Mass Effect 3's Original Ending Would Have Changed EVERYTHING & What This Means for Mass Effect 4
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- Опубликовано: 22 ноя 2024
- Did you know that Mass Effect 3 was supposed to end VERY differently? According to Drew Karpyshyn, the former lead writer for Mass Effect 1 & 2 - Admitted that he had other ideas for the ending to the trilogy - And is it possible that Mass Effect 4 could springboard off of this idea of his?
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What merch *is* viable for the code?
Still getting that mug in my kitchen either way.
@@ser-render-ser-vivor-ser-junn anything that's not a preorder or already discounted ☺️
I feel like when they did the poll with the release of the Legendary Edition to see what player's were choosing, they were seeing if there was a majority opinion on what a "canon" ending could be. In this case, if they did that, it looks like it'd be Perfect Destroy.
If they did that, I'd be kinda bummed out tbh
@@paradox_4094 same I couldn’t sacrifice EDI
@@commandershepard485 i cant do it lol her story arc in me2 and me3 feels pointless if you just kill her, and it reminds me of that sick your dog at the bear line from Ashley in me1.
If they can bring the Geth back, I'd say there's hope for EDI if they do this, but I hear yall
@@commandershepard485 Who knows, maybe they will retcon that part away because no one likes it. 'Hey, it turns out EDI had a backup stored somewhere safe, so she's fine'
I miss when Drew was working for Bioware, what an era.
- Destroy the Reapers by using the Mass Relays
- Plan goes ok, all Reapers dead, but at the cost of all races being separated from one another.
- Second Reaper fleet enters the galaxy.
- BBBBBRRRRRRRRRRRRRRPPPPPPPPPPP.
Drew Karpyshyn has brought up the motivation for the Reapers was the dark energy that was killing starts like in Haestrom in past AMAs. I'm kind of surprised that he didn't bring it up this time as well. I still hold firm that Bioware should just throw money at Drew until he comes back to be the lead writer on the newest ME game.
To be fair, the Reaper's motivation isn't relevant to the question asked. I'm going to have to find that AMA and see if he touches on the Dark Energy subplot somewhere.
What if ME4's prologue will be us playing the ending of ME3 but with only the canon ending choice given. o.O
I discovered Mass Effect early this year and was playing it over and over again ever since. It really changed my view on games and now I'm even considering learning about game development. All in all I'm so excided for the return of a story that had such an impact on me and to see people excited and keeping this community alive for new fans like me as well the future ones.
Game design is something to work towards but it not easy i know someone who's tried it they got so far with it but money for resources ran out as well as other problems
@@huanhoundofthevailinor2374 yeah I can imagine :/ well I'm considering it more like a hobby and something that interest me in a way to learn more about it but not really go into the whole industry because I've heard it's not all milk and honey
@@spamacc5125 ye it's not an easy thing to do but don't give up at first hurdle either you will learn a lot just from doin and you can do a lot of stuff without cash you only need that if you actually planning on making a game for release that's when things can get messy
I think you mentioned it in another video about the survey they did to see which ending, and which choices were the most popular, and they’re building the canon storyline from the choices that most people made. Destroy the Reapers, save the quarians and broker peace with the geth, cure the genophage, awaken the Leviathan-all of those choices will affect the galaxy and could cause more trouble. With the reaper threat gone, the Leviathan could try to take over again. Not everyone is crazy about the krogan being able to breed out of control now. There’s a living Prothean countless people will want to meet; the salarians are capable of cloning. More protheans through what could be a less than ethical means? The asari were hoarding knowledge-I can’t imagine what that effect would have on other species finding out. The geth being shut down after helping the galaxy when they achieved true sentience. So many factors, so many variables. Yea all the species pulled together to save the galaxy, but no one is perfect. So there will be issues. The citadel is now positioned over Earth and is completely destroyed-where will the counsel live now? If they’re even alive. That leaves open a vacuum in galactic government.
Javik said after the war he would kill himself to be with his friends
@@hpmlucci7553 he says that if you encourage him to look at the memory shard. He gets depressed and feels like he has no reason to live on after the defeat of the reapers. If you tell him to let the past go, he won’t look at the shard and he’ll tell Liara he would like to help her write her book about the Protheans and possibly explore the galaxy, since he was born in a time of war.
@@Ms_StoryDragon or he go the "selfish" road and go live with the Hanari like a king.
@@malacan4006 uhhhhh okay lol
INFJoy All decisions regarding the Geth are irrelevant if they choose Destroy as the canon ending because the Geth don't exist anymore in that case.
Javik will be dead in most scenarios btw because the majority of people let him investigate the memory shard.
People still refer to the fact that Liara looks much older in the trailer because of the wrinkles, when it's most likely just the next gen graphics in the trailer. We know Asari don't age the same as humans, just take a look at Aria in ME3 she's approximately 1000 years old yet doesn't look a day older than Liara. I personally think they put wrinkles on Liara just to start a debate in the community as it's something that has kept people talking since the day of the trailer's release up until now
Well heres a thought, could those be stress/lack of sleep wrinkles that Liara has (can Asari even get wrinkles), like what I mean is she is constantly looking for Shepard or what might remain of them the way it looks to us in the trailer. Even if it has been lets say atleast a few decades after the Reaper War.
The description on the merch website proves it is set right after ME3. This isn't a debate anymore.
@@ninfreak95 descriptions on random merch items can be wrong, wrong, we don't even know who wrote it
That's what I've been saying, she doesn't look old at all just detailed
@@Magosspud They edited it later to remove Shepard's name because they didn't want it revealed/it was inaccurate. That also means someone who knows the story purposefully left the rest. It is indeed accurate, approved and left on the site.
I'm on my 6th playthrough right now (2nd of LE) playing as a Shepard who starts off as a pure soldier, but will gain biotic powers after the collector attack in the beginning of ME2. Every time I boot up Mass Effect to play, I wish I could experience the series for the first time all over again.
PS: the music that plays in C-Sec in ME1 is filled to the brim with nostalgia every time I hear it
Same but then I’d loose legion and Mordin in the suicide mission
I aways remember the wonderfull day when i play ME 2 for the first time and the Normandy explodes, shepard in the space, suit losing oxigen, he burns and the screen goes dark, the logo appears and my tears fall, tears of emotion, i discover perfection. By the enkindlers, i love this game.
@@ghostharbinger1750 Still top 3 greatest prologues to any game ever
I just went through the whole LE (forgetting how long it was) and I never finished ME3 entirely so it kind of felt like a first time again. Funny enough I also started with soldier and swapped to vanguard for ME/ME3. Also discovering that ME2 was not entirely up to the task all the time lol, but by ME3 it was a lot of fun and made sense.
@@KaryudoDS If you're a PC player I'd highly recommend modding your game, it made my playthrough immensely more fun! The highlight mod for me was changing the way guns work in 2 and 3 so they had heatsinks like the first game, it made playing and decision making in battle a lot of fun!
The ending should be an epic final boss battle agaist Harbinger but with the entire army and fleet firing at him, hell Shephard could've even brough the big guns like the Biotic God, Blastro and Hamlet Elcor.
So when I first played ME3 when it came out I thought they where going to use a call back to ME1 and ME2 to kill the reapers. When the crucible main part is revealed to be the Citadel I was like oh yeah that makes sense. In ME1 we learn that the citadel is in fact a giant mass relay connected to the reapers and pulls them in from dark space. In ME2 we learn that thru the omega relay the drift is so large from jumping that you could end up in the black hole nearby. I thought that all that power was needed to override the system of the citadel pull all the reapers to it and then force relay them thru the omega relay into the event horizon of the black hole
I feel like the ending Drew is describing could have potentially produced a really good ending, because of the existence of the Omega 4 Relay. You could have somehow lured the Reapers through it, but by using the catalyst, changed its direction so that you basically launched them straight into the galactic core's black hole. Details would require some degree of finagling, but damn that would have been awesome.
Drew leaving was a major blow to Mass Effect. ME3 ending wouldnt be what it is if he was still there
Drew Also said in that AMA that he hasn't played me3 yet, although he planned an ending for the saga, i get the feeling that he became quite disconnected from his own creation and that now the writers might as well have their own path in mind regardless of what was once planned
but it is pure speculation and nothing drives me more crazy than knowing that someone out there KNOWS how this continues XD
Interesting theory about setting a booby-trap on relays) However, Reapers build them to speed up the process of harvesting - they don't need them to travel from dark space to Milky Way galaxy, not to mention from system to system. Even if some flagman ships will be destroyed, after several casualties Reapers will just go on their own. Time - consuming, but they won't stop.
It's pretty interesting I'm still excited for the next mass effect though I'm curious to know where they're going next from the trilogy.
Have a feeling that destroy will be Canon. If Shepard survived, it just makes sense. This news just solidifies that imo. ME4 might be focusing on how to reconnect everyone and fix the relays.
It actually makes a lot of sense when I think about it. After choosing the perfect destroy ending for ME3, the mass relays get destroyed, therefore other parts of the galaxy will have to be traveled to by ship alone without the use of the relays, making the journey a couple of weeks or months, instead of a few days with the help of the relays. But perhaps the next game will involve all the species in the galaxy to rebuild the relays, and bring back Commander Shepard in the process. That and revealing what the objectives the new Mass Effect game will have in store for the players.
This ending he mentions is kinda what I thought they were gonna do - sabotage the Relays. Would have been much better if they stuck with that instead of Star Child - where the Relays blowing up was kinda an unexplained after-thought that had to be addressed hastily (and poorly) by DLC later.
It would have been better if they went with literally anything other than star child. The little shit disproves his own narrative with his very existence. "AI will always try and destroy organics. Except me. Pay no attention to the fact that I am doing what I think is necessary to preserve them and have been doing so for millions of years. Uh... Anyway, what color would you like your explosion?"
Cant wait for the next installment. I cant get enough of your vids
I’m really glad that that ending wasn’t used as it would probably kill off the Normandy, they did in away plan for it with the tempest drive ,bi still like the idea that not all the relays were completely destroyed only needing months to repair select gates but others such as risk worlds were left untouched hence ranock would have been repaired by the geth if they survived the better question is how and who is in charge of the collective now that shepherd decided to destroy all synthetic life by destroying the reapers and would that also mean that those infected by geth died as well
One thing sticks in my mind from the first ME game. In the Codex was an entry that stated only a very small percentage of Mass Relays had been activated. If that's true then it seems logical there would be a sizable portion of the Milky Way that was unexplored. Were those unexplored regions hit by the Reapers? Were they not advanced enough to warrant destruction? Did an advanced civilization find a way to hide from the Reapers? If so, would they come forth as the galaxy was rebuilding? Would they help or maybe try to conquer a weakened galaxy after the war? I always thought the logical next step in the story was the aftermath and efforts to reconnect the galaxy. I could see Shepard leading the Normandy on missions through the once dormant Relays to see what wonders -- or horrors -- may await discovery.
Yeah 100% agree this is a sign of the next games direction. And I always believed Shep would live after the perfect ending as well. Assuming these two ideas are fact... It’s clear now they’re bold enough to tempt continuity. And it’s the best thing that could’ve happened. Just try to imagine how hollow a mass effect universe would be without acknowledging the trilogy. Even worse than Andromeda.
It’s basically a post apocalyptic galaxy. Isolated races. Isolated communities. Secrets in dark corners of the galaxy. Living and dead Reapers still influencing the galaxy. Protheans alive once again. No citadel. Scattered factions of Cerberus and beyond. Bring on that galactic wild west baby I can’t wait!
I think a Mass Effect where you jump through the galaxy finding and repairing lost relays would be cool.
You'd have to develop a way to jump place to place perhaps use the miniature relay that was in the Citadel and fit it into a new ship or something idk.
And maybe the big bad is a hostile species that was originally cut off but was unexpectedly reconnect due to your efforts repairing relays
The only feasible option to continue the story in ME is with the destruction ending. The other two are just to crazy. Control is super weird with all the Reapers still being around and Synthesis well... that last one would be a very bold choice. Haha or the 4th one - the cycle continues. xD
Control struck me as sort of what happened with the Geth and I just couldn't see people being okay with reapers suddenly helping them. Mean synthesis literally steals bodily autonomy from everyone which is kind of not cool, but I also just didn't get what made that a magic fix either.
Plus you just worked +100 hours to destroy the reapers, kind of odd not to do it.
I feel as if Bioware painted themselves into a corner somewhat with the three endings (four, really, because you can just let the reapers continue to destroy the galaxy again). There are so many ways to play through it, how does the next game logically proceed from the first three? I personally did both Synthesis and Destroy, and honestly only ended up choosing Destroy second time through so Liara wouldn’t cry, and also because I want my Commander to come back, dammit. But so many players are so passionate about their choices, and there were so many weighty choices, especially at end game - how do you wrap all those threads up and continue?
No one is passionate about Control or Synthesis.
@@DaNugeofRoxinbullshit
Fun fact: Drew Karpyshyn also wrote the first three Mass Effect novels, which detail the Mass Effect lore outside the games.
Mass Effect Revelation: Released in 2007 a couple months before the first game, the novel's story is set in 2165, 18 years before the first game (the prologue is in 2157 before the First Contact War began), and the story is about how David Anderson met Kahlee Sanders from ME3's Grissom Academy side quest and Saren, and how Saren screwed over Anderson's chance to be a Spectre candidate.
Mass Effect Ascension: This novel is set in 2184, with Kahlee Sanders as the central main character and Grayson, a character who is mentioned a few times in Mass Effect 3. A major story element in the novel is Cerberus assaulting the quarian ship the Idenna, which is why the quarians during Mass Effect 2 are slow to trust Cerberus operatives.
Mass Effect Retribution: This novel is the last novel Drew wrote, and it is set sometime after the Suicide Mission in Mass Effect 2. Kai Leng from Mass Effect 3 makes his debut in this novel, before his cybernetic upgrades due to Anderson shooting his kneecaps.
This is basically what I want the setup for the next game to be exactly: focusing on rebuilding the galaxy and dealing with the chaos that would stem from the galaxy suddenly being cut off from each other
Except from what I have seen the galaxy is not cut off from eachother, it's explicitly stated the relays and citadel are rebuilt.
That would have been a lot better. 1. It is a unified ending so when you continue you have less worry about making a canon that is different than the fans. 2. It makes sense. In the ending we got it dialed space magic to infinity and a magic device with 3 options when the goal of each generation before was beating the reapers was silly. 3. We wouldn't have got andromeda. Well we may have got something with similar themes and plot but it could have felt more tied to the lore.
I do think using the relays to destroy the repairs might have been an interesting direction to go with the ending as it would have felt like a less of a plot contrivance as the cruciable does.
Yeah, they needed something present in all three games to really have it work well. The crucible just comes out of no where in 3.
Drew Karpyshyn and R.A. Salvatore are my two favorite writers. Drew Karpyshyn was responsible for the greatest Scifi of all times, Mass Effect 2, i feel his absence when i was playing ME3 in the day 1 of the launch. It was awesome, but lack something, specialy on the ending. Mass effect is Drew Karpyshyn, i can see that in the books too. this guy is the new Asimov of scifi, they need to get him back for the new one.
Drew is thinking along the same lines I was trying to think of the consequences of what was going on in ME3 I think. I was trying to create a coherant set of consequences for the devastation I saw in the final battle, so I came up with my Toxic Homeworlds scenario. The idea was that the environments of the homeworlds were so screwed up that it triggers a mass exodus to the Andromeda Galaxy, possibly sped by the building of a mass relay for the purpose. An engineering ship and team would go to the edge of the relay's range, build another relay, and take it to its own limits, thus building a bridge to Andromeda. Each level could be filled with remnants of the reapers that have to be wiped out before crossing to make it safe. At some point, they stop finding reapers and start finding Jaardan or Kett instead, possibly even an Angara colony ship.
The Toxic Homeworlds scenario involves a lot of pollution, a lot of smoke damaging the climate, bacteria from other races getting into the ecosystem, ships crashing and detonating their eezo cores as they're destroyed (remember someone has to remove all the dead reaper and geth ships from orbit before they crash into Earth, and this could be the meaning of the geth face poster released on N7 day.) Eezo pollution is carcinogenic, and also causes biotic births. So you could also start seeing biotic wildlife and a mass die off of people and animals due to cancer. It doesn't matter as much if you rebuild your technology either, because if it takes too long the damage will already have been done. It also explains Liara with crows feet on her face climbing a snow covered dead reaper, climate chaos. Plus crow's feet aren't just caused by old age, they're also caused by stress, like the stress of seeing your friends and allies getting seriously ill. The Asari would be able to operate in eezo heavy environments quite easily, they've adapted to need it. So many of them might decide to stay on earth to help fix the damage (or tuchanka, palaven, ecetera.) A few centuries of isolation won't cause too much genetic drift for them either. So you could end up with a bunch of Little Thessia districts all over Earth and human/asari partnerships becoming far more common.
Still, I think the Milky way is going to see a huge post war exodus to Andromeda. I really wish I could see the response the Andromeda colonists have to hearing about the Reaper war and the possibility of the homeworlds being ruined.
I always thought the Dark Energy that Mass Relay emit route story line would have the reapers wiping our all space flight civilization so the young stars wouldn't die faster than it should. With this the reapers would save life but not bring life to total extinction. Then shepard comes along and said hey what you've been doing for the past millions of years isn't working anymore. It needs to change.
I really hope they do find some way of acknowledging the main choices in ME3. If they 'canonise' an ending, they're going to create more trouble than it's worth. Based on stats, none of the three have a majority, and while Synthesis and Control 'fans' seem to be less bolshy than Destroy stans, it will still split their existing audience.
I think they should just canonize Destroy ending. Just like they canonized the Shepard lives ending at the end of Mass Effect 2. You can’t import an ME2 save into ME3 if Shepard dies at the end of the Suicide Mission. For a Shepard dies ending for ME2, it’s just implied that in ME3, the Reapers win. So you are kind of forced to redo ME2 and maybe ME1 in order to get the Shepard lives ending for ME2 to import into ME3. And if they are continuing Shepard in the new game, well, then Control and Synthesis have created some game over for the narrative since Shepard died in those endings. Shepard lives at the end of Destroy. So once again, things are forced. The Control and Synthesis will just imply stuff like the Shepard dies ending of ME2, and that if you want to play ME4 (or 5, depending how you look at things because of Andromeda) and import stuff, well, you’ll have to replay the first three games, just like ME3 required you to replay ME1 and ME2 to create a save to import into ME3 where Shepard survives the Suicide Mission. So I guess what I’m trying to say is that, the whole forcing you to do something specific and replay previous games in order to get that specific thing has always been there. It’s just this new game will add another layer/make things more complicated. But I guess this is part of why you use multiple save slots and not constantly overwrite one save slot. That way you can try figuring out the best spot to carry on from so you don’t to replay an entire game. I did that when I decided I wanted to do playthroughs of the trilogy where Shepard romanced Miranda, Tali, and/or Jack. Instead of playing ME2 all the way through each time, I created one save slot where I could choose which romance path to go down, and once I finished a playthrough, I just reloaded that one save and went through everything again but with a new romance option. And the save I set up had pretty much only all loyalty missions and main story missions to go through. All planet probing/scanning and optional non-loyalty side missions were completed and out of the way so I wouldn’t have to go through them three times. So the same thing could be applied to the ME3 ending. Set up things for certain choices and then go from there. It’ll save time.
@@projectpat8807 That's not a good way of encouraging people to buy your new game. Shepard dying at the end of ME2 happened to a tiny portion of people, most of whom had to really try hard to accomplish that. Meanwhile, more people chose Control + Synthesis than did Destroy. The Refuse ending is the equivalent to Shep dying at the end of ME2
Accounting for all 3 main endings does not have to be more work than accounting for Shep's background in ME1. They already know how to do this kind of stuff; they've done it before. Saving a tiny amount of time by invaliding near to half the fan-base's playthroughs isn't good business sense.
Still love the idea of Anderson living and taking Sheppards place when taking control, destroying, or combining organic and AI together.
Dragon Age Keep was an interesting way to preserve the choices made in DA1&2 and carry them over to Inquisition. Perhaps Bioware should make a similar platform for Mass Effect 4
They probably will to be fair. DA:Keep is a nice little tool for editing your imports and I think people like using it rather than having to re-play the entirety of the previous games again for different choices.
I like the idea that the galaxy used the same idea that shepard used me2's blowing up a relay as a weapon against the reapers since its their technology and basically blowing up a system making the batarians death mean something and since we cant choose not to destroy the relay itd be a nice tie in
Yeah but remember with that idea, you'd be wiping out an entire star system and not guaranteed to get all the Reapers.
@@shadowsagen723 right. Youd have to do it all at once and find some way to protect the races of the galaxy
@@vlover15OO ie wouldn't be possible without killing everyone lol
Funny he gave that answer when years and years ago he said the original ending had something to do with the Reapers trying to solve the problem of dark energy killing stars (which was hinted at three times in ME2)
It would be cool if once the galaxy was saved and Shepard was found if the next move was to repair the mass relays. Using the keepers or something that doesn’t take 100 years. Maybe even using a secret that Liara uncovered from the many Prothean artifacts and digs she had done. Then one by one the galaxy was reconnected to one another as the different acts in the game played out. I could dig something like that. Especially if I had the mobility of Andromeda in the newer games.
I still don't know how they'll manage to top the Reapers as main antagonists, they were like the proverbial "white walkers, winter is coming" existential threat, where the hell do you go from there????
It isn't anime. The heroes didn't grow stronger with every fight.
That means that every enemy is a worthy enemy. Pirats, reaper cults, geth heretics, batherian seperatists.
@@jasperzanovich2504 that was sorta the direction they went with andromeda and ppl couldnt stop comparing it to the epic reaper threat even though that game was centered around settling a new home. I could be wrong but i feel like the fanbase might cry again if we dont get some super threat again.
@@paradox_4094 you know they'll cry. Fans of ME are to nostalgia driven and I honestly feel bad for the folks working on the next game. No matter how good it is folks will still complain.
Exactly, How are they gonna replace the Reapers that numbered into 20,000+, How many Leviathans remain? ATM this is how I'm comparing ME to the worst game that was once great, Warcraft. The ME Races= the people of Azeroth, The Reapers=The Burning Legion, Are the Leviathans on the same Level of the Old Gods, or is there an even bigger threat than what the Leviathans pose that would be on the Level of the Old Gods of Warcraft.
@@zelohendricks51 dont forget in a post apocalyptic milky way, we're gunna get exploration as a major part of the game and we all know how much og mass effect fans like their train rides instead
I hope in the new ME instead of going with just the destroy ending as a new starting point they should say the ending that actually happened was where Anderson and Shepard were sitting together at the end. On my 1st play through I felt relieved at that point and had a great sense of accomplishment. Then the child part ruined it for me. Play the child off as just a dream Shep had while he was unconscious or in a Coma since that part introduced too many endings (almost all bad). I'd be fine with that!
Wait have you not seen the indoctrination theory?
@@Shingeki__ No I had not but thank you for mentioning it. I just went and read up on it. Wow! I like it! It seems like some at Bioware did too.
Mr Hulten love the shilling + Afterlife music I imagined Aria with a M6 pointed at you.
if they went with detonating the relays i imagine the IFF ties into it, afaik the reapers have a degree of master-control over the relays or at least they're the same tech, so corrupting that link so the reapers would be killed by the relays whether by blowing up or just overcharging the reapers with way too much mass effect energy itd be a brilliant strategy
It's funny how the ending of 3 was so universally panned, but now we're all excited about what it all means XD
Ty for updating us. Mah man
One thing we know from the Arrival DLC in ME2 is that if you blow up a mass relay that's like a star going supernova. I guess there could be some space magic that means the mass relays are destroyed in a particular way that concentrates 99.99% of the energy into a focused beam aimed at the Reaper(s) that just jumped through. Though there would still be a significant hyper beam of energy blasted into space even after hitting a Reaper and destroying it. You'd also think that once a couple of MRs go dark, along with the Reaper(s) who jumped through they would stop using the MRs and start working out a different strategy for killing everyone. After all, they found a way to invade the galaxy from dark space without being able to jump straight to the Citadel.
The deal with the ending was that there is no absolute perfect ending were only the reapers die and and edi and geth survive. I always like all three endings to some extent
I guess we will find out soon, because since the game is in dev process - i expect smths like another teasers and basic demo showcase in next year
id think that reconecting the galaxy could be the start of the new mass effect conecting it to the dark energy theory by finding destroyed parts of the galaxy while reconecting , juts a thought.
If Shepard did die would like to play as a non human in me5 more than a new human character garrus Tali or liara becoming commander and taking control of the Normandy would be cool with me that said would still like to see Shepard again too
I think continuing in the Milky way after the reaper invasion is a very difficult path to go, nvm which ending of ME3 is cannon the multi different minor outcomes from the ME trilogy would have massive branching ramifications, so either they need to take all of those branches into consideration which would bog the game down in different version or they would either consolidate all the branches into one unified one or just ignore the impact of Shepards journey at which point it would in a sense invalidate the trilogy. I though Andromeda was a great work around of this dilemma, it is just such a shame that it fell flat in its execution. Frankly I think Andromeda should get another shot, but given how much these things cost to make and how badly received the first one was, I can understand why they are not eager to take a chance on that.
If enough time has passed (such as opening in the same time frame as ME:A), they could acknowledge all 3 main endings with about the same amount of work as accounting for Shep's background in ME1.
@@Klijpo I don't know, synthesis is so radically different from the other 2 that it's literally impossible to have it lead to the same starting point
@@Magosspud Not really. In terms of narrative issues, it's not that different from Control (in the immediate aftermath, the Reapers are docile and still around, and synthetics still exist). The green-circuit stuff can easily just fade away. In terms of gameplay, Synthesis playthroughs could have things like quicker/easier hacking/bypass (or whatever might replace them), be more susceptible to things like Overload, maybe even a bespoke Tech Power, or a slot that can swap out Tech Powers, a la profiles in ME:A.
These are just off the top of my head, so it's not "literally" impossible at all.Just requires a bit of imagination and creativity. :)
@@Klijpo @Klijpo The thing is if you just have the main consequence of synthesis visually fade away its no different from just choosing a cannon ending. And that's ignoring the story not being able to involve synthetic conflict or mabye even conflict at all, technology has advanced way beyond what would be possible, we see the green persist far into what seems to be far into the future, and people are most likely immortal according to EDI.
Edit: depending on the time frame you also have unsuited quarians in a society integrated with geth and we see geth bodies in a geth shaped crater surrounded by dead suited quarians in the ME4 teaser which would heavily conflict with that. They could be old corpses but I don't understand what the significance would be then
@@Magosspud Synthesis does not end ALL conflict, nor does it end potential conflict with Synthetics - it just eliminates the intrinsic, inevitable, and existensial conflict. All it means is any more mundane conflict between organics/synthetics can be resolved without resorting to genocide.
The green doesn't necessarily persist that far into the future - the last thing we see with actual people in it is the Normandy being repaired and taking off.
EDI says they find ways of transcending mortality; it's not a certainty.
All the ending cards are optimistic, even Destroy. Another game means something comes along to disrupt that potential good future.
BTW, the green glow is NOT the main point of Synthesis, and it fading is not the equivalent of choosing a canon ending. That's about acknowledging the choices players have made, and not erasing their agency.
I'm not opposed to a 'canon' ending, even Destroy, IF they have a great story idea that absolutely demands it.
Your point about the poster also raises issues. A Destroy ending eradicates the Geth; now I can think of ways they can be brought in without totally retconning the ending, but if they do retcon a Destroy ending into not destroying other Synthetics, it eliminates the reason many people chose one of the alternatives. That's even worse than just picking one and ignoring the rest; it undermines the end of previous saga entirely.
As for the Quarrians in suits - it looks like an airless planet; they'd be in suits anyway.
Collecting resources (perhaps even from Andromeda) and slowly rebulding damaged mass-relays in the Milky Way would bring in an interesting Farcry-like expansion mechanism. Would not be against it.
I am glad we had Drew for the first two games. I love this guy- his books are really awesome aswell. I hope he has a good time at Humanoid Studios and I'm looking forward to his new project.
Btw Mr. Hulten: I'd like to see some making of content regarding to Mass Effect,- maybe you can cut some stuff together? 😉
I'm sure there's a lot interesting stuff out there you could talk about.
that feels like a way to wrap things up and not different than the ending we got
Ok, so I'm glad no mention of the dark energy plot was used. It honestly would have been kind of a dumb idea. Sorry if this is unpopular, but I really think this way.
There is no way you could convince me that in 50,000 years of access to the tech available on the citadel that NODOBY noticed a problem with eezo and dark matter.
I do think I would have liked his ending of luring the reapers into the relays to blow them up, for the same reason I think the destroy ending is complete BS. All of the effort to reconcile the Geth and Quarians just to doom the Geth, when the original ending would have allowed the Geth to continue
It's called stakes my friend. Sometimes your efforts end up for naught when hard decisions need to be made. It's sad but I like it
@@zelohendricks51 exactly
@@zelohendricks51 I understand stakes, but I disagree that it was necessary. The synthesis ending which so many people seem to hate was actually a great compromise that served to actually better the galaxy. Putting aside the whole Kumbaya everybody magically gets along now, it allowed an end to the conflict, and did not necessitate any mass genocides of any species.
Honestly, for a Shepard that had been through so much conflict already and was showing extreme signs of PTSD and combat fatigue over the senseless loss of life that had already occurred, for a paragon ending, synthesis allowed the best outcome
@@michaelelam4594 I never said it was necessary. And while synthesis is good in some aspects it is still a galaxy wide forced choice which isn't exactly cool or ok. How do things like reproduction work? What do folks eat? What about the air they breath? There's WAY to many unknowns there
@XenoBlade X-3 lmao, dude! First, thanks! I've wanted to geek out about this for years with someone. And since this is only a game, this can be done with no hard feelings.
This argument is flawed and overused. 3 choices offered that aren't "do nothing", and every one is only Shepard there to make it. They are all choices forced onto the rest of the galaxy. Synthesis involves the most change on the galaxy, but everybody was basically just fighting up until their inevitable death as it was, so synthesis still beats death.
As for reproduction, why would it need to be any different? At it's basest level, conception is an exchange of information at a genetic level. Food? Again, it either doesn't change, or the tech could easily allow beings to be photovoltaic, as in sunlight powered, or even a combination, meaning less resources required by everybody. A massive decrease in famine and hunger galaxy wide.
Why would the atmospheric conditions for breathing change so massively as to be a danger? If anything, with synthesis, people should be able to easily alter themselves to be able to live in multiple atmospheres.
With destruction, their would be massive food shortages in systems that rely on interstellar trade for food, without doubt. Any densely populated planet that relied on imported food would suffer horrendously before any help could arrive.
Not to mention that it would be interesting to also see how the galaxy dealt with such a watershed change. How would civilization change, and what would stay the same.
Also, to someone like me, it was the most sci Fi of endings for a wonderfully sci Fi game
Actually, what people think happens with the Mass Effect Relays being destroyed (All Planets being Catastrophically Isolated from each other, A LA 'The Warp becoming Inaccessible and FTL Travel Impossible' like in 'Warhammer 40k', just shows how so many people were NOT PAYING ATTENTION to the game.
The Mass Effect Universe had TWO forms of FTL travel- 1.) The Mass Effect Relays 2.) 'REGULAR' FTL TRAVEL.
The Relays were Super Duper, Galaxy-Spanning Jump Points, similar to how fast Star Wars Hyperspace travel is. But they also had Ship-Only form of FTL, which, while nowhere near as fast, was still hundreds, if not a thousand, times faster than the Speed of Light, very Similar to 'Star Trek's' Warp Drive.
While it may have taken hundreds of years, it would have been entirely possible for an effective Mass Effect Relay system to be rebuilt and it is also likely that their Ship-Only FTL system is fast enough that very, VERY few planets would be so isolated as to perish.
C'mon Kids, Keep Up.
yea i saw that online. i honestly have no idea what they were thinking. didnt they have something about a queen reaper somewhere also?
They did!
Rebuilding the galixie does seem like a smart way to continue the story, keep it in the same setting, but completely change the rules and they totally covered their butts with the post credit thing saying whatever happen may or may not be accurate anyway.
I could certainly see the ME LE release as a way to get new saves out there for this, though I wouldn't mind if this game moved on a little if it added a little bit of closure. At the same time if we got more Sheppard and it was good I'd love it anyway. They previously had the Normandy crew together at least, so I could see that being a springboard maybe.
The only more exciting announcement they could've done than naming DeMarle the Narrative lead would've been having Drew back.
I hope for the next mass effect game that you can choose any race to play as. I specifically want a geth character kind of similar to legion or you can upload the shepherd vi into a geth and have shepherd with you.
So long as the game is centered around humans finding their place I believe that won't happen. They'd be fools to make Shep a side character
We all want a ME game where we can choose an race to play as but usually we always get stuck with a Human, Could they give us the option to play any race in ME that doesn't involve a Multiplayer mode or even the one genre we really wouldn't want ME to go down is a MMORPG, Yes they could but if I remember, they said ME is about Humanities place in the universe.
One of the worst things they could do is take our choices into consideration. Make a story and stick to it, trying to please everyone will only lead to them pleasing no one.
Well in Witcher 3 a character asks Geralt some questions about the past and depending what you answer, some things are different in game.
Not dramatically perhaps(don't remember everything), but in a good(depending on what you answer) way even so.
I think it would be Great, but also give an option to ignore our choices completely.
I don't care what anyone says, after replaying the trilogy years later without the overwhelming negativity from fans, I really liked the ending. I did play it with the extended cut though so maybe that improved it, I don't remember what the original was like. I really like how there was not just a giant "off" button for the reapers and all the choices have negative effects, there wasn't a perfect ending
I hate the hate towards me3. 98% of the game was great. The original ending was just three colors they promised we would not get and a terrible version of fallouts slideshow. It felt really off and a weird way to end the trilogy with A LOT of holes.
Oooh what if we as Shepherd now have to go repair all relays to help our team mates get home. Garrus and who ever else you took on your last push rescue your body etc .... ooooo fan fiction 💡
The biggest problem I can find of this is what all the reapers not currently using the network or reaper technology scattered among all the star systems that they've invaded.
I still sometimes wonder why they chose to show that N7 armour part in the new mass effect trailer? It must probably symbolise Shepherd
👍
They just need to look at a few mods and make them canon:
AHEM/MEHEM
CEM
Dream
And any mod that minimizes/removes starchild/stargazer
In my most recent playthrough after not being able to play for about one year: I defeated the illusive man, had the extended (restored cut) convo with Anderson...and I let go of the controlls, watched the beauty unfold, and was brought to tears. Everyone except Mordin and Legion and Vermire Casualty survived (yes, even Jacob) and this was a more human paragade playthrough, most choices made with "how would my FemShep do this" in mind.
Now to play dragon age and then the witcher than return and play renegon with Ashley surviving (for once🤣)
It be a scary idea if the Reapers dead out but their creations like the husks and Brutes were still active but gone feral and continued their rampage because Harbinger is still alive somehow.
How would the Reapers creations still be around if destroyed?, when we saw they creations incinerated in the destroy option.
@@shadowsagen723 true but maybe the wave only hit what was not underground or not in hiding
Or the weapon that used to kill them didn't get all of them, maybe some stayed in dark space as back up or whatever.
Or we the fandom don't listen to BW and speculate that the Reapers actually went to other galaxies to continue the Harvest there.
Kinda makes sense with the destroying the mass relays given how in the arrival dlc, shep destroyed the alpha relay.
I personally like the storyline where the Reapers are shown to be the actual good guys of the story and ending with the potential sacrifice of humanity to put an end to the cycles and stop the Dark Energy surges.
But then it begs the question... why not just ya know... let humanity breed tenfold and boom you have more than enough people to complete that mission and also not wipe out an entire species? Be like "sooooo guys... yeah so this thing is gonna happen, we gonna need alot of humans to fix it." Kinda comes across as a contrived conflict that could be entirely avoided. Sure if humanity refused (it is big ask) but they were never presented with all the facts to try and help resolve it either.
I mean it's better than whats in the game but I can't say it makes alot of sense either.
Personally the entire thing would've just been better if none of it was explained as it was in ME:1 with the Reapers just being this unknowable force of destruction. Really don't think it had to be any more complicated than that... I mean Soverigns speech is memorable for that exact reason, not because he spelled out what he was thinking.. Same goes for Vigil also saying "your survival depends on stopping them, not in understanding them."
Personally I do not think it would to hard to keep the choices from ME3 to ME4 due to most of the storylines had been finished and or completely resolved, in many cases they do not need to be mentioned but I would enjoy one final send off of Shepard and crew once and for all.
So the OG ending was basically the ending that another of my favorite scifi franchises got. Interesting^^
That original idea sounds perfect. Just imagine, the next game takes place like a decade past the me3 ending, the now saved but disconnected races of the galaxy desperately scramble to repair the damaged mass relay network, as less agricultural world(such as ilos) are also scrambling to quell the riots and gangs that have grown from the food scarcity, bringing several hub worlds the their knees, while more agricultural world's struggle to maintain equipment without the skilled labor and specialty parts from the more populated worlds. All while the many colony's across the galaxy become quite insular without anyway to contact friends or family that they had left behind.
You control a new MC, one who survived the devastation of the armed forces of the galaxy. Your job, is to carry the fix for the relays, attempt to bring peace back to the galaxy, and if possible, discover the fate of commander Shepherd and the crew of the Normandy sr-2.
Could also work as Shepherd being the MC and taking the reigns ass a ship comes across them, having traveled via sub light speeds across the galaxy. One that contains the fix for the relays, but with the catch that the ships administering the fix have to be at the relay to fix it.
Would make it almost like dragon age inquisition. Having to dispatch ships to the corners of the galaxy, and bringing the people of the galaxy on board to the effort, either through working to better the devastated corners of the Galaxy, or by becoming a ruthless dictator of the planets you find, forcing them to support you with an iron fist.
Idk bout y'all but that sounds like one hell of a game
Interesting. I will have to check to see if it was invalidated, but if not they should build off the Indoctrination Theory. If that happens, they have plenty of room to rewrite a full ending for ME3. This is because the we only know what the three choices do, according to the Reaper that is also trying to Indoctrinate us! If you pick Destroy you get 1 scene where Shepards chest plate expands, assuming he woke up from the attempted indoctrination, everything after can be whatever they decide. Maybe Destroy doesn't actually kill all Synthetic life? Idk but this path feels like it would both give ME3 players some level of closure, and segway cleaner into a 4th iteration without too many plot holes.
As much as I like Drew Karpyshyn, he should've stuck around for Mass Effect 3! He was the only one of the three main creators who wasn't a part of that game, and with the way ME3 turned out, that can't be a coincidence!
I always thought the next story would have to be about rebuilding... And the different galactic powers would have different ideas about how this rebuilt galactic community would work.
Without an enemy to unite against, it wouldn't be long before infighting breaks out.
For example, it could be freedom versus authoritarianism.
Quite the intro!
That ending sounds very close to the ending of the novels Hyperion/Endymion
I think the idea of building the crucible is absolutely essential to give sense to the story so I like what they did with the story and the destroy ending in ME3. In my opinion at the end of ME3 shouldn't have been any choice to make because destroying the reapers was the only real solution to the problem and it would have also been a philosophical "statememt" about the fact that sometimes in life you have no real choice. I think they didn't do it because they feared the players would get angry if a franchise based on choices would end without a choice. but they got angry anyway didn't they?
The thing is, you should never write the ending in mind with "What about the next one??" the best stories that continue to sell have complete endings, like LotR and Breaking Bad. You FOCUS on ending your story CORRECTLY and your franchise will resell, along with its offshoots, for eternity.
Reapers ARE mentioned in Mass Effect Andromeda if you do ... don't remember name of quest,but it involves gradually unlocking some recordings on big space station that serves as main HUB .
Or perhaps on Human ARK.
Not sure.
Quarian Ark took their sweet time to leave the Milky Way galaxy and while the rest of the major species(races?)left months before Reapers arrived , Quarians may have left after Reapers arrived.
My theory is that their Ark was followed by 1 or more Reapers considering post game message you receive at some terminal or something.
Immediately or not I cannot say.
Typically Reapers are much faster than Milky Ways fastest ships, but perhaps Arks were different.
Situation seemed desperate and final brief music suggested that something was very,very wrong.
Kett?
I suppose it's possible and given that Arks aren't armed... .
But Reapers seem more plausable to me .
The ending would have made much more sense if Drew had been there and in charge. He is a great writer and I loved his work on the first two games.
I feel like, in general, if a company is making a franchise, they should keep the same set of writers for the whole storyline.
I wish original ME team would buy back ME IP, and form there own indie dev team and claim back mass effect from EA. But that will never happen.
Thinking about the ending gives me tension in my neck.
3:04 Wrong. We all know from the Arrival DLC that destroying a Mass Relay produces enough energy to destroy the entire star system. This means that detonating the Mass Relays would have destroyed almost all homeworlds with the exception of Dekuuna, the Elcor homeworld (their system doesn't have a Mass Relay) as well as many important colony worlds which means detonating would have in fact destroyed the vast majority of the galactic population.
Regarding the 4 ME 3 endings - the Don't Choose ending is obviously not canon because in that case the Reapers finish the cycle and are defeated in the next cycle which means that except for the Yahg none of the known ME3 species would exist anymore. That's obviously not the case considering the trailers.
Synthesis is also not the canon considering that the Asari is not a matrix thing running code on the skin (that's a good thing because Synthesis is BS).
If they go for Control or Destroy as the canon ending....I have to say I hope its Control. This would keep a certain amount of uncertainty and possibly looming danger because the Reapers still exist.
If they choose Destroy this means that the Geth and EDI have been destroyed as well which would be such a shame and a theft of some incredible storytelling. And it would mean that most likely Shepard would be still alive (unless the setting is a few hundred years later) which absolutely should not be the case! Shepard dying at the end of ME3 wass the one thing I'm absolutely on board with. It is absolutely fitting that the hero pays the ultimate price to end a threat that has plagued the galaxy for more than a billion years.
I’m not sure I could handle a post reaper Milky Way game. I don’t want to see my romance option struggling through life without shep.
I thought the endings we got was drafted by Casey Hudson on the back of a diner napkin 15 minutes before a deadline or something?
It's reasonable to assume that the next series of games in the ME universe will be about rebuilding the galaxy. I think that, at this point, it's a given. Under these circumnstances, whow many of our choices will have mattered? Curing the Genophage and saving both Geth and Quarian, maybe.
Even then we can always avoid visiting their neighborhoods, orthey can be extinct by some other reason.
Marauder Shields Lives!
I'd like to point out that any ending that leaves the relays destroyed leaves multiple races stranded in places where there's nothing they can possibly eat.
Never realised till now but drew looks like senator Armstrong 👀
God, thats the face of "My writing needs a LOT of checks and balances"
As I recall, the destroy ending is the official ending. Though as I recall it implies that most or all AI, like the Geth or Edi die as well, and the poster clearly shows a Geth face, I don't know how that will work. But, it certainly sounds like it's a bit more in line with the original idea, to me at least.
There is a problem with the premise that you can just destroy all artifical life for good anyway, they are robots and robots can be remade. It's kinda got the same energy as saying they'll break all the omitools...
It's not the same as wiping out organic species that require millions of years of evolution coupled with just sheer luck.
@@DaciValt I guess it's a moral question as groups like the geth, at the end of the series, are fully sentient. Is it morally ok to let them die just because they're not organic, even though they would be considered full aware/sapient?
@@cnett486 Well that is the premise they were going for it seems, like experiences shape an individual.
But personally I think of it exactly like Legion puts it, they are purely software and not constrained by the same notions we put upon ourselves. They can adapt and change themselves at a whim just through a download just as an example.
Destroy and rebuild is the canon of history. It repeats over and over again like a feedback loop. Rebuilding would present new missions and could incorporate time travel.
Our choices have to mean something. Shepard has to be the main character, EDI has to be reconstructed and programmed from Jocker's backups. The crew is still around because the Normandy rises up from the surface of that planet it crashed on, and it flies away. So the old crew has to be involved. It present challenges to writers. Let's hope they write new stuff that's true to the story we all have immersed ourselves in.
I mean....GEEZZ....I tell my wife to call me Commander Shepard, and when she get's mad at me I tell her "I better go."
When a problem comes up, I find myself saying, "there's always a better way" and "Someone else might have gotten it wrong."
As of late I've been thinking about Mass Effect and realized:
They started this by its end. They made an entire UNIVERSE end in 3 years. From 2183 to 2186. What a waste. They could've done it like Star Wars with Abeloth and have the Reapers be a lurking ever growing threat instead of smacking them on our faces from the get-go. What a wasted opportunity to flesh out the entire universe.
Logasiri, Feros, Tasale, Flett, Trident, The weapon from Klendagon's glacing blow (IM mentioned he found it), Erinle, Rothla, Eingana, Namakli, Joab, Sanctum, Haskins, Garvug, Parnassus... *ALL* of these planets could host a game BY THEMSELVES. *This is what they've thrown away* .
The next game should be about Leviathan infiltration.
I hope the geth aren't antagonists in the next game. My poor flashlight heads have been through enough already
a new ME ! wow last time i switched of of the news 'cause they said they shelved the franchise after ME-A. well i hope they make a good story for this one. il have to go back and get 'news' again
It is good to know that the ending we got wasn’t *entirely* different from what they would’ve done. It’s definitely not the same thing by any stretch, but it would’ve been a slightly more satisfying ending to have it be a more organic cut off rather than random space magic from StarChild.
Also, the DE plot still was the better option in my opinion. Maybe one day they’ll pay it off. Maybe Tali’s kid will solve the problem.
Yeah but how would you stop Dark Energy or solve the problem of it when it is on a cosmic and astronomical level. Some one said they might have ditched the Dark Energy concept, because when they thought of that concept they looked at it and said how do you stop something that you cant see or even control.
@@shadowsagen723 this
@@shadowsagen723 As I understand it, that was the entire purpose of the reapers. They were making reapers to try and stop it. How is not clear, but that feeds right into what Soverein said 'We are beyond your understanding." The original ending was that a human reaper would have finally been able to stop it because of our genetic diversity, which is another concept that comes up a few times in Mass Effect. It's also why they were specifically targeting humans. Another plot point that was just dropped. I guess they were targeting humans because they were salty about Shepard, which seems really petty. So the final choice would have been do you let the reapers harvest humanity, thus stopping the dark energy problem, and no more reaping would ever need to be done, but Humanity gets wiped out, or do you say screw you, we'll figure it out ourselves and destroy the reapers. Now it's on everyone else to figure out a way to stop the dark energy problem. This was a way better ending in my opinion. It ties everything together through all three games beautifully and presents a horribly difficult choice at the end. I have o idea why they dropped it.
To me the Synthesis Ending will always the canon one, it makes the most sense, solving the conflict of organics vs synthetics in general, making all kinda one, physicly & mentaly closer, without changing them too much, and I think it's the hardest to achieve.
Shepards death is acceptable, though sad.
This being a trap is possible, same with Indoctrination. Interesting stuff.
But the "destruction" is to me just way too simple. It's the easiest to get, like a bad ending, Shepard surviving shouldn't be a reason to chose this, and the Reapers in general are a Cosmic Horror you just can't fight head on & destroy head-on with just conventional methods. Destroying them as shown is a bit off, though I'm not saying it's bad.
Fighting to the bitter end get's you the 4th ending, everyone dies.
About the next game, I'm interested, but they should've soft-rebooted it with it starts a 1000 years after ME3, and technology, just like evolution, made big steps forward. That, or just leave it.
God, I realy hope they don't go timetravel & multiverse, just to get Shepard back or change things. That would damage the franchise.
Also, there is no "Andromeda"... 😅