Dude, you're the man. I wish more people on youtube spoke about these things! Loving the content. Actual car talk - not about their preferred interior stitching
Loved the kid offering to put his booster seat in. He didn't think he'd need it but if you want me in it to make this happen I'm easy. Total Faith. Keep driving and more importantly keep inspiring that kid. Luv and Peace.
Not sure why its kept mentioned theyre not fast sports cars , with few tweaks they still do phenomenal results at Nurburgring or similar layout tracks. fantastic driving OP. Well done .
I didn't mean it like they are not fast in general. It was more about overall ethos for their tuning approach. They give up some performance for comfort, but that is not a bad thing. I love that about these cars. These cars have great top end so if you keep them in the power band and have grippy tires and some suspension setup they can put down some pretty good lap times for sure.
...pure pleasure listening and watching to you being so open and honest, and of course hard driving, respekt from a e39 m5/ e46 m3 fanatic from Germany
Z4M in my opinion is BMW M division's last great car. Its almost like they told the accounting department to go fuck themselves at the Christmas party. The new M cars are faster and more refined but they lack why we bought them in the first place. The spirit of the drive. Despite moving on to several M cars since, I cannot replace the "feeling" the Z4M gave me back in those days. Once the kids grow up I full intend to get a Z4M once more. Great Driving Skills! You know the car, the tires, the limits. Awesome.
Man I bought a z4 coupe (sport trim) in part due to your videos. Couldn’t afford the M so I just have to imagine it sounds as good as yours but what an awesome car. I love it.
.Hey great vid Garage Quin Motors! Really liked the side by side comparison and you nailed it when you said "That's what these cars are for" Just taking them out and Hooning them for a bit". Having a good time with pushing yourself and the cars capabilities while having that bond man with machine as well as your buddy! Great stuff man! That's what it's all about for those of us that can't race for the big time money etc.Love both cars!! Two of my very favs. I've got a M3 e46 but love the look of the Z4M.
Great content!! Very informative, This is what we want to see... lots of cross referencing driving attributes with other cars. The battle was great to see to. Good to see a vast variety of cars lately. Better than watching Motortrend Head to Head! as it is more entertaining, informative & more honest. You should consider testing some high powered all motor American cars that supposedly handle really well, such as Gen 5 Z28, GT350R, C6 Z06 & Gen 6 SS 1LE or even the crazy ZL1 1LE if you can get your hands on them & maybe at a different (larger) location. That would be great to see.
Thanks man. No, the wheel spin and drifting is certainly costing time if you were trying to set a time. Quick slip angles are fine if the car is rotating when exiting the corner, but anything more than that is wasted motion and causes loss in time.
Damn, this whole time I've been thinking that the Z4 was way lighter and with the same motor would spank my ass, so every time I saw one I wouldn't dare race em because well, I hate losing. Next time I see one I hope to have some good spirited fun. Thanks for the video and sweet driving.
I think it's about 120 lbs difference. So it's something but nothing monumental. A bolt on or two on the E46 would probably guarantee the victory in a straight line.
I loved the duel. The E46M3 is my fave M car. And I was planning on getting one. Now you’ve left me all confused and shit. I’m 6ft2. How easily can I fit into a Z4M without knocking my knees about constantly and banging on the roof liner too?
Do you think that the z4 coupe 3.0 si (the non M 260hp one) would have better turn in and overall better front grip having a mich lighter engine (aluminium and magnezium block)?
I mean less weight on the tires means they do not have to work as hard and will not be overloaded as easy, so it might be slightly better. However engine placement matters as well and both of these platforms have the engine extended well past the shock towers, so no matter how you dice it, the center mass of the engine is directly over the front axle. This is why cars like the Honda S2000 and FD RX-7 are front mid-ship layouts to overcome this, putting the engine behind the shock mounts and moving that mass more towards the center of the car.
+Garage Quinn Motors do you think that the e46 m3 has better front grip/understeers less than the e86?, engine placement looks similar on both, suspension is very similar, the only real difference betwin the two beeing wheelbase and track. Correct me if Im wrong
I would say if you did instrumented testing with same tire compound and alignment, the Z4M would understeer slightly less due to the 50/50 weight distribution, more rigid chassis and 120 lbs less curb weight. It wouldn't be a monumental difference by any means, but those small advantages should equate to slightly better out of the box performance on the Z4M.
By chance do you know What kind of lap times did these cars get? As to compare to you’re recent Miata, Mr2 etc lap times! Thank you for the great content
Two completely different cars. The Z4M is like a small grand touring car. and drive's like one where a Miata will always feel like a grassroots tuner car. The Miata will always be way more agile and light on its feet vs the Z4M
Yes, I had Pilot Supersports on it previously and the grippier compound reduced suspension movements quite a bit. I didn't go with them again because they chunked apart horribly last time I brought them to Lime Rock and tried to shoot video. The grip levels of those was somewhere in the middle between the Continentals I am running and the Direzza Star Spec on my friend's M3.
How does the chassis rigidity translate into the driving experience? The Z4M being about twice as rigid as the M3 must be really noticeable, I’m curious what kind of difference gets through to you.
It certainly is noticeable. Body flex becomes wasted movement in the chassis when asking the car to change direction or when going over bumps. So the more rigid chassis will always feel more immediate and direct from your inputs, which translates to a better, more enjoyable driving experience if that makes sense.
@@TheSlipAngle Makes total sense! I drive an IS300 with a chassis from 1998, so I definitely know what wasted movement feels like. I feel like I feel it the most when coming out of a drift with not exactly the right steering angle. The car seems to wobble and twist back to center. Is that what you’re describing?
-2.2 up front and -1.5 rear. It's mostly just the Continental DWS not up to the task. I had Pilot Supersports on it prior and they were noticeably more grippy.
R888s are very difficult to get into their operating temperature range on the street and in fact would be beat out by most modern 200 tw tires in a street scenario. But to answer your question, no, I don't have any desire to use this car for any form of competition whatsoever, so the amount of grip that the Conti's make on the street is plenty for me. I'd rather have a playful car then one I have to use speed and momentum to get some movement out of it on the street.
is this a drift vid ? like the guy said before they went out with the kid... "drive smooth". Looks like fun but, if this is to show which car is faster, better... this type of driving is not how to show which car is superior... but like I said, looks like fun.... edit: oh I get it now, "the slip angle", carry on brotha!
E46M3s/e92M3s are on every track accross Europe! Especially Germany and our Nürburgring, Hockenheimring. (Team Schirmer) builds monster M3s that's just suspension and they destroy all those high HP cars. another is DM Performance from France..
The Z4M and all other BMWs use McPherson strut front suspension. Double A arm or double wishbone is more commonly used in sports cars because out of the box they typically generate more mechanical grip and have camber adjustments via eccentric bolts in the control arms. As a result of that grip though, the more edgy they become at the limit of grip, so balancing them sometimes takes a little more effort. At the end of the day, either layout can be setup to generate max grip or to have blissful balance or to drift. So when I was making the reference with the Z4, all I am saying is that out of the box the Z4 is easier to slide around and balance without having to be as frantic behind the wheel as I am with my shorter wheel base, double A arm cars.
Yes, there is horsepower to be gained, however like any motor that is more efficient out of the box, there is less on the table vs something like an LS motor that has horrible out of the box HP per liter efficiency.
On a track, doing cartoon driving with tires not up to the job, sliding and goofing. No warm tires in the first lap and talking about sliding. Yeah. Cartoon fun-house stuff.
Dude, great vid but whats wrong with your z. I guess you were on a tiny track or something. Probably tires I think cause: ruclips.net/video/SD8JERvZlDE/видео.html Great chase vid. Fun starts half the way through.
There is nothing wrong with it. I have 360 TW Continental summer tires on. They aren't setting any lap records that's for sure. Tire compound is everything.
Hey, thanks for taking the time to reply. I understand about the tires. I own the Z to and love watching what others are up to. Thanks for the great vids!
You're the real deal brotha. You drive your cars hard. Putting those 1mil sub car youtubers to shame.
Thanks man! 👍👍👍
facts.
Dude, you're the man. I wish more people on youtube spoke about these things! Loving the content. Actual car talk - not about their preferred interior stitching
Thank you Gerard! 👍
Do more with the Z4M. I also have one and love it. Checked out some of your older vids before I bought mine.
Awesome man! 👍
Loved the kid offering to put his booster seat in.
He didn't think he'd need it but if you want me in it to make this happen I'm easy.
Total Faith.
Keep driving and more importantly keep inspiring that kid.
Luv and Peace.
Sick video mate! Keep it up. We need more Z4M and E46M films. Keep them coming!👍🏾👌🏾
Thank you Wain 👍
Two of the best cars ever built!!!
Preach it! :)
Love my Z4m roadster, you’ve tempted me to take it on a track day!
Highly enjoyable to watch. Life is better sideways. Never sell it. I use my Z4M for gripping the Ring. My Z3QP I use to hoon ... Cheers
Thanks bud 👍👍👍. One of my bucket lists items is to come drive the Nurburgring in someday in something German, RWD and some power behind it.
Not sure why its kept mentioned theyre not fast sports cars , with few tweaks they still do phenomenal results at Nurburgring or similar layout tracks. fantastic driving OP. Well done .
I didn't mean it like they are not fast in general. It was more about overall ethos for their tuning approach. They give up some performance for comfort, but that is not a bad thing. I love that about these cars. These cars have great top end so if you keep them in the power band and have grippy tires and some suspension setup they can put down some pretty good lap times for sure.
...pure pleasure listening and watching to you being so open and honest, and of course hard driving, respekt from a e39 m5/ e46 m3 fanatic from Germany
Thank you! 👍
Z4M in my opinion is BMW M division's last great car. Its almost like they told the accounting department to go fuck themselves at the Christmas party. The new M cars are faster and more refined but they lack why we bought them in the first place. The spirit of the drive. Despite moving on to several M cars since, I cannot replace the "feeling" the Z4M gave me back in those days. Once the kids grow up I full intend to get a Z4M once more. Great Driving Skills! You know the car, the tires, the limits. Awesome.
Thank you Sir! I agree with everything you said. 100P
Man I bought a z4 coupe (sport trim) in part due to your videos. Couldn’t afford the M so I just have to imagine it sounds as good as yours but what an awesome car.
I love it.
Right on!
.Hey great vid Garage Quin Motors! Really liked the side by side comparison and you nailed it when you said "That's what these cars are for" Just taking them out and Hooning them for a bit". Having a good time with pushing yourself and the cars capabilities while having that bond man with machine as well as your buddy! Great stuff man! That's what it's all about for those of us that can't race for the big time money etc.Love both cars!! Two of my very favs. I've got a M3 e46 but love the look of the Z4M.
Thanks Greg and awesome!
This content is amazing brother! I look forward to your vids more then any other car channel. Real. Raw. Fun
Thanks man! 👍
NOW THAT"S HOW YOU DO A REAL REVIEW. NOT LIKE ALL THE OTHERS WITH, NOTHING BUT TALKING ALL DAY
Thank you Sath 👍
It looked amazing watching the M cars dancing on the track!!!
Thanks Sam! 👍
Adjusting the seat belt constantly. Found myself in your "moving the seat belt away from the neck" motion ;)
One of the biggest annoyances with the Z4.
Would love to see a more fair comparison with an m3 with same tyres and no brake or engine mods.
Yea just going to baby it around the track :doriftooooooo:
woops lol
Great content!! Very informative, This is what we want to see... lots of cross referencing driving attributes with other cars. The battle was great to see to. Good to see a vast variety of cars lately. Better than watching Motortrend Head to Head! as it is more entertaining, informative & more honest. You should consider testing some high powered all motor American cars that supposedly handle really well, such as Gen 5 Z28, GT350R, C6 Z06 & Gen 6 SS 1LE or even the crazy ZL1 1LE if you can get your hands on them & maybe at a different (larger) location. That would be great to see.
Really enjoyed watching that! Both are very well balanced cars and you drove them like they should be driven!
Thanks bud 👍
Great car control and looks like you enjoyed the two cars. Is all the tail hanging out and wheel spin the fastest way around?
Thanks man. No, the wheel spin and drifting is certainly costing time if you were trying to set a time. Quick slip angles are fine if the car is rotating when exiting the corner, but anything more than that is wasted motion and causes loss in time.
Can you explain the differences in driving dynamics with a double A-arm car vs other types of suspension set-ups?
Damn, this whole time I've been thinking that the Z4 was way lighter and with the same motor would spank my ass, so every time I saw one I wouldn't dare race em because well, I hate losing. Next time I see one I hope to have some good spirited fun. Thanks for the video and sweet driving.
I think it's about 120 lbs difference. So it's something but nothing monumental. A bolt on or two on the E46 would probably guarantee the victory in a straight line.
"95 out of 10" i think you have just made another one of us car guys. lol
lol
I loved the duel. The E46M3 is my fave M car. And I was planning on getting one. Now you’ve left me all confused and shit. I’m 6ft2. How easily can I fit into a Z4M without knocking my knees about constantly and banging on the roof liner too?
One day I’ll own both. My favorite bmws. Got a 435i and a z4 3.0i at the moment
Do you think that the z4 coupe 3.0 si (the non M 260hp one) would have better turn in and overall better front grip having a mich lighter engine (aluminium and magnezium block)?
I mean less weight on the tires means they do not have to work as hard and will not be overloaded as easy, so it might be slightly better. However engine placement matters as well and both of these platforms have the engine extended well past the shock towers, so no matter how you dice it, the center mass of the engine is directly over the front axle. This is why cars like the Honda S2000 and FD RX-7 are front mid-ship layouts to overcome this, putting the engine behind the shock mounts and moving that mass more towards the center of the car.
+Garage Quinn Motors do you think that the e46 m3 has better front grip/understeers less than the e86?, engine placement looks similar on both, suspension is very similar, the only real difference betwin the two beeing wheelbase and track. Correct me if Im wrong
I would say if you did instrumented testing with same tire compound and alignment, the Z4M would understeer slightly less due to the 50/50 weight distribution, more rigid chassis and 120 lbs less curb weight. It wouldn't be a monumental difference by any means, but those small advantages should equate to slightly better out of the box performance on the Z4M.
+Garage Quinn Motors Thanks for the answer man, I really apreciate it !
Great Driving Skills
By chance do you know What kind of lap times did these cars get? As to compare to you’re recent Miata, Mr2 etc lap times! Thank you for the great content
So, if you were going for quickest lap times and had the same style tires, which would have the quickest times?
How does the Z4M compare to the J32 Miata you drove? I have a Miata right now and thought about J32 swapping it but a Z4M would be less money.
Two completely different cars. The Z4M is like a small grand touring car. and drive's like one where a Miata will always feel like a grassroots tuner car. The Miata will always be way more agile and light on its feet vs the Z4M
@@TheSlipAngle what about the Z4M vs RX8 strictly in the handling department? I’m getting a bit tired of the small size and unrefinemnet of my NA8.
Have you ran this car with stickier tires yet? If so did the front nose do better with it’s under steer?
Yes, I had Pilot Supersports on it previously and the grippier compound reduced suspension movements quite a bit. I didn't go with them again because they chunked apart horribly last time I brought them to Lime Rock and tried to shoot video. The grip levels of those was somewhere in the middle between the Continentals I am running and the Direzza Star Spec on my friend's M3.
How does the chassis rigidity translate into the driving experience? The Z4M being about twice as rigid as the M3 must be really noticeable, I’m curious what kind of difference gets through to you.
It certainly is noticeable. Body flex becomes wasted movement in the chassis when asking the car to change direction or when going over bumps. So the more rigid chassis will always feel more immediate and direct from your inputs, which translates to a better, more enjoyable driving experience if that makes sense.
@@TheSlipAngle Makes total sense! I drive an IS300 with a chassis from 1998, so I definitely know what wasted movement feels like. I feel like I feel it the most when coming out of a drift with not exactly the right steering angle. The car seems to wobble and twist back to center. Is that what you’re describing?
Why do you think the front is bitter on the m3?
I’ll take 3280 pounds in 2024. Thanks. 😂
Dat casual 911 slam though! ;)
lol
Which one is your favorite?
Dude, where is this magical place?! I'd love to come to spectate/get motivation to finish my s14 build. Also, great car control 👍🏿
Lime Rock Park
Haha no third gear required :D
Great video! Looks like the perfect track to hoon too!
Thanks Michael. Yes, it is an awesome little venue :)
Great video! You could benefit with a short shift kit in the Z4M.
Thank you 👍
How much/little camber do you use upfront? Mine did get much more bite with some negativity..
I use Michelin’s tho, might be another difference
-2.2 up front and -1.5 rear. It's mostly just the Continental DWS not up to the task. I had Pilot Supersports on it prior and they were noticeably more grippy.
Ok! Have you considered Toyo R888 or the like for this car? You could use them on your OEM rims I suppose
R888s are very difficult to get into their operating temperature range
on the street and in fact would be beat out by most modern 200 tw tires
in a street scenario. But to answer your question, no, I don't have any desire to use this car for any form of competition whatsoever, so the amount of grip that the Conti's make on the street is plenty for me. I'd rather have a playful car then one I have to use speed and momentum to get some movement out of it on the street.
Garage Quinn Motors Oh absolutely, I would never use my 888’s on the street, or even Nürburgring (which is a ”long fast street”). Just for track
Just rewatched this very enjoyable film, makes me really want to try an e46 M3
phenomenal video, more of this content please
Thank you!
another awesome video! thanks..
Thank you! 👍
I wanted a raw comparison not mostly personal opinion and a mod vs stock situation
They both won!!!! 🇩🇪💪 😘 BAYERISHE MOTOREN WERKE☝
Nice driving buddy!! Cool video
Thank you!
How'd the tires look?!
They held up good actually!
is this a drift vid ? like the guy said before they went out with the kid... "drive smooth". Looks like fun but, if this is to show which car is faster, better... this type of driving is not how to show which car is superior... but like I said, looks like fun.... edit: oh I get it now, "the slip angle", carry on brotha!
When do we get to see your new car?
I didn't get anything new yet. I'm actually trying to demonstrate restraint and use the money towards something more productive lol
E46M3s/e92M3s are on every track accross Europe! Especially Germany and our Nürburgring, Hockenheimring. (Team Schirmer) builds monster M3s that's just suspension and they destroy all those high HP cars. another is DM Performance from France..
They are definitely special cars!
Found it!! Thanks 👍
Can you explain the double A arm comments? Vs. what?
The Z4M and all other BMWs use McPherson strut front suspension. Double A arm or double wishbone is more commonly used in sports cars because out of the box they typically generate more mechanical grip and have camber adjustments via eccentric bolts in the control arms. As a result of that grip though, the more edgy they become at the limit of grip, so balancing them sometimes takes a little more effort. At the end of the day, either layout can be setup to generate max grip or to have blissful balance or to drift. So when I was making the reference with the Z4, all I am saying is that out of the box the Z4 is easier to slide around and balance without having to be as frantic behind the wheel as I am with my shorter wheel base, double A arm cars.
ayy homeboy is mean muggin at 17:50 lol represent
Can't find the first song you mentioned : (
freemusicarchive.org/music/Ketsa/5th_Cycle/Beautiful_Rain
excellent driving bro,very quick reflexes
Thanks man 👍
Can you uncork the s54 in the z?
Yes, there is horsepower to be gained, however like any motor that is more efficient out of the box, there is less on the table vs something like an LS motor that has horrible out of the box HP per liter efficiency.
brilliant!
Thank you!
That airbox sounds unholy
It was pretty awesome. I thinks I neeeeed lol
Same here. If only it didn't cost $3k lol. Isn't there a plenum that attaches before the filter too? Is that left off for more sound?
Yes and yes ;)
That is not the fastest way around a track.
Okay thanks for the pro tip
drift beamer :)
:)
Conti DWS on track?! rofl.
On a track, doing cartoon driving with tires not up to the job, sliding and goofing. No warm tires in the first lap and talking about sliding. Yeah. Cartoon fun-house stuff.
You’re a good driver dude! Not fake like all the other youtuber gays
Thanks Jason, I really appreciate that!
Garage Quinn Motors Would you recommend the E46 M3 or the Z4M?
Dude, great vid but whats wrong with your z. I guess you were on a tiny track or something. Probably tires I think cause:
ruclips.net/video/SD8JERvZlDE/видео.html
Great chase vid. Fun starts half the way through.
There is nothing wrong with it. I have 360 TW Continental summer tires on. They aren't setting any lap records that's for sure. Tire compound is everything.
Hey, thanks for taking the time to reply. I understand about the tires. I own the Z to and love watching what others are up to. Thanks for the great vids!
Ok you really need to record better, watching this almost made me dizzy