Thank you for watching. I might not respond but I promise I will read all your comments and take them on board, irrespective of whether you agree with me or not. I value all your opinions, especially as most of the people I’ve talked to about this are like-minded. I’m not going to push the sponsor for this video, but thanks to Nebula I can donate my fee. So please do check them out if you want to get yourself access to lots of cool stuff for $2.50 a month, and to support me too. Merry Christmas, Rohin.
My grandmom suffered with Alzheimer's for the last 10 years of her life. I never knew her when she didn't have it, so my experience with her was of a hollow person, who needed a lot of care from the family. My mom and my aunts would talk of how wonderful she was, how she would take care of them, cook delicious food, etc. but it was all in the past tense, as if grandma has already passed. If medical assisted dying was legal here in India, I still wouldn't think my mother would accept it, taking care of her was her form of grieving I think. She died in March 2021, during the COVID pandemic so my aunts couldn't make it. We buried her in her hometown, and my mom's first statement was how relieved but empty she felt. My mother is similar to your mom, extremely strong mentally and emotionally, and this was one of the few moments she shared her emotions with anyone else. If medically assisted dying is legal here, and I had the choice to decide for anyone in my family, and they wished for it, I would too. Thanks for the video, Rohin, and best wishes to you.
To consider and advocate for very clear laws on the criteria for when death assistance would be allowed, I urge you to learn about why the Disability Day of Mourning is a thing. The annual vigil is international, and this statement describes the deeply inhumane tragedies that lead to starting this tradition: "We see the same pattern repeating over and over again. A parent kills their disabled child. The media portrays these murders as justifiable and inevitable due to the “burden” of having a disabled person in the family. If the parent stands trial, they are given sympathy and comparatively lighter sentences, if they are sentenced at all. The victims are disregarded, blamed for their own murder at the hands of the person they should have been able to trust the most, and ultimately forgotten. And then the cycle repeats." (sorry for not including a l1nk, RUclips has been a pain in the neck regarding my comments lately) What will happen to those of us who cannot express their own wishes if death assistance is legalized? Too often abled people react to our very existence with repulsion, and these repulsed people all too often include our "loved ones".
You, Sir are a scholar and a legend - well done making this informative and tactfully put. Even though, at several moments, I could see you found it difficult.
Around 2009-2010 I was dating a woman with a deeply evangelical family. Her grandmother lived in Oregon and had terminal cancer. (Bone cancer as I recall) The grandmother was in so much pain and chose to exercise her right to die granted by the state. Most of the evangelical family members cut the grandmother out of their lives before she died. They would say things like "she is selfish" or "she is making the choice not to join us in heaven so why should we support her on Earth?" This was the most disgusting thing I have even seen, how much shame and vitriol was aimed at an old women who didnt want to feel the agonizing pain of cancer eating her body any more.
It is sad that people misconstrue Jesus’ message of love into a means to judge others and push people away. I’m so sorry for her loss and I pray for their family’s healing
Good old abrahamic religion, the only religion where pain and suffering is seen by it's followers as something beautiful and to deny it is seen an apostasy.
As someone with a chronic illness (EDS) I agree entirely, I know when I need pain meds to get my pain under control and I often know more about my condition than doctors do. I wish that doctors would trust my jugement and work with me instead of against me.
When you ask people how they’d prefer to die, the most common answer is “in my sleep”. No sane person wants to die in pain. So why are we forcing people to suffer, when we can allow them to pass peacefully?
Because the logical end result of medically assisted dying combined with the state acting as the medical provider and free healthcare means that your finite tax dollars will be going up against infinite potential suffering. Take a guess as to how that infinite potential suffering will be tackled. If you guessed the state instituting death panels and cutting off more expensive patients (read between the lines, "Net negative tax payer") and pushing medically assisted death, which is exactly what's happening in Canada, you'd be correct.
@@Flack0-Flacko These people just want to die. Full stop. They hate life in general and want to see death be more commonplace. It's actually disgusting.
My father passed away this year after 12 years of bed-ridden care. He’s my motivation for wanting a career in medical research. Seeing him cry once because he looked at me and couldn’t remember my name made me realize, sometimes being alive doesn’t mean living a life. Thank you for this video.
i hope u're doing ok. grief can be like a tempest, you think it’s over and then it hits you in waves. ur pops lives on in your memories of him. u can continue experiencing him as long u continue to remember :) a woman that was like a grandma to me died during quarantine and whenever i miss her, i try to remember what it felt like to be little and under her care again. i can still remember how she laughed and her hugs
seconds after my grandpa’s heart stopped, my dad looked at me and made me promise not to let him suffer like that. I'm deeply invested in this subject.
I'm Canadian, and when my grandmother was in her early 80s she was diagnosed with stage four cancer in every body part that was checked including her lungs, her blood, and both of her legs. It was the first year assisted dying was legal so she signed up and that's how she died. I was in the room when it happened. I personally feel assisted dying is a straight forward extension of palliative care. If the patient _will_ die and no one can prevent it, then ensuring the patient will not die badly is pretty much all palliative care is. If nature will brutally kill them in 6 weeks, using drugs to kill them peacefully in 4 weeks before things get too bad for painkillers to handle is two-dimensionally obvious.
I've seen painkillers used to the point of leaving people loopy and not themselves... I fear the loss of myself to medication because it's basically a living death at that point. If your options are to live in agony or be chemically sedated, I think adding a third option to die with your mind in check before your body completely breaks down is a merciful and good option. We will have to be very specific to make sure that line is drawn ethically but it must be drawn.
This is spot on, and no different than providing euthanasia to a beloved pet who is terminally ill. This is one of the most difficult, and kindest, things we can do for our loved ones.
"Heal the sick. But when that is not possible, prevent suffering." Exactly this. Terminally ill, mentally competent people should absolutely be able to choose how and when they die. I watched both my father and my best friend die of terminal cancer. I was then and remain now livid that the only choice available was for them to suffer to death. It was excruciating for them, and for their loved ones. In both cases I offered to help them die because I simply couldn't countenance them suffering so much when the end was inevitable. But both refused because they didn't want my life impacted by the act of compassion. Thanks for this video-- I too hope it prompts clearheaded conversations. I deeply appreciate you speaking out on this important topic.
Some wounds never heal especially for those mentally scarred betrayed by their own so called friends, family, relatives etc. Even your shadow leaves you when you need someone to comfort you.
While suffering metastatic cancer, I had to take my dad's extremely old and equally sick cat to be euthanized, and while explaining this to him he interrupted "Oh! Sign me up while you're there." Anyway the veterinarian refused to help anyone but the cat, and my dad passed 3 weeks later. Thanks for leveraging your platform to expand minds on this topic.
If I were to end up in your father's situation, I hope I would still have the sense of humour to make a demand like his. Maybe we should hope that we would not need to.
I almost didn’t watch this because of the warning from RUclips. I have a son who suffers from depression and I didn’t want to hear anything about suicide. Thank you for posting the notice about it. I’m so glad I watched this. This is an important conversation to have. Thank you for sharing your mothers story 🙏🏽. In my years as an ICU nurse I’ve seen many patients die. I’m so sorry for your loss. Your mom sounds like a wonderful person and she must be greatly missed.
@@orangeants What does "good things" even mean in the context of this comment section? The vast majority of comments that I have read here say that state-sanctioned killing is a good thing. So is that what you mean? In a world in which people seriously argue that killing is good, one can no longer argue for what is "good" and have it understood. We are in the midst of a death cult in which the ultimate harm is being pushed as a good thing.
@@Fx_Explains Everyone already has a choice. Decent people steer others away from that choice, to protect them. Decent people want to promote the well-being of others. Decent people don't push for the state-sanctioned killing of people with mental health problems.
My dad was diagnosed terminal immediately, given 6 months, made it a bit more. That “bit more” was agonizing, humiliating, and mentally breaking for him. He broke down many times telling me “this isn’t what a father is like” as I cared for him. I wish he had the choice to go on his own terms. Medication didn’t touch his pain. He was literally begging to die in the end. It was extremely hard on me as I’ve been in support of having this choice since long before he became sick. All I could do was advocate for him and try to keep his head on straight. It was torture for all of us mentally, physically as well for him. I wish he had the choice to control that part of his illness.
Before my dad died I always thought I wouldn't be able to do it. To end someone's suffering. Now I wish I had been braver and made the choice for him, like he wanted me to.
@visx1792 at least you learned your lesson if my dad asked Me to pull the plug I would have done it because that's what he told me sadly my dad died at work a few months ago 😔 sometimes you gotta do the hard decisions
My grandfather, at 92, had lung cancer. He was told he had months to live. He died peacefully in his sleep, and the cause was put down to lung cancer. When cleaning out his room (he was in a nursing home) we found dozens of Eclipse mint tins; many empty, but many filled with unknown pills (not mints). We believe he took his own life to prevent the inevitable suffering he would soon be experiencing. I remember not being sad that he'd done that (we already new he was dying), but I was sad that he went through it alone. He must have been stockpiling pills for months, if not years. I don't know what the pills were, but if they were pain meds, it would mean he'd had no pain relief for a while in order to stockpile them. Thats months of being in pain, and not being able to tell anyone, and carrying this burden alone.
That's my plan, too. I might tell someone, who I know can be trusted to keep it a secret. I plan on asking them to bring me an expensive bottle of wine or single malt whisky (if I'm not able to myself) to enjoy the last few hours before taking the pills.
My father passed away in 2021 from pancreatic cancer. We’re canadian so it gave us a lot a reassurance throughout his illness that, if he were to need it, he could access MAID. In the end, despite extensive palliative care, the pain was too much and he chose to access MAID. He passed away peacefully, surrounded by his family. For me, it now seems so logical that it should be included in treatment options for patients in end of life care. Hoping the UK will soon make the right decision in legalizing the right to choose
@@ikr2377 you are assuming so much. nowhere did op say that their father was killed because he was a burden. the vast majority of people love their family and would never ever choose to end their loved one's life simply because they are a burden. OP clearly stated the reason their father was given medical aid in death was because he was in too much pain and preferred to die in peace than to go on and endure more pain. In no way does that indicate that OP and their family "killed their own because they became a burden". It signifies that OP and their family chose to support their dying father in whatever decision he made about his own life when he was put in a horrible situation by a terminal illness that caused him levels of pain no person should be forced to deal with. The amount of disrespect in your comment towards OP and their dead father, and the tragic situation they were placed in by an unfortunate illness, is honestly horrifying and you should reflect on why you felt it was appropriate to say that to anyone and why you jumped to the illogical and evidentially unsupported conclusion you did.
I live in California and we assisted death legalized here. When my grandpa was dying from heart failure we went through the process of obtaining the drugs for him, and while he never had to use them, he told me that having them there in the cupboard brought him great relief. He knew that if his condition became to painful to bear that he would be able to go out on his own terms, and that alone brought him a great deal of comfort.
@@Qwerty-jy9mj sure, death is always morbid, kind of by definition, but it doesn’t have to be agonizing. Death on your own terms, surrounded by family, is a beautiful thing. My grandpa was always fiercely independent, and while he hated being bed bound, I’m glad he could have that feeling of control over his life so he wasn’t in as much despair toward the end.
@@teachersusan3730 exactly, having a choice can make a terminally ill person feel that they still have some control over their life. While he did have considerable pain at times toward the end, he was able to feel that it was his choice to bear it and spend more time with his family, rather than feeling like he had no option for anything else.
My mum was diagnosed with stage 4 cancer and opted for assisted dying. I supported her through the last 2 months of deteriorating quality of life. It was the hardest time. She was happy to have some control over the end, planned her funeral, met the celebrant and counted the days and hours until the doctor arrived.
@@hopegold883 I keep finding myself thinking that I just can't imagine why a medical professional, whose most fundamental ethical principle is to do no harm, is advocating the ultimate harm: the killing of those whose lives are in his hands.
My grandpa went out that way, pulmonary fibrosis meant he could barely leave the house and the prednisone had a lot of side effects... there are worse terminal illnesses but it was never going to get better. Imagine being a world traveler, a photographer (he had a color video camera in the 60s and my aunt has a bookshelf full of his photos) and being stuck in your house hooked up to a machine for 5 years and knowing that's the rest of your life. On his 78th birthday with his wife and children's approval he took himself off the oxygen. I don't know that the hospice people helped but they knew and they didn't do anything to stop him. My grandma didn't grieve much. The man she wanted back and the man he wanted to be was already long gone, she'd grieved for him already.
Yeah, there's multiple deaths a person goes through and that the family grieve for. When my mom came home diagnosed stage 4 it was shock, grief that the life she'd led had actually left long ago and none of us had noticed yet. Then when she fell down the stairs and got sepsis, when she could no longer walk, when she lost her ability to speak, they were all deaths, and we grieved for every step. When she finally went, the entire family had been begging for God to end it, including her. Her passing was a guilty relief. God help the suffering souls of those in their greatest trial
I’m very sorry for your loss. My dad had the same condition. He got a lung transplant at 70 and got five “bonus” years before dying earlier this year from non lung issues that laid him low. He had a poor quality of life the last six months. It was very hard on him and my mom. He wouldn’t have accepted MAID though we do have it here. It was never on the table because I believe his doctors kept his poor prognosis from us. They also kept him from getting dialysis for months while inpatient and it baffled me.
@@eqwerewrqwerqre this is actually a good example of why religious mindsets are so often toxic. Why should you feel guilty that your loved one is no longer suffering needlessly?
This is so relatable to me. It made me cry early on. When I was around 14, my grandfather who was my father (by adoption) was dying from multiple myeloma and also suffering from dementia. I happened upon him and my grandmother in the bathroom. While she was getting him ready for another day sitting in his chair she said "how are you feeling" and he said "I'm already dead." He was totally lucid. The look on her face and his face and the realization even at that age almost broke me. He had spent his life as a no job too small carpenter, plumber, electrician. He could do math in his head I could only imagine. He hand carved wooden figurines with no reference. He was unbelievably physically and emotionally strong. A few days later he tried to body check me because he had to pay the taxes from '79 and needed to find his wife (my grandmother/mom) to do so. I had been tasked with "babysitting" him while my grandmother attempted to chip out our storing freezer in our basement. He was still physically stronger than me despite his degradation and almost made it to the basement stairs before my grandmother heard me hollering. He also left to get cigarettes once and got lost. He was so scared and so confused and so defeated. We did hospice in home where he had a horrible time eating, resting, and suffering. I only wish we could have removed some of that suffering from him, on his own terms. After the experience, my grandmother is now a DNR and talks openly about how she will go out on her own terms. So many people chastise her. I totally get it. I won't pull the trigger so to speak, but I won't stop her from making her decision.
Also, it is okay to cry. It's okay to still feel sad about what you did not or could not do for your loved one. Sending you love and caring this holiday season.
I think the person suffering has a better idea of what is in their future than any of us do. Our view of life formed over many decades, and that view is utterly unique to us. I increasingly often say, "Immortality is a young person's dream. To those of a ripe old age mortality is more a promise than a threat: you don't have to do this forever." As I enter my '70s everybody in my life understands that.
This reminds me of a lucid moment my grandpa had once, where he remembered the major events of the past few years like my granny dying. He said he'd been in a dark, dark place for years- he grabbed my arm and looked me dead in my soul and said "don't ever let this happen to you" with more emotion than I'd seen since granny died and he was much more lucid. shit broke me man. I know he would rather be dead.
And so we see that this is all about pure, naked, unabashed disablism. There is *absolutely nothing wrong* with being dependent on others and needing care. It is absolutely a *good thing* to care for those who need care. To say that to kill someone is better than to have them be dependent on others is pure evil.
@@omp199 this choice has nothing to do with the carer or whether they want the validation of looking after someone. It’s about the person suffering and their wishes. My grandfather lived an active and independent life but suffered indescribable pain and the complete loss of dignity in his last year. He wished for the end every single day even though he had the best care available. He was past the point of medication, parts of him were falling off, every breath was agony, he lost his sight…death was a mercy to him and he should have been able to go on his terms much sooner as his last year was much worse than death, it was torture
@@plobclop Yes. I understand perfectly well that when someone complains about another person's loss of independence, they are speaking from a point of view of selfishness: they don't want others to be dependent on them. You are utterly naïve if you can see all these people posting about how they wish their relatives could have died sooner and not see the blatant conflict of interests.
My heart breaks for your mum. I was under suspicion of ALS for a while and I hoarded pills, made a plan and crossed my fingers... I still have the pills and will forever hope for assisted death. I really wanted to live but at the same time I wanted to be able to choose how I die. We deserve to choose how we die in these circumstances.
yea, i feel the same. i’m only 18 but i feel death becomes more real to me as time goes on. the adults around me, my uncles and aunts and my parents, they’ve all gotten older as well. before i realized it, my mom is nearing 60. the end is inevitable and we can only die once, we might as well do it right and have a say if we’ve lived long enough
also i hope u’re doing good. an ALS diagnosis is something that i’d imagine completely changes your worldview. it’s a difficult disease to have. there’s a podcast called we’re all insane that interviews a surviving daughter of a man with ALS. it’s very sad but also inspiring; he accomplished a lot even with his diagnosis.
You've totally won me over as a subscriber... but you've also entirely changed my view on assisted dying. Just last year, around this time, I had a course on medical ethics where I held a stance that was totally against it. I'll forward this video to my friends at medical school. Going forward, I'll fully and publicly support assisted dying with understanding of all the nuances you mentioned. Thank you!
I don't understand how could you keep that stance and advocate for being against it while all it took you to sway you on the other side was 40 min RUclips video. I understand that your frontal cortex isn't fully developed but cmon. Do you change your political stance after reading a well made argument and justification for it? If so don't vote, please
@@bookwormd8627I believe that theirs comment was made just to garner likes. Because everyone loves to see when someone who was against something understand that theirs previous opinion has no basis in reality. It's sad but people do stuff like that for likes all the time and the fact they didn't answer for 4 weeks, you basically have a confirmation :)
@@0NeeN0”Do you change your political stance after reading a well-written argument and justification for it?” Do you not? If an argument successfully counters all of my points, then I will change my opinion. If you don’t, then don’t vote, please
@@0NeeN0 I don't think your inferences are robust. Sometimes people just want to say their piece and be done, they may have better things to do than get into the weeds of a discussion in the RUclips comments. I assume you are against assisted dying, and seeing others who once shared your point of view being persuaded to change their views is uncomfortable for you. You could be right, but you cannot just assume that the OP was not genuine just because it is disagreeable to you. That's ostrich behaviour.
I’m Dutch, so I’ve pretty much grown up with the idea that helping someone pass on with dignity is the most humane thing we can do. We do it for our pets, like you said, so people should have the same right, to die without excruciating pain.
It's a fairly recent thing in the Netherlands still. The process is lengthy and arduous and you need a doctor who agrees with you. If your doctor is of the opinion your illness is bearable then screw you, endure it. It's still completely illegal outside of this specific pathway, mind. You'd still have to die alone and prepare privately if your doctor is dragging their feet, because it's illegal for anyone to "help"; that includes simply being aware of your suicide attempt and not intervening. I.e., being present and saying goodbye.
It has been in the law sinds 2002, (that's not that long to me, but maybe I'm getting old). There are still kinks to work out but I'm glad it's there as an option
@@ApequH time ia very relative, 2002 were 21 years ago of you were born 2003 and more the law is older than you and 21 is most legal age in many countries. it's true tho that for laws making progress takes so much time.
Well it would have been happening low-key in many places around the world. Often doctors would give a little too much painkiller, then write the death certificate. Of course this relied on a lot of trust with the doctor involved.
My grandfather had a rapid form of Alzheimer's and Parkinson's hit him at the same time. He had been extremely healthy his whole life (still landscaping daily in his mid 60s) and was always a very independent person. as he started to lose function and his brain started struggling it tore him apart. Thankfully here in Canada we have a program for assisted dying that he was able to use. It gave us the chance to spend some time with him, help him with a couple bucket list items and best of all help some other people. Since he was going to go through with assisted dying and it was really only his nervous system falling apart he was able to not only donate his organs to research and to save lives (his lungs especially) but it allowed for them to better setup the procedure for the recipient. When he found out that he could still help people and not have to suffer it helped him immensely with coming to peace with everything. I am immensely grateful that this option was available and that should something like that happen to any of us it is reassuring that we won't have to suffer needlessly.
Bless your grandfather, really, truly. I hope that one day we can solve these diseases, but, in the meantime, it is bittersweet and beautiful that he was able to spend amazing final moments with family, and gift future amazing moments to those in need of organs.
That is a beautiful and moving story. It is wonderful that he able to live the last of his life to the fullest and make such a difference even in death. Thank you for sharing it.
So sorry you all had to go through that. Thank you for sharing - it's a beautiful story and shows how valuable such a program is for everyone involved.
I had a grandfather who had been a Royal Marine whose career had spanned 2 world wars. I'm not saying that he was the bravest man in the world, but he was someone who had seen death close up. He wasn't a fearful man. As a small child he'd told me that 'big girls don't cry', when full of tears, I'd run to him for comfort. But then, a few years later, my mum and I visited him in hospital after he'd had yet another severe stroke. He was crying. He looked at me through the tears. He didn't want to be there. Fifty years later, I still remember that scene and it still fills me full of tears. I am signed up to the Dignity In Dying newsletter and support their cause. We allow our pets to have their suffering ended, why not our own family?
Your grandfather was brave, he fought in the trenches and the fight against Hitler. I also completely agree with you, sometimes, even though it is hard, sometimes it’s better to end the suffering.
I remember being 5 and 6 and hearing my mom scream about dying and just wanting to go. She had lung cancer that went to ovarian and then to brain cancer. My grandmother was supposed to care for her but she was always too drunk to come over. One time she told me to hand her her medicine which i thought was weird because my dad or I always gave her the meds. I did not do it because something felt off and tbh sometimes I regret not doing it because she died at around 80 or 90 pounds, and suffered the entire time.
What a fantastic video, I’m sorry your mum went through that. I too have had family members in the UK suffer for months on end only to be given morphine in their last moments. It’s so unnecessary to suffer for so long and have that final moment decided by the willingness of the doctor to administer the medicine. It’s all so arbitrary. I now live in Oregon and I think assisted dying is very popular here (not that it comes up in conversation all that much) In Oregon you have to be physically capable of administering the medicine yourself so all the doctor needs to do is approve the prescription. Like you said throughout the video it’s giving the patient control to decide for themselves.
Jem also died after a year with MND, in early 2019. And our daughter, a doctor, diagnosed him several months before we got the official diagnosis. No one should be forced to face such a death right to the end.
A total lie. In civilised countries, we look after people, and care for them until the end, managing their pain so that they can be as comfortable as possible. No civilised country sanctions the deliberate killing of those of its citizens most in need of care.
As a uk nurse I found this incredibly respectful, considerate and thought provoking. As someone who works with older adults I often consider the importance of achieving a dignified, pain free 'patient centred' death. Thank you for this video and giving me more to research and think about. I am sorry for your loss of your Mum.
My grandfather didn't do assisted dying, but he'd had a fall at 94 and decided it was time. He was fully lucid. We all said goodbye. A week later he died, despite doctors saying nothing in particular was physically wrong. He just let his body shut down and left the world. I think about him a lot. I wish everyone could have such a graceful and conscious exit when their time has come. Australia is slowly bringing it in but still too slow for many that are suffering beyond anything they humanely deserve.
I saw my grandfather pass away painfully over a period of 2 weeks, and the doctors didn't allow us to take him off the ventilator. My parents and uncle and aunt spent thousands and thousands to essentially prolong his suffering. It was the saddest thing I saw. I can't imagine what it would have been like for you to see your mom suffer for so long. But I hope she can see how important people like you are to the world.
2 weeks 😩 I'm so sorry he had to go through that and you had to witness it. In September , I watched my 41-year-old husband die over 5 days and actively die in a little over 12 hours. He was in so much pain and discomfort over the last year and 3 months of his life, but it was awful in his last days. His oxygen levels were within the normal range and yet he was gasping for air saying he couldn't breathe. The cancer had spread to his skull and was pressing on a cranial nerve so in the last days of his life he wasn't able to fully close his eye. At one point I had rested my head on his shoulder and looked up toward his eyes in the process and could see his cornea had started to deteriorate. I was seeing my husband's body break down before he was even dead. He was in so much pain that even as he lost the ability to verbally communicate he moaned in pain. The night he came home I asked the hospice nurse how long he might live and he said 2 days. I was shocked at the prospect of my favorite person leaving me and our 3-year-old behind so soon, but I also felt relieved he would not suffer for weeks. We afford animals a more dignified and comfortable death, why should that option not be extended to people? I don't know that my husband would have chosen that, but it would have been nice for him to have the choice. It's almost 4 months since he died and it's still hard for me to see past the cloud of suffering that enveloped the last year and 3 months of his life. I know there was good, but it's so hard to remember it over all the suffering.
@@ijustneedmyselfI'm really sorry. I'm going through a harsh period in my life too rn studying to be a doctor. It's so hard being left behind, even my parents and friends don't understand my feelings and sacrifices. I didn't make a mistake yet i always get judged and blamed. I hate not receiving emotional support when you need it the most especially when you suffer from depression, heath anxiety and trouble studying and coping with academic setbacks. My parents would rather force me into darkness than rescue me. The feeling of depression and hopelessness with frustrated is soul crushing and agonizing. I still try to live and move on but the past still haunts me and i have a lot of regret. I could only share my pain to complete strangers since the close ones never really care and are busy in their own lives
I am a Canadian. I have supported MAID all my adult life, and I still do. I believe it has a place. But you are entirely incorrect about the pressure. We do have some pretty public cases that arose with military veterans who were denied help with access to their health needs and encouraged (and documented) to take MAID if they were suffering so badly. There is a nasty kind of eugenicist faction of people that do exist, and are within the bureaucracies and power holding positions. The Federal government even did a cost benefit analysis on the matter to show the economic benefits of offering MAID over the cost of prolonged care (which is thoroughly offensive, and rather unethical in my opinion). There are also more and more cases of people who are enduring suffering that can be alleviated by better access to health care services and equipment, but most significantly alleviating their poverty and housing precarity. I still do believe in the need for MAID and compassion and dignity in death. But there absolutely needs to be strong challenging of the eugenist-y type folk, as well as a HUGE social investment in access to the things that bring quality of life. Once someone has had full access to those things, and if they feel their suffering exceeds (or will exceed) any possibility of having what they consider as a good life, that is where MAID should be available,
The ghouls in Canada that do this are incredibly protected by the Canadian Government and Media. I believe even reporting on it in the next few years will be considered hate speech and a crime. Seeing how they internally celebrate which demographics and how much money they were "saving" by targeting who they deemed not an asset to life was sickening and I have no doubt any government supported MAID program will devolve into this. I have no problem with a Doctor prescribing a treatment outside of the system that leads to death if the patient shows consent. But after seeing a regional director for transplants smugly tell her peers that nobody who wasn't fully covid vaccinated would receive any transplants under her watch, I have completely lost faith in medical bureaucracy, but not the practicing doctors themselves.
As a non-Canadian I first heard about the MAID system from an article about a disabled woman who was offered the program after having trouble getting a wheelchair accessible ramp installed outside her house a year or two ago, off the top of my head. I'm 100% for an assisted suicide system when it comes to late stage terminal illnesses or debilitating chronic conditions assuming they have their mental faculties about them. The waters are a bit murkier when it comes to neurodegenerative diseases or TBI where the patient isn't in the right mind to make that decision for themselves Like at what stage into the disease should they proceed with the procedure or where's the break off point where someone with a TBI can still live a fulfilling life. For possible future cognitive impairing cases I think it would be a good idea if from adulthood every citizen could opt in or out of the program in an appointment with their GP with an extensive list of conditionals such as the few I listed above where the decision can't really be made after. (To be reviewed every 5-10 years in early adulthood and increasing in frequency as you age) But the thought that it has been offered as an alternative solution for people with disabilities due to the lack of state resources sickens me. Also I remember reading at the time that they were introducing mental health conditions as a sole qualifier for the procedure which actually scares me, like really terrifies me... It's apparently being pushed back until March next year though while adjustments are being made. It's such a broad qualifier though and I admittedly have no idea of the specific requirements. On a personal level though I've a history of mental illness going on over a decade now, through the years I've had plenty of bad episodes where suicidal ideation plagues my mind. I only drink a few times a year and when I do it's almost a 50/50 chance that these thoughts turn into bawling self deprecating breakdowns or rarely actual attempts on life. But these thoughts are transitory and I'm also capable of being happy and have family members with disabilities who are dependant upon me. Obviously if I hypothetically had the MAID system in my country and booked an appointment during one of these episodes there would be enough time between my call and when I get an actual appointment that my mindset would change and I could cancel my appointment. But I'd be worried that if I were to have an episode again, book and cancel ad infinitum that I'd eventually be given an ultimatum to attend the appointment or be cut off from the service altogether. I don't truly want to be dead though but it's hard to convince yourself when you're in that state, I really just need better help than our social services currently provide.
I mean, we do need to increase social investment, but I'm of the opinion we don't hold people here if they don't want to be here, based on the supposed promise that we'll invest in society to help them. Having met my fellow Americans, and seeing that Canada seems to have the same types, they'll talk big game of the need to invest, but when the bill comes, they'll squash it every time because "We just can't afford it."
I've had two friends who had a parent, who in an extremity of agonizing pain, from the progress of an incurable cancer, begged their son to kill them. One, dying of liver cancer & under home hospice care, talked her son into trying - despite massively overdosing her, she didn't die & he couldn't bring himself to try again - she died in agony. Another, his father dying of a bone cancer that was inside his spine, couldn't find it in him to assist his father in dying - so his father died in agony as tumors attacked his spinal column. Children shouldn't be forced to make these kinds of decisions on parents who have no hope of recovery and are in so much pain. And before the religious attack me: there is no meaning or dignity in going through such suffering - and you are welcome to go through such if you have the misfortune to suffer such a disease if you believe your God wants that for you.
My great grandmother did assist with her husband's death well before I was born. It was also always a fairly open secret in the family. They had discussed it years before and everyone knew about their decision, each promising to help the other if needed. While it was an ethical choice it still destroyed her. For years she felt guilty and never stopped grieving his death. But I can't help but compare it to her death, drugged into a stupor by staff at a care home. She actually ended up with neurological issues from being over medicated. In the end her death was without dignity and long after she had lost her mind. I can also say of the two it was her death that I grew up afraid of, not my great grandfather's. I still feel she shouldn't have had to shoulder that burden, especially since she had to suffer in secret but I also know from her death what a gift she gave him.
@@kaedri8How exactly? RUclips detectives that are going to work hard at identifying him, not even knowing his jurisdiction, so they can figure out which one of his friends did something out of love for their parent years ago? You seriously think those that fight crime don't have more productive and important things to do? Silly and naive of you to say that.
I’m completely blown away by this. I have an ADRT and a living will. I don’t want to die in an ICU, tortured by needles, weird noises, delirium and pain that I can’t communicate. I’m so sorry to hear about your mum. I support the assisted dying law. All the best Rohin. Have a great festive season and all the best for 2024.
This was a wonderful video! My Auntie died from MND and she had a choice - starve or choke to death! She basically starved. I have just nursed my grandmother through palliative care - she was 96. I was given oramorph to give her if the pain became too much and I was told she probably wouldn't wake up again - she didn't. I was so grateful for our District Nurses. I'm so sorry for your loss x
I volunteer as a patient companion at my local hospital, and because of this I was previously against assisted dying, I felt that it would be a very dangerous thing to give people the option to end the lives of such vulnerable people, who are often suffering as much due to environmental factors as heath related factors. Your clear arguments in favour of legal provisions necessitating terminal illness and mental clarity in order for assisted dying has helped persuade me that it may be possible to implement it ethically. Great video!
@@m00se40Also because if their suffering also makes them mentally incapable they can't really speak for themselves and people deciding they should die because this random person judges their suffering worthy of death is super dangerous. The frail, the disabled, the "drains on society" would be euthanized. This MAID gets very close to euthanasia. Doctors should not be in the business of dying, but saving and preserving life. Comfort measures and hospice though is a bit different though there is a fine line and overlap..
I remember my grandmother wasting away to cancer when she was 57. She'd been professionally cleaning at a factory her entire life. The cleaning agents had benzene in them. I know society didn't know that it would give cancer at that times, but the least we could have done for her was to let her have peace. Peace before she became so skinny and eaten by the cancer, that just laying on her bones made her groan in agony. I still remember the scream she gave when the nurses had to turn her over for her bedbound wash. I was 5... It marked me for life, it was a terrible way to be introduced to the concept of death as a child. The 4th of October this year, the "Danish National Center for Ethics" decided that there is "Too much at play, regarding our basic view of human life, to recommend assisted suicide in Denmark" (Directly translated we call it 'active deathhelp', which I lowkey find hilarious). It pisses me off. Also: Thank you for sharing your story about your mother. She sounds like she was a lovely person 😊
@@Kristina-ek8yt I don't understand what you mean by "population prevention." If it is population control, rest easy: the total fertility rate in Denmark is 1.67 births per woman, and has been under the "replacement rate" of 2.1 for half a century.
Hello Rohin. I am very sorry about your Mum. May she rest in peace I am anesthesiologist, and my older brother passed away from ALS in 2015, after immense suffering. This video hits home Thank you for doing this.
Hey, sorry if this reply is weird, but how did you come to be an anesthesiologist? I’m in high school but I’m thinking of following the medical track, what education and how long?
I’m an M.D in Mexico, like in most countries, assisted dying si not legal and, to be honest, because of limited resources, end of life care is barely available for the Mexican population. This video felt extremely personal to me, as I have recently lost a very dear family member. My grandfather was diagnosed with peripheral artery disease, because of the extent of his vascular lesions, he was no longer a candidate for revascularization surgery, only palliative care was an option. The pain he suffered during his last months was something I can’t even begin to imagine. Despite being treated with morphine and other opioids, he was in constant pain. He was a traveler, the life he knew was no longer available to him, and that made him extremely sad. I have always thought we, as doctors, have the ability not only to cure, but also the opportunity to help our patients die in a peaceful and honorable way, surrounded by their loved ones. Every human being should be able to decide how he/she wants to go. In Mexico assisted dying is a topic that’s surrounded by stigma and taboo, I hope one day this changes. I don’t want any more of my family members to suffer in their final years, months or days. They, as well as everyone, deserve to decide when enough is enough. Thank you for sharing your story, I have always admired your work, and now, more than ever, I do.
@@Qwerty-jy9mj oh please, the two doctors are talking about seeing someone suffering immense pain at the end of their life, and asking whether that person should be able to ask for and be given some medical assistance to bring their life to an end somewhat sooner. It's neither accurate nor respectful nor helpful to call it murder, and nor is it being considered as a matter of policy - rather, an option, a choice that an individual with a terminal illness may wish to make. You may not want that choice for yourself, but other people do - should they be given a right to self-determination?
@@Qwerty-jy9mjYour rhetoric barely makes sense. The original sentence’s subject wasn’t even the patient, but the doctor who you accused of actively trying to make excuses for murdering someone. It isn’t disrespectful for someone to fulfil their loved ones last wish of being buried under a tree even if you believe in cremating now is it? In the end, the scenario is two willing participants doing something they both think is right. It would only be murder if the law said it was illegal to do that. Although whether you think that is moral is your opinion.
Rohin, thanks for using such a personal story to advocate for something so important. I had a similar experience with my father (CHF & Parkinsons); his final months on hospice were really difficult for him. I honestly don't know if he would have chosen a physician assisted death, but it wasn't an option for him in Pennsylvania at the time. As someone practicing in California, I can assure your viewers that no slippery slope has happened here since a law was passed to allow it as of 2016.
I'm sorry that RUclips has taken their pearl-clutching position toward this video of yours. Your videos are consistently insightful and spark valuable conversation on difficult topics. And as always, you manage to sprinkle in just enough humor and wit to balance the heavier topics without detracting from the gravity of the discussion.
I think the warning is appropriate because some people really don't have the mental capacity to deal with a topic like this. But I also believe that everyone who can at least consider the topic should watch this video despite the warning.
I can imagine this might be a very distressing topic for some people, or at certain times, and on that basis, I don't object to the warning. I guess the video does not get promoted through recommendations, and that seems to be a pity, because more people should think about these issues, if they are able to. One would expect that the algorithm could make such an inference if it has sufficient viewing history to analyse.
I had to put down my dog a week ago today (I'm not trying to compare that to losing a parent, but loss sucks no matter how you swing it). This was a very cathartic video, you handled the subject matter with a great deal of respect and nuance. Thank you!
Yes... my dog Marty had heart failure. We were unreasonably optimistic that he would survive with medication. Three months after his original diagnosis he was on double the medication. Three months later... his left atrium collapsed. Three days later we held him when he died, he died at peace home in our arms thanks to the help of a vet. I miss him everyday. I cannot imagine a human being suffering for years and years with heart failure and not getting to comfortably take a full breath or say when you've had enough. Considering the other medical issues humans can suffer with.
I lost my sweet mother, I’ve lost dearly beloved pets. And while I can safely say, that I’ve been thoroughly devastated by the loss of my cats. Even similarly to losing my mom. Love is love, grief is grief, the biggest difference is how losing a pet, compared to losing a beloved one, is how it impacts our daily lives.
There are two sides to my opinion on this, and they both have the same conclusion. Pets are family. If humans and animals are considered equal, then we should all have equal access to a comfortable death and not be forced to suffer. On the other hand, if humans are more important than animals, then it is even more cruel that we aren't allowed to forego that suffering and have a comfortable death. Whatever your stance on the value of humans vs animals, my opinion remains the same.
@@MedlifeCrisis That is one way to cope with it. You know what I mean. I have noticed it in some professional medics that I know. Ever since I was "under the knife" of a surgeon and his team and they found out that I work where I work and noticed how cynical I am (maybe it was the opiates I received for the pain), we got along way better than I ever expected. I still want to "show him" in a couple of years, as a pun to one of his anecdotes, just to prove him "wrong". A couple of years must pass. But I will pay him a visit. In good manner, obviously.
As a Nebula viewer, I saw this earlier today. It was quite heartbreaking to see you so emotional at the end and I got rather teary as well. Thanks for such a comprehensive look on a rather unduly controversial topic, Dr. Rohin.
My grandpa is suffering from stage 4 cancer right now. (If i remember correctly it started in the throat, but spread to his whole body by the time he started treatment.) Hes quite literally in his final days. When hes not sleeping hes barely sane enough to talk. His organs are falling apart and theybe had to put him on morphine. Hes having hallucinations too. Sometimes asking my grandma to bring a gun or a rope. He cant even sit up on his own, all he can do is suffer. If a person is essentially waiting for death, but constantly in pain, then I think being able to give them a painless and quick death is objectively the better option. Euthanasia isnt a thing where we live though, neither is assited dying. Every day im half expecting to get the message that hes dead, but its possible he'll remain in that state for over a week. I cant imagine just how painful it must feel to feel every bit of yourself fall apart and wither away, and all you can do is suffer.
Thank you Rohin. I remember my grandmother begging us to "let her rest" in her final months of her struggle with cancer. There was a conflict between and within every party involved. We tried to cling to hope and try as many things as possible to try to make her better. My grandfather bankrupted himself by going to pill peddlers and scammers selling healing teas, promising they would cure her in weeks. He said he would do it all over again just for that 0.nothing chance that he was getting something real. On the other hand my grandmother was furious and increasingly depressed because of the whole situation, feeling as you said the loss of control. She died peacefully in a coma in a diaper, her last days dulled by morphine, and her last years a husk of her former self. She was the first natural death in the family in 50 years. Her parents and in-laws had all committed suicide to avoid terminal illnesses. It was considered tradition almost. If my country had the option for assisted dying, she could have pleaded her case at least.
this is something that i’m also so incredibly passionate about, thank you for speaking about your mum! i’m MD1 from australia and work in the medical ethics space and have seen so many studies come through assessing voluntary assisted dying over the last 4 years and for the most part it has been so overwhelmingly positive. the only groups we have against it are the church funded researchers that try to lobby against it being legislated in each of the states but thankfully they’ve been unsuccessful. how anyone can think they have the right to so much power over other people’s lives is beyond me. end of life care should NOT be something people, ESPECIALLY doctors, are shy to talk about, and assisted dying is 100% a significant part of compassionate CARE. thank you for working towards such a great cause! PS there’s a great australian movie called “last cab to darwin” which is about VAD, worth a watch!
Last year, my partners father passed via assisted dying. He had terminal colon cancer. It was an extremely difficult experience but he was very clearly so close to being in a far worse state. We were all extremely grateful that his suffering didn’t progress and it wasn’t prolonged. He spent every moment he could with us until he truly no longer could. Thank you for this beautiful video and for sharing your thoughts. I am very much in support of assisted dying.
100% for it. I have MS and thankfully my symptoms are easy right now, but I have no certainty for how long that's going to last. I've spoken to people who have already lost nearly all mobility to it and there's a permanent heavy cloud weighing them down. I'd rather sign a paper asking for alleviation than struggle endlessly in a world where wheelchair accessibility is just a cute afterthought and with a disease that robs you of your dignity. Having the certainty that it's actually terminal unlike desperate DIY solutions would be very comforting.
I'm very sorry you are going through this. Hopefully with all the progress in immunotherapies, those who will be diagnosed in the future will have better outcomes. Autoimmune diseases are a special hell.
Though it still happens progressive disability in patients with MS happens a lot less these days. Therapy developed a lot in the last 20 years. If someone takes an appropriate therapy no disease progression is an achiveable goal.
My aunt used assisted dying. She was able to enjoy her time left, without the worry of pain and a slow death. She was able to go on holidays, visiting family, being visited etc, while still being able to and not having to through chemo or other treatments. I think that I also would want my family to see me, while i'm in a good state and spend some quality time with them, compared to being bedridden or something else. Idk, it probably depends on the situation :D The only thing i found weird was knowing the date beforehand. Usually when you have a old family member who is sick, you know that the death will come soon, but will always be somewhat suprised when it sets in (thats the case for me atleast). But with assisted dying you are able to plan a visit, accept it and talk with the person. I think it gave me closure aswell.
In 2017 I watch my mother go from a moderately healthy women in her late 50’s to gasping and wheezing. The cancer in her stomach had metastasized and spread up through her lungs and brain. My last memory was of her being hooked up to a hose that forced air into her lungs once a minute. She was so delirious in her last days and I didn’t get to say goodbye to my mother, just her body.
A few months ago my grandfather passed away using MAID in Canada. He suffered from prostate cancer that metastasized to his bones, causing hundreds of tiny bone fractures in his bones, especially the spine, pelvis, hips, and ribs. He was in such terrible agony near the end when the nurses did as little as turn him onto his other side. His condition deteriorated gradually over many months, with doses of prescription painkillers escalating over time to insane levels that still couldn’t put a dent in the terrible pain. Luckily,a few months in advance, he started setting the process of MAID in order in case it got to the point that he needed it, even though he was unsure he would ever use it. I am ultimately very grateful he could. It was past his time.
You did give your mom the death she wanted. Her breathing gave out while she relaxed with morphine in her veins. It just wasn’t as early as she would’ve wanted. She looked so happy in the photos with the family. I’m sure she was quite the woman and so proud of her son, the doctor.
For those who are based outside the UK, the term "learning disability" at 6:06 under UK contexts means a general decreased ability to learn, rather than the US definition (which is also used in many non-English-speaking countries) of inability to learn some academic subjects in conventional ways, e.g. dyslexia, dyscalculia, ADHD, etc. Its US equivalent would be some sort of intellectual disability, or disorders that cause physical disabilities and intellectual disabilities at the same time, like cerebral palsy. LDs in US contexts would be called "learning difficulties" in the UK.
At the end of my Dad's life, when his organs were failing and he was in great pain, the doctor asked him if he wanted morphine, warning him that it could hasten his end. He took it gladly. We could see the relief in his eyes when the morphine finally hit and he passed within a couple of hours with all of us with him. I will be forever grateful that the doctor had the compassion to offer this. I've seen a few people die in intractable pain. It is not necessary. There is nothing noble about this. Allowing someone to choose to end their suffering should not be a crime. As so many have noted, if you put a pet through what the terminally ill are expected to suffer you would be considered inhumane. Thank you for your courage in sharing your mother's story. She seems like a remarkable woman.
Thank you for this video. I’m a medical professional as well and it’s so true that though you have a body of medical knowledge, you stand by helplessly watching your family die. My mom, an oncology nurse, died from cancer…the last 2 months of her life weren’t worth living, in my opinion. She suffered. I doubt my mom would have actually chosen death with dignity, but the thought that my pets have better deaths than my own mom was an absolute truth.
I lost my mum to cancer in 2014. In the previous year, the cancer spread to her spinal cord, where it robbed her of her ability to walk. She was one of the most independent and fierce people I've ever known, and I watched her slow decline and worse - saw how increasingly afraid she was. I wish I could say that her final months didn't tar the memory I have of her, but in truth, there will always be a shadow over the thoughts I hold of her. I don't know if she would have chosen assisted dying, but at least if it were there, perhaps she wouldn't have been so afraid. Also, she DEFINITELY would have made fun of that cardigan
Yes, I completely agree that we should help those that have no possible treatment to easy their suffering, even by helping they die. That was a very emotional video. I'd like to add that although this is a channel focused on the content, the delivery is what really makes the difference. You are a great communicator, with a sharp sense of humor that makes us appreciate even more the topics that you cover. I guess, what I'm trying to say is that you're basically likable.
My mother died of COPD and the doctor talked about her death as "taking her off the ventilator," but in practice the nurse administered morphine every few minutes until she stopped breathing. It was much more like putting down a pet than I ever had expected.
As someone who lives with depression and suicidal ideation, I find it absurd and absolutely inappropriate for RUclips to put a suicide warning on this video. Assisted dying for the terminally ill is not at all comparable to suicide by people who could probably actually have been helped if they'd had access to the appropriate medical care. The two are not equivalent.
I am so sad this video got flagged as inappropriate, I hope this get rectified as soon as possible. If you ever would like to discuss such topics further, I would be really interested in hearing your opinion on people diagnosed with incurable neuro degenerative disease which wish to end their suffering.
"Do no harm" right ? But what happens when the most harm being done is by forcing a patient to live ? A great question indeed, and some people seem to confuse "do no harm" for "keep people alive no matter the cost"
Having a 93 yo grandma and seeing her slowly going downhill, having an option to do this feels almost necessary. In a few short years, she has gone from the lady that is almost always outside, tending her garden and flowers, to being almost unable to go outside, having to wear diapers and struggling to even lift a cup of tea. This has taken a huge mental toll on her and everyone around her, which makes her feel more and more like a burden. Although she does not have any terminal illness and does not suffer much pain beyond the usual old age things, the possibility that it could start at any time scares her more then the death itself. She just wants to die peacefully, and even just knowing that there is an option to do that, would give her more relief and peace of mind that any medication possibly could.
Yep. I am only 24, but I would love to have the option to choose when to die. The endless void of death scares me less than being unable to take care of myself or even worse, lose my mind to dementia. My grandpa died after suffering with COPD for about 30 years, which is longer than expected. No man or woman should have to suffer such a slow and painful death.
I fully agree. I do not have the numbers, but expect that many people were actually calmed down by knowing that there is a "way out", which increased the quality of their life and many of them even did not need to resort to the "way out". I hope I will never ever be forced into such a situation, regardless from which side.
Thank you for talking about this on such a public platform. When I worked as a vet nurse, I observed two types of deaths: the controlled and the uncontrolled. The controlled cases would involve a terminally ill animal who was suffering, so it's human owners would make the immensity difficult decision to bring their loved pet in for their final rest. Every one of those final moments I watched was peaceful, respectful, and filled with love. The uncontrolled cases often involved terminally ill pets too, but the owners... for various personal reasons, they couldn't bring themselves to organize euthanasia for their pet. Those deaths I witnessed were very sad. The pet suffered longer than it needed to and, when they were in their last hours of life, their human owner would panic and rush them to the vet in the hopes we could prolong their life (even if we had discussed at length that prolonging life was not medically possible for that health condition). Those pets suffered and to be honest their last moments were surrounded by panic and fruitless medical intervention, not love. I wish those owners could have remained calm and just held their pets allowing them to die peacefully at home in their loving owners arms. After seeing so many types of deaths, even "just" for pets, I very strongly support allowing a terminally ill person to die with dignity. When my own auntie died from cancer, I was so incredibly thankful to live in Australia where the palliative care team allowed my aunt to be surrounded by family. She had a room by the rose garden, we all got to tell her how much we love her, I even baked my aunt her favorite cherry pie, and she was given enough morphine to not be in pain for the first time in years. She fell asleep and never woke up, but she knew she was loved and she was given a dignified death. Everyone deserves this type of kindness.
Hey doc, it is so brave of you to talk about such a significant loss in your life and I really appreciate your courage. I also firmly believe that if everyone had your sense of rationality and calmness the world would truly be a better place Keep up the great work👍👍
I am an MD, I am from Switzerland with it’s special rules - and I lost my brother to colon cancer. He had perfect palliative care and could leave very peacefully, so no „help“ needed. But you bet I watched this video carefully. You didn’t disappoint 😌👍
This video was tremendous. As a doctor who wants to go into palliative care I saw a lot of this struggle during my intern year. You’ve laid it out well and succinctly and also made a lovely connection with the story about your mum. Palliative care is often in opposition to it but I feel that a lot of younger doctors (like me) feel that it’s an important change that needs to happen. I’m from Australia so I’ve seen it already and I feel that from what I’ve seen, it’s an important choice for patients to have.
I think this kind of stuff is very easy to explain the following way: if a person is KNOWN to die in the nearest future, there is no information that their condition could ever improve, and all indications show that it is only going to get worse, and ALL known/possible workarounds have been tried and have proved unsuccessful, then that person absolutely has the right to choose how they die. Personally I think this should apply even if that person is not currently in great pain, but that part is obviously subjective. If I had an incurable disease that caused me enough discomfort, even if I could tolerate it, and I knew that it would only get worse - why would I want to wait until the pain becomes unbearable? That just feels like prolonging the inevitable, causing everyone more suffering than necessary (obviously me, but also everyone who cares about me seeing me suffer and grieving from it), and wasting unnecessary resources on maintaining my miserable existance that would be much better spent on much more useful stuff, e.g. if I knew that keeping my dying ass alive for one more year would cost my relatives and the healthcare system a combined total of 100k€, then I would MUCH rather kill myself and have those 100k€ donated to orphanages, animal shelters, research institutions, etc.
Me too, and my mom also expressed interest in doing that as well... I know I'm only 26 but you just never know when something like this will happen And well, my dad's cousin actually got his one way ticket to Switzerland back in 2017... He had terminal prostate cancer (a very aggressive one btw), he wanted to do that bc he was scared to end up like my paternal grandpa in his final days (who also died from prostate cancer in 2015, he was 64 and I miss him so much 😭) and had the money to go there to have dignified end of life... Nobody in his close family agreed to that (him mom, brothers and nephew), but one of his friends (also his band mate) decided to go with him... He chose Dignitas and that companion is required for the post-death procedures, especially in his case bc we are from Brazil which is far away from Switzerland Anyways, he was able to rest in a peaceful, painless way shortly after his 56th birthday in 2017... He got to cheer with one of his mates with metal music and it was great to him and I'm happy he was able to get his one way ticket to Switzerland I was already favorable of that to me before, but after this dad's cousin experience it only reinforced my wishes to do that one day tbh
Both my mum's parents had strokes and had many months of simply lying there looking pleadingly at her and her brother and sister to help them go peacefully and with some dignity. The worst was my grandmother who saw her husband of 55 years go then went through it herself, after making her kids promise not to let the doctors do that to her. My mum was adamant not to go like that. And being a New Zealander, she now almost certainly won't.
My mother died of terminal lung cancer. I was fortunate enough that I could care for her till the end, but it only proved to me how cruel it is to deny people the chance of an easy and dignified way out. In the end there was nothing left for her but pain and indignity. If I ever get diagnosed with something like that I hope I'll have the courage to end it on my own terms...
Part of why I hate December so much is the shadow of my dad's illness. 24/12 - I found my dad rolling on the floor in agony, his one clear request was for me to help him die.... I didn't and I regret that decision every day. What followed my refusal were two of the most harrowing, painful and undignified months of his life, before he died alone in a hospital bed having had most of his bowels removed and barely weighing a third of his original weight. Since then shame is my companion this time of year, that I was either a coward or arrogant in whatever principles I thought prevented me from that act of mercy. I strongly support assisted dying or dignity in death care, the reasons against it do not hold much weight, but then I speak as someone who failed and is haunted by that, I don't want anyone else to feel so helpless, alone or ashamed. Thanks Rohin, your story meant a lot to me and too many others. I hope the good memories are never far from you and that many more await you.
My mum who was in a rest home with little quality of life (I was unable to care for her myself), begged me to supply her with sleeping tablets - but we'd had a case in NZ where a daughter in a similar situation ended up in jail for doing similar and so this idea was discarded. I discovered chatting with my mum that before she ended up in the rest home, she had actually tried to overdose on medication - but the attempt failed and was unpleasant and she was too scared to try again - she told me and others that she had flu' which she recovered from that. Finally she decided - and yes she was still capable of making decisions (and had a long-standing 'living will') - to stop medication, food and water. I'm glad the nursing home respected her living-will, though they did ask me if they had my permission to withhold meds (as though I owned my mother's life). I sat with her and "luckily" it only took about 36 hours for her to die, but also, I suspect an iron-will to refuse particularly water - she wouldn't even let me moisten her lips - such was her resolve. This should have been so much easier for a woman who deserved so much better. She should have had better choices. My very best wishes to you, Rohin.
Thank you for making this content. Most medical channels on youtube are either pure education or surface-level entertainment. I like that you dig into the ethical and systemically problematic parts of medicine that most people outside (or inside) the system don't think about.
Oh my god, your story is almost identical to my own mother's 😢 She underwent an operation for bowel cancer, and when I went to see her after, her voice was slightly slurred. We thought nothing of it. She then choked, and I saved her with the heimlich, then a month later, my brother had to do the same. Sure enough, 9 months later they diagnosed her with bulber palsy. I and my siblings too took care of our mother in her last 2 years. The worst thing was, that from the second time she choked, I knew it was the symptoms of bulber palsy, because I had written a fiction piece on someone with it, and did a lot of research on the illness, and this was only a short time before her initial operation. I don't think she would of availed of assisted death, as I feel she went after she said goodbye to those she loved, but I know she would have wanted the option for others. It's haunting to me how many people both around me and in the media have had some form of mnd, whereas I only really knew of Stephen Hawking. I'm so sorry for your loss❤
It never ceases to amaze me how many people are living with, or have friends or family living with, horrible medical conditions. Every time, I think, that could so easily be me or someone I love in a few years and that is why I support your position on this issue.
I watched my mum die in hospital last year. No words to describe how harrowing it was, went to school during the day and just sat there with her in the evenings watching her suffer. She was a fighter with a lot of hope and wouldn't have wanted a medically assisted death, although they did end up sedating her completely in her last few days due to her levels of pain. It's a horrible way to go. If I were in the same situation I would opt for a medically assisted death without a shadow of a doubt. A big thank you for campaigning for it. Hope it makes its way into the law before I strike unlucky.
You are such an incredible scientific communicator. You are all the more impressive for taking on ethically complex medical topics. I spend far too much of my life on this platform listening to all types of educational content, yet there is no one else I have found who presents with such clarity and respect for the audience. Please continue what you do.
My grandfather chose medically assisted dying a year and a half ago after his cancer came back. It was a hard decision, but watching him suffer was even harder than watching him pass with dignity
I’m a Canadian and this was super educational and one of the most level headed takes on MAID. I appreciate you for informing me about this. I’m a student and won’t be able to donate, but sending you and your family lots of love.
While I completely agree with this in terms of terminal patients, as a young, disabled, Canadian I find it horrifying. There was a woman who had extreme chemical sensitivities, her landlord wouldn't accommodate her and the government felt as though she was perfectly fine living how she was and refused to help her, so she went with MAID she publicly said she didn't want to die but she was suffering too much to live. I myself have complicated health problems that the health care system doesn't care to figure out and every time I go to see a doctor, which admittedly isn't often due to all the medical trauma I now have, I am scared it will be the time they will suggest MAID to me. Our healthcare system in my opinion doesn't give a single shit about us and they just waste our time until we give up trying to get help. The fears about the qualifications broadening is unfortunately valid, if your counties healthcare is already in shambles it can end up being used as a way for doctors to get out of doing their job. But again to be clear, I am in full support of assisted death in terminal cases, it isn't fair we allow our pets a more dignified death than our fellow humans. If someone is suffering and has low to no chance of survival then it should be their right to decide when to end things, the suffering we put terminal patients though is completely unnecessary. Just make sure that law doesn't get broadened. As much as it pains me to say most people still don't value the life of anyone who is disabled. If you've read all of this then firstly thank you for listening to my take, and I will leave you with this. No one is able bodied, everyone is either disabled or pre disabled, because there are only too options in life. Die young or live long enough that you end up disabled in some way, that's just how life works, so remember that disability rights and access benefit all of us. You're health is not in your control, so cherish it while you have it.
Thank you for sharing this. I feel like at least some of the people expressing the "Slippery slope" argument also have this as their fear but lack the precise wording to express it. They always tell you to keep fighting for proper medical care, but what happens when that fight has drained your strength to keep fighting? It's just too easy for them to tell us to kindly unalive ourselves instead of changing the system so medical care is easier to obtain.
@@juliaprohaska9295 Thanks for replying! Agreed, very well put, most people don't understand how hard it is to fight for your health. All the while doctors keep telling you that you're fine and they are satisfied with your quality of life. It is a very large and complicated issue that unfortunately doesn't have an easy fix. Hopefully we can at least start to address it and work towards a better solution soon
@@nielsgeudens4650 Canada have been offering death to their homeless and veterans who badly need help. Look it up. and Switzerland is on track to follow Canada.
This question is hard to answer, and it is even harder to justify. A person may be in very large amounts of pain due to an illness, and hence, people might believe that they should be allowed to end their own life. My father had cancer, and down the line, he developed sepsis. His body would feel so much pain that they had him on morphine for the entire day. He couldn't bear laying down, so he'd sleep sitting. His right leg was extremely swollen. However, he didn't give up. May he rest easy. I wanted to write this because i want whoever is reading to know that I know people who have been through these things. That is physical pain. However, do we disregard mental pain? We don't say that physical pain is worse than mental pain. Mental pain can be even worse at times. If people who are in physical pain should be allowed to end their own life, then why can't those who live life every day not wanting to be alive? Shouldn't they be assisted by doctors?
I agree with you. Apart from the moral question of taking away a person's life because of one's belief that they are intellectually superior to come to that conclusion, there is a danger of where this kind of approach will take people. It also hinders research on how to overcome the problems and gives scientists an easy way out.
I agree with legalising assisted dying. But your comment about the ‘slippery slope’ does apply to Canada unfortunately. Two younger people were approved for the service due to mould toxicity caused by their apartments. They couldn’t afford to move and theirs landlords didn’t fix it, so they opted for the service instead. While I think people deserve to die with dignity, I think we need to stay mindful of the way our current economic climate puts people at risk when we introduce these policies without first improving social conditions.
The slippery slope argument is pretty solid. It started with terminally ill individuals and advanced to 'mentally ill' individuals. Absolutely disgusting.
@@NigarIsHere there have been cases of them killing people with depression. Also a lot of disability human rights campaigners are against it. These by the most part are liberal people that know how the state works.
@@victoriap1561 that is really interesting, I would really like to see what the whole thing is about, like if it is a systematic issue or whatever, if it isn't too much to ask, could you name an article or the site you saw this information on?
Thank you for this. Difficult but so important. I have stage 4 breast cancer. As an atheist, i am not afraid of being dead. But i do hope not to suffer excessively on my way there. In my state in Australia, there are provisions for MAID and i applaud that. Every opposition to the development of these laws seems to come from one of three directions; 1) it's the 'slippery slope' (it'll give someone carte blanche to kill anyone they want to) or 2) palliative care physicians who can't accept that they cannot sufficiently relieve suffering and 3) suffering is good for your soul. The most persistent, vociferous opposition comes from Catholics. From where i stand, my choices should not be limited by someone else's superstition. As long as the individual is competent to indicate their wishes, i dont believe that the "dying within 6 or 12 months" (depending on where you live) requirement is appropriate. No-one can tell someone that their suffering is 'acceptable'. For Australians, the ABC Listen app has an old podcast called Better Off Dead by Andrew Denton and is worth a listen
it's legal here, i couldn't be more thankful for my grandma. she was suffering a lot at the end of her life and was given a painless and calm way out. just have to make sure it's as robust as it is here, family members and herself had to sign and two independent doctors had to give green light
I don't think including family consent is a good idea. What if someone's family opposes it for religious reasons. I don't think we should restrict people's freedoms depending on what their family wants
I assure you my parasocial feelings for you are very fond despite your standoffishness. An appropriate subject for the longest night of the year. My dad went with MND. I recognised the likely diagnosis as you talked about your mum choking on a prawn. Usually I get a nice feeling from spotting what is coming, not this time. I could not have cared for my dad, luckily my mum was there. He said it was the embarassment of not being able to do anything for himself that was the worst for him. He died unexpectedly soon during an operation because his breathing was worse than they thought. Much respect for every carer and the cared. Now I'm fond of your mum, too.
I have oculopharyngeal muscular dystrophy (OPMD), a disease with very similar symptoms as your mother had (severe ptosis is also a symptom). It is inherited. I watched my grandfather, my aunts, my uncle, and lastly, my mother die from this disease. I saw the feeding tubes, the eventual pneumonia, sepsis from the feeding tube, and swelling around the heart. I saw my mother, at her end, on a respirator, silently begging for us to let her go. I asked her, three times if she wanted us to remove the respirator, and she nodded yes, with tears in her eyes, and squeezed my hand. I don’t want to put my family through that same agony and guilt that I had to go through when stopping the respirator. I want to make the choice to die on my own terms before it gets to that point. I want more families to have access to their loved ones DNRs, and if I am not allowed to make the choice for assisted death, I will have my fucking DNR tattooed on my body so that some poor EMT who is called when my body is failing has no question as to my wish not to be intubated.
I support assisted dying, but the slippery slope is very real and it should be aknowledged before any legislations are passed. If this is to become law, then it must be rock solid
I am a first year graduate-entry medical student. When assisted dying opinion was polled in our ethics lectures, the vast majority were in favour. Times are changing - thank you for putting the case forward so eloquently and powerfully.
As I quote I heard from other doctor: A doctor's job is to reduce human suffering, not saving lives, because you can't save lives, only extend them. If you are treating a terminal patient, your job is to make them suffer less, not extend their lifes.
One of the things that makes me so angry is that if I ever got Alzheimer's, even if it was legal to opt for euthanasia, most places will not allow you to choose that because you're not deemed mentally competent. I would definitely rather dip out than die by inches as my memory goes.
This has been a debate in Canada. Should we allow a person who is competent now, but has a condition that will lead to suffering and mental incompetence, elect for a future MAID.
@@gjmottetcan you do that? I know DNR is a thing, and can be conditional (for example "in case o have X Y and Z disease and has progressed to a stage I cannot make a conscious choice I would like no heroic measures taken")
I have never understood why the government can force you to be alive against your will. I believe in autonomy and it baffles me that so many people argue against it.
My father died of metastatic cancer in 2020, after living with the knowledge that the condition was terminal for several years. The last 6 weeks of his life were harrowing to us all, even once he was able to get a bed in a local hospice. Watching that made me even more convinced that medically assisted death should be a thing, particularly for people with advanced terminal conditions.
I am a German med Student, Ex-paramedic and I want to go into anaesthesiology, pain medicine and maybe palliative care. I love your approach, and I deeply felt for the story of you and your mum. I think having a way of assisted dying is very much necessary, but also understand the concerns of people being pushed into it, because of socio-economic reasons, disability or a lack of mental health services. Like you I feel like this doesn’t negative the point though, we just have to find legislation that works around these things. Austria for example passed a bill in favour of assisted dying, but invests 18 million euros (2 million per inhabitant) into palliative care so that patients are not pushed into assisted dying because of a lack of assistance or care. Thank you for your moving and wonderful video, happy holidays and all the best to you and your family. I hope I can one day become a doctor as patient focused, reasonable and funny as you!
![ARGENTINA vs. CHILE [3-0] | RESUMEN | ELIMINATORIAS SUDAMERICANAS | FECHA 7](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/De3AWmXzhuA/mqdefault.jpg)
![ARGENTINA vs. CHILE [3-0] | RESUMEN | ELIMINATORIAS SUDAMERICANAS | FECHA 7](/img/tr.png)
Thank you for watching. I might not respond but I promise I will read all your comments and take them on board, irrespective of whether you agree with me or not. I value all your opinions, especially as most of the people I’ve talked to about this are like-minded. I’m not going to push the sponsor for this video, but thanks to Nebula I can donate my fee. So please do check them out if you want to get yourself access to lots of cool stuff for $2.50 a month, and to support me too. Merry Christmas, Rohin.
mum did a great job raising her son, she would be oh so proud of you posting and doing this for her and others.
♥
My grandmom suffered with Alzheimer's for the last 10 years of her life. I never knew her when she didn't have it, so my experience with her was of a hollow person, who needed a lot of care from the family. My mom and my aunts would talk of how wonderful she was, how she would take care of them, cook delicious food, etc. but it was all in the past tense, as if grandma has already passed.
If medical assisted dying was legal here in India, I still wouldn't think my mother would accept it, taking care of her was her form of grieving I think. She died in March 2021, during the COVID pandemic so my aunts couldn't make it. We buried her in her hometown, and my mom's first statement was how relieved but empty she felt. My mother is similar to your mom, extremely strong mentally and emotionally, and this was one of the few moments she shared her emotions with anyone else.
If medically assisted dying is legal here, and I had the choice to decide for anyone in my family, and they wished for it, I would too.
Thanks for the video, Rohin, and best wishes to you.
To consider and advocate for very clear laws on the criteria for when death assistance would be allowed, I urge you to learn about why the Disability Day of Mourning is a thing. The annual vigil is international, and this statement describes the deeply inhumane tragedies that lead to starting this tradition:
"We see the same pattern repeating over and over again. A parent kills their disabled child. The media portrays these murders as justifiable and inevitable due to the “burden” of having a disabled person in the family. If the parent stands trial, they are given sympathy and comparatively lighter sentences, if they are sentenced at all. The victims are disregarded, blamed for their own murder at the hands of the person they should have been able to trust the most, and ultimately forgotten. And then the cycle repeats."
(sorry for not including a l1nk, RUclips has been a pain in the neck regarding my comments lately)
What will happen to those of us who cannot express their own wishes if death assistance is legalized? Too often abled people react to our very existence with repulsion, and these repulsed people all too often include our "loved ones".
You, Sir are a scholar and a legend - well done making this informative and tactfully put. Even though, at several moments, I could see you found it difficult.
If you look at Canada someone was offered assistance in dying to save money for the provider
Around 2009-2010 I was dating a woman with a deeply evangelical family. Her grandmother lived in Oregon and had terminal cancer. (Bone cancer as I recall) The grandmother was in so much pain and chose to exercise her right to die granted by the state. Most of the evangelical family members cut the grandmother out of their lives before she died. They would say things like "she is selfish" or "she is making the choice not to join us in heaven so why should we support her on Earth?" This was the most disgusting thing I have even seen, how much shame and vitriol was aimed at an old women who didnt want to feel the agonizing pain of cancer eating her body any more.
Yup. Thats religion for you.
A prime example of how disgusting and toxic religion can be sadly.
The hypocrisy. 😤
It is sad that people misconstrue Jesus’ message of love into a means to judge others and push people away. I’m so sorry for her loss and I pray for their family’s healing
Good old abrahamic religion, the only religion where pain and suffering is seen by it's followers as something beautiful and to deny it is seen an apostasy.
The most knowledgeable expert on what level of pain or distress a patient is able to endure is usually that patient themselves.
As someone with a chronic illness (EDS) I agree entirely, I know when I need pain meds to get my pain under control and I often know more about my condition than doctors do. I wish that doctors would trust my jugement and work with me instead of against me.
Ya, that's definitely not a slippery slope.
@@carlosdominguez3108your mom is a slippery slope
Except in cases of mental illness
@@carlosdominguez3108correct
When you ask people how they’d prefer to die, the most common answer is “in my sleep”. No sane person wants to die in pain. So why are we forcing people to suffer, when we can allow them to pass peacefully?
Thats what i thought. But the doctors also have to consider the patients' loved ones and how they feel as well.
Because the logical end result of medically assisted dying combined with the state acting as the medical provider and free healthcare means that your finite tax dollars will be going up against infinite potential suffering.
Take a guess as to how that infinite potential suffering will be tackled.
If you guessed the state instituting death panels and cutting off more expensive patients (read between the lines, "Net negative tax payer") and pushing medically assisted death, which is exactly what's happening in Canada, you'd be correct.
Really yall wanna die in your sleep?
@@Flack0-Flacko These people just want to die. Full stop. They hate life in general and want to see death be more commonplace. It's actually disgusting.
@@Flack0-FlackoI would rather wanna die in a battleground. But quick. Atleast go out with a bang you know.
My father passed away this year after 12 years of bed-ridden care. He’s my motivation for wanting a career in medical research. Seeing him cry once because he looked at me and couldn’t remember my name made me realize, sometimes being alive doesn’t mean living a life. Thank you for this video.
i hope u're doing ok. grief can be like a tempest, you think it’s over and then it hits you in waves. ur pops lives on in your memories of him. u can continue experiencing him as long u continue to remember :) a woman that was like a grandma to me died during quarantine and whenever i miss her, i try to remember what it felt like to be little and under her care again. i can still remember how she laughed and her hugs
seconds after my grandpa’s heart stopped, my dad looked at me and made me promise not to let him suffer like that. I'm deeply invested in this subject.
And end him? Your dad is a coward
@@MrTripsJit's so remarkable the people who tend to call others cowards are the most comfortable and most detached from the situation.
I'm Canadian, and when my grandmother was in her early 80s she was diagnosed with stage four cancer in every body part that was checked including her lungs, her blood, and both of her legs. It was the first year assisted dying was legal so she signed up and that's how she died. I was in the room when it happened. I personally feel assisted dying is a straight forward extension of palliative care. If the patient _will_ die and no one can prevent it, then ensuring the patient will not die badly is pretty much all palliative care is. If nature will brutally kill them in 6 weeks, using drugs to kill them peacefully in 4 weeks before things get too bad for painkillers to handle is two-dimensionally obvious.
Perfect observation 👍
Everyone WILL die. Pain is inevitable in life. If all that is left is pain then it makes sense to end there. Choice is the issue for me.
this is beautifully put.
I've seen painkillers used to the point of leaving people loopy and not themselves... I fear the loss of myself to medication because it's basically a living death at that point. If your options are to live in agony or be chemically sedated, I think adding a third option to die with your mind in check before your body completely breaks down is a merciful and good option. We will have to be very specific to make sure that line is drawn ethically but it must be drawn.
This is spot on, and no different than providing euthanasia to a beloved pet who is terminally ill. This is one of the most difficult, and kindest, things we can do for our loved ones.
"Heal the sick. But when that is not possible, prevent suffering." Exactly this. Terminally ill, mentally competent people should absolutely be able to choose how and when they die. I watched both my father and my best friend die of terminal cancer. I was then and remain now livid that the only choice available was for them to suffer to death. It was excruciating for them, and for their loved ones. In both cases I offered to help them die because I simply couldn't countenance them suffering so much when the end was inevitable. But both refused because they didn't want my life impacted by the act of compassion. Thanks for this video-- I too hope it prompts clearheaded conversations. I deeply appreciate you speaking out on this important topic.
Not just terminally ill, but with a disease which will never be cured, and quality if life is non-existent.
Some wounds never heal especially for those mentally scarred betrayed by their own so called friends, family, relatives etc. Even your shadow leaves you when you need someone to comfort you.
While suffering metastatic cancer, I had to take my dad's extremely old and equally sick cat to be euthanized, and while explaining this to him he interrupted "Oh! Sign me up while you're there." Anyway the veterinarian refused to help anyone but the cat, and my dad passed 3 weeks later. Thanks for leveraging your platform to expand minds on this topic.
If I were to end up in your father's situation, I hope I would still have the sense of humour to make a demand like his. Maybe we should hope that we would not need to.
I love his sense of humour. Im sorry for your loss ... both of your father and the cat!
Right? Why is it kind to euthanize old and sick animals but immoral to euthanize humans who actually ask for it
Having a sense of humor about the situation takes a strong dude, sorry for your loss
How did both your dad and cat ended up with metastatic cancer? Must be something in house that radiation
I almost didn’t watch this because of the warning from RUclips. I have a son who suffers from depression and I didn’t want to hear anything about suicide. Thank you for posting the notice about it.
I’m so glad I watched this. This is an important conversation to have. Thank you for sharing your mothers story 🙏🏽.
In my years as an ICU nurse I’ve seen many patients die.
I’m so sorry for your loss. Your mom sounds like a wonderful person and she must be greatly missed.
I'm hoping for good things for your son 💜
@@orangeants What does "good things" even mean in the context of this comment section? The vast majority of comments that I have read here say that state-sanctioned killing is a good thing. So is that what you mean? In a world in which people seriously argue that killing is good, one can no longer argue for what is "good" and have it understood. We are in the midst of a death cult in which the ultimate harm is being pushed as a good thing.
Do you think people who have depression should have a choice for suicide?
@@Fx_Explains Everyone already has a choice. Decent people steer others away from that choice, to protect them. Decent people want to promote the well-being of others. Decent people don't push for the state-sanctioned killing of people with mental health problems.
@@omp199 OK
My dad was diagnosed terminal immediately, given 6 months, made it a bit more. That “bit more” was agonizing, humiliating, and mentally breaking for him. He broke down many times telling me “this isn’t what a father is like” as I cared for him. I wish he had the choice to go on his own terms. Medication didn’t touch his pain. He was literally begging to die in the end. It was extremely hard on me as I’ve been in support of having this choice since long before he became sick. All I could do was advocate for him and try to keep his head on straight. It was torture for all of us mentally, physically as well for him. I wish he had the choice to control that part of his illness.
Before my dad died I always thought I wouldn't be able to do it. To end someone's suffering. Now I wish I had been braver and made the choice for him, like he wanted me to.
@visx1792 at least you learned your lesson if my dad asked Me to pull the plug I would have done it because that's what he told me sadly my dad died at work a few months ago 😔 sometimes you gotta do the hard decisions
My grandfather, at 92, had lung cancer. He was told he had months to live. He died peacefully in his sleep, and the cause was put down to lung cancer. When cleaning out his room (he was in a nursing home) we found dozens of Eclipse mint tins; many empty, but many filled with unknown pills (not mints). We believe he took his own life to prevent the inevitable suffering he would soon be experiencing. I remember not being sad that he'd done that (we already new he was dying), but I was sad that he went through it alone. He must have been stockpiling pills for months, if not years. I don't know what the pills were, but if they were pain meds, it would mean he'd had no pain relief for a while in order to stockpile them. Thats months of being in pain, and not being able to tell anyone, and carrying this burden alone.
At 92 and still had full control, he was a strong man
Thank you for sharing. It sounds like your late grandfather was a strong man who wanted to live his life and end his life on his own terms.
That's my plan, too. I might tell someone, who I know can be trusted to keep it a secret. I plan on asking them to bring me an expensive bottle of wine or single malt whisky (if I'm not able to myself) to enjoy the last few hours before taking the pills.
I too found a cache of narcotics in my mother's home, but when she truly became ill she was no longer able to access them.
Ooof this hit me hard 💔💜
My father passed away in 2021 from pancreatic cancer. We’re canadian so it gave us a lot a reassurance throughout his illness that, if he were to need it, he could access MAID. In the end, despite extensive palliative care, the pain was too much and he chose to access MAID. He passed away peacefully, surrounded by his family. For me, it now seems so logical that it should be included in treatment options for patients in end of life care. Hoping the UK will soon make the right decision in legalizing the right to choose
Ditto in America.
Don't tell us in the UK what we should do.
@@ikr2377found the hopeless contrarian.
@@firstletterofthealphabet7308 if you want to kill your own when they become a burden please don't tell us to do it .
@@ikr2377 you are assuming so much. nowhere did op say that their father was killed because he was a burden. the vast majority of people love their family and would never ever choose to end their loved one's life simply because they are a burden. OP clearly stated the reason their father was given medical aid in death was because he was in too much pain and preferred to die in peace than to go on and endure more pain. In no way does that indicate that OP and their family "killed their own because they became a burden". It signifies that OP and their family chose to support their dying father in whatever decision he made about his own life when he was put in a horrible situation by a terminal illness that caused him levels of pain no person should be forced to deal with. The amount of disrespect in your comment towards OP and their dead father, and the tragic situation they were placed in by an unfortunate illness, is honestly horrifying and you should reflect on why you felt it was appropriate to say that to anyone and why you jumped to the illogical and evidentially unsupported conclusion you did.
I live in California and we assisted death legalized here. When my grandpa was dying from heart failure we went through the process of obtaining the drugs for him, and while he never had to use them, he told me that having them there in the cupboard brought him great relief. He knew that if his condition became to painful to bear that he would be able to go out on his own terms, and that alone brought him a great deal of comfort.
I think that‘s the point - the feeling that there is a choice.
that's rather morbid.
@@Qwerty-jy9mj sure, death is always morbid, kind of by definition, but it doesn’t have to be agonizing. Death on your own terms, surrounded by family, is a beautiful thing. My grandpa was always fiercely independent, and while he hated being bed bound, I’m glad he could have that feeling of control over his life so he wasn’t in as much despair toward the end.
@@teachersusan3730 exactly, having a choice can make a terminally ill person feel that they still have some control over their life. While he did have considerable pain at times toward the end, he was able to feel that it was his choice to bear it and spend more time with his family, rather than feeling like he had no option for anything else.
My mum was diagnosed with stage 4 cancer and opted for assisted dying. I supported her through the last 2 months of deteriorating quality of life. It was the hardest time. She was happy to have some control over the end, planned her funeral, met the celebrant and counted the days and hours until the doctor arrived.
Absolutely incredible video, can’t even begin to imagine how hard it must’ve been to make it ❤❤❤
Thanks mate 🙏 Happy new year!
I kept finding myself thinking I just can’t imagine how anyone could hear this and still fight to keep assisted dying illegal. Insane. And cruel.
@@hopegold883 I keep finding myself thinking that I just can't imagine why a medical professional, whose most fundamental ethical principle is to do no harm, is advocating the ultimate harm: the killing of those whose lives are in his hands.
My grandpa went out that way, pulmonary fibrosis meant he could barely leave the house and the prednisone had a lot of side effects... there are worse terminal illnesses but it was never going to get better. Imagine being a world traveler, a photographer (he had a color video camera in the 60s and my aunt has a bookshelf full of his photos) and being stuck in your house hooked up to a machine for 5 years and knowing that's the rest of your life. On his 78th birthday with his wife and children's approval he took himself off the oxygen. I don't know that the hospice people helped but they knew and they didn't do anything to stop him. My grandma didn't grieve much. The man she wanted back and the man he wanted to be was already long gone, she'd grieved for him already.
This is heartbreaking!
Yeah, there's multiple deaths a person goes through and that the family grieve for. When my mom came home diagnosed stage 4 it was shock, grief that the life she'd led had actually left long ago and none of us had noticed yet. Then when she fell down the stairs and got sepsis, when she could no longer walk, when she lost her ability to speak, they were all deaths, and we grieved for every step. When she finally went, the entire family had been begging for God to end it, including her. Her passing was a guilty relief. God help the suffering souls of those in their greatest trial
I’m very sorry for your loss. My dad had the same condition. He got a lung transplant at 70 and got five “bonus” years before dying earlier this year from non lung issues that laid him low. He had a poor quality of life the last six months. It was very hard on him and my mom. He wouldn’t have accepted MAID though we do have it here. It was never on the table because I believe his doctors kept his poor prognosis from us. They also kept him from getting dialysis for months while inpatient and it baffled me.
@@eqwerewrqwerqre this is actually a good example of why religious mindsets are so often toxic. Why should you feel guilty that your loved one is no longer suffering needlessly?
@@GameTimeWhyI don't think religion have anything to do with their guilt my guy.
This is so relatable to me. It made me cry early on.
When I was around 14, my grandfather who was my father (by adoption) was dying from multiple myeloma and also suffering from dementia. I happened upon him and my grandmother in the bathroom. While she was getting him ready for another day sitting in his chair she said "how are you feeling" and he said "I'm already dead." He was totally lucid. The look on her face and his face and the realization even at that age almost broke me.
He had spent his life as a no job too small carpenter, plumber, electrician. He could do math in his head I could only imagine. He hand carved wooden figurines with no reference. He was unbelievably physically and emotionally strong.
A few days later he tried to body check me because he had to pay the taxes from '79 and needed to find his wife (my grandmother/mom) to do so. I had been tasked with "babysitting" him while my grandmother attempted to chip out our storing freezer in our basement. He was still physically stronger than me despite his degradation and almost made it to the basement stairs before my grandmother heard me hollering. He also left to get cigarettes once and got lost. He was so scared and so confused and so defeated.
We did hospice in home where he had a horrible time eating, resting, and suffering. I only wish we could have removed some of that suffering from him, on his own terms.
After the experience, my grandmother is now a DNR and talks openly about how she will go out on her own terms. So many people chastise her. I totally get it. I won't pull the trigger so to speak, but I won't stop her from making her decision.
Also, it is okay to cry. It's okay to still feel sad about what you did not or could not do for your loved one. Sending you love and caring this holiday season.
I think the person suffering has a better idea of what is in their future than any of us do. Our view of life formed over many decades, and that view is utterly unique to us.
I increasingly often say, "Immortality is a young person's dream. To those of a ripe old age mortality is more a promise than a threat: you don't have to do this forever." As I enter my '70s everybody in my life understands that.
This reminds me of a lucid moment my grandpa had once, where he remembered the major events of the past few years like my granny dying. He said he'd been in a dark, dark place for years- he grabbed my arm and looked me dead in my soul and said "don't ever let this happen to you" with more emotion than I'd seen since granny died and he was much more lucid. shit broke me man. I know he would rather be dead.
Yes. Death isn’t the worst thing, suffering, pain, loss of dignity, loss of independence, so much is worse.
And so we see that this is all about pure, naked, unabashed disablism. There is *absolutely nothing wrong* with being dependent on others and needing care. It is absolutely a *good thing* to care for those who need care. To say that to kill someone is better than to have them be dependent on others is pure evil.
@@omp199 this choice has nothing to do with the carer or whether they want the validation of looking after someone. It’s about the person suffering and their wishes. My grandfather lived an active and independent life but suffered indescribable pain and the complete loss of dignity in his last year. He wished for the end every single day even though he had the best care available. He was past the point of medication, parts of him were falling off, every breath was agony, he lost his sight…death was a mercy to him and he should have been able to go on his terms much sooner as his last year was much worse than death, it was torture
@@omp199 you've absolutely no reading comprehension, have you?
@@plobclop Yes. I understand perfectly well that when someone complains about another person's loss of independence, they are speaking from a point of view of selfishness: they don't want others to be dependent on them. You are utterly naïve if you can see all these people posting about how they wish their relatives could have died sooner and not see the blatant conflict of interests.
Your argument makes assumptions on the priorities of living for all humans. Such is illogical
My heart breaks for your mum. I was under suspicion of ALS for a while and I hoarded pills, made a plan and crossed my fingers... I still have the pills and will forever hope for assisted death. I really wanted to live but at the same time I wanted to be able to choose how I die. We deserve to choose how we die in these circumstances.
yea, i feel the same. i’m only 18 but i feel death becomes more real to me as time goes on. the adults around me, my uncles and aunts and my parents, they’ve all gotten older as well. before i realized it, my mom is nearing 60. the end is inevitable and we can only die once, we might as well do it right and have a say if we’ve lived long enough
also i hope u’re doing good. an ALS diagnosis is something that i’d imagine completely changes your worldview. it’s a difficult disease to have. there’s a podcast called we’re all insane that interviews a surviving daughter of a man with ALS. it’s very sad but also inspiring; he accomplished a lot even with his diagnosis.
You've totally won me over as a subscriber... but you've also entirely changed my view on assisted dying. Just last year, around this time, I had a course on medical ethics where I held a stance that was totally against it. I'll forward this video to my friends at medical school. Going forward, I'll fully and publicly support assisted dying with understanding of all the nuances you mentioned. Thank you!
Could you explain why you were against it? I don’t see right now why anyone would be, but I’d like to hear what you thought.
I don't understand how could you keep that stance and advocate for being against it while all it took you to sway you on the other side was 40 min RUclips video. I understand that your frontal cortex isn't fully developed but cmon. Do you change your political stance after reading a well made argument and justification for it? If so don't vote, please
@@bookwormd8627I believe that theirs comment was made just to garner likes. Because everyone loves to see when someone who was against something understand that theirs previous opinion has no basis in reality. It's sad but people do stuff like that for likes all the time and the fact they didn't answer for 4 weeks, you basically have a confirmation :)
@@0NeeN0”Do you change your political stance after reading a well-written argument and justification for it?”
Do you not? If an argument successfully counters all of my points, then I will change my opinion. If you don’t, then don’t vote, please
@@0NeeN0 I don't think your inferences are robust. Sometimes people just want to say their piece and be done, they may have better things to do than get into the weeds of a discussion in the RUclips comments. I assume you are against assisted dying, and seeing others who once shared your point of view being persuaded to change their views is uncomfortable for you. You could be right, but you cannot just assume that the OP was not genuine just because it is disagreeable to you. That's ostrich behaviour.
I’m Dutch, so I’ve pretty much grown up with the idea that helping someone pass on with dignity is the most humane thing we can do.
We do it for our pets, like you said, so people should have the same right, to die without excruciating pain.
It's a fairly recent thing in the Netherlands still. The process is lengthy and arduous and you need a doctor who agrees with you. If your doctor is of the opinion your illness is bearable then screw you, endure it.
It's still completely illegal outside of this specific pathway, mind. You'd still have to die alone and prepare privately if your doctor is dragging their feet, because it's illegal for anyone to "help"; that includes simply being aware of your suicide attempt and not intervening. I.e., being present and saying goodbye.
It has been in the law sinds 2002, (that's not that long to me, but maybe I'm getting old). There are still kinks to work out but I'm glad it's there as an option
@@eclipseeffigy That's not true, if your doctor can't do it with his/her full conscience then they have to refer you to a doctor who is.
@@ApequH time ia very relative, 2002 were 21 years ago of you were born 2003 and more the law is older than you and 21 is most legal age in many countries. it's true tho that for laws making progress takes so much time.
Well it would have been happening low-key in many places around the world. Often doctors would give a little too much painkiller, then write the death certificate.
Of course this relied on a lot of trust with the doctor involved.
My grandfather had a rapid form of Alzheimer's and Parkinson's hit him at the same time. He had been extremely healthy his whole life (still landscaping daily in his mid 60s) and was always a very independent person. as he started to lose function and his brain started struggling it tore him apart. Thankfully here in Canada we have a program for assisted dying that he was able to use. It gave us the chance to spend some time with him, help him with a couple bucket list items and best of all help some other people. Since he was going to go through with assisted dying and it was really only his nervous system falling apart he was able to not only donate his organs to research and to save lives (his lungs especially) but it allowed for them to better setup the procedure for the recipient. When he found out that he could still help people and not have to suffer it helped him immensely with coming to peace with everything. I am immensely grateful that this option was available and that should something like that happen to any of us it is reassuring that we won't have to suffer needlessly.
Bless your grandfather, really, truly. I hope that one day we can solve these diseases, but, in the meantime, it is bittersweet and beautiful that he was able to spend amazing final moments with family, and gift future amazing moments to those in need of organs.
That is a beautiful and moving story. It is wonderful that he able to live the last of his life to the fullest and make such a difference even in death. Thank you for sharing it.
Wow, I didn't even think about the organ donation angle! I'm very pro AD, but this pushes me in the pro side even more.
I'm sorry for your loss. 💕
he sounds like a great guy!
So sorry you all had to go through that. Thank you for sharing - it's a beautiful story and shows how valuable such a program is for everyone involved.
I had a grandfather who had been a Royal Marine whose career had spanned 2 world wars. I'm not saying that he was the bravest man in the world, but he was someone who had seen death close up. He wasn't a fearful man. As a small child he'd told me that 'big girls don't cry', when full of tears, I'd run to him for comfort. But then, a few years later, my mum and I visited him in hospital after he'd had yet another severe stroke. He was crying. He looked at me through the tears. He didn't want to be there. Fifty years later, I still remember that scene and it still fills me full of tears.
I am signed up to the Dignity In Dying newsletter and support their cause. We allow our pets to have their suffering ended, why not our own family?
Your grandfather was brave, he fought in the trenches and the fight against Hitler. I also completely agree with you, sometimes, even though it is hard, sometimes it’s better to end the suffering.
I remember being 5 and 6 and hearing my mom scream about dying and just wanting to go. She had lung cancer that went to ovarian and then to brain cancer. My grandmother was supposed to care for her but she was always too drunk to come over. One time she told me to hand her her medicine which i thought was weird because my dad or I always gave her the meds. I did not do it because something felt off and tbh sometimes I regret not doing it because she died at around 80 or 90 pounds, and suffered the entire time.
What a fantastic video, I’m sorry your mum went through that.
I too have had family members in the UK suffer for months on end only to be given morphine in their last moments. It’s so unnecessary to suffer for so long and have that final moment decided by the willingness of the doctor to administer the medicine. It’s all so arbitrary.
I now live in Oregon and I think assisted dying is very popular here (not that it comes up in conversation all that much)
In Oregon you have to be physically capable of administering the medicine yourself so all the doctor needs to do is approve the prescription.
Like you said throughout the video it’s giving the patient control to decide for themselves.
I am a massive fan of both of you and this is absolutely amazing that I’d find you here! Keep up the amazing work both of you!
Yes. So many are forced to suffer debilitating, agonising deaths.
Jem also died after a year with MND, in early 2019. And our daughter, a doctor, diagnosed him several months before we got the official diagnosis. No one should be forced to face such a death right to the end.
A total lie. In civilised countries, we look after people, and care for them until the end, managing their pain so that they can be as comfortable as possible. No civilised country sanctions the deliberate killing of those of its citizens most in need of care.
As a uk nurse I found this incredibly respectful, considerate and thought provoking. As someone who works with older adults I often consider the importance of achieving a dignified, pain free 'patient centred' death. Thank you for this video and giving me more to research and think about. I am sorry for your loss of your Mum.
My grandfather didn't do assisted dying, but he'd had a fall at 94 and decided it was time. He was fully lucid. We all said goodbye. A week later he died, despite doctors saying nothing in particular was physically wrong. He just let his body shut down and left the world.
I think about him a lot. I wish everyone could have such a graceful and conscious exit when their time has come. Australia is slowly bringing it in but still too slow for many that are suffering beyond anything they humanely deserve.
I saw my grandfather pass away painfully over a period of 2 weeks, and the doctors didn't allow us to take him off the ventilator. My parents and uncle and aunt spent thousands and thousands to essentially prolong his suffering. It was the saddest thing I saw. I can't imagine what it would have been like for you to see your mom suffer for so long. But I hope she can see how important people like you are to the world.
2 weeks 😩 I'm so sorry he had to go through that and you had to witness it. In September , I watched my 41-year-old husband die over 5 days and actively die in a little over 12 hours. He was in so much pain and discomfort over the last year and 3 months of his life, but it was awful in his last days. His oxygen levels were within the normal range and yet he was gasping for air saying he couldn't breathe. The cancer had spread to his skull and was pressing on a cranial nerve so in the last days of his life he wasn't able to fully close his eye. At one point I had rested my head on his shoulder and looked up toward his eyes in the process and could see his cornea had started to deteriorate. I was seeing my husband's body break down before he was even dead. He was in so much pain that even as he lost the ability to verbally communicate he moaned in pain. The night he came home I asked the hospice nurse how long he might live and he said 2 days. I was shocked at the prospect of my favorite person leaving me and our 3-year-old behind so soon, but I also felt relieved he would not suffer for weeks. We afford animals a more dignified and comfortable death, why should that option not be extended to people? I don't know that my husband would have chosen that, but it would have been nice for him to have the choice. It's almost 4 months since he died and it's still hard for me to see past the cloud of suffering that enveloped the last year and 3 months of his life. I know there was good, but it's so hard to remember it over all the suffering.
@@ijustneedmyself I’m in tears reading it. I cannot imagine going through it. I wish he has a peaceful after life.
@@theamhway I wouldn't honestly wish it on anyone. The U.S. needs to do better. Wishing you the best ❤️
@@ijustneedmyselfI'm really sorry. I'm going through a harsh period in my life too rn studying to be a doctor. It's so hard being left behind, even my parents and friends don't understand my feelings and sacrifices. I didn't make a mistake yet i always get judged and blamed. I hate not receiving emotional support when you need it the most especially when you suffer from depression, heath anxiety and trouble studying and coping with academic setbacks. My parents would rather force me into darkness than rescue me. The feeling of depression and hopelessness with frustrated is soul crushing and agonizing. I still try to live and move on but the past still haunts me and i have a lot of regret. I could only share my pain to complete strangers since the close ones never really care and are busy in their own lives
I am a Canadian. I have supported MAID all my adult life, and I still do. I believe it has a place. But you are entirely incorrect about the pressure. We do have some pretty public cases that arose with military veterans who were denied help with access to their health needs and encouraged (and documented) to take MAID if they were suffering so badly. There is a nasty kind of eugenicist faction of people that do exist, and are within the bureaucracies and power holding positions. The Federal government even did a cost benefit analysis on the matter to show the economic benefits of offering MAID over the cost of prolonged care (which is thoroughly offensive, and rather unethical in my opinion). There are also more and more cases of people who are enduring suffering that can be alleviated by better access to health care services and equipment, but most significantly alleviating their poverty and housing precarity. I still do believe in the need for MAID and compassion and dignity in death. But there absolutely needs to be strong challenging of the eugenist-y type folk, as well as a HUGE social investment in access to the things that bring quality of life. Once someone has had full access to those things, and if they feel their suffering exceeds (or will exceed) any possibility of having what they consider as a good life, that is where MAID should be available,
Fortunately those people that recommended this inappropriately were fired.
The cost benefit is part of any Bill presented in Government. So it was required.
The ghouls in Canada that do this are incredibly protected by the Canadian Government and Media. I believe even reporting on it in the next few years will be considered hate speech and a crime. Seeing how they internally celebrate which demographics and how much money they were "saving" by targeting who they deemed not an asset to life was sickening and I have no doubt any government supported MAID program will devolve into this.
I have no problem with a Doctor prescribing a treatment outside of the system that leads to death if the patient shows consent. But after seeing a regional director for transplants smugly tell her peers that nobody who wasn't fully covid vaccinated would receive any transplants under her watch, I have completely lost faith in medical bureaucracy, but not the practicing doctors themselves.
As a non-Canadian I first heard about the MAID system from an article about a disabled woman who was offered the program after having trouble getting a wheelchair accessible ramp installed outside her house a year or two ago, off the top of my head.
I'm 100% for an assisted suicide system when it comes to late stage terminal illnesses or debilitating chronic conditions assuming they have their mental faculties about them. The waters are a bit murkier when it comes to neurodegenerative diseases or TBI where the patient isn't in the right mind to make that decision for themselves Like at what stage into the disease should they proceed with the procedure or where's the break off point where someone with a TBI can still live a fulfilling life.
For possible future cognitive impairing cases I think it would be a good idea if from adulthood every citizen could opt in or out of the program in an appointment with their GP with an extensive list of conditionals such as the few I listed above where the decision can't really be made after. (To be reviewed every 5-10 years in early adulthood and increasing in frequency as you age)
But the thought that it has been offered as an alternative solution for people with disabilities due to the lack of state resources sickens me. Also I remember reading at the time that they were introducing mental health conditions as a sole qualifier for the procedure which actually scares me, like really terrifies me... It's apparently being pushed back until March next year though while adjustments are being made. It's such a broad qualifier though and I admittedly have no idea of the specific requirements.
On a personal level though I've a history of mental illness going on over a decade now, through the years I've had plenty of bad episodes where suicidal ideation plagues my mind. I only drink a few times a year and when I do it's almost a 50/50 chance that these thoughts turn into bawling self deprecating breakdowns or rarely actual attempts on life. But these thoughts are transitory and I'm also capable of being happy and have family members with disabilities who are dependant upon me.
Obviously if I hypothetically had the MAID system in my country and booked an appointment during one of these episodes there would be enough time between my call and when I get an actual appointment that my mindset would change and I could cancel my appointment. But I'd be worried that if I were to have an episode again, book and cancel ad infinitum that I'd eventually be given an ultimatum to attend the appointment or be cut off from the service altogether. I don't truly want to be dead though but it's hard to convince yourself when you're in that state, I really just need better help than our social services currently provide.
I mean, we do need to increase social investment, but I'm of the opinion we don't hold people here if they don't want to be here, based on the supposed promise that we'll invest in society to help them. Having met my fellow Americans, and seeing that Canada seems to have the same types, they'll talk big game of the need to invest, but when the bill comes, they'll squash it every time because "We just can't afford it."
I've had two friends who had a parent, who in an extremity of agonizing pain, from the progress of an incurable cancer, begged their son to kill them. One, dying of liver cancer & under home hospice care, talked her son into trying - despite massively overdosing her, she didn't die & he couldn't bring himself to try again - she died in agony. Another, his father dying of a bone cancer that was inside his spine, couldn't find it in him to assist his father in dying - so his father died in agony as tumors attacked his spinal column.
Children shouldn't be forced to make these kinds of decisions on parents who have no hope of recovery and are in so much pain. And before the religious attack me: there is no meaning or dignity in going through such suffering - and you are welcome to go through such if you have the misfortune to suffer such a disease if you believe your God wants that for you.
You need to delete this. It puts your friends at risk.
@@kaedri8 ok paranoid schizo
My great grandmother did assist with her husband's death well before I was born. It was also always a fairly open secret in the family. They had discussed it years before and everyone knew about their decision, each promising to help the other if needed. While it was an ethical choice it still destroyed her. For years she felt guilty and never stopped grieving his death. But I can't help but compare it to her death, drugged into a stupor by staff at a care home. She actually ended up with neurological issues from being over medicated. In the end her death was without dignity and long after she had lost her mind.
I can also say of the two it was her death that I grew up afraid of, not my great grandfather's. I still feel she shouldn't have had to shoulder that burden, especially since she had to suffer in secret but I also know from her death what a gift she gave him.
@@kaedri8How exactly?
RUclips detectives that are going to work hard at identifying him, not even knowing his jurisdiction, so they can figure out which one of his friends did something out of love for their parent years ago?
You seriously think those that fight crime don't have more productive and important things to do?
Silly and naive of you to say that.
@@kaedri8you are a weirdo
I’m completely blown away by this. I have an ADRT and a living will. I don’t want to die in an ICU, tortured by needles, weird noises, delirium and pain that I can’t communicate. I’m so sorry to hear about your mum. I support the assisted dying law. All the best Rohin. Have a great festive season and all the best for 2024.
This was a wonderful video! My Auntie died from MND and she had a choice - starve or choke to death! She basically starved. I have just nursed my grandmother through palliative care - she was 96. I was given oramorph to give her if the pain became too much and I was told she probably wouldn't wake up again - she didn't. I was so grateful for our District Nurses. I'm so sorry for your loss x
I volunteer as a patient companion at my local hospital, and because of this I was previously against assisted dying, I felt that it would be a very dangerous thing to give people the option to end the lives of such vulnerable people, who are often suffering as much due to environmental factors as heath related factors. Your clear arguments in favour of legal provisions necessitating terminal illness and mental clarity in order for assisted dying has helped persuade me that it may be possible to implement it ethically. Great video!
Thank you for volunteering ❤
Why are the causes of someone’s suffering relevant to them being able to end their own lives?
@@m00se40 because if their suffering is avoidable should we not prioritise ending their suffering over ending their lives?
@@m00se40Also because if their suffering also makes them mentally incapable they can't really speak for themselves and people deciding they should die because this random person judges their suffering worthy of death is super dangerous. The frail, the disabled, the "drains on society" would be euthanized. This MAID gets very close to euthanasia. Doctors should not be in the business of dying, but saving and preserving life. Comfort measures and hospice though is a bit different though there is a fine line and overlap..
I remember my grandmother wasting away to cancer when she was 57. She'd been professionally cleaning at a factory her entire life. The cleaning agents had benzene in them.
I know society didn't know that it would give cancer at that times, but the least we could have done for her was to let her have peace. Peace before she became so skinny and eaten by the cancer, that just laying on her bones made her groan in agony. I still remember the scream she gave when the nurses had to turn her over for her bedbound wash. I was 5... It marked me for life, it was a terrible way to be introduced to the concept of death as a child.
The 4th of October this year, the "Danish National Center for Ethics" decided that there is "Too much at play, regarding our basic view of human life, to recommend assisted suicide in Denmark" (Directly translated we call it 'active deathhelp', which I lowkey find hilarious). It pisses me off.
Also: Thank you for sharing your story about your mother. She sounds like she was a lovely person 😊
Denmark being concerned with the ethics of AD, but doing the bare minimum for general population prevention and infection control is hilarious to me.
@@Kristina-ek8yt I don't understand what you mean by "population prevention." If it is population control, rest easy: the total fertility rate in Denmark is 1.67 births per woman, and has been under the "replacement rate" of 2.1 for half a century.
@@flagmichael It's a video about healthcare, and my comment is about healthcare and disease prevention (chronic and every other).
@@Kristina-ek8ytI think I know what you meant, but the words can be mis-read to mean the opposite.
If I am correct about what you meant, I agree.
Norwegian, also pro aktiv dødshjelp. If something can't be treated, then suffering should be minimised and that should include aktiv dødshjelp.
Hello Rohin.
I am very sorry about your Mum.
May she rest in peace
I am anesthesiologist, and my older brother passed away from ALS in 2015, after immense suffering.
This video hits home
Thank you for doing this.
Hey, sorry if this reply is weird, but how did you come to be an anesthesiologist? I’m in high school but I’m thinking of following the medical track, what education and how long?
I’m an M.D in Mexico, like in most countries, assisted dying si not legal and, to be honest, because of limited resources, end of life care is barely available for the Mexican population. This video felt extremely personal to me, as I have recently lost a very dear family member.
My grandfather was diagnosed with peripheral artery disease, because of the extent of his vascular lesions, he was no longer a candidate for revascularization surgery, only palliative care was an option. The pain he suffered during his last months was something I can’t even begin to imagine. Despite being treated with morphine and other opioids, he was in constant pain. He was a traveler, the life he knew was no longer available to him, and that made him extremely sad.
I have always thought we, as doctors, have the ability not only to cure, but also the opportunity to help our patients die in a peaceful and honorable way, surrounded by their loved ones. Every human being should be able to decide how he/she wants to go. In Mexico assisted dying is a topic that’s surrounded by stigma and taboo, I hope one day this changes. I don’t want any more of my family members to suffer in their final years, months or days. They, as well as everyone, deserve to decide when enough is enough.
Thank you for sharing your story, I have always admired your work, and now, more than ever, I do.
I don't understand what's the urge, not among peers but among the people who swore to do no harm, to claim the right to murder as a matter of policy.
@@Qwerty-jy9mj oh please, the two doctors are talking about seeing someone suffering immense pain at the end of their life, and asking whether that person should be able to ask for and be given some medical assistance to bring their life to an end somewhat sooner. It's neither accurate nor respectful nor helpful to call it murder, and nor is it being considered as a matter of policy - rather, an option, a choice that an individual with a terminal illness may wish to make. You may not want that choice for yourself, but other people do - should they be given a right to self-determination?
@@Ozymandi_as
Respectful to whom? The victim?
@@Qwerty-jy9mjYour rhetoric barely makes sense. The original sentence’s subject wasn’t even the patient, but the doctor who you accused of actively trying to make excuses for murdering someone. It isn’t disrespectful for someone to fulfil their loved ones last wish of being buried under a tree even if you believe in cremating now is it?
In the end, the scenario is two willing participants doing something they both think is right. It would only be murder if the law said it was illegal to do that. Although whether you think that is moral is your opinion.
@@AnimeFan-wd5pq
So it _is_ a matter of policy. You just have no clue of what you're talking about.
Rohin, thanks for using such a personal story to advocate for something so important. I had a similar experience with my father (CHF & Parkinsons); his final months on hospice were really difficult for him. I honestly don't know if he would have chosen a physician assisted death, but it wasn't an option for him in Pennsylvania at the time. As someone practicing in California, I can assure your viewers that no slippery slope has happened here since a law was passed to allow it as of 2016.
Sorry to hear that Eric
😢❤
I'm sorry that RUclips has taken their pearl-clutching position toward this video of yours. Your videos are consistently insightful and spark valuable conversation on difficult topics. And as always, you manage to sprinkle in just enough humor and wit to balance the heavier topics without detracting from the gravity of the discussion.
I think the warning is appropriate because some people really don't have the mental capacity to deal with a topic like this. But I also believe that everyone who can at least consider the topic should watch this video despite the warning.
I can imagine this might be a very distressing topic for some people, or at certain times, and on that basis, I don't object to the warning. I guess the video does not get promoted through recommendations, and that seems to be a pity, because more people should think about these issues, if they are able to. One would expect that the algorithm could make such an inference if it has sufficient viewing history to analyse.
I had to put down my dog a week ago today (I'm not trying to compare that to losing a parent, but loss sucks no matter how you swing it). This was a very cathartic video, you handled the subject matter with a great deal of respect and nuance. Thank you!
So sorry to hear that, you take care ❤️
Yes... my dog Marty had heart failure. We were unreasonably optimistic that he would survive with medication. Three months after his original diagnosis he was on double the medication. Three months later... his left atrium collapsed. Three days later we held him when he died, he died at peace home in our arms thanks to the help of a vet. I miss him everyday. I cannot imagine a human being suffering for years and years with heart failure and not getting to comfortably take a full breath or say when you've had enough. Considering the other medical issues humans can suffer with.
I lost my sweet mother, I’ve lost dearly beloved pets. And while I can safely say, that I’ve been thoroughly devastated by the loss of my cats. Even similarly to losing my mom. Love is love, grief is grief, the biggest difference is how losing a pet, compared to losing a beloved one, is how it impacts our daily lives.
There are two sides to my opinion on this, and they both have the same conclusion.
Pets are family.
If humans and animals are considered equal, then we should all have equal access to a comfortable death and not be forced to suffer.
On the other hand, if humans are more important than animals, then it is even more cruel that we aren't allowed to forego that suffering and have a comfortable death.
Whatever your stance on the value of humans vs animals, my opinion remains the same.
@@_JoyceArt well said, well said.
wow, i did not think i would actually be brought to tears from this channel
Come on, it was always a possibility. Some of my jokes are REALLY bad
@@MedlifeCrisis I didn't think I would be brought to laughter either... still waiting on that one
@@MedlifeCrisis That is one way to cope with it. You know what I mean. I have noticed it in some professional medics that I know. Ever since I was "under the knife" of a surgeon and his team and they found out that I work where I work and noticed how cynical I am (maybe it was the opiates I received for the pain), we got along way better than I ever expected. I still want to "show him" in a couple of years, as a pun to one of his anecdotes, just to prove him "wrong". A couple of years must pass. But I will pay him a visit. In good manner, obviously.
@@erikziak1249 ?
@@smasher248 Correct.
As a Nebula viewer, I saw this earlier today.
It was quite heartbreaking to see you so emotional at the end and I got rather teary as well.
Thanks for such a comprehensive look on a rather unduly controversial topic, Dr. Rohin.
My grandpa is suffering from stage 4 cancer right now. (If i remember correctly it started in the throat, but spread to his whole body by the time he started treatment.)
Hes quite literally in his final days. When hes not sleeping hes barely sane enough to talk. His organs are falling apart and theybe had to put him on morphine. Hes having hallucinations too. Sometimes asking my grandma to bring a gun or a rope. He cant even sit up on his own, all he can do is suffer. If a person is essentially waiting for death, but constantly in pain, then I think being able to give them a painless and quick death is objectively the better option. Euthanasia isnt a thing where we live though, neither is assited dying. Every day im half expecting to get the message that hes dead, but its possible he'll remain in that state for over a week. I cant imagine just how painful it must feel to feel every bit of yourself fall apart and wither away, and all you can do is suffer.
Thank you Rohin.
I remember my grandmother begging us to "let her rest" in her final months of her struggle with cancer. There was a conflict between and within every party involved. We tried to cling to hope and try as many things as possible to try to make her better. My grandfather bankrupted himself by going to pill peddlers and scammers selling healing teas, promising they would cure her in weeks. He said he would do it all over again just for that 0.nothing chance that he was getting something real.
On the other hand my grandmother was furious and increasingly depressed because of the whole situation, feeling as you said the loss of control. She died peacefully in a coma in a diaper, her last days dulled by morphine, and her last years a husk of her former self.
She was the first natural death in the family in 50 years. Her parents and in-laws had all committed suicide to avoid terminal illnesses. It was considered tradition almost.
If my country had the option for assisted dying, she could have pleaded her case at least.
this is something that i’m also so incredibly passionate about, thank you for speaking about your mum! i’m MD1 from australia and work in the medical ethics space and have seen so many studies come through assessing voluntary assisted dying over the last 4 years and for the most part it has been so overwhelmingly positive. the only groups we have against it are the church funded researchers that try to lobby against it being legislated in each of the states but thankfully they’ve been unsuccessful. how anyone can think they have the right to so much power over other people’s lives is beyond me. end of life care should NOT be something people, ESPECIALLY doctors, are shy to talk about, and assisted dying is 100% a significant part of compassionate CARE. thank you for working towards such a great cause!
PS there’s a great australian movie called “last cab to darwin” which is about VAD, worth a watch!
Last year, my partners father passed via assisted dying. He had terminal colon cancer. It was an extremely difficult experience but he was very clearly so close to being in a far worse state. We were all extremely grateful that his suffering didn’t progress and it wasn’t prolonged. He spent every moment he could with us until he truly no longer could. Thank you for this beautiful video and for sharing your thoughts. I am very much in support of assisted dying.
100% for it. I have MS and thankfully my symptoms are easy right now, but I have no certainty for how long that's going to last. I've spoken to people who have already lost nearly all mobility to it and there's a permanent heavy cloud weighing them down. I'd rather sign a paper asking for alleviation than struggle endlessly in a world where wheelchair accessibility is just a cute afterthought and with a disease that robs you of your dignity. Having the certainty that it's actually terminal unlike desperate DIY solutions would be very comforting.
I'm very sorry you are going through this. Hopefully with all the progress in immunotherapies, those who will be diagnosed in the future will have better outcomes. Autoimmune diseases are a special hell.
Though it still happens progressive disability in patients with MS happens a lot less these days. Therapy developed a lot in the last 20 years. If someone takes an appropriate therapy no disease progression is an achiveable goal.
@@Macaroth1ok but what does this have to do with someone who does get an advanced form of the disease and wants to die?
@@GameTimeWhy Nothing. It was meant as an encouragement for @cucumberwhale that for many patients today the disease doesn't have as terrible a course.
My aunt used assisted dying. She was able to enjoy her time left, without the worry of pain and a slow death. She was able to go on holidays, visiting family, being visited etc, while still being able to and not having to through chemo or other treatments.
I think that I also would want my family to see me, while i'm in a good state and spend some quality time with them, compared to being bedridden or something else. Idk, it probably depends on the situation :D
The only thing i found weird was knowing the date beforehand. Usually when you have a old family member who is sick, you know that the death will come soon, but will always be somewhat suprised when it sets in (thats the case for me atleast). But with assisted dying you are able to plan a visit, accept it and talk with the person. I think it gave me closure aswell.
In 2017 I watch my mother go from a moderately healthy women in her late 50’s to gasping and wheezing. The cancer in her stomach had metastasized and spread up through her lungs and brain. My last memory was of her being hooked up to a hose that forced air into her lungs once a minute. She was so delirious in her last days and I didn’t get to say goodbye to my mother, just her body.
A few months ago my grandfather passed away using MAID in Canada. He suffered from prostate cancer that metastasized to his bones, causing hundreds of tiny bone fractures in his bones, especially the spine, pelvis, hips, and ribs. He was in such terrible agony near the end when the nurses did as little as turn him onto his other side. His condition deteriorated gradually over many months, with doses of prescription painkillers escalating over time to insane levels that still couldn’t put a dent in the terrible pain. Luckily,a few months in advance, he started setting the process of MAID in order in case it got to the point that he needed it, even though he was unsure he would ever use it. I am ultimately very grateful he could. It was past his time.
You did give your mom the death she wanted. Her breathing gave out while she relaxed with morphine in her veins. It just wasn’t as early as she would’ve wanted. She looked so happy in the photos with the family. I’m sure she was quite the woman and so proud of her son, the doctor.
For those who are based outside the UK, the term "learning disability" at 6:06 under UK contexts means a general decreased ability to learn, rather than the US definition (which is also used in many non-English-speaking countries) of inability to learn some academic subjects in conventional ways, e.g. dyslexia, dyscalculia, ADHD, etc. Its US equivalent would be some sort of intellectual disability, or disorders that cause physical disabilities and intellectual disabilities at the same time, like cerebral palsy. LDs in US contexts would be called "learning difficulties" in the UK.
At the end of my Dad's life, when his organs were failing and he was in great pain, the doctor asked him if he wanted morphine, warning him that it could hasten his end. He took it gladly. We could see the relief in his eyes when the morphine finally hit and he passed within a couple of hours with all of us with him. I will be forever grateful that the doctor had the compassion to offer this.
I've seen a few people die in intractable pain. It is not necessary. There is nothing noble about this. Allowing someone to choose to end their suffering should not be a crime. As so many have noted, if you put a pet through what the terminally ill are expected to suffer you would be considered inhumane.
Thank you for your courage in sharing your mother's story. She seems like a remarkable woman.
Thank you for this video. I’m a medical professional as well and it’s so true that though you have a body of medical knowledge, you stand by helplessly watching your family die. My mom, an oncology nurse, died from cancer…the last 2 months of her life weren’t worth living, in my opinion. She suffered. I doubt my mom would have actually chosen death with dignity, but the thought that my pets have better deaths than my own mom was an absolute truth.
I lost my mum to cancer in 2014. In the previous year, the cancer spread to her spinal cord, where it robbed her of her ability to walk. She was one of the most independent and fierce people I've ever known, and I watched her slow decline and worse - saw how increasingly afraid she was. I wish I could say that her final months didn't tar the memory I have of her, but in truth, there will always be a shadow over the thoughts I hold of her.
I don't know if she would have chosen assisted dying, but at least if it were there, perhaps she wouldn't have been so afraid.
Also, she DEFINITELY would have made fun of that cardigan
Yes, I completely agree that we should help those that have no possible treatment to easy their suffering, even by helping they die.
That was a very emotional video. I'd like to add that although this is a channel focused on the content, the delivery is what really makes the difference. You are a great communicator, with a sharp sense of humor that makes us appreciate even more the topics that you cover.
I guess, what I'm trying to say is that you're basically likable.
My mother died of COPD and the doctor talked about her death as "taking her off the ventilator," but in practice the nurse administered morphine every few minutes until she stopped breathing. It was much more like putting down a pet than I ever had expected.
Yup, it's an unspoken agreement already, with good care. This just enshrines it as an option for all.
As someone who lives with depression and suicidal ideation, I find it absurd and absolutely inappropriate for RUclips to put a suicide warning on this video. Assisted dying for the terminally ill is not at all comparable to suicide by people who could probably actually have been helped if they'd had access to the appropriate medical care. The two are not equivalent.
I am so sad this video got flagged as inappropriate, I hope this get rectified as soon as possible. If you ever would like to discuss such topics further, I would be really interested in hearing your opinion on people diagnosed with incurable neuro degenerative disease which wish to end their suffering.
It’s proper. This is a traumatizing topic.
"Do no harm" right ?
But what happens when the most harm being done is by forcing a patient to live ?
A great question indeed, and some people seem to confuse "do no harm" for "keep people alive no matter the cost"
Having a 93 yo grandma and seeing her slowly going downhill, having an option to do this feels almost necessary. In a few short years, she has gone from the lady that is almost always outside, tending her garden and flowers, to being almost unable to go outside, having to wear diapers and struggling to even lift a cup of tea. This has taken a huge mental toll on her and everyone around her, which makes her feel more and more like a burden. Although she does not have any terminal illness and does not suffer much pain beyond the usual old age things, the possibility that it could start at any time scares her more then the death itself. She just wants to die peacefully, and even just knowing that there is an option to do that, would give her more relief and peace of mind that any medication possibly could.
Yep. I am only 24, but I would love to have the option to choose when to die. The endless void of death scares me less than being unable to take care of myself or even worse, lose my mind to dementia.
My grandpa died after suffering with COPD for about 30 years, which is longer than expected. No man or woman should have to suffer such a slow and painful death.
I think just the *knowledge* about having the option of an assisted death can give you some peace of mind and reduce the feeling of helplessness
I fully agree. I do not have the numbers, but expect that many people were actually calmed down by knowing that there is a "way out", which increased the quality of their life and many of them even did not need to resort to the "way out". I hope I will never ever be forced into such a situation, regardless from which side.
Thank you for talking about this on such a public platform.
When I worked as a vet nurse, I observed two types of deaths: the controlled and the uncontrolled. The controlled cases would involve a terminally ill animal who was suffering, so it's human owners would make the immensity difficult decision to bring their loved pet in for their final rest. Every one of those final moments I watched was peaceful, respectful, and filled with love.
The uncontrolled cases often involved terminally ill pets too, but the owners... for various personal reasons, they couldn't bring themselves to organize euthanasia for their pet. Those deaths I witnessed were very sad. The pet suffered longer than it needed to and, when they were in their last hours of life, their human owner would panic and rush them to the vet in the hopes we could prolong their life (even if we had discussed at length that prolonging life was not medically possible for that health condition). Those pets suffered and to be honest their last moments were surrounded by panic and fruitless medical intervention, not love. I wish those owners could have remained calm and just held their pets allowing them to die peacefully at home in their loving owners arms.
After seeing so many types of deaths, even "just" for pets, I very strongly support allowing a terminally ill person to die with dignity. When my own auntie died from cancer, I was so incredibly thankful to live in Australia where the palliative care team allowed my aunt to be surrounded by family. She had a room by the rose garden, we all got to tell her how much we love her, I even baked my aunt her favorite cherry pie, and she was given enough morphine to not be in pain for the first time in years. She fell asleep and never woke up, but she knew she was loved and she was given a dignified death. Everyone deserves this type of kindness.
Hey doc, it is so brave of you to talk about such a significant loss in your life and I really appreciate your courage. I also firmly believe that if everyone had your sense of rationality and calmness the world would truly be a better place Keep up the great work👍👍
I totally believe they should be allowed to. Suffering without need or any hope of recovery is torture to me.
I am an MD, I am from Switzerland with it’s special rules - and I lost my brother to colon cancer. He had perfect palliative care and could leave very peacefully, so no „help“ needed. But you bet I watched this video carefully. You didn’t disappoint 😌👍
This video was tremendous. As a doctor who wants to go into palliative care I saw a lot of this struggle during my intern year. You’ve laid it out well and succinctly and also made a lovely connection with the story about your mum. Palliative care is often in opposition to it but I feel that a lot of younger doctors (like me) feel that it’s an important change that needs to happen. I’m from Australia so I’ve seen it already and I feel that from what I’ve seen, it’s an important choice for patients to have.
I think this kind of stuff is very easy to explain the following way: if a person is KNOWN to die in the nearest future, there is no information that their condition could ever improve, and all indications show that it is only going to get worse, and ALL known/possible workarounds have been tried and have proved unsuccessful, then that person absolutely has the right to choose how they die.
Personally I think this should apply even if that person is not currently in great pain, but that part is obviously subjective. If I had an incurable disease that caused me enough discomfort, even if I could tolerate it, and I knew that it would only get worse - why would I want to wait until the pain becomes unbearable? That just feels like prolonging the inevitable, causing everyone more suffering than necessary (obviously me, but also everyone who cares about me seeing me suffer and grieving from it), and wasting unnecessary resources on maintaining my miserable existance that would be much better spent on much more useful stuff, e.g. if I knew that keeping my dying ass alive for one more year would cost my relatives and the healthcare system a combined total of 100k€, then I would MUCH rather kill myself and have those 100k€ donated to orphanages, animal shelters, research institutions, etc.
I’ve always said that if I lose my faculties in ways that I no longer feel myself, I’ll get a ‘one way ticket to Switzerland’
Me too, and my mom also expressed interest in doing that as well... I know I'm only 26 but you just never know when something like this will happen
And well, my dad's cousin actually got his one way ticket to Switzerland back in 2017... He had terminal prostate cancer (a very aggressive one btw), he wanted to do that bc he was scared to end up like my paternal grandpa in his final days (who also died from prostate cancer in 2015, he was 64 and I miss him so much 😭) and had the money to go there to have dignified end of life... Nobody in his close family agreed to that (him mom, brothers and nephew), but one of his friends (also his band mate) decided to go with him... He chose Dignitas and that companion is required for the post-death procedures, especially in his case bc we are from Brazil which is far away from Switzerland
Anyways, he was able to rest in a peaceful, painless way shortly after his 56th birthday in 2017... He got to cheer with one of his mates with metal music and it was great to him and I'm happy he was able to get his one way ticket to Switzerland
I was already favorable of that to me before, but after this dad's cousin experience it only reinforced my wishes to do that one day tbh
Both my mum's parents had strokes and had many months of simply lying there looking pleadingly at her and her brother and sister to help them go peacefully and with some dignity. The worst was my grandmother who saw her husband of 55 years go then went through it herself, after making her kids promise not to let the doctors do that to her. My mum was adamant not to go like that. And being a New Zealander, she now almost certainly won't.
My mother died of terminal lung cancer. I was fortunate enough that I could care for her till the end, but it only proved to me how cruel it is to deny people the chance of an easy and dignified way out. In the end there was nothing left for her but pain and indignity. If I ever get diagnosed with something like that I hope I'll have the courage to end it on my own terms...
Part of why I hate December so much is the shadow of my dad's illness. 24/12 - I found my dad rolling on the floor in agony, his one clear request was for me to help him die.... I didn't and I regret that decision every day. What followed my refusal were two of the most harrowing, painful and undignified months of his life, before he died alone in a hospital bed having had most of his bowels removed and barely weighing a third of his original weight.
Since then shame is my companion this time of year, that I was either a coward or arrogant in whatever principles I thought prevented me from that act of mercy.
I strongly support assisted dying or dignity in death care, the reasons against it do not hold much weight, but then I speak as someone who failed and is haunted by that, I don't want anyone else to feel so helpless, alone or ashamed.
Thanks Rohin, your story meant a lot to me and too many others. I hope the good memories are never far from you and that many more await you.
My mum who was in a rest home with little quality of life (I was unable to care for her myself), begged me to supply her with sleeping tablets - but we'd had a case in NZ where a daughter in a similar situation ended up in jail for doing similar and so this idea was discarded. I discovered chatting with my mum that before she ended up in the rest home, she had actually tried to overdose on medication - but the attempt failed and was unpleasant and she was too scared to try again - she told me and others that she had flu' which she recovered from that. Finally she decided - and yes she was still capable of making decisions (and had a long-standing 'living will') - to stop medication, food and water. I'm glad the nursing home respected her living-will, though they did ask me if they had my permission to withhold meds (as though I owned my mother's life). I sat with her and "luckily" it only took about 36 hours for her to die, but also, I suspect an iron-will to refuse particularly water - she wouldn't even let me moisten her lips - such was her resolve. This should have been so much easier for a woman who deserved so much better. She should have had better choices. My very best wishes to you, Rohin.
Thank you for making this content. Most medical channels on youtube are either pure education or surface-level entertainment. I like that you dig into the ethical and systemically problematic parts of medicine that most people outside (or inside) the system don't think about.
Oh my god, your story is almost identical to my own mother's 😢 She underwent an operation for bowel cancer, and when I went to see her after, her voice was slightly slurred. We thought nothing of it. She then choked, and I saved her with the heimlich, then a month later, my brother had to do the same. Sure enough, 9 months later they diagnosed her with bulber palsy. I and my siblings too took care of our mother in her last 2 years. The worst thing was, that from the second time she choked, I knew it was the symptoms of bulber palsy, because I had written a fiction piece on someone with it, and did a lot of research on the illness, and this was only a short time before her initial operation. I don't think she would of availed of assisted death, as I feel she went after she said goodbye to those she loved, but I know she would have wanted the option for others. It's haunting to me how many people both around me and in the media have had some form of mnd, whereas I only really knew of Stephen Hawking. I'm so sorry for your loss❤
It never ceases to amaze me how many people are living with, or have friends or family living with, horrible medical conditions. Every time, I think, that could so easily be me or someone I love in a few years and that is why I support your position on this issue.
I watched my mum die in hospital last year. No words to describe how harrowing it was, went to school during the day and just sat there with her in the evenings watching her suffer. She was a fighter with a lot of hope and wouldn't have wanted a medically assisted death, although they did end up sedating her completely in her last few days due to her levels of pain. It's a horrible way to go. If I were in the same situation I would opt for a medically assisted death without a shadow of a doubt. A big thank you for campaigning for it. Hope it makes its way into the law before I strike unlucky.
You are such an incredible scientific communicator. You are all the more impressive for taking on ethically complex medical topics. I spend far too much of my life on this platform listening to all types of educational content, yet there is no one else I have found who presents with such clarity and respect for the audience. Please continue what you do.
My grandfather chose medically assisted dying a year and a half ago after his cancer came back. It was a hard decision, but watching him suffer was even harder than watching him pass with dignity
It's "do no harm", not "do not allow death". Sometimes allowing someone to die is by far the less harmful outcome
I’m a Canadian and this was super educational and one of the most level headed takes on MAID. I appreciate you for informing me about this. I’m a student and won’t be able to donate, but sending you and your family lots of love.
While I completely agree with this in terms of terminal patients, as a young, disabled, Canadian I find it horrifying. There was a woman who had extreme chemical sensitivities, her landlord wouldn't accommodate her and the government felt as though she was perfectly fine living how she was and refused to help her, so she went with MAID she publicly said she didn't want to die but she was suffering too much to live.
I myself have complicated health problems that the health care system doesn't care to figure out and every time I go to see a doctor, which admittedly isn't often due to all the medical trauma I now have, I am scared it will be the time they will suggest MAID to me. Our healthcare system in my opinion doesn't give a single shit about us and they just waste our time until we give up trying to get help. The fears about the qualifications broadening is unfortunately valid, if your counties healthcare is already in shambles it can end up being used as a way for doctors to get out of doing their job.
But again to be clear, I am in full support of assisted death in terminal cases, it isn't fair we allow our pets a more dignified death than our fellow humans. If someone is suffering and has low to no chance of survival then it should be their right to decide when to end things, the suffering we put terminal patients though is completely unnecessary. Just make sure that law doesn't get broadened. As much as it pains me to say most people still don't value the life of anyone who is disabled.
If you've read all of this then firstly thank you for listening to my take, and I will leave you with this. No one is able bodied, everyone is either disabled or pre disabled, because there are only too options in life. Die young or live long enough that you end up disabled in some way, that's just how life works, so remember that disability rights and access benefit all of us. You're health is not in your control, so cherish it while you have it.
Thank you for sharing this. I feel like at least some of the people expressing the "Slippery slope" argument also have this as their fear but lack the precise wording to express it.
They always tell you to keep fighting for proper medical care, but what happens when that fight has drained your strength to keep fighting? It's just too easy for them to tell us to kindly unalive ourselves instead of changing the system so medical care is easier to obtain.
@@juliaprohaska9295 Thanks for replying! Agreed, very well put, most people don't understand how hard it is to fight for your health. All the while doctors keep telling you that you're fine and they are satisfied with your quality of life. It is a very large and complicated issue that unfortunately doesn't have an easy fix. Hopefully we can at least start to address it and work towards a better solution soon
Yes but it depends. Like coup de grace. But when people who ask for help but gets recommended dying, that's where it's wrong.
But that is also never going to happen
@@nielsgeudens4650 Canada have been offering death to their homeless and veterans who badly need help. Look it up. and Switzerland is on track to follow Canada.
This question is hard to answer, and it is even harder to justify. A person may be in very large amounts of pain due to an illness, and hence, people might believe that they should be allowed to end their own life. My father had cancer, and down the line, he developed sepsis. His body would feel so much pain that they had him on morphine for the entire day. He couldn't bear laying down, so he'd sleep sitting. His right leg was extremely swollen. However, he didn't give up. May he rest easy. I wanted to write this because i want whoever is reading to know that I know people who have been through these things.
That is physical pain. However, do we disregard mental pain? We don't say that physical pain is worse than mental pain. Mental pain can be even worse at times. If people who are in physical pain should be allowed to end their own life, then why can't those who live life every day not wanting to be alive? Shouldn't they be assisted by doctors?
I agree with you. Apart from the moral question of taking away a person's life because of one's belief that they are intellectually superior to come to that conclusion, there is a danger of where this kind of approach will take people. It also hinders research on how to overcome the problems and gives scientists an easy way out.
@@NoorsUnpopularOpinions Exactly. Well said
I agree with legalising assisted dying. But your comment about the ‘slippery slope’ does apply to Canada unfortunately. Two younger people were approved for the service due to mould toxicity caused by their apartments. They couldn’t afford to move and theirs landlords didn’t fix it, so they opted for the service instead. While I think people deserve to die with dignity, I think we need to stay mindful of the way our current economic climate puts people at risk when we introduce these policies without first improving social conditions.
The slippery slope argument is pretty solid.
It started with terminally ill individuals and advanced to 'mentally ill' individuals.
Absolutely disgusting.
100% The way it's going in Canada too, they proactively offer it to the "distressed mentally ill".
I couldn't find anything about what you guys are talking about, would y'all mind providing some sources on the claim?
@@NigarIsHere there have been cases of them killing people with depression. Also a lot of disability human rights campaigners are against it. These by the most part are liberal people that know how the state works.
@@victoriap1561 that is really interesting, I would really like to see what the whole thing is about, like if it is a systematic issue or whatever, if it isn't too much to ask, could you name an article or the site you saw this information on?
Thank you for this. Difficult but so important. I have stage 4 breast cancer. As an atheist, i am not afraid of being dead. But i do hope not to suffer excessively on my way there. In my state in Australia, there are provisions for MAID and i applaud that. Every opposition to the development of these laws seems to come from one of three directions; 1) it's the 'slippery slope' (it'll give someone carte blanche to kill anyone they want to) or 2) palliative care physicians who can't accept that they cannot sufficiently relieve suffering and 3) suffering is good for your soul. The most persistent, vociferous opposition comes from Catholics. From where i stand, my choices should not be limited by someone else's superstition. As long as the individual is competent to indicate their wishes, i dont believe that the "dying within 6 or 12 months" (depending on where you live) requirement is appropriate. No-one can tell someone that their suffering is 'acceptable'.
For Australians, the ABC Listen app has an old podcast called Better Off Dead by Andrew Denton and is worth a listen
Dentons work was pivotal in gaining acceptance in Oz, I'm sure of it. Wishing you all the best Cassie.
it's legal here, i couldn't be more thankful for my grandma. she was suffering a lot at the end of her life and was given a painless and calm way out. just have to make sure it's as robust as it is here, family members and herself had to sign and two independent doctors had to give green light
I don't think including family consent is a good idea. What if someone's family opposes it for religious reasons. I don't think we should restrict people's freedoms depending on what their family wants
I assure you my parasocial feelings for you are very fond despite your standoffishness. An appropriate subject for the longest night of the year. My dad went with MND. I recognised the likely diagnosis as you talked about your mum choking on a prawn. Usually I get a nice feeling from spotting what is coming, not this time. I could not have cared for my dad, luckily my mum was there. He said it was the embarassment of not being able to do anything for himself that was the worst for him. He died unexpectedly soon during an operation because his breathing was worse than they thought. Much respect for every carer and the cared. Now I'm fond of your mum, too.
I have oculopharyngeal muscular dystrophy (OPMD), a disease with very similar symptoms as your mother had (severe ptosis is also a symptom). It is inherited. I watched my grandfather, my aunts, my uncle, and lastly, my mother die from this disease. I saw the feeding tubes, the eventual pneumonia, sepsis from the feeding tube, and swelling around the heart. I saw my mother, at her end, on a respirator, silently begging for us to let her go. I asked her, three times if she wanted us to remove the respirator, and she nodded yes, with tears in her eyes, and squeezed my hand. I don’t want to put my family through that same agony and guilt that I had to go through when stopping the respirator. I want to make the choice to die on my own terms before it gets to that point. I want more families to have access to their loved ones DNRs, and if I am not allowed to make the choice for assisted death, I will have my fucking DNR tattooed on my body so that some poor EMT who is called when my body is failing has no question as to my wish not to be intubated.
I support assisted dying, but the slippery slope is very real and it should be aknowledged before any legislations are passed.
If this is to become law, then it must be rock solid
I am a first year graduate-entry medical student. When assisted dying opinion was polled in our ethics lectures, the vast majority were in favour. Times are changing - thank you for putting the case forward so eloquently and powerfully.
As I quote I heard from other doctor: A doctor's job is to reduce human suffering, not saving lives, because you can't save lives, only extend them. If you are treating a terminal patient, your job is to make them suffer less, not extend their lifes.
One of the things that makes me so angry is that if I ever got Alzheimer's, even if it was legal to opt for euthanasia, most places will not allow you to choose that because you're not deemed mentally competent. I would definitely rather dip out than die by inches as my memory goes.
This has been a debate in Canada. Should we allow a person who is competent now, but has a condition that will lead to suffering and mental incompetence, elect for a future MAID.
It seems like that should be able to be written into a will.
@@gjmottetcan you do that? I know DNR is a thing, and can be conditional (for example "in case o have X Y and Z disease and has progressed to a stage I cannot make a conscious choice I would like no heroic measures taken")
I have never understood why the government can force you to be alive against your will. I believe in autonomy and it baffles me that so many people argue against it.
My father died of metastatic cancer in 2020, after living with the knowledge that the condition was terminal for several years. The last 6 weeks of his life were harrowing to us all, even once he was able to get a bed in a local hospice. Watching that made me even more convinced that medically assisted death should be a thing, particularly for people with advanced terminal conditions.
I am a German med Student, Ex-paramedic and I want to go into anaesthesiology, pain medicine and maybe palliative care. I love your approach, and I deeply felt for the story of you and your mum. I think having a way of assisted dying is very much necessary, but also understand the concerns of people being pushed into it, because of socio-economic reasons, disability or a lack of mental health services. Like you I feel like this doesn’t negative the point though, we just have to find legislation that works around these things. Austria for example passed a bill in favour of assisted dying, but invests 18 million euros (2 million per inhabitant) into palliative care so that patients are not pushed into assisted dying because of a lack of assistance or care. Thank you for your moving and wonderful video, happy holidays and all the best to you and your family. I hope I can one day become a doctor as patient focused, reasonable and funny as you!
Incentive and profit are inevitable roadblocks which will cement my position against this mercy
11:20 nevermind, aye. For the terminally ill this ought to be a right after a period of time
My father died 2 years ago. He had a signed DNR,DNI. I am sure glad we did not have to use it, and he died peacfuly at home and not in pain.