Unbelievable a video of a 23 minute video that has basically answered the question everyone wants to know about celestion guitar speakers. The only bit missing is where the Seventy 80 speakers sit because they’re common in a lot of affordable cabs and combos so giving reasons why you would want to change that kind of speaker would be helpful. I have started using redback speakers because I wanted to run a 100watt amp through a 1x12 cab it sounds fantastic and it replaced the Vintage 30 in there which I really didn’t like the sound. But your explanation has made me understand why I really like the redback is because it’s in the ballpark of the era of music I like to listen to. Excellent work this definitely needs to be on the celestion website.👍
I'm seriously sleep deprived and a bit dehydrated this morning, yet I'm at the edge of the seat; thank you so much for explaining what previously was an impenetrable mess to me!
This was exactly what RUclips was designed for. Right down to using a drum stick as your pointer. I would have gone to University if I could have learned useless-useful information like this.
I went to university and any stuff I learnt about this then (well actually it was more specifically learning bass playing and music) was extra-curricular. I presume having done a Mech Eng degree made it easier to learn this stuff later on! A
@@BarefacedAudio I went to music college but learnt everything I know from sound engineering and gigging in function bands in the evenings. I've run a musical instrument shop for a decade and I definitely never used anything from my further education in my day to day life. 🤷🏻♂️ Love your work... Will be buying a cab just as soon as I am working again.
Just what I have been looking for! Thanks for taking the time to make this video ... a fantastic and fascinating explanation. Going to need to watch this a couple of times to digest, but feeling a LOT more confident about speaker upgrading or choice. Brilliant.
Great video. Thoroughly agree with everything stated. I only have experience with the gold, 25w greenback, v-type, neo creamback, vintage 30 and G12T-75. I would add that the gold works really well in a deluxe reverb, 25w greenbacks seem to balance out only in a 4x12 and can sound harsh with high gain (but weirdly fine for fuzz), vintage 30s sound good in 1x12, 2x12 and 4x12 and produce decent cleans given how good they are for high gain but as many would agree the upper mids can be fatiguing. V-types are excellent for the price and provide a good balance for 'jack of all trades' amps like the DSL40CR. G12T-75s sound good in the Marshall 1960A cab with high gain but quite scooped in a mix and not great for cleans. The seventy 80 deserves all the hate it gets, the neo creamback has a bit too fast of a response and the G12 Neo Century Vintage is similar and overly bright (as seems to be the case for the newish Neo V type that there are about two demos of on all of RUclips). Need to get my hands on a blue, G12H anniversary and a G12H (55) (or four..) at some stage as well. Thanks for sharing your knowledge!
Have to stop the video half way through just to say a big tahnk you!!! I've been looking for information on speakers as I just got myself a cab and want to change it to better for my tubemeister deluxe 20 head. Such valuable information to me right now.
This was very useful. I've mostly known Vintage 30s or whatever my combos came with. Watching Johan Segeborn and his great experiments/demos on vintage cabinets have me asking myself some questions about sound level, smoothness, etc .. Looking into the idea of running in stereo a pair of Monoprice/HB 15w tube combos, much like Budda Guedes, and realizing that I have some more to learn of what would work well. Now I need to learn more of your products, since you do have a the clearest explanation of Celestions I've seen, which tells me you know your products and that is something I can stand behind.
Brilliantly explained, 10/10. It's rare to get an easy to follow but still informative video. I was actually excited learning this all. Celestion should be promoting this. Thanks
Great Video! A lifetime worth of very useful info in less than thirty minutes! Just as useful as "the talk" (birds & bees) me Pop gave me fifty years ago....
I purchased a reality 112FR today and then watched this video to understand different celestion speakers and its absolutely fantastic, not only do you know your stuff, you are a born teacher, very clear and concise. Thanks mate
Dude, this vid has given me a totally different perspective. I've been trying for a early 2000s v30-ish speaker quest. But I play at bedroom levels heavily attenuated. Now I kinda realize all the youtube vids with speaker sounds bites blasting their cabinets with 100w amps arent really what my setup needs or can replicate. Thank you very much.
Everyone's praise of the detailed and informative nature of this video is spot-on. I agree on the V30 and V-Type analyses completely. I mix them and they sound amazing.
Didn’t know anything about speakers and how they effect my sound before this video, other than that celestion is the standard. Just bought my first boutique amp head and have decided to build my own cab. This video is awesome and made everything in the decision process so much easier. Explaining in an understandable matter, while not compensating or cutting out technicality and information. Awesome video 👍.
I’m pairing a G12H30 70th Anniversary with a G12H-30 (55 Hz) in a 50 watt Ampeg Reverberocket 212 open-backed combo. Sounds great! Nice creamy mids with present lows and sweet highs with a bit of distortion from the Anniversary while the 55 Hz G12H is a basic straightforward balance across the frequencies Speaker that runs a bit cleaner and keeps the combo from sounding too gritty. Love it!
This video... is priceless!!!! Best damn explanation of Celestion speakers I've ever heard. Actually... one of the best explanations of guitar speakers... period. I wish you would do a video like this but with audio examples. It would honestly be my "greatest day of my life" dream to be able to have a single amp head, in the center of a room, with... 10-15 1x12 cabinets placed around the amp in an arch... with some kind of switchable junction box that allows me to run the head into each 12" speaker, one at a time. I've seen a lot of "shoot out" videos on RUclips that show... one or two Celestions A/B'd. But... the audio is usually rubbish, and it is usually not a very good comparison. Like... Neo 250 vs. AlNiCo Blue. If I had $100,000 to spend on Celestions, I'd buy one of each and make my dream video. Ha!!! Anyway... I digress like mad. Thanks man!!! Excellent excellent video!!!
This was excellent thank you, I'd love more audio electronics stuff from you guys. Intro to small signal design maybe? Chancing my arm a bit there! Thank you for this, very concise and not boring at all. But yeah whatever you upload I will watch
Have cabs fitted with G12-K100, V30, G12-T75 and a 2x15 with Celestion G15, 2x10 with G10s. Got every Celestion IR and own a Kemper. Nice roundup vid. Rolling off high end or paired with a dark amp and the Vintage 30 is nice allround speaker. I agree. It depends on the entire signal chain what speaker I choose - I like to blend the low end of a 15” with the articulation of a 12” or 10”. I play lower tunings mostly. Would love to try a Barefaced cab sometime, but have to get rid of stuff first before accumulating more gear. Wish you all the best with your channel and business.
this is the best explanation on youtube ever! ive swapped the stock speaker on a hot rod deluxe mk 3 to an alnico cream 90w and it turned out amazing, this was at my work on live gigs at a backline company so the amp is gigged with many guitar players and different styles and they all love it since it took the harshness away. at home i'm using 2 greenback heritage 20w with my 1974x and i love them thanks for an amazing and insightful video. btw here is my free tube tip: whatever amp you have it doesn't matter swap v1 to a vintage mullard it's under 100$ tested on ebay enjoy
Alnico Blue, Alnico Gold, Vintage 30, G12M Heritage, G12M-65, G12H(55) Her, G12H(75) Her, G12H-150 Red, G12-65. Seriously GOOD video on loudspeakers. Particularly when you explained how a single Redback will sound full like a 4x cabinet. I have all of the above speakers, but want to add a pair of 25w Greenbacks. A good 70s sound, for my 74 JMP.
I have two Cabs. My first cab is a marshal 2x12 with a mixture of vintage 30 and a heritage 30 which I use with my Marshall jvm. I have a barefaced 1x12 with a cream back 75 which I use with a victory v40. I play blues funk soul and blues in an 8 piece band. When playing the guitar bass and drums are mainly without mic and only the horns keys and vocals go via a pa unless in a massive venue. The 1x12 (as I change what I take) with the cream back I find has more bottom end than my 2x12 even with the bass cut engaged on the cabinet , sometimes I would say too much bass on occasions when it’s stood on a hard floors stage. Great can though, really love it.
Great! Just found this and answering a lot of questions. Now... a comparison between 10” and 12”. A (4) 10’s cab was always a stand out to me. I don’t know what it is about it but enlighten me. Good, bad and ugly.
You can't make general statements about 10" vs 12" speakers because so many other aspects of a speaker matter more (even though they're harder/impossible to see). However, if you keep everything else the same (motor, voice coil, cone material, surround and spider materials) and just shrink the diameter of the cone then you end up with a tone that has less bottom, more mids and better treble dispersion - basically more clear and less fat. A conventional 4x10" cab won't have the dispersion benefit and will suffer from comb filtering too, as the wave fronts from the four speakers all interact.
great long story, thank you. I love Greenbacks and G12H30 Anniversaries and lately I have been testing Alnico Creambacks. I am not completely sold on them yet, they seem a little 'stiff' compared to my usual Greenback/G12H30 2x12 closed cab setup but they are big and glorious and smooth sounding so I'll keep on using them to see if they get even 'softer' when broken in. The V-type is actually pretty interesting too, I just bought a Laney GH30R with a V-type in and it sounded really good. I had an 8 Ohms Alnico Creamback lying around waiting for a combo so I put that into the Laney instead but I'm not sure the difference in sound is big enough to justify the huge price difference! I really don't like the aggressive upper midrange honk of the V30 but the V-type is much more 'neutral' Celestion close to a G12H30 and even cheaper.
more free tube tips: 1. get a used orange vt 1000 tube tester it's 300$ 2.for a better tone swap v1 to a vintage mullard rca or ge they are under 100$ on ebay they all sound different but much better than modern stuff 3.for blues jr and hrd a mullard i63 is the best choice, for bright amps in general and strats...and distortion... 4.for blackface amps my black marlin set is v1 mullard i63 for a bassman like tone at the normal channel and ge12ax7wa at v2 for the vibrato channel 5.ge's are great to tame angry modern marshall's 6.brimars are the warmest mullards are the smoothest ge's are nice crisp and clear rca's are the american crunch enjoy
I mix them with V-30's in the same cab and think they sound amazing. I like the combo better than my greenback loaded cabinet. I haven't tried an alnico. I like what I have.here in videos of the alnico's.
I have the G12H-75 as well in an oversized Avatar partial open back cab, and yes, "tight & clear" is a good description of this speaker, as well as full& round. It is a great pairing with a Soldano head. It is also VERY loud. I'm wondering how the G12H-75 compares to the NEO cream back.
Very informative explanation of the Celestion speaker types. I've tried about a third of these speakers and my number one favorite is 25w Greenback. Second would be the G12-65. I know the Creamback 65 is supposed to be a higher wattage handling model of the 25w Greenback, but to me it sounds nothing like it. A few years ago, Celestion put out a limited-edition anniversary model with a Pulsonic cone that I only bought 2 of at the time and I wish I had bought more. It's called an G12-35X (I think) and they sound great.
@BarefacedAudio I've never tried the EVH, but I have briefly tried the 20w Heritage which is supposed to be the exact same speaker. I've heard the 20w Heritage, but not with my amp which is a '72 Marshall Super Lead. I compared it to a 25w Greenback using a Bogner amp and found it noticeably darker-sounding and compressing/distorting quicker. The thing I really like about the 25w Greenback is it's vocal-sounding midrange, but I think they need to be in a 4x12 configuration to really shine. I've always wanted to try the G12H (75) Heritage, but never had the opportunity to do so. The exact model number of the limited-edition Celestion speaker that I mentioned is G12-35XC and they were available 2017-2018. They are similar to a Greenback, but with a little more low-mid oomph. I use them in my JCM800 50w 2x12 combo. They make the open-back combo react and sound similar to a closed-back cabinet.
I've settled on the early 80's vented(!) T75, which resembles the fabled G12-65's pretty well but sit way better in the mix. I used to have M25 black backs in an X pattern with K85's in my 1960B, which added thick and clear lows to the raunchy mids of the M25.
Thank you for the cool video. I have used Celestion G12H(55 Hz) and G12H(75 Hz), Celestion Gold, G12H Anniversary, G12T75, and EVH Greenbacks. Your lecture seems to explain something I was wondering: why the EVH speakers sound dark to me. I have had the Heritage 55 hz and 75 hz in a pair of 1x12 cabs for a long time. I picked those two after trying a bunch of speakers by different brands. Recently I acquired a Marshall 1960B (? the slanted one) loaded with G12T75s. I actually thought the T75s sounded pretty good (even though they get a lot of hate online), particularly the clean sounds. However, I liked the Heritage speakers so much that I thought I wanted the 20 W version in my cab. I was told by Celestion that the EVH's are the same as the Heritage, so I got four and put them in. I have found the EVH's to be much darker and muddier sounding than the Heritage speakers and I wondered if I should have held out and found some used Heritage 20 W speakers even though Celestion claims they are the same. I almost like the T75's better, but the EVH's do convey the midrange of a greenback (which I like). Anyway, according to your video, it makes sense that the 20 W version is more bassy and less crisp than the Heritage because it has a smaller magnet than the Heritage. Now I am thinking that I may want to switch my 4x12 to V-types or something. Anyway, thanks for the video. I almost clicked away because I didn't want to watch a 20 minute lecture, but it was pretty interesting!
i have an alnico blue and g12 h anniversary in my top hat club royal that is utter perfection. i think those two speakers were made for each other,especially in vox/marshall type circuits. i also use a alnico gold in a more fender tweed princeton type circuit( swart str) i honestly did not think it was going to work,but it sounds great,will not be changed!
I have the new Duchess amp pedal and I'm looking for a single 12 incher to knock dicks into the dirt. This made things so much clearer. Excellent video.
I had used V30 for years But I was felt it was a little harsh in the top end and they were some mint things I wasn’t crazy about. The funny thing is I have a V 30 in my blues junior and it sounds great even and it’s not too bright. In my Bogner one by 12 I switched out the V30 for a Scumback J 75. That was less harsh in the highs and had more low mids which I preferred. I was also using a ported custom 1x12 with an EV 12L. With my Mezzabarba Skill 30 head which is a bright head and can go very high gain it was still a bit bright on the top. So I put in an Altec 417 and the high end harshness went away. That speaker seems to work well with clean but doesn’t get harsh on high gain sounds like many others do. Is someone who mixes I recognize that the guitar sweet spots are really the mids. In most mixes You typically roll off Lows and the highs on electric guitar. One thing with both the EV 12L and Altec is that they are high wattage speakers so they don’t break up as easily. This could be good or bad depending on what you were going for. I did Also noticed that when I switched them out the Altec was a little less loud than the EV. For me that’s actually a good thing because even with 30 Watt amps i’m still barely turning it up before it’s “too loud“. I think so far with all the trials I’ve had with speakers and cabs Altec 417 8H Series II has worked the best overall. It works well with Clean as well as very high gain and everything in between Andy biggest thing I like about it is the fact that the highest are not ice picky or harsh even if I go into a high gain boosted lead. Since it handles such high wattage you have to push it a bit to get into the sweet spot. As an experiment on my tone king Imperial 31 amp I ran it through the Altec one by 12 and that didn’t work as well. The tone king 33 speaker is it not only a 30 W speaker which broke up much sooner than the outlet but worked better for the amp. I’ll check with the tone king was a bit to “hard“ but I guess if I ever needed to use that amp and get more headroom that would be one solution because with the tone king since it’s only 30 W with a 30 W speaker your cleans do start crunching up if you get louder they live band. But the mezzabarba skill 30 head and the Altec for 17 seems like a good combination I could be playing in the loud seven piece 80s bands and the clean Chorus type parts stay super clean but then I can go to the high gain and do a screaming Van Halen lead and it’s not harsh. I did have a 412 with all Altecs which sounded great but was 100 pounds and totally impractical to use live. I am still curious about the Barefaced Cabs because the concept of The sound not changing drastically depending on listening position is very cool. I could set the amp to get a great sound right in front of it but then when I’m standing up at a gig the speaker is basically pointed at my legs and loses a lot of clarity which affects the “feel“ of the guitar.
Wow! what a cool break down and description of C speakers! I've had greenbacks, creambacks, VTs, and V30s. Out of these, I'm going to have to say the V30's sounded best for my preferred sound. 2x12 cabs with 2 1x12 cabs. If like to try the 250 coppers. They sound right up my alley. :o)
What a fantastic video. I've long been confused with Celestions colours, letters and numbers. This has cleared it right up for me. I've recently been trying out some speaker options, I purchased a 5153 with matching closed back 1x12, I usually play with V30's but I was excited to try the G12h. Only a previous owner changed it out for an eminence Man-o-war that I can only describe as terrible. So I took 3 different v30's out my Marshall and Mesa cabs respectively and a Chinese V30 and trialled them in the 1x12. They all sounded much closer to what I'm used to hearing obviously but I was surprised at the tonal shift going from 4x12 to a 1x12 enclosure. You touch on it in the video where you describe the effects a 4x12 makes to the top end output, and how something like a H-heritage is great at lower volumes etc, it made me wonder... Is there another celestion speaker that by itself in a 1x12 sounds more like, or has more of the characteristics that V30's do in a 4x12? (if that makes sense) Thanks!
I honestly have used just about all of these expect the really loud 100+ watts but I still love the alnico blue the best is really think it is the nicest sound more the the other alnico’s, I also have vintage 30s in a lot of amps and I just started using v-types I really like them a lot
Have tested in detail AlNiCo Blue/silver, V30, G12M Greenback+ Creamback, G12H-30 Anniversary, G12-65, G12T-75 and -100. Best combination by my ear is AlNiCo and ceramic in combo. Playing rock/blues/americano/pop-reverby-stuff I use a vintage silver + G12H-30 in a 212 cab. For 112 I have not really decided. Have earlier used G12-65 and G12-100. Also tried 1x G12H-30. Now I use another AlNiCo silver VOX speaker, but with only 17W power rating it has limited volume. Looking for best >50W solution - Possible Creamback, but need to get a better overview of the Jensen/american voicings. Maybe a A-type is good second option? Most likely will end up with a Alnico Gold :D
Highly educational! I'm just now setting off down this rabbit hole and demystifying guitar loudspeakers has been requiring much time input, which is cool. Back when I gigged in the late 80s and early half of the 90s, my main Thiele 2x12 slant had EV 100watt speakers. In my current researching I am finding my preference is Celestion H heavy magnet builds. Alnicos are very impressive sounding, thanks for the explanation on that! I don't own any of the speakers in your presentation. At a friend's house in 2019 we put a bunch of his cabs through some paces and the speaker which really stood out as sounding great was a pair NEO Creamback in a Germino 2x12. I believe most of the other cabs had V30s, but I'm not certain. I currently have a couple Tech 21 PE60s with Seventy 80, a SS Princeton with the typical Fender blue OEM and a couple Fender CyberTwins with G12T-100 set up in a big multiAmp WDW setup. With a VHT 2562 incoming I'm looking to do some speaker experiments to go alongside building an all tube WDW setup. Your video has me interested in the NEO 250, which is a surprise. I've watched a bunch of vids today on Celestion comparisons and the A-Type and Creamback H have stood out to me...my research continues and my cart is growing.
Celestion Alnico Cream. Worth the price premium. I play with very tight high gain. It retains all of the definition of the distortion of my 25 watt Mesa Mark Series since the power handling is so much higher than the amp output. The alnico mag tames the harsh highs just enough to reign in any harshness and adds enough warmth to make chugging sound more organic and less sterile. Anyone who thinks alnico can't be used for metal should re examine this topic. I think I'll add a ceramic creamback when I upgrade to a 2x12 unless you have another suggestion. 50% of what I play is metal w/ the other half being jazz, fusion, neo soul, and blues. The Cream sounds great for most genres IMO and is just very clear, warm, and organic while filtering out harshness.
Agree, they are not flabby sounding at all, just big, bold and sweet and very 'firm' in the tone too. I got a deal on 4 of them and put them into 2 2x12 closed cabs for some classic ZZ TOP rock and they are growing on me (usually play Greenbacks or G12H30)
I think it's important to test many speakers with all the different circuits that you can to find the most compatible combinations make sure to observe proper impedence, I can also increase or decrease volume by adding speakers or decrease speaker sensitivity to lower volume increase speaker sensitivity to raise volume different type speaker for different type tone
The G12 H Anniversary is the best all around sounding IMO. Oozes classic rock and Paul Kossoff. Vintage 30s are great in 212s and paired with the G75s in a 412. Classic Lead is killer too and props to the Creamback 65
I find them a little high pitched in frequency yes too bright as he said.. creamback, white alnico and copperback...mixed various mid and low end speakers texas heat, swamp thang, blackbird alnico and a 4 ohm celestion 100 hot and now it's not high pitches and may not be for everyone...grungy and thick
Great video sir. In short I prefer low wattage speakers for the reasons you state. They sound sweeter faster. They are nearer to the floor if you will and do not require revving a 12 cylinder engine to 7000 RPM to get their legs stretched. G 12 M 20 and blue most near and dear to my heart. G 12 H 75 and 55 are excellent. Definitely very different to each other and to the previously mentioned and you can tell which 60s stars wound up on those particularly the 55. 35XC is a modern classic in my opinion. Truly great. There are a few modern Jensens that are truly exceptional but not as uniformly exceptional as Celestions are. I must say that random old alnico speakers are a treasure hunt worth excavating. There are some truly brilliantly great sounds out there. Lurking around in old people’s living rooms. And on eBay of course. To hear you is to hear my own self. It’s refreshing to realize that someone else in the world realizes that all of these distinctions are not just stickers and plastics and designations. These are such all different animals. One I failed to mention is the Marshall vintage modern greenback. G12c. I think it is basically an undoped G 12 m 25. Doping really takes the sweetness out of the mid range. And notably all of my favorite speakers by Celestion are undoped. I wonder whether you know off the top your head whether the G 12 M 20 uses a paper former.
I like the vintage 30 in my 40c. Had to change the pre amp tubes and remove the c29 cap. Made the speaker perform a lot better. Sucks the greenbacks are only 30w.
Arghh. You didn't even talk about the Anniversary G12H ! I have one and it's actually sitting in a box at the moment. Was hoping you'd give me a clue as to proper application. I'm going to assume that, given it's position on the chart, that it's more of a lead guitar voiced speaker. But I also think that a lead guitar voiced speaker would actually be better for a gainier rhythm sound? Excuse my petty criticism. Really, really wonderful video. Genius !
As a bassist, this is the only video that's ever clearly explained the apparently-convaluted Celestion 12" speaker range - excellent job Alex, thanks! I'll look foward to a similar vid 4 the 10"ers, in due course. Have you done a similar video for the 10" & 12" bass speakers that your company get made by Eminence? Cheers - from a future 1x10" Barefaced bass cab user!
I had vintage 30s in a 2x12 but when I changed to a 4x12 I didn't like vintage 30s in that so I changed to g12m65 creambacks they sound much better. I found with the vintage 30s because of the higher sensitivity they don't break up as early as the creambacks plus creambacks are a lot smoother not so harsh. I use 2 2x12s now instead of a 4x12 it's easier to carry
I came here looking for more information on my Marshall Heritage G12's ... RUclips videos on these are scarce & many are basically useless in my 'umble ! Looks like they're great for those 80's sounding cabinets Any chance you could expound the virtues of these Speakers in another Video Barefaced Audio, I for one would appreciate that Great video & interesting history lesson too ..... Keep up the good work Joe from Tasmania / Australia
I have a Greenback, a Creamback, and an Alnico Cream. One of each. They each have their place. The Cream and Creamback each work great in a 1x12. The Greenback needs to be in a cranked 4x12 to sound good.
Thank you for the explanation. I am looking for a new 12" Celestion to replace the stock Seventy 80 that comes in many lower cost amps. I am really torn because I love the British G12M greenback from my long ago Marshall days, I like the Vintage 30 in a few different combos or cabs, and I am oddly drawn to the Blue for one low wattage tube combo (Blackstar Studio 10 KT88). I am assuming I want the low wattage speaker to provide the most character with my 10 watt amp. I plan on building another 1x12" cab (or perhaps a 2x12) to use with other heads or as extensions. For that I would need Greenback or Ruby. These days 15-22 watts is the max I am going to play. Wish I had space and money to try all of these out. Your explanation of the Alnico speakers confused me a bit. I get that they are not the classic rock sound from the 60-80s, but they seem quite popular with rock guitarists. I wish I could find a demo with my exact Blackstar Studio 10 KT88 with a Blue, a greenback and a vintage 30. Shit, the amp sounds decent with the cheapo Seventy 80 so I can only see it getting better. I love a Fender/Jensen sound for clean headroom, but prefer Celestion for anything dirtier. The Cele have a bark and snarl that I just love. Paired with a fun tube amp they are very satisfying. I know sound engineers who make all kinds of pro or con arguments about what sits in the mix best. Back to my project: I am likely to try a Greenback first based on cost. I have heard a Vintage 30 in a similar Blackstar amp and it was nice, but that amp had over twice the wattage of my 10 watt. This is why I believe the G12M-greenback 25 watt or Blue (15 watt) are my best best bets. Does this sound sensible? I play rock, blues, mostly of a classic rock style. I used to play punk and metal but those days are gone. Hendrix or Page fuzz sounds are about as heavy as I get and often just use a Spark boost pedal with a little gain dialed in on the amp for all the dirt I need while tracking. I can always add distortion in the mix but I can't take it away if tracked with too much. That said I like the Celestion bark and want that in my tracks.
I have four 4x12’s….every one of them are Marshall and have the Marshall G12 Vintage speakers (Original Version of the V30)……All from different eras…1987..1993..2003..and 2019….They are my favorite speakers by far…They just sound “right”to me….I have owned some G12M Greenbacks,which I didn’t care for….also G12-65’s,which I did like,but the Vintage 30 just sounds like what I think a guitar speaker should sound like…chest thumping low mids,nice soft crunchy midrange,and slightly rolled off treble…..the Greenback just sounds all farty in the low end,and it sounds like you put a blanket over the cab…what can I say..I have been playing V30’s for 35 plus years…I am a V30 guy for life….Great explanation of the difference in all these speakers though….
I don’t know about Celestion, but I have this 15” Magnavox Alnico from 1967 made by Eminence. I play it outside a cabinet and it has the most high end detail I have ever heard!!! Sometimes I turn it so the front of the speaker is facing down on some convenient surface, right now a cared board box. And it’s still plenty detailed. I shudder to think how it would sound if you made a 15” box.
This is great information, Cleared up many questions I had, I would like to know if there is a pdf available with all this great info. Thank you for explaining this to us.
It's easy to smooth out the vintage 30 harshness , just put MXR 10 band EQ in the fx loop, bring down 2Khz @ -6db and 4Khz @-4db. Now you will have smoother tone without sounding muffled, comfortable to be listened to at higher volume.
My Barefaced 1x12 I stuck with the V30 because it does everything I need from it at lower volumes and sounds good with my blackface Fender but can handle my JCM800 if needed and it really fills a room. For more power and heavier sounds I have a closed back 2x12 with the V30 up top and the G12H 75 Creamback on the bottom.
It would be interesting to find out how a Barefaced Reformer with a Redback or a Radical or Uprising with other speakers would compare to your closed back 212! A
I have experience with the alnico blue gold and cream, the heritage G12m and Heritage G12H (55hz) , the regular g12m and G12H, the 70th anniversary G12H, the the vintage 30, the g12Hcreamback and the v type. Celestions are my favorite all around speakers. I put them in about everything. I particularly like them in fender amps to fill out the midrange some. I have a 55 hz G12H in a deluxe reverb (a vintage 30 sounds good in that as well) also have a 70th anniversary G12H in a tweed deluxe and lots of g12m in Marshall style amps and dr z style amps. Alnico blue in vox style. V type in a fender brownface deluxe. I wouldn’t necessarily agree with all the characterizations (g12Hs seem to have a lot of lows in addition to the highs, I wouldn’t say alnico golds loose highs compared to blues and I wouldn’t say any single 12 sounds like a 4x12. But a good bit of these I would agree with. I also find the alnico cream to be quite versatile regardless of its power rating and seems to sound really good in a plethora of settings.
the first G12 is actually from a radiogram speaker of the late 40s., id say via my research , I have a pair of the first radiogram speakers that the first guitar speakers were made from mine are around 1940s , the same alnico magnet just on a new basket . I have the very heavy cast basket the guitars speakers were a pressed steel basket,
That makes sense! I have a booklet on speaker making from that era by Gilbert Briggs of Wharfedale fame, which includes a chapter on loudspeakers for electric guitar and bass use. A
thanks for these explanations. I've got a VOXtb with a Bull Dog speaker and recently bought a later made VOXAC15c1 with a Greenback- quite a different sound! I was wondering if you know much about this VOX Bull Dog speaker and which Celestion it is most similar too, some say the Alnico Blue?
Excellent video, thank you! I'm most familiar with the Alnico Blue, the G12M, heritage and H, and the Vintage 30. I've found them very much as you describe. My 80s 4x12 with British-made Vintage 30s sounds better than my cabs with the newer Vintage 30s, even though the 80s cabinet itself is poorer quality. I love 4x12 speakers with 2x Vintage 30s and 2x G12 Heritage, or better still, 2x G12H. One of each in a 2x12 ought to sound great. The Alnico Blue is great for blues and classic rock, especially with a Vox amp, as you say. I've heard a cheaper cream back, but not the Alnico. Great for blues. I've only heard the Copperback with the Victory pedal amp. Tube preamp, digital power stage, then Copperback. Not an experience I enjoyed. The Victory amp was excellent, but the combination of digital power and unfamiliar speaker was too far from what I'm used to in my Classic/Hard Rock/Metal world. Instead of being inspired by tone, I had to concentrate and adjust my playing. Not fun, but far from an exhaustive audition. What have we learned? I'd love to audition your cabs with different cones, and eventually buy a 1x12, a vertical 2x12, and 2 horizontal 2x12s. Oh...and I use the word "great" far too often... If you do any blindfold testing of cabs and cones, I'd happily help out, once people are able to safely get together again. I'm genuinely 100% blind, so my ears are all I can judge gear by. Thanks again for a very informative vid.
This video should be on Celestion's page, the knowledge and clarity in this video alone is worth the price of several amps and cabs.
Ladies and gentlemen we have a bingo
@@jaycee30865 Take your shirt off, babe
Absolutely agree 👍
Well done...However, is it my imagination, or did you skip the G-12H Anniversary ? ...& if on purpose, why ?
Unbelievable a video of a 23 minute video that has basically answered the question everyone wants to know about celestion guitar speakers. The only bit missing is where the Seventy 80 speakers sit because they’re common in a lot of affordable cabs and combos so giving reasons why you would want to change that kind of speaker would be helpful.
I have started using redback speakers because I wanted to run a 100watt amp through a 1x12 cab it sounds fantastic and it replaced the Vintage 30 in there which I really didn’t like the sound. But your explanation has made me understand why I really like the redback is because it’s in the ballpark of the era of music I like to listen to.
Excellent work this definitely needs to be on the celestion website.👍
One of the most comprehensive and informative speaker overviews I've come across. Amazing amount of info packed into 20 minutes.
I'm seriously sleep deprived and a bit dehydrated this morning, yet I'm at the edge of the seat; thank you so much for explaining what previously was an impenetrable mess to me!
You hardly mentioned my personal favorite-the G12H30!
Excellent, educational, very well presented - THANK YOU!
I like the fact that you used a drum stick for your pointer stick.
This was exactly what RUclips was designed for. Right down to using a drum stick as your pointer. I would have gone to University if I could have learned useless-useful information like this.
I went to university and any stuff I learnt about this then (well actually it was more specifically learning bass playing and music) was extra-curricular. I presume having done a Mech Eng degree made it easier to learn this stuff later on! A
@@BarefacedAudio I went to music college but learnt everything I know from sound engineering and gigging in function bands in the evenings. I've run a musical instrument shop for a decade and I definitely never used anything from my further education in my day to day life. 🤷🏻♂️
Love your work... Will be buying a cab just as soon as I am working again.
I think they would have taught this in high school back in the day potentially especially if you were an A/V nerd
Phenomenal video. Thanks so much! Extremely helpful
I have been looking for explanations like these. Yours are amazing! Thank you so much for sharing your knowledge!
A really informative video, that’s cleared up a lot of uncertainty in my mind
Just what I have been looking for! Thanks for taking the time to make this video ... a fantastic and fascinating explanation. Going to need to watch this a couple of times to digest, but feeling a LOT more confident about speaker upgrading or choice. Brilliant.
The video I didn't know I needed but not can't live without. Excellent explanations.
Great review! Really cleared up everything you need to know when selecting a Celestion speaker.
Fantastic video; perfect breakdown. Thanks for the upload.
Good explanations! You have summarized in a few minutes what took me years to understand.
I will have to watch this a few times to fully retain all the info here. Great video.
Excellent breakdown.
Awesome! Best video on guitar speakers I've ever seen
Excellent video. Thanks!
Thank you for your thoughts on the subject, interesting viewpoint.
Thank you, very informative and helpful!
Fantastic and informative presentation. Thoroughly enjoyable plus the admission..”I’ve been there” re metal. This made my day. Thank you.
Great video. Thoroughly agree with everything stated. I only have experience with the gold, 25w greenback, v-type, neo creamback, vintage 30 and G12T-75.
I would add that the gold works really well in a deluxe reverb, 25w greenbacks seem to balance out only in a 4x12 and can sound harsh with high gain (but weirdly fine for fuzz), vintage 30s sound good in 1x12, 2x12 and 4x12 and produce decent cleans given how good they are for high gain but as many would agree the upper mids can be fatiguing.
V-types are excellent for the price and provide a good balance for 'jack of all trades' amps like the DSL40CR.
G12T-75s sound good in the Marshall 1960A cab with high gain but quite scooped in a mix and not great for cleans.
The seventy 80 deserves all the hate it gets, the neo creamback has a bit too fast of a response and the G12 Neo Century Vintage is similar and overly bright (as seems to be the case for the newish Neo V type that there are about two demos of on all of RUclips).
Need to get my hands on a blue, G12H anniversary and a G12H (55) (or four..) at some stage as well.
Thanks for sharing your knowledge!
Fantastic video! Very informative!
Merci et bravo pour l’historique des 12p Celestion 🔊et vos explications. Vive le Rock !🎸
Great video.
Excelent descriptions. Thanks!
Fantastic and highly educational
Have to stop the video half way through just to say a big tahnk you!!!
I've been looking for information on speakers as I just got myself a cab and want to change it to better for my tubemeister deluxe 20 head. Such valuable information to me right now.
This was very useful. I've mostly known Vintage 30s or whatever my combos came with.
Watching Johan Segeborn and his great experiments/demos on vintage cabinets have me asking myself some questions about sound level, smoothness, etc ..
Looking into the idea of running in stereo a pair of Monoprice/HB 15w tube combos, much like Budda Guedes, and realizing that I have some more to learn of what would work well.
Now I need to learn more of your products, since you do have a the clearest explanation of Celestions I've seen, which tells me you know your products and that is something I can stand behind.
Brilliantly explained, 10/10. It's rare to get an easy to follow but still informative video. I was actually excited learning this all. Celestion should be promoting this. Thanks
Very nice mate!
Great Video! A lifetime worth of very useful info in less than thirty minutes! Just as useful as "the talk" (birds & bees) me Pop gave me fifty years ago....
excellent video (and very much needed :)
I purchased a reality 112FR today and then watched this video to understand different celestion speakers and its absolutely fantastic, not only do you know your stuff, you are a born teacher, very clear and concise. Thanks mate
Very helpful!
Dude, this vid has given me a totally different perspective. I've been trying for a early 2000s v30-ish speaker quest. But I play at bedroom levels heavily attenuated. Now I kinda realize all the youtube vids with speaker sounds bites blasting their cabinets with 100w amps arent really what my setup needs or can replicate. Thank you very much.
Excellent. Thanks you.
Everyone's praise of the detailed and informative nature of this video is spot-on. I agree on the V30 and V-Type analyses completely. I mix them and they sound amazing.
Didn’t know anything about speakers and how they effect my sound before this video, other than that celestion is the standard. Just bought my first boutique amp head and have decided to build my own cab. This video is awesome and made everything in the decision process so much easier. Explaining in an understandable matter, while not compensating or cutting out technicality and information. Awesome video 👍.
Great video ... very informative.
Just saw this. Very helpful, thanks.
Great video!!
I’m pairing a G12H30 70th Anniversary with a G12H-30 (55 Hz) in a 50 watt Ampeg Reverberocket 212 open-backed combo. Sounds great! Nice creamy mids with present lows and sweet highs with a bit of distortion from the Anniversary while the 55 Hz G12H is a basic straightforward balance across the frequencies Speaker that runs a bit cleaner and keeps the combo from sounding too gritty. Love it!
this video is so helpful professor drumstick!!
This video... is priceless!!!! Best damn explanation of Celestion speakers I've ever heard. Actually... one of the best explanations of guitar speakers... period. I wish you would do a video like this but with audio examples. It would honestly be my "greatest day of my life" dream to be able to have a single amp head, in the center of a room, with... 10-15 1x12 cabinets placed around the amp in an arch... with some kind of switchable junction box that allows me to run the head into each 12" speaker, one at a time. I've seen a lot of "shoot out" videos on RUclips that show... one or two Celestions A/B'd. But... the audio is usually rubbish, and it is usually not a very good comparison. Like... Neo 250 vs. AlNiCo Blue. If I had $100,000 to spend on Celestions, I'd buy one of each and make my dream video. Ha!!! Anyway... I digress like mad. Thanks man!!! Excellent excellent video!!!
This was excellent thank you, I'd love more audio electronics stuff from you guys. Intro to small signal design maybe? Chancing my arm a bit there! Thank you for this, very concise and not boring at all. But yeah whatever you upload I will watch
Have cabs fitted with G12-K100, V30, G12-T75 and a 2x15 with Celestion G15, 2x10 with G10s. Got every Celestion IR and own a Kemper. Nice roundup vid.
Rolling off high end or paired with a dark amp and the Vintage 30 is nice allround speaker. I agree.
It depends on the entire signal chain what speaker I choose - I like to blend the low end of a 15” with the articulation of a 12” or 10”. I play lower tunings mostly.
Would love to try a Barefaced cab sometime, but have to get rid of stuff first before accumulating more gear. Wish you all the best with your channel and business.
this is the best explanation on youtube ever!
ive swapped the stock speaker on a hot rod deluxe mk 3 to an alnico cream 90w and it turned out amazing, this was at my work on live gigs at a backline company so the amp is gigged with many guitar players and different styles and they all love it since it took the harshness away. at home i'm using 2 greenback heritage 20w with my 1974x and i love them
thanks for an amazing and insightful video.
btw here is my free tube tip: whatever amp you have it doesn't matter swap v1 to a vintage mullard it's under 100$ tested on ebay
enjoy
Thank you so much!
I use an Alnico Blue with a G12H 70th Anniversary in a /13 2x12 open-backed cab. Great combination together!
well explained !! Thank you.
Alnico Blue, Alnico Gold, Vintage 30, G12M Heritage, G12M-65, G12H(55) Her, G12H(75) Her, G12H-150 Red, G12-65.
Seriously GOOD video on loudspeakers. Particularly when you explained how a single Redback will sound full like a 4x cabinet. I have all of the above speakers, but want to add a pair of 25w Greenbacks. A good 70s sound, for my 74 JMP.
I have two Cabs. My first cab is a marshal 2x12 with a mixture of vintage 30 and a heritage 30 which I use with my Marshall jvm. I have a barefaced 1x12 with a cream back 75 which I use with a victory v40. I play blues funk soul and blues in an 8 piece band. When playing the guitar bass and drums are mainly without mic and only the horns keys and vocals go via a pa unless in a massive venue. The 1x12 (as I change what I take) with the cream back I find has more bottom end than my 2x12 even with the bass cut engaged on the cabinet , sometimes I would say too much bass on occasions when it’s stood on a hard floors stage. Great can though, really love it.
Great! Just found this and answering a lot of questions. Now... a comparison between 10” and 12”. A (4) 10’s cab was always a stand out to me. I don’t know what it is about it but enlighten me. Good, bad and ugly.
You can't make general statements about 10" vs 12" speakers because so many other aspects of a speaker matter more (even though they're harder/impossible to see). However, if you keep everything else the same (motor, voice coil, cone material, surround and spider materials) and just shrink the diameter of the cone then you end up with a tone that has less bottom, more mids and better treble dispersion - basically more clear and less fat. A conventional 4x10" cab won't have the dispersion benefit and will suffer from comb filtering too, as the wave fronts from the four speakers all interact.
great long story, thank you.
I love Greenbacks and G12H30 Anniversaries and lately I have been testing Alnico Creambacks. I am not completely sold on them yet, they seem a little 'stiff' compared to my usual Greenback/G12H30 2x12 closed cab setup but they are big and glorious and smooth sounding so I'll keep on using them to see if they get even 'softer' when broken in.
The V-type is actually pretty interesting too, I just bought a Laney GH30R with a V-type in and it sounded really good. I had an 8 Ohms Alnico Creamback lying around waiting for a combo so I put that into the Laney instead but I'm not sure the difference in sound is big enough to justify the huge price difference! I really don't like the aggressive upper midrange honk of the V30 but the V-type is much more 'neutral' Celestion close to a G12H30 and even cheaper.
A type indeed sounds great, I might be pairing it with a M greenback, or on its own. Really informative video.
Nice, informative.
more free tube tips:
1. get a used orange vt 1000 tube tester it's 300$
2.for a better tone swap v1 to a vintage mullard rca or ge they are under 100$ on ebay they all sound different but much better than modern stuff
3.for blues jr and hrd a mullard i63 is the best choice, for bright amps in general and strats...and distortion...
4.for blackface amps my black marlin set is v1 mullard i63 for a bassman like tone at the normal channel and ge12ax7wa at v2 for the vibrato channel
5.ge's are great to tame angry modern marshall's
6.brimars are the warmest mullards are the smoothest ge's are nice crisp and clear rca's are the american crunch
enjoy
G12H-75 Creamback is my favourite, tight clear sound.
I mix them with V-30's in the same cab and think they sound amazing. I like the combo better than my greenback loaded cabinet.
I haven't tried an alnico. I like what I have.here in videos of the alnico's.
I have the G12H-75 as well in an oversized Avatar partial open back cab, and yes, "tight & clear" is a good description of this speaker, as well as full& round. It is a great pairing with a Soldano head.
It is also VERY loud.
I'm wondering how the G12H-75 compares to the NEO cream back.
Very informative explanation of the Celestion speaker types. I've tried about a third of these speakers and my number one favorite is 25w Greenback. Second would be the G12-65. I know the Creamback 65 is supposed to be a higher wattage handling model of the 25w Greenback, but to me it sounds nothing like it. A few years ago, Celestion put out a limited-edition anniversary model with a Pulsonic cone that I only bought 2 of at the time and I wish I had bought more. It's called an G12-35X (I think) and they sound great.
I think we should do some more comparisons of the Greenback/Creamback/Redback family! Have you tried the EVH?
@BarefacedAudio I've never tried the EVH, but I have briefly tried the 20w Heritage which is supposed to be the exact same speaker. I've heard the 20w Heritage, but not with my amp which is a '72 Marshall Super Lead. I compared it to a 25w Greenback using a Bogner amp and found it noticeably darker-sounding and compressing/distorting quicker. The thing I really like about the 25w Greenback is it's vocal-sounding midrange, but I think they need to be in a 4x12 configuration to really shine. I've always wanted to try the G12H (75) Heritage, but never had the opportunity to do so.
The exact model number of the limited-edition Celestion speaker that I mentioned is G12-35XC and they were available 2017-2018. They are similar to a Greenback, but with a little more low-mid oomph. I use them in my JCM800 50w 2x12 combo. They make the open-back combo react and sound similar to a closed-back cabinet.
I've settled on the early 80's vented(!) T75, which resembles the fabled G12-65's pretty well but sit way better in the mix.
I used to have M25 black backs in an X pattern with K85's in my 1960B, which added thick and clear lows to the raunchy mids of the M25.
Thank you for the cool video. I have used Celestion G12H(55 Hz) and G12H(75 Hz), Celestion Gold, G12H Anniversary, G12T75, and EVH Greenbacks. Your lecture seems to explain something I was wondering: why the EVH speakers sound dark to me.
I have had the Heritage 55 hz and 75 hz in a pair of 1x12 cabs for a long time. I picked those two after trying a bunch of speakers by different brands. Recently I acquired a Marshall 1960B (? the slanted one) loaded with G12T75s. I actually thought the T75s sounded pretty good (even though they get a lot of hate online), particularly the clean sounds. However, I liked the Heritage speakers so much that I thought I wanted the 20 W version in my cab. I was told by Celestion that the EVH's are the same as the Heritage, so I got four and put them in. I have found the EVH's to be much darker and muddier sounding than the Heritage speakers and I wondered if I should have held out and found some used Heritage 20 W speakers even though Celestion claims they are the same. I almost like the T75's better, but the EVH's do convey the midrange of a greenback (which I like). Anyway, according to your video, it makes sense that the 20 W version is more bassy and less crisp than the Heritage because it has a smaller magnet than the Heritage. Now I am thinking that I may want to switch my 4x12 to V-types or something.
Anyway, thanks for the video. I almost clicked away because I didn't want to watch a 20 minute lecture, but it was pretty interesting!
i have an alnico blue and g12 h anniversary in my top hat club royal that is utter perfection. i think those two speakers were made for each other,especially in vox/marshall type circuits. i also use a alnico gold in a more fender tweed princeton type circuit( swart str) i honestly did not think it was going to work,but it sounds great,will not be changed!
I have the new Duchess amp pedal and I'm looking for a single 12 incher to knock dicks into the dirt. This made things so much clearer. Excellent video.
I had used V30 for years But I was felt it was a little harsh in the top end and they were some mint things I wasn’t crazy about. The funny thing is I have a V 30 in my blues junior and it sounds great even and it’s not too bright. In my Bogner one by 12 I switched out the V30 for a Scumback J 75. That was less harsh in the highs and had more low mids which I preferred. I was also using a ported custom 1x12 with an EV 12L. With my Mezzabarba Skill 30 head which is a bright head and can go very high gain it was still a bit bright on the top. So I put in an Altec 417 and the high end harshness went away. That speaker seems to work well with clean but doesn’t get harsh on high gain sounds like many others do. Is someone who mixes I recognize that the guitar sweet spots are really the mids. In most mixes You typically roll off Lows and the highs on electric guitar. One thing with both the EV 12L and Altec is that they are high wattage speakers so they don’t break up as easily. This could be good or bad depending on what you were going for. I did Also noticed that when I switched them out the Altec was a little less loud than the EV. For me that’s actually a good thing because even with 30 Watt amps i’m still barely turning it up before it’s “too loud“. I think so far with all the trials I’ve had with speakers and cabs Altec 417 8H Series II has worked the best overall. It works well with Clean as well as very high gain and everything in between Andy biggest thing I like about it is the fact that the highest are not ice picky or harsh even if I go into a high gain boosted lead. Since it handles such high wattage you have to push it a bit to get into the sweet spot. As an experiment on my tone king Imperial 31 amp I ran it through the Altec one by 12 and that didn’t work as well. The tone king 33 speaker is it not only a 30 W speaker which broke up much sooner than the outlet but worked better for the amp. I’ll check with the tone king was a bit to “hard“ but I guess if I ever needed to use that amp and get more headroom that would be one solution because with the tone king since it’s only 30 W with a 30 W speaker your cleans do start crunching up if you get louder they live band. But the mezzabarba skill 30 head and the Altec for 17 seems like a good combination I could be playing in the loud seven piece 80s bands and the clean Chorus type parts stay super clean but then I can go to the high gain and do a screaming Van Halen lead and it’s not harsh. I did have a 412 with all Altecs which sounded great but was 100 pounds and totally impractical to use live. I am still curious about the Barefaced Cabs because the concept of The sound not changing drastically depending on listening position is very cool. I could set the amp to get a great sound right in front of it but then when I’m standing up at a gig the speaker is basically pointed at my legs and loses a lot of clarity which affects the “feel“ of the guitar.
Absolute genius this guy
Wow! what a cool break down and description of C speakers! I've had greenbacks, creambacks, VTs, and V30s. Out of these, I'm going to have to say the V30's sounded best for my preferred sound. 2x12 cabs with 2 1x12 cabs. If like to try the 250 coppers. They sound right up my alley. :o)
What a fantastic video. I've long been confused with Celestions colours, letters and numbers. This has cleared it right up for me.
I've recently been trying out some speaker options, I purchased a 5153 with matching closed back 1x12, I usually play with V30's but I was excited to try the G12h. Only a previous owner changed it out for an eminence Man-o-war that I can only describe as terrible. So I took 3 different v30's out my Marshall and Mesa cabs respectively and a Chinese V30 and trialled them in the 1x12. They all sounded much closer to what I'm used to hearing obviously but I was surprised at the tonal shift going from 4x12 to a 1x12 enclosure. You touch on it in the video where you describe the effects a 4x12 makes to the top end output, and how something like a H-heritage is great at lower volumes etc, it made me wonder...
Is there another celestion speaker that by itself in a 1x12 sounds more like, or has more of the characteristics that V30's do in a 4x12? (if that makes sense)
Thanks!
I honestly have used just about all of these expect the really loud 100+ watts but I still love the alnico blue the best is really think it is the nicest sound more the the other alnico’s, I also have vintage 30s in a lot of amps and I just started using v-types I really like them a lot
Have tested in detail AlNiCo Blue/silver, V30, G12M Greenback+ Creamback, G12H-30 Anniversary, G12-65, G12T-75 and -100. Best combination by my ear is AlNiCo and ceramic in combo. Playing rock/blues/americano/pop-reverby-stuff I use a vintage silver + G12H-30 in a 212 cab. For 112 I have not really decided. Have earlier used G12-65 and G12-100. Also tried 1x G12H-30. Now I use another AlNiCo silver VOX speaker, but with only 17W power rating it has limited volume. Looking for best >50W solution - Possible Creamback, but need to get a better overview of the Jensen/american voicings. Maybe a A-type is good second option? Most likely will end up with a Alnico Gold :D
Highly educational! I'm just now setting off down this rabbit hole and demystifying guitar loudspeakers has been requiring much time input, which is cool.
Back when I gigged in the late 80s and early half of the 90s, my main Thiele 2x12 slant had EV 100watt speakers. In my current researching I am finding my preference is Celestion H heavy magnet builds. Alnicos are very impressive sounding, thanks for the explanation on that!
I don't own any of the speakers in your presentation. At a friend's house in 2019 we put a bunch of his cabs through some paces and the speaker which really stood out as sounding great was a pair NEO Creamback in a Germino 2x12. I believe most of the other cabs had V30s, but I'm not certain. I currently have a couple Tech 21 PE60s with Seventy 80, a SS Princeton with the typical Fender blue OEM and a couple Fender CyberTwins with G12T-100 set up in a big multiAmp WDW setup. With a VHT 2562 incoming I'm looking to do some speaker experiments to go alongside building an all tube WDW setup.
Your video has me interested in the NEO 250, which is a surprise. I've watched a bunch of vids today on Celestion comparisons and the A-Type and Creamback H have stood out to me...my research continues and my cart is growing.
well, I bought four EVM 12L
Celestion Alnico Cream. Worth the price premium. I play with very tight high gain. It retains all of the definition of the distortion of my 25 watt Mesa Mark Series since the power handling is so much higher than the amp output. The alnico mag tames the harsh highs just enough to reign in any harshness and adds enough warmth to make chugging sound more organic and less sterile. Anyone who thinks alnico can't be used for metal should re examine this topic. I think I'll add a ceramic creamback when I upgrade to a 2x12 unless you have another suggestion. 50% of what I play is metal w/ the other half being jazz, fusion, neo soul, and blues. The Cream sounds great for most genres IMO and is just very clear, warm, and organic while filtering out harshness.
Agree, they are not flabby sounding at all, just big, bold and sweet and very 'firm' in the tone too.
I got a deal on 4 of them and put them into 2 2x12 closed cabs for some classic ZZ TOP rock and they are growing on me (usually play Greenbacks or G12H30)
Excellent comment
X4,,,? C
@@georgefromgreece4119 ycttyt yt cy. Tttttrt
I think it's important to test many speakers with all the different circuits that you can to find the most compatible combinations
make sure to observe proper impedence, I can also increase or decrease volume by adding speakers or decrease speaker sensitivity to lower volume increase speaker sensitivity to raise volume different type speaker for different type tone
The G12 H Anniversary is the best all around sounding IMO. Oozes classic rock and Paul Kossoff. Vintage 30s are great in 212s and paired with the G75s in a 412. Classic Lead is killer too and props to the Creamback 65
I find them a little high pitched in frequency yes too bright as he said.. creamback, white alnico and copperback...mixed various mid and low end speakers texas heat, swamp thang, blackbird alnico and a 4 ohm celestion 100 hot and now it's not high pitches and may not be for everyone...grungy and thick
Great video sir. In short I prefer low wattage speakers for the reasons you state. They sound sweeter faster. They are nearer to the floor if you will and do not require revving a 12 cylinder engine to 7000 RPM to get their legs stretched. G 12 M 20 and blue most near and dear to my heart. G 12 H 75 and 55 are excellent. Definitely very different to each other and to the previously mentioned and you can tell which 60s stars wound up on those particularly the 55. 35XC is a modern classic in my opinion. Truly great.
There are a few modern Jensens that are truly exceptional but not as uniformly exceptional as Celestions are.
I must say that random old alnico speakers are a treasure hunt worth excavating. There are some truly brilliantly great sounds out there. Lurking around in old people’s living rooms. And on eBay of course.
To hear you is to hear my own self. It’s refreshing to realize that someone else in the world realizes that all of these distinctions are not just stickers and plastics and designations. These are such all different animals.
One I failed to mention is the Marshall vintage modern greenback. G12c. I think it is basically an undoped G 12 m 25. Doping really takes the sweetness out of the mid range. And notably all of my favorite speakers by Celestion are undoped.
I wonder whether you know off the top your head whether the G 12 M 20 uses a paper former.
I like the vintage 30 in my 40c. Had to change the pre amp tubes and remove the c29 cap. Made the speaker perform a lot better. Sucks the greenbacks are only 30w.
Arghh. You didn't even talk about the Anniversary G12H ! I have one and it's actually sitting in a box at the moment. Was hoping you'd give me a clue as to proper application. I'm going to assume that, given it's position on the chart, that it's more of a lead guitar voiced speaker. But I also think that a lead guitar voiced speaker would actually be better for a gainier rhythm sound? Excuse my petty criticism. Really, really wonderful video. Genius !
As a bassist, this is the only video that's ever clearly explained the apparently-convaluted Celestion 12" speaker range - excellent job Alex, thanks! I'll look foward to a similar vid 4 the 10"ers, in due course. Have you done a similar video for the 10" & 12" bass speakers that your company get made by Eminence? Cheers - from a future 1x10" Barefaced bass cab user!
I shall do a video about the Celestion guitar 10"s and some more about our Barefaced 10CR and 12XN made by Eminence in due course! A
I had vintage 30s in a 2x12 but when I changed to a 4x12 I didn't like vintage 30s in that so I changed to g12m65 creambacks they sound much better. I found with the vintage 30s because of the higher sensitivity they don't break up as early as the creambacks plus creambacks are a lot smoother not so harsh. I use 2 2x12s now instead of a 4x12 it's easier to carry
Speaker Boffin Bae?
Best guitar speaker explanation I've heard so far. Please do one each for Jensen and Eminence...Please, please!
We're only fitting Celestion speakers here at the factory - it's complicated enough having all these choices! Glad it made sense! A
I came here looking for more information on my Marshall Heritage G12's
... RUclips videos on these are scarce & many are basically useless in my 'umble !
Looks like they're great for those 80's sounding cabinets
Any chance you could expound the virtues of these Speakers in another Video Barefaced Audio, I for one would appreciate that
Great video & interesting history lesson too ..... Keep up the good work
Joe from Tasmania / Australia
I have a Greenback, a Creamback, and an Alnico Cream. One of each. They each have their place. The Cream and Creamback each work great in a 1x12. The Greenback needs to be in a cranked 4x12 to sound good.
Thank you for the explanation. I am looking for a new 12" Celestion to replace the stock Seventy 80 that comes in many lower cost amps. I am really torn because I love the British G12M greenback from my long ago Marshall days, I like the Vintage 30 in a few different combos or cabs, and I am oddly drawn to the Blue for one low wattage tube combo (Blackstar Studio 10 KT88). I am assuming I want the low wattage speaker to provide the most character with my 10 watt amp. I plan on building another 1x12" cab (or perhaps a 2x12) to use with other heads or as extensions. For that I would need Greenback or Ruby. These days 15-22 watts is the max I am going to play. Wish I had space and money to try all of these out. Your explanation of the Alnico speakers confused me a bit. I get that they are not the classic rock sound from the 60-80s, but they seem quite popular with rock guitarists. I wish I could find a demo with my exact Blackstar Studio 10 KT88 with a Blue, a greenback and a vintage 30. Shit, the amp sounds decent with the cheapo Seventy 80 so I can only see it getting better. I love a Fender/Jensen sound for clean headroom, but prefer Celestion for anything dirtier. The Cele have a bark and snarl that I just love. Paired with a fun tube amp they are very satisfying. I know sound engineers who make all kinds of pro or con arguments about what sits in the mix best. Back to my project: I am likely to try a Greenback first based on cost. I have heard a Vintage 30 in a similar Blackstar amp and it was nice, but that amp had over twice the wattage of my 10 watt. This is why I believe the G12M-greenback 25 watt or Blue (15 watt) are my best best bets. Does this sound sensible? I play rock, blues, mostly of a classic rock style. I used to play punk and metal but those days are gone. Hendrix or Page fuzz sounds are about as heavy as I get and often just use a Spark boost pedal with a little gain dialed in on the amp for all the dirt I need while tracking. I can always add distortion in the mix but I can't take it away if tracked with too much. That said I like the Celestion bark and want that in my tracks.
i like both creambáck the m and the h its the ulimative 60s and 79s tone
I have four 4x12’s….every one of them are Marshall and have the Marshall G12 Vintage speakers (Original Version of the V30)……All from different eras…1987..1993..2003..and 2019….They are my favorite speakers by far…They just sound “right”to me….I have owned some G12M Greenbacks,which I didn’t care for….also G12-65’s,which I did like,but the Vintage 30 just sounds like what I think a guitar speaker should sound like…chest thumping low mids,nice soft crunchy midrange,and slightly rolled off treble…..the Greenback just sounds all farty in the low end,and it sounds like you put a blanket over the cab…what can I say..I have been playing V30’s for 35 plus years…I am a V30 guy for life….Great explanation of the difference in all these speakers though….
I don’t know about Celestion, but I have this 15” Magnavox Alnico from 1967 made by Eminence. I play it outside a cabinet and it has the most high end detail I have ever heard!!! Sometimes I turn it so the front of the speaker is facing down on some convenient surface, right now a cared board box. And it’s still plenty detailed. I shudder to think how it would sound if you made a 15” box.
This is great information, Cleared up many questions I had, I would like to know if there is a pdf available with all this great info. Thank you for explaining this to us.
That's a good idea!
15:55 “em-bigening” is not the only new thing I learned today but definitely the befunnerest.
REALLY appreciate your breakdown. Thx, much. BTW - I might suggest a different color, other than pale blue; on your white board.
I have no idea where all the whiteboard markers have gone but that was the only non-black colour I could find!
@@BarefacedAudio - na worries, mate. I could read it - but I had to focus closely. You also mentioned most of the stats.
It's easy to smooth out the vintage 30 harshness , just put MXR 10 band EQ in the fx loop, bring down 2Khz @ -6db and 4Khz @-4db. Now you will have smoother tone without sounding muffled, comfortable to be listened to at higher volume.
My Barefaced 1x12 I stuck with the V30 because it does everything I need from it at lower volumes and sounds good with my blackface Fender but can handle my JCM800 if needed and it really fills a room. For more power and heavier sounds I have a closed back 2x12 with the V30 up top and the G12H 75 Creamback on the bottom.
It would be interesting to find out how a Barefaced Reformer with a Redback or a Radical or Uprising with other speakers would compare to your closed back 212! A
@@BarefacedAudio It would. I certainly wouldn't mind if you wanted to send me one😁
I have experience with the alnico blue gold and cream, the heritage G12m and Heritage G12H (55hz) , the regular g12m and G12H, the 70th anniversary G12H, the the vintage 30, the g12Hcreamback and the v type. Celestions are my favorite all around speakers. I put them in about everything. I particularly like them in fender amps to fill out the midrange some. I have a 55 hz G12H in a deluxe reverb (a vintage 30 sounds good in that as well) also have a 70th anniversary G12H in a tweed deluxe and lots of g12m in Marshall style amps and dr z style amps. Alnico blue in vox style. V type in a fender brownface deluxe. I wouldn’t necessarily agree with all the characterizations (g12Hs seem to have a lot of lows in addition to the highs, I wouldn’t say alnico golds loose highs compared to blues and I wouldn’t say any single 12 sounds like a 4x12. But a good bit of these I would agree with. I also find the alnico cream to be quite versatile regardless of its power rating and seems to sound really good in a plethora of settings.
I like the sound of g12 h creamback 75w
the first G12 is actually from a radiogram speaker of the late 40s., id say via my research , I have a pair of the first radiogram speakers that the first guitar speakers were made from mine are around 1940s , the same alnico magnet just on a new basket . I have the very heavy cast basket the guitars speakers were a pressed steel basket,
That makes sense! I have a booklet on speaker making from that era by Gilbert Briggs of Wharfedale fame, which includes a chapter on loudspeakers for electric guitar and bass use. A
thanks for these explanations. I've got a VOXtb with a Bull Dog speaker and recently bought a later made VOXAC15c1 with a Greenback- quite a different sound! I was wondering if you know much about this VOX Bull Dog speaker and which Celestion it is most similar too, some say the Alnico Blue?
Excellent video, thank you! I'm most familiar with the Alnico Blue, the G12M, heritage and H, and the Vintage 30. I've found them very much as you describe. My 80s 4x12 with British-made Vintage 30s sounds better than my cabs with the newer Vintage 30s, even though the 80s cabinet itself is poorer quality. I love 4x12 speakers with 2x Vintage 30s and 2x G12 Heritage, or better still, 2x G12H. One of each in a 2x12 ought to sound great. The Alnico Blue is great for blues and classic rock, especially with a Vox amp, as you say. I've heard a cheaper cream back, but not the Alnico. Great for blues. I've only heard the Copperback with the Victory pedal amp. Tube preamp, digital power stage, then Copperback. Not an experience I enjoyed. The Victory amp was excellent, but the combination of digital power and unfamiliar speaker was too far from what I'm used to in my Classic/Hard Rock/Metal world. Instead of being inspired by tone, I had to concentrate and adjust my playing. Not fun, but far from an exhaustive audition. What have we learned? I'd love to audition your cabs with different cones, and eventually buy a 1x12, a vertical 2x12, and 2 horizontal 2x12s. Oh...and I use the word "great" far too often...
If you do any blindfold testing of cabs and cones, I'd happily help out, once people are able to safely get together again. I'm genuinely 100% blind, so my ears are all I can judge gear by. Thanks again for a very informative vid.
The 2x12 with a V30 and a G12H is exactly what I have and it does sound great.
Very well explained👍What speaker is likely to handle SRV-tone best without getting insanely loud?
The G12M goes lower than the G12H 55Hz 😳🤯