark Digital Circuit and end up with the same route I think.
I guess I just wanted some involvement with Rouge in this route lol
Pure Hero can't be canon. Last Story contradicts that.
Best thing about Shadow The Hedgehog? The CGI cutscenes
And Never Turn Back
Yes
also i am all of me
Yes. This video game would’ve worked great as a movie
@@davidvazquez8225 no. It wouldn’t have.
It would look nice, but it wouldn’t change the fact the story is horrendous and possibly the worst pre meta era story in the whole franchise.
I used to be a Shadow fangirl when I was like 12, so this game was my favorite from the franchise, I tought it was so cool and stayed that way because I didn't touch it again since i finished, and now I''m starting to realize how cringy it is.
Shadow had his own game but we never got to see him like a person with complex emotions, just edgy the hedgy saying "damn"
It's cheesy, not cringe. Know the *damn* difference.
@@FindingsOfAnArmouredMind yeah, no, its kinda cringey for me
It’s definitely tryhard and unnecessarily edgy but somehow I don’t find it that cringe
its so edgy lol
And doing nearly nonsensical tasks while going through a bunch of asinine stories that won`t matter since most of them would be non-canon, and even the ones that are canon are equally stupid
Story of Shadow the Hedgehog is like a Visual Novel, cept like there is no common route skip option and the endings all suck.
To me, the story of Shadow the Hedgehog is more like a crappy choose-your-own-adventure book, where you have all these different story paths, only for there to end up being only one “true” “canon” path, making all the others pointless in the end.
@SGMD 8889 you mean the Submarine thing? I believe that was made-up
Idk not all of the endings suck to me. Some of them are nice. Like the pure hero, semi-hero, semi-dark, and the one where he betrayed Black Doom at the end. That ending is funny.
All of these stuff has ruined Shadow as an character.
The dreamcasts downfall is really one of the saddest things in gaming history for me. It was a powerful console for its time, so much wasted potential.
The dreamcast was (and still is to this day) one of the most revolutionary consoles ever made. I just don't think the world was truly ready for it 😔
@@AldenDoble there were plans to port Half Life to it at the time aswell :(
It was a powerful system, but strategically it was too soon. If they maybe would have waited one more year. I'd love to see Sega rebuild their empire and maybe release a system one day. It could happen MC world.
It really was an incredible console for the era, a shame nobody besides Sega and Acclaim really took advantage of it. That PowerVR chip has a lot more to give than 2D platformers and top-down shooters, or in modders' case, another Doom source port.
Crazy thing is. Sega has enough properties and exclusives to enter the console market again. They'd actually be decent competition, especially with the console shortage. They'd sell like hotcakes.
This game’s story feels like a “choose your own adventure book” with the ability to jump to later pages to continue the story left out. You have to read the whole thing page by page like a regular book, whether it makes sense or not.
Underrated comment right here. The comment in the video about the main story not being relevant to the Last Story felt off to me because, as you said, the main story needs to be taken as a front-to-back amalgamation of events, even if it doesn't make linear sense. It's not that none of these things happened, it's that all of them happened, just maybe not quite as the game depicted.
But unlike most of the cartoons, this one actually kills people instead of just hurting them. Just like in real life.
Yeah the story in the game is amazing . Sure it’s not as good as the stories in the Adventure games but it’s still good
Rock. I'm sorry. But I can't agree.
@@jjc4924 So when you were saying that StH is more realistic you weren’t complimenting it?
I was born in ‘98 and this was the first game I ever owned. Sure I played old classic Mac games before, but Shadow was the first my dad bought only for me thinking it would be another happy childlike Sonic game.
Now I know this bad boy had a deep impact in my personality, from the edginess I went through my teens to the gothic-industrial-esque musical preferences that still remain.
I’ve noticed that too many Sonic retrospectives on youtube are done by dudes in their 30s who all grew up with the adventure era so I think it’s really nice and refreshing to hear opinions from someone with a different experience with the franchise.
I never knew about the piano in the beginning of Never Turn Back and now I can't unhear that.
the final cutscene where shadow says "goodbye, shadow the hedgehog" is oddly prophetic, like sonic team knew that they pretty much ruined his character and how he's perceived by the masses for the foreseeable future.
But Sonic 06 portayed a wonderful Shadow. If Only he remained like that
I remember 06 and heroes having a decent portrayal.
Honestly now knowing all the company turmoil that went on during this time with the merger with Sammy, creative warfare with Yuji Naka, and basically forcing Iizuka to develop huge portions of the game alone, it’s actually amazing that anything released at all during that period.
"I need to know about the past, who am I, what am I doing here . . ."
"WHAT AM I FIGHTING FOOOOOOARRRRRGH!?"
Gerald Robotnik with an Dr. Light ascent: That's an good question.
"For what reason do I exist? The answers are just up ahead"
I was a big fan of Sonic after finishing up Sonic X, and I was desperate for more Sonic action.
This lead me to buying Shadow the Hedgehog for the PS2. And while I struggled to get through it, I soon found myself having a blast with it...after using a gameshark for infinite health ammo and stuff.
Yes I enhanced the game, but it allowed me to have so much fun.
I guess my advice is if you want to enjoy this game use a game shark and it's a blast.
in my opinion infinite ammo doesn't fix the stages or the story. no hate it's just my personal opinion.
@@AlphaZeroX96 Oh god, the horror! I call for execution!
sonic x was a good representation of sonic
Whatever makes you have more fun with the game.
If you have to cheat to have fun with a game, then the game is bad to begin with.
Me before the video: Where's that DAMN fourth 3d Sonic review.
Me now: O, here it is. That was easy, like stealing candy from a baby, wich is fine by me.
*Proceeds to use a karate key on my device in order to watch the video.*
@Holden The Gamer Just see the video.
@Holden The Gamer He's quoting the memes of Shadow the Hedgehog.
But did you find the computer room before you karate chop your computer?
@Holden The Gamer lol, perfectly describes the writers of the game.
@@robertkovarna8294 Well, you kind of have to find the computer room before you can karate chop the computer.
I do sincerely hope one day Shadow may be able to get another game that is great, and keeps his character great as it was in SA2, Heroes & 06. A Shadow The Hedgehog game is not bad, and some of their ideas had potential even if their presentation in Shadow The Hedgehog made them seem very bad. I just don’t want to see what could be such a great game thrown to the wayside like so many other things in the gaming industry and especially in Sonic.
I think they're making one. A few months ago, Sega was announcing a darker toned game, and everyone thought it was gonna be Shadow the Hedgehog 2. Unfortunately, it wasn't, and people were so upset that they got Shadow The Hedgehog trending on Twitter, so i think they'll make another one since the demand is high
@@cerebralassassin2185 there is certainly a possibility, but the problems lay within Sega itself which has some sort of rules or restrictions in place that might hurt things (came sometime after 06 I believe?), and so that may just make for another flop of a game. I can’t say for sure. However, there may also be a problem in Sega relating to fears of a character like Shadow overtaking Sonic in popularity. I don’t know how widespread that fear may be, and how much it has influenced things over time so take that part with a grain of salt, but I am still just skeptical and almost feel that the unfortunate and unnecessary shroud of Sonic 06 hanging over the Sonic Team and Sega may just make any Shadow the Hedgehog 2 a flop.
your wish is Sega's Command! 🧞♂️ a sequel to Shadow the Hedgehog (in which Black Doom returns) is due to be released in, "Autumn 2024". Just Search, "Sonic x Shadow Generations"
I mean looks like shadow x sonic generations looks good so.
I enjoyed this game enough to not only get all A Ranks and all keys on every stage and complete Expert Mode, but I've fully completed all the library sequences
TWICE.
Also, I can easily buy Shadow being evil in this game. Remember he lost his memory and in the game Doom manipulates him by telling him what GUN did to Maria. This was literally the same motivation he had to nearly destroy Earth in Sonic Adventure 2.
I also could buy it if Black Doom somehow mixed the facts about his past but the thing is, in the last stages of Heroes he says "Even if I'm not real, I'm still the Ultimate Life Form, Shadow the Hedgehog!"
So in the end he doesn't care if he's fake or not, he decides to just keep moving and doing the right thing, not to say he showed an heroic nature by saving Rouge in SA2 and Heroes
But here he keeps asking about his past, straight up doesn't care that the city is being attacked, just shows interest when Black Doom offers info about his past and the idiot just believes him
The intro cutscene is just dumb and out of character for Shadow
@@ayrtonjoga Yes but for a while Shadow in SA2 was willing to destroy Earth. Shadow on the Dark path in this game is basically like SA2 Shadow. Its not hard to believe that Doom could manipulate his memories, lie to him about his friends (Sonic, Rouge, Omega, Amy, etc.) and put him on the same path he was on in SA2 all the way until Amy was in the right place at the right time. Also, the intro scene was before he really showed any concern for humans specifically outside of maybe existential threats to humans and anthros alike like Metal Sonic. At the onset of the intro, he just saw basically a battle between humans and aliens and thought "That's their problem"-unless you go down the path to change Shadow's mentality.
@@shadowthehedgehog3113 Yes, the awakened Shadow from SA2 would be manipulated by Doom just like how Gerald did to his memories(not *pure* evil tho, he still showed some compassion for Rouge)
But in Heroes despite initially going with intent of discovering his past, he ignored it over time, created a bond with Rouge and Omega, still helped to defeat Metal Sonic's final forms, and just kept moving
All I'm saying is: If Shadow from SA2 was awakened by Doom, I believe he would *be* evil and obey to his command, but I think him instantly believing Doom and acting all evil *after* the events of Heroes is not on character
@@ayrtonjoga Sega said the only reason this game exists is because they received a lot of fan mail, requesting that Sonic wielded a gun. Yuji Naka knew that Sonic using gun would be out of character for sonic, but maybe it can work for Shadow??????
@@orangeslash1667 The thing is that I don't mind certain Sonic characters using guns, like Eggman or even Tails (if it has a cartoonish look) because they both use mechs
But it just doesn't make sense for Shadow, like, how the self-entitled "Ultimate Life Form" would need guns?? He is already very powerful with his chaos powers, especially in his Super form
Shadow karate chopping the computer is still one of the most hilarious moments in all of gaming and not because it was supposed to be.
Unironically, the shadow fandub’s plot was not only comprehensible, but also more cohesive than the original version
and this is doubly true for 06!
Yes, that's right. Shadow one of the characters without drawing from previous works. In the original comics, games, and series, there wasn't Shadow. This is a character that is mostly associated as the anti-Sonic from the developments. Despite his large fan base, Shadow was merely an addition and had no connection to sustaining the franchise.
No, I'm the devil. HEAVY DOG
This games OST is awesome in my opinion. There’s ton of unused songs. Just look them up. Magna-fi has an album released in 06 or 07 and the first track was intended to be in the game. Check them out.
Unreleased tracks you say? Well, it is time to check those out.
Bro the whole soundtrack was lit my guy
.
49:41 , do you know the name of this song?
@@kolldee3006 literally the theme of a level you see. Lava shelter
The part where he explains that the Shadow game has no backbone with its tone and "darker" moments, sums up a HUGE issue I had with Sonic Forces. It's just as many crappy copouts with no lasting commitments in its narrative in that game too, its like Sega doesn't learn sometimes.
It’s bc forces was written by people who know nothing about sonic, literally. If we had the unleashed/ black knight writers, forces would’ve been much better. Have the gameplay be more of a mix between unleashed and generations and you’ve got a good game
Shadow being an android would be the only way this character assassination would make any sense. Like, Robotnik created new life for this shadow, as an android, and he's experiencing new problems and issues like a child would and it shapes him into a different person because it's all he really experienced up until that point. I think the main problem is that this game makes shadow the driving force in the story instead of the story happening to shadow. Choices in games are supposed to put you into a position that would make your choice matter, but limit options and maybe even knowledge of each choice, and make you carefully consider each option and understand the respective pros and cons. Who in their right mind would choose Black Arms aside from, "Do I wanna do an evil playthrough?"
Also, a funny note, the only guy I knew who had this game was my best friend in elementary school. He is black and had absolutely no problems with the names of the aliens. In fact, I don't even remember him acknowledging it at all. I guess the whole seeing racism thing just goes over the head of 3rd/4th graders unless it's painfully blatant. I mean, you can argue that this is, but it definitely wasn't the intention.
I never owned this game, but I had SA2. We would talk about the different plots in this game and piece together it with the only Sonic game he and I mutually owned, Sonic Heroes. I really miss those days.
The game does make sense if you reformulate it like this: A character study of Shadow, by observing him in a bunch of what-if scenarios. Or at least it would, if it wasn't a character assassination instead as you pointed out.
Sometimes I wish they'd remake these games and make a coherent canon and refine the gameplay to be better but I know that's definitely not gonna happen lol
I unironically would love a Shadow the Hedgehog remake. As embarrassing as the plot/dialogue was, I had enough fun with it to try going for all 326 routes. Switching to more Sonic Adventure-based movement system, redesigning the level design to accommodate it, as well as ironing out the shooting would be awesome.
Adventure, Adventure 2, Heroes, and the Hedgehog need remakes
This game needs a reinvention
I think the scenes where Shadow finds a Shadow Android in Heroes & Shadow offers a perfect comparison between the two.
In Heroes Shadow finds an android, and at most is mildly concerned before brushing it off to continue the mission.
In Shadow, he’s flabbergasted at the sight of the damn thing and decides to go full lunatic and take over the world.
One is Shadow the Hedgehog, the other is a drooling idiot who doesn’t know what to do with himself.
"This is like taking candy from a baby, which is fine by me." He says on the Hero Path.
Its just a bad translation. The line isn't good in the Japanese, but its much less vague/misunderstandable.
It was like, "This is easy, which is fine by me", English just used an idiom which kinda doesn't work in the line.
Not defending the writing. Just saying it still fits with a Heroic path.
@@Nerdgirl9853 I did not know that. Thanks for informing me!
@@Laurmachi no problem. And also, translating it like that was likely purposeful, in order to sound more edgy.
But yeah, was just bad translation of an already not-the-best line.
@@Nerdgirl9853 The Japanese words is just every player in this game
The game had its many flaws but there is an underlying theme to the story and I still liked it. If they were to try doing it again I bet it would be amazing. It's not as great as the other games, but it had too much potential and I wish it had more love.
THIS
I really want a redo, not a remake, of this game. Redo the ark where he gets his memory back and defeats the Black Arms and do it right.
Same, I think this game had a lot of potential, and I even enjoy playing the end result in small bursts over the years, but if you condensed the level amount, reworked the morality system and how the npc's act upon it, and tweaked the bugs in the controls like the homing attack and such, you'd have a pretty solid game.
A re-imagining would be the proper term here.
@@sulphurous2656 I believe redo fits better since the original is flawed and it would be a second attempt, thus a retry or redo.
@@Birzt and, seeing as how Sega and Sonic Team are on good terms with them, get the fanbase, the ACTUAL fanbase, not those whiny 12 year olds who think Shadow is just edgy and nothing more, to help out on multiple fronts, like gameplay, level design, story, etc.
@@paperluigi6132 I would argue to do what Mania did. Can't get people who don't know what they are doing. An idea is worthless on its own. Definitely get people who are fans though. Never make something you don't care about.
I had fun playing Shadow the Hedgehog on the GameCube. It took me forever to beat the game. I know most people didn't really care for the game, but I actually loved it! I always liked nuking my enemies with Chaos Blast.
Death to all who oppose me! 😅
If I had a penny for every time I heard that quote... I would have more than one penny.
@@thelonewolf7443 Arrragh! DEATH TO ALL WHO OPPOSE ME!👿 -Shadow the Hedgehog 2005
Also, tbf, that scene in Death Ruins with Black Doom was not Shadow actually working with him-he was helping Rouge spy on him. Black Doom figures this out and that's why he sends Black Bull after them.
35:57 I fully agree this stage is SUPER bad. However I never seen those glitches happen, not in the GameCube version at least.
oh wow
I am aware that Shadow The Hedgehog is a trash game, but I still love it lmao
I do too. But don’t say it’s trash. You can say that it’s good. Don’t let anyone stop you
@@rockwarestar4670 Well, I don't really thnk that it's that good or good at all, I just like it for other reasons. You can still have fun or like bad games. That how I think at least.
@@rockwarestar4670 Except why would he say it’s good when it’s not good nor does he think it is good? Just because you personally like something doesn’t mean it’s any good. It’s okay and possible to like something that’s bad. That’s why they’re called “guilty pleasure”. They’re stuff you enjoy despite you knowing fully from an objective standpoint, that they aren’t very good.
@@craftymasterproductions4218 Exaclty. Alot of people nowadays really blur the line between “objective” and “subjective”. Subjectivity is your personal enjoyment, whilst objectivity is just fact, in terms of the objective quality of the actual product. You’d be surprised how many people don’t understand this (and I’ve met alot of them in my time 🙄)
@@SM-th7pw true. But the terms "good" and "bad" aren't objective because you describe good and bad differently based on what the standard is. and objectivity requires consistentcy.
Shadow the Hedgehog is the textbook example of the "Edgy Spin-off".
It sucks though because it kinda isn't even a spin off.
The events all taking place after and continuing shadows story from Sa2 makes this much closer to a main series game.
@@CraftyChicken91 I suppose you have a point.
Yet it’s in my top five favorite GameCube games
Fun fact: Black Doom is voiced by Goku's English VA
And I couldn't care less about that to be perfectly honest. Not after the BS he's been doing since last year.
@@jjc4924 what he's been doing ?
Hector. To put it simply, he has been being destroying Vic carrier and being more douchbag to the fans & makes Funi worst.
@@jjc4924 good to know thanks for answering
Sean?
I feel like this is one of your best reviews in the Sonic retrospective. Looking at the history of video games during the era in which Shadow The Hedgehog was released is REALLY important context as to how it even came to being, and you did a great job with that.
This was the one that got me into his channel, so I’ll always have it as one of my favorites, right behind 06 which is maybe my favorite video he’s ever made besides the TMNT stuff
The most troubling thing about this game is its troubling legacy. This one game still overshadows the character despite being over a decade old. Every IP has its share of missteps, but rarely do you see its continuing legacy. It makes you wonder what could have been if this game was of the same quality as the Adventure series.
I feel like this game was too ambitious for it's own good. It had a good idea with the "choose your own adventure" gimmick but the execution wasn't done well. The mission structure is easily the game's biggest flaw. Instead of kill X amount of enemies they should have just had different paths to take depending on the alignment you wanted with a corresponding goal ring. Also fix the controls to be like SA1 and 2, make the story more cohesive, fix Shadow's personality, and this game could have been one of the highlights of the series. Instead it is seen as a joke and the game that started the Dark Age, ruined Shadow's reputation as a character, and led to all the "Ow the Edge" memes.
Despite all the controversy though I still really enjoy playing this game despite its flaws.
The "Live and Learn" riff at the end of the super transformation is one of the only redeeming parts of this game
I still find it amazing that one of the CGI movie producers from this game ended up directing both Sonic Movies
"Damn, not here!"
"This can't be...!"
Damn, not here
You’re going straight to Hell!
“That DAMN forth chaos emerald!”
"This is the end of you, and the end to my cursed past!"
I think they wanted to remember Gerald as who he was before Maria's death made him snap. But he did snap, and the reason for that should not be forgotten.
I think the following could've improved the game:
* As you do the good, neutral, & evil missions, the connections on the map light up.
* Instead of automatically following connections as you play, let you select any level you've created a connection to. This means you don't have to keep restarting, and you don't have to replay any particular mission, but you'd still need to do each level 2-3 times (total) to do each mission.
* Once all of the connections are lit up, pick a particular track as the canon, highlight that particular path, and unlock the final piece of the story. The other paths are theoretic possibilities that Shadow considered, as part of his search for who he is, but didn't ultimately choose, because that's not who he is. (To prevent confusion, allow the player to replay the cutscenes of this path if they so choose, to jog their memory, as an option.)
* Better voice acting direction (The example you referred to as "word salad" can actually make perfect sense if some of the lines (especially the first one) had a sarcastic tone, for example.)
* A few bug fixes.
Man this channel is so great for re-capping games I’ve never played
This is the first time someone actually praised the music in Shadow the hedgehog, I feel like everyone just write it off as edgy trash when it actually has great tracks especially the vocal tracks, although I might be tad bias considering my 2 favorite songs from the game that I love to bits are Chosen one and Broken (yeah I know Broken didn't make into the game but still).
Never turn back isn't my favorite Crush 40 song, it is on my top 3 though, my favorite is Knight of the wind, while I don't like black knight as a game (I borrowed it from a friend didn't like the gameplay at all) the vocal tracks, specifically the Crush 40 songs and covers, are their best collection of songs in a Sonic game ever imo.
i see you are a person of great tastes your pfp is from code lyoko right?
@@niteriemcfarlane5285 Yeah, I love that show. It's nice seeing fellow code lyoko fans, because it's rare to see.
Gotta ask, what’s it like being Xana-fied? 😅
I am... All of me is pretty good, it's on my top 5 Crush 40
@@Rex13013 code lyoko is amazing :)
If you do some research about the behind the scenes of this game’s production, there’s actually a rather funny reason why this game’s tone tries soo hard for the edginess. And that’s because, Izuka and co had no clue how to write dark stories. Their solution? Binge watch a bunch of dark emo vampire shit from the mid 2000’s, like the Underworld and Blade movies. Yeah, they took notes and copy pasted the dark tone from a superficial level.
That’s where the weird use of guns, motorcycles alien with cults and Karate Chop action comes into play. It was just Izuka and co mimicking terrible vampire slaying flicks of the time assuming this was what westerners were into.
DYKG made a video detailing this a few years back! You can look it up where they cite their sources and such! Crazy shit!
this is exactly why you should never pander to an audience. pandering only leads to a superficial product. create what you truly think is good and the audience will come to you.
Damn, I didn't know that. The reason why it's so edgy was they took their main inspiration from UNDERWORLD (And Blade, but Blade is the second most important comic book movie ever made, so...)
The Lesson of Shadow the Hedgehog? Never take influence from Underworld for your big budget action platformer title! You'll never know what you'll do if you take influence from the wrong stuff.
@@simpson6700 what people think is good is subjective, devs could think sonic forces was amazing when most people think it sucks.
16:13 "despite calling him the ultimate life form before."
He doesn't remember that at that part of the story yet. Lol
late but it didn't seem like he hated him in heroes.
@@spinballproduction9678 ....what? Did you mean to reply to someone else?
No why do you ask that
@@spinballproduction9678 Ah woops. For some reason I thought this was his Heroes video and my timed clip didn't make it obvious until I skipped back a bit.
You're onto something though. It seemed like in Heroes he was perplexed by the thought of someone who looked just like him while acting totally different. He was just confused and didn't know how to act beside him but he respected him in the Final Fight; him and Knuckles. In his solo spinoff, I guess he just treats him like the annoying kid brother who won't leave him alone. Thanks Sonic Team.
Shadow the Hedgehog was my first "proper" Sonic game besides Sonic Riders. While I understand how bad this game is compared to the earlier 3D games but I unapologetically love how fucking weird and edgy it is.
Huh... You know, this game does the "kill your past" better than The Last Jedi.
Shadow is constantly trying to figure out if he's real or just an android. He's told different things depending on which story you go through. But at the end, he casts aside his need for a past and focuses on defeating the villain. That clip at the 9 minute mark of the final boss, where Eggman tells Shadow he's the same one from SA2, comes after he's made up his mind. He is the Ultimate Life Form. All of it.
...Damn, I didn't expect to think this when watching the video.
In 06 he dropped this whole "what is muh past?!?" and he got a new threat to fight against, it's part of the reason why he worked in the later game and not here lol
people really don't like the last jedi even if I didn't think someone would compare it to story in shadow the hedgehog
@@maude7420 That's what happens when you insert an equally edgy character.
Mephiles threatened his edge.
Same with Infinite or whatever from Sonic forces.
funi shado edgi
And Metal Gear Solid 2 did it better than both.
Okay, how is this guy 2 years younger than me? Stop making me feel old at age 22.
I'm 30. It's kind of fascinating seeing how people that are younger than me view the series. I was born in 90 and I got a Genesis in 92-93 with Sonic 2.
My Godkids are all big Sonic fans from seeing Boom or X on Hulu. So it's been a real treat showing them the games I grew up with or Mania for example. It just makes me happy. For better or worse, Sonic's still an icon and it's nice that something so pivotal to my childhood is still a thing today.
Fuuuck me cause I was born in 1999 and Jay is born in 2000!? AND HE'S SOUNDS MUCH MORE OLDER THAN ME WTH!?
I’m 25 and I’ve always been secret sonic fan so has my boyfriend I’ve been a fan since I was 5 when I got my own sega mega drive and sonic the hedgehog 2 and Ecco the dolphin 🐬
Dont ask how old we classic Sonic fans are...
On the subject of ages, I am waiting for someone to comment about the part around 47:10 where I say “I was in a discord call back in high school.” Can’t imagine a lot of youtubers have said that lol
The way this game's story was handled makes me think of the trainwreck that was Phantasy Star III, a game which multiple story paths, often contradicting each other's lore-wise and the series' lore as a whole. It has so many different timelines and boils down to...4 endings, I guess? But everything is a mess. And the translation, at the time, was also pretty bad. Sega was notorious for their bad English translation for a very long time.
it still baffles me how they decided to make such a huge amount of stages and then for some godforsaken reason to split them in 10.
the mere thought decreases my IQ out of sheer wasted potential.
What do you think of Phantasy Star Online Episode 3 and the first 3 episodes of PSO2 that also has this feature?
Such a strange twist that SEGA were infamous for terrible translations, but now they're the best in the business for localisation of games.
Your channel should be in the millions with subscribers. I usually hate review channels cause they always nick pick on the bad and is very annoying at that. But I love how in depth your are with your reviews. I've seen your jak reviews, tmnt, batman beyond, and sonic 06 so far. While just starting this one. You love what you do and I love that. Keep up the good work
20:50 And?
The only reason he might join Black Doom is because he has amnesia.
Just look at him!
He literally knowns nothing about the past .
If he did he would never join BD since he destroys humans.
The real flaw in writting is the fact that it breaks the entire continuity of Sonic Heroes.
There are a l o t of evidence that Shadow in Heroes is actually an android/clone.
However ShTH has a snippet dialogue 10 min into final boss where Eggman says he "caught Shadow and saved him"
Which also makes absolutely NO sense.
How?(He was on the arc when Shadow fell, how tf was he able to even save him???)
Why?(from his pov Shadow is either on Sonic side or is dangerous loner why tf would he save him???)
When?(He was shown being surprised and then mourning his and Grandfather's passing. When did he find the time to even save him?)
Even if we assume it's canon, that doesn't explain why tf he knows nothing about past or Sonic Co in ShTH even tho he learned about them n team dark in Heroes.
It would make SO much sense if heroes shadow was android/clone and ShTH Shadow was real one.
Because if that's not the case then how tf did he got a *second* amnesia?
Only this one seems to be even stronger in some cases to the point he's ok with evil acts.
Did he fall off Eggman ship in Heroes????
also im pretty sure Amnesia doesnt make you change personality that drastically.
(talking about all the various endings.)
To me its like a split personality thing lol
I mean
I feel personality is quite dependent on events transpired in life and how they shape us, people aren't born good or evil, they become that
So if Shadow lost all memory except the death of a close friend then I think Shadow could be turned evil if the influence, Black Doom, is there
That's just my take tho
possibly.
Actually, that part about Eggman saving Shadow was somewhat(poorly) explained. I don't remember where did exactly I saw it(either in ShTH itself or in some podcast or somesuch), so I can't provide actuall proof right now(maybe later), but it goes like this:
When Eggman saved Shadow? Somewhere after SA2.
How did Eggman saved Shadow? If I remember correctly, ARK was damaged a bit while it was on the crash course to Earth. Some of it's damaged parts fall on earth. After SA2 Eggman tried to find those broken parts of ARK to use them for his robots, but, instead, found unconscious Shadow.
Why did Eggman saved Shadow? He thought to research Shadow to try and make something similar to him. In the end he made Shadow Android series with collected data.
And funny thing about Shadow in Heroes being an actual android - it was NEVER confirmed. The end in the dark story was made quite ambigiuos. There is many hints that Shadow in Heroes is an adroid, that is true, but then many detailes aren't quite fit: like, why did that particular Shadow was stored ALONE, not with the other androids? Why did he was hidden on the SECRET base? And why the hell Omega was put to secure that particular exemplar?
Amnesia from ShTH is the same amnesia from the Heroes. The misunderstanding about amnesia problem rises from a few things:
1. Many people are suprisingly forgetful of the fact that Shadow, actually, didn't learned much from Sonic Heroes. The only thing he learned was that Eggman made androids that looks like him. And that's, basicaly, it. He didn't remembered ARK or any events of SA2. He didn't even found out if he was an android or not. He just decided to not care about that for the time being. "I am what I am" or somesuch.
2. The other thing - Shadow never was suprised about seeing any of the characters we meet durning the game. Interestingly, all characters that we meet in the game, exept for the Commander and Black Doom for obvious reasons, are from Sonic Heroes and Sonic Heroes ONLY. Shadow met them all before. But he never adresses them like they are friends either. It's like they are an acquaintances at most. And from Shadow's perspective that is actually the truth! Because he don't remember them that much anyway(exept for Rouge and Omega). He only remembers a few facts here and there, but not everything.
So after Heroes, Shadow decided to try and find his lost memories on his own (without looking back on that android crap in Heroes) but then Black Doom appeared.
All that doesnt excuse the bad, sloppy and very lazy writing, but still - continuity of Sonic Heroes wasn't broken.
And... uhmmm... I'm sorry for this giant essay. X)
i honestly can't believe people think shadow saying "this is like taking candy from a baby, which is fine by me" means he's fine taking candy from babies. i'm pretty sure he just means it's really easy, and _that's_ fine by him.
Sure but it's funnier to think about it like that
You've got to admit the phrasing is kinda ridiculous
I think most people's issue is the delivery of the line and not it's literal meaning.
So? Line still sucks
yea it is still pretty stupid
You know what destroys the morality system even further than the fact you can switch morality at a whim? The fact that there is a last story. If players wanted a villainous shadow which is part of the point of the game, then the game is basically saying to screw off. What’s the point of having multiple endings if all of them are non canon and we just have a hero ending?
If I had to sum this game`s story up with a single sentence, it would be:
``It all starts with this... a game containing the ultimate character assassination``
--Me & other people who may have come up with this
Thats the,Shadow the Hedgehog!?
@@alptugraakan7490 Yes, the character assassin is Shadow the hedgehog (Also called by the unofficial but much more suitable name of "ow the edge") and the one assassinated is Shadow the hedgehog
@@pkmntrainerred4247 i guess you didnt understand that i did a sa2 3rd hero story cutscene joke
@@alptugraakan7490 Ah, sorry, its been quite a while since I last played SA2 so my memories of that game are quite rusty.
Nice reference tho
I think I'm the only one who LOVED this game as a kid. Shadow was my favourite character and I loved the 3D sonic games so Shadow was like a dream come true.
This was my first sonic game.....
Shadow the hedgehog is the poster child for character assassination. Wtf did they do to my boi.
Am I the only one who thinks that Shadow's nose in the thumbnail just looks... Wrong?
I thought i was the only one
I don't get it, that's how his nose always looked..
@@alysssabear Maybe it's just the angle of how shadow was drawn that makes it look weird, but to me his nose just looks a bit small and very slightly off centered.
I think is a bit smaller that normal
The nose is fine, but his thumb looks really weird
So this whole time I thought that as a 10 year old playing this game that I was just too stupid to understand the storyline & got frustrated to the point where I never finished the game but that wasn’t really the case!? It was just an entirely poorly made game!?? 🤦🏾♂️
0:40 Interestingly, we used to have "anti-exclusives" in that gen. After the Dreamcast failed, Sony said "If you don't port Sonic on our PS2 right now, we'll never let you put another Sonic game on our consoles", and that's why there are some bad Sonic ports such as Sonic Heroes being extremely glitchy.
In my opinion, the word “damn” isn't edgy at all. I think it's ok for Sonic characters to throw light swears like that. Besides, kids today swear like sailors anyways.
Here comes to XBOX live kids
Sonic and friends say the word and shit in the Japanese dub, so yea i kinda agree
ESPECIALLY when they play FPS OR any Grand Theft Auto games...
@@AK46supr The word used isn't the same strength as "shit". Its closer to "crap",
Glad to see a new video in retrospective! This might be one of my favorite series on youtube. As for this game, I've never played it, but it leaves of sour taste for me simply because what it did to the series and for Shadow's character. I'm sure there are people who do legitimately like it though, and that's cool. After all, I think Secret Rings is a very flawed, yet still decent game (Can't wait for that episode). Keep the great work J!
_Aboard the Egg Fleet, after Sonic Heroes is over..._
*Shadow:* "Hrm... Sonic."
*Sonic:* "Yo, Shadow. You're looking moody as usual - what's up?"
*Shadow:* "With all this Metal Sonic business out of the way... tell me. Are you aware of the details of my past?"
*Sonic:* "Oh yeah, the lot of us heard all about that back on the Ark, ha. Why, you telling me you forgot, or something?"
*Shadow:* "Tsk... yes. I must've been inflicted with amnesia of some sort..."
*Sonic:* "Oh man, yeah, I can see how that would've happened, with what happened to you at the end when we stopped the Ark's fall..."
*Shadow:* "So tell me."
*Sonic:* "Geez, cool it. I'll grab myself a chili dog and we'll have a chat! - Also, woah, did you see those vats with android clones of you...?"
*Shadow:* "... tsk... what if I am one of them..."
*Sonic:* "... have you tried poking yourself to see if you bleed?"
*Shadow:* "... uh-"
Im aware of all the games flaws but damn this is such a guilty pleasure for me and idk why
40:37 Nice editing, using the actual cutscenes in place of the stills.
The only ending that’s canon is the pure hero ending.
Meaning that Shadow declared that he had all seven Chaos Emeralds twice, and that Black Doom still tried to convince Shadow to help him, despite Black Doom getting beaten up by Shadow earlier.
Honestly the most canon pathway for me is Westopolis Hero, Lethal Highway Hero, Cirus Park Neutral, Mad Matrix Neutral, Space Gadget Hero, then Final Haunt Hero
I believe there's a 11th final that you can get after you get all the other 10 finals. It's the LAST story with Super Shadow and all of that and is the canon one
@@trashmouth2020 story-wise the pure hero ending leads to the last story segment, I think Entertainer Ev is right: there's only 2 possible endings that leads to the last story segment: Pure Hero ending or Semi Hero ending, and the level choice that he suggested seems the most logical.
The fact the Story of the Game is basically, Shadow lost his memory AGAIN, was enough to make it feel unnecessary.
Umm again?After sa2,sth and heroes(based on how you want it to be)happens in the same time
He had lost his memories before Sonic Heroes, and this game is a continuation of that. He never “lost them again.” I’m not sure where you’re getting that from.
This is a common mistake that bothers me a lot. Shadow never lost his memory any more than one time.
I remember renting this at my mothers' request ("I know it's a sonic game but what if it's not good") and just hating it solely for the new voice actors.
It didn't help that I went for the slightly good route on my first playthrough, which not only has the least engaging story but also made me experience Charmy and Vector's ear-grating new voices. I didn't do any other playthroughs and just returned it.
Damn, I love Jason as Shadow
The start of the dark age, Shadow showed how Sega couldn't write stories any more. What sad is that this game was unnecessary since Shadow arc was done and even in Heroes Shadow said he doesnt care if he is real or not.
Exactly my thoughts. This game is one of the most pointless and unnecessary games ever made for a franchise
Because that makes sense. Seriously, him saying he does not care throws out his entire motivation, and justification, to be in the plot of heroes.
@@lpfan4491 I think what they mean is that, the entire game (Heroes) Shadow is trying to figure out who he is, then he ultimately concludes that he doesn’t care whether he’s real or not, because he’s still Shadow the Hedgehog and he’ll continue to carry out Shadows legacy whether he is real or not. It’s putting forth the message that Shadows past does not define who he is as a person, and as such he doesn’t bother going to all the trouble to find out his past because his past does not define who he is or who he wants to be. You could argue that it throws all the development of SA2 out the window and that would be a fair argument, however that doesn’t deny that his arc in Heroes is a pretty solid one, because it shows that Shadow isn’t a hero soley because it’s what Maria wanted (although that certainly played a big part), but rather because it’s the right thing to do, coz in SA2 Shadow was actually manipulated by Gerald into thinking Maria wanted revenge against the humans, which causes to want revenge, whilst in Heroes Shadow’s mind is completely blank, yet he still does good showing that he is a good person at heart.
I understand the basic sentiment, but for me, it is basically just going on a journey for one purpose alone....and then without any real trigger for the change in opinion, you just one day say "fuck it, I do not care anymore".
@@lpfan4491 Ah okay I get you. Yeah I agree, nothing really triggered Shadow to change his perspective, one minute he’s like “ *OMG WHO AM I* “ and next minute he’s all like “lmao nah fuck dat idc” without anything to trigger his decision.
I think one of the few story things this game does is pretty clearly implying that you're the real shadow throughout the whole game and that shadow is actually created by the aliens because he can do the thing where he travels through the alien tube things and his skin color being black and red like the aliens makes sense
And for the possibility of him being an android I don't think the lower poly count of the npc androids is like lack of polish or anything I think that was actually supposed to show that they are machines but the real shadow is clearly different, and also it makes sense logically that eggman would lie about creating shadow in the hopes of controlling him
And the reason I say all of this is bc I disagree that the thing eggman says 9 minutes into the final boss fight is like the only confirmation you get, I think its effectively confirmed through the game