this weird circle graph format is based in the game lore you can see there's "alpha bracket" and "omega bracket", representing alpha and omega earth's (thats why theyre circular) in the lore, and give us a feeling like "oh so the omega earth champion is matching alpha earth champion wow what a confront!" :-)
Swiss system with bo1 until you play a match that's elimination or qualifying match Bo1: 0-0, 1-0, 0-1 matches Bo3: 0-2, 1-2, 2-2, 2-1 e 2-0 matches CSGO does that and 16 teams play 3~5 matches in 1 week with 32 teams, you can do this within 2 weeks 16 teams qualify to playoffs do the playoffs 3rd week: round of 16: 2 matches bo3 per day (thursday to sunday) 4th week quarter finals: 2 matches bo3 per day (thursday and friday) semifinals: 2 matches bo3 (saturday) final: 1 match bo5 (sunday) 4 weeks tournament done
I think, from what's been said on stream, sentinel's plan is to put tenz on jett on maps jett is meta, and kayo when another duelist or no duelist is meta, and have zekken flex
I'm so mad they split the brackets the way they did as far as the schedule goes. I wish they had all the R1 games in the first week so I can see all the teams instead of just half the teams. It's also just weird for the players because the week one players have like a week before they play again.
The main issue with the thought that multiple streams would have the smaller matchup not get watched is such a flawed one that I can't believe people are really using it as a serious excuse. Those teams aren't gonna get any more viewers just because it's on a main stream. There would be a miniscule increase if any at all. If no one wants to watch them on a b stream, no one's gonna watch them on a main stream.
@@Girvo747 what do you mean well see. We've already seen the previous tournaments and how the unknown teams get practically no viewership compared to the bigger teams
How can you argue for audience perspective being better when it's to justify worse teams getting further in the tournament? You can watch every game now but they're all going to be worse games so it doesn't matter.
the ludwig x tarik invitational vibe is honestly what smash events have already been like for a while and it would be great to see valorant casting start to take a change in that direction. smash has some of the best commentary out of any sport or esport ive ever watched and the vibe of valorant casting sometimes just feels too professional, forced, or even just boring a lot of times
See I think the exact opposite, smash commentary is one thing that makes it extremely hard for me to get into the game. If I’m watching a game that I don’t play at a high level myself, I want info. I want to know why the things are happening and what is happening, which I think Valorant does probably the best job in the industry at. The couch co-stream atmosphere is cool as well but please for the love of god, not on main broadcast. It works for a game like league of legends at times (the LEC pandemic home casts for example) in the moments where there is downtime, but Valorant as a game doesn’t have the largest amount of downtime without action.
Based Balla. LOCK//IN would be cool if it was a fun extra tournament, but the fact that it's instead of a Masters just means we're not going to get enough top level competition this year.
While I agree that it's unfortunate we won't get a second masters tournament, what you have to realize is that the format going forward will be just like this but without the Lock In tournament, probably to mirror League. So basically we're only gonna get 2 international tournaments per year, with this year being the one where we get an extra just to hype people up for the beginning of the partner leagues, which makes it alright in my opinion. If it's between only 2 events and having a third event that's got a casual, silly format, I will take the third event every time.
@@riivulet This is just incorrect. They've said in future years that the LOCK//IN will be replaced with a regular masters tournament, leaving two Masters a year + Champions.
i also kinda agree with wyatt and sideshow tbh. it is interesting to see teams battle it out so intensely at the very start because it’s all or nothing. tmv also said that this would be a great event for upset potentials and all which excites me. do i think it’s great for the players? absolutely not. it does suck given the fact 16 teams who practiced and all will only have one match but personally that one excites me because there should be no room for error. this event probably wont change my perspective to the teams if they get eliminated at the first round but it would change at the champion of this event given that they kept composed and win everything. but yeah i get it why a lot of ppl hate it
Definitely not a fan of the format.. I agree with balla that I don't mind these kinds of formats sometimes, but seems like a waste of 1 of only 3 international events. Idk just feels like we're getting short-changed for 1 of the most hyped events of the year.. If anything I'd rather see bo3 single elimination online qualifiers but then the teams who qualify go play in the masters/champs format. That way they wouldn't have to spend as much money since that seems to be 1 of the main reasons for this format, and we'd still get some really great storylines and potentially great revenge matches in the big tournament. The biggest reason I don't like single elimination here is that the seeding it totally random.. so you could potentially get a few of the best teams in the world playing eachother early and some of them being eliminated without and us never knowing which teams really were the best. I also think it adds a ton more stress to these teams, on top of there being a massive advantage for the teams that get to watch the 1st set of matches, especially since there's a totally new meta and very few teams have played with their new rosters in any officials. I also just enjoy watching teams make adjustments as the tournament goes on, and some of the biggest adjustments happen after a loss. Its always a great storyline to see a team who lost early come back through the lower bracket with a renewed understanding of the meta and how they want to play it
The thing is we could recommend a bunch of things but it just won't work cause riot doesn't have their priorities straight They value something that literally doesn't even matter now or in the long run
Swiss isnt bo1 josh. Go get eliminated in swiss theyd have to lose 4 maps. 2 bo1 losses then in the elimination game a bo3 loss. Its a far more "fair" format, allows more gameplay for teams, still produces upsets (especially in the bo1 games), and the best teams largely get through. I think a team losing 2 bo1s back to back is just as fair as losing a bo3. Btw promotion and elimination games in Swiss are bo3
Agree with most of the points about the Sentinels/Shahz drama but I will say, I didn’t even think the tweet was even remotely a jab at him-I took it as just a play on the common “Tenz go kill” copypasta, no? I can see why if shahz was annoyed by other stuff it would be interpreted as hurtful but I guess from my perspective it had nothing to do with Shahz or the igling from last year.
No it's definitely a jab at shahz. The copypasta was made to make fun of shahz because they're saying his strats are bad. So you saying that is also giving credence to the fact that it was towards shahz
@@343JustMe The copypasta wasn't made for that reason though, to my understanding. I definitely could be wrong on this but I thought the copypasta originated from CSGO. And regardless, it's more about how good tenz is, no? Like that was the point of it, it isnt actually saying anything about shahz really imo
@@343JustMe Not really, the copy pasta was made cause Tenz was just that good, and you might be forgetting, after Iceland where Tenz cemented himself as the best player where "tenz go kill" was still being used, Shaz was being hailed as the best IGL in the game and some had him as the best player in the game.
the main issue with the bracket is that the teams are seeded at random which means interesting teams like FNC or SEN are gone after the first day, having the teams actually seeded accurately like March Madness is the missing touch imo
Exactly, it's just a bunch of different mistakes that make it so this tourney is just an absolute nightmare. Riot also dont realize that a ton of people watch for their favourite teams. If I was a Sen or FNC fan and one of them went out round 1, I doubt I'd watch much of the tourney at all until the very end. There just no reason to commit a ton of time to be watching the matches especially when you don't have a stake in the tournament anymore.
@@Girvo747 yea because you don't care about competitive integrity at all. Structure is what brings the most hype and best grudge matches. I don't blame you but for real competitive watchers this format is a nightmare and a really big turnoff
I think arguing for a format that makes you say "its fine if you don't want to watch a bunch of Swiss matches, just wait for playoffs" is completely invalid. Competitively speaking sure it might be better, but remember this is the first tournament with 1 significant effect on the split that's meant to just be a showcase. A format that makes fans not want to watch 1/3 of the tournament and will therefore net riot negative views during that time period just isn't realistic. People need to realize we can't always have it all.
The people complaining about the single elim bracket now are just hypocrites. In 2021 we had single elim brackets at Masters and even CHAMPS and it was aweful but still everyone was defending the format lol But I agree that fully playing one side of the bracket first and then the other sucks
I don’t have an issue with the format, but I totally understand why some people do. Having legit seeding like March madness would make it a lot better, but I don’t think that’s possible when there’s so many new teams. There’s no perfect setup for this first event, but we all know it’s still gonna be banging either way.
Single elim = RNG 🤡 tournament Whoever wins this won't be the best team. That's how single elim always works. I am excited to see these teams but how teams do at this tournament will 0% affect how strongly I view them. Even if they win. Massive Riot failure.
I don’t understand the player/coach sentiment for the kick off tournament…the same people who will say the format is trash and the games are meaningless are the same ones who says “it’s all about champions anyway” “masters is cool, but champions is what really matters”. So how is this any different? How would having two masters be more meaningful then three distinct tournaments. As for “wasting time”, this is completely nonsense, these players are salaried employees of an organization and industry designed to play video games. So playing in an international tournament to kick off the new season is beneath a player? Players need a reality check that it’s not all about them - single elim is undoubtedly more unpredictable which usually leads to more interesting storylines.
If theyre going for viewership this format will have good early viewership but could fall off hard if better teams get upset or all the large fan base teams go out
Fusion had a 3 man DPS line up between him and 2 rookies, Zest and Mn3. Zest was an MVP candidate and carried this team to success on his flex DPS, also Carpe's flex is shit. Mn3 who was another hitscan was simply just the better option in terms of mechanical skill. Carpe became like a backup option because Zest and Mn3 just did everything that Carpe could do but miles better. He was simply a backup for emergencues which happened at the very end of the most recent post season.
28:20 having single elim the way they're doing will get the most viewership and make the most money. Companies care less about competitive integrity and more about viewership 👌👌👌
If you think about it, there might be a tier gap between the guard and the rest of tier 2. Looking at the evidence last year, they're the only team that made international events that didn't break up or make franchising. Even in the LCQ, they only lost to 100T. They beat the rest fairly handily, even faze and c9
Bro game companies arent feeling the recession nearly ad bad. Orgs are ran terribly and crypto had its fingers in almost every big org. Thats why orgs and tos have layoff. Riot could afford 30 all at once
Try not to mention sinatraa (IMPOSSIBLE CHALLENGE) felt so tense seeing if they would say anything even at the end for the weekly award 😂 “well known overwatch player” Also love Ballas stance on the Sao Paulo format, very in depth and straight up the truth
Stop complaining about your life, I literally have to live in Kent. As speculated, can confirm Kent is a county with a lot of wealth/income disparity. It definitely does have wealthy areas but it also has some of the most deprived areas in the country. I'm from one of the more deprived areas and it is indeed a shithole.
wyatt....good job on consistently narrating events for the Audio Listeners much apreciated
this weird circle graph format is based in the game lore
you can see there's "alpha bracket" and "omega bracket", representing alpha and omega earth's (thats why theyre circular) in the lore, and give us a feeling like "oh so the omega earth champion is matching alpha earth champion wow what a confront!"
:-)
Swiss system with bo1 until you play a match that's elimination or qualifying match
Bo1: 0-0, 1-0, 0-1 matches
Bo3: 0-2, 1-2, 2-2, 2-1 e 2-0 matches
CSGO does that and 16 teams play 3~5 matches in 1 week
with 32 teams, you can do this within 2 weeks
16 teams qualify to playoffs do the playoffs
3rd week: round of 16: 2 matches bo3 per day (thursday to sunday)
4th week
quarter finals: 2 matches bo3 per day (thursday and friday)
semifinals: 2 matches bo3 (saturday)
final: 1 match bo5 (sunday)
4 weeks tournament done
Put some respect on DSG
I think, from what's been said on stream, sentinel's plan is to put tenz on jett on maps jett is meta, and kayo when another duelist or no duelist is meta, and have zekken flex
Great episode of plat chat, loved the banter
56:47 well so what is a kind of repsonse
the online reactions, less so than 'personalities'
Single elim is exciting af, especially because it’s just this event. Fun start!
Can we petition to change the CEO of Sentinels? That guy is the biggest L boomer I think I've ever seen
I'm so mad they split the brackets the way they did as far as the schedule goes. I wish they had all the R1 games in the first week so I can see all the teams instead of just half the teams. It's also just weird for the players because the week one players have like a week before they play again.
And TSM are still Team Seriously Mid to me lol
The main issue with the thought that multiple streams would have the smaller matchup not get watched is such a flawed one that I can't believe people are really using it as a serious excuse. Those teams aren't gonna get any more viewers just because it's on a main stream. There would be a miniscule increase if any at all. If no one wants to watch them on a b stream, no one's gonna watch them on a main stream.
We’ll see. I reckon it’ll have more of an impact than you might think!
@@Girvo747 what do you mean well see. We've already seen the previous tournaments and how the unknown teams get practically no viewership compared to the bigger teams
How can you argue for audience perspective being better when it's to justify worse teams getting further in the tournament? You can watch every game now but they're all going to be worse games so it doesn't matter.
When will Wyatt make it to these valorant events 😢 I always feel bad seeing everyone at the events besides him
we want wyatt on the casters desk‼
He barely casts of course he isn't gonna get invited
@@343JustMe Wyatt has been casting events for different esports as well as Valorant. For years.
@@Blu_embers yea but he's not as good as the others and he rarely does it with valorant
Wait, he wasn’t invited? I always thought it was because he didn’t want to cast
the ludwig x tarik invitational vibe is honestly what smash events have already been like for a while and it would be great to see valorant casting start to take a change in that direction. smash has some of the best commentary out of any sport or esport ive ever watched and the vibe of valorant casting sometimes just feels too professional, forced, or even just boring a lot of times
Not all smash events mostly just summit
See I think the exact opposite, smash commentary is one thing that makes it extremely hard for me to get into the game. If I’m watching a game that I don’t play at a high level myself, I want info. I want to know why the things are happening and what is happening, which I think Valorant does probably the best job in the industry at.
The couch co-stream atmosphere is cool as well but please for the love of god, not on main broadcast. It works for a game like league of legends at times (the LEC pandemic home casts for example) in the moments where there is downtime, but Valorant as a game doesn’t have the largest amount of downtime without action.
Based Balla. LOCK//IN would be cool if it was a fun extra tournament, but the fact that it's instead of a Masters just means we're not going to get enough top level competition this year.
While I agree that it's unfortunate we won't get a second masters tournament, what you have to realize is that the format going forward will be just like this but without the Lock In tournament, probably to mirror League. So basically we're only gonna get 2 international tournaments per year, with this year being the one where we get an extra just to hype people up for the beginning of the partner leagues, which makes it alright in my opinion.
If it's between only 2 events and having a third event that's got a casual, silly format, I will take the third event every time.
@@riivulet This is just incorrect. They've said in future years that the LOCK//IN will be replaced with a regular masters tournament, leaving two Masters a year + Champions.
@@robreid5229 My b, in that case I agree
i also kinda agree with wyatt and sideshow tbh. it is interesting to see teams battle it out so intensely at the very start because it’s all or nothing. tmv also said that this would be a great event for upset potentials and all which excites me. do i think it’s great for the players? absolutely not. it does suck given the fact 16 teams who practiced and all will only have one match but personally that one excites me because there should be no room for error. this event probably wont change my perspective to the teams if they get eliminated at the first round but it would change at the champion of this event given that they kept composed and win everything. but yeah i get it why a lot of ppl hate it
Definitely not a fan of the format.. I agree with balla that I don't mind these kinds of formats sometimes, but seems like a waste of 1 of only 3 international events. Idk just feels like we're getting short-changed for 1 of the most hyped events of the year..
If anything I'd rather see bo3 single elimination online qualifiers but then the teams who qualify go play in the masters/champs format. That way they wouldn't have to spend as much money since that seems to be 1 of the main reasons for this format, and we'd still get some really great storylines and potentially great revenge matches in the big tournament. The biggest reason I don't like single elimination here is that the seeding it totally random.. so you could potentially get a few of the best teams in the world playing eachother early and some of them being eliminated without and us never knowing which teams really were the best. I also think it adds a ton more stress to these teams, on top of there being a massive advantage for the teams that get to watch the 1st set of matches, especially since there's a totally new meta and very few teams have played with their new rosters in any officials.
I also just enjoy watching teams make adjustments as the tournament goes on, and some of the biggest adjustments happen after a loss. Its always a great storyline to see a team who lost early come back through the lower bracket with a renewed understanding of the meta and how they want to play it
The thing is we could recommend a bunch of things but it just won't work cause riot doesn't have their priorities straight
They value something that literally doesn't even matter now or in the long run
as a viewer, i completely agree with wyatt on his single-elim take
Swiss isnt bo1 josh. Go get eliminated in swiss theyd have to lose 4 maps. 2 bo1 losses then in the elimination game a bo3 loss. Its a far more "fair" format, allows more gameplay for teams, still produces upsets (especially in the bo1 games), and the best teams largely get through. I think a team losing 2 bo1s back to back is just as fair as losing a bo3. Btw promotion and elimination games in Swiss are bo3
Agree with most of the points about the Sentinels/Shahz drama but I will say, I didn’t even think the tweet was even remotely a jab at him-I took it as just a play on the common “Tenz go kill” copypasta, no? I can see why if shahz was annoyed by other stuff it would be interpreted as hurtful but I guess from my perspective it had nothing to do with Shahz or the igling from last year.
No it's definitely a jab at shahz. The copypasta was made to make fun of shahz because they're saying his strats are bad. So you saying that is also giving credence to the fact that it was towards shahz
I don’t think it can be read as anything other than a shot at shahz though…
@@343JustMe The copypasta wasn't made for that reason though, to my understanding. I definitely could be wrong on this but I thought the copypasta originated from CSGO. And regardless, it's more about how good tenz is, no? Like that was the point of it, it isnt actually saying anything about shahz really imo
@@Girvo747 I mean, I definitely didn't read it that way. It's just referencing a copypasta, I didn't really interpret it as much deeper than that.
@@343JustMe Not really, the copy pasta was made cause Tenz was just that good, and you might be forgetting, after Iceland where Tenz cemented himself as the best player where "tenz go kill" was still being used, Shaz was being hailed as the best IGL in the game and some had him as the best player in the game.
Wyatt spittin facts about Sen 🤣
the main issue with the bracket is that the teams are seeded at random which means interesting teams like FNC or SEN are gone after the first day, having the teams actually seeded accurately like March Madness is the missing touch imo
Exactly, it's just a bunch of different mistakes that make it so this tourney is just an absolute nightmare. Riot also dont realize that a ton of people watch for their favourite teams. If I was a Sen or FNC fan and one of them went out round 1, I doubt I'd watch much of the tourney at all until the very end. There just no reason to commit a ton of time to be watching the matches especially when you don't have a stake in the tournament anymore.
I can kind of agree with this take. But also the randomness adds to the fun IMO!
@@Girvo747 yea because you don't care about competitive integrity at all. Structure is what brings the most hype and best grudge matches. I don't blame you but for real competitive watchers this format is a nightmare and a really big turnoff
Seeding makes the problem so much worse.
I just got home and was about to start eating my lunch when I started watching this video. Why 😢
I think arguing for a format that makes you say "its fine if you don't want to watch a bunch of Swiss matches, just wait for playoffs" is completely invalid. Competitively speaking sure it might be better, but remember this is the first tournament with 1 significant effect on the split that's meant to just be a showcase. A format that makes fans not want to watch 1/3 of the tournament and will therefore net riot negative views during that time period just isn't realistic. People need to realize we can't always have it all.
Please please more events like the ludwig x tarik. I've been dreaming about chill casts
The people complaining about the single elim bracket now are just hypocrites. In 2021 we had single elim brackets at Masters and even CHAMPS and it was aweful but still everyone was defending the format lol
But I agree that fully playing one side of the bracket first and then the other sucks
I don’t have an issue with the format, but I totally understand why some people do. Having legit seeding like March madness would make it a lot better, but I don’t think that’s possible when there’s so many new teams. There’s no perfect setup for this first event, but we all know it’s still gonna be banging either way.
Single elim = RNG 🤡 tournament
Whoever wins this won't be the best team. That's how single elim always works. I am excited to see these teams but how teams do at this tournament will 0% affect how strongly I view them. Even if they win. Massive Riot failure.
I don’t understand the player/coach sentiment for the kick off tournament…the same people who will say the format is trash and the games are meaningless are the same ones who says “it’s all about champions anyway” “masters is cool, but champions is what really matters”. So how is this any different? How would having two masters be more meaningful then three distinct tournaments. As for “wasting time”, this is completely nonsense, these players are salaried employees of an organization and industry designed to play video games. So playing in an international tournament to kick off the new season is beneath a player? Players need a reality check that it’s not all about them - single elim is undoubtedly more unpredictable which usually leads to more interesting storylines.
If theyre going for viewership this format will have good early viewership but could fall off hard if better teams get upset or all the large fan base teams go out
Wyatt "let me set the stage" Rivers xD
I love Josh and send him love for his loss
❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️
Haven’t been watching OWL since 5v5 came in. How come carpewas benched for most the season? He was a top player when I stopped watching
Fusion had a 3 man DPS line up between him and 2 rookies, Zest and Mn3. Zest was an MVP candidate and carried this team to success on his flex DPS, also Carpe's flex is shit. Mn3 who was another hitscan was simply just the better option in terms of mechanical skill. Carpe became like a backup option because Zest and Mn3 just did everything that Carpe could do but miles better. He was simply a backup for emergencues which happened at the very end of the most recent post season.
Carpe couldn't keep up, simple as that. Younger DPS came in and were simply better than him.
@@glxtchr4230 ah ok, thanks for the reply
@@bunndumm yeah makes sense ty
41:34 Wyatt having ptsd moment
100T gm, right?
@@gabes1733 yep
@@SiddarthaTB ty
wyatt will always hate sentinels!!!!
Kinda sucks they lost Demon1 tho, feel like him & Clear would’ve been a crazy duo
Exalt's doing a great job replacing Demon1, so all's good.
Watching this late and you were right about nation imploding but they didn’t even make it lol
28:20 having single elim the way they're doing will get the most viewership and make the most money. Companies care less about competitive integrity and more about viewership 👌👌👌
Sideshow has the best commentary
well there is the funny moment in the funny moments award 2023, Josh casualy throwing up in his hands after almost die
It's a good exiting format. Only butt hurt sen fans are screaming against it.
58:22 casual and laid back but also seriously competitive and high uqualtiy
1:41:47 that shit is too funny
I think sen did amazing. I think 90% of this tournament was the comms and making the team environment better.
Nice I ate my breakfast at the threw up Story from Sideshow 😂😂😂
I think the sideshow guy is looking to deep into this tourney for sentinels lol
Josh and wyatt predicting nsic just for them to bow out in 2 kekw
T1 should bring in JoXJo to igl until carpe is match ready
I dont watch any of the vct games unless plat chat or Wyatt costreams them tbh.
2:10:20
yo when are we gonna get video podcasts like ow
They threw T1 away after one tournament. Damn.
How do you choke on a piece of corn
josh is on his sen hate arc
32:32
Why is the only other option from this format a Swiss bo1??? There are a billion different formats that would work, it's not one or the other
Well don't wanna be rude but
Balla was one of the most boring coasters of vct
If you think about it, there might be a tier gap between the guard and the rest of tier 2. Looking at the evidence last year, they're the only team that made international events that didn't break up or make franchising. Even in the LCQ, they only lost to 100T. They beat the rest fairly handily, even faze and c9
Faze clan should be just as good tbh
TGRD also lost their old coach who was a big part of their success
Bro game companies arent feeling the recession nearly ad bad. Orgs are ran terribly and crypto had its fingers in almost every big org. Thats why orgs and tos have layoff. Riot could afford 30 all at once
Try not to mention sinatraa (IMPOSSIBLE CHALLENGE) felt so tense seeing if they would say anything even at the end for the weekly award 😂 “well known overwatch player”
Also love Ballas stance on the Sao Paulo format, very in depth and straight up the truth
Oh yea having 1 of Sen or FNC go out in the first round is totally not gonna cut viewership in half
5:51 ?
Stop complaining about your life, I literally have to live in Kent. As speculated, can confirm Kent is a county with a lot of wealth/income disparity. It definitely does have wealthy areas but it also has some of the most deprived areas in the country. I'm from one of the more deprived areas and it is indeed a shithole.
Hey…Platchat thanks for the smiles:)
I'm disappointed in Wyatt and sideshows take on the tourney