I love every Terminator movie. There is only 1 thing i really miss from the new ones. The horror factor. If you watch the original terminator, the whole movie is grim dark, depressive, cold and frightening. None of the future movies could capture that feeling.
Exactly! So true! Also the VFX of T1 look's so much better! Like with many other movie franchises... 1. part will alway's be superior no matter what. 😉
@not an avatar nor starwars fan just gimme Divison3 I like your name! :) Division 1 was best! Let's hope we will get 3. part focusing much more on Division 1 gameplay.
Hard to believe that several of the movies after T2 spent significant time in the post apocalypse and none of them were scarier than T1. I'd watched all the horror/slasher movies by age 12 and nothing was scarier than the Terminators after T1...and worse, the story was believable.
After watching this, Bruce Willis had it right in Looper: "I don't want to talk about time travel because if we start talking about it then we're going to be here all day talking about it, making diagrams with straws."
To be fair, this was to keep the movie relatable to normies with average IQs. Any serious talk of time travel takes some brain cells your box office crowd don't have.
GuyIncognito there is no “serious” talk about time travel because it doesn’t and will never exist. Time can only go in one direction (according to our understanding of physics).
@@theendurance according to "our" understanding... we used to think earth was flat until it was proven round. we used to think we were the center of the universe until it was proven we weren't... how long until our understanding of physics is proven to be elementary compared to whats actually possible??
@@guyincognito. Do you think it possible that they sent at least 3 Terminator back to stop Kyle and Sarah? It would explain the reason Kyle had to wait for the Terminator to spot her. Maybe have the Terminator see SGT Candy in a reboot.
Yes. My college had (hopefully past tense) a course about the films of Harrison Ford, and some college has a course about Beyoncé, so a Terminator course would be entirely justified.
Regardless of how deep you are into this, I think it's cool to look back and to think that one movie in 1984 inspired so much imagination that a whole franchise was made of this. I think this reflects the quality of the original movie and the very idea behind this exciting and engrossing story that struck a nerve with people's fantasy (and concern ...) regardless of age back then in 1984 and now.
I thought Isaac Asimov brought awareness and popularized the concept of rules being enforced on robot programming to prevent harm or death to humanity.
30 years on and still talking about this brilliant movie that started it all. Movies from the 80’s are, for the most part, unmatched in their storylines.
"From the future?" - Sarah Connor "One possible future. From your point of view? I don't know tech stuff." - Kile Reece This is what you say when you grew up knowing how to fire a weapon and not much else. Six
someone didn't watch T2 Judgement day. Arnold says and I quote "human decisions are removed from strategic defense, system goes online August 4, 1997. Skynet begins to learn at a geometric rate, it becomes self aware a 2:14 AM Eastern time August 29th in a panic to try to pull the plug." I will never forget the original date that judgement day was supposed to happen in the movie because it was my 18th birthday. How can anyone forget that their 18th birthday was in a friggin movie.
"Three Billion Human Lives Ended On August Twenty-Ninth Nineteen Ninety Seven. The Survivors Of The Nuclear Fire Called The War 'Judgement Day'. They Lived Only To Face A New Nightmare: The war Against The Machines."
I don't think the any of the terminators could run 88 mph. If you remember on the the second terminator the " liquid metal terminator " chased the car out of the mental institute and was unable to catch up to it. Just saying.
Is this because Doc Brown ... modified the amplifier in the 1st Back To The Future ... all because of the surge the tubes received ... the start of machine intelligence WOWSERS
The sad thing is that the perfect grandfather paradox the first movie had, actually died at the end of the first movie. Sarah herself caused the second movie and others thereafter to happen because she chose to CHASE THE STORM at then end, instead of flee south as Reese had said she would. It's a small detail, but something you notice after multiple rewatches. There is no Fate but what we make (for ourselves.)
Part 2.- If the first film is actually a time loop then it's a solid question to ask... how many times has this loop cycled? I think the original mission was just as we learned, to save Sarah. I think the "Original", original timeline was altered either by the T-800's killing spree or Kyle intercepting Sarah to protect her. That interference prevented Sarah from meeting John's real father and instead Kyle became John's father, thereby changing the future and forming this time loop which is now being continually altered by new events. Which also means that This John that is now controlled by Skynet isn't actually the real John Connor of legend.
It could be that the original John Connor with a different father would have been the resistance leader who sent Kyle Reese back, and so Kyle told Sarah all about him and what was coming, so then when she had a baby by him she named him John and trained him to lead the resistance, even though he wasn't the exact same John Connor. So, a self-fulfilling prophecy.
My one and only question from the first movie was always about how could 2029 John from the future tell 2029 Kyle to tell Sarah from 1984 that his mother will be strong and train her son John to fight and stand against the machines, but how could he knew that is what is supposed to happen if he is the very first John that was never tried to be killed by some machines that travel back in the future sent by a self aware system that has never been yet made and he is the first John to ever experience an end of the world at 1997, that means he and his mom had a normal life until 1997, not a life where his mom is teaching and preparing him to be some future leader bcoz she could not knew that yet, so I assume the 2029 John that sends 2029 Kyle back in the T1 is not the first original John that had no idea he was about to become a leader, but lets say a John from one of the loops you mentioned, a John that has already survived everything that happens throughout the Terminator movies, not the very first John that didn't experience the events from the second and third Terminator movie, bcoz his mother wouldnt have had a reason to prepare him for an end of the world and would be inappropriate for 2029 Kyle to tell 1984 Sarah that she will train her son as if her training him has already happened when it didnt since the 2029 John wasnt attacked from machines when he was little, and not she should so that the first John can live? I know it is quite a long question, but what do u think, whose John was the 2029 John from the first movie, the very first John or a John from some of the loops that you said must have been created?
I suspect that for all relevant purposes, unless the child were a girl, calling him John would have still resulted in the future Skynet was trying to prevent.
One thing people never seem to clue in on is that the original time loop had to start at some point. The first time it started skynet probably developed on its own then at some point in the future humans scored a decisive victory against the machines and skynet sent back the first terminator to change this and the first Kyle Reese was sent back too. In the course of events Kyle meets Sarah, who initially may have had nothing to do with the war but gets caught up in it now that she's carrying Kyle's child. The terminator sent to the past ensures the creation of skynet and perhaps accelerates the timeline from whatever it originally was. Now with John Connor created he ensures the downfall of skynet creating the loop. At least that's one possibility.
I was more under the impression that all the time travel had caused the timeline to start unraveling and creating paradoxes. Thus, the Terminator in Genisys that has protecting Sarah since she was a child is actually the exact same Terminator that was supposed to protect John in 1995. The T-1000 that Sarah and the time misplaced "Uncle Bob" destroy was the one that was supposed to attack John in 1995, but he showed up 22 years later than he should have. The constant changes to the time stream caused them to stop arriving at the correct time and thus time itself was becoming unstable due to John Connor and Skynet's constant war across time.
AustynSN that actually makes sense. I like the explanation in this video, but that is VERY plausible, since the Butterfly Effect represents your theory to a T!! That’s a simple but appropriate response!👍🏼
Tell you what mate You've gotta have an amazing mind to get thru that saga. You've done a pretty good job of it and I salute you. The best explanation I've heard from anyone. Bravo..
I'd like to see a movie where the machines dont send back anyone and the same with John not sending anyone. Removing the time travel aspect completely and making a movie where John and Kyle and the rest of the resistance battle through to destroy the defense network and end up destroying the machines to oblivion. An honest and true plot and timeline where things happen as they are supposed to happen with no time travel involved at all.
What would this movie be called...... I dont know........definitely up to James Cameron to name it or think something up............... Maybe I got one......... Terminator Resistance Humans becoming the ones who terminate the machines....while also realizing they are exactly the same as the machines.......they both kill and destroy each other for their survival in the world. Made of Metal and Wires and Circuits or to be made of Bones and Veins and Meat.....they both kill in order to survive. Besides.....applying real thought into it....the AI evolved with the exact same instincts as humans. Mass killings of a potential threat to its survival to stay alive. There's no difference in machines or humans........and I believe James Camerons creation of this franchise shows his understanding in the two. Metal or Human....they both have the potential to be cold. Lol Am I going to deep? Yeah I am lol. Sorry💀💀🖤🖤
@@navimajora19, a year later, and I'm here to tell you that it's not possible, because without Kyle Reese traveling back in time John Connor does not exist.
@@notahotshot Do you know how to think? They never sent anybody in the first place, and yet John still became John in the future, regardless of Kyle, he's the plot hole in this series since it started. Try and think harder, and don't let your nostalgia of being a fan ruin your ability to find the biggest plot hole in the first film. It even claims it within the movie script, once the machines discovered time travel, they sent back the Terminator and once the Resistance found out what they did, they sent back Kyle. MAJOR AND BIGGEST PLOT HOLE IN THE STORY. 👏👏👏
@Teun de Heer It makes more sense if you look at the stories being told from the T800's perspective of what must have happened where each story is that of a different T800. And yeah, it gets kinda corrected in Dark Fate's alternate timeline.
@@ThreeDaysOfDan I was about to say: Maybe he did see it, he retconed everything after T2! 😂 Btw, I'm not too sure what to think of this new Terminator. Good thing, it's rated R (final-f***ing-ly), but I smell a trap... Peace from France! 🍻
There are so many time travel theories. Doctor who theory: there are Malleable events that are so insignificant that they can be changed or fixed time points that can’t be. Multiverse theory (partly time travel): every change you make to a timeline creates an alternate timeline. Single timeline theory: every change you make will affect the future and everything in it but wont create a new timeline. Flash Tv theory: you can time travel but this wont open a new timeline, it will simply change the one your are in but the timeline will try to rewrite itself, however there are multiverses and they are created by making and unsure decision which will create a timeline where you did that instead. Solid timeline: no matter what you try everything will happen and you can’t change it. Tell me which ones i missed.
The Flash TV Theory. Its Different because The Flash Altered The Timeline, and Only He recognized the Differences between the Two, and Decided To Fix It. Side Note : The Reverse cant alter the timeline because He comes From the future.
Now this was a comment section I was hoping was full, a very interesting invitation for discussion. My last romantic interaction was a woman who used "timeline" every time she wanted to pour cold water on us. Despite her efforts I still like the term, timeline.
But what if Skynet ran all of these probabilities as a computer simulation and each movie we see is just one of the iterations of quadrillion's of iterations?
Personally I subscribe to the theory that every action causes branching points in time, creating parallel universes... These universes are effectively self-contained and if one travels back in time in one such universe, the instant they arrive, they create additional branching universes/timelines FROM their starting points PAST... So in regards to the Terminator timeline(s), they all occurred, and are all canon... As going back to any point in any of the timelines, would create additional branching points and would leave their starting point untouched and continuing on as if nothing happened. Judgement day happened in 1997, 2004, 2017 in their respective timelines and branching points there from.. And if we go by this, there are probably iterations where a Judgement day happened probably every year from mid 90's depending on branching paths to the same ultimate goal... There are also probably iterations where skynet never exists, or where skynet won the war... Either by defeating the resistance, or because the resistance never existed..
This is actually one way time travel would be possible is if time created branches like this IF time is completely linear. Otherwise paradoxes would happen causing time and existence to unravel and collapse in upon itself. Now if time is not linear and actually circular during different cycles it would be possible too. I personally think if time is linear it’s more like a corkscrew of cycles where the curves of different cycles happen similarly but with varying slight differences.
I dont know anything about phantoms or phantom singularity/ies but im pretty sure that if you kill off all the langoliers then time stops. Anyways free bagels are awesome.
I wonder if this guy is eventually going to make another terminator timeline explained, but this time explaining how dark fate fits into the overall timeline.
Well... in Dark Fate there was another Terminator so may be it changed the past once more and Arnold grew a conscience and stopped Skynet from being activated in 2004/2017
According to the script writers of Genisys, Skynet/T-5000 was " universe hopping " and had full knowledge of the events of all previous films. The sequel would have shown and explained it's timeline/universe. The T1-Salvation timeline ended with the 2015 comic book series of the same name in which John Connor and Skynet made peace and helped humanity rebuild better than ever.
The first movie was just a paradox (it ended where it starts, and starts when it ended) but (like most modern sci fi) uses the writing crutch of times lines to just do anything.
Hells yeah. If you read the original script or novel of T2, it even already explains that Skynet sent the T1000 minutes after it sent the T800 to 1984. It knew the '84 mission's only success was its own birth, so it sent them both back to back through time because the '95 mission was the real assassination mission. They were both gone before the Resistance ever got to the time displacement chamber. So yeah, T1 & 2 are where I end the franchise too.
Minutes is a long time when you can millions of calculations per second. Within seconds (probably less) of sending the T-800 to 1984, it would know that it failed. So it took its prototype T-1000 and threw that back in time to kill Connor directly. It would've known that it failed, but the indirect result of sending the T-1000 back to the past ended up being the prevention of Skynet ever existing, closing the causal loop and ending the entire story. T3 and onward can be viewed as fanfic (only a teenager could write that crap), alternate timelines, both...or irrelevant.
Yeah, what i like on the ongoing parts is these "battle across time" theme. If both enemys have the access to timetravelling technologies, they would have need a real new style of strategy. @Assad's Prophet, actually you can change the future, you cant change the past (in real world). I personally like the multiversum theory, that all possibilities are happen at any time. But Terminator is a movie and dont follow real world physics.
You bring up the interesting point about the exact moment of conception. That would explain the changes in John Connor's appearance, the changes in Kyle Reese's appearance, out of all of the other crazy stuff we've got to deal with the variables of the exact moment of conception, which brings in another, what, 1 in 4 million chance of something changing? This explanation actually makes the new movie make sense, ties together all of the timelines *and* gives the possibility of people from alternate futures coming back to a single, shared, original timeline.
+Darksnovia you might be right. Even though it seems now that Sarah Conner might be the new protagonist, we know she dies of leukemia sometime after her body's age equivalent of 29th August 1997 (i.e. the original J.D.). Since her body age in Genesys is still the one of 1984, that would mean that if she lives the rest of her life from 2017, her new year of death would end up being sometime after 2030.
+Adel Helal BUT that's terminator 3, as far as it being canon, James Cameron said it was not. As well as that timeline wouldn't even exist anymore anyway. But t3 doesn't count anymore
I would love to see a terminator film that is based on the original alpha timeline (where John Connor has a different father) that takes place in the future and focuses solely on the events immediately preceding the first terminator movie, specifically the final battle of the war that ends with the Resistance being victorious and the T-800 and Kyle Reese being sent back to 1984. There is so much potential material to explore here. But I’d only be interested in that movie if it were written and directed by James Cameron and had the same film noir aesthetic as the 1984 original. He perfectly captured the essence of what a war of man vs. machine would be like - dark, bleak, and destructive with overwhelming feelings of depression and hopelessness, but also of determination and will to survive.
The Terminator timeline is as follows, a T-800 is sent back to 1984 to terminate Sarah Connor before she conceives John Connor who would lead the human resistance to overthrow Skynet in 2029. The resistance sends back Kyle Reese to protect Sarah. This creates a paradox because Kyle and Sarah would meet and Kyle would father John Connor with Sarah. The T-800 would attempt to the very end to terminate Sarah Connor but would end up crushed in a hydraulic press at the Cyberdyne Systems factory. This entire process ensures the creation of Skynet but also the creation of John Connor. Skynet mission failed. Skynet has only one more chance to correct its mistake and sends back an experimental T-1000 back to 1995 to terminate John Connor as a young boy. The resistance captures a T-800 and the future John Connor reprogrammes it to protect the young John Connor and it too is sent back to 1995 to protect John Connor. The T-800, John Connor and Sarah Connor destroy the Cyberdyne building and all information on the CPU and arm and steal both the smashed CPU and the arm from the 1984 T-800 and in the end throw both into the molten steel followed by the reprogrammed T-800. This ends Skynet and Judgement Day never happens, it is over, no software AI and no other intelligence calling itself Legion, its over! Skynet ensured it's existence when it sent the T-800 back to 1984. Skynet then ensured it's doom when it sent back the T-1000 back to 1995 never factoring in that the resistance would send back a reprogrammed T-800 and that the young John Connor would encourage the T-800 to learn by resetting the CPU and that the T-800 would learn that the destruction of Cyberdyne and the smashed CPU and arm from the 1984 T-800 to be destroyed would help prevent the war including its own termination! T1 and T2 are perfect and ended perfectly. T3 should never have been allowed to happen, nor Salvation, nor Genisys and certainly not Dark Fate. These latter films are not part of the Terminator movies so their confusing timelines do not matter. Just Hollywood and unfortunately Cameron it seems milking the franchise bone dry and ruining the masterpieces that are T1 and T2. As the T-800 said in T2 "It has to end now"
T3 and T4 should’ve been prequels(?) to T1 and T2. It should’ve explored John during the war, how he met and trained Kyle Reese (which is what Salvation did), the origin of the time weapon, and T4 should’ve closed off with the T-800 and Kyle being sent back to 1984, this completing the loop.
The thing you have to understand about T1 is that you are seeing the final timeline at that moment, other timelines had to exist first to create it, which resolves the "your dad is a time traveler" "paradox"
The problem with this franchise is nothing after T2 is worth considering. Leaving aside the fact that they're utterly terrible, an ending was filmed that showed once and for all that the Terminator story ended with T2. They just tacked on a more vague ending so they could churn out moneymaking sequels, and look how that turned out. The original story with a self-contained causal loop between the past and the future was brilliant. The rest can be considered fanfic or at best 'alternate timelines'. Like the recent Star Trek reboots...call anything 'alternate timeline'' and you can do what the fuck you like, you won't have to justify it or explain it. You can make as many godawful 'sequels' and TV series you like.
Most probably it was JC desicion just for making so "we don't freaking even predict what will become"...and then some guys decided just to use the franchise to money-making. Also, IMO they are not THAT terrible (aside I'd rather call T3 an action-comedy with little depth), sequels goes T5 >>>>> T4 >>>>>>>>>>>> T3. But yeah, I'd consider them 'alternate timelines' too. Nothing can beat good old T1
Terminator 1 was the better film. It was a film about the threat of modern technology to 1980s society and how the future was going to wipe us all out. The Terminator represented new technology, it was cold, calculating and would stop at nothing - as shown by the ending scenes where the remains of the Terminator, stripped of all its human camouflage and no legs still needed to complete its mission. T2 kind of labelled the point, but also was more hopeful that technology wasn't totally evil, the 90s were a more optimistic time. Arnie didn't like playing a baddie, so they made him the "good" terminator and stuck in a few comedy moments. Then the rest of the films just fell into "Killer cyborgs from the future, robots take over the planet, it's always dark and raining and tinted teal and orange" trope that everyone does, with a plot as thin as a first generation rubber skinned terminator ;)
Lore-wise, it's still possible for Skynet to have been developed in Terminator 3. In Terminator 2, we find out that due to a time Paradox, Skynet would have been developed via reverse engineering. We never really thought about the implications other than it's a loop that's necessary for Skynet to exist. But what if it's not necessary? What if Skynet would have been developed anyway? Here's how and it's called the "Original Timeline" theory: In the original timeline, it's the first one and everything is happening for the very first time where there's no time travel and no Terminator. John Conner is an entirely different person than the John Conner we know in T2 and his father is not Kyle Reese. Skynet was developed by normal means with no reverse engineering of future tech due to time travel. When Skynet sends a Terminator back in time to the first Terminator movie, it created a series of events where Skynet would have been developed *sooner* than it would have originally in the original timeline because of reverse engineering the Terminator Tech. As an unintended consequence, Kyle Reese met Sarah Conner, and the child they conceive is not the same John Conner from the original timeline, but a different person entirely that Sarah decided to _name_ John Conner because of what Kyle Reese told her. When they destroyed all of the research of reverse engineering the Terminator Tech in T2, what it did was that they prevented the scenario where Skynet was developed *sooner* than it was supposed to originally in the original timeline via reverse engineering. With that out of the way, they set the timeline back on its original path (with the exception of Kyle Reese being John Conner's father) where Skynet is developed the way it's supposed to without time travel shenanigans. This theory makes it so that Terminator 3 makes sense as a movie lore-wise and honestly, I like this theory because all the pieces fit to make a great trilogy.
Great video man!! It never hit me that the t1000 that was sent back to kill Sarah was the same one in 1984 she was waiting for. That would explain the t800 using the rpg to displace it long enough to get away and, with Sarah's parents dead, there was nobody for the t1000 to impersonate to get to her.
No, they're not necessarily intertwined. John didn't invent Skynet, but he was key in the search for it. If John were never born, then Skynet wouldn't have had any trouble winning the war.
false. skynet will become self aware with or without john. but what's really going to bake your noodle later on is: would john exist if he hadnt sent kyle back to protect his mother?
T1 and T2: make perfect sense T3: makes no sense whatsoever T4: makes even less than no sense T5: for christ sake, come up with something original T6: make it stop! timelines are totally convoluted and twisted as all hell. franchise is totally fucked up beyond recognition.
Yeah, storyline wise, I agree it should've ended with both Terminator Movies T1 and T2. But franchise wise T2 and T3 are my no.1, T4 and T1 are my no.2, but T5 and T6, I agree that it was the worst, but the saving grace were the characters in my honest opinion.
Here’s the only timeline that matters: (With T2 being the excellent exception) the movie industry keeps REPEATING the Terminator plot over and over, in movie after movie, except with consecutively diminishing profit returns.
T1 and T2: make perfect sense T3: makes no sense whatsoever T4: makes even less than no sense T5: for christ sake, come up with something original T6: make it stop! timelines are totally convoluted and twisted as all hell. franchise is totally fucked up beyond recognition.
@@jamesdick2580 it’s problematic for sure tho, a lot of problems with it but maybe I’m bias because It was the first terminator movie I got to see in theaters as a young man, I was born in 92 so I didn’t get to see both first entries until years later and after being enamored by them, I felt like it actually was awesome, it’s just a tired concept by the third entry, the humor is a bit forced, and the casting suffers, Arnold really carries the film, it was just more of the same but the ending was profound to me, finding out that sky net targets the humans as a threat to itself and that’s why it all started and that nothing they could do prevent the consequence of the invention of something so powerful like technology, I think it was one of the best endings to me, it’s a lot like how the watchmen movie ends, Jon’s just gotta face the reality instead of running from his destiny, it really played on that tone that t2 set for Jon impo, but yeah I think it mainly suffers from it’s time it came out, it was at a time where action movies started focusing on how over the top they could make the action sequences were abd I feel like besides the ending, it really feels heavily like they did another round because they could, it was definitely a cash grab action movie for sure, it misses the mark on being unique or “new” but it was more of the same of the things that made me like the franchise in the first place so it’s hard for to trash it, now genysis and dark fate to me look like absolute garbage
@@jamesdick2580 also salvation I’ve never seen but from what I’ve read about it, it sounds like that at least breaks the stereotypical format that terminator set up which wasn’t appreciated at the time I remember how I literally didn’t go cuz I didn’t like the idea that Arnold wasn’t in it, I thought he was the face of the franchise really but now as I’m older I really wanna watch that because it actually kinda focuses on something new.... the whole Marcus thing tho.... now that makes no sense to me
Very good explanation, thank you. The main reason Genisys was disliked was because it was simultaneously vague and complicated, which creates confusion. Your video makes me want to watch it again because it actually makes sense and ties together with the other timelines.
I'm starting to think the only way it works is multiple universes all going back into each other's timelines but seldom their own. They can't exist without these other universes, this war far surpasses time travel.
i agree completely. IF temporal displacement is at all possible, which BTW is a BIG if, then we are most definitely living in a multiverse. changing the 'past' in any way, would create unstable imbalances otherwise. and paradoxes do NOT exist.
What is forgotten or not realised is that the events of the original Terminator film depict *at least* the third iteration of the time line. original time line: John Connor is born from a random guy and Skynet is invented wtithout using any future tech. Kyle Reese sent back but at this stage is not JC's father. time line 2: KR is sent back and becomes JC's father. Only at this point does Sarah Conner know tell (via a recording) JC that KR is his father. time line 3: JC sens back KR *knowing* that KR is his father. KR has also been primed by JC and goes back already in love with SC.
No, T1 was written with the immutable future rule, JC was always KR's son. It's only afterwards that they changed the way the series' timetravel worked in order to allow for sequels.
I honestly lost track after Terminator Salvation. That’s when I had to start going back and re-watching. I thought I actually understood this mess of a timeline, honestly, Genesis just complicated the entire thing.
A theory I've got is that Genisys' script has some influence from the Sarah Connor Chronicles. Maybe what sent Arnie's Genisys T-800 back for young Sarah Connor is the A.I. that the T-1000 was creating to fight Skynet.
Um, forget about the movie that actually shows the time war hitting a major point, I don't think so. Genisys is a damn good terminator movie. It shows that Skynet knows about its past failures and is attempting to finally correct them all. It also showed that there is someone or something else that is fighting Skynet and it is not the Resistance. I can't wait to see what comes out of the time war now.
T1 and T2: make perfect sense T3: makes no sense whatsoever T4: makes even less than no sense T5: for christ sake, come up with something original T6: make it stop! timelines are totally convoluted and twisted as all hell. franchise is totally fucked up beyond recognition.
I believe that this explanation, though it does leave out the original timeline, is very accurate to the events that have taken place thus far in the saga.
I like this video, but I noticed that you left out the part where the T-X, upon arriving in the past, goes to a payphone and emits a digital signal, presumably assisting Skynet in becoming self-aware.
This analysis is even Further complicated by the fact that at the end of the TV series, SkyNet resolves the Connor conundrum by bringing J.C. to the future and stranding him as a stranger to the Resistance. I wonder if John Connor, as the savior of humanity, his initials are just a coincidence with that of Jesus Christ ?
You must be remembering things wrong from "Sarah Connor Chronicles." Skynet has nothing to do with the ending at all, if you paid attention earlier in the last season, that T-1000 is the one from the submarine in the future, the T-1000 that the resistance asks to join them. She goes rogue from Skynet and travels back to create an A.I. that can defeat Skynet.
@@Rez090 No. The very last episode, after we learn that a "Terminator" was sent back and took over the identity of a company CEO, John Connor confronts the "CEO Terminator" and she calls in the drone that takes him to the future so that he never leads the Resistance. That one was, technically, a SkyNet unit.
Now I know you weren't paying attention, they both went to the future to chase down the A.I. that stole the body from the female terminator that was protecting John. The T-1000 that was posing as a CEO was not affiliated with Skynet, it was a rogue unit.
Sheesh, at any rate, John Connor ends up in the future and the Resistance has no idea who he is, which technically creates a New Branch off the linear Time Line they illustrate here. One in which John had disappeared and has no influence on the Resistance.
But isn't THE original timeline the one where Sarah has john and she teaches him to become a warrior all on her own? The second timeline is the one you presented as the first in which skynet says fuck that and sends back the t-800. Essentially the second timeline is the key to everything. Not the original
There was no 'original' timeline, as the first film showed. The whole point of the first two (and only real films that count) was that the events were a closed causal loop, with events in the future causing events in the past.
But wasn't part of the premise of the 3rd film (garbage I'll admit) that if Skynet closed the loop without changing the result, it needed to try a new approach? Hence skynet sends a terminator to kill lieutenants and then John would be a bonus. Hence there is a possibility since some of the lieutenants are killed, the future may in fact change. Also, while the 4th film (again garbage I'll admit) does not follow a standard terminator plot from the first three films, the resistance still exists, meaning skynet could in theory still be defeated. Hence, a more sophisticated infiltration unit is created, but fails because it left too much of a human element intact. This would be a different skynet from the original film, and also a different John. Hence skynet continues to work on improving its tech when John does not die at the end of T4. I could follow the logic of T3 and T4, even if that logic was to make money off of a franchise. However, T5 requires too many extra logic jumps to truly be feasible from a time perspective. Yet at the same time, the only way skynet may be intelligent enough to create the T3000 and the T5000 is the Genysis version that we see building a core at the end of the film. I saw T5 as a giant rhetorical question that was purely a money grab. What I didn't understand was if they asked the question (John as a Terminator) then answered the question (the Genysis version of skynet) in the same film, the sequels to T5 become even more redundant. The films seem to come in twos where a loop is opened in the odd films and closed in the even films. Yet in the fifth film, they already opened and closed the loop. While it hurts to imagine what the writing would be if two more are in the making, it does pose the question of what direction given events from five films are they going to take two more when quite frankly they are (pardon the phrasing) out of time as the loop is practically complete and current.
'original' john could have been from another father (not reese). The key isnt john, its sarah & her bringing up each john as a badass. it doesnt have to be a "closed causal loop"
It pains me whenever they leave out the original timeline. Listen guys, the original timeline was normal. Sarah gets pregnant and has Baby John . The Artificial intelligence becomes self aware in 1997. Humanity is almost wiped out, and Sarah barely survives and teaches her son how to be strong. It's during this timeline Sarah herself starts to become a warrior and a strong role model for John. This is the original timeline but nobody ever uses it. The second timeline is created when Skynet sends the Terminator back to 1984
Then who is Johns father? Also how does judgement day happen in 1997 when Cyberdyne Systems that creates skynet doesn't have the technology from the T-800 from 1984?
The original Skynet was a military defense system. It became self aware an considered all mankind a threat . This design would be no different then us creating an advance Internet system. You don't need tech from the future to make advancements. ( nor babies ) It's not impossible. The T-800s arm altered the timeline giving Miles the ability to create Skynet without starting from scratch. This is why by 2029 Skynet sends a T-1000 instead of the T-800 because the timeline is " upgraded".
The most common belief is that this now creates a loop, thus making Reese go back in time each moment 2029 occurs. It doesn't . The loop exists but each time you go back you change the loop. Perhaps the resistance was always destined to beat Skynet , but Skynet was always destined to send a terminator back. But the events change forever. Notice after the T-1000 incident the timeline changes again and John gets killed by Skynet after 2029.... This means Reece never got sent back because the war is still raging. It's then Johns wife send a terminator to protect the new resistance leaders from skynet a new female Model.
The original timeline is dependent on the T-800 going back in time. That is how Skynet gets its inspiration for a self-aware AI. It is also dependent on Reese to father John Connor. This is the whole premise behind the causal loop theory of time travel.
The whole point of sending the T-800 was to change the existing timeline. Key word being change. The original timeline is what Skynet was trying to alter. It's not part of the existing timeline at all, the T-800 was sent back to erase and re-write the timeline. T-800 goes back, kills Sarah and John therefore no resistance. Therefore no Terminator gets sent back. Time changes Skynet wins. Skynet did not send the terminator back so a loop can start.
It's been hinted in many sources that the Future War has become irreversibly changed into a multiversal proxy war: the Human Resistance and SkyNet continuously try to change, or prevent, several timelines to prevent either side from gaining a decisive victory.
In the Genisys timeline; Judgement day reverted back to 2029 because The chip and endoskeleton were destroyed. T2 doesn't happen in the Genisys timeline as John isn't born in 1985. That and it is not confirmed that Pops and the T-1000 were sent back in 2030; or were the same timeline that Kyle came from. Multiverse time travel 101. Terra Nova explained it well. If you send humans back in time to live on earth, modern civilization would change UNLESS the time travel is into a timeline that is NOT the timeline you actually come from. You aren't travelling to YOUR own past, but the past of an alternative universe. (And it means that ANOTHER timeline traveled into it to create John Connor, the Kyle you see traveling through time is NOT the Kyle who fathered the John that sent him back in time. So that John could kill THIS Kyle and Sarah as they are not HIS Kyle and Sarah) It really wasn't a nexus point that caused Kyle to end up with two timeline memories... It was the fact he was entering a timeline/alternate universe that had already been affected by the time travel of Pop's to 1983 as well as John Connor's travel to 2015 AND his own jump to 2017 in the destination timeline/universe. But then again, Pop's wasn't programmed with truth. He doesn't know who reprogrammed him and sent him back. Knowing that Alternate Universes exist was probably taken out of his database because that IS where he came from. His database is a false one. So the nexus point explanation given by Pops is in itself a calculated lie
It's not hard to figure out. Skynet would have been built no matter what. AI was advancing, even before a terminator came through time. When Kyle reese went back to 1984, the future he was from became his past, and the new timeline he arrived in became his future. Same with the T800. when he arrived in 1984, that was technically the year of its creation, thus accelerating Skynet's creation.
Well done! I’ve always wanted to love the Terminator franchise. I love robots, time travel, and typically all things sci-fi, but movies 2-4 just seemed like cut-rate storytelling. You have done the due diligence to piece together a plausible logic that has restored the story. You and you alone aided the fans not unlike the revelation of the “Darth Jar Jar” theory put forth by one lone fan who cared, while Hollywood clearly didn’t. Thank you and well done, sir.
Does anyone else think a great movie about Miles Dyson, his life, and the eventual meeting of Sarah Connor couldn't have been a pretty awesome movie? I mean T2 sort of followed a storyline, and it did it well. But you didn't need to go and reinvent the wheel with another sequel. Just think about the reality of the situation and the many compelling options.
Great vid, Adel! But I think we could avoid all this if: the Resistance sent someone back in time to kill the guy who discovered how to make fire, and Skynet sent a Terminator back in time to kill Adam before he shagged Eve. Problem solved. 😉
I was just thinking about that very thing... Without the inclusion of the Sarah Connor Chronicles, you can't call this a complete timeline review. This information has to be looked at and included.
Thank you for such a comprehensive breakdown of what is a very important topic and actually very confusing matter. I think I'll need to watch this a few times before I completely understand it, however I'm sure eventually I'll get my head around it. It's great to see someone treat this information with the respect it deserves. Some people, like one of my friends for example, just don't seem to care at all (I know someone who hasn't even seen the original Terminator! and they're not even interested in seeing it!!) and no matter how much you try to explain it, they're just not interested and it seems they'd rather just spend time with friends and family talking and laughing than actually sitting down and analysing these important time lines. It's crazy!
Interestingly enough there was a military satellite project called Sky-Net, and I remember seeing the patches and stickers from the project when I was working on some equipment for making parts for a military contractor. It used to be not too far from the headquarters for Harbor Freight in Southern California, and I thought that it was interesting seeing strawberries and near there on the other side of the 101 freeway a place that grows orchids and a Very large Santa Claus near the Rose over cross. For those that don' t know the area this is Oxnard.... BTW there are some other projects by the same name.
@@MarkofO Because pictures existed in 1984 and John was still Sarah's son. He just had that pic of his mommy with him, may be Sarah had always wanted to go to Mexico so in the original timeline she did travel and got the pic (you never see her pregnant in that pic)
I watch these movies to enjoy with popcorn and try not to overthink it. It really stops making sense while watching T2. Without Skynet there are no terminators. Without terminators there is no Skynet. This invalidates the first movie because in the original time line Skynet would never have existed and Sarah’s friend would have enjoyed her sandwich and gone to sleep.
Great vid man,So basically the unknown events after Salvation could’ve caused Genesis since the altered timeline that became Salvation has a different outcome for the future and that outcome is skynet sending a terminator to 2029 to create Genesis; I hope I explained that in a coherent way that makes sense
GREAT VIDEO!!! It`s one of the best timeline explanations out there. One thing bothers me a lot is HOW WAS THE 1997 J-DAY PREVENTED IN GENISYS?!?!Here`s my theory on it: THE T-5000 IS THE ONE WHO SENDS POPS BACK TO SAVE SARAH!What the T-5000 wants is to get rid of Miles Dyson`s and Kyle Reese`s role on it`s creation. It wants to be the responsible for its own creation, creating a time-loop, just like John Connor was able to do for himself.So, in order to do that, it needs to prevent the J-Day`s from 1997 and 2004 from happening, and creating a new J-Day (in 2017), but it knows John, Sarah and Reese will be there to bother them, so his plan is to help them SUCCEED in defeating the T1`s Skynet. Here`s what it did:After infecting JC, it sends a T-1000 and a T-800 back in time to STAGE an assassination attempt on young Sarah Connor. In order not to be detected, it programs the T-800 to truly protect Sarah, but the T-1000 is programed to throw the fight and play dead. This explains how a T-800 was able to defeat a T-1000 so easily.All this is done in order to manipulate Sarah to do the T-5000`s bidding, preventing the 1997 J-Day, and the creation of the Skynet version that always fails to defeat the resistance. She succeeds in it, when she defeats the T-800 not leaving any trace of it behind to be reverse-engineered by Dyson.Immediately after the T-5000 sends a T-1000 and Pops to the past, it also sends the T-3000 to 2014 in order to conclude its plan, so he can have early access to the Time Machine, T-1000s and the advanced T-5000 version of Skynet, resulting on its new 2017 J-Day, which happens later than the T-1`s 1997 J-Day, but with provides him with much better chances of winning the war AND makes him responsible for it`s own creation, creating a new timeloop independent from the Connors.ALSO, after Pops and Sarah save Reese, they INEXPLICABLY decide to jump to 1997 in order to prevent J-Day. But why? Why not just take the long way and be better prepared for it. THIS WAS ALSO PART OF THE T-5000`S PLAN! In order to prevent John`s birth, it gives Pops the Time Machine schematics and programs him to make Sarah jump from 1984 to 1997, preventing her from birthing John in 1985, and ensuring that he will never exist.What the T-5000 failed to see was that Kyle would have knowledge of the new 2017 J-Day. Kyle saves the day on this one by preventing (or delaying) J-Day, but leaves the future of war uncertain.Cheers.
Above anything else, 2 things have always lead to Skynet' s defeat 1) the knowledge John possesses about the war leading up to 2029 allows him to effectively cheat and rig the game in his favor. 2) the date of Judgement Day being known gives John the opportunity to avoid being part of the population destroyed in the initial nuclear war. As much as I didn't like Genisys, it removed these 2 advantages the Resistance had on it. Leveling the playing field. Dark Fate seems to also favor Skynet based on these 2 facts. John would be too old to lead the Resistance through a 30+ yr war and most, if not all, info he (and Sarah by extension) has regarding Skynet could virtually be non-applicable since Skynet starts off more advance due to the delay from T2. Now the Resistance simply has to win without relying on knowledge from Kyle's future (not counting Grace's knowledge of HER timeline)
This is an excellent analysis. So many people just dismiss Genisys and don't even _notice_ the running theme of "taking the long way", a clear hint of what was happening behind the scenes.
I like to think of the Terminator timeline in terms of the multiverse, so that in the very first original timeline John Conner's father was somebody other than Kyle and Skynet was created from scratch.
The convoluted jump hooping that is the impossible task of justifying Genisys (god I hate that name) is astounding. You're telling me that T-5000 goes back in time to prevent T2 from happening, then just sits around for the original 1997 judgment day to happen. He then idles by until the resistance takes out the original Cyberdyne in 2029, so that the events of T1 can play out which completely ensure that John Conner is born and that the 1997 judgment day happens. It is only then that he converts John Connor into his robo buddy so that he can go back to 2017... 20 years after the judgment day that he absolutely made sure would happen... so that he can make an even better judgment day... but then T-5000 also sends back a robot to kill Sarah Connor, despite the fact that she died in a loony bin and really has no ability to foil his current plans... which will make sure that John Connor, that he needs for his plans, will never be born... ...what?
I love every Terminator movie. There is only 1 thing i really miss from the new ones. The horror factor.
If you watch the original terminator, the whole movie is grim dark, depressive, cold and frightening. None of the future movies could capture that feeling.
Exactly! So true!
Also the VFX of T1 look's so much better!
Like with many other movie franchises...
1. part will alway's be superior no matter what. 😉
@not an avatar nor starwars fan just gimme Divison3
I like your name! :)
Division 1 was best!
Let's hope we will get 3. part focusing much more on Division 1 gameplay.
This comment is so true, that's the secret sauce that the new movies definitely don't have.
Yes, I got same feeling, the 1st was incredible, also I don't like CGI in excess as LOTR, too much image just CGI and too fast get a headache like.
Hard to believe that several of the movies after T2 spent significant time in the post apocalypse and none of them were scarier than T1.
I'd watched all the horror/slasher movies by age 12 and nothing was scarier than the Terminators after T1...and worse, the story was believable.
I liked terminator Salvation - had a fresh perspective of the future.. But lacked the Laser Guns
Early days of the war, energy weapons don't become a thing till just after salvation I believe.
pew pew pew
And the night battles.
Although Salvation wasn’t a bad movie I expected to have dark, into the war, plasma laser battle fights like in the intro of T2
Elvis Ac The Disappointment
I love this video, but sadly, Terminator has suffered a Dark Fate.
I thought it suffered from the rise of the maschines🤔
I think your statement will become the defacto way to end any arguments or questions regarding the franchise/timeline. Well done, sir!
good one
And John Connor wish they'd erase everything but t1-3 then remake salvation
3:57 I'm confused how'd they nvr exist if they did in the future so if John's killed in t1 does that mean 2018 John would be erased from existence?
After watching this, Bruce Willis had it right in Looper:
"I don't want to talk about time travel because if we start talking about it then we're going to be here all day talking about it, making diagrams with straws."
To be fair, this was to keep the movie relatable to normies with average IQs. Any serious talk of time travel takes some brain cells your box office crowd don't have.
GuyIncognito there is no “serious” talk about time travel because it doesn’t and will never exist. Time can only go in one direction (according to our understanding of physics).
@@theendurance according to "our" understanding... we used to think earth was flat until it was proven round. we used to think we were the center of the universe until it was proven we weren't... how long until our understanding of physics is proven to be elementary compared to whats actually possible??
@@guyincognito. Do you think it possible that they sent at least 3 Terminator back to stop Kyle and Sarah? It would explain the reason Kyle had to wait for the Terminator to spot her. Maybe have the Terminator see SGT Candy in a reboot.
Looper sucked
It was all a dream by the homeless guy in T1
There, fixed it
Hay buddy did you just see a bright light?
That actually makes a lot of sense.
It was all a dream, I used to read Word Up! magazine
Salt-n-Pepa and Heavy D up in the limousine
He is creative
@@greta8849 hangin pictures on my wall, every Saturday Rap Attack, Mr. Magic, Marley Mal
There should be a college course explaining the terminator timeline
Yes. Let's keep idiots occupied with no skills for actual work. Lol
AGREED!
Yes. My college had (hopefully past tense) a course about the films of Harrison Ford, and some college has a course about Beyoncé, so a Terminator course would be entirely justified.
I agree
After watching this, I came to only one conclusion:
You have way too much time on your hands, dude.
T1 & T2 - Perfect, makes total sense.
T3 - Sure, why not?
T4 - uhhh, I guess so...
T5 - Wait, what?
T6 - Please make it stop.
Honestly every movie can be a sequel AND a standalone movie. Every single event effects the future so every movie is in itself its own timeline
OMG!!! translucentorb!!!
I don't know about you, but sounds like you're having an orgasm of sorts..
Why would you want it to stop..???
why waste money on a mediocre movie? OG's are always better smh
T5 was a reboot.
Spot.on!
Regardless of how deep you are into this, I think it's cool to look back and to think that one movie in 1984 inspired so much imagination that a whole franchise was made of this. I think this reflects the quality of the original movie and the very idea behind this exciting and engrossing story that struck a nerve with people's fantasy (and concern ...) regardless of age back then in 1984 and now.
It inspired imagination so much that real A.I. development has rules now to keep things safe, It was a wake up call so to say..
I thought Isaac Asimov brought awareness and popularized the concept of rules being enforced on robot programming to prevent harm or death to humanity.
@@Elfnetdesigns indeed
@@PandaXclone2 Asimov inspired those who would read his works. The Terminator movies inspired a much wider audience.
@@johndavos2154 Good observation, Sir Davos
30 years on and still talking about this brilliant movie that started it all. Movies from the 80’s are, for the most part, unmatched in their storylines.
Sure, if you completely ignore the 70’s
"From the future?" - Sarah Connor
"One possible future. From your point of view? I don't know tech stuff." - Kile Reece
This is what you say when you grew up knowing how to fire a weapon and not much else.
Six
Its kyle not kile
sorry if I was rude
someone didn't watch T2 Judgement day. Arnold says and I quote "human decisions are removed from strategic defense, system goes online August 4, 1997. Skynet begins to learn at a geometric rate, it becomes self aware a 2:14 AM Eastern time August 29th in a panic to try to pull the plug."
I will never forget the original date that judgement day was supposed to happen in the movie because it was my 18th birthday. How can anyone forget that their 18th birthday was in a friggin movie.
Robert Benoit THANK YOOU
"Three Billion Human Lives Ended On August Twenty-Ninth Nineteen Ninety Seven. The Survivors Of The Nuclear Fire Called The War 'Judgement Day'. They Lived Only To Face A New Nightmare: The war Against The Machines."
Stand back. I was born exactly the 26th October 1985, the perfect day in the history of time travel movies...
Hell ya thats awesome all yall
Heck it was my 10th birthday
It was never just a war between two armies shooting at each other, it was essentially a war of time. How you built history in your favor.
What about Sarah Connor Chronicles.? Time travel in the bank.
No fate but what we make. T2 threw that right out there.
I am soooo happy, none of these Terminators had a SPORTS ALMANACH. That would have been a mess.
Almanac.
It would bet on itself and win lol
I don't think the any of the terminators could run 88 mph. If you remember on the the second terminator the " liquid metal terminator " chased the car out of the mental institute and was unable to catch up to it. Just saying.
yup lol
That's the next one I think. John Conner gets rich starts a casino there is also an amazing guitar scene.
Plot twist....... Doc Brown was behind it all along!!! That damn flux capacitor!!!
Doc Brown is fuckin awesome!!
Duke.. 🤣😂🤣 Too funny mate 🤣
Is this because Doc Brown ... modified the amplifier in the 1st Back To The Future ... all because of the surge the tubes received ... the start of machine intelligence WOWSERS
@@darinb.3273 Yep that HAD to be it LOL
Great SCOTT, I think you’re on to something...
The sad thing is that the perfect grandfather paradox the first movie had, actually died at the end of the first movie. Sarah herself caused the second movie and others thereafter to happen because she chose to CHASE THE STORM at then end, instead of flee south as Reese had said she would. It's a small detail, but something you notice after multiple rewatches.
There is no Fate but what we make (for ourselves.)
Part 2.- If the first film is actually a time loop then it's a solid question to ask... how many times has this loop cycled?
I think the original mission was just as we learned, to save Sarah. I think the "Original", original timeline was altered either by the T-800's killing spree or Kyle intercepting Sarah to protect her.
That interference prevented Sarah from meeting John's real father and instead Kyle became John's father, thereby changing the future and forming this time loop which is now being continually altered by new events.
Which also means that This John that is now controlled by Skynet isn't actually the real John Connor of legend.
That explains why he still lost.
It could be that the original John Connor with a different father would have been the resistance leader who sent Kyle Reese back, and so Kyle told Sarah all about him and what was coming, so then when she had a baby by him she named him John and trained him to lead the resistance, even though he wasn't the exact same John Connor. So, a self-fulfilling prophecy.
My one and only question from the first movie was always about how could 2029 John from the future tell 2029 Kyle to tell Sarah from 1984 that his mother will be strong and train her son John to fight and stand against the machines, but how could he knew that is what is supposed to happen if he is the very first John that was never tried to be killed by some machines that travel back in the future sent by a self aware system that has never been yet made and he is the first John to ever experience an end of the world at 1997, that means he and his mom had a normal life until 1997, not a life where his mom is teaching and preparing him to be some future leader bcoz she could not knew that yet, so I assume the 2029 John that sends 2029 Kyle back in the T1 is not the first original John that had no idea he was about to become a leader, but lets say a John from one of the loops you mentioned, a John that has already survived everything that happens throughout the Terminator movies, not the very first John that didn't experience the events from the second and third Terminator movie, bcoz his mother wouldnt have had a reason to prepare him for an end of the world and would be inappropriate for 2029 Kyle to tell 1984 Sarah that she will train her son as if her training him has already happened when it didnt since the 2029 John wasnt attacked from machines when he was little, and not she should so that the first John can live?
I know it is quite a long question, but what do u think, whose John was the 2029 John from the first movie, the very first John or a John from some of the loops that you said must have been created?
I suspect that for all relevant purposes, unless the child were a girl, calling him John would have still resulted in the future Skynet was trying to prevent.
@Chris Madison One of the Gang members That The Terminator killed When he first went back in past
One thing people never seem to clue in on is that the original time loop had to start at some point. The first time it started skynet probably developed on its own then at some point in the future humans scored a decisive victory against the machines and skynet sent back the first terminator to change this and the first Kyle Reese was sent back too. In the course of events Kyle meets Sarah, who initially may have had nothing to do with the war but gets caught up in it now that she's carrying Kyle's child. The terminator sent to the past ensures the creation of skynet and perhaps accelerates the timeline from whatever it originally was. Now with John Connor created he ensures the downfall of skynet creating the loop. At least that's one possibility.
I was more under the impression that all the time travel had caused the timeline to start unraveling and creating paradoxes. Thus, the Terminator in Genisys that has protecting Sarah since she was a child is actually the exact same Terminator that was supposed to protect John in 1995. The T-1000 that Sarah and the time misplaced "Uncle Bob" destroy was the one that was supposed to attack John in 1995, but he showed up 22 years later than he should have. The constant changes to the time stream caused them to stop arriving at the correct time and thus time itself was becoming unstable due to John Connor and Skynet's constant war across time.
AustynSN that actually makes sense. I like the explanation in this video, but that is VERY plausible, since the Butterfly Effect represents your theory to a T!! That’s a simple but appropriate response!👍🏼
Tell you what mate
You've gotta have an amazing mind to get thru that saga.
You've done a pretty good job of it and I salute you.
The best explanation I've heard from anyone.
Bravo..
I'd like to see a movie where the machines dont send back anyone and the same with John not sending anyone.
Removing the time travel aspect completely and making a movie where John and Kyle and the rest of the resistance battle through to destroy the defense network and end up destroying the machines to oblivion. An honest and true plot and timeline where things happen as they are supposed to happen with no time travel involved at all.
What would this movie be called......
I dont know........definitely up to James Cameron to name it or think something up...............
Maybe I got one.........
Terminator Resistance
Humans becoming the ones who terminate the machines....while also realizing they are exactly the same as the machines.......they both kill and destroy each other for their survival in the world.
Made of Metal and Wires and Circuits or to be made of Bones and Veins and Meat.....they both kill in order to survive.
Besides.....applying real thought into it....the AI evolved with the exact same instincts as humans.
Mass killings of a potential threat to its survival to stay alive. There's no difference in machines or humans........and I believe James Camerons creation of this franchise shows his understanding in the two. Metal or Human....they both have the potential to be cold.
Lol
Am I going to deep?
Yeah I am lol. Sorry💀💀🖤🖤
@@navimajora19, a year later, and I'm here to tell you that it's not possible, because without Kyle Reese traveling back in time John Connor does not exist.
@@notahotshot
Do you know how to think?
They never sent anybody in the first place, and yet John still became John in the future, regardless of Kyle, he's the plot hole in this series since it started. Try and think harder, and don't let your nostalgia of being a fan ruin your ability to find the biggest plot hole in the first film.
It even claims it within the movie script, once the machines discovered time travel, they sent back the Terminator and once the Resistance found out what they did, they sent back Kyle. MAJOR AND BIGGEST PLOT HOLE IN THE STORY.
👏👏👏
this is the best explanation, i just read over so many, and none touched on my concerns, but you mentioned em all
I always picked that line from John Connor saying in T3 "When I was 13 they tried again" as that we are missing events (a movie) from there.
well, he was 13 at the beginning of dark fate, but....
@@cameronbaker97 "When I was 13 I died."
@Teun de Heer It makes more sense if you look at the stories being told from the T800's perspective of what must have happened where each story is that of a different T800. And yeah, it gets kinda corrected in Dark Fate's alternate timeline.
Yeah the missing events are from the tv show.
I watched this on my phone while taking a shit. We are truly living in the future.
what a time to be alive 💩
I'm still confused lol 😂...
Oh no, people have been shiting for a long, very long time
Exactly what I'm doing👌
LEFT HOOK LARRY Eyyyyy 👌🏻
I hope James Cameron watches this to see what lengths his audience will go to to check continuity.
I think he's too busy counting his money
James Cameron only made T1 and T2, so...
the new one only considers 1-2 cannon
Good point bro.
@@ThreeDaysOfDan I was about to say: Maybe he did see it, he retconed everything after T2! 😂
Btw, I'm not too sure what to think of this new Terminator.
Good thing, it's rated R (final-f***ing-ly), but I smell a trap...
Peace from France! 🍻
"Time travel makes my head hurt" John Conner.
Temple mechanics can get anyone's confused
The idea of my best friend and 2nd lieutenant bumping uglies with my mom would cause me to have an existential crisis. John took it like a champ.
@@twistedyogert Reese was a Sargent, not a officer.
There are so many time travel theories.
Doctor who theory: there are Malleable events that are so insignificant that they can be changed or fixed time points that can’t be.
Multiverse theory (partly time travel): every change you make to a timeline creates an alternate timeline.
Single timeline theory: every change you make will affect the future and everything in it but wont create a new timeline.
Flash Tv theory: you can time travel but this wont open a new timeline, it will simply change the one your are in but the timeline will try to rewrite itself, however there are multiverses and they are created by making and unsure decision which will create a timeline where you did that instead.
Solid timeline: no matter what you try everything will happen and you can’t change it.
Tell me which ones i missed.
The Flash TV Theory. Its Different because The Flash Altered The Timeline, and Only He recognized the Differences between the Two, and Decided To Fix It. Side Note : The Reverse cant alter the timeline because He comes From the future.
Now this was a comment section I was hoping was full, a very interesting invitation for discussion. My last romantic interaction was a woman who used "timeline" every time she wanted to pour cold water on us. Despite her efforts I still like the term, timeline.
But what if Skynet ran all of these probabilities as a computer simulation and each movie we see is just one of the iterations of quadrillion's of iterations?
@robert20351 that would change everything
at least it would makes sense that some part are totally incompatible
Aaaand then the realization that our current reality is a simulation, and these movies are a simulation being created by a simulation
Good point.
Personally I subscribe to the theory that every action causes branching points in time, creating parallel universes... These universes are effectively self-contained and if one travels back in time in one such universe, the instant they arrive, they create additional branching universes/timelines FROM their starting points PAST... So in regards to the Terminator timeline(s), they all occurred, and are all canon... As going back to any point in any of the timelines, would create additional branching points and would leave their starting point untouched and continuing on as if nothing happened.
Judgement day happened in 1997, 2004, 2017 in their respective timelines and branching points there from..
And if we go by this, there are probably iterations where a Judgement day happened probably every year from mid 90's depending on branching paths to the same ultimate goal... There are also probably iterations where skynet never exists, or where skynet won the war... Either by defeating the resistance, or because the resistance never existed..
yes, think of the TV series Sliders, the very premise you're talking about
This is actually one way time travel would be possible is if time created branches like this IF time is completely linear. Otherwise paradoxes would happen causing time and existence to unravel and collapse in upon itself. Now if time is not linear and actually circular during different cycles it would be possible too. I personally think if time is linear it’s more like a corkscrew of cycles where the curves of different cycles happen similarly but with varying slight differences.
@@adamcarreras-neal4697 Also Stein's Gate.
The final Terminator movie is going to be John Connor and Skynet having to team up to stop the Langoliers, that's how much of a mess this timeline is
nice .
John Porteous funny
John Porteous
And then Marty shows up in a flying Delorean and all hell brakes loose.
I dont know anything about phantoms or phantom singularity/ies but im pretty sure that if you kill off all the langoliers then time stops. Anyways free bagels are awesome.
Research is imminant.
#crowdsource
I wonder if this guy is eventually going to make another terminator timeline explained, but this time explaining how dark fate fits into the overall timeline.
Well... in Dark Fate there was another Terminator so may be it changed the past once more and Arnold grew a conscience and stopped Skynet from being activated in 2004/2017
@@victorfergn Dark Fate was made to ignore 3-5 so it sums it up
Bold of you to assume Dark Fate fits anywhere
It didn't
Dark Fart does it's own thing.
According to the script writers of Genisys, Skynet/T-5000 was " universe hopping " and had full knowledge of the events of all previous films. The sequel would have shown and explained it's timeline/universe. The T1-Salvation timeline ended with the 2015 comic book series of the same name in which John Connor and Skynet made peace and helped humanity rebuild better than ever.
Now that's a good T7 plot the new Salvation sees Skynet defeated after it's sent the TX back to 2004 in 20232 makes pace with John and the resistance.
The first movie was just a paradox (it ended where it starts, and starts when it ended) but (like most modern sci fi) uses the writing crutch of times lines to just do anything.
The alternate ending of T2 where John becomes a senator and Sarah grows into an old woman will always be THE correct timeline for me.
Hells yeah. If you read the original script or novel of T2, it even already explains that Skynet sent the T1000 minutes after it sent the T800 to 1984. It knew the '84 mission's only success was its own birth, so it sent them both back to back through time because the '95 mission was the real assassination mission. They were both gone before the Resistance ever got to the time displacement chamber.
So yeah, T1 & 2 are where I end the franchise too.
Minutes is a long time when you can millions of calculations per second. Within seconds (probably less) of sending the T-800 to 1984, it would know that it failed. So it took its prototype T-1000 and threw that back in time to kill Connor directly. It would've known that it failed, but the indirect result of sending the T-1000 back to the past ended up being the prevention of Skynet ever existing, closing the causal loop and ending the entire story.
T3 and onward can be viewed as fanfic (only a teenager could write that crap), alternate timelines, both...or irrelevant.
But you can't change the future, it would cause a paradox.
What about Battle Across Time?
Yeah, what i like on the ongoing parts is these "battle across time" theme. If both enemys have the access to timetravelling technologies, they would have need a real new style of strategy.
@Assad's Prophet, actually you can change the future, you cant change the past (in real world). I personally like the multiversum theory, that all possibilities are happen at any time. But Terminator is a movie and dont follow real world physics.
Fucking hell...I need a nap now....
I'm a time-lord too, but usually, my shit's as simple as just loading the game again so that the fuck up I made never happened.
You just explained the whole plot of Terminator: Genisys, more people need to watch this.
You bring up the interesting point about the exact moment of conception.
That would explain the changes in John Connor's appearance, the changes in Kyle Reese's appearance, out of all of the other crazy stuff we've got to deal with the variables of the exact moment of conception, which brings in another, what, 1 in 4 million chance of something changing?
This explanation actually makes the new movie make sense, ties together all of the timelines *and* gives the possibility of people from alternate futures coming back to a single, shared, original timeline.
You konw in a way in Genisys Skynet finally won because Jon Connor no longer exist as of Terminator Genisys.
+Darksnovia you might be right. Even though it seems now that Sarah Conner might be the new protagonist, we know she dies of leukemia sometime after her body's age equivalent of 29th August 1997 (i.e. the original J.D.).
Since her body age in Genesys is still the one of 1984, that would mean that if she lives the rest of her life from 2017, her new year of death would end up being sometime after 2030.
+Adel Helal BUT that's terminator 3, as far as it being canon, James Cameron said it was not. As well as that timeline wouldn't even exist anymore anyway. But t3 doesn't count anymore
+Alex chiriboga nope all the movies are officially Canon where you hate the movies or not they happened just not in the same timeline.
+Darksnovia terminator is defined not canon and t3 is now not canon anymore according to James Cameron. Get over it
+Alex chiriboga where's the evidence of James Cameron saying that s*** unless you can provide evidence your argument is full of holes.
I would love to see a terminator film that is based on the original alpha timeline (where John Connor has a different father) that takes place in the future and focuses solely on the events immediately preceding the first terminator movie, specifically the final battle of the war that ends with the Resistance being victorious and the T-800 and Kyle Reese being sent back to 1984. There is so much potential material to explore here.
But I’d only be interested in that movie if it were written and directed by James Cameron and had the same film noir aesthetic as the 1984 original. He perfectly captured the essence of what a war of man vs. machine would be like - dark, bleak, and destructive with overwhelming feelings of depression and hopelessness, but also of determination and will to survive.
The Terminator timeline is as follows, a T-800 is sent back to 1984 to terminate Sarah Connor before she conceives John Connor who would lead the human resistance to overthrow Skynet in 2029. The resistance sends back Kyle Reese to protect Sarah. This creates a paradox because Kyle and Sarah would meet and Kyle would father John Connor with Sarah. The T-800 would attempt to the very end to terminate Sarah Connor but would end up crushed in a hydraulic press at the Cyberdyne Systems factory. This entire process ensures the creation of Skynet but also the creation of John Connor. Skynet mission failed. Skynet has only one more chance to correct its mistake and sends back an experimental T-1000 back to 1995 to terminate John Connor as a young boy. The resistance captures a T-800 and the future John Connor reprogrammes it to protect the young John Connor and it too is sent back to 1995 to protect John Connor. The T-800, John Connor and Sarah Connor destroy the Cyberdyne building and all information on the CPU and arm and steal both the smashed CPU and the arm from the 1984 T-800 and in the end throw both into the molten steel followed by the reprogrammed T-800. This ends Skynet and Judgement Day never happens, it is over, no software AI and no other intelligence calling itself Legion, its over! Skynet ensured it's existence when it sent the T-800 back to 1984. Skynet then ensured it's doom when it sent back the T-1000 back to 1995 never factoring in that the resistance would send back a reprogrammed T-800 and that the young John Connor would encourage the T-800 to learn by resetting the CPU and that the T-800 would learn that the destruction of Cyberdyne and the smashed CPU and arm from the 1984 T-800 to be destroyed would help prevent the war including its own termination! T1 and T2 are perfect and ended perfectly. T3 should never have been allowed to happen, nor Salvation, nor Genisys and certainly not Dark Fate. These latter films are not part of the Terminator movies so their confusing timelines do not matter. Just Hollywood and unfortunately Cameron it seems milking the franchise bone dry and ruining the masterpieces that are T1 and T2. As the T-800 said in T2 "It has to end now"
Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't it a T-101 sent back in 1984 (T1) and again in 1995 (T2, as the good guy)?
Chase Thompson Yes that’s correct, because T-101 is another name for the T-800.
I think i actually remember reading that the producer for dark fate considered 3-5 noncanon- an alternate timeline. Dont quote me though
@@zombveeautoworks T-800 Series, Model 101
T3 and T4 should’ve been prequels(?) to T1 and T2. It should’ve explored John during the war, how he met and trained Kyle Reese (which is what Salvation did), the origin of the time weapon, and T4 should’ve closed off with the T-800 and Kyle being sent back to 1984, this completing the loop.
What about the Sarah Connor Chronicles? Does that still count? That adds another nice layer to the bowl of spaghetti.
scc covers the exiles in time, also has the connors travel into the future, both of which genesys lifts and uses.
@@anyotherdayortime
How did Genysis use this? I haven't seen the show
The thing you have to understand about T1 is that you are seeing the final timeline at that moment, other timelines had to exist first to create it, which resolves the "your dad is a time traveler" "paradox"
The problem with this franchise is nothing after T2 is worth considering. Leaving aside the fact that they're utterly terrible, an ending was filmed that showed once and for all that the Terminator story ended with T2. They just tacked on a more vague ending so they could churn out moneymaking sequels, and look how that turned out. The original story with a self-contained causal loop between the past and the future was brilliant. The rest can be considered fanfic or at best 'alternate timelines'. Like the recent Star Trek reboots...call anything 'alternate timeline'' and you can do what the fuck you like, you won't have to justify it or explain it. You can make as many godawful 'sequels' and TV series you like.
Most probably it was JC desicion just for making so "we don't freaking even predict what will become"...and then some guys decided just to use the franchise to money-making. Also, IMO they are not THAT terrible (aside I'd rather call T3 an action-comedy with little depth), sequels goes T5 >>>>> T4 >>>>>>>>>>>> T3. But yeah, I'd consider them 'alternate timelines' too. Nothing can beat good old T1
Terminator 1 was the better film. It was a film about the threat of modern technology to 1980s society and how the future was going to wipe us all out. The Terminator represented new technology, it was cold, calculating and would stop at nothing - as shown by the ending scenes where the remains of the Terminator, stripped of all its human camouflage and no legs still needed to complete its mission.
T2 kind of labelled the point, but also was more hopeful that technology wasn't totally evil, the 90s were a more optimistic time. Arnie didn't like playing a baddie, so they made him the "good" terminator and stuck in a few comedy moments.
Then the rest of the films just fell into "Killer cyborgs from the future, robots take over the planet, it's always dark and raining and tinted teal and orange" trope that everyone does, with a plot as thin as a first generation rubber skinned terminator ;)
KRSsven I am unaware of a god-awful tv series
Charlie Parks The Sarah Conner Chronicles, dont watch it, youll do yourself a favor.
@@charlieparks2015 The Sarah Conner Chronicles
one timeline exists.. teminator and T2.. thats it.. everything else is non canon in my heart at least
No one cares why you think
iii ii no one cares that you don't care what he thinks
Ja Ke no one cares that you don't care what he doesn't care what the other person thinks lmao!! Just kidding man
No one cares that no one cares.
well good news the T2 timeline is continuing in 2019
That timeline is even more complicated than the movie Inception.
Even Interstellar is easier to understand than this!
Inception ain't even complicated haha. And Interstellar? come on mate
Inception was simple
Primer
Pavel Mecer on was be he in a dream or reality at end
Lore-wise, it's still possible for Skynet to have been developed in Terminator 3. In Terminator 2, we find out that due to a time Paradox, Skynet would have been developed via reverse engineering. We never really thought about the implications other than it's a loop that's necessary for Skynet to exist.
But what if it's not necessary? What if Skynet would have been developed anyway? Here's how and it's called the "Original Timeline" theory:
In the original timeline, it's the first one and everything is happening for the very first time where there's no time travel and no Terminator. John Conner is an entirely different person than the John Conner we know in T2 and his father is not Kyle Reese. Skynet was developed by normal means with no reverse engineering of future tech due to time travel.
When Skynet sends a Terminator back in time to the first Terminator movie, it created a series of events where Skynet would have been developed *sooner* than it would have originally in the original timeline because of reverse engineering the Terminator Tech.
As an unintended consequence, Kyle Reese met Sarah Conner, and the child they conceive is not the same John Conner from the original timeline, but a different person entirely that Sarah decided to _name_ John Conner because of what Kyle Reese told her.
When they destroyed all of the research of reverse engineering the Terminator Tech in T2, what it did was that they prevented the scenario where Skynet was developed *sooner* than it was supposed to originally in the original timeline via reverse engineering.
With that out of the way, they set the timeline back on its original path (with the exception of Kyle Reese being John Conner's father) where Skynet is developed the way it's supposed to without time travel shenanigans.
This theory makes it so that Terminator 3 makes sense as a movie lore-wise and honestly, I like this theory because all the pieces fit to make a great trilogy.
Great video man!! It never hit me that the t1000 that was sent back to kill Sarah was the same one in 1984 she was waiting for. That would explain the t800 using the rpg to displace it long enough to get away and, with Sarah's parents dead, there was nobody for the t1000 to impersonate to get to her.
So basically they can't Kill each other, because if John Connor is never born then Skynet won't be created their lives are intertwined, how ironic!
Al Hashim Caezar Nonok Well it will always end with john Connor killing skynet and skynet trying to prevent its own death.
Al Hashim Caezar Nonok not tru its juss john wouldnt lead
No, they're not necessarily intertwined. John didn't invent Skynet, but he was key in the search for it. If John were never born, then Skynet wouldn't have had any trouble winning the war.
false. skynet will become self aware with or without john. but what's really going to bake your noodle later on is: would john exist if he hadnt sent kyle back to protect his mother?
Actual Terminator Timeline: The Terminator. Terminator 2. The End.
T1 and T2: make perfect sense
T3: makes no sense whatsoever
T4: makes even less than no sense
T5: for christ sake, come up with something original
T6: make it stop! timelines are totally convoluted and twisted as all hell.
franchise is totally fucked up beyond recognition.
@@jamesdick2580 T2 doesnt make sense, if the war never happened then kyle will never go back to save sarah and you know...
I enjoyed watching Terminator 3 as well. 😂
Yeah, storyline wise, I agree it should've ended with both Terminator Movies T1 and T2. But franchise wise T2 and T3 are my no.1, T4 and T1 are my no.2, but T5 and T6, I agree that it was the worst, but the saving grace were the characters in my honest opinion.
@jamesdick2580 lol T2 makes no sense and contradicts the original T3 makes way more sense and closed the loop.
This was the best video for making sense of all these time lines. Thank you
Here’s the only timeline that matters:
(With T2 being the excellent exception) the movie industry keeps REPEATING the Terminator plot over and over, in movie after movie, except with consecutively diminishing profit returns.
T1 and T2: make perfect sense
T3: makes no sense whatsoever
T4: makes even less than no sense
T5: for christ sake, come up with something original
T6: make it stop! timelines are totally convoluted and twisted as all hell.
franchise is totally fucked up beyond recognition.
@@jamesdick2580 I wouldn’t necessarily say T3 makes no sense, it makes sense but it’s just kind of pointless, its a movie that didn’t need to happen
@@cbeckwith172 fair point!
@@jamesdick2580 it’s problematic for sure tho, a lot of problems with it but maybe I’m bias because It was the first terminator movie I got to see in theaters as a young man, I was born in 92 so I didn’t get to see both first entries until years later and after being enamored by them, I felt like it actually was awesome, it’s just a tired concept by the third entry, the humor is a bit forced, and the casting suffers, Arnold really carries the film, it was just more of the same but the ending was profound to me, finding out that sky net targets the humans as a threat to itself and that’s why it all started and that nothing they could do prevent the consequence of the invention of something so powerful like technology, I think it was one of the best endings to me, it’s a lot like how the watchmen movie ends, Jon’s just gotta face the reality instead of running from his destiny, it really played on that tone that t2 set for Jon impo, but yeah I think it mainly suffers from it’s time it came out, it was at a time where action movies started focusing on how over the top they could make the action sequences were abd I feel like besides the ending, it really feels heavily like they did another round because they could, it was definitely a cash grab action movie for sure, it misses the mark on being unique or “new” but it was more of the same of the things that made me like the franchise in the first place so it’s hard for to trash it, now genysis and dark fate to me look like absolute garbage
@@jamesdick2580 also salvation I’ve never seen but from what I’ve read about it, it sounds like that at least breaks the stereotypical format that terminator set up which wasn’t appreciated at the time I remember how I literally didn’t go cuz I didn’t like the idea that Arnold wasn’t in it, I thought he was the face of the franchise really but now as I’m older I really wanna watch that because it actually kinda focuses on something new.... the whole Marcus thing tho.... now that makes no sense to me
Very good explanation, thank you. The main reason Genisys was disliked was because it was simultaneously vague and complicated, which creates confusion. Your video makes me want to watch it again because it actually makes sense and ties together with the other timelines.
Chief O'brien from Star Trek DS9: "I _HATE_ TEMPORAL MECHANICS!"
... and you just read that in Chief O'Brien's voice.
@@j.casalinoThat's how I heard it.
Who? Did you mean Chief O'Brien from Star Trek The Next Generation?
@@saschamayer4050 same person. He was a main character in Deep Space 9
Time travel bullshittery really fucked him over in DS9
It is truly a dark timeline when Genisys isn't the worst canon Terminator sequel out...
I'm starting to think the only way it works is multiple universes all going back into each other's timelines but seldom their own. They can't exist without these other universes, this war far surpasses time travel.
i agree completely. IF temporal displacement is at all possible, which BTW is a BIG if, then we are most definitely living in a multiverse. changing the 'past' in any way, would create unstable imbalances otherwise. and paradoxes do NOT exist.
What is forgotten or not realised is that the events of the original Terminator film depict *at least* the third iteration of the time line.
original time line: John Connor is born from a random guy and Skynet is invented wtithout using any future tech. Kyle Reese sent back but at this stage is not JC's father.
time line 2: KR is sent back and becomes JC's father. Only at this point does Sarah Conner know tell (via a recording) JC that KR is his father.
time line 3: JC sens back KR *knowing* that KR is his father. KR has also been primed by JC and goes back already in love with SC.
Sounds like a good explanation to me me 👍🏻
No, T1 was written with the immutable future rule, JC was always KR's son. It's only afterwards that they changed the way the series' timetravel worked in order to allow for sequels.
I honestly lost track after Terminator Salvation. That’s when I had to start going back and re-watching. I thought I actually understood this mess of a timeline, honestly, Genesis just complicated the entire thing.
A theory I've got is that Genisys' script has some influence from the Sarah Connor Chronicles. Maybe what sent Arnie's Genisys T-800 back for young Sarah Connor is the A.I. that the T-1000 was creating to fight Skynet.
u should just forget about genesis
Um, forget about the movie that actually shows the time war hitting a major point, I don't think so. Genisys is a damn good terminator movie. It shows that Skynet knows about its past failures and is attempting to finally correct them all. It also showed that there is someone or something else that is fighting Skynet and it is not the Resistance. I can't wait to see what comes out of the time war now.
T1 and T2: make perfect sense
T3: makes no sense whatsoever
T4: makes even less than no sense
T5: for christ sake, come up with something original
T6: make it stop! timelines are totally convoluted and twisted as all hell.
franchise is totally fucked up beyond recognition.
this make my brain hurts trying to figure this out. oh god there it goes again
Watching this confused me more than watching the films in order.
So i rewatched them. Figured out how it all worked and im fine now
and after all Hulk comes and will say "Guys thats not how Timetravel work " :-D
This video is much better than one i see the otherday, saying that the films are all wrong and not possible!
Great job!👍
20:33 The Child may even be a girl
Terminator Dark Fate??
This piqued my interest too, dark fate trailer, "shes me" ??
People have been saying it would be Jane Connor as a joke before the movie was even announced.
Right, she could have had five kids before having John. She can't know this is the one, unless she plans never to have sex again. It's all confusing.
This is masterful. You have put way more thought into this than the creators and you should be proud!
I will never understand this timeline
The Back to the Future timeline makes more sense...if that makes any sense.
and timeline like Click and Multi universe
GBuster The back to the future timeline is not very hard to understand...
GBuster Back to the future is the kids version of timeline explanations. it's very inconsistent
....It`s just fantasy and not some kind of serious science......It`s just for etertaiment and joy.
AMAZING explanation! Please please update this after T6!
I believe that this explanation, though it does leave out the original timeline, is very accurate to the events that have taken place thus far in the saga.
I like this video, but I noticed that you left out the part where the T-X, upon arriving in the past, goes to a payphone and emits a digital signal, presumably assisting Skynet in becoming self-aware.
The T-X had come back from a timeline where skynet become self aware in 2005.
This analysis is even Further complicated by the fact that at the end of the TV series, SkyNet resolves the Connor conundrum by bringing J.C. to the future and stranding him as a stranger to the Resistance.
I wonder if John Connor, as the savior of humanity, his initials are just a coincidence with that of Jesus Christ ?
You must be remembering things wrong from "Sarah Connor Chronicles." Skynet has nothing to do with the ending at all, if you paid attention earlier in the last season, that T-1000 is the one from the submarine in the future, the T-1000 that the resistance asks to join them. She goes rogue from Skynet and travels back to create an A.I. that can defeat Skynet.
@@Rez090 No. The very last episode, after we learn that a "Terminator" was sent back and took over the identity of a company CEO, John Connor confronts the "CEO Terminator" and she calls in the drone that takes him to the future so that he never leads the Resistance. That one was, technically, a SkyNet unit.
Now I know you weren't paying attention, they both went to the future to chase down the A.I. that stole the body from the female terminator that was protecting John. The T-1000 that was posing as a CEO was not affiliated with Skynet, it was a rogue unit.
Sheesh, at any rate, John Connor ends up in the future and the Resistance has no idea who he is, which technically creates a New Branch off the linear Time Line they illustrate here. One in which John had disappeared and has no influence on the Resistance.
Paul Hawkins rez090 is right
But isn't THE original timeline the one where Sarah has john and she teaches him to become a warrior all on her own? The second timeline is the one you presented as the first in which skynet says fuck that and sends back the t-800. Essentially the second timeline is the key to everything. Not the original
You have no idea that timeline and the original timeline is not one in the same.
There was no 'original' timeline, as the first film showed. The whole point of the first two (and only real films that count) was that the events were a closed causal loop, with events in the future causing events in the past.
But wasn't part of the premise of the 3rd film (garbage I'll admit) that if Skynet closed the loop without changing the result, it needed to try a new approach? Hence skynet sends a terminator to kill lieutenants and then John would be a bonus. Hence there is a possibility since some of the lieutenants are killed, the future may in fact change.
Also, while the 4th film (again garbage I'll admit) does not follow a standard terminator plot from the first three films, the resistance still exists, meaning skynet could in theory still be defeated. Hence, a more sophisticated infiltration unit is created, but fails because it left too much of a human element intact. This would be a different skynet from the original film, and also a different John. Hence skynet continues to work on improving its tech when John does not die at the end of T4.
I could follow the logic of T3 and T4, even if that logic was to make money off of a franchise. However, T5 requires too many extra logic jumps to truly be feasible from a time perspective. Yet at the same time, the only way skynet may be intelligent enough to create the T3000 and the T5000 is the Genysis version that we see building a core at the end of the film. I saw T5 as a giant rhetorical question that was purely a money grab. What I didn't understand was if they asked the question (John as a Terminator) then answered the question (the Genysis version of skynet) in the same film, the sequels to T5 become even more redundant.
The films seem to come in twos where a loop is opened in the odd films and closed in the even films. Yet in the fifth film, they already opened and closed the loop. While it hurts to imagine what the writing would be if two more are in the making, it does pose the question of what direction given events from five films are they going to take two more when quite frankly they are (pardon the phrasing) out of time as the loop is practically complete and current.
Jeremy McCoy judgement day is inevitable you can only post pone it
'original' john could have been from another father (not reese). The key isnt john, its sarah & her bringing up each john as a badass. it doesnt have to be a "closed causal loop"
Judgement day was Aug 29th not Aug 4th. Skynet was switched on Aug 4th, became self aware on 29th
It pains me whenever they leave out the original timeline. Listen guys, the original timeline was normal. Sarah gets pregnant and has Baby John . The Artificial intelligence becomes self aware in 1997. Humanity is almost wiped out, and Sarah barely survives and teaches her son how to be strong. It's during this timeline Sarah herself starts to become a warrior and a strong role model for John. This is the original timeline but nobody ever uses it. The second timeline is created when Skynet sends the Terminator back to 1984
Then who is Johns father? Also how does judgement day happen in 1997 when Cyberdyne Systems that creates skynet doesn't have the technology from the T-800 from 1984?
The original Skynet was a military defense system. It became self aware an considered all mankind a threat . This design would be no different then us creating an advance Internet system. You don't need tech from the future to make advancements. ( nor babies ) It's not impossible. The T-800s arm altered the timeline giving Miles the ability to create Skynet without starting from scratch. This is why by 2029 Skynet sends a T-1000 instead of the T-800 because the timeline is " upgraded".
The most common belief is that this now creates a loop, thus making Reese go back in time each moment 2029 occurs. It doesn't . The loop exists but each time you go back you change the loop. Perhaps the resistance was always destined to beat Skynet , but Skynet was always destined to send a terminator back. But the events change forever. Notice after the T-1000 incident the timeline changes again and John gets killed by Skynet after 2029.... This means Reece never got sent back because the war is still raging. It's then Johns wife send a terminator to protect the new resistance leaders from skynet a new female Model.
The original timeline is dependent on the T-800 going back in time. That is how Skynet gets its inspiration for a self-aware AI. It is also dependent on Reese to father John Connor.
This is the whole premise behind the causal loop theory of time travel.
The whole point of sending the T-800 was to change the existing timeline. Key word being change. The original timeline is what Skynet was trying to alter. It's not part of the existing timeline at all, the T-800 was sent back to erase and re-write the timeline. T-800 goes back, kills Sarah and John therefore no resistance. Therefore no Terminator gets sent back. Time changes Skynet wins. Skynet did not send the terminator back so a loop can start.
I understood that "Battle Across Time" mention you quickly put there, great job
It's been hinted in many sources that the Future War has become irreversibly changed into a multiversal proxy war: the Human Resistance and SkyNet continuously try to change, or prevent, several timelines to prevent either side from gaining a decisive victory.
In the Genisys timeline; Judgement day reverted back to 2029 because The chip and endoskeleton were destroyed. T2 doesn't happen in the Genisys timeline as John isn't born in 1985.
That and it is not confirmed that Pops and the T-1000 were sent back in 2030; or were the same timeline that Kyle came from.
Multiverse time travel 101. Terra Nova explained it well. If you send humans back in time to live on earth, modern civilization would change UNLESS the time travel is into a timeline that is NOT the timeline you actually come from. You aren't travelling to YOUR own past, but the past of an alternative universe. (And it means that ANOTHER timeline traveled into it to create John Connor, the Kyle you see traveling through time is NOT the Kyle who fathered the John that sent him back in time. So that John could kill THIS Kyle and Sarah as they are not HIS Kyle and Sarah)
It really wasn't a nexus point that caused Kyle to end up with two timeline memories... It was the fact he was entering a timeline/alternate universe that had already been affected by the time travel of Pop's to 1983 as well as John Connor's travel to 2015 AND his own jump to 2017 in the destination timeline/universe. But then again, Pop's wasn't programmed with truth. He doesn't know who reprogrammed him and sent him back. Knowing that Alternate Universes exist was probably taken out of his database because that IS where he came from. His database is a false one. So the nexus point explanation given by Pops is in itself a calculated lie
watching the orange line drawing back to 1973, i went to watch Robot Chicken's terminator genesis again. RObot chicken is always on point.
SO John conner = Reverse flash
both exiles in time being chased by death by multiple timelines
so barry allen = eabord thawne
It's not hard to figure out. Skynet would have been built no matter what. AI was advancing, even before a terminator came through time. When Kyle reese went back to 1984, the future he was from became his past, and the new timeline he arrived in became his future. Same with the T800. when he arrived in 1984, that was technically the year of its creation, thus accelerating Skynet's creation.
Well done! I’ve always wanted to love the Terminator franchise. I love robots, time travel, and typically all things sci-fi, but movies 2-4 just seemed like cut-rate storytelling. You have done the due diligence to piece together a plausible logic that has restored the story. You and you alone aided the fans not unlike the revelation of the “Darth Jar Jar” theory put forth by one lone fan who cared, while Hollywood clearly didn’t. Thank you and well done, sir.
Even the Doctor couldn't fix this mess of a time line :|
he sort of did (being the embodiment of Skynet), and by the way Genisys wasn't a continuity of the established timeline - it was a reboot.
Genisys was such a waste of talent for Matt Smith
Jim Moore the only reason it was considered a continuity was because of young Sarah Conner and Arnold fought young Arnold from T1
best 24 minutes.. good job sir 😎
Does anyone else think a great movie about Miles Dyson, his life, and the eventual meeting of Sarah Connor couldn't have been a pretty awesome movie? I mean T2 sort of followed a storyline, and it did it well. But you didn't need to go and reinvent the wheel with another sequel. Just think about the reality of the situation and the many compelling options.
Have a film about Silberman (non-SCC ver) instead. Would watch it just to see his face when the bombs fall and he realises the Connors were right.
Great vid, Adel!
But I think we could avoid all this if:
the Resistance sent someone back in time to
kill the guy who discovered how to make fire,
and Skynet sent a Terminator back in time to kill Adam before he shagged Eve.
Problem solved. 😉
All the time traveling even after listening to your breakdowns still has me as confusing as a box of puzzles
Salvation was a good place to end it..
You forgot about the timeline of the Sarah Connor Chronicles: since the show took place after T2, and skips over T3 completely; leading to Salvation
I was just thinking about that very thing... Without the inclusion of the Sarah Connor Chronicles, you can't call this a complete timeline review. This information has to be looked at and included.
what came first, the chicken, or the egg
The chicken because it travelled back in time to then lay an egg
dan b YES! O_O
Darth B00b The egg! Cause Dinos uses eggs too!
Darth B00b: it was the cockerel. you can tell cos he's smoking.
Stefanele, ce cauti paicea ?
Thank you for such a comprehensive breakdown of what is a very important topic and actually very confusing matter. I think I'll need to watch this a few times before I completely understand it, however I'm sure eventually I'll get my head around it. It's great to see someone treat this information with the respect it deserves. Some people, like one of my friends for example, just don't seem to care at all (I know someone who hasn't even seen the original Terminator! and they're not even interested in seeing it!!) and no matter how much you try to explain it, they're just not interested and it seems they'd rather just spend time with friends and family talking and laughing than actually sitting down and analysing these important time lines. It's crazy!
Interestingly enough there was a military satellite project called Sky-Net, and I remember seeing the patches and stickers from the project when I was working on some equipment for making parts for a military contractor. It used to be not too far from the headquarters for Harbor Freight in Southern California, and I thought that it was interesting seeing strawberries and near there on the other side of the 101 freeway a place that grows orchids and a Very large Santa Claus near the Rose over cross. For those that don' t know the area this is Oxnard.... BTW there are some other projects by the same name.
Kyle wasn’t John’s first father.
But in Terminator 1 Kyle has a pic of Sarah how lol please explain
John gave it to him
@@MarkofO John gave it to him so that he'd know her when he saw her.
@@tonystank3091 no shit but how if Reese wasn't johns father until he got sent backed
@@MarkofO Because pictures existed in 1984 and John was still Sarah's son. He just had that pic of his mommy with him, may be Sarah had always wanted to go to Mexico so in the original timeline she did travel and got the pic (you never see her pregnant in that pic)
I watch these movies to enjoy with popcorn and try not to overthink it. It really stops making sense while watching T2. Without Skynet there are no terminators. Without terminators there is no Skynet. This invalidates the first movie because in the original time line Skynet would never have existed and Sarah’s friend would have enjoyed her sandwich and gone to sleep.
I love this universe so much. Wish more people included the tv show The Sarah Connor Chronicles though
You need to come back and update this video with a new timeline of Dark Fuck (intended insult).
Great vid man,So basically the unknown events after Salvation could’ve caused Genesis since the altered timeline that became Salvation has a different outcome for the future and that outcome is skynet sending a terminator to 2029 to create Genesis; I hope I explained that in a coherent way that makes sense
GREAT VIDEO!!! It`s one of the best timeline explanations out there. One thing bothers me a lot is HOW WAS THE 1997 J-DAY PREVENTED IN GENISYS?!?!Here`s my theory on it: THE T-5000 IS THE ONE WHO SENDS POPS BACK TO SAVE SARAH!What the T-5000 wants is to get rid of Miles Dyson`s and Kyle Reese`s role on it`s creation. It wants to be the responsible for its own creation, creating a time-loop, just like John Connor was able to do for himself.So, in order to do that, it needs to prevent the J-Day`s from 1997 and 2004 from happening, and creating a new J-Day (in 2017), but it knows John, Sarah and Reese will be there to bother them, so his plan is to help them SUCCEED in defeating the T1`s Skynet. Here`s what it did:After infecting JC, it sends a T-1000 and a T-800 back in time to STAGE an assassination attempt on young Sarah Connor. In order not to be detected, it programs the T-800 to truly protect Sarah, but the T-1000 is programed to throw the fight and play dead. This explains how a T-800 was able to defeat a T-1000 so easily.All this is done in order to manipulate Sarah to do the T-5000`s bidding, preventing the 1997 J-Day, and the creation of the Skynet version that always fails to defeat the resistance. She succeeds in it, when she defeats the T-800 not leaving any trace of it behind to be reverse-engineered by Dyson.Immediately after the T-5000 sends a T-1000 and Pops to the past, it also sends the T-3000 to 2014 in order to conclude its plan, so he can have early access to the Time Machine, T-1000s and the advanced T-5000 version of Skynet, resulting on its new 2017 J-Day, which happens later than the T-1`s 1997 J-Day, but with provides him with much better chances of winning the war AND makes him responsible for it`s own creation, creating a new timeloop independent from the Connors.ALSO, after Pops and Sarah save Reese, they INEXPLICABLY decide to jump to 1997 in order to prevent J-Day. But why? Why not just take the long way and be better prepared for it. THIS WAS ALSO PART OF THE T-5000`S PLAN! In order to prevent John`s birth, it gives Pops the Time Machine schematics and programs him to make Sarah jump from 1984 to 1997, preventing her from birthing John in 1985, and ensuring that he will never exist.What the T-5000 failed to see was that Kyle would have knowledge of the new 2017 J-Day. Kyle saves the day on this one by preventing (or delaying) J-Day, but leaves the future of war uncertain.Cheers.
With the Original T-800 being killed by Sarah in Genius, the humans never got their hands on the T-800 chip.
Great explanation.
Christophyr Jenkins
It is
"Everything is proceeding as I have forseen."
Above anything else, 2 things have always lead to Skynet' s defeat
1) the knowledge John possesses about the war leading up to 2029 allows him to effectively cheat and rig the game in his favor.
2) the date of Judgement Day being known gives John the opportunity to avoid being part of the population destroyed in the initial nuclear war.
As much as I didn't like Genisys, it removed these 2 advantages the Resistance had on it. Leveling the playing field.
Dark Fate seems to also favor Skynet based on these 2 facts. John would be too old to lead the Resistance through a 30+ yr war and most, if not all, info he (and Sarah by extension) has regarding Skynet could virtually be non-applicable since Skynet starts off more advance due to the delay from T2.
Now the Resistance simply has to win without relying on knowledge from Kyle's future (not counting Grace's knowledge of HER timeline)
This is an excellent analysis. So many people just dismiss Genisys and don't even _notice_ the running theme of "taking the long way", a clear hint of what was happening behind the scenes.
Timecrimes is the movie that the most accurately represents a linear timeline with loops.
I'm still trying to understand how John lived threw getting a chunk of metal slammed threw his heart and chest even after it was ripped out.
matt2244 fr
Heart transplant.
its fan fiction it doesn't really matter.
Marcus gives up his heart so John could survive. That's how.
Plot armour.
Confusing, but you did make it much clearer for me. Thanks!
I like to think of the Terminator timeline in terms of the multiverse, so that in the very first original timeline John Conner's father was somebody other than Kyle and Skynet was created from scratch.
The convoluted jump hooping that is the impossible task of justifying Genisys (god I hate that name) is astounding.
You're telling me that T-5000 goes back in time to prevent T2 from happening, then just sits around for the original 1997 judgment day to happen. He then idles by until the resistance takes out the original Cyberdyne in 2029, so that the events of T1 can play out which completely ensure that John Conner is born and that the 1997 judgment day happens. It is only then that he converts John Connor into his robo buddy so that he can go back to 2017... 20 years after the judgment day that he absolutely made sure would happen... so that he can make an even better judgment day... but then T-5000 also sends back a robot to kill Sarah Connor, despite the fact that she died in a loony bin and really has no ability to foil his current plans... which will make sure that John Connor, that he needs for his plans, will never be born...
...what?