IBM Model F62 "Kishsaver" review (capacitive buckling springs)
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- Опубликовано: 29 сен 2024
- Skip to 9:03 for a typing demonstration.
Today we look at the IBM 6019284 Model 200 62-key "Kishsaver" terminal keyboard. It was a glorious day when IBM perfected the 60% keyboard ^^ .
My keyboard reviews: bit.ly/1TbOtft
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I'm Thomas and I do videos and reviews on mechanical keyboards ranging from the most sickening modern RGB gaming keyboards to vintage hardware relics, or sometimes keycaps or keyswitches ranging from Cherry MX to Alps SKCM to IBM buckling springs and anything in between.
Follow me on Twitter for updates on my keyboard videos! / chyrosran22
The practice sentence was: "Hello my name is Thomas and I'm typing on an IBM Model F62 Kishsaver right now. Jesus Christ, I'm not a space saving guy, but if I was, I'd hopefully be able to snag one of these."
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4:54 Top 10 most brutal dubstep drops
dat metallic echo after the drop
that's so metal @@Banom7a
this scared the fuck out of me
The one thing a Kishsaver definitely doesn't save is your money!
Yes, it's not a Cashsaver. How ironic for a banking terminal!
@@Chyrosran22 LOL!
Weight imperial
Weight actual......
Oh you sneaky bugger.
^^
@Disciplexeon The Operator thanks
Well I went ahead and bought one of those from the Brand New Model F Keyboards website! We'll see how it is when he ships it out later this year!
jesus christ the drop "hint" jumpscared me
I find it funny how heavy it is, considering that it's supposed to be a space saving keyboard.
It's meant to squeeze more tellers side by side, not fit in your briefcase; why would you want a portable keyboard, you need a truck to move a computer anyway? What do you think this is; the future?
Nice vid mate
The thing is, @Chyro , when you measure the "weight" in kg, you're actually measuring the mass. The "weight" units that are apart of Yee Olde' Units Systems is Newtons.
If you wish to measure the mass in Freedom Units, however, you can use Slug.
But I'm sure you know this as you work in the sciences
;P
You are right, but the metric and imperial systems are not the only used, various technical systems are also quite popular! As a european thermal engeneer I use quite a lot power expressed in metric kilocalories instead of watts, because I instantly have the amount of water needed for heating or cooling. Other technical systems use kgf, as the force that corresponds to that made by one kg of mass on the normal earth gravity. Or even in structural engineering they straight swap the kg symbol with DN (decanewton), making the simplification that a kg is 10 N instead of 9.81!
Yes, I'm aware of this, just as I'm aware that keycaps are properly called "buttons" xD .
I was unaware that "Buttons" were the proper terminology. Thanks again for spreading knowledge!
I was unaware that "Buttons" were the proper terminology. Thanks again for spreading knowledge!
"Keycaps" are the two-part ones like on buckling springs and stuff, one-part keycaps are technically called "buttons", yes.
"Actual"
these switches are like chad blue switches
Though if we should compare to similar switches, Kaihua BOX whites or jades would be more apt for the comparison
You dont need ounces, 220.462 lbs is 100kg
its like saying "metric is shit, i dont need two measurements with imperial because 100 pounds is 45 kilograms and 359 grams"
imperial and actual, really bruh XD
Dude, your balance between comedic / professional is spot on.
Thanks :) .
Imperial / Actual. You made my day.
youtube hearing a model F drop as music make mine too
How? Kg is weight of 1 litre of water at freezing point. Gram is 1cm^3 of water at freezing point (1/100 of litre). Pound is defined as... 0.45359237kg lol.
@ yeah, it takes a higher iq to use imperial. I know its rough for you.
Kg is mass, not weight.
@@altlllOlOlOll I appreciate your belief in squandering extra brainpower trying to compute two different units.
Really keeps you firing on all cylinders and your brain in tip-top shape when you need to do this insanity-inducing conversion every day. Helpful if you're born in the US and you need to keep what few brain cells you were born with in fighting (or flight) form.
Source: I'm also an American. Not proud of that.
Great review. I can't believe how heavy that thing is. Also, I always get a kick out of your sarcastic comments about the imperial system!
Didn't expect to find you here! I like your 'where to start' and 'time to buy' videos!
YellowSuperNintendo thank you :)
Generic Green Squid Thanks! I love mechanical keyboards and always watch Thomas' videos
Jesus twinkle tits Christ! That made me laugh as well as dropping it.
*cough wrong and imperial* aaugh sorry uh what?
*FACTS
I'm waiting for the more authentic cast iron edition.
'let me drop you a hint' then the sound of the keyboard killed it for me :DDDDD
the new f77 is even heavier at 8.8 pounds after adding a detachable usb c im adding.2 pounds n shit so ima round to 9 pounds
"Let me drop you a small hint..." KAPLOOONGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGgggggggggggggggggg..!!! :D
"Or six 'Loobss', two point seven 'Ozz'" Hahahahaha!!
*wheezes*
Most modern software accomplishes a "return" key using a SHIFT+ENTER combination. I do like the old keyboards with both, my Macintosh keyboard has both, which is strange since they dropped so many other keys.
"6 lbzzz and 2.7 ozzz!" LOL
I like the use of "Models F" instead of "Model F" for the plural. Similar to 'attorneys general'.
and governors general
At that time they probably didn't think that pc (and peripherals) would be replaced every couple of years, so just to be sure they built those things to last a 2-3 lifetimes, and then overengineered with a factor of 200%. At 5:36 you can see something like a cable tie or a simple label with a stamp, but it seems more a bandage from a mummy! Someone at IBM must have thought that if they can last 5000 years on a mummy they can use them on their keyboards!
Specialised bank terminals like the IBM 4704 probably did have a long service run, I'm guessing. The 4704 came out in 1986 apparently books.google.ie/books?id=tbIGz5NppoYC&lpg=RA1-PA84&dq=IBM+4704&pg=RA1-PA84&redir_esc=y#v=onepage&q=IBM%204704&f=false while I think the absolute earliest anyone would have been likely to junk their 4700 systems in favour of a system using commodity PCs would have been well after Windows 3.1 came out in 1992; and it would more likely have happened after WinNT 4 came out in 1996, maybe quite a few years after that.
Computers were also like $5000 at least back then.
@@leocomerford
I wouldnt be surprised if someone somewhere is still using them
Old IBM stuff is fascinating. I found an old IBM very basic laser printer and that thing is built like a tank and it has one of those famous IBM flip switches.
The weekend historian part of me wonders if the reason that IBMs stuff from back then was built as they were had to do with the cold war. They would basically have been to computer systems what lockheed was to aircraft that is the worlds most advanced at the time. I cant find anything to confirm this suspicion but 70-80s IBM stuff just screams "I have cold war pentagon project funding and experience". Everything from keyboards with extremely well thought out mechanisms and layouts to everything being extremely well built from the finest materials. They sure were getting paid a lot by someone who wanted them to develop high quality products and who were willing to pay for that quality thats for sure.
Regardless the quality of their stuff amazes me to this day.
TFW 60% Keyboards actually predate the TKL.
Can't wait to get my Repro, because i'm not insane enough to pay for a genuine, haha.
I've also seen a few images going around of a Chinese 60% case modeled after this that weighs something like 8 pounds that i'm hoping to track down and claim.
I laughed my idiot head off when you dropped it. Cripes that's a mighty beast!
4:50 on repeat. No regrets. That clip alone almost made me buy one of those modern ones, but I can't live without my dedicated function and arrowkeys.
Guess I'm still stuck with my AK33RGB, which I'm very tempted to mod with Kailh Navy Heavy switches (yes, they finally came in!)
Cheers man, thanks for sharing!
devjock you might like a video I have planned a few months down the line ;) .
Another 'I can't buy that' stuff... Anyway XT or AT model F is quite good value for money even in nowadays. They are rugged af,reistant to the dust, and extremely pleasant typer.I think any keyboard lovers should have model F.
Weight (Imperial) & Weight (Actual)
lol! Savage.
Ahh finally a 4704 review! I feel like you'd absolutely love the full size 107 key board that weighs 10 pounds. I know I love mine, even if I can't use it a night because it's too loud...
Austin Pratt I love mine too! :D
We use metric weight to measure our illicit drugs here, does that count?
Love your videos, watched nearly every single one! but I got unsubdued from you about a month ago, as I haven't seen your new videos from a month ago. But I'm back listening to your smooth amazing voice while learning about great keyboards
Aww, no beeping demo?
stonent that's for another video ;) .
2:32 to use it you have to press SHIFT+ENTER and it works as a return key
I own one of the F77 Reproduction boards, and I can say with certainty that it lives up to the originals. It is a truly fantastic board. Also, it weighs 4.7 KILOS!
Me: I need a new keyboard. Hmm, let's check reddit and RUclips for recommendations.
Me, having subscribed to your channel's RSS feed: I need 84 new keyboards (at least 83 different Model Fs and Ms) and money.
Oh, you.
Aww man, I listen to your reviews at work, (like its not on the current window) and when you dropped it for the 'small hint' I almost fell out of my seat LoL!
Nowadays Shift+Enter generally works as a Return key on most applications, but it would be nice if they were separate keys because that shortcut is not obvious at all.
"Let me drop you a small hint."
*literally drops keyboard about an inch or two*
Keyboard: *SMACK*
stampycatfan01 Pretty sure the drop was less than ONE inch actually xD .
And the sound was like an anvil falling on wood.
I believe the actual noise is "THUD"
nearly 3 kilos...
"you could kill someone with this" is an understatement.
There definitely aren't enough cast zinc keyboards being made today.
Speaking to how close these "New Model F" keyboards are to the old ones: I don't have a complete board, but I did buy replacement flippers for a 122 key battleship that had extremely worn springs. (These were 50 cents apiece, so not extremely cheap, but probably the cheapest way to get a model F 122 to new typing condition.)
If the quality of the flippers is anything to go on, these things are pretty much identical to the original Model F in key feel. I literally can't tell any difference between these and the lesser used keys from before the mod. I did a side by side comparison of new vs old flippers, and even in appearance the difference is negligible. The sound is 100 percent bang on to the originals, right down to the pitch. I can't imagine the level of work that went into getting things THAT right...
For those of you with a more worn out model F board, buying these replacement flippers is a no brainer. I'd definitely do so while they're still in production.
Interestingly, many chat programs let you input Shift+Enter to let you create lines. The Return lives on!
"A system of measurements is always better when you need two different units to express one thing." Approved.
Nani? What the actual fuck!!?? What in the world is that thing? 2.8-FUCKING KILOS???? GIVE ME A BREAK, IBM!!!!
6 libz 2.7 ozz
The separate Enter and Return keys really need to make a comeback. It would be great for things like Skype messaging and the like.
I for one rather like my defensive typing implement... err... Battleship :P
Sure, there's no room for anything else on the desk other than the mouse, but for the gaming rig it's perfect! It's not actually that much bigger than my old Roccat, in fact given its shorter front bezel it might actually be a bit smaller in this regard, so I don't consider it a compromise at all.
I'm actually watching this video a few days after I saw that your own New Model F was shipped
I'm very much looking forward for an in-depth review of your unit since I'm on the fence of actually buying one myself (even tho the Unicomp Model M looked quite tempting)
*stumble home drunk from the bar* *bing, new video* *BANG KEYBOARD DROP* awesome...
Imperial / Actual is just perfect. I love it. That's it.
This is fantastic!
Keep up the great work Thomas.
What is your recording setup? Sounds amazing!
It's an sE Electronics X1 in a Rode PSA-1 boom arm coupled to a Cube4Nano audio interface.
The iron throne of keyboard owners
Can your voice go any deeper? lol
Very nice way to start my day! Thank you good sir, will come again!
Superb quality!
I laughed at one luh-buh three ozz
Hope I can get an answer from you or from those who has the new model f62/77. I've been looking for a vintage keyboard that has nkro. And definitely model f has it. I'd like to know if it works as smooth as the modern mechanical keyboards? I'm planning to get one and use it on my stream for gaming.
My Model M feels more like a linear keyboard. The tactility when the spring buckles is very weak and unsatisfying.
I know that the plastic rivets get broken over time on these keyboards. But I don't feel any of them got broken loose in the housing.
I don't know if the bolt modding would fix the issue and make the springs more taught giving them more tactility when they buckle.
Ivan Kolić How do you “feel” they are not broken? Open up the chassis and see the backplate yourself. It’s the only way of being “sure”, I think. If they are indeed broken, then bolt-modding is the only route.
People mostly mention plastic rivet heads brake loose and rattle in the keyboard housing.
There is no rattle on mine, that's why I doubt that the rivets have given in.
Is it possible that the springs get worn out from typing and do not have that strength and tactility?
Mine is in pretty good condition, I doubt It had much use.
But, nevermind, I did buy the tool needed to open up my Model M and I plan to bolt mod it.
Ivan Kolić sounds like maybe just new springs are needed, I have read that they do eventually wear out and can be swapped out without a complete disassembly. Also once cleaned these thing almost never show signs of prior usage
Damn your videos are awesome :)
Kaiser333333 cheers mate :) .
That is a lot of lubs and oz!
I WANT A MODEL F SOOOOOOO BAAAAAAAD.
lbs is still a mystery for me too
That "enter-return" thing is funny, you can observe the difference while using whatsapp web. Enter sends the message. You have to press shift+enter to activate the "return" function and go to another line.
Has anybody made a converter for these? It's awesome you can get a USB repro.
It's been converted to USB, yes. I don't think there's an out-of-the-box converter for it.
Chyrosran22 Thanks for the reply
Metal keyboard ! I just love this! :)
Jezus twinkle tits christ!
THIS THING WAYS MORE THAN A FUCKING REAM OF FUCKING PAPER!? WWHHAATT!?
This keyboard is even heavier than my laptop what the fuck!?
Funny how Shift + Enter is often used today to imitate the behavior of the return key.
its 3:30 am and I read the title as the ibm "dishwasher". idk whats wrong with me
does anybody know where i can find one of these that isnt a replica?
I get the feeling he really likes saying "Models F", and "Models M".
Ohmygosh I'm so excited to get one of the reproductions! I have an original teensy-modded XT F but this will be so amazing. It's definitely going to be my main board. Can you do a comparison of the original and reproduction if you get one? Thank you!
You can retrieve the old functionality on modern OS's by mapping Shift+Return to one of the enter keys.
i got to try a new and an old kishsaver at a meetup a few months ago, and theyre extremely similar, might have to buy one..
it weighs more than my laptop!
A great video, for a great keyboard.
Will the real Kishy please stand up?
Will I or won't I? These are the important questions.
lol i couldint help buck buckle my springs during the typeing demo on my f122
HOOOLY COW, nice rare keeb!
1:18? on the right side, what is that keyboard? Is it capacitive buckling spring?
Mmmm. By far the favorite of all my boards to date.
But I've yet to try beamsprings...
i just realised... your voice here... O_O
Are you planning to get / review a modern repro? Would be awesome to get your input on it.
"is it heavy? - then its expensive" - some guy in Jurassic Park
Best keyboard ever. For me F62>F77>AT>F107>XT>M. I own a Model M 1988 and burn in desires of getting at least an XT, preferably an AT, ideally a Unsaver, F62/F77, F107 for lots of extra keys. Then get me a SSK, a Blue&Orange Alps, linears SKCM, Cherry Vintage MX, some Beamspring, a Topre for my wife, and we'll be done.
Carlos Sánchez I hope you have deep pockets :p .
I might start an auction on Ebay for my soul.
Can I buy it if you voor 140€
Where can I purchase one of these
where do you buy those keyboards?
Alok Sardar he didn’t buy this one. It’s on loan. They’re super duper rare!
Great video, never knew about a 60% IBM board, now that's a vintage board I can see myself using. But why is it that on a previous 60% board review, the Pok3r if I'm not mistaken(it might have been another modern space-saving keyboard), you clearly mentioned you didn't like the 60% layout, saying that you could never use it and that it's completely unnecessary, because ''who needs that much desk/mouse space anyway?'', but when you review a 60% IBM board you talk about it as if it was perfect? Did you think it was unnecessary to say how much you dislike this layout again? Did you want to only say positive things about this board(which does deserve all the positives, I mean, I love 60%, this board is like a dream to me, it puts my HHKB to shame)...I don't understand. It's almost like you want to say bad things about new keyboards and keep the reputation of old keyboards perfect.
I didn't mention anything about the 60% layout because in this case it is clearly pointless. Obviously if you want a bigger than 60% one you'd get one of the bigger sizes. Besides, by now you guys basically know I don't like small sized. It's also a setup for a later, related video in which I DO talk about the layout.
We really need a group buy project to make metal cases for the F AT and case tops for the F122. An all-metal case takes buckling spring from *awesome* to whatever is beyond *awesome* (perhaps *orgasmic*?), and my F107 is my favorite typing keyboard.
Thank you for another great video!
Nicholas Fiorentini as mentioned in the video, so, the F77 which you can order right now?
is this first ever 60%
mechancal keyboard
I find these videos depressing.(love your videos but hate the memory's)
I used to have over 20 model F"s and early Model M's. (All square badges that I bought when they were cheap)
When I went away for a few days they were all destroyed and thrown away.
When I got back I was told they were thrown away because I should be using new keyboards rather than old crap especially with new keyboards being so cheap(membrane)
I just started looking into enjoying typing again with these videos but all the IBM buckling springs are now unaffordable.
Looking at hundreds of dollars locally for late model M's that are missing keys etc...
Anyway thanks for the videos.
Be careful. A black hole may form around that keyboard due to its density.
I'm tempted to buy a keyboard from www.modelfkeyboards.com. Anyone with an experience with them?
They're still in initial manufacturing. Nobody has one yet. Ellipse keeps everyone updated quite well and currently I believe it's only the keycaps and the springs that he's waiting on factory perfection for.
Taran Van Hermert would love this!!!
The Kishsaver might be my favorite! :D
Still don't like the sound of model F's :P
You must have punched a brick wall with your right hand
Sic Semper Beats no, that's just the lighting making it look like that.
Great review I hope there is a F77 review coming soon
1:05 - err, Fokker? ;-)