Video quality looked fine to me mate. Shame the face of some pompous twat kept appearing on the screen, but then the camera switched back to you and we’re all good again
Language Jones is specialist and won’t appeal to everyone - i like him with the usual caveats. He’s knowledgeable, academic, serious and actually known in his field. You can read the papers and evidence he cites. A lot of what he says is at least worth thinking about. BUT he simultanously reveres John Wells as a giant in the field of linguistics and doesn’t much like esperanto - so there’s that. 😂
Mi sciis ke li ne ŝatas Esperanton, sed kiu estas John Wells, kaj kial estas malbone ke li ŝatas lin? (Li iam "minacis" fari filmeton pri Esperanto se homoj volas tion. Se li faros, eble mi ne spektos, por ankoraŭ esti kapabla ĝui la ceteron de liaj filmetoj, mdr.)
I kind of wish he cited a few papers in this video but maybe I need to watch another. I didn’t know he doesn’t like Esperanto, well, in that case he probably will totally dismiss me lol. Especially if John Wells couldn’t convince him!
I guess I’ll comment on Language Jones since we’re critiquing him. I don’t agree with everything he says but I agree with a lot and what’s more important is I really enjoy hearing him talk about languages. He’s really smart and interested in the topic and the videos are very interesting as a result. Actually, I was comparing him to Matt vs Japan. I could also listen to Matt talk about language learning over and over and never get bored.
@@paulwalther5237 I’ll just add, I’m not really critiquing him just this one video. I added this video the okayish language advice playlist as it was neither great advice or bad advice.
He has the typical problem of linguists-they think everyone loves grammar as much as they do and wants to learn all sorts of unnecessary details about the linguistics of another language.
I donno, I hate grammar, but there's huge value in starting with grammar. Not because it's fun and enjoyable, but because it gives an overview of the challenges of the language. It's why it's super useful to try learning more than one language. I did the german thing, and now have switched over to french(I live in Canada). Trying to stretch my brain to understand German grammar, made starting french very very straight forward. I learn the hardest parts first, then I know what the destination is. It's sort of like getting in a helicopter to see the top of mount everest before you return to the base camp and start your journey up the language tree. I start with the grammar allow myself to get overwhelmed. Then I basically give up on the deep end of the grammar and build my language plan around getting to that end game. Knowing the grammar allows me to appreciate what words I want to learn. My plan for french is learn 1000 verbs. Then learn 10,000 nouns/adjectives/adverbs. Then after all that switch back to the grammar of those verbs. I'm also think it's hard to learn only words that interest you in your own language. If the word is never used in your internal dialogue you probably won't retain it. When I'm vacation, "the key to my hotel room" isn't something that enters my internal monologue" it's just a background thing, I have no conscious interest in. Instead on vacation I'm usually focused on the history of the place I'm visiting in. 1,000 words regarding history is far easier for me to learn, than 100 words about mundane dull parts of life like my hotel room key.
15:20 When he said “the noun is red”, I think he meant “the [noun] is red”, meaning that you would fill in the noun with something useful. I don’t think he meant the literal word “noun”
You’re totally right. I think because he was talking about grammar before this for some reason I just assumed he meant noun as in actual noun. My bad here >.
Yeah, something like this: La manzana es roja → The apple is red La silla es roja → The chair is red If "casa" means "house", how do you say "the house is red"? La manzana está en la caja → The apple is in the box. La caja está en la habitación → The chair is in the room. How do you say "the room is in the house"? I tried that once with someone I was chatting with, and at least they had fun. They probably didn't get to learn a lot in only a few minutes, but if we had kept going, who knows?
The Italian thing he mentioned was Language Lords who used a 14 minute video from the Easy Italian youtube channel as his core to begin his Italian journey as a way to learn 1000 words and how to use them. LL has also got videos on his techniques to learn French and Spanish. If Jones has been to the LL channel he knows what LL is trying to do and why, so Jones is being somewhat disingenuous.
Okay, I might have to go watch that video by language lords at some point to see for myself. But not liking the idea that Languagejones is taking stuff out of context.
I thought about that Xiaoma's video in which he tries to learn Italian in 24 hrs, and the results are what you can expect from 24 hrs of learning, lol. But he learned with a book and tutors in that one, iirc. But come on, I went and watched that LL video, and okay, he did a reasonable job for two months of learning. But he never mentions (or I missed it) that Italian is almost like the perfect mix between French and Spanish, two languages that he speaks. He probably doesn't "need" to study grammar for it (he would probably benefit from it, but he's starting off a good base). I speak Spanish, and more than 90% of Portuguese grammar would be something I already can intuit. Still, learning the parts where it's different helps a lot. LJ is not making a critique of that video, he's only throwing a quip. And that video can be pretty misleading in my opinion. It would be a completely different thing trying to learn any language from a different family.
My first impression of this guy put me off for a long while because he had this whole video calling various polyglots frauds. I not only thought that was a poisonous thing to do, but I also thought he was just wrong. I eventually checked out more of his library of content and have categorized him as a source of largely unactionable content with some interesting insights. Like Oscar Wilde but more specialized.
@nuansd Setting aside the question of whether and to what extent it's a good idea for us to declare that most polyglots aren't legit (which I don't feel like I gain much from doing), I feel like polyglot fraud witch hunting can be sketchy business.
@@TalkingAmerican i believe his main point - like metatron on his channel - is that ‘polyglot frauds’ who promise you brilliant success because look they speak 8 plus languages ‘fluently’ when they actually don’t and that you can too if only you buy their course / book/ programme or whatever are essentially scammers and frauds who make genuine learners feel inadequate when they shouldn’t and take money under false pretences.
I get both sides of this. For one I don’t say someone is a fraud because I usually don’t know enough about the person to say if that’s true or not. So I just like to dismantle ideas because that usually requires very little background on the person. Also those I would consider frauds usually do speak multiple languages but over-inflate how many they speak and undersell the effort involved or totally don’t mention they’re natives in multiple! Despite this, I don’t think I’ve ever said as of yet that X person is a fraud. Instead always just debate ideas on an individual level.
I like Language Jones, but he does have limitations. He tends to do interesting videos. I remember this one being underwhelming. The points I remember taking from this video are: 1) SRS are the best way to retain information 2) Get a good grammar to study as needed, and look at the overview of the language 3) Look for materials that treat the Target Language as its own thing, and not just a translation of your First Language So far my favorite language textbook is Progress In Irish(1989). Each lesson Vocab, important grammar note, and example sentance: Tá is Ag siúl walking ... In Irish the verb comes first ... Tá Brian ag siúl. Brian is walking. The only problem is that i dont have native speaker examples of the words and sentences.
6:04 I have a funny story to share. One day, I was reading a language textbook in Portuguese, my native language. The book was supposed to teach how to say 'I'm Brazilian,' but instead, it taught how to say 'I'm American.' After that experience, I decided never to touch a language textbook again!
Haha, that reminds me of Pimsleur which was drilling me on saying I’m American or I’m from California or something in Chinese and I was thinking… I’m totally going to accidentally tell someone I’m from California one day haha
I totally agree with you about Rosetta Stone for Chinese. It seems that no one really says 食品杂货店 (shí pǐn zá huò diàn) most people just say 超市 (chāo shì). Rosetta Stone doesn't teach that distinction. Doesn't even mention chāo shì
Can you understand the Japanese expression “dame desu ne”? I sometimes go to a local language meetup and one guy took Japanese in college and only remembers that expression which I think is hilarious. (It’s what his teacher said to him when he passed in his final exam).
Nope, only remember how to count to 10 haha but if I started learning the language again I’m guessing lots would come flooding back. Oh I can still read a lot of hiragana.
21:50 is a perfect example of making something that seems daunting and confusing seem rather easy, comprehensive and not all a foreign concept. Hes not "showing off" he created a premise and then displayed its use thus concluding the topic. If mentioning the benefits of problematic topic and then showing people (english speakers) how theyve been doing it this whole time in a short concise example about coffee and the acquisition of it is showing off then every language channel should stop because every last one of you can in some manner be seen as showing off the result's your chosen verbal toil. 😂
I was interested in his videos for a while until he admitted that he doesn't speak another language at a high level, only at an intermediate level. Well...I'm intermediate at my target language so why in the world am I wasting my time watching him? I'm okay with people being smug and know-it-all, but not when they've haven't walked the walk themselves.
I’m actually not aware of what languages he’s speaks. I guess that’s where him and I differ. He’s coming at this from a theoretical understanding and I’m coming at it from a practical understanding.
This guy leans on his Phd in linguistic but that does not mean he is an expert in language acquisition. He already says his ideal course includes an understanding of grammar and yet most experts in language acquisition baulk at the idea. As for memorizing lists of words, why? A guy from NZ memorized the entire French dictionary, won the national french scrabble games and yet cannot speak a word of French. People are looking for hacks and making it harder than it need be as a result. Language acquisition takes time and speaking is a result of acquisition not a tool.
I’ve heard of that New Zealand guy before. The guy is seriously committed to beating the French in their own language without giving them an inch by actually learning their language haha
"The average language learner has no clue what any of that means. . ." True, but the average language learner never gets past "Dos cervezas, por favor." For those (adult learners) who are serious about learning a language to fluency, the majority of them will need to learn grammar for the same reason that when you sit down to learn the piano, the teacher will first show you how to hold the violin and the bow properly, give you the names of the strings, teach you how to read notes off sheet music, etc.
I’m a serious language learner and I generally don’t learn grammar (apart from the bare bones) until after I’ve recognised it via patterns in the language. Grammar has its place, but what Languagejones is proposing is just a bad idea. I’ve taught language classes both with and without grammar and those without grammar always retained students for a lot longer. It’s also very dependent on the learner. Some love grammar and some hate it. One of the best foreign Chinese speakers I’ve seen online has a video where he talks about how he never learned grammar and only recognised it after the fact. In the end the best approach is whatever approach keeps one moving forward. I still don’t understand some Esperanto grammar rules yet I can perfectly apply them all the time while others can explain the rules but can’t apply them naturally.
@@Evildea Don't get me wrong, I'm not really defending most of what this guy says here. I have seen his videos before and find his advice of mixed quality. But with all due respect, when you say you're a serious language learner, I don't really know you except what you've said in this video, which is that you speak Esperanto fluently, and are intermediate in one other language. Esperanto (which I do not speak) is well-known for having a stripped down, greatly simplified grammar in order to facilitate its learning as an international language. So essentially, you're saying you have not yet reached fluency in a non-constructed language. In my experience, it's really easy to build in fossilized weaknesses if you ignore grammar. I spoke to a Chinese guy just yesterday parking my car outside of Chinatown in my city who spoke with fluency and ease, but said, "You bring car two hour ago? Twelve dollar." He had learned to communicate fine, but had no use of verb tenses or even plural. If you don't study grammar at all, this is a risk. Some people are probably good at extrapolating grammar, but most of us are not, at least not as adult learners.
@@Evildea Your example of drawing arrows between the gerund of English and the equivalent in Esperanto wouldn't work in, say, Swahili. If I wrote that Usingalisoma usingalijifunza means "If you hadn't studied, you wouldn't have learned," there is no way you could extrapolate the grammar from that, no matter how many arrows I drew. Again, I'm not taking issue with much of what you say here, or your criticisms of this guy, but almost everyone I know who has reached a B2-C2 in a foreign language as an adult has done a fair bit of conscious study of the grammar. It's not fun, but I think it's necessary for most of us.
Hey, all good. I haven’t taught Swahili speakers so obviously a different approach would need to be tailored to them. It’s like learning Chinese doesn’t even really have a tense system anything like English so his grammar approach wouldn’t work well either. That’s a big part of the video. One must develop methods based on both a source and target language. I’m not fluent in a non constructed language but give me a few years and I’ll reach fluency in Chinese haha (currently like an upper intermediate). Pretty sure my advice would be the same. I have however taught thousands of hours of English using every method possible so I’ve seen what works and doesn’t work. Probably best is just to ask the student what they want to focus on. A grammar approach or some other method. If they don’t know, go through a testing phase of applying different methods until they find something they like.
Simple grammar Cheat sheets (Verb tenses) Michel Thomas method That's about it. Cheats There are little cheats for grammar and language learning. Michel Thomas grammar for Arabic, Spanish and French are the best. I also use Mnemonics for alphabets (I mine the best mnemonics. Not really necessary but I like to find the best ones.) Pronoun tables (it helps me with German, French and various other languages) Cases tables
A simple grammar cheat sheet is definitely a good idea. I’ve never really used one but after a while if I notice patterns I like to go back and check my understanding of the pattern against a grammar guide. It basically just confirms what I’ve already learned by this point.
The guy who has memorized an entire dialogue in italian to learn it is from someone you've reviewed before. This one: ruclips.net/video/Ry3XmUZ3d4s/видео.html&ab_channel=LanguageLords
languagejones used to be a cartoon character featured on South Park episode Smug Alert! which mostly revolves around people of San Francisco farting and smelling their own farts. His explosive flatulence eventually tore the fabric of 2D cartoon world and allowed him to cross over to our reality, where he found a place as a youtube linguist sharing the excessive amounts of the expelled gases that he wasn't able breath back in and recycle, with the rest of us
its just popular science. its entertainment. they have better understanding of the neighbouring fields then the general public, but way less understanding then average enthusiast of a field. pedagogy isnt linguistic. most of his stuff is useless for language learners because its completely different field and his experience in learning is irrelevant (just like mathematician can easily understand physics equations, even with 0 clue of what parameters actually means). so why do bother watch his language learning videos? other ones are interesting tho.
At this poit I have to say, he gives not an ounce of value except for the level of english he speaks. In my opinion he never gives a practical tip or suggestion... I learnt much more from ari no yume, especially a way of organising the resources and how to be more consistent. Stuff that really helps.😂
@@Evildea ruclips.net/video/UJN25tipc_g/видео.htmlsi=vvfw_KNcbj6c1swa But it's not one of the typical videos that you usually review. But she has quite a lot of recap on resources and stuff. Will send you a better link tomorrow.
![Noob To Max With DRAGON REWORK In Blox Fruits [FULL MOVIE]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/LnBMOinoOvA/mqdefault.jpg)
My video quality isn't very good as currently working out of a poorly lit apartment in China.
Will be back in Australia in a week.
Review Stuart Jay Raj. He's Australian as well. Stu is the BEST!
Video quality looked fine to me mate. Shame the face of some pompous twat kept appearing on the screen, but then the camera switched back to you and we’re all good again
Language Jones is specialist and won’t appeal to everyone - i like him with the usual caveats. He’s knowledgeable, academic, serious and actually known in his field. You can read the papers and evidence he cites. A lot of what he says is at least worth thinking about. BUT he simultanously reveres John Wells as a giant in the field of linguistics and doesn’t much like esperanto - so there’s that. 😂
Mi sciis ke li ne ŝatas Esperanton, sed kiu estas John Wells, kaj kial estas malbone ke li ŝatas lin?
(Li iam "minacis" fari filmeton pri Esperanto se homoj volas tion. Se li faros, eble mi ne spektos, por ankoraŭ esti kapabla ĝui la ceteron de liaj filmetoj, mdr.)
I kind of wish he cited a few papers in this video but maybe I need to watch another.
I didn’t know he doesn’t like Esperanto, well, in that case he probably will totally dismiss me lol. Especially if John Wells couldn’t convince him!
@frechjo Li estas fama esperantisto kaj lingvisto; eo.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_C._Wells
It annoys me that he sets up expectations that he will suggest something novel and then delivers almost nothing.
Yeah, I was kind of hoping he would talk about the science of memory but just spoke about SRS :/
I guess I’ll comment on Language Jones since we’re critiquing him. I don’t agree with everything he says but I agree with a lot and what’s more important is I really enjoy hearing him talk about languages. He’s really smart and interested in the topic and the videos are very interesting as a result. Actually, I was comparing him to Matt vs Japan. I could also listen to Matt talk about language learning over and over and never get bored.
@@paulwalther5237 I’ll just add, I’m not really critiquing him just this one video. I added this video the okayish language advice playlist as it was neither great advice or bad advice.
He has the typical problem of linguists-they think everyone loves grammar as much as they do and wants to learn all sorts of unnecessary details about the linguistics of another language.
I donno, I hate grammar, but there's huge value in starting with grammar. Not because it's fun and enjoyable, but because it gives an overview of the challenges of the language. It's why it's super useful to try learning more than one language.
I did the german thing, and now have switched over to french(I live in Canada). Trying to stretch my brain to understand German grammar, made starting french very very straight forward.
I learn the hardest parts first, then I know what the destination is. It's sort of like getting in a helicopter to see the top of mount everest before you return to the base camp and start your journey up the language tree.
I start with the grammar allow myself to get overwhelmed. Then I basically give up on the deep end of the grammar and build my language plan around getting to that end game. Knowing the grammar allows me to appreciate what words I want to learn. My plan for french is learn 1000 verbs. Then learn 10,000 nouns/adjectives/adverbs. Then after all that switch back to the grammar of those verbs.
I'm also think it's hard to learn only words that interest you in your own language. If the word is never used in your internal dialogue you probably won't retain it.
When I'm vacation, "the key to my hotel room" isn't something that enters my internal monologue" it's just a background thing, I have no conscious interest in. Instead on vacation I'm usually focused on the history of the place I'm visiting in. 1,000 words regarding history is far easier for me to learn, than 100 words about mundane dull parts of life like my hotel room key.
15:20 When he said “the noun is red”, I think he meant “the [noun] is red”, meaning that you would fill in the noun with something useful. I don’t think he meant the literal word “noun”
You’re totally right. I think because he was talking about grammar before this for some reason I just assumed he meant noun as in actual noun. My bad here >.
Yeah, something like this:
La manzana es roja → The apple is red
La silla es roja → The chair is red
If "casa" means "house", how do you say "the house is red"?
La manzana está en la caja → The apple is in the box.
La caja está en la habitación → The chair is in the room.
How do you say "the room is in the house"?
I tried that once with someone I was chatting with, and at least they had fun. They probably didn't get to learn a lot in only a few minutes, but if we had kept going, who knows?
@@Evildea wasnt noun read tho 🤔
The Italian thing he mentioned was Language Lords who used a 14 minute video from the Easy Italian youtube channel as his core to begin his Italian journey as a way to learn 1000 words and how to use them. LL has also got videos on his techniques to learn French and Spanish. If Jones has been to the LL channel he knows what LL is trying to do and why, so Jones is being somewhat disingenuous.
Okay, I might have to go watch that video by language lords at some point to see for myself. But not liking the idea that Languagejones is taking stuff out of context.
@@EvildeaI’d love to see your reaction to that LL video as well!
@@katieclark5774 or his Spanish video series. That is where he did minimum 8 hours a day but often 10 and 12 hours.
@katoeclark5774 I’ll add it to the backlog :)
I thought about that Xiaoma's video in which he tries to learn Italian in 24 hrs, and the results are what you can expect from 24 hrs of learning, lol. But he learned with a book and tutors in that one, iirc.
But come on, I went and watched that LL video, and okay, he did a reasonable job for two months of learning. But he never mentions (or I missed it) that Italian is almost like the perfect mix between French and Spanish, two languages that he speaks. He probably doesn't "need" to study grammar for it (he would probably benefit from it, but he's starting off a good base). I speak Spanish, and more than 90% of Portuguese grammar would be something I already can intuit. Still, learning the parts where it's different helps a lot.
LJ is not making a critique of that video, he's only throwing a quip. And that video can be pretty misleading in my opinion. It would be a completely different thing trying to learn any language from a different family.
My first impression of this guy put me off for a long while because he had this whole video calling various polyglots frauds. I not only thought that was a poisonous thing to do, but I also thought he was just wrong.
I eventually checked out more of his library of content and have categorized him as a source of largely unactionable content with some interesting insights.
Like Oscar Wilde but more specialized.
I mean most of those "polyglots" are not really seriously polyglots.
@nuansd Setting aside the question of whether and to what extent it's a good idea for us to declare that most polyglots aren't legit (which I don't feel like I gain much from doing), I feel like polyglot fraud witch hunting can be sketchy business.
@@TalkingAmerican i believe his main point - like metatron on his channel - is that ‘polyglot frauds’ who promise you brilliant success because look they speak 8 plus languages ‘fluently’ when they actually don’t and that you can too if only you buy their course / book/ programme or whatever are essentially scammers and frauds who make genuine learners feel inadequate when they shouldn’t and take money under false pretences.
I get both sides of this. For one I don’t say someone is a fraud because I usually don’t know enough about the person to say if that’s true or not. So I just like to dismantle ideas because that usually requires very little background on the person. Also those I would consider frauds usually do speak multiple languages but over-inflate how many they speak and undersell the effort involved or totally don’t mention they’re natives in multiple! Despite this, I don’t think I’ve ever said as of yet that X person is a fraud. Instead always just debate ideas on an individual level.
I eventually realized after watching his vid he makes a really interesting title but just babble and babble nothing interesing.
LanguageJones just enjoys the sound of his own voice.
I like Language Jones, but he does have limitations. He tends to do interesting videos. I remember this one being underwhelming. The points I remember taking from this video are:
1) SRS are the best way to retain information
2) Get a good grammar to study as needed, and look at the overview of the language
3) Look for materials that treat the Target Language as its own thing, and not just a translation of your First Language
So far my favorite language textbook is Progress In Irish(1989). Each lesson Vocab, important grammar note, and example sentance:
Tá is
Ag siúl walking
...
In Irish the verb comes first
...
Tá Brian ag siúl.
Brian is walking.
The only problem is that i dont have native speaker examples of the words and sentences.
Any good text to speech systems for Irish? I’m assuming not :/
6:04 I have a funny story to share. One day, I was reading a language textbook in Portuguese, my native language. The book was supposed to teach how to say 'I'm Brazilian,' but instead, it taught how to say 'I'm American.' After that experience, I decided never to touch a language textbook again!
Haha, that reminds me of Pimsleur which was drilling me on saying I’m American or I’m from California or something in Chinese and I was thinking… I’m totally going to accidentally tell someone I’m from California one day haha
I totally agree with you about Rosetta Stone for Chinese. It seems that no one really says 食品杂货店 (shí pǐn zá huò diàn) most people just say 超市 (chāo shì). Rosetta Stone doesn't teach that distinction. Doesn't even mention chāo shì
In fact, I’d totally forgot about 食品杂货店 as never used it lol!
Can you understand the Japanese expression “dame desu ne”? I sometimes go to a local language meetup and one guy took Japanese in college and only remembers that expression which I think is hilarious. (It’s what his teacher said to him when he passed in his final exam).
Nope, only remember how to count to 10 haha but if I started learning the language again I’m guessing lots would come flooding back. Oh I can still read a lot of hiragana.
@@Evildea For anyone reading this you could translate the above Japanese phrase to “It’s no good is it.”
I watched the Duo video years ago but didn't remember who it belonged to 😂😂😂😂.
Haha I am the culprit!!
21:50 is a perfect example of making something that seems daunting and confusing seem rather easy, comprehensive and not all a foreign concept. Hes not "showing off" he created a premise and then displayed its use thus concluding the topic. If mentioning the benefits of problematic topic and then showing people (english speakers) how theyve been doing it this whole time in a short concise example about coffee and the acquisition of it is showing off then every language channel should stop because every last one of you can in some manner be seen as showing off the result's your chosen verbal toil. 😂
That was my honest reaction in the moment. It felt more showboat than educational.
Good review.
I was interested in his videos for a while until he admitted that he doesn't speak another language at a high level, only at an intermediate level. Well...I'm intermediate at my target language so why in the world am I wasting my time watching him? I'm okay with people being smug and know-it-all, but not when they've haven't walked the walk themselves.
I’m actually not aware of what languages he’s speaks. I guess that’s where him and I differ. He’s coming at this from a theoretical understanding and I’m coming at it from a practical understanding.
This guy leans on his Phd in linguistic but that does not mean he is an expert in language acquisition. He already says his ideal course includes an understanding of grammar and yet most experts in language acquisition baulk at the idea. As for memorizing lists of words, why? A guy from NZ memorized the entire French dictionary, won the national french scrabble games and yet cannot speak a word of French. People are looking for hacks and making it harder than it need be as a result. Language acquisition takes time and speaking is a result of acquisition not a tool.
I’ve heard of that New Zealand guy before. The guy is seriously committed to beating the French in their own language without giving them an inch by actually learning their language haha
It's 50/50 because his content is often politically charged and he has a unique style of humor that I love but may not appeal to everyone.
Yeah I noticed a few titles of videos that would definitely rub some people the wrong way.
Listening to a video with different speeds is kinda crazy 🥴
Haha I need to speed up the videos I review otherwise my videos would be 30+ minutes.
"The average language learner has no clue what any of that means. . ."
True, but the average language learner never gets past "Dos cervezas, por favor." For those (adult learners) who are serious about learning a language to fluency, the majority of them will need to learn grammar for the same reason that when you sit down to learn the piano, the teacher will first show you how to hold the violin and the bow properly, give you the names of the strings, teach you how to read notes off sheet music, etc.
I’m a serious language learner and I generally don’t learn grammar (apart from the bare bones) until after I’ve recognised it via patterns in the language. Grammar has its place, but what Languagejones is proposing is just a bad idea. I’ve taught language classes both with and without grammar and those without grammar always retained students for a lot longer. It’s also very dependent on the learner. Some love grammar and some hate it. One of the best foreign Chinese speakers I’ve seen online has a video where he talks about how he never learned grammar and only recognised it after the fact.
In the end the best approach is whatever approach keeps one moving forward. I still don’t understand some Esperanto grammar rules yet I can perfectly apply them all the time while others can explain the rules but can’t apply them naturally.
@@Evildea Don't get me wrong, I'm not really defending most of what this guy says here. I have seen his videos before and find his advice of mixed quality.
But with all due respect, when you say you're a serious language learner, I don't really know you except what you've said in this video, which is that you speak Esperanto fluently, and are intermediate in one other language. Esperanto (which I do not speak) is well-known for having a stripped down, greatly simplified grammar in order to facilitate its learning as an international language. So essentially, you're saying you have not yet reached fluency in a non-constructed language. In my experience, it's really easy to build in fossilized weaknesses if you ignore grammar. I spoke to a Chinese guy just yesterday parking my car outside of Chinatown in my city who spoke with fluency and ease, but said, "You bring car two hour ago? Twelve dollar." He had learned to communicate fine, but had no use of verb tenses or even plural.
If you don't study grammar at all, this is a risk. Some people are probably good at extrapolating grammar, but most of us are not, at least not as adult learners.
@@Evildea Your example of drawing arrows between the gerund of English and the equivalent in Esperanto wouldn't work in, say, Swahili. If I wrote that Usingalisoma usingalijifunza means "If you hadn't studied, you wouldn't have learned," there is no way you could extrapolate the grammar from that, no matter how many arrows I drew.
Again, I'm not taking issue with much of what you say here, or your criticisms of this guy, but almost everyone I know who has reached a B2-C2 in a foreign language as an adult has done a fair bit of conscious study of the grammar. It's not fun, but I think it's necessary for most of us.
Hey, all good. I haven’t taught Swahili speakers so obviously a different approach would need to be tailored to them.
It’s like learning Chinese doesn’t even really have a tense system anything like English so his grammar approach wouldn’t work well either.
That’s a big part of the video. One must develop methods based on both a source and target language.
I’m not fluent in a non constructed language but give me a few years and I’ll reach fluency in Chinese haha (currently like an upper intermediate). Pretty sure my advice would be the same.
I have however taught thousands of hours of English using every method possible so I’ve seen what works and doesn’t work.
Probably best is just to ask the student what they want to focus on. A grammar approach or some other method. If they don’t know, go through a testing phase of applying different methods until they find something they like.
@@Evildea Chinese is a huge accomplishment, and I'm sure even where you are now represents tons of dedication and consistency.
Simple grammar
Cheat sheets (Verb tenses) Michel Thomas method
That's about it.
Cheats
There are little cheats for grammar and language learning.
Michel Thomas grammar for Arabic, Spanish and French are the best.
I also use
Mnemonics for alphabets (I mine the best mnemonics. Not really necessary but I like to find the best ones.)
Pronoun tables (it helps me with German, French and various other languages)
Cases tables
A simple grammar cheat sheet is definitely a good idea. I’ve never really used one but after a while if I notice patterns I like to go back and check my understanding of the pattern against a grammar guide. It basically just confirms what I’ve already learned by this point.
You should review Stuart Jay Raj. He is simply excellent 👍. language, culture, prosody. He is by far the best on RUclips.
I’ll add him to the list!
I unsubbed from him a few months back and now he has returned!! aahhhh!!!!!
Never fear! I usually review a RUclipsr only once :D
The guy who has memorized an entire dialogue in italian to learn it is from someone you've reviewed before. This one: ruclips.net/video/Ry3XmUZ3d4s/видео.html&ab_channel=LanguageLords
Great! I’ll save this one and do a react to it. No idea if I’ll post it but might be good.
languagejones used to be a cartoon character featured on South Park episode Smug Alert! which mostly revolves around people of San Francisco farting and smelling their own farts. His explosive flatulence eventually tore the fabric of 2D cartoon world and allowed him to cross over to our reality, where he found a place as a youtube linguist sharing the excessive amounts of the expelled gases that he wasn't able breath back in and recycle, with the rest of us
This story was so random that I actually google language jones South Park lol
its just popular science. its entertainment. they have better understanding of the neighbouring fields then the general public, but way less understanding then average enthusiast of a field. pedagogy isnt linguistic.
most of his stuff is useless for language learners because its completely different field and his experience in learning is irrelevant (just like mathematician can easily understand physics equations, even with 0 clue of what parameters actually means). so why do bother watch his language learning videos? other ones are interesting tho.
At this poit I have to say, he gives not an ounce of value except for the level of english he speaks. In my opinion he never gives a practical tip or suggestion... I learnt much more from ari no yume, especially a way of organising the resources and how to be more consistent. Stuff that really helps.😂
BTW, I loathe anki. 😂😂😂 But I use other spaced rep methods.
Never heard of Ari, got any videos you recommend for me to check out and possibly review?
@@Evildea ruclips.net/video/UJN25tipc_g/видео.htmlsi=vvfw_KNcbj6c1swa
But it's not one of the typical videos that you usually review. But she has quite a lot of recap on resources and stuff. Will send you a better link tomorrow.
Thanks!
7:48 I was going to! :P
I knew it haha!