Thank you for this video. I've been eyeing the GR300, but I see lots of accounts of it feeling sluggish, despite having the same geometry as the Revolt. This kind of confirms it. Would love a Ti bike, but seems like the Revolt is the way to go.
I'm looking for a ti gravel bike with no toe overlap. So far the Lynskey Chilhowee seems to fit the bill but not a fan of it's helix down tube. The GR300 is more my style but appears to still have overlap 😢
FWIW, even on twisting single track, I haven't found the toe overlap to be a problem on the GR300. More a thing to be managed. It is definitely a thing though, so if you're doing really technical stuff this probably isn't the right bike.
Thank you, this video was super helpful in comparing a racing gravel bike (revolt) and a more comfortable/leisurely one (Lynksey GR300). I am looking for a high-performance titanium gravel bike (not really for racing) for about 50% road riding (up and down hilly pavement roads) and 50% gravel riding (fire-roads, single tracks with some uphill riding on those gravel roads) that will last me a long time. I'd also like to put on a rear rack for a child seat to take my 2-year old on rides with me from time to time. I'm 200 lbs and my 2-year old is about 25 lbs right now (she'll probably increase in weight to up to 35 lbs by the end of the year), and I want to make sure the bike can accommodate both of our weights when I take her on rides with me. total weight and my physical dimensions below: total weight: between 200-235 lbs (200 lb for me, and 25-35 lbs for child) Height: 191cm Wingspan: 187cm Shoulder width: 44cm Inseam: 83cm I know I want a 58 cm frameset given my above dimensions, but can't decide which bike on the following shortlist is best given my goals and dimensions. I realize that I'm limited by the fact that these bikes are custom built, and so I cannot try them out beforehand. But if the better bike is one that is ordered, I'll take the chance. 1. Bearclaw Titanium Thunderhawk frameset (one with titanium fork or carbon fork) 2. Thomson Piedmont frameset 3. Linskey Pro GR/GR500 Gravel bike frameset. I plan to add a low-gearing (i.e., 2x-something) Shimano GRX groupset to them, and make whatever additional mods needed for comfort. Which one should I choose, and if Lynskey, what's really the difference between the GR300, GR500 and GR PRO? Thank you in advance. Lee
I can't really speak to the Bearclaw or Thomson frames since I've never had the chance to really look at in-depth or ride them. The main reason I went with the Lynskey was because of its value. Lynskey runs sales all the time (current offer is 15% off), so I was able to get the internal frameset for $1800. The main difference between the GR300 and the GR Pro is that the PRO has a diamond shaped top & down tubes (IIRC, R500 has the same thing). The PRO also has dropped seat stays and uses a different Ti alloy blend (3AL-2.5V vs 6AL-4V). 3AL-2.5V (GR300) should be more compliant because 6AL-4V (PRO) is a stiffer material (maybe why they dropped the seat stays, which should increase compliance), and in theory should weigh more (although Lynskey claims the same weight for both frames in L). My goal with the GR300 was to get a bullet-proof bike with a comfortable ride. Something that I didn't mind riding over the winter, and could be locked to a signpost without worrying if it would get damaged. Your questions around weight are probably best addressed with the frame builder. I can't imagine that a Ti bike (any Ti bike) wouldn't be able to support massive loads (well over 240lb), but it's not something I have ever researched. I worked with Jordan at Lynskey, he's a great guy, very helpful, I'm sure he would be able to answer any questions around rack fit and weights (or tell who there can if he can't). LMK what you decide, and how it works out.
@@Mamilian Thank you for getting back to me on this and for clarity on the difference between the PRO and the GR300 with respect to blend of Ti and seat stays. It sounds like the total weight I'm expecting to put on the bike won't be a problem which is comforting, because that was one of the reasons I am considering titanium gravel bikes. I did call Lynskey earlier today but no answer before closing, so left message on Alex's voicemail. If I ordered the GR300 frameset to then build out, do you have experience with the turnaround time to get it in the mail? I live in Los Angeles, Ca, so if coming from TN and/or on back order , then not sure it will be quick. However, if not a quick turnaround do you have insight into whether a local bike shop in Ca would have this frameset brand new? If it turns out that it will take a long time to arrive, I will consider a Thomson or Bearclaw Thunderhawk frame instead if they will be quicker. But, I'm concerned about Thomson, since I haven't seen enough about how reliable/durable/well-performing it is in discussion forums or on the internet. It was recommended by several individuals in a good local bike shop in my area. Thank you, Lee
@@emceeaye Turn around on the frame will depend on a lot of factors. Definitely something you'll want to nail down with whoever you go with. IIRC, it took ~2 months for me to get my frame, but that was pre-vaccine COVID (last fall), so they were following spacing protocols that shouldn't apply currently.
Interesting video, I would lover to see more comparison between carbon vs ti road bikes. I have a 2015 carbon roadbike (rim brake) and canyon grizl gravel bike and im looking to upgrade to roadbike. I mostly want a responisve quick bike but cant make up my mind. Do you think Ti is too heavy/unresponsive for my needs? Or would a Ti roadbike with more aggresive geometry also do the trick for me? by the way, the orange bartape looks cool.
Responsiveness is mostly a function of geometry, but there is something to the weight and material as well. The geometry of the Revolt and GR300 isn't that different, but the Revolt is more responsive and frisky, the GR300 is more stable. Neither is anywhere close to how quick the Tarmac is; you don't even have to think about placing it. It just teleports where you want it to be, but on the other had I wouldn't want to do a technical gravel descent on it :D. Personally, I don't think I would shop Ti for road, given my preferences in a road bike (fast, frisky, nimble, sharp, stiff, etc). But there absolutely is a place for it if you want something a little smoother, a little more stable, etc. You might be able to get all of that with the right Ti tubes, geometry, welding, etc., but I think it will be harder to get there than if you bought a carbon race bike. Matching endurance road, is probably very possible with the right frame.
Thank you for this upload. I have a TCR and recently the idea of on gravel bike is floating around. I was thinking of Revolt Aluminum (testing the water so to speak) to test out.. Ultimately I know I want a titanium bike. Question. Is your riding setup the same for the road bike and grave bike the same?
The setup on my gravel and road bikes is roughly the same except for things like drop (which I commented on in the video). I do run a slightly shorter (120mm vs 130mm) on the GR300 vs Revolt to have a slightly more relaxed setup when I'm not racing. My first gravel bike was an aluminum Revolt. It's a great way to dip a toe in the water, but I would swap the tires immediately. The rubber that it comes with is terrible.
instead of "Gravelbikes" i do have 29er Hardtails - a carbon and a titanium one. I consider your aspects on framematerial 100% , but as i am 53 age i would keep the titanium if i only could have ONE bike. I have a titanium Road Bike as well - ROAD PEDALS are an absolute MUST HAVE on a Road bike for me. Is it that you only do Ultra long Rides with your Road Bike ?.... that you can step in a shop or coffe bar more easy ? Anyway a S Works "tarmac" with Mtb pedals seems realy strange.....best regards and wishes for you....
I don't see the value in running different shoe/cleat setups on different bikes when SPD works so well. While SPD were originally designed for MTB use, there are several road focused pedals available. Wrote a longer look at it here: www.mamilian.bike/blog/2020/03/one-cleat-to-rule-them-all
Man, just wanted to say thanks for a great video! This is the best video I have seen on YT about this subject and I didn’t have to listen to annoying music in the background to learn haha Could you weigh in on a personal debate I’m having as you seem to process similarly to me when it comes to riding? Im 26 and am currently on a 2015 Giant Propel Advanced 2 with Roval CLX 60s. I’m on too small of a frame (I’m 5’ 7 and it’s an XS😝) and get fatigued by about mile 35 usually. I LOVE going fast on it though and feel like it’s very capable for what it is. I mostly ride solo usually 25-50 miles at a time at a 17.5-19mph pace and raced in college however now find myself interested in gravel, although living in Dallas most of my riding would lean towards road still as I really enjoy that (85% is my guess). I have signed up for Gravel Locos next year and plan to do more like Big Sugar / other NWA rides and am processing whether to buy a cheaper gravel bike like a Revolt Advanced 3 and keep my Propel to trade in for a TCR in the future OR trade in the Propel along with my Specialized Fuse and combine that money to get the 2022 Revolt Advanced 1 and get a Zipp 303s wheelset with 28mm tires. The second sounds really appealing to get a electronic shifting and have one really good bike but my concern is that I would lose the ability to go really fast still (or at least fast to me) and feel like I’m on a sluggish bike. I love to bomb descents and can keep up in groups that average a 20-22 pace so wondering if I could still do so with minor adjustments like a bigger chainring up front but nothing huge? If any of this makes sense I would love to hear your recs based on my situation based off your experience with a Tarmac and Revolt in the same garage? Thanks so much!
I'm not surprised that the Propel is fatiguing. It's really fast, but prioritizes aero over compliance. In a friendly group, you would be fine on a gravel bike with endurance-ish geometry, but if it's more competitive group ride, a lighter/more aero/more responsive geometry would definitely come in handy (same answer for bombing descents). Looking at the geometry difference b/w a TCR and the 2022 Revolt in short flip orientation (bikeinsights.com/compare?geometries=61842bb4218e22001c360066,608bb6431df88f001d45ff3d,) these bikes will handle very differently. You can certainly do it with one bike and two wheelsets (although I would consider cheaper wheels than Zipp, I love my Farsports), there will be lots of tradeoffs. It's also worth considering that gravel is really hard on components. This is why I don't run electronic parts on my gravel bikes. Personally, I would run two bikes for the different disciplines and optimize around that, but obviously that requires more budget than having a single bike with two wheelsets. Hope that helps.
@@Mamilian Andrew, just wanted to circle back to your comment as I promised myself I would do when my decision was made and I had a new bike under me. Your counsel was extremely helpful and out of all of the informative videos on comparing the two different disciplines bikes on RUclips, yours was the most helpful along with your comment. Thank you for taking to time to help me process that. With that said, I am very happy to share that I ended up going with the TCR Advanced Pro 1. I have 3 rides on it so far and couldn’t be more excited and glad o chose this bike. I know I would have missed the speed for sure and love how versatile the bike still is. I really think my next bike will be a gravel bike though and this bike suits my current riding style way better. Thank you again and safe riding🤙🏽
@@michaelsegalo7284 Hi Michael. I bought L size and I think this way is better. You will have more possibility to adjust the height of your stem if you want more comfort...
I’m know weight weenie, being that I’m a Clydesdale…..but how much does your GR300 weigh? I own a Lynskey Peleton that I bought many years ago but never rode it. Instead I put 2.5K on my fat bike doing gravel rides, quite silly yes I know.
As someone who owns a Revolt and is debating a titanium Lynsky or Litespeed this video was extremely helpful.
Thank you for this video. I've been eyeing the GR300, but I see lots of accounts of it feeling sluggish, despite having the same geometry as the Revolt. This kind of confirms it. Would love a Ti bike, but seems like the Revolt is the way to go.
Thanks for sharing your experience with these two. I found it really useful.
I'm looking for a ti gravel bike with no toe overlap. So far the Lynskey Chilhowee seems to fit the bill but not a fan of it's helix down tube. The GR300 is more my style but appears to still have overlap 😢
FWIW, even on twisting single track, I haven't found the toe overlap to be a problem on the GR300. More a thing to be managed. It is definitely a thing though, so if you're doing really technical stuff this probably isn't the right bike.
I have one route near me that's a fire road with steep switchbacks. I always catch my toes :(
@@phenoge 👍
Amazing bike .
Are you experiencing any toe overlap on GR300 and what size tires and crank size you are using.
Sorry, I missed this. I haven't had that problem with 175mm cranks and 45mm tires, but it would be also dependent on cleat position.
Thank you, this video was super helpful in comparing a racing gravel bike (revolt) and a more comfortable/leisurely one (Lynksey GR300). I am looking for a high-performance titanium gravel bike (not really for racing) for about 50% road riding (up and down hilly pavement roads) and 50% gravel riding (fire-roads, single tracks with some uphill riding on those gravel roads) that will last me a long time. I'd also like to put on a rear rack for a child seat to take my 2-year old on rides with me from time to time. I'm 200 lbs and my 2-year old is about 25 lbs right now (she'll probably increase in weight to up to 35 lbs by the end of the year), and I want to make sure the bike can accommodate both of our weights when I take her on rides with me.
total weight and my physical dimensions below:
total weight: between 200-235 lbs (200 lb for me, and 25-35 lbs for child)
Height: 191cm
Wingspan: 187cm
Shoulder width: 44cm
Inseam: 83cm
I know I want a 58 cm frameset given my above dimensions, but can't decide which bike on the following shortlist is best given my goals and dimensions. I realize that I'm limited by the fact that these bikes are custom built, and so I cannot try them out beforehand. But if the better bike is one that is ordered, I'll take the chance.
1. Bearclaw Titanium Thunderhawk frameset (one with titanium fork or carbon fork)
2. Thomson Piedmont frameset
3. Linskey Pro GR/GR500 Gravel bike frameset.
I plan to add a low-gearing (i.e., 2x-something) Shimano GRX groupset to them, and make whatever additional mods needed for comfort.
Which one should I choose, and if Lynskey, what's really the difference between the GR300, GR500 and GR PRO?
Thank you in advance.
Lee
I can't really speak to the Bearclaw or Thomson frames since I've never had the chance to really look at in-depth or ride them. The main reason I went with the Lynskey was because of its value. Lynskey runs sales all the time (current offer is 15% off), so I was able to get the internal frameset for $1800.
The main difference between the GR300 and the GR Pro is that the PRO has a diamond shaped top & down tubes (IIRC, R500 has the same thing). The PRO also has dropped seat stays and uses a different Ti alloy blend (3AL-2.5V vs 6AL-4V).
3AL-2.5V (GR300) should be more compliant because 6AL-4V (PRO) is a stiffer material (maybe why they dropped the seat stays, which should increase compliance), and in theory should weigh more (although Lynskey claims the same weight for both frames in L). My goal with the GR300 was to get a bullet-proof bike with a comfortable ride. Something that I didn't mind riding over the winter, and could be locked to a signpost without worrying if it would get damaged.
Your questions around weight are probably best addressed with the frame builder. I can't imagine that a Ti bike (any Ti bike) wouldn't be able to support massive loads (well over 240lb), but it's not something I have ever researched. I worked with Jordan at Lynskey, he's a great guy, very helpful, I'm sure he would be able to answer any questions around rack fit and weights (or tell who there can if he can't).
LMK what you decide, and how it works out.
@@Mamilian Thank you for getting back to me on this and for clarity on the difference between the PRO and the GR300 with respect to blend of Ti and seat stays. It sounds like the total weight I'm expecting to put on the bike won't be a problem which is comforting, because that was one of the reasons I am considering titanium gravel bikes. I did call Lynskey earlier today but no answer before closing, so left message on Alex's voicemail. If I ordered the GR300 frameset to then build out, do you have experience with the turnaround time to get it in the mail? I live in Los Angeles, Ca, so if coming from TN and/or on back order , then not sure it will be quick. However, if not a quick turnaround do you have insight into whether a local bike shop in Ca would have this frameset brand new?
If it turns out that it will take a long time to arrive, I will consider a Thomson or Bearclaw Thunderhawk frame instead if they will be quicker. But, I'm concerned about Thomson, since I haven't seen enough about how reliable/durable/well-performing it is in discussion forums or on the internet. It was recommended by several individuals in a good local bike shop in my area.
Thank you,
Lee
@@emceeaye Turn around on the frame will depend on a lot of factors. Definitely something you'll want to nail down with whoever you go with. IIRC, it took ~2 months for me to get my frame, but that was pre-vaccine COVID (last fall), so they were following spacing protocols that shouldn't apply currently.
Interesting video, I would lover to see more comparison between carbon vs ti road bikes. I have a 2015 carbon roadbike (rim brake) and canyon grizl gravel bike and im looking to upgrade to roadbike. I mostly want a responisve quick bike but cant make up my mind. Do you think Ti is too heavy/unresponsive for my needs? Or would a Ti roadbike with more aggresive geometry also do the trick for me? by the way, the orange bartape looks cool.
Responsiveness is mostly a function of geometry, but there is something to the weight and material as well. The geometry of the Revolt and GR300 isn't that different, but the Revolt is more responsive and frisky, the GR300 is more stable. Neither is anywhere close to how quick the Tarmac is; you don't even have to think about placing it. It just teleports where you want it to be, but on the other had I wouldn't want to do a technical gravel descent on it :D. Personally, I don't think I would shop Ti for road, given my preferences in a road bike (fast, frisky, nimble, sharp, stiff, etc). But there absolutely is a place for it if you want something a little smoother, a little more stable, etc. You might be able to get all of that with the right Ti tubes, geometry, welding, etc., but I think it will be harder to get there than if you bought a carbon race bike. Matching endurance road, is probably very possible with the right frame.
Thank you for this upload. I have a TCR and recently the idea of on gravel bike is floating around. I was thinking of Revolt Aluminum (testing the water so to speak) to test out.. Ultimately I know I want a titanium bike.
Question.
Is your riding setup the same for the road bike and grave bike the same?
The setup on my gravel and road bikes is roughly the same except for things like drop (which I commented on in the video). I do run a slightly shorter (120mm vs 130mm) on the GR300 vs Revolt to have a slightly more relaxed setup when I'm not racing.
My first gravel bike was an aluminum Revolt. It's a great way to dip a toe in the water, but I would swap the tires immediately. The rubber that it comes with is terrible.
@@Mamilian Thank you so much for your prompt response.
instead of "Gravelbikes" i do have 29er Hardtails - a carbon and a titanium one. I consider your aspects on framematerial 100% , but as i am 53 age i would keep the titanium if i only could have ONE bike.
I have a titanium Road Bike as well - ROAD PEDALS are an absolute MUST HAVE on a Road bike for me. Is it that you only do Ultra long Rides with your Road Bike ?.... that you can step in a shop or coffe bar more easy ? Anyway a S Works "tarmac" with Mtb pedals seems realy strange.....best regards and wishes for you....
I don't see the value in running different shoe/cleat setups on different bikes when SPD works so well. While SPD were originally designed for MTB use, there are several road focused pedals available.
Wrote a longer look at it here:
www.mamilian.bike/blog/2020/03/one-cleat-to-rule-them-all
Man, just wanted to say thanks for a great video! This is the best video I have seen on YT about this subject and I didn’t have to listen to annoying music in the background to learn haha
Could you weigh in on a personal debate I’m having as you seem to process similarly to me when it comes to riding?
Im 26 and am currently on a 2015 Giant Propel Advanced 2 with Roval CLX 60s. I’m on too small of a frame (I’m 5’ 7 and it’s an XS😝) and get fatigued by about mile 35 usually. I LOVE going fast on it though and feel like it’s very capable for what it is. I mostly ride solo usually 25-50 miles at a time at a 17.5-19mph pace and raced in college however now find myself interested in gravel, although living in Dallas most of my riding would lean towards road still as I really enjoy that (85% is my guess). I have signed up for Gravel Locos next year and plan to do more like Big Sugar / other NWA rides and am processing whether to buy a cheaper gravel bike like a Revolt Advanced 3 and keep my Propel to trade in for a TCR in the future OR trade in the Propel along with my Specialized Fuse and combine that money to get the 2022 Revolt Advanced 1 and get a Zipp 303s wheelset with 28mm tires. The second sounds really appealing to get a electronic shifting and have one really good bike but my concern is that I would lose the ability to go really fast still (or at least fast to me) and feel like I’m on a sluggish bike. I love to bomb descents and can keep up in groups that average a 20-22 pace so wondering if I could still do so with minor adjustments like a bigger chainring up front but nothing huge?
If any of this makes sense I would love to hear your recs based on my situation based off your experience with a Tarmac and Revolt in the same garage? Thanks so much!
I'm not surprised that the Propel is fatiguing. It's really fast, but prioritizes aero over compliance. In a friendly group, you would be fine on a gravel bike with endurance-ish geometry, but if it's more competitive group ride, a lighter/more aero/more responsive geometry would definitely come in handy (same answer for bombing descents).
Looking at the geometry difference b/w a TCR and the 2022 Revolt in short flip orientation (bikeinsights.com/compare?geometries=61842bb4218e22001c360066,608bb6431df88f001d45ff3d,) these bikes will handle very differently.
You can certainly do it with one bike and two wheelsets (although I would consider cheaper wheels than Zipp, I love my Farsports), there will be lots of tradeoffs. It's also worth considering that gravel is really hard on components. This is why I don't run electronic parts on my gravel bikes. Personally, I would run two bikes for the different disciplines and optimize around that, but obviously that requires more budget than having a single bike with two wheelsets. Hope that helps.
@@Mamilian Andrew, just wanted to circle back to your comment as I promised myself I would do when my decision was made and I had a new bike under me. Your counsel was extremely helpful and out of all of the informative videos on comparing the two different disciplines bikes on RUclips, yours was the most helpful along with your comment. Thank you for taking to time to help me process that.
With that said, I am very happy to share that I ended up going with the TCR Advanced Pro 1. I have 3 rides on it so far and couldn’t be more excited and glad o chose this bike. I know I would have missed the speed for sure and love how versatile the bike still is. I really think my next bike will be a gravel bike though and this bike suits my current riding style way better. Thank you again and safe riding🤙🏽
@@danielkatani612 Congrats on the new bike!
Hello. What is the lynskey frame size ? How tall are you ?
And what is your bb-saddle height ? I'm 185cm and I hesitate with ML or L...
It's a L, I'm 187cm. BB-> saddle is 799mm. You could probably do either size.
Thank you !!!@@Mamilian
@@franckbertuzzi3632 I’m debating the exact same thing. Did you pick one up and which size did you go with?
@@michaelsegalo7284 Hi Michael. I bought L size and I think this way is better. You will have more possibility to adjust the height of your stem if you want more comfort...
What bar tape are you using on the three bikes? Looks the same across the board. Building a GR300 currently. Thanks in advance.
Fizik Tempo Bondcush Soft - www.fizik.com/us_en/tempo-microtex-bondcush-soft.html. I really like it, as you can probably guess :).
I’m know weight weenie, being that I’m a Clydesdale…..but how much does your GR300 weigh? I own a Lynskey Peleton that I bought many years ago but never rode it. Instead I put 2.5K on my fat bike doing gravel rides, quite silly yes I know.
Last time I weighed it, 9.39kg with pedals and cages.
@@Mamilian That’s not bad at all, thanks for the quick reply.
Especially because I put very little effort into optimizing for weight.
You are clearly a fan of orange bar tape )). Thanks for the vid. I'm pulling my hair off now trying to decide if I want to go ti or stick with carbon.
I've done the research. Orange is the fastest bar tape :D.
Heh. Heh. He said "Breaking wind"