It’s the way teachers are treated, not the money. Students are allowed to bully, swear at, threaten, ridicule, and intimidate teachers and other students with no consequences. Each school needs a security team on call to remove antisocial students and a clear plan to deal with them. It’s left up to the teachers, who cannot remove the student; can’t get help in the moment; and have to confront a dangerous person alone. If a student is out of control in a classroom, the teacher must remove the entire class and relocate them to a ‘safe area.’ Often the situation escalates quickly and classrooms do not have an emergency call button, nor a person who will respond who has permission to safely stabilise a dangerous student. This clearly shows that the student controls everything , and the teacher is powerless. Teachers are hired to teach their specialty not be abused for coming to work. Even a bottle shop has security, and it is not expected that the cashier risks their life to miraculously get through to an unreasonable person. Police have authority to stop a dangerous teenager, but there is no one at schools to assist teachers with antisocial students, so it gets worse and worse and then teachers leave. I witnessed a fight among several students, and couldn’t intervene due to the students ‘rights’ other than to shout ‘stop’ and blow a whistle, which attracted more students. After hours of paperwork and meetings about what happened, I was told by the principal that next time I should ask students to pull the kids off each other who are fighting because teachers can’t touch students. Really? Endanger other students to stop a fight while I stand there with a whistle doing nothing? Having no security, no authority, no respect, and no help makes everyone unsafe. Add to that online ‘challenges’ in vandalism at school or public ridicule of teachers that is recorded and posted online, and it’s no wonder why any adult would quit such a toxic work environment. The antisocial students rule the schools and they know it.
A week after this was shown we had a teacher being bullied by students who snapped and fought back. That teacher has been arrested for assault. So having put up with all the problems described he is now a criminal, his reputation destroyed and with no future. It is hard enough with all the other problems but fundamentally undisciplined students makes it hazardous. Administrative issues are many times greater than they used to be. Whether assessments, meetings or paperwork and bureaucracy this has grown out of all proportion. Teaching is a tiny part of the actual job these days. So ever increased workload coupled with ever less support and greatly reduced pay in real terms. Why do it?
I attended Saint Benedict's Senior College in Sydney on scholarship in 1982. It was an amazing experience, but it looks like Australia has decided to adopt America's education problems. Since 1988 I have taught at a dozen schools and consulted at around a hundred across 6 states (in the US). The MAIN problem is NOT the pay! It is the psychological, emotional and physical abuse that teachers are being subjected to on a DAILY basis. For you non-teachers, imagine being belittled, abused and demeaned by children, adolescents and even adults (who hold your livelihood in their hands) and at the same time attacked for not "meeting the needs" of your abusers.
Paying them more will NOT solve the problem. This model of mixed abilities, shall we call it, in the same class results in teachers effectively having to prep for and teach multiple lessons/levels in one class/period constantly. Add the shocking behaviour from kids these days that is due to poor parenting and society/government's will to remove any ability to control or punish said poor behaviour and you have a most unappealing job. Good luck reversing the trend in state schools.
And in tandem with the problem of mixed abilities is the lack of vocational tracking at the secondary level, and the progressive ruination of the slower kids through social promotion in which they’re continually being kicked upstairs to become the next higher grade or form’s problem. This is how you get secondary students with the reading level of an eight year old but they’re doomed to sit there flunking out because the manual arts programs were all eliminated owing to deindustrialization and the computer revolution. Even secretarial science for the more anti-intellectual girls has gone the way of the dodo bird and been replaced by keyboarding orientation in computer labs which don’t really duplicate traditional secretarial typist programs. In order to become a secretary today one is expected to get a university degree, perversely.
💯! Pay more more will not solve any problem. The excess workload is still present as well as the disrespect and misery. If anything, more workload will be placed on teachers because they’re getting paid more!
I earned my Ed degree, and having seen the work needed ... HA... No way I was going to be abused for that salary!!! I made Twice++ as much being a Geologist!
As a retired teacher I can name a number of issues. Mandatory vaccination number one. Where were the teacher unions? Dead in the water. Other issues are national curriculum guidelines introduced with few resources. This means that teachers are having to constantly re-invent the wheel. Programs have to be planned and implemented, for different stages, by the teachers. This creates excessive workload. The increase of children with special needs integrated into main classes. These children require individual programs to be implemented with very little support. Extra, extra responsibilities for example having to monitor the health plans of individual children. Before I retired I told my university prac students, not to be a classroom teacher as it had become a 'dog's body job'. Too much responsibility, too much administration work, excessive report demands. I could go on ........constant interruptions from the core business of teaching was a huge problem as well. Programs for this that and another............I'm sure you get my drift. I was there for the students, that I loved. The system has been broken deliberately. No question about it.
Start with the basics. It is an organised, unionised, protectionist racket for permanent staff. The rest (on Contracts) rarely full time, are left transient and vulnerable. You can just imagine the atmosphere in this workplace. Thank God I am financially independent. I look back on the experience as having met the worst in Australian society (I don't mean the students)!
BTW, Australia used to solve the teacher shortage with teachers from overseas but there is currently a teacher shortage around the world since Covid. The same issues are facing teachers around the world.
People don’t have energy to take care of their homes after work, because of the work environment. It’s basically camping in your own space. What’s the point? You work all day to come home to barely be able to clean your space. Then you have to still deal with landlord/lady, neighbors, etc. after being at some thankless draining job all day. There’s no point anymore.
Most states in the USA are in massive debt. Calif. is $1 trillion in debt, mostly with unfunded pension liabilities. Teachers are not getting a raise and schools are not getting fixed. If the kids are being impacted, too bad. We're seeing the decline of civilization now like Rome in "Gladiator" (2000).
They are only taking American teachers under 30. There are plenty of American veteran teachers who would love to teach in Australia. Why the age discrimination?
Right first of all no teachers don't need to be paid more, from my understanding they get paid more then nurses, second of all what needs to be fixed is the admin work they need to do, the education departments of Australia really need to create jobs strictly for this area of admin then that way you have a teacher teaching and another person or team of people working on the admin, yeah they may have to be in the classroom with the teacher but it would take the load off of the teacher and teacher aide. Also the education department needs to make a teaching diploma so we get teachers in asap rather then waiting 3+ years
I'm a teacher and I can tell you pretty confidently that most teachers don't do it for the pay. Incentivising teachers to work harder for higher pay isn't going to solve problems. The stress will remain the same and continue to impact their lives (and the lives of their students).
Our Union sold us out. We got a 1.5% payrise each year for 4 years. I would have like to have seen that at the CPI (inflation rate) at the time, which was 2.3%, or at least 2% each year. I just wanted to see it keep up with inflation. Now inflation is 8%, mortgage rates have gone up 3% in the last year and I'm stuck in a contract of 1.5% payrise each year for the next 4 years. I'm not asking for a huge payrise - just to keep up with inflation so I can pay the bills. My mortgage has increased $900 per month, while my pay has increased $110 per month, since last year.
@@traceyholt8223 Wage growth has been stagnant in most proffessions for more than a decade, 1.5% growth per year is about the same for me as a software engineer. So there must be more to it than just wages.
@@Tapecutter59 While your figure might be true it's not true in terms of comparing 4 year degrees. Teachers used to earn the same as other professions. A teacher degree now will earn you around 80% of what another degree will of the same length. The big test is to look at pay at age 40. The peak of your career. A teacher is on around $105,000 with a max of around $120,000 depending on your state. Less than 3% of people with teacher degrees are on over $150k. If you do mathematical science, law, commerce, engineering, economics or any medical science over a third are on over $150k. To get over $150k you need to be in charge of over 100 staff and 1000 kids. You're the CEO of a fairly large company. As a teacher I can do a masters, multiple PHds, get awarded the best teacher in the entire world, revolutionise teaching and I'll still be on the same pay. No amount of qualification or ability will give you much of a pay increase. The only way to get a higher pay is to not teach. If I go work in central office where I do often meaningless jobs the prospect of higher pay is very likely.
It’s the way teachers are treated, not the money. Students are allowed to bully, swear at, threaten, ridicule, and intimidate teachers and other students with no consequences. Each school needs a security team on call to remove antisocial students and a clear plan to deal with them. It’s left up to the teachers, who cannot remove the student; can’t get help in the moment; and have to confront a dangerous person alone. If a student is out of control in a classroom, the teacher must remove the entire class and relocate them to a ‘safe area.’ Often the situation escalates quickly and classrooms do not have an emergency call button, nor a person who will respond who has permission to safely stabilise a dangerous student. This clearly shows that the student controls everything , and the teacher is powerless. Teachers are hired to teach their specialty not be abused for coming to work. Even a bottle shop has security, and it is not expected that the cashier risks their life to miraculously get through to an unreasonable person. Police have authority to stop a dangerous teenager, but there is no one at schools to assist teachers with antisocial students, so it gets worse and worse and then teachers leave. I witnessed a fight among several students, and couldn’t intervene due to the students ‘rights’ other than to shout ‘stop’ and blow a whistle, which attracted more students. After hours of paperwork and meetings about what happened, I was told by the principal that next time I should ask students to pull the kids off each other who are fighting because teachers can’t touch students. Really? Endanger other students to stop a fight while I stand there with a whistle doing nothing? Having no security, no authority, no respect, and no help makes everyone unsafe. Add to that online ‘challenges’ in vandalism at school or public ridicule of teachers that is recorded and posted online, and it’s no wonder why any adult would quit such a toxic work environment. The antisocial students rule the schools and they know it.
A week after this was shown we had a teacher being bullied by students who snapped and fought back. That teacher has been arrested for assault. So having put up with all the problems described he is now a criminal, his reputation destroyed and with no future. It is hard enough with all the other problems but fundamentally undisciplined students makes it hazardous. Administrative issues are many times greater than they used to be. Whether assessments, meetings or paperwork and bureaucracy this has grown out of all proportion. Teaching is a tiny part of the actual job these days. So ever increased workload coupled with ever less support and greatly reduced pay in real terms. Why do it?
I attended Saint Benedict's Senior College in Sydney on scholarship in 1982. It was an amazing experience, but it looks like Australia has decided to adopt America's education problems.
Since 1988 I have taught at a dozen schools and consulted at around a hundred across 6 states (in the US). The MAIN problem is NOT the pay! It is the psychological, emotional and physical abuse that teachers are being subjected to on a DAILY basis.
For you non-teachers, imagine being belittled, abused and demeaned by children, adolescents and even adults (who hold your livelihood in their hands) and at the same time attacked for not "meeting the needs" of your abusers.
Paying them more will NOT solve the problem. This model of mixed abilities, shall we call it, in the same class results in teachers effectively having to prep for and teach multiple lessons/levels in one class/period constantly. Add the shocking behaviour from kids these days that is due to poor parenting and society/government's will to remove any ability to control or punish said poor behaviour and you have a most unappealing job. Good luck reversing the trend in state schools.
And in tandem with the problem of mixed abilities is the lack of vocational tracking at the secondary level, and the progressive ruination of the slower kids through social promotion in which they’re continually being kicked upstairs to become the next higher grade or form’s problem. This is how you get secondary students with the reading level of an eight year old but they’re doomed to sit there flunking out because the manual arts programs were all eliminated owing to deindustrialization and the computer revolution. Even secretarial science for the more anti-intellectual girls has gone the way of the dodo bird and been replaced by keyboarding orientation in computer labs which don’t really duplicate traditional secretarial typist programs. In order to become a secretary today one is expected to get a university degree, perversely.
AMEN to this !!!
💯! Pay more more will not solve any problem. The excess workload is still present as well as the disrespect and misery. If anything, more workload will be placed on teachers because they’re getting paid more!
Too many of us are on yearly contracts for over 5 years. No permanent jobs...🤦♀️
I earned my Ed degree, and having seen the work needed ... HA... No way I was going to be abused for that salary!!! I made Twice++ as much being a Geologist!
It seems like teachers are being asked to do admin work.
Abusive students, plus low pay, high numbers of students to teacher ratio, no help, feeling under valued and over workerd etc etc
As a retired teacher I can name a number of issues. Mandatory vaccination number one. Where were the teacher unions? Dead in the water. Other issues are national curriculum guidelines introduced with few resources. This means that teachers are having to constantly re-invent the wheel. Programs have to be planned and implemented, for different stages, by the teachers. This creates excessive workload. The increase of children with special needs integrated into main classes. These children require individual programs to be implemented with very little support. Extra, extra responsibilities for example having to monitor the health plans of individual children. Before I retired I told my university prac students, not to be a classroom teacher as it had become a 'dog's body job'. Too much responsibility, too much administration work, excessive report demands. I could go on ........constant interruptions from the core business of teaching was a huge problem as well. Programs for this that and another............I'm sure you get my drift. I was there for the students, that I loved. The system has been broken deliberately. No question about it.
Start with the basics. It is an organised, unionised, protectionist racket for permanent staff. The rest (on Contracts) rarely full time, are left transient and vulnerable. You can just imagine the atmosphere in this workplace. Thank God I am financially independent. I look back on the experience as having met the worst in Australian society (I don't mean the students)!
Shortages are epidemic in all service professions; medical, police military, firefighters.
BTW, Australia used to solve the teacher shortage with teachers from overseas but there is currently a teacher shortage around the world since Covid. The same issues are facing teachers around the world.
Why would you move to Australia after how they treated people during covid! No thanks!
They won't take American teachers over 30
People don’t have energy to take care of their homes after work, because of the work environment. It’s basically camping in your own space. What’s the point? You work all day to come home to barely be able to clean your space. Then you have to still deal with landlord/lady, neighbors, etc. after being at some thankless draining job all day. There’s no point anymore.
Healthcare is even worse. Much less being a cop, one of the good ones that is. It’s just getting less and less worth it all the time.
Most states in the USA are in massive debt. Calif. is $1 trillion in debt, mostly with unfunded pension liabilities. Teachers are not getting a raise and schools are not getting fixed. If the kids are being impacted, too bad. We're seeing the decline of civilization now like Rome in "Gladiator" (2000).
The one of few times when the Project is on the mark.
The best time to plant a tree is 20 years ago, and then it takes 6 years to train a teacher - 4 years at uni and 2 years on the job.
They are only taking American teachers under 30. There are plenty of American veteran teachers who would love to teach in Australia. Why the age discrimination?
Right first of all no teachers don't need to be paid more, from my understanding they get paid more then nurses, second of all what needs to be fixed is the admin work they need to do, the education departments of Australia really need to create jobs strictly for this area of admin then that way you have a teacher teaching and another person or team of people working on the admin, yeah they may have to be in the classroom with the teacher but it would take the load off of the teacher and teacher aide.
Also the education department needs to make a teaching diploma so we get teachers in asap rather then waiting 3+ years
Would be Intresting to hear the what teachers would feel is fair as a weekly pay for them ?
Yearly --> 90K+ Minimum!
I'm a teacher and I can tell you pretty confidently that most teachers don't do it for the pay. Incentivising teachers to work harder for higher pay isn't going to solve problems. The stress will remain the same and continue to impact their lives (and the lives of their students).
Our Union sold us out. We got a 1.5% payrise each year for 4 years. I would have like to have seen that at the CPI (inflation rate) at the time, which was 2.3%, or at least 2% each year. I just wanted to see it keep up with inflation. Now inflation is 8%, mortgage rates have gone up 3% in the last year and I'm stuck in a contract of 1.5% payrise each year for the next 4 years. I'm not asking for a huge payrise - just to keep up with inflation so I can pay the bills. My mortgage has increased $900 per month, while my pay has increased $110 per month, since last year.
@@traceyholt8223 Wage growth has been stagnant in most proffessions for more than a decade, 1.5% growth per year is about the same for me as a software engineer. So there must be more to it than just wages.
@@Tapecutter59 While your figure might be true it's not true in terms of comparing 4 year degrees. Teachers used to earn the same as other professions. A teacher degree now will earn you around 80% of what another degree will of the same length.
The big test is to look at pay at age 40. The peak of your career. A teacher is on around $105,000 with a max of around $120,000 depending on your state. Less than 3% of people with teacher degrees are on over $150k. If you do mathematical science, law, commerce, engineering, economics or any medical science over a third are on over $150k. To get over $150k you need to be in charge of over 100 staff and 1000 kids. You're the CEO of a fairly large company.
As a teacher I can do a masters, multiple PHds, get awarded the best teacher in the entire world, revolutionise teaching and I'll still be on the same pay. No amount of qualification or ability will give you much of a pay increase. The only way to get a higher pay is to not teach. If I go work in central office where I do often meaningless jobs the prospect of higher pay is very likely.