The person with higher vertical oscilation will have a longer stride length of two runners with same cadence, plus a lower percentage of contact time. Both can contact ground in same relation to mass center. If pace is same, then vertical jump heights will also be same , as well as stride length. If keeping same cadence, spring higher and you will be going faster with automatically longer stride. Running is alternate foot jumping, at a trajectory. A 90° jump trajectory is called "running in place".
If you are running let's say by landing your feet directly under your body and then for one length you abruptly change to an overstride, then you have in fact increased your stride length. But guess what, your next overstride will go back to a lower stride length. That's because the start of the measure tape for the next measure will be at the spot of your last overstride. Hopefully this example helps someone get past the mind boggle
Lots of running this week, 3rd Marathon. Finished also your course the evening before (some audio session still open). Was a great experience with course and helped me a lot, it is worth every cent/penny. While doing the marathon i really liked to be able to switch running styles to distribute the overload of the muscles to different parts of the body. Like getting more power from the hips, when quad hurts or increase/decrease cadence for more or less pjong. BTW in the English version of the course the strength and mobility excercise for "strength and mobile hips" is the same as "adductor strength". Same exercise video, but different language.
I started to think - what really overstriding is? Someones say - hit the ground with your foot just under your hips. But others say - it needn't to be just under your hips but the angle that make shin and the ground at the time of the first ground contact is the right angle. The second case seems ok but what if the angle at the knee is too high? Eg (in extreme) also right angle? (Something like during the drill called lunges.) Is this overstiding? Maybe not be also not a corrct technique. So - what is recommended ange at the knee at the time of the first ground contact?
Yup, I had short stride length with overstriding, and it injured the ligament behind my knee big time. Only figured it out after I video'd myself sideview. In my mind, I was running perfectly.
Good information, Butt muscles has to be strong to pull you leg back up!!! Long distance running, your legs has to come up behind you, for that you need strong butt and Hamstring muscle!!!
Thanks for the debunking. I still can't rewire the way I think about this because I cannot separate overstriding from the stride length since I image if I start putting my foot farther away from the center mass, the stride length would naturally increase. Since these two are not correlated, would there be any metric that would show that you're overstriding? (like GCT?)
Hey there! I'd like to try answering your question or put my thought for others to chime in on. I think cadence may be the metric to detect overstride, albeit indirectly, since overstride creates braking forces and slows maximal potential. The best way to detect overstride, I heard Frank say in a previous video of his, is to video yourself.
Newb here, but maybe I can add something to the conversation. When you land with your foot out in front of your body, it does not increases your stride length. It increases your contact time with the ground. Land with the food below you, and you immediately start pushing yourself back up. Land with it out in front, and your not really creating force, until the food is below you. See what the Fredric says about this?
Cristian, the video is a little off. Fredrik's definition of over-striding is faulty. Over-striding is when you try to make your stride bigger in order to go faster. There are three ways to achieve this: 1. reaching further out in front with the landing foot, 2. pushing off harder and at a higher angle with the take-off foot, and 3, a combination of both 1 and 2. Landing under your centre of mass is largely irrelevant and has been debunked.
@@natethetoe386 - Nate, it does a bit of both. It's a nuanced balancing act. If you saw Kitata winning his Marathon, I think it was in 2020, beating Kipchoge, you'll see how much he overstrides. It didn't slow him down.
Hi Fredrik, Prentis here again - big fan of yours and also your biggest critic! I'm going to rib you on this one as well. I agree with the Maria and David story - not enough information. But, at 1:56, you say "if two runners have exactly the same pace, and exactly the same cadence then they will have exactly the same stride length." I agree! But you then go on to demonstrate something completely different and unrelated to the statement. Pretty much everything else you say in the video is nonsense. You cannot have a short stride length and still be over-striding. That is absolutely nonsensical. Over-striding is when you are reaching for a stride length which is greater than your natural stride length. And, by the way, all world-class and top performance runners do this when in competition, and accounts for about a 10% improvement in their speed relative to their performance runs in training. For men, this accounts for a typical training stride length of 1.9m and a middle distance (1500m) competition stride length of typically 2.1m. That's why competition races bloody hurt. What you are talking about is not over-striding but incorrect landing. That's something completely different. At 3:00 you say you "didn't keep the same cadence". Well, why didn't you? It undermines the entire pretext of what you are conveying. Any coach who tells his protege to take shorter steps needs to think about a change in career! And lastly, of the whoppers in this video, whilst running on the beach or over snow will leave footprints so you can measure stride length, these are very poor, and dangerous surfaces to run on, and will yield false, and short stride lengths because these surfaces sap energy return from your push-off. A neutral surface like concrete or tarmac is much better, especially if you can draw chalk marks on the ground at 10cm intervals and video yourself traversing a decent length of this marked ground at various speeds.
@@mikevaldez7684 Frederik still doesn't understand running technique and his video is wrong. Overstriding lengthens stride and allows to run faster thanks to braking forces.
In high performance runners overstriding is an integral part of non-metabolic propulsion. Thanks to this, you generate horizontal braking and more elastic potential energy is stored in the tissues. So overstriding provides a longer stride.
Every elite runner slows down in all steps. This mechanism let them load tissues and push of much efficient. This is non-metabolic push off, which occurs in first 25% of GCT. That means that the elite runners get maximum dynamics of push off when stance phase is still during overstriding.
These exaggerated running postures really help to visualize the problems!
The person with higher vertical oscilation will have a longer stride length of two runners with same cadence, plus a lower percentage of contact time.
Both can contact ground in same relation to mass center.
If pace is same, then vertical jump heights will also be same , as well as stride length.
If keeping same cadence, spring higher and you will be going faster with automatically longer stride.
Running is alternate foot jumping, at a trajectory.
A 90° jump trajectory is called "running in place".
quite useful for me to understand the pace,the strike, the cadence
. Thanks a lot
If you are running let's say by landing your feet directly under your body and then for one length you abruptly change to an overstride, then you have in fact increased your stride length. But guess what, your next overstride will go back to a lower stride length. That's because the start of the measure tape for the next measure will be at the spot of your last overstride. Hopefully this example helps someone get past the mind boggle
Lots of running this week, 3rd Marathon. Finished also your course the evening before (some audio session still open). Was a great experience with course and helped me a lot, it is worth every cent/penny.
While doing the marathon i really liked to be able to switch running styles to distribute the overload of the muscles to different parts of the body. Like getting more power from the hips, when quad hurts or increase/decrease cadence for more or less pjong.
BTW in the English version of the course the strength and mobility excercise for "strength and mobile hips" is the same as "adductor strength". Same exercise video, but different language.
Really appreciate your work ❤
I started to think - what really overstriding is? Someones say - hit the ground with your foot just under your hips. But others say - it needn't to be just under your hips but the angle that make shin and the ground at the time of the first ground contact is the right angle. The second case seems ok but what if the angle at the knee is too high? Eg (in extreme) also right angle? (Something like during the drill called lunges.) Is this overstiding? Maybe not be also not a corrct technique. So - what is recommended ange at the knee at the time of the first ground contact?
So how do fix the problem with not landing under centre of mass. That answer would be helpful please 😊
Yup, I had short stride length with overstriding, and it injured the ligament behind my knee big time. Only figured it out after I video'd myself sideview. In my mind, I was running perfectly.
✨Thank you, Sir, 🙏✨
Good information, Butt muscles has to be strong to pull you leg back up!!! Long distance running, your legs has to come up behind you, for that you need strong butt and Hamstring muscle!!!
Thanks for the debunking. I still can't rewire the way I think about this because I cannot separate overstriding from the stride length since I image if I start putting my foot farther away from the center mass, the stride length would naturally increase. Since these two are not correlated, would there be any metric that would show that you're overstriding? (like GCT?)
Hey there! I'd like to try answering your question or put my thought for others to chime in on. I think cadence may be the metric to detect overstride, albeit indirectly, since overstride creates braking forces and slows maximal potential. The best way to detect overstride, I heard Frank say in a previous video of his, is to video yourself.
Newb here, but maybe I can add something to the conversation.
When you land with your foot out in front of your body, it does not increases your stride length. It increases your contact time with the ground.
Land with the food below you, and you immediately start pushing yourself back up. Land with it out in front, and your not really creating force, until the food is below you.
See what the Fredric says about this?
Cristian, the video is a little off. Fredrik's definition of over-striding is faulty. Over-striding is when you try to make your stride bigger in order to go faster. There are three ways to achieve this: 1. reaching further out in front with the landing foot, 2. pushing off harder and at a higher angle with the take-off foot, and 3, a combination of both 1 and 2. Landing under your centre of mass is largely irrelevant and has been debunked.
@@natethetoe386 - Nate, it does a bit of both. It's a nuanced balancing act. If you saw Kitata winning his Marathon, I think it was in 2020, beating Kipchoge, you'll see how much he overstrides. It didn't slow him down.
@@prentishancockgardeningwhat if you have both overstriding and incorrect landing at the same time? Would that be considered good mechanics?
🙏🏽🙏🏽
Hi Fredrik, Prentis here again - big fan of yours and also your biggest critic! I'm going to rib you on this one as well. I agree with the Maria and David story - not enough information. But, at 1:56, you say "if two runners have exactly the same pace, and exactly the same cadence then they will have exactly the same stride length." I agree! But you then go on to demonstrate something completely different and unrelated to the statement. Pretty much everything else you say in the video is nonsense. You cannot have a short stride length and still be over-striding. That is absolutely nonsensical. Over-striding is when you are reaching for a stride length which is greater than your natural stride length. And, by the way, all world-class and top performance runners do this when in competition, and accounts for about a 10% improvement in their speed relative to their performance runs in training. For men, this accounts for a typical training stride length of 1.9m and a middle distance (1500m) competition stride length of typically 2.1m. That's why competition races bloody hurt.
What you are talking about is not over-striding but incorrect landing. That's something completely different.
At 3:00 you say you "didn't keep the same cadence". Well, why didn't you? It undermines the entire pretext of what you are conveying.
Any coach who tells his protege to take shorter steps needs to think about a change in career!
And lastly, of the whoppers in this video, whilst running on the beach or over snow will leave footprints so you can measure stride length, these are very poor, and dangerous surfaces to run on, and will yield false, and short stride lengths because these surfaces sap energy return from your push-off. A neutral surface like concrete or tarmac is much better, especially if you can draw chalk marks on the ground at 10cm intervals and video yourself traversing a decent length of this marked ground at various speeds.
@prentishancockgardening, You clearly did not understand the video. Go back to rapping & pulling weeds for a living. 👌🙋🙏
@@mikevaldez7684 - Then please explain it to me, Mike?
@@prentishancockgardening Why would I waste my time? Fredrik already told me you were a troll😁🙋🙏
@@mikevaldez7684 - You up-voted both of your own comments. Damn!
@@mikevaldez7684 Frederik still doesn't understand running technique and his video is wrong. Overstriding lengthens stride and allows to run faster thanks to braking forces.
In high performance runners overstriding is an integral part of non-metabolic propulsion. Thanks to this, you generate horizontal braking and more elastic potential energy is stored in the tissues. So overstriding provides a longer stride.
" it slows you down"
No.
@@yacool yokol, it slows you down 👇
@@yacool Gait (Horizontal) propulsion is adversely affected by braking forces.
Only being able to run faster, farther & longer matters to competitive long distance runners 😁🙋🙏
Every elite runner slows down in all steps. This mechanism let them load tissues and push of much efficient. This is non-metabolic push off, which occurs in first 25% of GCT. That means that the elite runners get maximum dynamics of push off when stance phase is still during overstriding.
Your examples 😂😂😂