You are rephrasing arguments presented by islamists and christian evengelicists against secularism............. (1) You're conflating political secularism with libertinism and hedonism. Secularism, as a political theory, advocates for the separation of state and church. It is unrelated to behaviors such as drinking and the objectification of women. While the objectification of women does occur in Western societies, it has a long history predating the emergence of secularism. Instances of women being objectified can be traced back to civilizations like the Ottomans, Umayyads, Abbasids, and Mughals, notably through practices such as sex slavery. Women's objectification stems from factors such as class division, capitalism, and feudalism. The primary reasons behind sexual harassment include alcoholism, drug abuse, gang violence, and erroneous beliefs about women's bodies. These factors existed prior to the advent of secularism and are closely linked to capitalist and feudal societies, which perpetuate class struggles and inflict significant harm on society.......... (2) You pointed out some negative instances of the economies of certain secular societies, but when comparing overall figures with Islamic states, secular states emerge as clear winners. For instance, while the number of homeless people in the USA is around 700,000, in Pakistan, it exceeds 20 million.Western states generally boast higher GDP per capita, lower poverty rates, better infrastructure, and higher standards of living compared to many islamic countries. This discrepancy can't solely be attributed to either secularism or religion; rather, it is due to the economic reformations in Europe and the economic decline in the subcontinent.............. (3) In the final analysis, when comparing societies, it's essential to consider overall statistics and conditions from every perspective. While you pointed out some negative aspects of those societies, You may have overlooked their overall performance. It's important to recognize that problems exist in all societies. For example, if we examine the rule of Hazrat Abu Bakr, Hazrat Uthman, and Hazrat Ali, we find instances of fitnahs, fights, wars, and bloodshed, indicating challenges even among Islamic leaders of the highest caliber. Similarly, problems exist in secular Western states as well. However, when comparing them to Muslim states on average, unfortunately, we find ourselves lagging behind...............
Hi there. 1. There is no such conflation, this is not a detailed video, but rather a short chunk taken from a lager video. Regarding this being an attack upon the political theory and philosophy behind secularism, I would say you can clearly see rather that it’s merely a comparison on certain grounds I am doing between western secular states and conservation muslim societies, so that I am afraid is merely a strawman of the video, as if I wished to do the former the video would not be doing a comparison of what occurs in the society, rather the comparison of the political theories and a scrutiny of the philosophical and ethical aspects behind them. Regarding the examples you gave of the older Islamic states, I find it rather baffling that you think that slavery can be traced to them, rather slavery is there in all pre modern societies and in fact it can be traced back to the earliest written history we possess. So I don’t know what that’s about, however it’s clearly disingenuous and inaccurate. Secondly I do not consider the mere reality of concubinage as objectification in any regard to begin with, nor do I agree with your categorization of it as “sex slavery” to be anything rather than a misunderstanding of the reality of slavery in such premodern states. Lastly on the last thing you wished to forward, I find it an extremely simplistic take, to strip what occurs in the society to merely capitalistic tendencies and not the views, beliefs and way of life, of the people in that society is not only an extremely simplistic take but rather a take that does not take into consideration societal factors and circumstances, nor does it explain the examples I have given in any regard. However I don’t wish to write an article here, and I can make a detailed video on this matter in the future which you can watch, In Sha Allah. 2. This firstly shows that you do not understand what an “Islamic state” is to begin with, I would not consider any muslim majority country in the modern era as a pure “Islamic state” to begin with, rather we can see piece meal Islamic law being practiced or implemented in systems that are rather clearly unislamic. Even in this you have conveniently only taken states that may fit what you wish to forward, for example you have taken the subcontinent rather than the gulf states, homelessness rather than an aging population, and absolute numbers rather than comparisons of growth, though factors in an economic analysis are far more expansive than what I have mentioned too, however this is just to show that this point of yours lacks a holistic approach, and also a certain selective criticism. Even in regards to the metric you mentioned of homelessness, it is merely increasing in the States, it is up by more than 12% from 2022, and the other economic decay issues that the western states face. I will currently also not go into the fact that the state you mentioned, Pakistan namely, is a state that is an infant state which has an extremely violent history of colonialist occupation, which obviously can not be divorced when comparing it to states that have had much more time to prosper in certain aspects. 3. I agree to some extent with you here, as there is no denial being forwarded from my side that in terms of material possessions and technologies, or even standards of living, mostly these states display far better quality and performance in these, however I personally do not consider material metrics as any form of a primary measure of the effectiveness of a society to begin with, though it is considered in my view but as a secondary factor. In my thinking the moral, societal, spiritual, familial and communitarian factors are far more important in a state than its mere material possessions. Also I agree with you that problems exist in all societies, I do not believe in utopias, and I think nor do you. Anyhow, I have already written a plenty, I can perhaps do a video on these matters in depth in the further In Sha Allah. I do thank you for your feedback and apologize if I came across as harsh. اَلسَلامُ عَلَيْكُم وَرَحْمَةُ اَللهِ وَبَرَكاتُهُ
JazakhAllah Khayr, this really puts things into perspective.
Wa Iyyakum brother. 😁
Great work!
Great 👍
Brother intro ki nasheed konsi hai?
It’s salawat upon RasulAllah ﷺ
Great Work Boss🙃
JazakhAllah Khayr. 😁
You are rephrasing arguments presented by islamists and christian evengelicists against secularism.............
(1) You're conflating political secularism with libertinism and hedonism. Secularism, as a political theory, advocates for the separation of state and church. It is unrelated to behaviors such as drinking and the objectification of women. While the objectification of women does occur in Western societies, it has a long history predating the emergence of secularism. Instances of women being objectified can be traced back to civilizations like the Ottomans, Umayyads, Abbasids, and Mughals, notably through practices such as sex slavery.
Women's objectification stems from factors such as class division, capitalism, and feudalism. The primary reasons behind sexual harassment include alcoholism, drug abuse, gang violence, and erroneous beliefs about women's bodies. These factors existed prior to the advent of secularism and are closely linked to capitalist and feudal societies, which perpetuate class struggles and inflict significant harm on society..........
(2) You pointed out some negative instances of the economies of certain secular societies, but when comparing overall figures with Islamic states, secular states emerge as clear winners. For instance, while the number of homeless people in the USA is around 700,000, in Pakistan, it exceeds 20 million.Western states generally boast higher GDP per capita, lower poverty rates, better infrastructure, and higher standards of living compared to many islamic countries. This discrepancy can't solely be attributed to either secularism or religion; rather, it is due to the economic reformations in Europe and the economic decline in the subcontinent..............
(3) In the final analysis, when comparing societies, it's essential to consider overall statistics and conditions from every perspective. While you pointed out some negative aspects of those societies, You may have overlooked their overall performance. It's important to recognize that problems exist in all societies. For example, if we examine the rule of Hazrat Abu Bakr, Hazrat Uthman, and Hazrat Ali, we find instances of fitnahs, fights, wars, and bloodshed, indicating challenges even among Islamic leaders of the highest caliber.
Similarly, problems exist in secular Western states as well. However, when comparing them to Muslim states on average, unfortunately, we find ourselves lagging behind...............
Hi there.
1. There is no such conflation, this is not a detailed video, but rather a short chunk taken from a lager video. Regarding this being an attack upon the political theory and philosophy behind secularism, I would say you can clearly see rather that it’s merely a comparison on certain grounds I am doing between western secular states and conservation muslim societies, so that I am afraid is merely a strawman of the video, as if I wished to do the former the video would not be doing a comparison of what occurs in the society, rather the comparison of the political theories and a scrutiny of the philosophical and ethical aspects behind them.
Regarding the examples you gave of the older Islamic states, I find it rather baffling that you think that slavery can be traced to them, rather slavery is there in all pre modern societies and in fact it can be traced back to the earliest written history we possess. So I don’t know what that’s about, however it’s clearly disingenuous and inaccurate. Secondly I do not consider the mere reality of concubinage as objectification in any regard to begin with, nor do I agree with your categorization of it as “sex slavery” to be anything rather than a misunderstanding of the reality of slavery in such premodern states.
Lastly on the last thing you wished to forward, I find it an extremely simplistic take, to strip what occurs in the society to merely capitalistic tendencies and not the views, beliefs and way of life, of the people in that society is not only an extremely simplistic take but rather a take that does not take into consideration societal factors and circumstances, nor does it explain the examples I have given in any regard. However I don’t wish to write an article here, and I can make a detailed video on this matter in the future which you can watch, In Sha Allah.
2. This firstly shows that you do not understand what an “Islamic state” is to begin with, I would not consider any muslim majority country in the modern era as a pure “Islamic state” to begin with, rather we can see piece meal Islamic law being practiced or implemented in systems that are rather clearly unislamic. Even in this you have conveniently only taken states that may fit what you wish to forward, for example you have taken the subcontinent rather than the gulf states, homelessness rather than an aging population, and absolute numbers rather than comparisons of growth, though factors in an economic analysis are far more expansive than what I have mentioned too, however this is just to show that this point of yours lacks a holistic approach, and also a certain selective criticism. Even in regards to the metric you mentioned of homelessness, it is merely increasing in the States, it is up by more than 12% from 2022, and the other economic decay issues that the western states face. I will currently also not go into the fact that the state you mentioned, Pakistan namely, is a state that is an infant state which has an extremely violent history of colonialist occupation, which obviously can not be divorced when comparing it to states that have had much more time to prosper in certain aspects.
3. I agree to some extent with you here, as there is no denial being forwarded from my side that in terms of material possessions and technologies, or even standards of living, mostly these states display far better quality and performance in these, however I personally do not consider material metrics as any form of a primary measure of the effectiveness of a society to begin with, though it is considered in my view but as a secondary factor. In my thinking the moral, societal, spiritual, familial and communitarian factors are far more important in a state than its mere material possessions. Also I agree with you that problems exist in all societies, I do not believe in utopias, and I think nor do you.
Anyhow, I have already written a plenty, I can perhaps do a video on these matters in depth in the further In Sha Allah.
I do thank you for your feedback and apologize if I came across as harsh.
اَلسَلامُ عَلَيْكُم وَرَحْمَةُ اَللهِ وَبَرَكاتُهُ