Zen or Hip? (ifi review / comparison)
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- Опубликовано: 20 окт 2024
- I’ve been testing out a couple of ifi products lately. In this video I compare the ifi Zen DAC and ifi Hip DAC, and let you know what my experience was using each of these devices. My preference was for the Hip, but there are definitely some reasons why someone might want the Zen instead.
Here’s links to stuff mentioned in the video (some are affiliate):
Ifi Hip DAC: amzn.to/3vXfuJu
Ifi Zen DAC: amzn.to/31trRyZ
iPhone OTG Cable: amzn.to/3cjseSR
Ifi Power Supply: amzn.to/3d80uQj
Cheap Power Supply I think would work: amzn.to/3fcD0fC
4.4 to dual XLR (if you’re thinking about using the Zen as a balanced DAC): amzn.to/3da6hoC
As usual, I’d also recommend looking for used options at:
Head-Fi: www.head-fi.org/
HifiGuides: forum.hifiguid...
The "Power Match" feature is simply a gain switch for high/low gain.
That may be why you had issues with not being able to use the volume range of these devices and the Zen Dac's ability to drive more demanding headphones...
Love all your reviews. Sincere and honest. 🙏 Keep up the great work. 😀
I have my ZEN DAC stacked and connected via the 4.4 balanced out to an ifi ZEN CAN. Now that is how you utilize ifi's hardware. Advantage of the CAN is use any headphones for different music, etc.
Thanks just subscribed, good open review. The issue I have with the ifi entry end lineup is that the hipdac has no line out. If you want a portable device at this sort of price, it has no Airplay or Bluetooth and if I want a desk system I have to buy the zen dac which is almost identical and then the zen can. What I would want is to buy the hipdac and walk around with it then drop it on the desk and plug it into the zen can as a DAC. Fiio, xDuoo etc for similar price devices have line out capability.
I 100% support this statement. Of the ifi products I've tested, I like the sound of the Hip DAC the best (and I've got a Micro Black Label on my desk). If it had bluetooth, I would have kept it. If it had a line out, I would have kept it. If it had both...well, I would have definitely kept it. Also, a gain switch would have been good, like, a real gain switch instead of the iem match thing.
@@MrAyrit the matching thing is basically the gain switch, it’s supposed to have a gain stepping system but it dosent really so off for IEMS and on for 150ohm plus headphones I guess.I have a bid on eBay for one with some cosmetic scratching on volume pot for 70 that I will go for not the full price because of the lack of line out, it makes me suspicious of their motives tbh.
@@adrianmorrish8494 yeah, I just didn’t appreciate the “matching” system. I’d rather have a knob, and I didn’t feel it lowered the gain to the levels I wanted it to be. On all my headphones, I literally just barely touched the volume knob. I want to have more control than that.
100% agree.
The Line Out is very important, because it has much more power (and also higher voltage) than the standard Headphone Output, which allows you to connect the DAC to your integrated Amp at home. The standard Headphone Output is too weak for that, and so the volume will be too low.
Don’t you just hate it when The Wife Prints Something when you’re trying to drop knowledge on the Internets? SUBBED FOR THAT REASON ALONE!
Does these 2 amp/DACs change the frequency response/sound profile of the headphones your using?
I wondering because the hip dac have a warm sound and the dt770 which I am using with it have a somewhat cold sound profile!
Ifi is somewhat known for being a little warm but nothing that would cause any issues.
Agree with everything you said about zen dac. I had these exact same issues with it.
Thanks for weighing in. Always nice to hear that someone else has heard the same thing you did.
for anyone interested maybe power supply improves audio quality on Zen Dac v1 don't know but It Dosn't on Zen Dac v2 you don't need psu at all i tested several on my Zen Dac v2 no difference in sound quality at all
I've used my Zen Dac V2 for almost a year without an external power supply and been using it with the ifi Power adapter for almost 2 months now. The sound quality difference is not that much but I feel a bit darker background for the sound representation and the bass guitar and low thumping feels more visceral. Please take that with a hint of a salt though. The only noticeable difference would be it doesn't drains the battery of my mobile devices when connected with the power supply.
Great review!
Just wanted to know why double amping is frowned upon? I'm a newb so please bear with me.
I plan to use a qudelix 5k as a dac to source a zen can amp. Would that work well?
I believe the thought process is that each amp adds distortion, so if you double amp you end up amping distortion instead of a clean signal. To be real, a lot of amps are so clean any more, I honestly don't think it is probably as big of deal as it used to be, especially if you're starting with a clean amp. I haven't heard of the qudelix, I assume you want to use that so you can have bluetooth when you want it? What headphones are you trying to drive?
@@MrAyrit thanks again!
Yes I'd like the option to use the bt capability on it to source music from my phone.
I'm looking to drive the hifiman he 4xx. Probably a sundara in the future.
@@kabirdevnm4850 Sounds like as good a place to start as any. I don't know much about the qudelix 5k, but it looks like it's pretty well reviewed. The Zen Can is a solid amp. It's all subjective though, the main thing is trust your ears, and if you aren't enjoying yourself then make a change. If you are enjoying yourself, then don't let anyone tell you your set up isn't any good. It's all about what moves you.
@@MrAyrit haha sure noted. Appreciate your responses! :) cheers
excellent video
I have a doubt, I have the hifiman he400se and the sensitivity is 91dB and the impedance is 25 ohms and I have heard that they are very difficult to have a very high volume due to their low sensitivity of 91dB.
I want a dac / amp or audio interface that gives me a lot of volume more than 100% since I love listening to very loud songs and with excellent sound quality, which of all these do you recommend for my Hifiman and gives me too much power in volume:
the HiBy FD3 with balanced cable?, the iFi Hip-dac2 with balanced cable?, the RODE AI-1 usb-c audio interface?, the Audient iD4 MKII USB-C audio interface? the Audient EVO 4 audio?, and the Monolith Liquid Spark amp but just the amp using an RCA to USB cable?
I haven’t heard any of those but the liquid spark, but based on the last hip DAC, I’d probably go for the second gen of that. The 400se aren’t that hard to drive though.
powermatch is a gain switch. It helps with the volume range issue
Would you this would pair well with a set of hd560s running balanced? Or maybe a fiio q1 mk2?
I've been eyeing the btr5, but don't think I'd use the Bluetooth feature often.
Yep, I think that’d be a great pairing. Another viewer has said they thought the Hip DAC was a step up from the BTR5 with the 560s.
more than enough even on single ended
Quick question.
Do you think a btr5 can drive hd560s from single ended output ?
And between a hip dac and btr5 which one would you recommend as a portable source for hd560s ?
I can't make an ultimate comparison here, because I have since passed my 560s and BTR5 along. However, I can tell you that another viewer has passed along that see enjoyed the 560s on the BTR5, but did think there was a noticeable sound improvement with the Hip DAC. Personally, I believe the Hip DAC to be the better sounding device.... but the BTR5 is super convenient, and can drive the 560 just fine (even unbalanced). I believe this is a question of good sound quality and very convenient (BTR5) to better sound quality and less convenient. If you will be using it at your desk at all, I think the Hip DAC would be the better choice.
@@MrAyrit thanks for your detailed answer !!! Appreciated
@@sohailbarvar7817 You're welcome. I will be reviewing the Chord Mojo in the near future, and as I mentioned at the end of the video, if you've got the budget, that is a very very nice device.
@@MrAyrit unfortunately I wouldn't be able to stretch my budget that far but was hopping to get a unit which supports SPDIF input and can be used portable I guess my only options are : FIIO Q5S
IFI MICRO IDSD
CHORD MOJO
And they are all out of my budget (200$)
Probably I will end up buying a btr5 for now (my laptop sound card sucks) and add a desktop combo later on as it seems to be the better choice.
BTW it would be great if you make a video on what to look for when buying used audio gear.
U seem to be experienced in that regard I saw a used fiio q5s mentioned to be like new the other day for 200$ but couldn't verify if it sounded right or what should I even look for so I ended up skipping that.
@@sohailbarvar7817 That's a great idea for a video. Thanks for the input. You may want to check out this xduoo model if you're looking for optical: amzn.to/2PhFdLU -- I haven't used it personally, but I've heard good things about the xduoo products.
BTW unless your source can't output 5v through usb (iphone or ipad can't but a laptop certainly can ) there is no deference if you use zen dac with a power adapter or boss power, both in terms of sound and power output
Thanks for weighing in on this. I am just speaking from what I've heard other people comment on. I just know I was getting some very noticeable noise through my iPad OTG cable.
Thank you for sharing 🙏
Hey mate, do you happen to have heard the AP80 which you can compare to either of these? Thanks very much
Sorry, heard that one. Do you have a link?
What is the cheapest dac (destop or dongle) with good enough sound quality you recommend for iem exclusively. Thanks
I mean something like the qudelix 5k or btr3k would probably do the trick. Are you looking for cheaper than that?
@@MrAyrit no q5k seems a reasonable price, so ifi zen or hip offers no sound quality improvement over a q5k ?
Hi, how long does the battery last in the hip? And when you use it plugged in with usb drains the battery or passes it? Thanks, buena comparación!
Advertised battery life is 12 hours. I usually keep my stuff pretty well charged, so I didn’t test those limits, but it never died on me and I’d go several days without charging and a couple of hours of use. I found on the ifi site that it is always running off battery power, but you can charge at the same time, so I doubt you’d ever completely drain it if you are shutting it off when not in use. This is a big advantage over the BTR5 IMO, because that device could not run usb and charge at the same time.
Yes,, my concern is about the useful life of the battery but none of this is to use for a lifetime....thanks for the reply
I have the IFI hip Dac and DT990 Beyerdynamic 250 Oms not enough power it keeps Switching the music my IPhone 11 speakers instead of keeping the music on my headphoness. Iam still looking for something better that can power my headphones loud enough the IFI hop Dack not enough powerful it did sounded more louder than using speakers of IPhone 11 but not enough loudness. What amplifier will work better for my DT990 to use my IPhone?
I’m a big fan of the Chord Mojo. You can also look at something like the iFi Micro. Xudoo also has some pretty nice portable offerings.
Hi man ... thank you so much ... could you help me to understand how to buy a USED Chord MOYO online ... Is there more than one ...? I do not got it ... on line, but you can find it “NEW “ 400$ but the formal price is 650$... I mean how the price could be 400$ NEW ? Do you think maybe is better and save money for the IFI DIABLO? Appreciate it.
Yeah, I do have plans to make a video about buying used at some point, but I can give you a couple of pointers. I usually buy off of head-fi or the the hifiguides forum. With head-fi, sellers have feedback you can check. Usually, a seller will send you a Paypal invoice. When you pay, make sure you specify that you are purchasing a product, and that gives you protections through Paypal. I've had almost no issues purchasing like this. Typically people in the headphone hobby are really nice / helpful, and they take really good care of their gear (of course, there are exceptions).
As far as the Diablo, I haven't heard it, but I really doubt that you need to spend that much. If anything, I'd look at a used Micro. I just did a comparison between the Mojo / Micro that you may want to check out: ruclips.net/video/txZzEl6wC3M/видео.html
Subscribed!
Have one question though.
Among the below headphones which one do you think has better soundstage and which one needs amp/dac to use it to full potential.
1. ATH M50X
2. Beyerdynamic DT770 PRO (32 ohms, 88 ohms, or higher?)
3. MARSHALL Major 3 BT
4. ATH M40X
5. Hifiman 400i (2020 version)
6. Senheiser 560s
7. Beyerdynamic DT880 pro
8. Beyerdynamic DT990 pro
Dac/Amp:
1. Fiio BTR3K
2. Fiio BTR5
3. Ifi Zen Dac
4. Ifi Hip Dac
5. Topping BC 3
6. Topping L30
7. Fiio Q5
Please tell me the one best combination for the good soundstaging.
Okay, a lot to unpack here. Of the headphones, one of the Beyers is going to have the best soundstage. My preference between those is the 880, but remember it is open, so you'll hear things around you, and your audio will leak to the outside world. They will need an amp to drive them. For the Beyers, I'd skip any of the bluetooth players and go for the Zen, Hip, or L30 (but you'll need a DAC with that). A lot of people recommend the Liquid Spark stack for the Beyers, as it tames the highs a bit. Another choice to look at that will have smaller soundstage, but is a great and easy to drive headphone. I can confirm that it pairs well with the BTR5, but it will probably be pretty good off of pretty much anything. The Beyers will be more comfortable though, IMO.
@@MrAyrit so what's that other option!?
@@apaulmarshall what’s your use look like? Gaming? Have you looked at the TYGR? That’s my favorite Beyer all around, and easy to drive.
Also look at the SHP9600
@@MrAyrit not gaming. Jusstt music. Anything that gives life to the music that I'm listening to. Not for mixing, gaming, etc. Just a casual audiophile. Btw. Thank you so much for taking your time replying. A lot of respect.
Thanks!
Can the Hip Dac play music while charging the Battery at the same time?
Yes
do you have any suggestion for DT 880 pro ? (250 ohm)
I'd think that either would be fine.
iPhone OTG cable link is dead on Amazon. Any other options?
amzn.to/3F8Kfix
Try that one.
Could you please provide the name of the iPhone OTG Cable as your link is broken: @t
Yeah, I can't find the one I have. Here's a well-rated cheaper model: amzn.to/3zliTU1
or, here's the official Apple model: amzn.to/3wluq3U
Thanks from INDIA.
i have a 2.5mm balanced cable. If i buy hip dac, it comes with 4.4mm balanced output.
I found one 4.4mm to 2.5mm adapter online.
But, i am not sure if that works because, 4.4mm has TRRRS where as 2.5mm has TRRS.
can you please clarify my doubt?
I’d they are both balanced, I think you’ll be fine. I’ve got something like this, and it works fine: amzn.to/3AdGztF
@@MrAyrit i am using shanling ua2 portable inline Dac/ amp for my hifiman sundara, the volume is loud enough for me. It has ESS 9038Q DAC chip.Because, my dac/amp can provide 190mw, 2.5V @ 32 ohms.
I want to upgrade. Is the Hip dac a real upgrade for my sundara ? Can the sound be better with burr brown dac and high power amp ?
Thanks for the review 👍
does ifi hip dac work with phone or pc with empty battery with only otg?
I’m not 100% sure, but I believe that is the case.
Shame you never tried the external power supply on the Zen Dac. It really improves the sound and power compared with powering the device via USB.
I'm reaching out to iFi to maybe get the Zen DAC back to try with the Zen CAN, perhaps they will send one with an external power supply to try.
Was the ifi power adapter used ? Or just a normal power adapter. I can’t warrant spending all that money on a power supply if there is minimal difference
@@aaronwade2382 The original IFI IPower (The predecessor of the IPower 2) I still use this combo!
Do you know If It's possible to connect hip dac to another amp?
I’m sure it’s possible m, but I’m not sure if it would be recommended, as you’ll be double amping (although I’ve done things like this in the past, and thought it sounded fine). Basically, you’ll probably be introducing more distortion into your chain. What is your reasoning for doing it that way?
@@MrAyrit Because when I EQ, I need whole lot of power for headphones to sound decently loud.. and I use very easy to drive headphones(Austrian Audio hi x55 and AKG K550 mk2.)still they need more power.. I'm thinking to buy the hip dac to connect to xduoo xd 05 plus. I mean, I already connect a Topping NX4 to It and It sounds great with plenty of volume, but I also would like a little warmer sound, that's why I'm thinking about hip dac..
@@jimis3167 and you need it to be portable?
@@MrAyrit yes. No problem pairing hip dac with xduoo, I consider this portable..
@@MrAyrit Is It possible to connect hip dac's 4.4 out to xduoo's AUX IN? Can you link a cable which would work for this application?
Have any plan to review lcd-2c or lcd x??
Oh, I’m always open to possibilities. Currently have an isine 10, lcd fazor, Argons, k361, penrose....
LCD2 Fazor review has been filmed, but probably won't be released for a few weeks. I've got an offer for someone to lend me an LCD-X, but I've got other gear that I have purchased that I need to review first. So, maybe mid-summer on the LCD-X (if it happens).
@@MrAyrit I have the mobius got for 300 in sale, I like it in 24 x 96k hifi mode USB connected to my MacBook Pro makes me believe I would like the lcd’s if this is their house sound
@@adrianmorrish8494 I’m not sure the Mobius is their house sound. Not if it sounds like the Penrose anyway (review coming).
@@MrAyrit I have no idea how the Penrose sounds, I have heard it is tuned more specifically for gaming plus I don't think it has the DSP profiles of the Mobius but does have an eq
The extra power supply does not make any difference for the zendac according to all the reviews never tried it
Edit: unless you try to power it with a tablet or phone
Zen or schiit ?
Depends on what Schiit you’re talking about. If you’re talking modi/magni, that would probably be my preference.
You need to research the subject of power sources for audio devices, it is not incidental.
I know the basics. I did have a chance to try the new Zen DAC with the power supply, but I did not notice a huge improvement outside of it actually being able to run off a mobile device. I think what rubs me the wrong way in this instance is why not provide at least a basic power supply to start with if it is important to the performance.
your the first person to complain that the hip dac is too powerful
I guess I’m just a super quiet listener. I’ve had this problem with several different pieces of gear. Can only use like 10% of the volume range.
yes external power supply improve
I did not really find that it improved much, but it does allow for a better signal from a phone.