Unison Tom Interval Tuning - Easy, Reliable, Versatile | Season Four, Episode 47
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 10 сен 2024
- Unison tuning, or batter and reso tuned to the same pitch, is something that seems to throw a lot of people off in concept. If you’ve spent any amount of time experimenting with tuning, you’ve likely figured out some intervals that you prefer with your drums. Today we wanted to demonstrate what a unison tuning can sound like in comparison to an alternative interval as well as the juxtaposition of different intervals for different drums.
PATREON:
This season is made possible by our Patreon supporters. Join us on Patreon for access to exclusive content such as Cymbal Sounds, our long awaited cymbal series, and MUCH more: sladl.ink/Patreon
PRODUCTION PARTNERS:
GIK Acoustics (sonic treatment): sladl.ink/GIK
AKG Audio (microphones): sladl.ink/AKG
Evans Drumheads: sladl.ink/Evan...
ProMark Drumsticks: sladl.ink/ProM...
Signal chain:
Mics - Focusrite Clarett 8Pre USB & OctoPre - MacPro w/Pro Tools 12.8
Recorded at 48kHz / 24bit
Overheads: (Matched Pair in Glyn Johns - Cardioid) AKG C314 sladl.ink/C314...
Toms: AKG C518M sladl.ink/C518M
Kick Drum: AKG D12vr sladl.ink/AKGD...
No EQ or compression in use with drum demos unless otherwise noted
Acoustic Treatment:
GIK 242 Acoustic Panels: sladl.ink/GIK242
GIK 4A Alpha Pro Series Diffusor/Absorber: sladl.ink/GIK4...
GIK Evolution PolyFusor Combination Sound Diffuser/Absorber: sladl.ink/GIKE...
GIK Tri-Trap Corner Bass Trap: sladl.ink/GIKT...
Drums:
Pearl Masters Maple Custom Extra w/Ludwig LM400 70’s Supraphonic
Cymbals:
22” Jesse Simpson Clone of old Zildjian A, 14 Jesse Simpson old K Clone over Zildjian Prototype New Beat top
Drumheads:
Snare: Evans G12 / Snare Side 300
Toms: Evans G1 Coated / G1 Clear
Kick Drum: Evans UV EMAD / EQ3 Coated White Reso
Hosted by: Cody Rahn
Production & Consulting: Ben O'Brien Smith @ Cadence Independent Media
👂🏼👉🏼🥁
Leave your questions, comments, suggestions, requests down below and don't forget to subscribe!
*NOTE: Troll comments will be deleted. You're welcome to disagree with whatever you like but let's keep the conversation civilized and focused on drums.
--------------------------
Sounds Like a Drum is a CADENCE INDEPENDENT MEDIA production
For more information, visit www.cadenceindependent.com
Follow us on Instagram: / soundslikeadrum
Like us on Facebook: / soundslikeadrum
![“Fixing” Your Snare Sound [Step by Step] | Season Five, Episode 40](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/xosBfmxmm40/mqdefault.jpg)
Same pitch is great for toms and medium tunings but the floor toms loose projection when tuned super low. I'd rather tune the bottoms of floor toms up just to give them more presence. I've used unison tuning for a long time and I think it works well for when you tune the drums and muffle them because they give a very strong fundamental with no pitchbend. Overtime I've learned to use the top head to give the base pitch of the drum and use the bottom to control the darkness and brightness of the drum.
I think there may be a fundamental misconception in your thinking - check carefully what he says roundabout the 5:20 mark. Both heads are responsible for the pitch - if you tune up the bottom head for, in your words, 'brightness', the pitch of the drum will go up. Whatever pitches you have for the individual heads when isolated, the whole drum will resonate at one fundamental pitch that is a product of the two heads when hit under normal conditions.
@@frasermcallister6058 yes you're absolutely right. You can have the same fundamental pitch of the drum on two drums with dramatically different timbres. That's why drums are such a fascinating instrument to tune and record ♡♡♡
I like what you said about not having to have the same intervals on your rack tom as your floor tom. Ive found with different kits there's different sweet spots for each drum. For instance i have 10,12, and 14 inch toms and the 10 and 14inch drum love to be tuned with different pitches on each side but the 12 inch will choke out unless bot heads are the same exact pitch. Fascinating stuff
I was going to say something similar. I remember coming to the realization that rack toms and floor toms are different instruments and they should be treated as such.
Yes! I’ve been tuning my tom’s like this for years. It’s the only way I can get the sound I hear in my head.
"It'll tear apart the fabric of the universe!" 😂😂😂😂😂
I've been using unison tuning for so many years. I tried other tunings and I came back to what I'm used to.
I have an old bebop Gretsch kit 12" and 14" and it always sounded good and at my age I'm not really open to new changes !!! Cheers
I am the type of drummer that like the deeper tones on the toms and I have relied most on the combination of the heads that I use for batter or reso and even I tune them to a "prescribed" tuning I usually change everything to where I like the sound better.
Another thing is that I used to tune my drums at home and bring them to church and there I usually need to work on tuning the drums again because of the size of the room variable.
In this video you share information I had not heard before and it widens the perspective that there's not a right or wrong...just be open minded to new ideas and let the sound of your drum guide you.
Thank you and look forward to hearing more interesting information from you all.
Blessings to all!!
I feel like a key takeaway from many of his videos is the same: if it sounds good, if it feels good, it is good. And that’s something that bears repeating. Drums are music, and music is about how we want to sound and feel. Everything else is secondary to that.
This all resonates (excuse the pun) with what I have found over years of playing and tuning drums. Nice to hear it from someone else.
Hi Cody! First of all, I am OBSESSED with this channel. You have completely become my drum tuning sherpa and have opened my mind to so many different approaches to tuning my kit. I loved this video, as usual, but I would like to ask two questions/make two requests.
1. I think it would be helpful when you say that you tuned a drum to a specific interval (in this case, the perfect 4th), that you hit both the batter & reso heads before you demo them.
2. Could you talk a little more about how to compensate for the different head masses, if you're using a denser head on either the batter or reso?
Again, amazing stuff. Instant subscriber when I found the page. Thank you for all you do 🙏
Excellent episode! I have found (and not as a golden rule, just a tendency) a unison tuning works particularly well with higher tensions (think bop tuning), and lower tensions on the same drum tend to fare well with intervals of a third and higher. Of course this is subjective, but experimentation can help us discover what we like!
Best drum channel on youtube hands down!!! And you guys have killer cymbals!!! That ride!!! I just ordered a 20inch trans stamp clone 1599gram Funch ride!!! THE HOLY GRAIL!!!! 😁🥁❤😁🥁❤😁🥁❤
Another FANTASTIC episode.
This brought me to an idea--what about an episode on tuning for playing outside? I so often find that my bass drums and tom toms can sound in-tune and rad indoors but need to be tuned higher and closer to unison outside. Would you guys consider doing an episode on that, especially with the summer months of outdoor gigs just around the corner?
Glad to hear it! Doing an episode on tuning for outdoors would be tricky for us, as it would likely require us to be outdoors in order to do the topic justice and that quickly turns into a major logistical challenge. We'd love to do a whole series of videos that would require remote production but we'd need significantly more support from the community on Patreon in order to make that possible.
Husbands a mechanic and said old tuning is almost a lost art. It’s like building an engine, if you use your own intuition on tightening nuts and bolts, you can get close but the torque wrench equals everything in unison to perfection. And he plays drums, drum, heads, and rings make a difference also, he’s always experimenting with his drum set. He doesn’t really care for unison tuning for studio, but, for open arena or outside, unison sounds great
My Pearl Masters Premium Maple absolutely sings with clear Ambassadors top and bottom in unison tuning, and records beautifully with unison tuning + e-rings... but on every other kit and with every other head combination, I prefer some kind of interval and a bit of detune growl.
Well spoken! 100% agree with everything. You mentioned different bearing edges. At my venue, our house kit is a Pearl Reference Pure. No mics except the bass drum. I tune the resos to a Perfect 4th higher on the 16 13 and 12. The 10 sounds better at a Minor 3rd because of the pitch bend. It just sounds cooler to me and it doesn't choke the drum. It's easy to choke a 10 and/or 8. They gotta breath!
When I play at other venues, I have to use their house kits. Japan is like that. The reality is that time is limited to experiment so I use the above mentioned formula with my predetermined pitches and intervals. And in reality, it works 9 out of 9 times. And it always sounds better than whatever it was before.
Given a decent amount of time in a venue, studio, or at home, you are absolutely right to say that one must consider the music AND the room. I don't like unison tuning, but am totally willing to experiment if I needed to. It's always about the music first. I hope this video opens many minds. Having watched this channel for a long time, I'm totally indoctrinated into it's philosophy. Because it really works to experience change. That's also what our music is about, right? Right!
It’s an eternal nightmare so many product to try with diff music situation cost a fortune but i love it 👏👏👏🤟🏻🤟🏻🥁🇨🇦
The Perfect 4th interval sounded best to my ears. Wonky overtones were much reduced. Those overtones might be desirable in an un-mic'd situation so they have their place but I definitely preferred the cleaner, shorter note produced when the resonant head was pitched up.
Myself, I use a tune-bot and tune the heads a 4th apart and each individual drum (10-12-14) a 4th apart. Sounds killer. I'll occasionally use a 5th between batter and resonant heads for a bit more sustain and resonance but generally stick to 4ths between individual drums. I play Gretsch Renown RN2s and they're super resonant.
Great content as always, and I learn something new every time I tune in. Thanks for this!
I have a Renown in 13, 16 and 24. I am tempted to try the perfect 4th. Are you tuning the reso higher than the batter? I see in your comment that you prefer the reso pitched up.
Hey Matt. Yes, I prefer the resonant head tuned higher than the batter which is pretty standard. I use a tune-bot to establish the overall pitches for each head and then I use the 'Resonant Tuning' feature of the iDrumTune Pro app to dial in the interval between heads. The app recommends the 1.5 ratio by default which is a Perfect 5th but I much prefer the 1.34 ratio which is a Perfect 4th. The Renowns sound killer with either one but the P4 interval between heads shortens the sustain a little and as you know, Renowns have sustain to spare. Good luck!
@@bakedalaska4363 cool thanks!
I love this channel. 🖤
Bro you look dope with the handlebar stache
I always tune to same pitch with coated ambassadors on both batter and reso. Both high and medium tunings. Drums sound great.
fantastic as always, guys! Very informative with awesome demonstrations. I appreciate all of the work that you do.
Yeah man truly well put together info. Excellent
i have 10x10, 12x12 and 16x16 toms
With tune bot I go unison: 247 Hz; 190Hz and 100Hz.
Works fine
That's quite the jump with the m7th between the 16" and 12", though it makes sense for the sizes. Out of curiosity, what are you using for batter and reso heads?
@@SoundsLikeADrum ec2 clear top, genera resonant bottom.
The thing I am not pro at tuning drums, but tuning 16th tom higher makes it sound more "jazzy", while I prefer more rock\metal oriented
Great video as always!
Bob Gatzen has been a big influence on how I tune drums, and he advocated unison tuning for toms. Recently though, I've been adopting Nolly's method of tuning the tom heads to a minor third - tuning the reso side to the desired note, then tuning the batter to a minor third below it. However, you actually tune a half step below your desired pitch to account for the strike of the stick sharpening the note of the drum. I found though through my testing that the 16" floor tom had too much bend in the note as it decayed, so perhaps for that drum a unison tuning would be more appropriate.
Cool stuff! As always
I seem to always have the reso on my floor tom higher than the batter (currently it's about a M3 or P4 higher), but with my rack tom, it honestly doesn't matter to me if the reso is slightly higher, the same, or slightly lower (within a M2 in either direction). As long as there isn't a weird interaction that chokes the sound, the differences aren't big enough to matter IMHO.
I would suggest that especially for Higher Tunings IT might make Sense to tune the reso lower than the batter since the Air Inside the shell has more space to vibrate instead of choking the reso head by Air pressure when you hit those accents.
I like unison tunings due to increased resonance of the drum. To me it speaks the longest. Especially in higher tunings. Your thoughts?
I t would be great if you could put up the information just as a overlay of what pitch the drum is and what each drum tuning interval is: eg- (E Batter over G Resonant) Major third and fundamental frequency. Makes it easier for novices like me to what you are doing :)
Great topic and excellent points. Would be nice to hear the tunings from a room mic as well as from the tom mics.
personally not how i tune them, but if it sounds good to your ear and the drum set your playing go for it
Hey Cody! I thought you might consider an EP of failed drum gimmicks that have come and gone. Not all failed ofcourse, but never caught on or whatever. Like the tilted riser, Tama drumdial, etc. Keep them vids coming!!
I really like the unison tuning on my Masters MMX. It feels like the "purest" tuning and gives me great consistent tones. However, now I really want to try out the perfect fourth to hear the diffence myself.
Don't just check out the perfect fourth- experiment with different intervals on each of the drums. It makes sense that not all drums will sound alike with the same interval between batter and reso, particularly if the depth to diameter ratio difffers.
There is a surprising lack of information on tuning 5 lug toms. I have a 2008 Renown that I constantly fight with myself when tuning the 10 and 12 because of their weird 5-lug design. Any tips for those??
There's not a whole lot that's different with 5-lug drums in terms of the approach to tuning. The key (as with all drums) is to be cognizant of making small, incremental adjustments in tension. The less lugs, the more each lug impacts the tension of the drumhead. Working with two keys to tension the farthest opposing lugs simultaneously will help to distribute tension more evenly but, still, you'll want to keep those to very small turns to gradually bring the drumhead up to pitch.
I never knew what I was doing was called unison. Of course I'm using ec2's top and bottom but I always tune to the drum and it just comes out that way and that's the way it sounds best to me.
Yep! The interval is called a unison (same pitch).
You should do another video about high reso/ low batter vs low reso/ high batter for low and medium tuning. You've covered low reso for high bebop tuning. I used to tune my batter higher than reso at a medium low to low tuning. Seems like it's more sketchy to have a bigger interval with high batter/low reso. So I started doing it the other way
How do you decide which pitch to aim for with each drum? I’ve heard and tried a few different ideas related to the natural pitch of the shell, but I was curious if you personally like to factor that in?
Thanks for another great video 👍 never really used unison tuning, but this got me inspired to try it out. By the way, did you ever test the Benny Greb floor tom tuning?
I'm surprised you said you hear more attack with the heads tuned in unison. One of the reasons (I thought) people tune at intervals like a 3rd, 4th, or 5th is for more attack, while unison has less attack but more projection and sustain.
Curious, have you noticed that the uv heads have a little more attack than the standard G1?
Yep! It's different film + different coating so, while it's still a single-ply drumhead, it's a different animal.
I’ve been using unison tuning for a couple decades… clear emperors on batter and reso… all toms tuned pretty low, and it sounds mean and nasty… very Pantera-esque. HOWEVER, I recently figured out that my floor toms, 14” and 18” sound a little bit better with clear ambassador resos tuned to Perfect 4th intervals… what I’ve known as the Nolly Tuning. But my rack toms sound better with low unison tuning with emperors top and bottom. I don’t know if it has to do with shell depth or diameter… but I will experiment until I find out… I’m guessing it has to do with depth.
My next experiment is to see if clear G2s sound good with this tuning scheme, because I am so tired of Remo’s terrible quality control.
That’s crazy. I just switched back to Remo because the Evans dented when I tuned them the first time I tuned them. I hit with authority but don’t dent heads or break sticks. Don’t make things like they used to is what us old guys say.
Awesome 👍
When we are dealing with double ply tops, single ply bottoms, is unison going to be same pitch or same tension?
That's a great question and I think points to the lack of understanding of this "out there". I think many times drummers say "equal tension", when what they mean is "equal pitch", because really, how can you measure tension per se? Even with a Drum Dial the head thickness plays a part in how it reads. So...there's probably not a single, precise answer to your question, but I would think "unison" refers to pitch, so the double ply would have a higher tension than the single ply bottom to achieve that. My 2 cents ;)
Let’s say you have Emperors on batter and reso with unison tuning… if you change out the reso for an ambassador, but tune it to the same pitch as you had the Emperor, the drum will sound exactly the same, except have a tiny bit more sustain. And as the chosen pitch for both heads gets lower, the difference n sustain will be less and less.
@@BeatsAndMeats True. Also, that same pitch with ambassador will require less "tension" to achieve.
TL;DW: Don't buy into prescriptive tunings. If it sounds good, it is good.
I tune them the same and then bring up the reso about a quarter turn.
Gregg Bissonnette advocates same pitch tuning. So......
i prefer the first setting sound
That’s the unison tuning for both toms.
I'm not a fan of unison tuning because the drums end up sounding like a basketball, giving a very unnatural sound to my ears. I prefer to tune the resos high and the batters low on my toms and bass drum. That's where the drums really sing. The snare is the only one where I reverse the order and tune my batter higher than the reso.
Did you think that these drums sounded like basketballs here?
First!
Thanks for being quick to watch & comment! If you enjoy the episode, be sure to share with a drummer friend and let us know what your experience has been with unison tom tuning. Cheers!