Since you asked: the only Age 2 unit that beats Doppelsoldners' base Siege damage are Samurai (67), but cost-efficiency wise (considering they are 2 pop units), I think Pikemen (64 for 160 recources and 2 pop) and Qiang Pikemen (60 for 140 recources and 2 pop) are still top dog.
Doppelsoldners are also slower... 0.5 M.S. x 20 seconds that it took to reach the outpost (probably times another 3 to get to a back T.P. line) is 30 less distance travelled over that minute compared to pikemen. 30/4.5 = 6.67 which is about another 150 siege damage lost per unit at 60 base siege.
I think Spain won because of these things 1) Revnak built a second town center instead of making more units or an artillery foundry. 2) Revnak should have used chevaulegers or doppelsoldners and not war wagons which are very slow and tend to get caught by infantry. 3) Germany cannot send 2 falconets in age 3, so they will sacrifice many units trying to eliminate enemy cannons. 4) Revnak aged late to fortress age, he should ignored the tower
1:47-157 - Teach me maths Lion Daddy... we needed the spamming maths & geometry gif there! Also just found it, but will have to go & spend the weekend looking back in the Fitness section of the discord... also need to ask a few questions if that's alright. I've also spoken to Dutch... he does sound like that!
I watched enough Lionheart now to automatically spoil myself whenever i see Revnaks Account shown in a Casted Match... I didnt even watch this Video yet. I see a Spain Title and a German Top 1 Player? Yeaaa you know where this is going to end up haha
A few things I noticed-a) Skirms can't kite rods continuously. Kiting needs 3 things- extra range, extra speed and space to move. Lack of one of them stops kiting. b) Artillery makes a better case for germany vs spain because of extra range(26 vs 20 of skirm), splash damage and as hard counter vs a civ with strong high dps infantry. c) Since artillery is coin heavy, FI or coin cards should be considered for reliable coin generation. Should also be a theoretical counter to spanish gold.
i dont think playing late against spanish gold is any reliable strategy against it, unless its super late game like for 1 hour or so. i think its all about solid push without falling back. base trade is usually good against spanish gold since your opponent needs to use his settlers to spend time on cutting trees for additional shipment spawning points.
The Rodeleros are beateble for Germany, actually quite nicely with artillery. Rush to Age 3 build falcs, protect them with Dopps and you are fine. It's just very gold heavy
With how often I see lion's big heavy balls missing their target... I thought faster moving units might exacerbate this. Obviously there is the bounce mechanic alongside distance and such, but it seemed at least somewhat intuitive (but that's adding out of game logic of course).
Depends on what you wish to counter and the recources you have. Skirmishers are much more expensive to mass and very Coin heavy, but they have more range, hitpoints and ranged resist, and counter heavy infantry like pikes and musketeers more effictively thanks to higher multipliers and the Counter Infantry upgrade in the Arsenal. Crossbows are weaker and cost Wood, but much easier to mass. In large groups they can be very cost-efficient especially against Dragoon- light infantry compositions, but 1 on 1 Skirmishers can wipe the floor with them thanks to their superior range, hitpoints and range resistance, so I guess that's why Kaiser opted for Skirmishers here
@@Dutch_is_a_Weird_Language thank you! Learning the game with all these multipliers makes it sometimes harder to know if some units are better. It explains why janissary always run over my poor crossbow dudes
Skirms are generally better for a few reasons even with upgrades for crossbows. First is that they have 20 range vs. 16, that's a significant difference, especially when countering ranged cavalry. Skirms have a much better firing animation and also do not require veteran upgrade. It's 400 resources and train time but with the other drawbacks too, it's just not worth using crossbows beyond colonial unless you have to. There are some special exceptions and maps where crossbows 'may' be worth it (e.g Florida with native upgrades) but that's rare. It's probably the firing animation that's the big deal here, if that was better you'd probably see crossbows more.
@@mannyramirez5630 also rarely when advanced arsenal comes in clutch you have more upgrades for your gunpowder infantry, but not for crossbows specifically. main exception to this is portugal with a card that makes your crossbows being gunpowder infantry too.
Dopps beat rodeleros and lancers (and also pike, hussar, and goons and musks in late game), so its just skirms and cannons left, wich can be countered also by uhlans, or with cannons. But yeah, germany have so many disadvantages since their units are way too expensive, slow, hard to use and etc. and not really that strong... And dont know why he did WW, all spanish army (rods-skirm) countered it
When I first played AOE3 I always thought of rodeleros as very weak units, but they can be far more useful by the looks of it if you know how to use them
My opinion, Spain played flawlessly his deck Germany, did not make any cannons nor use Native Outpost nor produce mercenaries. As a german player i'd use 10 Pistoleros to take care of the Rodeleros. Never undersestimate the power of PISTOLERO ruclips.net/video/w0qfQaJtF2E/видео.html&ab_channel=Movieclips
![[DRAGON BALL LEGENDS REVEALS ＆ STUFF] LEGENDS FESTIVAL 2024 Special Edition Part 2](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/af0phKxitX8/mqdefault.jpg)
Since you asked: the only Age 2 unit that beats Doppelsoldners' base Siege damage are Samurai (67), but cost-efficiency wise (considering they are 2 pop units), I think Pikemen (64 for 160 recources and 2 pop) and Qiang Pikemen (60 for 140 recources and 2 pop) are still top dog.
haha thank you!
Was also going to say this
I would have imagined was something like brits granadier with attack cards or a random gian granadier 😂 good to know
Doppelsoldners are also slower... 0.5 M.S. x 20 seconds that it took to reach the outpost (probably times another 3 to get to a back T.P. line) is 30 less distance travelled over that minute compared to pikemen. 30/4.5 = 6.67 which is about another 150 siege damage lost per unit at 60 base siege.
combine with church card it better
He needed to make some artillery backed by pike units
True, germany must make royal horse train card
I think Spain won because of these things
1) Revnak built a second town center instead of making more units or an artillery foundry.
2) Revnak should have used chevaulegers or doppelsoldners and not war wagons which are very slow and tend to get caught by infantry.
3) Germany cannot send 2 falconets in age 3, so they will sacrifice many units trying to
eliminate enemy cannons.
4) Revnak aged late to fortress age, he should ignored the tower
killing the tower is fine, it delays the spain player
Important fact to know: the archaic infantry combat card also affects your war dogs.
as if they needed buffing haha
War dogs are also affected by the infantry breastplate tech, so even more buff @@lionheart9015 🦮
Imagine being so salty you lost that you resort to playing Germany trying to win the rematch...and you still lose. 😂
1:47-157 - Teach me maths Lion Daddy... we needed the spamming maths & geometry gif there!
Also just found it, but will have to go & spend the weekend looking back in the Fitness section of the discord... also need to ask a few questions if that's alright.
I've also spoken to Dutch... he does sound like that!
Maths isnt my strong point haha and ask as many questions as you like
When "Germany is broken civ" meets any civ with cav and anticav
I watched enough Lionheart now to automatically spoil myself whenever i see Revnaks Account shown in a Casted Match...
I didnt even watch this Video yet. I see a Spain Title and a German Top 1 Player? Yeaaa you know where this is going to end up haha
A few things I noticed-a) Skirms can't kite rods continuously. Kiting needs 3 things- extra range, extra speed and space to move. Lack of one of them stops kiting. b) Artillery makes a better case for germany vs spain because of extra range(26 vs 20 of skirm), splash damage and as hard counter vs a civ with strong high dps infantry. c) Since artillery is coin heavy, FI or coin cards should be considered for reliable coin generation. Should also be a theoretical counter to spanish gold.
i dont think playing late against spanish gold is any reliable strategy against it, unless its super late game like for 1 hour or so. i think its all about solid push without falling back. base trade is usually good against spanish gold since your opponent needs to use his settlers to spend time on cutting trees for additional shipment spawning points.
Great match thanks for the content.
Thanks for watching King
The Rodeleros are beateble for Germany, actually quite nicely with artillery.
Rush to Age 3 build falcs, protect them with Dopps and you are fine.
It's just very gold heavy
With how often I see lion's big heavy balls missing their target... I thought faster moving units might exacerbate this. Obviously there is the bounce mechanic alongside distance and such, but it seemed at least somewhat intuitive (but that's adding out of game logic of course).
Is this Kaiserklein? Or Kaister? Pr are theu the same person?
Kaiserklein and Kaister are different persons, the former does like baguette and the latter doesn't.
Kaister lol
I'm new to competitive aoe3, stat lines are difficult for me to understand. Are skirms always better than crossbows if you're going archaic upgrades?
Depends on what you wish to counter and the recources you have. Skirmishers are much more expensive to mass and very Coin heavy, but they have more range, hitpoints and ranged resist, and counter heavy infantry like pikes and musketeers more effictively thanks to higher multipliers and the Counter Infantry upgrade in the Arsenal. Crossbows are weaker and cost Wood, but much easier to mass. In large groups they can be very cost-efficient especially against Dragoon- light infantry compositions, but 1 on 1 Skirmishers can wipe the floor with them thanks to their superior range, hitpoints and range resistance, so I guess that's why Kaiser opted for Skirmishers here
@@Dutch_is_a_Weird_Language thank you! Learning the game with all these multipliers makes it sometimes harder to know if some units are better. It explains why janissary always run over my poor crossbow dudes
Skirms are generally better for a few reasons even with upgrades for crossbows. First is that they have 20 range vs. 16, that's a significant difference, especially when countering ranged cavalry. Skirms have a much better firing animation and also do not require veteran upgrade. It's 400 resources and train time but with the other drawbacks too, it's just not worth using crossbows beyond colonial unless you have to. There are some special exceptions and maps where crossbows 'may' be worth it (e.g Florida with native upgrades) but that's rare. It's probably the firing animation that's the big deal here, if that was better you'd probably see crossbows more.
@@mannyramirez5630 also rarely when advanced arsenal comes in clutch you have more upgrades for your gunpowder infantry, but not for crossbows specifically. main exception to this is portugal with a card that makes your crossbows being gunpowder infantry too.
Thanks guys, this is great info! Hopefully I improve my 30 percent wr
cant believe discord hate puppies :(
There is only one way to beat rods as Germany. Spam as many toxic walls as possible and place some arty behind.
Dopps beat rodeleros and lancers (and also pike, hussar, and goons and musks in late game), so its just skirms and cannons left, wich can be countered also by uhlans, or with cannons. But yeah, germany have so many disadvantages since their units are way too expensive, slow, hard to use and etc. and not really that strong...
And dont know why he did WW, all spanish army (rods-skirm) countered it
When I first played AOE3 I always thought of rodeleros as very weak units,
but they can be far more useful by the looks of it if you know how to use them
They dont really have a hard counter when you mass enough of them, great unit honestly
I think if German built three layers of walls, should win this. He didn’t wall this time.
15:37 Should have been 69 !!! 😂😅
🤣
Economy is everything
peace
I'd never go WW against Spain, he should have gone for artillery and Chevaulegers.
underestimated unit!
always great seeing revnak lose. what a clean up at the end as well!
I think rodeleros have 3x attack against cav but not against anti cav. isnt it?
Why didnt he make some artillery
Germany only S tier civ in the game 👀
😂
gg ez
Germany OP
🤣
My opinion,
Spain played flawlessly his deck
Germany, did not make any cannons nor use Native Outpost nor produce mercenaries.
As a german player i'd use 10 Pistoleros to take care of the Rodeleros.
Never undersestimate the power of PISTOLERO
ruclips.net/video/w0qfQaJtF2E/видео.html&ab_channel=Movieclips
But at the end of the day what are you going to be? A revnak dsc gg hotp promoter or a kaister dsc gg hotp hater?