There was a chap on our street who had a FSO P and polished it every weekend a couple of doors up there was a Lada and he argued constantly how much better his FSO was over the Lada. The saga continued when the Lada owner upgraded to a Samara... Enter the glorious FSO Polinez and the weekend polishing and arguing continued!! Ahhhh life in a 1980's Northern Town!
@@kierancurtis8545 Lada had better engine and theoretically better suspension. 125p had much stronger platform. In Lada and many other cars of the era main chassis stringers end by the ends of cocpit, which means in case of accident the cabin is only held by the doorstep profiles and the roof. 125p had the heavy Fiat platform with big stringers going through entire car alongside the center tunnel. Each side is like 5mm thick, it's like a frame was added to a monocoque body. In the engine bay those stringers had huge round holes to make them collaps in the collision. The boot part is built like a friction shock absorber. One square pipe put into another that narrows slightly. I've learnt that when I had to repair a corrosion in one of those cars and after cutting through the rotten part, discovered the rear stringer is not a single element but a shock absorber.
@@antuha-cs4ie the road and service conditions on the East were quite different. Very few Western cars could actually survive there. Keep that in mind.
That intro was really quite something, I thought I was still watching an advert for a moment! 🤣 My parents used to own a Polonez back in around 1983, they said it was the heaviest car they've ever driven, and that the steering was guaranteed to build upper body strength. However, they also said that it was such a rock-solid machine that other drivers probably knew to keep out of its way, lest they end up on the losing side of a collision! Another superb video, great work! 😁
First two weeks of driving (parking) Polonez with no PS my muscles hurt. Then I drove a friend after parking she asked if it has power steering?! No I have said I am just that strong :)
I purchased one of these in March1983. It was the top of the line with alloy wheels, sun roof, lifetime rust proofing warranty and 10 speed windscreen wipers. To top off the deal, it came with a 4 berth caravan, fully fitted out with kitchen, wardrobe, double bed and two bunks, at no extra cost. I can't remember what I paid but the car on it's own was a bargain. In the 4 years I owned it it was very reliable with only the charging regulator failing ( done under warranty ).
Never saw one, did see the Lada, a Russian Fiat, that rusted too hell after a few weeks. Sadly it was a chance for a working class man to finally own a new car.
@@seltaeb3302 There were some cars sold in what was called 'internal export', Polonezes sold in Poland but for foreign currency (without allowance ticket or waiting list). Many of them had a peculiar rustproofing; so any profile, like stringer or doorstep, and anything not outright visible, like undergaps between body pannels and under doors were covered in a mixture of wax, oil and corrosion inhibitors. I own such Polonez from 1989 and since then it survived with only a few spots and otherwise is totally healthy and would survive another ten years without a touch. I think export cars after certain years and on some markets did receive same treatment. This is something you might want to do on a new car, since rustproofing these days is terrible again, but there are sprays to do something similar. It takes some knowledge how a bodyshell is built as well as some crawling though.
@@seltaeb3302 The original Fiat version rusted faster than the Lada. There was another car from the Soviet Union, the Moskvich, that rusted faster than either but had quite decent mechanical parts.
All things considered they weren't really a bad looking car. Not top of the line as far as styling goes but generally acceptable for your everyday runabout.
@@seltaeb3302 They wouldn't rust, under the condition that you properly conserved them yourself. Turns out this was as an option done by factory or dealership. I heard a few stories and I bought one that had a peculiar conservation system. Doesn't look very clean, but apparently worked since 1989.
I grew up in Poland around the time the Polonez came out, and I remember quite a few people talking about it as a bit of a modern, aspirational vehicle. We never got one, but after a few years on the waiting list, my parents got a Fiat 125. Thanks for the trip down memory lane.
What an interesting time for Poland and Europe. Meanwhile Poland was politically shedding the Soviet yoke (solidarnosc) before anyone other country. ❤🇵🇱from 🇬🇧
@@zogzoogler Thanks for the ❤ I was too young to have a full grasp of what was going on, but I definitely remember a lot of tension. I do remember my dad parking the car in a massive queue when we heard a supply of petrol was coming in, and leaving it there overnight, sometimes longer. I also remember the empty grocery stores shelves. And the food stamps. Sometimes you even got candy! It all seems so surreal now. For some reason, I do have fond memories of the kool-aid type drinks sold in clear plastic bags. I'm sure they were awful, but it was always a treat when we got one. Good times!
I recall my mother saying, you had to be either in the Police force, communist party or in some other form of Government to be able to afford a Polonez or to simply jump the queue on the waiting list for one of these cars…People waited up to a year just for the Polski Fiat (Maluch) , so I can’t even imagine the waiting list for a Polonez…
@@paulsz6194 My father knew someone who traveled abroad for work and who was able to acquire some US dollars. Apparently, those were quite effective at jumping the queue as well.
In 1978 I owned a 1300 125p. By 1979 I had (with the guidance of Practical Mechanics magazine) replaced the engine with a Fiat 1600 twin cam, changed the seats (which were plastic) into cloth type seats from a Fiat 125, changed the gearbox to a Fiat 5 speed, changed the front grill from black plastic to a chrome grill from a Fiat 125 and changed the dashboard to a recessed speedo and and rev counter. I also had to convert the clutch from hydraulic to cable. From the outside the car was undeniably a standard 125p but it gave drivers of the new Golf 1500 a bit of a shock when pulling away from the lights :) I really liked the car, it was simple and never let me down. I remember the Polonez being launched but could never afford to own one back then. Great video, thanks for sharing the info.
This episode amazed me in three different points in particular: 1. The (as usual) well researched story about a quirky Eastern block car. 2. The intro. 3. The unexpected view of the Lego Technic helicopter, my most beloved Lego set as a kid.
It's a new Lego model. I bought most of the parts new from Lego. I had to source some used as they weren't made any longer. I used to have one but stupidly sold it.
I recollect that the Polonez even got a Rover K engine ats some point in its life. During the RAI (Dutch international motor show) we as enginering students got free tickets to attent the show. Just after the fall of the Iron curtain those former other then Lada eastern block cars were way more exotic to us then Italian sportscars. The trabant with a VW polo engine, Polonez with a 16v Rover K engine, Skoda Rapids in special rally trim.
Correct. 1.4 103BHP version was mass produced from 1993 to 1998, and there were several hundreds made with 1.6 and 1.8 liter. It actually gave the car it's second chance after death, when people saw on Google video and early years of RUclips what this car could do. Since most VW Golfs on Polish roads were II, IIIrd generation usually with 65BHP engine, Polonez with Rover engine was a cheap sleeper. I remember embarrasing several hot headed guys with it even past 2010. Now people put 1.8 VVC in.
@@piotrmalewski8178What is wrong with the Polonez's original engine? It has hemispherical cylinder heads with the valves worked by pushrods, done by having four of the pushrods cross from one side of the engine to the other by passing between the cylinders. It also has the Lodz-Weber carburettor with very precise mixture control. You can set it up so that the exhaust emissions are so clean that the MoT tester thinks his measuring apparatus has gone wrong. I think this engine is also in the 125p.
@@cedriclynch The 1.5 liter pushrod had only 3 crankshaft bearings and it developed relatively high maximum power thanks to being tuned to high rpms. This meant it lacked any low revs torque and you had to rev it high which didn't suit character of the car, and a normal user who was not educated could break the engine easily. I remember my uncle would not downshift from 5th gear unless going under 50kph which was a murder to this engine. You could rev it safely to 8 thousand rpms on stock valve springs but most people just didn't know how to use it. Rover was much better with good low-end torque and 5 crankshaft bearings. Besides, for some odd reason it would make the whole body resonate in a literally painful-to-the-driver way if driven under 2200 rpms which corrected any incompetent instantly. 125p originally had 115c engine (different engine code, Polonez' 1.5 liter was coded AA and AB depending on camshaft type) 115c had different and obsolete lubrication system and a few other changes (they say there were 124 modifications in AA versus 115c by 1978). Not sure if translating it correctly but 115c had centrifugal oil filter alongside the normal one, which required cleaning like ever 60 thousand miles, and it didn't have modern type seals on valves while Polonez had. Eventually 125p received Polonez upgraded engine in the 'M' version, also many units were more or less modified aftermarket. There were also many 125ps rebuilt into Polonezes after accidents so you never really know what the heck is under the bonnet unless you take a good look at it.
I bought a second hand, and I can confirm that the seats were very good. Another god thing was that you could change the coals of the generator without dismantling it. But if you had had Citroën gs like me, the steering was absolutely terrible. One thing I never will forget, I turned to the left and suddenly I heard a strange sound. I thought the gearbox or the transmission had a problem, so I stopped the car, but I didn't stop the engine. Stepped out and went to the back to look underneath the car, and what I saw was something unbelievable. The fuel tank had fallen off, and gasoline was pouring out, and the warm exhaust pipe was right beside it. I jumped back and switched the engine off. It happened New Year's evening's afternoon and the car was stuffed with fireworks, so it could have ended up in a very big fireworks. Nevertheless, I drove 70.000 km in it, and it was the cheapest 70.000 I have ever experienced.
@@Low760 The fuel tank was held by two steel stripes. Technically those stripes had a lifespan of like 15 years and should have been covered with aluminium layer, but with little quality control, it's possible in his car they were made of sulphur-contaminated steel and rotted from the inside. When I replaced the whole thing in my 14 years old car, I covered the stripes in chlorinated rubber and added rubber isolator between them and the fuel tank.
To Torben Larson. There was something similar about Skoda. There was something like that which could have caused a fire, and "something or other" was re-routed to prevent that. BUT ONLY FOR EXPORT. Local customers didn't count!
We owned a 1987 FSO Polonez 1.5 SLE (two mirrors, adjustable steering column, 5speed, full instrument panel etc), and honestly this car was a workhorse. Spacious, solid, super reliable, comfortable, it offered us the most an Eastern European car could offer (it was very cheap in Greece) and despite it's rear solid axle with leaf springs it handled really well. The only drawback but that was common during those years, was the heavy steering especially during parking manoeuvres. But that was literally nothing compared to it's overall performance. I really miss it.
I'm yet to discover what the previous owner has done with steering in my car. There is no power steering but I can turn the wheel with one finger. On the other hand, Polonez has very 'quick' steering for the time, so it's expected it should give a lot of resistance. My first Polonez, the widened one with Rover engine did have heavy steering, but after a few drives I got so used to it it was never a problem again.
@@pieterwoerden2701 My father drove a Polonez 1500 as a taxi in the 1980s, supported his entire family by working and earned several times more than most working Poles at that time. My father drove 200,000 kilometers in this taxi car and never had a breakdown! Greeting from Poland.
@@PocałujmniewdupęPocałujmniewdu That's great. Perhaps the Polonez is the victim of anti-USSR propaganda, which was the case at the time. Lada's also had a name for a poor finish.
@@pieterwoerden2701 What cars did the Netherlands produce in the 1970s? At that time, Poland produced several models of passenger cars, several models of delivery vehicles, several models of mopeds and motorcycles, and all these vehicles were exported to several dozen countries around the world, including highly industrialized countries! At that time, Poland was earning billions of dollars on the export of these vehicles! Poland was the most devastated country by the War, Poland did not receive help in the form of the Marshall Plan and yet Poland was able to reclaim the entire country, the entire industry and construct, produce and sell its own industrial products! Polish tractors and Polish combine harvesters were even exported to the USA!!!
I used to sell new FSO’s during the 80’s and 90’s . They were surprisingly reliable and pretty tough! They suffered with electrical gremlins’ but otherwise a good car and value for money.
@@witchcraftanditsconsequenc4280 Only now noticed that. But that was the point of the test. Behind the wheel in this specific clip, engineer Janusz Gutowski. He said himself that after a test run on this track he would send cars back with average of 30 to 40 issues. In one unit a suspension arm fell off, and record breakers were sent back to be repaired and improved 5 times before they would pass the test and not make any weird noises.
BMW. Bayerische Motoren Werke IVECO. Industrial Vehicles Corporation SAAB. Svenska Aeroplan Aktie Bolag FIAT. Fabrica Italiana Automobili Torino and many more.
I've always loved the design of this car. There's something about it that feels right from almost all angles, especially in the pre-facelifted versions
I recently realised it was the 1970s equivalent of an SUV. Just not an SUV. If you look closely, the general wedge shape and fake side air intakes suggest a loose inspiration from 1970s supercars. It's like a few basic lines of a70s mid-engine wedge shape supercar streched onto a family car.
I didn't realise Fiat had any inputs to the styling. I now see similarities with the styling of their Strada. Fun fact: The styling of the Hyundai Ioniq 5 is a homage to that of their Pony. Another Italian styled car from that time.
@@torstenscholz6243 Nah, Lancias looked different. There is some similarity to Delta but the two cars are totally different in terms of platform and proportions. I think originally it was some dropped Fiat project. Perhaps one aimed for US market VW Passat Passat B1 looked very similar, but was more rounded and had 3rd windows instead of fake vents. Giugiaro styled them both.
Ah, the Polonez - my uncle had one of these many years ago. He invariably described that thing as a "tank" but it took whatever he threw at it. I remember how every time my cousins got a lift into town in it, they'd ask to be dropped off fairly far from where they wanted to go just so their mates wouldn't see them getting out of the back of the FSO. It was barely one step above a Lada in their eyes, I guess! I also remember getting a lift in a Caro, one of a few sold in the UK with the 1.9 PSA diesel motor.
I've had an Opel/Vauxhall/Buick/Holden Cascada, since 2013, a Polish made posh convertible sold all over the world and I love it. I'd have no hesitation buying a Polish made car.
Former brother in law bought a Lada Riva 1.3SL brand new in the early in the 80's followed up after 3 years by a 1.5 Polonez - both agricultural and crude but as a mechanic he had the tools and knowledge to maintain both. His verdict? The FSO was the winner.
My father had a 125p from 1979, the year I was born, until 1993. Our best friends had a Lada and I have fond memories from both. At the same time there was one single Polonez where I grew up and, as I was riding past it with my bicycle, I always thought it looked like a spaceship, compared to our 125p. I was happy to see many 125p in Poland and a 125p Story would be a dream!
Many thanks for bringing back memories from my teen years. Who didn't dream about Polonez back then in Poland? Congrats on your acting skills in the intro! Well done!
This is extremely well researched, given how much confusion and inaccurate information there in Polish publications about the car, but I'll still give a few info and corrections if I may: 1:53, the original 125p looked differently than this facelift model shown here. Mechanicals from the 1300/1500 is generally correct, however there were some modifications to the engine and the brakes were from the new 125. 2:27 , the 1,3 Coupe from 1974 had nothing to do with 125p. It had centrally mounted drivertrain from Fiat 128. It was mid engine. 3:00. The 1,3 and 1.5 push rod-engines were intended to be replaced from the very start. They were only supposed to be used in Polonez for the first few years and quickly replaced with a new family of SOHC engine of 1.6 to 2 liter capacities. Based on this idea FSO also worked with Ricardo on 2 liter diesel engine, and made 60 units before the project was cancelled. 7:50 - this is in an official version, but probably the whole contest was faked. Besides, rapid change of names from Polski Fiat to FSO was a shot in the knee, and on some markets like Finland the name Polski would remain. 9:38 - Turning circle was 10,8 meters which was less than Passat B1. Also, as it turned out, it could have been lowered be changing placement of front brake calipers, which was done in I think 1994. 10:41 - the lever was designed this way so it could be connected directly to the gear selector without any linkage and thus remove the need for adjustments and replacements. 11:27 - actually 90 miles an hour is a figure for fully loaded car. In reality those cars could do about 110 but it varied a lot on quality of each unit and wether or not carburettor settings were right. The engine mostly lacked low end torque for a car that heavy though, which also contributed to lifespan issues. 12:00 - actually the doors on the three door were same as in any car of the kind, that is: much longer. I don't think this version was ever seriously considered as a mass volume car, since the production line was not programmed for 3 door types and they were largely welded manually. Apparently there were some thoughts of turning them into GT or sports cars. Not just because of 2000 Turbo prototype rally car, but also because they were offered with very high trim levels and various modifications like shorter main gear, or 2 liter engine. The 2000 Turbo was extensively tested and competed in all rounds of National Championships, so should the situation not been as terrible as it was, they would have made at least several hundreds of 3 door 2 litre turbos. 13:41 - to my best knowledge no improvements or changes have been done to suspension untill 1993 when it was widened front and rear, received stronger shock absorbers and thicker springs at front. There could have been some variation on the thickness or the number of leaf springs though. 17:43 - actually early 90s and transition to market economy caused huge unemployment and deterioration of life standard for many people, however the economy also began to grow rapidly and Polonez being not much more expensive Fiat 126p and cheaper than Fiat Ciqnquecento effectively helped to do it because it big and hefty enough to do anything. For years to come those cars would go around loaded to the roof and pulling trailers of goods for sale on street markets. Not everyone wanted pickup truck, and hatchback Polonez would be as much of a family car as a substitute of a truck. 18:22 - a lot of these options were available back in 1980s, just not in domestic market. As for Caro, it even had an option of the inner part of light alloys to be painted in body color. There were also 3 different steering wheel patterns and 4 different types of seats to be chosen, the standard ones, and 3 'Inter Groclin' types; air cushoned, hard bucket, and 'Akupresura', a type of soft bucket seat. 20:58 - there was absolutely no changes to the front suspension at this point. It could have been easily modified to provide more grip, since double wishbone is a very flexible setup when it comes to choosing different settings, but this would have made a live axle car aggressively oversteer, so this was never done outside rally cars. The belief that anything changed was probably coming from the fact that at this point the negatives at the factory were worn out, and all cars had slightly twisted front which requred very uneven number of washers under upper suspension arm mountings in every car, and thus repair books give slightly different wheel angle tolerances. If you're mentioning all those details, I'd have rather mentioned introduction of new Lucas braking system as an option in 1993 and making it standard in 1995. However, while an improvement, the braking was long in comparison to newer competitors. The real strenght of this car was that primitive high clearance suspension and standard steel skidplate made it resilient to the terrible shape of the Polish roads back then. Beginning and this: 24:21 - Polonez was actually hated for many years. Initially because there was a misconception that only communist party members would drive i and in the 90s because it was often someone's first car, not properly mained and to tell the truth, production quality had dramatic fluctuations from unit to unit so those cars deteriorated rapidly and people thought of it as something they wanted to get rid off. Those cars only got some positive recognition in the last 10 or 15 years because of nostalgia and various internet publications. For example it's safety provess was never properly marketed. Nobody ever had an idea to take let's say BMW E36 and crash it against Polonez. People only learnt how well Polonez' body was designed after it vanished from the market and articles from crash tests and street images and news of people driving Polonezes surviving horrible crashes have circled the internet. It makes you thinking when when you see in crash tests and images from real street crashes that Polonez' cocpit would almost never give up, while even BMW E36 would collapse in standard crash test and A pillar stab the driver.
One more info I'd add: 125p was still manually welded which was a big problem. Not because of human personnel costs because the full employment policy in socialist economy and trade unions after fall of it forced the factory to be hugely overstaffed anyway. But it was a problem because there was huge rotation of workforce, according to Edward Pietrzak, who worked there for 40 years, becoming head manager in 1980s; 'About 25% of workers were constantly new staff and during strikes we had to employ office workers, soldiers or even prisoners. This had terrible effect on our cars quality'. The Polonez though had one more advantage over 125p; the welding process was fully automated (with the exception of soldering finish on some joints or making version the line was not programmed for, like 3 doors and sedans). This not only meant that theoretically they could make 150 thousand cars a year (which they never did), but most importantly it provided much more consistent welding quality which further contributed to body stiffness and safety.
@@piotrmalewski8178just curious, if you don't mind me asking. How do you know all of this? I am not doubting what you are saying, it's just so remarkably in depth.
@@gaterunner64 Sources like FSO's period video documentaries, interviews from car magazines with factory higher ups and engineers. The rest is in period catalogues and repair books. I've just been reading through it for 15 years. It helps I can repair cars and read blueprints. The latter is my everyday job.
OMG I love this video. Love obscure cars that folks barely heard of. In Canada I saw an Oltcit Panama, insane that in 2024 it is still around! Please do a video on that too!
The original FSO Polonez looks so much like the first Hyundai Pony! The subsequent respective fates of the two companies of course differ significantly.
Similarly to Pony, Polonez was built for bad roads. The heavy version of Fiat rear wheel drive platform with reinforcements along the center tunnel, and standard steel cover of the oil pan. Those two 'things' sticking out from the bottom when you look at front. This car could go to the forest, drive down the stairs or even survive a low altitude jump without any damage.
I have fond memories of the FSO Polonez, I learned to drive in one. I remember my driving instructor telling me, if you can drive this you can drive anything! He was right! Thank you for producing a history of this car. 👍🏻🙂
I have fond memories of the Polonez as my my father-in-law had one. They were remarkably crude and rough sounding but very durable and we travelled all over Poland In it and would generally arrive with eyes smarting from all the petrol fumes on the motorways. When he sold it for a first generation Octavia a neighbor bought it and it is still going to this day. There's a lot to be said for a simple vehicle and it would be nice to have a direct replacement for it nowadays
hooray the fso polenez i had 1 in 1985 second hand on b317 mnr from swithland motors owned by gordon banks. i loved it was my first car when passed my test. went every where i had my cb radio in it was freedom. great video
I grew up in Lublin, Poland, I remember my dad owning a FSO Polonez when i was around 5 years old. It had a racing green colour scheme. It was a brilliant car that we took on long drives to Hungary. So easy to fix and run. I have fond memories of that car and the holiday's we had as a family. Thank you so much for taking me down on memory lane. ❤️
@@witchcraftanditsconsequenc4280 Caro was in many ways worse than the old model. The quality became consistent somewhere from 1994 onwards and the electronic fuel injection was super reliable and made life easier, plus from 1993 it has better suspension. But comfort-wise, the old model was vastly superior to Caro. I owned both and they are like two different cars. Caro feels crude and shaky and takes a while to trust. The old models feels like a battlecruiser slicing through oceanic waves like they're nothing put you in a state of mind where you just want to chill and slow down.
Oh my! I remember asking you if you could create a FSO Polonez video in the future and look now! Thank you for your great work and awesome videos! Best Regards! 🇵🇱❤
Very good video, but one mistake has been made: FSO didn't close their doors in 2011 at all! They now produce car *parts* , rent office spaces and are classified as a Stock management company, and they're still making a very good profit off of it! Hope this gets seen!
In last years and this year also the factory is demolished bit by bit, and houses for people are built. The factory was in the city, so land is very valuable, and taxes are too high to run factory here.
13:43 A curious little detail about the front end redesign: while in theory the new front was introduced for the 1985 model year, in practice its introduction was gradual and initially only limited to export models. Once 1987 model aka the aquarium came along the new front became standard, but even then cars were still occasionally made with the older front. So in practice one can find 4 different, original combinations of front end and side windows on a Polonez from that period
I won this car in a Sun newspaper competition in thelate 70's, the same colour as the thumbnail. Nice car let down by quality issues, i wound down the drivers window and when I wound it back up, the window rubber followed, also the battery shorted out on the bonnet. But it plenty of extras not seen in other cars of the day.
I was born in 1979 and I remember these cars very well. I have also driven many of them since 1996, when I have got my license. I like the first model the most, it was a really one handsome car. It was called "Borewicz" because it was one of those, that the hero of the popular detective series "Calling 07", lieutenant Borewicz, drove.
Very well researched and well made video, thanks a lot! I'm from Poland, as a kid I remember many Polonez cars on the road, now they are very rare sight. Additionaly, I would like to write on some lesser known and very interesting other Polonez models: - 2500 Racing, also known as Stratopolonez, 1978. Made with engine and running gear from the legendary Lancia Stratos rally car, crashed on Rally Poland 1977 by Andrzej Jaroszewicz. one of the top rally drivers in Poland at that time (he was also a son of then Prime Minister and boss of the so called Sport & Development department, precisely Passenger Car Research and Development Center). This Polonez had supporting structure and engine from the afromentioned Stratos. Car had independent suspension at the front and radiator from the Polish truck Star and wider body with additional airboxes to the engine. There was no aerodynamics on the car and the car itself was very hard to drive. The car raced sporadically in Polish Racing Championship until 1985 and still exists to this day (which is very very rare when it comes to Polish racing and rally cars) - 2000 Rally Group B, 1984-1986. The afromentioned Polonez 2000 Rally Group 4 was later converted to Group B regulations. But the modifications were very modest. All the original ralky cars dismantled, in recent times some replicas were made. Some trivia about the Group 4 version: homologation papers were propably fake (the factory changed the number of the cars made for international homologation), in 1979 the cars were sponsored by Canadian F1 team Walter Wolf Racing (Jaroszewicz was friends with Walter Wolf), Polish crew Maciej Stawowiak/Ryszardz Żyszkowski finished 10th in the Rally Portugal 1980, a WRC round. - Pickup, 1981. Very early incarnation of the Truck, there was also 6x2 version made in the same year. - Sedan. 1982. Very early incarnation of the Atu. - Long, 1979 and 1982. 7 doors, 5,1 m long. Only 2 cars were made. First were used as a car that took workers to the FSO factory, later drove as a taxi, car was scrapped in 2000. Second was in posession of Polish State Railways and was also scrapped. In 2018 the replica of the first car was made. - Distrispecial, 1983/1986. Cars with poliester bumpers, made by Belgian importer N.V. Distrimotor S.A.. One car, 1.3 C version, survived to the present day and is in Poland. There was also a one LE 1.6 version, but only the bumpers survived. - 2000 Turbo Rally, 1984. 2.0 DOHC engines from Fiat 132 with Holset turbochargers. No international homologation. Used in Polish Rally Championship 1984-1987 - The Truck model was also used as a hearse, named Bella. There were also some prototypes made as a camper vans called Super Truck. - Activa, 1987. Polonez with a hydropneumatic suspension, made by Warsaw University of Technology for tests and research. - Piedra 1.3 Turbo Diesel, 1988. Already mentioned N.V. Distrimotor S.A. planned to sell Polonez cars equipped with Italian FNM 1366 cc turbocharged diesel engines from the motorboats (!) under the Piedra brand name. 23 cars were made, only one survived and was bought from Belgium to Poland by a FSO collector. -Analog, 1992-1996. 4x4 version on the Truck chassis, 7 prototypes made, production plans scrapped when Daewoo took over. Most of the prototypes survived to this day. One of the Polonez 2000 Turbo car was used as a operational vehicle for Polish Militia. Additionaly, Polish Militia rallied in 2 rounds of the Polish Rally Championship with 3 Polonez 1600 Rally. There were also some cars made specially by exporters for the domestic markets like Finn-Special made for the Finnish market by Wihuri-Yhtyma Oy or rally version of the Caro made by Dutch importer Abimex called Prima 1.4 Abimex with Rover engine. And there was even a Chinese copy. In 1990-1995 Dongfanghong made cars a la Polonez with a front from Chinese made VW Santana. Also, for some years, there was a fantastic museum of Polish cars history made in the former paintshop of the FSO factory, sadly no longer existent. All the information that I wrote I took from this book: bonito.pl/produkt/leksykon-polskich-samochodow-osobowych-1951-2002-wydanie-2 Propably the best book about the history of Polish passenger cars, sadly there is no English language version AFAIK. Best regards :D
My father bought a khaki green one in 1984. I can confirm that the seats were fantastic, like a big sofa. Car was underpowered for the weight. It struggled to pull a caravan with 5 of us on hoilday. The alternator died and there were none available for 3 weeks. So we went to a local Auto Electrician. Rectifier pack was straight off a Fiat ( !? ) fixed for not a lot of money. In 1986, I bought it of him as my Ford Capri got damaged, just before my wedding. Drove to Newquay from Scotland, drank petrol but was comfortable at 70mph. Year later the Heater matrix blew out and when I went to the dealer, they said sorry but not available and it is a 3hour job to remove it. Challange accepted. Yup 3 hours whole dash out. Turned out the matrix was an exact copy of a Fiat ( ??? ) part. Then we put it back. Oh my God. It squeeked, it rattled, it clunked. Then the rust started, and by god it was quick. So in 1991 it was sent to the scapyard. Had fun with it. The Mark 2 was even uglier
Woah, this vid is so unexpected but for sure it will be amazing (like all of yours). Greetings from Poland. Fun fact: It is unknown how we got Polonez. All those stories are just myths and theories. The most probable one is that Polonez is just a modified version of a cancelled prototype that was supposed to replace Fiat 132.
It is unknown as there is no one version from A to Z confirmed to be true by more than one person. But you can pick the pieces of the puzzle and put them together; and mr Big Car did it quite well. I know it sounds more fun to see it all as a mystery but it was just business. There are really A LOT of similar designs from that era, and because Italians absolutely ruled in car design of the 70's and many of the designers worked for more than one design studio, you can find the same recycled ideas in cars from UK, France, Italy, Germany, Japan, Korea, Czechia, Poland...
@@blinski1 I'm pretty sure interiorless Polonez mockup already existed when Polish team went to Italy looking for 125p replacement. I don't remember the name, but it was someone from FSO delegation describing they disliked every car Fiat was going to offer them and surprised Italians by asking for this one when they spotted it accidentally and learnt it was a dropped project for US market.
Wow, i didn’t expect FSO hit your channel, I remember these very well and there is a one that everyone loves called Borewicz from a very popular criminal TV series played back in late 70 early 80 in Poland. I wish I could get one now 😢
I worked for a small dealer of these in 1989,and remember having to rebuild the engines at pdi ,due to poor machining and components used at manufacture!.A lot of the parts we sourced were old stock genuine FIAT parts.
We did the same in Poland. My uncle had 3 Polonezes. First thing he would do, was to have the engine disassembled and then reassembled by a police mechanic. Also heard from a factory test driver who's job was to do one run to top speed. He said 'some cars would go 170 without any work, but some we had to send back three times and they still struggled to reach 150.'
This brings back memories. I grew up in a town called Swindon, during 70/80's and we had an FSO sales showroom a few doors down from me. But oddly never seen many out on the road 😕
I did'nt realise the Polonez stayed in production for so long I remember it at Earls Court in the late 70s, early 80s. I seem to remember a huge steering wheel and check straps for the doors but it did offer a lot of car for the money. Also I think there may have been a "Rallye" version at one tme with wheel arch extensions attached with exposed pop rivets. As Shania Twain once sang, "that don't impress me much".
I had a soft spot for this car. It wasnt great, but it was very practical and got people around. My grandad had a 125p. The problem with the later 125p versions was the 1500 engine and a drop in manufacturing quality. The earlier ones were actually quite decent cars.
There were some PF/FSO cars on the road in Norway back in the days. The 125p was regarded as an alternative to a Lada. A bit bigger as well. Cheap and very basic transport, but not as bad as reputed, this according to the owners. The cars were robust, conventional and easy to fix. 125p-models were bought by people who finally had the money to buy a new car for the price of a somewhat tired, used western model. People who did not care about status. Far fewer Polonez were sold, by ca 1980 most people could afford a more modern, west European or Japanese car. Today, very few PF/FSO cars are still on the road. Rust and lack of collecting values in the nineties killed off most of them.
One thing that kept the Polonez afloat was the state of the used car market in Poland. More specifically the import of used cars from Germany. Like it is now with the American car industry, the cars that were imported to Poland from Germany in the early-to-late 90's were usually death traps - cars welded together from three, with mismatched everything and with wiring that would make for a nice campfire out on the highway if you so much as dared to look at the heating seats option the wrong way The Polish Government also introduced tariffs to keep the foreign cars from flooding the domestic market and killing off FSO. So they had that going for them for a little while, at least until the tariffs were slowly phased out. There were actually talks with Fiat and Volkswagen for the buyout of FSO. But the unions - who had just secured themselves a strong position after basically overthrowing the government - were still on a power trip. They demanded that the FSO keep the outdated Polonez, that the factories be kept at their current employee count for five years, as well as some other things. Daewoo was the only company willing to agree to all of this - Fiat and VW... just politely asked the unions "Is there a tank riding in my eye?" and turned around and left Exquisite video, was waiting with baited breath on this one
@ big car I had a FSO Polonez myself. I think it was 1979 but it could have been 1980 when I bought it. I live in the Netherlands. First you compare the Polonez to an Opel Kadett but it was much bigger, more the size of an Opel Rekord. They used the Fiat 1500X engine that produced 85 HP. It was not sluggish with that engine, nor was it very fast. Later I had an Opel Rekord and the passengerspace was slightly better in the Polonez and the trunk was pretty much bigger in the Opel Rekord. The Opel with it's 2.0 L 90 HP was sluggish.
Someone who lived down the road from us in the 80's got a new Polonez. It was in that petrol blue shade that most of the UK cars seemed to be. I was 11 or 12 at the time and I thought it looked quite a neat car even though it was clearly a bargain basement job. It sounded good too, more sporty than it actually was but whatever. It's a shame we never got the 2 litre version. Back to the car down the road. It was kept for about 10 years and oh, the rust! It was such a bloody shame. Eventually it vanished to be replaced by a Sierra estate.
Very cool to see a Polish car on an automotive channel. I’m American and have never laid eyes on a Polonez. Very reminiscent of 80’s Volkswagen cars. So many car manufacturers out there completely unknown to us in the USA. I did live in Germany for 14 years, but this was pre-1990. So I did see a lot of cars not seen here in the USA. Mostly French and Italian . We don’t have Peugeot, Renault or Citroen in the USA. So they are pretty rare here too. Poland has a lot of great engineers, I’m surprised they don’t have a car available in the USA. I know the fiat 500 is built in Poland. Does Poland still have a domestic car manufacturer? Anyways, cool video. The intro was great. I’m sure a lot of Polish people related. 👍🏻
No, we don't. Except for trucks and buses. Jelcz still exists and makes those under own name. There were a few tries alongside. Leopard was making luxury retro cars with Corvette engine of a little over a decade, and Arrinera was making a supercar also with Corvette engine, but both went bankrupt. The sole survivor from the 'old-school' is Bosmal, which now is strictly a research and development company acting as a contractor for other companies, but started as R&D division at FSM, and branded convertible version of Fiat 126p. I'm pretty sure they developed drivetrain for the first gen 500e. After Polonez was killed off, and Daewoo fell, FSO kept making Daewoo Lanos and rebranded it as FSO, actually selling well in Ukraine, but the company was partly sold to Ukrainian AvtoZAZ who was allowed to dismantle Lanos' production line and move it to Ukraine. FSO was once more updated by GM and made Chevrolets but eventually stopped making cars when the city of Warsaw raised the land tax and government refused to create a special economy zone alike the one Fiat or Opel factories would be in. FSO didn't have trouble with engineers but with how they were robbed by socialist economy (for example, literally not getting paid for the cars they sold), then with mismanagement and events like the mentioned above. In 1990s FSO was still trying to further develop Polonez, there were proposed suspension redesign, 4 wheel drive and Daewoo engine upgrades, but after Daewoo takeover it didn't seem to make economic sense. Shame really, because with a few well thought mods it handles really nicely (it has 50:50 weight balance), and even after year 2000, there were still a few cars that didn't have crumple zones working that well or passenger cabin that stiff. This car maintains cabin space even when rammed by a train. It had potential to become either a durable simple car for less developed markets, or an oldschool fun car like the Mustang, or a nice light offroader. As a utility car it was selling well even in developed markets like Italy. Another issue was that istead of making a single company with strong offer, the state split it into single factories.. FSO was making family cars, FSM little cars, Nysa was making minivans, Żuk was making vans, Star was making trucks, Jelcz was making trucks and buses, Autosan was making buses and FSR was makig off-road vehicles, Ursus was making tractors and gear. To make it worse, factories making subcomponents such as steering racks or turbochargers were also separate entities, sold to separate companies after the fall of communism which in some cases meant losing access to critical components or losing potential to develop new ones. Also, FSO and FSM both had rights to 'Polski' brand, while FSO and FSR had similar names and their cars were often presented together, which rightfully irritated FSO because there was a dramatic difference in production technology and quality of cars between the two. There was also always this problem that there was a bunch of cars that had compatible parts and components but belonged to different entities. For example, there were existing transmission components for an off-roader from Honker miltary car and an excellent engine from Andoria, but FSO couldn't just say 'we're putting the three together' to finish their off-road pickup project. They had to enter negotiation with various different companies. Again, shame, because Polonez Analog could have been an alternative to Mitsubishi L200.
@@piotrmalewski8178 Great comment. It seems nowadays that Poland has a lot of foreign car and utility vehicle companies having factories there, but there's not much left concerning genuinely Polish companies. The only Polish-based automotive company doing well is apparently Solaris Buses, and partly Autosan. Jelcz still builds trucks, but only for the military; civilian truck and bus production has stopped years ago. Tractor maker Ursus also went bankrupt a few years ago and seems to have disappeared now, as did the Honker and the Lublin van some years ago. Really sad to see so many legendary companies and designs disappear.
@@torstenscholz6243 Lublin was a real shame to fall. In it's time it was really competetive in every way but fall of Daewoo and becoming split entitity killed it in long term. Perhaps had it been a part of FSO, they would have been able to modernize it with the money from Chevrolets. Andoria engine still had a lot of potential, the car just needed more comfy interior with and some added convieniences like AC to last longer. On the other hand trade unions in those post-communist factories mantained low work ethics. Most mechanical issues in Polonezes were caused not by technology, design or even quality of materials, but mainly by factory staff.
it's got a bit of a look of the lacia delta to it. which is no bad thing at all . Great video as per. Cheers dude from Daz and my dog Max from the East coast of Lincs
My Polish wife hates this car and visibly gags when she sees one. Something to do with very uncomfortable and long rides when she was a kid. I tease her sometimes by expressing my admiration for the car and telling her I would like to buy one
I've got to say, there a big difference in comfort between the old version and the Caro or Atu. Caro and Atu are a bit shaky and have terrible standard seats. The old version was much better. Suspension flows nicely, and the seats are much bigger, thicker, better profiled and made of soft foam.
@@BigCar2 It had mid mounted drivetrain from Fiat 128, so not a 125p derivative as you describe it. The thing is, Polish engineers were frequent visitors at Fiat and probably saw Lotus' mockup. Same for 125p Coupe, I believe it's some Abarth or Lancia concept knockoff. Something like Polonez however, was crudely drawn as a general idea of a future car by Jan Krzysztof Meisner in 1960, and then published in Stile Industria. Perhaps other people had the same ideas independently (there is no Canadian geometry as they say), but Meisner said that when Polonez showed up it was his dream coming true, because when he published sketches of this body shape, listing advantages, he knew there was no chance of making it in Poland at the time, but hoped it would come back as license car. He described it as 'a car that looked smart enough to impress on special occasions, but practical enough you could load a lot in and sleep there comfortably'. In Polonez, if you 'decompose' the rear sofa there is flat and just enough space to put a standard mattress for 2 people in.
ah the Polonez. I remember a few of these coming in for MOT back in the 80s. really liked them, all that FIATness going on in a full sized hatchback saloon. that was in an era when most cars here in the UK still sported a boot
Yes, that was pretty funny. The correct word in English would be 'reclining'. Folded seats are a thing too, but these were reclining, which is much better. I always wanted a car that you can comfortably sleep in. But yeah, the seats were decomposing as well. lol. FSO, thank you off of a mountain!
The final prototypes of production model were ready by 1975, so they were just slow intrudcing it. Also, Edward Pietrzak who was production manager at the time, and by 1981 became head manager of the company, stated that he himself would have gone for front wheel drive, but most higher ups in FSO believed that a good car should be rear wheel drive. Works rally team also wanted rear wheel drive since such cars dominated the competition.
Polski Fiats were imported to the UK through Sheerness Docks in Kent. I worked on what was supposed to be pre-delivery inspection on the 125p, Polonez and Tarpan. Most had to be almost re-built as the build quality was appalling! Most of them were already rusting, had components that didn't work, and in some cases missing entirely!
That makes sense. FSO cars were robbed by staff and suffered from drunkness and sabotage. Tarpan was made by FSR, and FSO hated FSR for primitive production technology. Actually, if a component made in FSO was the same as the component used in Tarpan, and it failed quality inspection at FSO, it was sent to be used in Tarpan.
You did the excellent job. Thank you. The 1st generation of the Polonez was also called the Borowicz after the famous tv series,007 where the main character the police inspector Borowicz has been using the brand new FSO Polonez.
the Polonez was designed in ITALY. There is a video on the original prototype, while the same as the production model, many details were lost on the production model. Jangarbacz filmed the original Polonez prototype offered to FSO by Turin. The official prototype was named the Polski indeed, and it was way more stylish, especially inside
It was some-kind-of little Polish Ford Crown Victoria. :DDD Many Polish policemen praise the endurance of 'Panda car' Polonez (ceased from duty around 2008-2010), comparing to more fragile successor Kia C'eed Wagon.
I worked for a garage that had an FSO franchise in the mid eighties. They sold a lot of Polonez, as they were a very cheap car loaded with extra goodies at the time. There were a lot of build quality issues though, like windows that fell out of the runners and dropped into the door. We also had to do a recall on every vehicle for the brakes, as the master cylinder needed alternations to brake lines and would allow air into the system. Cheap motoring, if you like that sort of thing.
It's a known issue in Poland. The problem was, the full employment policy in socialist economy, which meant however bad you worked, you had a job granted. There was even a saying, that if you want a good car, it must be made on Wednesday, because of Tuesday workers still have hangover, and on Thursday they are already drinking. I personally found Polonezes absolutely reliable but I only owned like 15 years old+ ones, so those must have been the good units.
An interesting history of a car with numerous restylings that gradually changed the design beyond recognition. You forgot to mention in the video that there was an Orciari "sporty" body kit and the Caro Plus/Caro Atu Plus/Caro Truck Plus also featured a different grille and different side repeaters turns lights.
I had one.I was 19 and Polonez was 18.My first car. History of this car -It was rebuild after crash and fire in local dealership called "Polmozbyt" (crash was before i was an owner).So i had body from 90' but all mechanical parts ware old 4 speed manual,engine with low number (45 and something K) Orginal body (and whole car) was bild in second year of production 1980.Regards from Poland.
I owned a 1989 Polonez in 1995. I found it particular charming and for a few hundred pounds in excellent condition, it was easy to see the sense in it. My most enduring memory of it was the steering column stalks. They were made of such thin plastic, they flexed as I moved them and it made indicating a turn quite an unpleasurable experience. I'm sure the car could have been hugely improved if the stalks were nicer to use. I love the old days.
I remember when I was a child, how many Polish tourists were invading Romania Black Sea Coast resorts, driving their Polonez 1500, many, towing a caravan, or driving those tiny Polski Fiat 126p, almost always towing a small trailer, with luggage and a tent, inside. On our market these cars had little to no presence. Even if Romanians were waiting for their paid Dacia 1300 (Romanian made Renault 12), around two years, due to high demand. I must say, I never saw a Polonez 1500 owned by a Romanian. Apart from Romanian made Dacia1300, on our roads there were Skoda 120L, Skoda 1000MB, Skoda 100, few Lada 1200 and 1500, Trabant, few Wartburgs, but no Polonez. However as a boy, with much passion for cars, seeing these Polonez 1500 in hotels parking lots, was very interesting. I was dreaming of having one, but everything changend later, when our Dacia 1310, and later Dacia 1410 and 1410 Sport (coupe), were launched. And after the second Romanian car Brand was launched - Oltcit (Romanian made Citroen Visa), with two variants, Club and Special, my interest for these Polish cars vanished.
I remember these cars as a kid and my partner is polish so I’ve really enjoyed this video! They were as good as anything else at the time, re marinas and regular escort mk2’s etc, a seventies polonez is quite a handsome car from it’s day I think and there were lots about in the UK at the time. Lovely cars 😃👍
![Seungmin "그렇게, 천천히, 우리(As we are)" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/kAzmhLHePqU/mqdefault.jpg)
I wasn't ready for that intro
Same lol. It went from being silly to more formal by the end of the intro
My toilet was.
No one was.
Unexpected is an understatement.
Fun intro... Reminds me of a song (and video) a fella I know did several years ago.... ruclips.net/video/eqV6B0w_3TU/видео.html
There was a chap on our street who had a FSO P and polished it every weekend a couple of doors up there was a Lada and he argued constantly how much better his FSO was over the Lada.
The saga continued when the Lada owner upgraded to a Samara...
Enter the glorious FSO Polinez and the weekend polishing and arguing continued!!
Ahhhh life in a 1980's Northern Town!
Unfortunately the 125p was a turd in comparison to the Lada.
@@kierancurtis8545 Lada had better engine and theoretically better suspension. 125p had much stronger platform. In Lada and many other cars of the era main chassis stringers end by the ends of cocpit, which means in case of accident the cabin is only held by the doorstep profiles and the roof. 125p had the heavy Fiat platform with big stringers going through entire car alongside the center tunnel. Each side is like 5mm thick, it's like a frame was added to a monocoque body. In the engine bay those stringers had huge round holes to make them collaps in the collision. The boot part is built like a friction shock absorber. One square pipe put into another that narrows slightly. I've learnt that when I had to repair a corrosion in one of those cars and after cutting through the rotten part, discovered the rear stringer is not a single element but a shock absorber.
@@piotrmalewski8178 Interesting. Thanks for the information 😊
arguments about which crappy eastern bloc car was better lol
@@antuha-cs4ie the road and service conditions on the East were quite different. Very few Western cars could actually survive there. Keep that in mind.
That intro was really quite something, I thought I was still watching an advert for a moment! 🤣
My parents used to own a Polonez back in around 1983, they said it was the heaviest car they've ever driven, and that the steering was guaranteed to build upper body strength. However, they also said that it was such a rock-solid machine that other drivers probably knew to keep out of its way, lest they end up on the losing side of a collision!
Another superb video, great work! 😁
Can you do a similar intro for one of your video's Rory? 😜
Well, I think, early 80's FSO and Lada cars were OK built compared to late 80's ones.
@@BigCar2 Not photogenic enough unfortunately! 😋
First two weeks of driving (parking) Polonez with no PS my muscles hurt. Then I drove a friend after parking she asked if it has power steering?! No I have said I am just that strong :)
@@BigCar2 I'll never get that minute of my life or the contents of my stomach back.
I purchased one of these in March1983. It was the top of the line with alloy wheels, sun roof, lifetime rust proofing warranty and 10 speed windscreen wipers. To top off the deal, it came with a 4 berth caravan, fully fitted out with kitchen, wardrobe, double bed and two bunks, at no extra cost. I can't remember what I paid but the car on it's own was a bargain. In the 4 years I owned it it was very reliable with only the charging regulator failing ( done under warranty ).
Never saw one, did see the Lada, a Russian Fiat, that rusted too hell after a few weeks. Sadly it was a chance for a working class man to finally own a new car.
@@seltaeb3302 There were some cars sold in what was called 'internal export', Polonezes sold in Poland but for foreign currency (without allowance ticket or waiting list). Many of them had a peculiar rustproofing; so any profile, like stringer or doorstep, and anything not outright visible, like undergaps between body pannels and under doors were covered in a mixture of wax, oil and corrosion inhibitors. I own such Polonez from 1989 and since then it survived with only a few spots and otherwise is totally healthy and would survive another ten years without a touch. I think export cars after certain years and on some markets did receive same treatment.
This is something you might want to do on a new car, since rustproofing these days is terrible again, but there are sprays to do something similar. It takes some knowledge how a bodyshell is built as well as some crawling though.
@@seltaeb3302 The original Fiat version rusted faster than the Lada. There was another car from the Soviet Union, the Moskvich, that rusted faster than either but had quite decent mechanical parts.
All things considered they weren't really a bad looking car. Not top of the line as far as styling goes but generally acceptable for your everyday runabout.
@@seltaeb3302 They wouldn't rust, under the condition that you properly conserved them yourself. Turns out this was as an option done by factory or dealership. I heard a few stories and I bought one that had a peculiar conservation system. Doesn't look very clean, but apparently worked since 1989.
I grew up in Poland around the time the Polonez came out, and I remember quite a few people talking about it as a bit of a modern, aspirational vehicle. We never got one, but after a few years on the waiting list, my parents got a Fiat 125. Thanks for the trip down memory lane.
What an interesting time for Poland and Europe. Meanwhile Poland was politically shedding the Soviet yoke (solidarnosc) before anyone other country. ❤🇵🇱from 🇬🇧
@@zogzoogler Thanks for the ❤ I was too young to have a full grasp of what was going on, but I definitely remember a lot of tension. I do remember my dad parking the car in a massive queue when we heard a supply of petrol was coming in, and leaving it there overnight, sometimes longer. I also remember the empty grocery stores shelves. And the food stamps. Sometimes you even got candy! It all seems so surreal now. For some reason, I do have fond memories of the kool-aid type drinks sold in clear plastic bags. I'm sure they were awful, but it was always a treat when we got one. Good times!
I recall my mother saying, you had to be either in the Police force, communist party or in some other form of Government to be able to afford a Polonez or to simply jump the queue on the waiting list for one of these cars…People waited up to a year just for the Polski Fiat (Maluch) , so I can’t even imagine the waiting list for a Polonez…
@@paulsz6194 My father knew someone who traveled abroad for work and who was able to acquire some US dollars. Apparently, those were quite effective at jumping the queue as well.
Thanx God they got 125 - a car with a soul - Polonez was a terrible piece of trash
In 1978 I owned a 1300 125p. By 1979 I had (with the guidance of Practical Mechanics magazine) replaced the engine with a Fiat 1600 twin cam, changed the seats (which were plastic) into cloth type seats from a Fiat 125, changed the gearbox to a Fiat 5 speed, changed the front grill from black plastic to a chrome grill from a Fiat 125 and changed the dashboard to a recessed speedo and and rev counter. I also had to convert the clutch from hydraulic to cable. From the outside the car was undeniably a standard 125p but it gave drivers of the new Golf 1500 a bit of a shock when pulling away from the lights :) I really liked the car, it was simple and never let me down. I remember the Polonez being launched but could never afford to own one back then. Great video, thanks for sharing the info.
What happened to that car afterwards?
This episode amazed me in three different points in particular:
1. The (as usual) well researched story about a quirky Eastern block car.
2. The intro.
3. The unexpected view of the Lego Technic helicopter, my most beloved Lego set as a kid.
It's a new Lego model. I bought most of the parts new from Lego. I had to source some used as they weren't made any longer. I used to have one but stupidly sold it.
I recollect that the Polonez even got a Rover K engine ats some point in its life.
During the RAI (Dutch international motor show) we as enginering students got free tickets to attent the show.
Just after the fall of the Iron curtain those former other then Lada eastern block cars were way more exotic to us then Italian sportscars.
The trabant with a VW polo engine, Polonez with a 16v Rover K engine, Skoda Rapids in special rally trim.
Correct. 1.4 103BHP version was mass produced from 1993 to 1998, and there were several hundreds made with 1.6 and 1.8 liter.
It actually gave the car it's second chance after death, when people saw on Google video and early years of RUclips what this car could do. Since most VW Golfs on Polish roads were II, IIIrd generation usually with 65BHP engine, Polonez with Rover engine was a cheap sleeper.
I remember embarrasing several hot headed guys with it even past 2010. Now people put 1.8 VVC in.
@@piotrmalewski8178What is wrong with the Polonez's original engine? It has hemispherical cylinder heads with the valves worked by pushrods, done by having four of the pushrods cross from one side of the engine to the other by passing between the cylinders. It also has the Lodz-Weber carburettor with very precise mixture control. You can set it up so that the exhaust emissions are so clean that the MoT tester thinks his measuring apparatus has gone wrong. I think this engine is also in the 125p.
@@cedriclynch The 1.5 liter pushrod had only 3 crankshaft bearings and it developed relatively high maximum power thanks to being tuned to high rpms. This meant it lacked any low revs torque and you had to rev it high which didn't suit character of the car, and a normal user who was not educated could break the engine easily. I remember my uncle would not downshift from 5th gear unless going under 50kph which was a murder to this engine. You could rev it safely to 8 thousand rpms on stock valve springs but most people just didn't know how to use it.
Rover was much better with good low-end torque and 5 crankshaft bearings. Besides, for some odd reason it would make the whole body resonate in a literally painful-to-the-driver way if driven under 2200 rpms which corrected any incompetent instantly.
125p originally had 115c engine (different engine code, Polonez' 1.5 liter was coded AA and AB depending on camshaft type)
115c had different and obsolete lubrication system and a few other changes (they say there were 124 modifications in AA versus 115c by 1978).
Not sure if translating it correctly but 115c had centrifugal oil filter alongside the normal one, which required cleaning like ever 60 thousand miles, and it didn't have modern type seals on valves while Polonez had. Eventually 125p received Polonez upgraded engine in the 'M' version, also many units were more or less modified aftermarket.
There were also many 125ps rebuilt into Polonezes after accidents so you never really know what the heck is under the bonnet unless you take a good look at it.
I bought a second hand, and I can confirm that the seats were very good. Another god thing was that you could change the coals of the generator without dismantling it.
But if you had had Citroën gs like me, the steering was absolutely terrible.
One thing I never will forget, I turned to the left and suddenly I heard a strange sound. I thought the gearbox or the transmission had a problem, so I stopped the car, but I didn't stop the engine. Stepped out and went to the back to look underneath the car, and what I saw was something unbelievable. The fuel tank had fallen off, and gasoline was pouring out, and the warm exhaust pipe was right beside it. I jumped back and switched the engine off. It happened New Year's evening's afternoon and the car was stuffed with fireworks, so it could have ended up in a very big fireworks.
Nevertheless, I drove 70.000 km in it, and it was the cheapest 70.000 I have ever experienced.
Did it rust thru to cause it?
@@Low760 The fuel tank was held by two steel stripes. Technically those stripes had a lifespan of like 15 years and should have been covered with aluminium layer, but with little quality control, it's possible in his car they were made of sulphur-contaminated steel and rotted from the inside. When I replaced the whole thing in my 14 years old car, I covered the stripes in chlorinated rubber and added rubber isolator between them and the fuel tank.
To Torben Larson.
There was something similar about Skoda. There was something like that which could have caused a fire, and "something or other" was re-routed to prevent that. BUT ONLY FOR EXPORT. Local customers didn't count!
@@piotrmalewski8178CLEVER!
My dad had 2 of these, really comfy, many great childhood memories 🙂
We owned a 1987 FSO Polonez 1.5 SLE (two mirrors, adjustable steering column, 5speed, full instrument panel etc), and honestly this car was a workhorse. Spacious, solid, super reliable, comfortable, it offered us the most an Eastern European car could offer (it was very cheap in Greece) and despite it's rear solid axle with leaf springs it handled really well. The only drawback but that was common during those years, was the heavy steering especially during parking manoeuvres. But that was literally nothing compared to it's overall performance. I really miss it.
I'm yet to discover what the previous owner has done with steering in my car. There is no power steering but I can turn the wheel with one finger.
On the other hand, Polonez has very 'quick' steering for the time, so it's expected it should give a lot of resistance.
My first Polonez, the widened one with Rover engine did have heavy steering, but after a few drives I got so used to it it was never a problem again.
Here in the Netherlands, the car had the worst reputation ever.
@@pieterwoerden2701 My father drove a Polonez 1500 as a taxi in the 1980s, supported his entire family by working and earned several times more than most working Poles at that time. My father drove 200,000 kilometers in this taxi car and never had a breakdown! Greeting from Poland.
@@PocałujmniewdupęPocałujmniewdu That's great. Perhaps the Polonez is the victim of anti-USSR propaganda, which was the case at the time. Lada's also had a name for a poor finish.
@@pieterwoerden2701 What cars did the Netherlands produce in the 1970s? At that time, Poland produced several models of passenger cars, several models of delivery vehicles, several models of mopeds and motorcycles, and all these vehicles were exported to several dozen countries around the world, including highly industrialized countries! At that time, Poland was earning billions of dollars on the export of these vehicles!
Poland was the most devastated country by the War, Poland did not receive help in the form of the Marshall Plan and yet Poland was able to reclaim the entire country, the entire industry and construct, produce and sell its own industrial products! Polish tractors and Polish combine harvesters were even exported to the USA!!!
I used to sell new FSO’s during the 80’s and 90’s . They were surprisingly reliable and pretty tough! They suffered with electrical gremlins’ but otherwise a good car and value for money.
The tube camera streaking effect on the clip at 13:43 is glorious!
Only you would notice that!
@@BigCar2 Me too! Love vidicon effect on old videos.
I also noticed that the right headlight slowly fades off during this clip, and in the next camera angle, it's back on! Hmmmm..
@@witchcraftanditsconsequenc4280 Only now noticed that. But that was the point of the test. Behind the wheel in this specific clip, engineer Janusz Gutowski. He said himself that after a test run on this track he would send cars back with average of 30 to 40 issues. In one unit a suspension arm fell off, and record breakers were sent back to be repaired and improved 5 times before they would pass the test and not make any weird noises.
For anyone curious, FSO stands for "Passenger Car Factory" and FSM was "Small Engine Car Factory". Yeah, they were incredibly creative.
Created by central planers of PZPR, same people who calculated average toliet paper use :).
BMW. Bayerische Motoren Werke
IVECO. Industrial Vehicles Corporation
SAAB. Svenska Aeroplan Aktie Bolag
FIAT. Fabrica Italiana Automobili Torino
and many more.
FSM: Small displacement car factory 😉
Still, the name FSO and the logo was OK and it would do allright in the export markets, if the factory could offer a better car.
What a dumb comment
I've always loved the design of this car. There's something about it that feels right from almost all angles, especially in the pre-facelifted versions
Especially those twin headlights, i don't know why.
I recently realised it was the 1970s equivalent of an SUV. Just not an SUV. If you look closely, the general wedge shape and fake side air intakes suggest a loose inspiration from 1970s supercars. It's like a few basic lines of a70s mid-engine wedge shape supercar streched onto a family car.
I didn't realise Fiat had any inputs to the styling. I now see similarities with the styling of their Strada.
Fun fact: The styling of the Hyundai Ioniq 5 is a homage to that of their Pony. Another Italian styled car from that time.
I've heard that the design was inspired by the Lancia models of the time, which seems plausible.
@@torstenscholz6243 Nah, Lancias looked different. There is some similarity to Delta but the two cars are totally different in terms of platform and proportions. I think originally it was some dropped Fiat project. Perhaps one aimed for US market
VW Passat Passat B1 looked very similar, but was more rounded and had 3rd windows instead of fake vents. Giugiaro styled them both.
Ah, the Polonez - my uncle had one of these many years ago. He invariably described that thing as a "tank" but it took whatever he threw at it. I remember how every time my cousins got a lift into town in it, they'd ask to be dropped off fairly far from where they wanted to go just so their mates wouldn't see them getting out of the back of the FSO. It was barely one step above a Lada in their eyes, I guess! I also remember getting a lift in a Caro, one of a few sold in the UK with the 1.9 PSA diesel motor.
I've had an Opel/Vauxhall/Buick/Holden Cascada, since 2013, a Polish made posh convertible sold all over the world and I love it. I'd have no hesitation buying a Polish made car.
Former brother in law bought a Lada Riva 1.3SL brand new in the early in the 80's followed up after 3 years by a 1.5 Polonez - both agricultural and crude but as a mechanic he had the tools and knowledge to maintain both. His verdict? The FSO was the winner.
especially once the fso 1.5 got 5 cam bearings. The lada was a turd
@@goclunker I don't know where you got that information, but Polonez never had 5 cam bearings, only 3. Lada had 5 bearings in their engines.
@@marcin6271 Fiat DOHC, FSO Diesel, VM Diesel. Citroen Diesel, Ford SOHC and Rover engines all had 5 bearings.
My father had a 125p from 1979, the year I was born, until 1993. Our best friends had a Lada and I have fond memories from both. At the same time there was one single Polonez where I grew up and, as I was riding past it with my bicycle, I always thought it looked like a spaceship, compared to our 125p. I was happy to see many 125p in Poland and a 125p Story would be a dream!
Many thanks for bringing back memories from my teen years. Who didn't dream about Polonez back then in Poland? Congrats on your acting skills in the intro! Well done!
This is extremely well researched, given how much confusion and inaccurate information there in Polish publications about the car, but I'll still give a few info and corrections if I may:
1:53, the original 125p looked differently than this facelift model shown here. Mechanicals from the 1300/1500 is generally correct, however there were some modifications to the engine and the brakes were from the new 125.
2:27 , the 1,3 Coupe from 1974 had nothing to do with 125p. It had centrally mounted drivertrain from Fiat 128. It was mid engine.
3:00. The 1,3 and 1.5 push rod-engines were intended to be replaced from the very start. They were only supposed to be used in Polonez for the first few years and quickly replaced with a new family of SOHC engine of 1.6 to 2 liter capacities. Based on this idea FSO also worked with Ricardo on 2 liter diesel engine, and made 60 units before the project was cancelled.
7:50 - this is in an official version, but probably the whole contest was faked. Besides, rapid change of names from Polski Fiat to FSO was a shot in the knee, and on some markets like Finland the name Polski would remain.
9:38 - Turning circle was 10,8 meters which was less than Passat B1. Also, as it turned out, it could have been lowered be changing placement of front brake calipers, which was done in I think 1994.
10:41 - the lever was designed this way so it could be connected directly to the gear selector without any linkage and thus remove the need for adjustments and replacements.
11:27 - actually 90 miles an hour is a figure for fully loaded car. In reality those cars could do about 110 but it varied a lot on quality of each unit and wether or not carburettor settings were right.
The engine mostly lacked low end torque for a car that heavy though, which also contributed to lifespan issues.
12:00 - actually the doors on the three door were same as in any car of the kind, that is: much longer. I don't think this version was ever seriously considered as a mass volume car, since the production line was not programmed for 3 door types and they were largely welded manually. Apparently there were some thoughts of turning them into GT or sports cars. Not just because of 2000 Turbo prototype rally car, but also because they were offered with very high trim levels and various modifications like shorter main gear, or 2 liter engine. The 2000 Turbo was extensively tested and competed in all rounds of National Championships, so should the situation not been as terrible as it was, they would have made at least several hundreds of 3 door 2 litre turbos.
13:41 - to my best knowledge no improvements or changes have been done to suspension untill 1993 when it was widened front and rear, received stronger shock absorbers and thicker springs at front. There could have been some variation on the thickness or the number of leaf springs though.
17:43 - actually early 90s and transition to market economy caused huge unemployment and deterioration of life standard for many people, however the economy also began to grow rapidly and Polonez being not much more expensive Fiat 126p and cheaper than Fiat Ciqnquecento effectively helped to do it because it big and hefty enough to do anything. For years to come those cars would go around loaded to the roof and pulling trailers of goods for sale on street markets. Not everyone wanted pickup truck, and hatchback Polonez would be as much of a family car as a substitute of a truck.
18:22 - a lot of these options were available back in 1980s, just not in domestic market. As for Caro, it even had an option of the inner part of light alloys to be painted in body color. There were also 3 different steering wheel patterns and 4 different types of seats to be chosen, the standard ones, and 3 'Inter Groclin' types; air cushoned, hard bucket, and 'Akupresura', a type of soft bucket seat.
20:58 - there was absolutely no changes to the front suspension at this point. It could have been easily modified to provide more grip, since double wishbone is a very flexible setup when it comes to choosing different settings, but this would have made a live axle car aggressively oversteer, so this was never done outside rally cars. The belief that anything changed was probably coming from the fact that at this point the negatives at the factory were worn out, and all cars had slightly twisted front which requred very uneven number of washers under upper suspension arm mountings in every car, and thus repair books give slightly different wheel angle tolerances.
If you're mentioning all those details, I'd have rather mentioned introduction of new Lucas braking system as an option in 1993 and making it standard in 1995. However, while an improvement, the braking was long in comparison to newer competitors.
The real strenght of this car was that primitive high clearance suspension and standard steel skidplate made it resilient to the terrible shape of the Polish roads back then.
Beginning and this: 24:21 - Polonez was actually hated for many years. Initially because there was a misconception that only communist party members would drive i and in the 90s because it was often someone's first car, not properly mained and to tell the truth, production quality had dramatic fluctuations from unit to unit so those cars deteriorated rapidly and people thought of it as something they wanted to get rid off.
Those cars only got some positive recognition in the last 10 or 15 years because of nostalgia and various internet publications. For example it's safety provess was never properly marketed. Nobody ever had an idea to take let's say BMW E36 and crash it against Polonez. People only learnt how well Polonez' body was designed after it vanished from the market and articles from crash tests and street images and news of people driving Polonezes surviving horrible crashes have circled the internet. It makes you thinking when when you see in crash tests and images from real street crashes that Polonez' cocpit would almost never give up, while even BMW E36 would collapse in standard crash test and A pillar stab the driver.
One more info I'd add: 125p was still manually welded which was a big problem. Not because of human personnel costs because the full employment policy in socialist economy and trade unions after fall of it forced the factory to be hugely overstaffed anyway. But it was a problem because there was huge rotation of workforce, according to Edward Pietrzak, who worked there for 40 years, becoming head manager in 1980s; 'About 25% of workers were constantly new staff and during strikes we had to employ office workers, soldiers or even prisoners. This had terrible effect on our cars quality'.
The Polonez though had one more advantage over 125p; the welding process was fully automated (with the exception of soldering finish on some joints or making version the line was not programmed for, like 3 doors and sedans). This not only meant that theoretically they could make 150 thousand cars a year (which they never did), but most importantly it provided much more consistent welding quality which further contributed to body stiffness and safety.
@@piotrmalewski8178just curious, if you don't mind me asking. How do you know all of this? I am not doubting what you are saying, it's just so remarkably in depth.
@@gaterunner64 Sources like FSO's period video documentaries, interviews from car magazines with factory higher ups and engineers. The rest is in period catalogues and repair books. I've just been reading through it for 15 years. It helps I can repair cars and read blueprints. The latter is my everyday job.
OMG I love this video. Love obscure cars that folks barely heard of. In Canada I saw an Oltcit Panama, insane that in 2024 it is still around! Please do a video on that too!
The original FSO Polonez looks so much like the first Hyundai Pony! The subsequent respective fates of the two companies of course differ significantly.
Similarly to Pony, Polonez was built for bad roads. The heavy version of Fiat rear wheel drive platform with reinforcements along the center tunnel, and standard steel cover of the oil pan. Those two 'things' sticking out from the bottom when you look at front. This car could go to the forest, drive down the stairs or even survive a low altitude jump without any damage.
@@piotrmalewski8178basically a rally car from the factory lol 😂
I have fond memories of the FSO Polonez, I learned to drive in one. I remember my driving instructor telling me, if you can drive this you can drive anything! He was right! Thank you for producing a history of this car. 👍🏻🙂
Indeed! I passed my driver's license exams in one of these :)
Bought a 125p in 1985, it was 6 years old, bright yellow it cost me £40, allowing for inflation a 2018 car for about £350 today.
The value of money was strong back then
@@DMartinovAlso, people during communism era in Poland, earned about $8 a month.
Bro, if they used your intro as an advert in 1978, most of the world's population including dignitaries would be driving the Polonez today!
I have fond memories of the Polonez as my my father-in-law had one. They were remarkably crude and rough sounding but very durable and we travelled all over Poland In it and would generally arrive with eyes smarting from all the petrol fumes on the motorways. When he sold it for a first generation Octavia a neighbor bought it and it is still going to this day. There's a lot to be said for a simple vehicle and it would be nice to have a direct replacement for it nowadays
This car has such a underdog charm to it and I love that vibe. I can totally understand why the Polish still love this car decades on.
Love that intro!
"The back sofa didn't decompose" 🤣🤣
In Polish: "Tylna kanapa nie rozkładała się" :)
Well, the rest of the car decomposed pretty well, though.
I had a 1994 FSO Caro 1.9 GLD Was a great car, easy to work on, and never let me down. I loved driving it especially with rear wheel drive........
Peugeot diesel I believe, lots of fun on snow with that RWD.
@@alexeveryman5080 1.9 XUD was very entertaining.
hooray the fso polenez i had 1 in 1985 second hand on b317 mnr from swithland motors owned by gordon banks. i loved it was my first car when passed my test. went every where i had my cb radio in it was freedom. great video
I grew up in Lublin, Poland, I remember my dad owning a FSO Polonez when i was around 5 years old. It had a racing green colour scheme. It was a brilliant car that we took on long drives to Hungary. So easy to fix and run. I have fond memories of that car and the holiday's we had as a family. Thank you so much for taking me down on memory lane. ❤️
The first generation Polonez was still the most beautiful, I think. I also loved the dasboard with gauges galore! But yeah, I was only 14....
As someone who is from a completely different generation, I love how the Caro looks and I want one.
@@witchcraftanditsconsequenc4280 Caro was in many ways worse than the old model. The quality became consistent somewhere from 1994 onwards and the electronic fuel injection was super reliable and made life easier, plus from 1993 it has better suspension. But comfort-wise, the old model was vastly superior to Caro. I owned both and they are like two different cars. Caro feels crude and shaky and takes a while to trust. The old models feels like a battlecruiser slicing through oceanic waves like they're nothing put you in a state of mind where you just want to chill and slow down.
Oh my! I remember asking you if you could create a FSO Polonez video in the future and look now! Thank you for your great work and awesome videos! Best Regards! 🇵🇱❤
Very good video, but one mistake has been made: FSO didn't close their doors in 2011 at all! They now produce car *parts* , rent office spaces and are classified as a Stock management company, and they're still making a very good profit off of it! Hope this gets seen!
Thanks for the update.
@@BigCar2No problem!
This is why I watch this channel , great audience as well as content
In last years and this year also the factory is demolished bit by bit, and houses for people are built. The factory was in the city, so land is very valuable, and taxes are too high to run factory here.
They're basically a landlord, and most of their production facilities have been closed.
As a Chilean that grew up in the US, love me a story about a car I've never heard of.
13:43 A curious little detail about the front end redesign: while in theory the new front was introduced for the 1985 model year, in practice its introduction was gradual and initially only limited to export models. Once 1987 model aka the aquarium came along the new front became standard, but even then cars were still occasionally made with the older front. So in practice one can find 4 different, original combinations of front end and side windows on a Polonez from that period
The 'new' front was a fake 'Coupe' version front used on export markets in top of the line versions.
I won this car in a Sun newspaper competition in thelate 70's, the same colour as the thumbnail. Nice car let down by quality issues, i wound down the drivers window and when I wound it back up, the window rubber followed, also the battery shorted out on the bonnet. But it plenty of extras not seen in other cars of the day.
I was born in 1979 and I remember these cars very well. I have also driven many of them since 1996, when I have got my license. I like the first model the most, it was a really one handsome car. It was called "Borewicz" because it was one of those, that the hero of the popular detective series "Calling 07", lieutenant Borewicz, drove.
125p were plenty on the streets of Yugoslavia, but Polonez was a rare beast.
Decomposing rear Seats are a much underated Feature 😂
Very well researched and well made video, thanks a lot! I'm from Poland, as a kid I remember many Polonez cars on the road, now they are very rare sight. Additionaly, I would like to write on some lesser known and very interesting other Polonez models:
- 2500 Racing, also known as Stratopolonez, 1978. Made with engine and running gear from the legendary Lancia Stratos rally car, crashed on Rally Poland 1977 by Andrzej Jaroszewicz. one of the top rally drivers in Poland at that time (he was also a son of then Prime Minister and boss of the so called Sport & Development department, precisely Passenger Car Research and Development Center). This Polonez had supporting structure and engine from the afromentioned Stratos. Car had independent suspension at the front and radiator from the Polish truck Star and wider body with additional airboxes to the engine. There was no aerodynamics on the car and the car itself was very hard to drive. The car raced sporadically in Polish Racing Championship until 1985 and still exists to this day (which is very very rare when it comes to Polish racing and rally cars)
- 2000 Rally Group B, 1984-1986. The afromentioned Polonez 2000 Rally Group 4 was later converted to Group B regulations. But the modifications were very modest. All the original ralky cars dismantled, in recent times some replicas were made. Some trivia about the Group 4 version: homologation papers were propably fake (the factory changed the number of the cars made for international homologation), in 1979 the cars were sponsored by Canadian F1 team Walter Wolf Racing (Jaroszewicz was friends with Walter Wolf), Polish crew Maciej Stawowiak/Ryszardz Żyszkowski finished 10th in the Rally Portugal 1980, a WRC round.
- Pickup, 1981. Very early incarnation of the Truck, there was also 6x2 version made in the same year.
- Sedan. 1982. Very early incarnation of the Atu.
- Long, 1979 and 1982. 7 doors, 5,1 m long. Only 2 cars were made. First were used as a car that took workers to the FSO factory, later drove as a taxi, car was scrapped in 2000. Second was in posession of Polish State Railways and was also scrapped. In 2018 the replica of the first car was made.
- Distrispecial, 1983/1986. Cars with poliester bumpers, made by Belgian importer N.V. Distrimotor S.A.. One car, 1.3 C version, survived to the present day and is in Poland. There was also a one LE 1.6 version, but only the bumpers survived.
- 2000 Turbo Rally, 1984. 2.0 DOHC engines from Fiat 132 with Holset turbochargers. No international homologation. Used in Polish Rally Championship 1984-1987
- The Truck model was also used as a hearse, named Bella. There were also some prototypes made as a camper vans called Super Truck.
- Activa, 1987. Polonez with a hydropneumatic suspension, made by Warsaw University of Technology for tests and research.
- Piedra 1.3 Turbo Diesel, 1988. Already mentioned N.V. Distrimotor S.A. planned to sell Polonez cars equipped with Italian FNM 1366 cc turbocharged diesel engines from the motorboats (!) under the Piedra brand name. 23 cars were made, only one survived and was bought from Belgium to Poland by a FSO collector.
-Analog, 1992-1996. 4x4 version on the Truck chassis, 7 prototypes made, production plans scrapped when Daewoo took over. Most of the prototypes survived to this day.
One of the Polonez 2000 Turbo car was used as a operational vehicle for Polish Militia. Additionaly, Polish Militia rallied in 2 rounds of the Polish Rally Championship with 3 Polonez 1600 Rally. There were also some cars made specially by exporters for the domestic markets like Finn-Special made for the Finnish market by Wihuri-Yhtyma Oy or rally version of the Caro made by Dutch importer Abimex called Prima 1.4 Abimex with Rover engine. And there was even a Chinese copy. In 1990-1995 Dongfanghong made cars a la Polonez with a front from Chinese made VW Santana. Also, for some years, there was a fantastic museum of Polish cars history made in the former paintshop of the FSO factory, sadly no longer existent.
All the information that I wrote I took from this book: bonito.pl/produkt/leksykon-polskich-samochodow-osobowych-1951-2002-wydanie-2
Propably the best book about the history of Polish passenger cars, sadly there is no English language version AFAIK. Best regards :D
🇵🇱🇵🇱🇵🇱🇵🇱🇵🇱 POLSKA GUROM 🇵🇱🇵🇱🇵🇱🇵🇱🇵🇱
I really wasn't expecting polonez here, nice.
Siemka, też się cieszę;)
Polska gurom
Ja tez. Jestem w szoku
Wow I never heard of this car before, it was an awesome video.
8:20 part got that Gran Turismo vibe, super nice.
My father bought a khaki green one in 1984. I can confirm that the seats were fantastic, like a big sofa. Car was underpowered for the weight. It struggled to pull a caravan with 5 of us on hoilday. The alternator died and there were none available for 3 weeks. So we went to a local Auto Electrician. Rectifier pack was straight off a Fiat ( !? ) fixed for not a lot of money. In 1986, I bought it of him as my Ford Capri got damaged, just before my wedding. Drove to Newquay from Scotland, drank petrol but was comfortable at 70mph. Year later the Heater matrix blew out and when I went to the dealer, they said sorry but not available and it is a 3hour job to remove it. Challange accepted. Yup 3 hours whole dash out. Turned out the matrix was an exact copy of a Fiat ( ??? ) part. Then we put it back. Oh my God. It squeeked, it rattled, it clunked. Then the rust started, and by god it was quick. So in 1991 it was sent to the scapyard. Had fun with it. The Mark 2 was even uglier
Still better than what you get today. 3 months wait time for valve adjustment parts for a new Toyota.
Another great Big Car episode! I had forgotten about this car completely!
That intro was 🔥
Thanks for this video. As a huge fan of these cars, tjis is very valuable for me that somone outside from Poland can getting know about Polonez :)
Nicely done.👍 Quite interesting story about this not so well known car. The mentioned Chevrolet Aveo was a re-branded Daewoo Aveo.
As a self-described car guy/petrol head, I am disappointed in myself that I had never heard of FSO until today. Excellent vid as always dude. 🤘🏻
Woah, this vid is so unexpected but for sure it will be amazing (like all of yours). Greetings from Poland.
Fun fact: It is unknown how we got Polonez. All those stories are just myths and theories. The most probable one is that Polonez is just a modified version of a cancelled prototype that was supposed to replace Fiat 132.
It is unknown as there is no one version from A to Z confirmed to be true by more than one person. But you can pick the pieces of the puzzle and put them together; and mr Big Car did it quite well. I know it sounds more fun to see it all as a mystery but it was just business. There are really A LOT of similar designs from that era, and because Italians absolutely ruled in car design of the 70's and many of the designers worked for more than one design studio, you can find the same recycled ideas in cars from UK, France, Italy, Germany, Japan, Korea, Czechia, Poland...
@@blinski1 I'm pretty sure interiorless Polonez mockup already existed when Polish team went to Italy looking for 125p replacement. I don't remember the name, but it was someone from FSO delegation describing they disliked every car Fiat was going to offer them and surprised Italians by asking for this one when they spotted it accidentally and learnt it was a dropped project for US market.
Wow, i didn’t expect FSO hit your channel, I remember these very well and there is a one that everyone loves called Borewicz from a very popular criminal TV series played back in late 70 early 80 in Poland. I wish I could get one now 😢
I worked for a small dealer of these in 1989,and remember having to rebuild the engines at pdi ,due to poor machining and components used at manufacture!.A lot of the parts we sourced were old stock genuine FIAT parts.
We did the same in Poland. My uncle had 3 Polonezes. First thing he would do, was to have the engine disassembled and then reassembled by a police mechanic. Also heard from a factory test driver who's job was to do one run to top speed. He said 'some cars would go 170 without any work, but some we had to send back three times and they still struggled to reach 150.'
One word: Marvelous. So much I didn't know and seen before and you're intro is doing it again. 👍
This brings back memories.
I grew up in a town called Swindon, during 70/80's and we had an FSO sales showroom a few doors down from me. But oddly never seen many out on the road 😕
Awesome intro. Great video. Europe has some of the most unique cars ever. Love this car. ❤
A tremendous video again sir 👏
I did'nt realise the Polonez stayed in production for so long I remember it at Earls Court in the late 70s, early 80s. I seem to remember a huge steering wheel and check straps for the doors but it did offer a lot of car for the money. Also I think there may have been a "Rallye" version at one tme with wheel arch extensions attached with exposed pop rivets. As Shania Twain once sang, "that don't impress me much".
I had a soft spot for this car. It wasnt great, but it was very practical and got people around. My grandad had a 125p. The problem with the later 125p versions was the 1500 engine and a drop in manufacturing quality. The earlier ones were actually quite decent cars.
There were some PF/FSO cars on the road in Norway back in the days. The 125p was regarded as an alternative to a Lada. A bit bigger as well. Cheap and very basic transport, but not as bad as reputed, this according to the owners. The cars were robust, conventional and easy to fix. 125p-models were bought by people who finally had the money to buy a new car for the price of a somewhat tired, used western model. People who did not care about status. Far fewer Polonez were sold, by ca 1980 most people could afford a more modern, west European or Japanese car. Today, very few PF/FSO cars are still on the road. Rust and lack of collecting values in the nineties killed off most of them.
One thing that kept the Polonez afloat was the state of the used car market in Poland. More specifically the import of used cars from Germany. Like it is now with the American car industry, the cars that were imported to Poland from Germany in the early-to-late 90's were usually death traps - cars welded together from three, with mismatched everything and with wiring that would make for a nice campfire out on the highway if you so much as dared to look at the heating seats option the wrong way
The Polish Government also introduced tariffs to keep the foreign cars from flooding the domestic market and killing off FSO. So they had that going for them for a little while, at least until the tariffs were slowly phased out.
There were actually talks with Fiat and Volkswagen for the buyout of FSO. But the unions - who had just secured themselves a strong position after basically overthrowing the government - were still on a power trip. They demanded that the FSO keep the outdated Polonez, that the factories be kept at their current employee count for five years, as well as some other things. Daewoo was the only company willing to agree to all of this - Fiat and VW... just politely asked the unions "Is there a tank riding in my eye?" and turned around and left
Exquisite video, was waiting with baited breath on this one
Some of those used German cars ended being re-sold in Lithuania🥴
Is that why BMW owners to this day avoid using blinkers? It all started in Poland, with shady electrical on German cars.
The tariffs made a locally car more expensive? Huh? That sounds like the opposite of a tariff.
Polonez on Big Car, am I dreaming? Greetings from Poland. Parents had Caro 1.6 GLI, lots of fun with RWD on snow with all the weight in front :).
The Sunbeam Alpine meets the Lancia Delta…..
The Intro took me right back to the late 80s and Morris Minor and the Majors.”Stutter rap”…. 😊
"so join with us in the p..p..p..Pololonez rap."
@@BigCar2 “No….. sleep…. till Bedtime !!!!”
I remember in the mid 80s FSO cars (especially the polonez model) were on display at my local market place 😁
@ big car I had a FSO Polonez myself. I think it was 1979 but it could have been 1980 when I bought it. I live in the Netherlands. First you compare the Polonez to an Opel Kadett but it was much bigger, more the size of an Opel Rekord. They used the Fiat 1500X engine that produced 85 HP. It was not sluggish with that engine, nor was it very fast. Later I had an Opel Rekord and the passengerspace was slightly better in the Polonez and the trunk was pretty much bigger in the Opel Rekord. The Opel with it's 2.0 L 90 HP was sluggish.
Someone who lived down the road from us in the 80's got a new Polonez. It was in that petrol blue shade that most of the UK cars seemed to be. I was 11 or 12 at the time and I thought it looked quite a neat car even though it was clearly a bargain basement job. It sounded good too, more sporty than it actually was but whatever. It's a shame we never got the 2 litre version.
Back to the car down the road. It was kept for about 10 years and oh, the rust! It was such a bloody shame. Eventually it vanished to be replaced by a Sierra estate.
Very cool to see a Polish car on an automotive channel. I’m American and have never laid eyes on a Polonez. Very reminiscent of 80’s Volkswagen cars. So many car manufacturers out there completely unknown to us in the USA. I did live in Germany for 14 years, but this was pre-1990. So I did see a lot of cars not seen here in the USA. Mostly French and Italian . We don’t have Peugeot, Renault or Citroen in the USA. So they are pretty rare here too. Poland has a lot of great engineers, I’m surprised they don’t have a car available in the USA. I know the fiat 500 is built in Poland. Does Poland still have a domestic car manufacturer? Anyways, cool video. The intro was great. I’m sure a lot of Polish people related. 👍🏻
Unfortunately we don't have anymore :(
No, we don't. Except for trucks and buses. Jelcz still exists and makes those under own name. There were a few tries alongside. Leopard was making luxury retro cars with Corvette engine of a little over a decade, and Arrinera was making a supercar also with Corvette engine, but both went bankrupt.
The sole survivor from the 'old-school' is Bosmal, which now is strictly a research and development company acting as a contractor for other companies, but started as R&D division at FSM, and branded convertible version of Fiat 126p. I'm pretty sure they developed drivetrain for the first gen 500e.
After Polonez was killed off, and Daewoo fell, FSO kept making Daewoo Lanos and rebranded it as FSO, actually selling well in Ukraine, but the company was partly sold to Ukrainian AvtoZAZ who was allowed to dismantle Lanos' production line and move it to Ukraine. FSO was once more updated by GM and made Chevrolets but eventually stopped making cars when the city of Warsaw raised the land tax and government refused to create a special economy zone alike the one Fiat or Opel factories would be in.
FSO didn't have trouble with engineers but with how they were robbed by socialist economy (for example, literally not getting paid for the cars they sold), then with mismanagement and events like the mentioned above.
In 1990s FSO was still trying to further develop Polonez, there were proposed suspension redesign, 4 wheel drive and Daewoo engine upgrades, but after Daewoo takeover it didn't seem to make economic sense. Shame really, because with a few well thought mods it handles really nicely (it has 50:50 weight balance), and even after year 2000, there were still a few cars that didn't have crumple zones working that well or passenger cabin that stiff. This car maintains cabin space even when rammed by a train. It had potential to become either a durable simple car for less developed markets, or an oldschool fun car like the Mustang, or a nice light offroader. As a utility car it was selling well even in developed markets like Italy.
Another issue was that istead of making a single company with strong offer, the state split it into single factories.. FSO was making family cars, FSM little cars, Nysa was making minivans, Żuk was making vans, Star was making trucks, Jelcz was making trucks and buses, Autosan was making buses and FSR was makig off-road vehicles, Ursus was making tractors and gear.
To make it worse, factories making subcomponents such as steering racks or turbochargers were also separate entities, sold to separate companies after the fall of communism which in some cases meant losing access to critical components or losing potential to develop new ones. Also, FSO and FSM both had rights to 'Polski' brand, while FSO and FSR had similar names and their cars were often presented together, which rightfully irritated FSO because there was a dramatic difference in production technology and quality of cars between the two. There was also always this problem that there was a bunch of cars that had compatible parts and components but belonged to different entities. For example, there were existing transmission components for an off-roader from Honker miltary car and an excellent engine from Andoria, but FSO couldn't just say 'we're putting the three together' to finish their off-road pickup project. They had to enter negotiation with various different companies. Again, shame, because Polonez Analog could have been an alternative to Mitsubishi L200.
@@piotrmalewski8178 Great comment. It seems nowadays that Poland has a lot of foreign car and utility vehicle companies having factories there, but there's not much left concerning genuinely Polish companies. The only Polish-based automotive company doing well is apparently Solaris Buses, and partly Autosan. Jelcz still builds trucks, but only for the military; civilian truck and bus production has stopped years ago. Tractor maker Ursus also went bankrupt a few years ago and seems to have disappeared now, as did the Honker and the Lublin van some years ago. Really sad to see so many legendary companies and designs disappear.
@@torstenscholz6243 Lublin was a real shame to fall. In it's time it was really competetive in every way but fall of Daewoo and becoming split entitity killed it in long term. Perhaps had it been a part of FSO, they would have been able to modernize it with the money from Chevrolets. Andoria engine still had a lot of potential, the car just needed more comfy interior with and some added convieniences like AC to last longer.
On the other hand trade unions in those post-communist factories mantained low work ethics. Most mechanical issues in Polonezes were caused not by technology, design or even quality of materials, but mainly by factory staff.
it's got a bit of a look of the lacia delta to it. which is no bad thing at all . Great video as per. Cheers dude from Daz and my dog Max from the East coast of Lincs
Lancia Even
My Polish wife hates this car and visibly gags when she sees one. Something to do with very uncomfortable and long rides when she was a kid. I tease her sometimes by expressing my admiration for the car and telling her I would like to buy one
I think her parents had Maluch (Fiat 126p), Polonez was quite spacious and pretty good for long drives especially with Inter groclin seats.
@@alexeveryman5080 My wife had a Maluch when she was 18. Not sure what her parents had
I've got to say, there a big difference in comfort between the old version and the Caro or Atu.
Caro and Atu are a bit shaky and have terrible standard seats. The old version was much better. Suspension flows nicely, and the seats are much bigger, thicker, better profiled and made of soft foam.
Thanks!
Thank you!
That concept at 2:25 has to be by Giugiaro - it's an Esprit on stilts, super cool
It looks like it, doesn't it?
@@BigCar2 It had mid mounted drivetrain from Fiat 128, so not a 125p derivative as you describe it.
The thing is, Polish engineers were frequent visitors at Fiat and probably saw Lotus' mockup. Same for 125p Coupe, I believe it's some Abarth or Lancia concept knockoff.
Something like Polonez however, was crudely drawn as a general idea of a future car by Jan Krzysztof Meisner in 1960, and then published in Stile Industria.
Perhaps other people had the same ideas independently (there is no Canadian geometry as they say), but Meisner said that when Polonez showed up it was his dream coming true, because when he published sketches of this body shape, listing advantages, he knew there was no chance of making it in Poland at the time, but hoped it would come back as license car. He described it as 'a car that looked smart enough to impress on special occasions, but practical enough you could load a lot in and sleep there comfortably'.
In Polonez, if you 'decompose' the rear sofa there is flat and just enough space to put a standard mattress for 2 people in.
ah the Polonez. I remember a few of these coming in for MOT back in the 80s. really liked them, all that FIATness going on in a full sized hatchback saloon. that was in an era when most cars here in the UK still sported a boot
"decompose" and "fold down" in polish can be the same word.
I realized it when you said it translated it this way haha
Yes, that was pretty funny. The correct word in English would be 'reclining'. Folded seats are a thing too, but these were reclining, which is much better. I always wanted a car that you can comfortably sleep in. But yeah, the seats were decomposing as well. lol. FSO, thank you off of a mountain!
During the 1980s, my Polish neighbours in France owned a Polonez car. I remember that it said "Polski" on the rear.
It was quite remarkable that car was designed for the eighties was still rear wheel driven and equipped with old fashioned
leaf suspension
The final prototypes of production model were ready by 1975, so they were just slow intrudcing it. Also, Edward Pietrzak who was production manager at the time, and by 1981 became head manager of the company, stated that he himself would have gone for front wheel drive, but most higher ups in FSO believed that a good car should be rear wheel drive. Works rally team also wanted rear wheel drive since such cars dominated the competition.
As someone who grew up in 90s era Poland, this was very nostalgic. 🥲🇵🇱
Polski Fiats were imported to the UK through Sheerness Docks in Kent. I worked on what was supposed to be pre-delivery inspection on the 125p, Polonez and Tarpan. Most had to be almost re-built as the build quality was appalling! Most of them were already rusting, had components that didn't work, and in some cases missing entirely!
That makes sense. FSO cars were robbed by staff and suffered from drunkness and sabotage. Tarpan was made by FSR, and FSO hated FSR for primitive production technology. Actually, if a component made in FSO was the same as the component used in Tarpan, and it failed quality inspection at FSO, it was sent to be used in Tarpan.
Impressive factual knowledge. Best.
I had never heard of this car, so this was super interesting :)
OH MY GOD, MY PRAYERS HAVE BEEN ANSWERED
Bro rockin' the FSO. Peace.
Jak się tylko Motobieda dowie :)
Ciii nie mów mu ;).
Już mu kobieta musi gotować bigos na uspokojenie, bo w Big Car nie było przekleństwa co 3 sekundy i stwierdzenia, że Polonez to najgorszy chłam ;)
Raczej Złomnik w kolejnym filmie będzie to rapował...
Polish car factory names were so creative. FSO, FSM, FSC, FSC, FSR, FSD, but you also had SFA "Autosan", JZS "Jelcz" and FSC "Star".
You did the excellent job. Thank you. The 1st generation of the Polonez was also called the Borowicz after the famous tv series,007 where the main character the police inspector Borowicz has been using the brand new FSO Polonez.
Sorry but the auto text corrected the surname - Borewicz pronounced like Borevitsh
07 not 007
the Polonez was designed in ITALY. There is a video on the original prototype, while the same as the production model, many details were lost on the production model. Jangarbacz filmed the original Polonez prototype offered to FSO by Turin. The official prototype was named the Polski indeed, and it was way more stylish, especially inside
It was some-kind-of little Polish Ford Crown Victoria. :DDD Many Polish policemen praise the endurance of 'Panda car' Polonez (ceased from duty around 2008-2010), comparing to more fragile successor Kia C'eed Wagon.
Thanks Big Car for bringing to foreigners best history of most facelifted car in the world
I worked for a garage that had an FSO franchise in the mid eighties. They sold a lot of Polonez, as they were a very cheap car loaded with extra goodies at the time. There were a lot of build quality issues though, like windows that fell out of the runners and dropped into the door. We also had to do a recall on every vehicle for the brakes, as the master cylinder needed alternations to brake lines and would allow air into the system. Cheap motoring, if you like that sort of thing.
It's a known issue in Poland. The problem was, the full employment policy in socialist economy, which meant however bad you worked, you had a job granted.
There was even a saying, that if you want a good car, it must be made on Wednesday, because of Tuesday workers still have hangover, and on Thursday they are already drinking.
I personally found Polonezes absolutely reliable but I only owned like 15 years old+ ones, so those must have been the good units.
Time for an FSO Polonez Beats edition :)
That was a very nice take on the intro, more of that please!
Absolutely Love this channel, got me into obscure car brands that really had alot going for them.
An interesting history of a car with numerous restylings that gradually changed the design beyond recognition. You forgot to mention in the video that there was an Orciari "sporty" body kit and the Caro Plus/Caro Atu Plus/Caro Truck Plus also featured a different grille and different side repeaters turns lights.
That Back To The Polish Future clip was hilariously! 🤣👍
Yeah, I liked that one!
I had one.I was 19 and Polonez was 18.My first car. History of this car -It was rebuild after crash and fire in local dealership called "Polmozbyt" (crash was before i was an owner).So i had body from 90' but all mechanical parts ware old 4 speed manual,engine with low number (45 and something K) Orginal body (and whole car) was bild in second year of production 1980.Regards from Poland.
I owned a 1989 Polonez in 1995. I found it particular charming and for a few hundred pounds in excellent condition, it was easy to see the sense in it. My most enduring memory of it was the steering column stalks. They were made of such thin plastic, they flexed as I moved them and it made indicating a turn quite an unpleasurable experience. I'm sure the car could have been hugely improved if the stalks were nicer to use. I love the old days.
Maybe you didn't know it was adjustable and forgot to lock it in place?
Just kidding.
That intro, brilliant. I expect this kind of thing every time from now on.
I remember when I was a child, how many Polish tourists were invading Romania Black Sea Coast resorts, driving their Polonez 1500, many, towing a caravan, or driving those tiny Polski Fiat 126p, almost always towing a small trailer, with luggage and a tent, inside. On our market these cars had little to no presence. Even if Romanians were waiting for their paid Dacia 1300 (Romanian made Renault 12), around two years, due to high demand. I must say, I never saw a Polonez 1500 owned by a Romanian. Apart from Romanian made Dacia1300, on our roads there were Skoda 120L, Skoda 1000MB, Skoda 100, few Lada 1200 and 1500, Trabant, few Wartburgs, but no Polonez. However as a boy, with much passion for cars, seeing these Polonez 1500 in hotels parking lots, was very interesting. I was dreaming of having one, but everything changend later, when our Dacia 1310, and later Dacia 1410 and 1410 Sport (coupe), were launched. And after the second Romanian car Brand was launched - Oltcit (Romanian made Citroen Visa), with two variants, Club and Special, my interest for these Polish cars vanished.
FSO didn't sell Polonezes anywhere in the East Block except for domestic market. Maybe that's why.
Besides Polish tourists coming to the Black Sea, the FSO Polonez was known in Romania from the car rallies (the "2000" version). Beautiful car.
I remember these cars as a kid and my partner is polish so I’ve really enjoyed this video!
They were as good as anything else at the time, re marinas and regular escort mk2’s etc, a seventies polonez is quite a handsome car from it’s day I think and there were lots about in the UK at the time.
Lovely cars 😃👍
The Polonez was the dreamcar in the late 1970s in Poland.
Such a great amount of detail you put into this! It was a bit of an ungainly looking thing, but I miss basic and odd cars like this!
Someday I will buy a Polonez