Man I love your videos! To hear someone who REALLY knows the specs, capabilities, and pros and cons of each battery system, with no bs, is really refreshing 👌 PW3 is a beast, for sure. Any word on when the dc expansion units are available, and also the remote meter system for the Gateway3, to allow partial home backup and sync with smart tarrifs? Keep up your videos, they are essential in the RUclips swamp of late. Cheers, Mick
Thanks so much for the kind words. I have yet to see the DC expansion units hit the shelves, but the Tesla Remote Meter is currently available and they are transitioning to the Gateway 3 as the only choice.
This is by a huge margin, the best explanation I have seen on how Powerwalls, and in particular, the powerwall 3 works. I can't tell you how many 20 minute videos on RUclips I've come across that tell me nothing more than the bold text on the Tesla website - which only takes 5 minutes to read. I really hope my installer is as well informed as you. On my next phone call, I'll now have lots of intelligent questions for him. FYI - installing Solar in CA is just plain awful. Powewalls need to be spaced 3 feet from any door or window, 3 feet from a gas line, and here's the killer - 3 feet from each other. You need a pretty big, windowless house to install more than one or two Powerwalls. The utility only buys back at 7 cents per kwh. But charges 60 cents peak, and 24 cents off peak. You basically need to be 100% grid independent.
Yes, the International Fire Codes can be a pain in the butt to abide by, and some homes just flat out aren't eligible for a battery when the AHJs don't allow any wiggle room. LA County is about the worst when it comes to that. They are one of a few AHJs out in CA that do not recognize the UL9540A testing that allows these batteries to be stacked closer than 3 feet apart even though the battery manufacturers have shown it is perfectly safe to do so. Unfortunately if you live in one of those areas, you drew the short stick. Thanks so much for the kind words!
This is a great video! Thanks for putting this information out. I am ready to install solar and having well presented information like this is so helpful!
The "dude trust me it is LFP" IS strange. One can speculate that they want the freedom to use different batteries based on what is available and cost-effective and that they have designed the electronics to be flexible and to work with a few different options. LFP is a selling point in itself, but one can speculate that they don't want to hint that their previous house batteries are bad or unsafe. And they don't seem to be. The news would be full of it if Tesla Powerwalls were exploding in people's houses. Anyway, I trust the "dude" here. Seems to know his stuff, and has a good beard. All good. 😁
I agree, sometimes I think the "thermal runaway" issue is just a sales tactic from other manufacturers pushing LFP. I never really hear of Lithium Ion batteries catching on fire, and if they were really that dangerous, they would be recalled or not allowed to be used in EVs and in people's homes. They have all passed very stringent 9540A testing requirements to get through International Fire Codes. That being said, the additional cycles and lower rate of degradation out of LFP is the selling point for me personally. It is very strange that the battery chemistry is not shown on the datasheet though. Not really sure what to think about that to be honest.
I suspect they don’t Talk about it because they still want to sell their old power wall 2 units, as well. Talking up the threes LPF leads to awkward discussions about the twos battery Chemistry
well done, I've heard many of the new solar panels have the ability to get shaded and not hurt the rest of the string, even without optimizers or inverters.
Yes, solar panels have come a long way over the years. Depending on the bussing inside the solar panels and the orientation of the panels, shading may or may not be a big issue. Most solar panels have bypass diodes to mitigate shading issues, but in general, if you have lots of shading issues, some good ole microinverters or optimizers are difficult to beat. Thanks for watching!
Looks like a great battery and it comes with a 6 string inverter! I was thinking of getting micro inverters for our apartment but if I can save money and still have just the battery and a gateway in the garage then I'm happy. Good to see they have rapid shut downs.
Adding 2 PW3 to my existing Enphase PV system. Would not give up my individual panel monitoring. But the PW3 is a lot of bang for the buck. Installed after all credits and utility rebates OTD for $19K. My second PW3 is the Expansion unit. I'll have the best of both worlds.
A great video, thanks for taking the time to put all of these new features and capabilities of the Powerwall 3 on a video. Perhaps the single biggest and in my view most important, features is that huge peak power capability. I live in the desert and have two AC units. For everyone else's inverters operating in backup mode, something has to be done to prevent the inverter from shutting down and going off line if both AC compressors start up at the same time, particularly if the OAT is over 100 degrees! I also have couple of quick comments / questions. On the mid circuit interrupters, in round numbers solar panels put out around 50 volts around midday, two in series output lethal voltage, so wouldn't the mid circuit interrupters need to be placed on each panel, not on every two or three? At least according to the Fire Dept. where I live there shouldn't be any lethal voltages when the system is in rapid shut down. You also said that you would have to buy enough Powerwall 3 units to power the whole home during backup. Doesn't it have any sort of load management / load shed capability? It seems that a good portion of the competing manufacturers either have automatic load management or are working on it. I would like to see another video on the Tesla App and in particular how it interacts with the Powerwall 3.
Thanks for watching @HerbertHerbGlum and you have some great questions! For the mid circuit interrupters you have a great point. I did some research and all I could find is that an MCI needs to be connected between no more than 165A of operating voltage, but like you said, that should technically be plenty enough to kill someone. It may be because that voltage is isolated within the array boundary, so a firefighter could still cut into the circuit between the solar panels and the PW3 and be completely isolated from that dangerous voltage. Tesla does not have any load shedding capabilities. They seem to be getting rid of all of the bells and whistles and just shooting for the lowest cost system/highest output battery. You could however pair this with the Tesla Backup Gateway 2 for partial home backup, or you could install it alongside a SPAN Smart Panel to intelligently manage your loads during an outage. SPAN and PW3 recently achieved compatibility status, which makes them a great combo.
Temperature limits are kind of restrictive for much of the US during extreme weather events. In much of the midwest and most of the mountain west there are nights where that -4 can easily be exceeded. As well in states like Texas, Arizona and Florida you can easily exceed 122F in direct sunlight.
Agreed. Between temperature limitations, building codes, and fire codes, it can make an energy storage project quite the challenge. Thanks for watching.
Awesome video! Clears up qiestions after your BG3 video. And many ither questions. Like and subscribe! Only thing missing was VTH and VTG, VTX. Hoping this is all included at some point. Have Cybertruck soon which includes paid for 3V gateway. There are enormous advantages to having PW3 in system. 3V gateway will be PW3 compatible at some point, but not now. Tesla said that I could do 3V gateway now, but would require special support for commisioning to disable 3V site controller. They recommend I instal BG2/3 or Backup Switch instead. Any thoughts about which gateway to go with? Mostly concearned about future compatability with VTH and VTG.
Hi @bluedrew it is really tough for me to give any advice on this subject, as I am not an expert in this area, but it does appear that on Tesla's website it does show it paired with PW3 and the backup switch. I think the decision would be more based on your home loads. If you want to purchase a PW3, back up your entire home, and you are willing to wait a few more weeks/months for the GW3 to hit the shelves, the GW3 would probably be the better choice just because it is slightly less expensive. But again, I have no experience with bi-directional Tesla charging, so until I got my hands on an installation manual and some datasheets, it is a tough call.
Excellent video...I looked at your service area map. I'm in Georgia which you don't service....can you recommend anyone in Georgia given your years of experience in the business. Thanks
17:00 The Tesla backup switch, eliminates relocating loads to a Backup Load Center. If there’s not enough space in the main panel for the PW3 breaker a generation load center might be needed. 20:05 The PW3 can work with a Generac backup. Main panel, Gateway, Generac breaker in Gateway, then Generac relay, then Backup Load Center.
Absolutely. In that configuration the generator would not be capable of charing the battery though. It would be first line of defense(solar/batteries) and second line of defense(generator). In my opinion, if you have a fossil fuel powered generator, it is usually best to pair it with a system that can integrate the two power sources all into one system, but that is just a personal opinion. Thanks for watching!
Great video. I’m still a bit frustrated with all generations of Powerwalls. They are far too expensive for most homeowners. I was recently quoted a price of $1,000 or so per kWh installed. To go off grid, keep power through the winter, and top off an EV at night, the average homeowner will need at least 50 kWh of storage? To actually disrupt the electric utility cartels, battery storage will need to drop by about 80%.
Batteries are certainly the most expensive part of an solar energy storage system. They have come a long way in the last 10 years and the industry is constantly innovating while prices continue to drop. But yes, the average American home is thirsty for energy and replacing the grid entirely is not an easy feat. Thanks for watching!
I think the solution is to store as much energy as possible as heat (and cool, and even gravity) rather than electricity. While this is very hard to retrofit, it’s a travesty it’s not acknowledged in the relevant codes. Of course, a whole system design like this will prioritize efficiency as well. If it were up to me, I’d make it a requirement for new builds, but don’t consider myself an autocrat, just a pragmatist.
@freeheeler09 You don’t go off-grid without VERY aggressive improvement of the efficiency in electricity usage. That typically, because of how sloppy typical construction practices are, means making the choice at the time of house construction. Otherwise it requires major renovation & device/appliance replacement
Great question. As far as I am aware, they don't support off grid applications. I think it would likely void the warranty if the system was not connected to the grid and internet.
Optimizers could be used in conjunction with the Powerwall 3 correct? That is no different from when solar PV with optimizers sent DC to a standalone inverter and from there to a battery (if you had one). Thanks for the details and the clrificaion on LFP batteries. Looking forward to some future videos of installations with the Gateway 3. We don't have the same meters here in the UK, so it would be Gateway3. Good video, thanks.
Hi @grahamastor4194 Tesla does not provide any guidance about any way to use 3rd party optimizers on their system. Hypothetically you would think there would be a way to rig them up, but I assume you would be voiding the system warranty if you found a way to do that successfully. I would think if you wanted to use optimizers you would have to AC couple a different solar system with the Powerwall 3, but that would also cause you to loose the benefits of that DC coupled architecture of the all in one Powerwall 3 system. Thanks so much for the kind words and for watching the channel!
How about an install on a house that already has solar but no storage? Is there a way to install a PW3 so it charges off excess solar during the day and runs the house in the evening/night, without tying into the current solar system?
Absolutely. The Powerwall 3 recently was approved for "AC coupling" which is exactly what you are talking about. It basically tricks a grid tied only inverter into thinking the grid is operating and uses a CT clamp to monitor the PV output to charge the batteries accordingly.
Can me and a couple other neighbors string these things together. So that we could share the 30 KW of PV. Now that would be an interesting microgrid. Seems like the redundancy would be nice.
You can certainly stack multiple PW3s and multiple solar arrays together, but most AHJs and utilities would not allow neighbors to share solar arrays and batteries. In general it is one system per utility meter, so if each person has their own meter, they would each need their own individual system. That being said, shared community solar is a growing trend that I am not an expert on.
Thank you for sharing all this information. You show the PW3 landing on the LC. But doesn't that require a derating of the main LC breaker for that much backfeed on the bus? And if you have multiple PW's, the backfeed current gets crazy fast. Shouldn't those land on the GW3 to control the total current on the LC bus? I rarely hear about the desire to NOT derate the main breaker. And second question: Just what is this mysterious "remote meter?"
Absolutely a good point. It really depends on the bus rating and main breaker rating, but yes, in most cases when using the Gateway, the PW3 breakers will land in the internal panel board in the Gateway. Depending on whether you are using the GW2 or GW3, and some other site conditions, there can sometimes be an advantage of landing the PWs in a downstream sub panel, but in most cases not. The PW3 would have a 60A backfed breaker rating so it would not be compatible for a breaker connection on most existing electrical equipment. In the Tesla GW2 they had two meters....the primary meter X and the secondary meter Y. In some cases even these meters were not sufficient to deal with certain on site conditions, in which case you would need to add a Neurio Meter. This is especially the case when there are non-backed up loads upstream of the GW2 or if there are multiple PV or battery systems on site. From what I understand Tesla is not building out the compatibility between the Neurio Meter and the PW3, so the mysterious "Tesla Remote Meter" is taking the place of both the secondary meter Y and the Neurio Meter. That is about all I know about it until I can get my hands on some datasheets and installation manuals when it comes out. Thanks for watching!
That is correct, PW3 does have panel level PCS if your jurisdiction and utility allows it's use. Unlike many of it's competitors, the PW3 does not curtail the system performance in order to accomplish this, which is great. Thanks for watching!
when the dc expansion packs come out, is it possible to add just that to enphase panel system ? or do we need the pw3 and the dc pack can only be added to an existing pw3 ?
Why would different strings need to face the same direction? PW3 has 6MPPT connectors. Wouldn't each string wired to different MPPT's not care which way the other one is faceing?
Correct. As long as all panels on the same string are oriented the same way, you are good to go. You just want to avoid putting opposite oriented modules on the same string. Thanks for watching!
No idea, but you can always get a quote directly from me. We generally are pretty competitive with the prices that Tesla charges on turn key installations.Thanks for watching!
Overpriced and impossible to buy you can order one but when you'll get it no one knows meanwhile I have zero electricity. Tried getting a powerwall in 2016 & again in 2020. Ther are better cheaper and actually available to purchase today rather than order and pray it comes someday
Hi @russbritt4100. I remember the days of having customers waiting for years on the Powerwall 1 after paying a deposit to be put on the list, and certainly there were some supply issues on Powerwall 2 at times, but both Powerwall 2 and Powerwall 3 are now widely available in the U.S. without any delays. We are installing them in 23 states across the U.S. as we speak. Thanks for watching!
This may sound like a strange question, but if I get a Powerwall 3, do I no longer need a whole house surge protector like an Intermatic? IOW does the Tesla gateway handle surges from the grid or will an additional whole house surge protector be beneficial? I live in central Texas and and we're getting some weird blackouts , brownouts...and surges where some breakers get flipped.
Most people only have a sub-panel controlled by the Powerwall. If that’s the case, it will not help in that regard. Basically, you would have to have it set to power your house directly, with a grid backup. This will cost you greatly by having this huge (Powerwall) capacity, and taking an efficiency hit for every kWh you consume.
Hi @VishalRaoOnRUclips I would always suggest having an external whole house surge arrestor. They are now required by code to protect sensitive electronics such as ground fault circuit interrupters and arc fault circuit interrupters. Most can easily connect through a circuit breaker in your main service panel and only cost about $100-$200. That is much cheaper than replacing a bunch of sensitive electronics. As far as I am aware the Tesla Gateway does not contain any additional surge protection. Now if the grid is unstable and the voltage or frequency goes out of tolerance, the Tesla system will sense that and disconnect from the grid until it is stable again, but a true surge can come through in milliseconds and really do some damage if you aren't protected.
Hi @rogerwhite5022. Unfortunately at this time I cannot offer any turn key systems in Tennessee whatsoever. Right now I am an independent energy consultant for one of the largest solar installation platforms in the US and I can offer turn key installations in 23 out of the 50 states. We are constantly expanding but this is the list as of 5/28/2024. Thank you for watching the channel! Arizona California Colorado Connecticut Delaware Florida Hawaii Idaho Illinois Massachusetts Maryland North Carolina New Jersey New Mexico Nevada Ohio Pennsylvania Puerto Rico South Carolina Texas Utah Virginia West Virginia
Why not just use smart outlets to control low priority loads? Even a dozen of these would cost next to nothing compared to the cost of a smart panel plus installation. Plus many homes are not wired to breakers in a logical enough fashion to come close to the granular control of smart outlets.
If your utility company allows the use of the Backup Switch and you are buying a whole home backup system, then the Backup Switch is the way to go. Unfortunately the vast majority of utilities in the U.S. have not yet approved it's use in which case you would have to revert to either the Tesla Backup Gateway 2 or 3.
Gateway 3 has that sub panel. Might allow for easier and cheaper wiring to a charger and the PW3 itself. That's an advantage for me. My main panel is at back of garage. Putting PW3 there not a good idea (car can crash into it). For me better to have BG3 on side of house along with PW3 and short cable run to a new UWC.
@@bluedrewtotally in your case that makes sense. I live in AZ where we have combo meter panels where the back up switch is great because you don’t have to rewire a whole panel to install the gateway.
To my knowledge, no. I don't believe Tesla has developed a DC:DC EV charger. The SolarEdge Smart EV Charger is the only product I am aware of that can do that.
Hi @edgardorodriguez, following back up on this question. At this time you cannot combine PW2 and PW3 into one system. I am not sure if that is something Tesla plans on releasing in the future or not.
"Dragging the string down" is an old problem, i advice you to check this real test comparing the shading of panels. ruclips.net/video/TYok2dtuYKY/видео.html
Understood. It is definitely less of an issue with the newer solar panels and bypass diodes, but still can be an issue depending on configuration and shading. Thanks for watching.
I do not know Joe, but honestly he was an inspiration for me to start my own RUclips channel. I am one of his subscribers and watch most of his videos. I like to keep tabs on what all of the solar RUclipsrs are up to. Thanks for watching and for the comment sir!
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Man I love your videos! To hear someone who REALLY knows the specs, capabilities, and pros and cons of each battery system, with no bs, is really refreshing 👌
PW3 is a beast, for sure. Any word on when the dc expansion units are available, and also the remote meter system for the Gateway3, to allow partial home backup and sync with smart tarrifs?
Keep up your videos, they are essential in the RUclips swamp of late.
Cheers, Mick
Thanks so much for the kind words. I have yet to see the DC expansion units hit the shelves, but the Tesla Remote Meter is currently available and they are transitioning to the Gateway 3 as the only choice.
Had my Powerwall 3 for a week now. Quite happy so far
Glad to hear it. Keep us updated. Thanks for watching!
This is by a huge margin, the best explanation I have seen on how Powerwalls, and in particular, the powerwall 3 works. I can't tell you how many 20 minute videos on RUclips I've come across that tell me nothing more than the bold text on the Tesla website - which only takes 5 minutes to read. I really hope my installer is as well informed as you. On my next phone call, I'll now have lots of intelligent questions for him. FYI - installing Solar in CA is just plain awful. Powewalls need to be spaced 3 feet from any door or window, 3 feet from a gas line, and here's the killer - 3 feet from each other. You need a pretty big, windowless house to install more than one or two Powerwalls. The utility only buys back at 7 cents per kwh. But charges 60 cents peak, and 24 cents off peak. You basically need to be 100% grid independent.
Yes, the International Fire Codes can be a pain in the butt to abide by, and some homes just flat out aren't eligible for a battery when the AHJs don't allow any wiggle room. LA County is about the worst when it comes to that. They are one of a few AHJs out in CA that do not recognize the UL9540A testing that allows these batteries to be stacked closer than 3 feet apart even though the battery manufacturers have shown it is perfectly safe to do so. Unfortunately if you live in one of those areas, you drew the short stick. Thanks so much for the kind words!
Really great video. Been in solar for 20 years and learned a lot.
Glad it was helpful! Thanks for the kind words.
This is a great video!
Thanks for putting this information out.
I am ready to install solar and having well presented information like this is so helpful!
Glad to hear it. Thanks for watching the channel!
The "dude trust me it is LFP" IS strange. One can speculate that they want the freedom to use different batteries based on what is available and cost-effective and that they have designed the electronics to be flexible and to work with a few different options. LFP is a selling point in itself, but one can speculate that they don't want to hint that their previous house batteries are bad or unsafe. And they don't seem to be. The news would be full of it if Tesla Powerwalls were exploding in people's houses. Anyway, I trust the "dude" here. Seems to know his stuff, and has a good beard. All good. 😁
I agree, sometimes I think the "thermal runaway" issue is just a sales tactic from other manufacturers pushing LFP. I never really hear of Lithium Ion batteries catching on fire, and if they were really that dangerous, they would be recalled or not allowed to be used in EVs and in people's homes. They have all passed very stringent 9540A testing requirements to get through International Fire Codes. That being said, the additional cycles and lower rate of degradation out of LFP is the selling point for me personally. It is very strange that the battery chemistry is not shown on the datasheet though. Not really sure what to think about that to be honest.
I suspect they don’t Talk about it because they still want to sell their old power wall 2 units, as well. Talking up the threes LPF leads to awkward discussions about the twos battery Chemistry
very informative presentation, please do a video on the various configurations of Tesla powerwall 3, Tesla powershare and Span panel
Great feedback. I will add it to the list. Thanks for watching!
well done, I've heard many of the new solar panels have the ability to get shaded and not hurt the rest of the string, even without optimizers or inverters.
Yes, solar panels have come a long way over the years. Depending on the bussing inside the solar panels and the orientation of the panels, shading may or may not be a big issue. Most solar panels have bypass diodes to mitigate shading issues, but in general, if you have lots of shading issues, some good ole microinverters or optimizers are difficult to beat. Thanks for watching!
Thank you! Very helpful and easy to understand. Love the Pro and Cons explanation and examples given. 👍👍👍
@haroldsvoyage8912 Thanks for the kind words and for watching!
Looks like a great battery and it comes with a 6 string inverter! I was thinking of getting micro inverters for our apartment but if I can save money and still have just the battery and a gateway in the garage then I'm happy. Good to see they have rapid shut downs.
It does save you some cash if you can sacrifice that module level monitoring. Thanks for watching!
Adding 2 PW3 to my existing Enphase PV system. Would not give up my individual panel monitoring. But the PW3 is a lot of bang for the buck. Installed after all credits and utility rebates OTD for $19K. My second PW3 is the Expansion unit. I'll have the best of both worlds.
That is certainly possible now with the Powerwall 3 combined with the Backup Gateway 2 for AC coupling. Thanks for watching!
A great video, thanks for taking the time to put all of these new features and capabilities of the Powerwall 3 on a video. Perhaps the single biggest and in my view most important, features is that huge peak power capability. I live in the desert and have two AC units. For everyone else's inverters operating in backup mode, something has to be done to prevent the inverter from shutting down and going off line if both AC compressors start up at the same time, particularly if the OAT is over 100 degrees! I also have couple of quick comments / questions. On the mid circuit interrupters, in round numbers solar panels put out around 50 volts around midday, two in series output lethal voltage, so wouldn't the mid circuit interrupters need to be placed on each panel, not on every two or three? At least according to the Fire Dept. where I live there shouldn't be any lethal voltages when the system is in rapid shut down. You also said that you would have to buy enough Powerwall 3 units to power the whole home during backup. Doesn't it have any sort of load management / load shed capability? It seems that a good portion of the competing manufacturers either have automatic load management or are working on it. I would like to see another video on the Tesla App and in particular how it interacts with the Powerwall 3.
Thanks for watching @HerbertHerbGlum and you have some great questions! For the mid circuit interrupters you have a great point. I did some research and all I could find is that an MCI needs to be connected between no more than 165A of operating voltage, but like you said, that should technically be plenty enough to kill someone. It may be because that voltage is isolated within the array boundary, so a firefighter could still cut into the circuit between the solar panels and the PW3 and be completely isolated from that dangerous voltage.
Tesla does not have any load shedding capabilities. They seem to be getting rid of all of the bells and whistles and just shooting for the lowest cost system/highest output battery. You could however pair this with the Tesla Backup Gateway 2 for partial home backup, or you could install it alongside a SPAN Smart Panel to intelligently manage your loads during an outage. SPAN and PW3 recently achieved compatibility status, which makes them a great combo.
Temperature limits are kind of restrictive for much of the US during extreme weather events. In much of the midwest and most of the mountain west there are nights where that -4 can easily be exceeded. As well in states like Texas, Arizona and Florida you can easily exceed 122F in direct sunlight.
Agreed. Between temperature limitations, building codes, and fire codes, it can make an energy storage project quite the challenge. Thanks for watching.
Awesome video! Clears up qiestions after your BG3 video. And many ither questions. Like and subscribe!
Only thing missing was VTH and VTG, VTX. Hoping this is all included at some point.
Have Cybertruck soon which includes paid for 3V gateway. There are enormous advantages to having PW3 in system. 3V gateway will be PW3 compatible at some point, but not now.
Tesla said that I could do 3V gateway now, but would require special support for commisioning to disable 3V site controller. They recommend I instal BG2/3 or Backup Switch instead.
Any thoughts about which gateway to go with? Mostly concearned about future compatability with VTH and VTG.
Hi @bluedrew it is really tough for me to give any advice on this subject, as I am not an expert in this area, but it does appear that on Tesla's website it does show it paired with PW3 and the backup switch. I think the decision would be more based on your home loads. If you want to purchase a PW3, back up your entire home, and you are willing to wait a few more weeks/months for the GW3 to hit the shelves, the GW3 would probably be the better choice just because it is slightly less expensive. But again, I have no experience with bi-directional Tesla charging, so until I got my hands on an installation manual and some datasheets, it is a tough call.
Excellent video...I looked at your service area map. I'm in Georgia which you don't service....can you recommend anyone in Georgia given your years of experience in the business. Thanks
Hi James, unfortunately I don't have any recommendations for solar installers in Georgia, but thanks for watching the channel.
17:00 The Tesla backup switch, eliminates relocating loads to a Backup Load Center. If there’s not enough space in the main panel for the PW3 breaker a generation load center might be needed.
20:05 The PW3 can work with a Generac backup. Main panel, Gateway, Generac breaker in Gateway, then Generac relay, then Backup Load Center.
Absolutely. In that configuration the generator would not be capable of charing the battery though. It would be first line of defense(solar/batteries) and second line of defense(generator). In my opinion, if you have a fossil fuel powered generator, it is usually best to pair it with a system that can integrate the two power sources all into one system, but that is just a personal opinion. Thanks for watching!
I wonder that it takes to back feed electrical power back to my house during outage with or without PW3?
I am not sure I understand the question Jeff. Can you clarify?
Great video. I’m still a bit frustrated with all generations of Powerwalls. They are far too expensive for most homeowners. I was recently quoted a price of $1,000 or so per kWh installed. To go off grid, keep power through the winter, and top off an EV at night, the average homeowner will need at least 50 kWh of storage? To actually disrupt the electric utility cartels, battery storage will need to drop by about 80%.
Typo fix. Battery storage costs will need to drop by 80%.
Batteries are certainly the most expensive part of an solar energy storage system. They have come a long way in the last 10 years and the industry is constantly innovating while prices continue to drop. But yes, the average American home is thirsty for energy and replacing the grid entirely is not an easy feat. Thanks for watching!
I think the solution is to store as much energy as possible as heat (and cool, and even gravity) rather than electricity. While this is very hard to retrofit, it’s a travesty it’s not acknowledged in the relevant codes. Of course, a whole system design like this will prioritize efficiency as well.
If it were up to me, I’d make it a requirement for new builds, but don’t consider myself an autocrat, just a pragmatist.
@freeheeler09
You don’t go off-grid without VERY aggressive improvement of the efficiency in electricity usage.
That typically, because of how sloppy typical construction practices are, means making the choice at the time of house construction. Otherwise it requires major renovation & device/appliance replacement
Can the pw3 be an off grid system?
Great question. As far as I am aware, they don't support off grid applications. I think it would likely void the warranty if the system was not connected to the grid and internet.
Optimizers could be used in conjunction with the Powerwall 3 correct? That is no different from when solar PV with optimizers sent DC to a standalone inverter and from there to a battery (if you had one). Thanks for the details and the clrificaion on LFP batteries. Looking forward to some future videos of installations with the Gateway 3. We don't have the same meters here in the UK, so it would be Gateway3. Good video, thanks.
Hi @grahamastor4194 Tesla does not provide any guidance about any way to use 3rd party optimizers on their system. Hypothetically you would think there would be a way to rig them up, but I assume you would be voiding the system warranty if you found a way to do that successfully. I would think if you wanted to use optimizers you would have to AC couple a different solar system with the Powerwall 3, but that would also cause you to loose the benefits of that DC coupled architecture of the all in one Powerwall 3 system. Thanks so much for the kind words and for watching the channel!
How about an install on a house that already has solar but no storage? Is there a way to install a PW3 so it charges off excess solar during the day and runs the house in the evening/night, without tying into the current solar system?
Absolutely. The Powerwall 3 recently was approved for "AC coupling" which is exactly what you are talking about. It basically tricks a grid tied only inverter into thinking the grid is operating and uses a CT clamp to monitor the PV output to charge the batteries accordingly.
Can me and a couple other neighbors string these things together. So that we could share the 30 KW of PV. Now that would be an interesting microgrid.
Seems like the redundancy would be nice.
You can certainly stack multiple PW3s and multiple solar arrays together, but most AHJs and utilities would not allow neighbors to share solar arrays and batteries. In general it is one system per utility meter, so if each person has their own meter, they would each need their own individual system. That being said, shared community solar is a growing trend that I am not an expert on.
You could do this on a off Grid system
Tesla Energy! 😍
Boom!
Thank you for sharing all this information.
You show the PW3 landing on the LC. But doesn't that require a derating of the main LC breaker for that much backfeed on the bus? And if you have multiple PW's, the backfeed current gets crazy fast. Shouldn't those land on the GW3 to control the total current on the LC bus? I rarely hear about the desire to NOT derate the main breaker.
And second question: Just what is this mysterious "remote meter?"
Absolutely a good point. It really depends on the bus rating and main breaker rating, but yes, in most cases when using the Gateway, the PW3 breakers will land in the internal panel board in the Gateway. Depending on whether you are using the GW2 or GW3, and some other site conditions, there can sometimes be an advantage of landing the PWs in a downstream sub panel, but in most cases not. The PW3 would have a 60A backfed breaker rating so it would not be compatible for a breaker connection on most existing electrical equipment.
In the Tesla GW2 they had two meters....the primary meter X and the secondary meter Y. In some cases even these meters were not sufficient to deal with certain on site conditions, in which case you would need to add a Neurio Meter. This is especially the case when there are non-backed up loads upstream of the GW2 or if there are multiple PV or battery systems on site. From what I understand Tesla is not building out the compatibility between the Neurio Meter and the PW3, so the mysterious "Tesla Remote Meter" is taking the place of both the secondary meter Y and the Neurio Meter. That is about all I know about it until I can get my hands on some datasheets and installation manuals when it comes out.
Thanks for watching!
@@RockyBroadSolarLLC
It’s controlled by PCS. No 120% rule.
That is correct, PW3 does have panel level PCS if your jurisdiction and utility allows it's use. Unlike many of it's competitors, the PW3 does not curtail the system performance in order to accomplish this, which is great. Thanks for watching!
Did you say mins string voltage of 60v??? That’s wild! With string voltage flexibility that low you really wouldn’t need module level mppt
Agreed. It sure does allow the ability to add some short string lengths. Thanks for watching!
Thank You for All that you are doing for our Planet Earth..
.. Peace.. Shalom.. Salam.. Namaste
🙏🏻 😊 ✌ ☮ ❤
Thank you for the kind words!
when the dc expansion packs come out, is it possible to add just that to enphase panel system ? or do we need the pw3 and the dc pack can only be added to an existing pw3 ?
The DC expansion units can only be paired with a PW3 battery. Thanks for watching!
Why would different strings need to face the same direction? PW3 has 6MPPT connectors. Wouldn't each string wired to different MPPT's not care which way the other one is faceing?
Correct. As long as all panels on the same string are oriented the same way, you are good to go. You just want to avoid putting opposite oriented modules on the same string. Thanks for watching!
I just looked at Tesla website, if you go to buy a power wall it does not say definitively what power wall version you are buying. Anyone know why?
No idea, but you can always get a quote directly from me. We generally are pretty competitive with the prices that Tesla charges on turn key installations.Thanks for watching!
Overpriced and impossible to buy you can order one but when you'll get it no one knows meanwhile I have zero electricity. Tried getting a powerwall in 2016 & again in 2020. Ther are better cheaper and actually available to purchase today rather than order and pray it comes someday
Hi @russbritt4100. I remember the days of having customers waiting for years on the Powerwall 1 after paying a deposit to be put on the list, and certainly there were some supply issues on Powerwall 2 at times, but both Powerwall 2 and Powerwall 3 are now widely available in the U.S. without any delays. We are installing them in 23 states across the U.S. as we speak. Thanks for watching!
This may sound like a strange question, but if I get a Powerwall 3, do I no longer need a whole house surge protector like an Intermatic? IOW does the Tesla gateway handle surges from the grid or will an additional whole house surge protector be beneficial? I live in central Texas and and we're getting some weird blackouts , brownouts...and surges where some breakers get flipped.
Most people only have a sub-panel controlled by the Powerwall. If that’s the case, it will not help in that regard.
Basically, you would have to have it set to power your house directly, with a grid backup. This will cost you greatly by having this huge (Powerwall) capacity, and taking an efficiency hit for every kWh you consume.
Hi @VishalRaoOnRUclips I would always suggest having an external whole house surge arrestor. They are now required by code to protect sensitive electronics such as ground fault circuit interrupters and arc fault circuit interrupters. Most can easily connect through a circuit breaker in your main service panel and only cost about $100-$200. That is much cheaper than replacing a bunch of sensitive electronics. As far as I am aware the Tesla Gateway does not contain any additional surge protection. Now if the grid is unstable and the voltage or frequency goes out of tolerance, the Tesla system will sense that and disconnect from the grid until it is stable again, but a true surge can come through in milliseconds and really do some damage if you aren't protected.
@@RockyBroadSolarLLC Thank you!
Do you install systems in Johnson City Tn?
Hi @rogerwhite5022. Unfortunately at this time I cannot offer any turn key systems in Tennessee whatsoever. Right now I am an independent energy consultant for one of the largest solar installation platforms in the US and I can offer turn key installations in 23 out of the 50 states. We are constantly expanding but this is the list as of 5/28/2024. Thank you for watching the channel!
Arizona
California
Colorado
Connecticut
Delaware
Florida
Hawaii
Idaho
Illinois
Massachusetts
Maryland
North Carolina
New Jersey
New Mexico
Nevada
Ohio
Pennsylvania
Puerto Rico
South Carolina
Texas
Utah
Virginia
West Virginia
How much energy (in kilowatt hours) can the power wall 3 actually store?
13.5kWh Thanks for watching!
Why not just use smart outlets to control low priority loads? Even a dozen of these would cost next to nothing compared to the cost of a smart panel plus installation. Plus many homes are not wired to breakers in a logical enough fashion to come close to the granular control of smart outlets.
That would certainly be an option @KB3M and is a great suggestion. Thanks for watching the channel!
Not having Micro-Inverters, is a deal killer for me.
I also feel like losing the module level monitoring/performance manipulation is making a backwards move in technology. Thanks for watching!
Why use this over a backup Switch? Only reason I see is V2H with the cybertruck
If your utility company allows the use of the Backup Switch and you are buying a whole home backup system, then the Backup Switch is the way to go. Unfortunately the vast majority of utilities in the U.S. have not yet approved it's use in which case you would have to revert to either the Tesla Backup Gateway 2 or 3.
Gateway 3 has that sub panel. Might allow for easier and cheaper wiring to a charger and the PW3 itself.
That's an advantage for me. My main panel is at back of garage. Putting PW3 there not a good idea (car can crash into it). For me better to have BG3 on side of house along with PW3 and short cable run to a new UWC.
@@bluedrewtotally in your case that makes sense. I live in AZ where we have combo meter panels where the back up switch is great because you don’t have to rewire a whole panel to install the gateway.
If you have an EV can PW3 charge it DC without inversion? Straight from the panels or battery?
To my knowledge, no. I don't believe Tesla has developed a DC:DC EV charger. The SolarEdge Smart EV Charger is the only product I am aware of that can do that.
@@RockyBroadSolarLLC I just took a look. Up to 24KW, impressive.
Can I add a Tesla Power wall 3 to a tesla powerwall 2 so I can sell more on the Virtual power wall?
Great question! I honestly need to look further into this and get back to you.
Hi @edgardorodriguez, following back up on this question. At this time you cannot combine PW2 and PW3 into one system. I am not sure if that is something Tesla plans on releasing in the future or not.
@@RockyBroadSolarLLC Thanks for the reply ☺️ Hope they do it someday.
"Dragging the string down" is an old problem, i advice you to check this real test comparing the shading of panels.
ruclips.net/video/TYok2dtuYKY/видео.html
Understood. It is definitely less of an issue with the newer solar panels and bypass diodes, but still can be an issue depending on configuration and shading. Thanks for watching.
Nothing new, Tesla is just catching up to the competition.
I hear you. It is a constant race to be in front of the competition. Thanks for watching.
*passing
You seriously need to stop bouncing back and forth, it's really distracting from your message.
Great feedback. I will keep that in mind. Thanks for watching!
Do you happen to know Joe @SolarSurge ?
I do not know Joe, but honestly he was an inspiration for me to start my own RUclips channel. I am one of his subscribers and watch most of his videos. I like to keep tabs on what all of the solar RUclipsrs are up to. Thanks for watching and for the comment sir!