Romance is Ruining Love: Devaluing Platonic Love in Media

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  • Опубликовано: 18 ноя 2024

Комментарии • 66

  • @kait.5437
    @kait.5437 Год назад +37

    It’s actually crazy how it’s seen as normal that people are supposed to largely leave behind their friendships and familial relationships when they get married. It’s weird to me that you are supposed to completely value someone new in your life over people you’ve probably known for years if not your whole life. Idk.

  • @Aaron-mj9ie
    @Aaron-mj9ie Год назад +121

    People will adamantly argue with you and say that men and women can't be friends, as if that were even remotely true. It's frickin weird. Like, y'all ain't EVER been forced to sit next to someone in a class or at work that's the opposite gender AND you thought was fun to be around?

    • @SoggyChips1
      @SoggyChips1 Год назад

      **ITs remotely true**
      That is lie
      Its not even remotely true , they can be friends I have experienced it myself

    • @Aaron-mj9ie
      @Aaron-mj9ie Год назад +6

      @@SoggyChips1 that's what I'm saying. Men and women can just be bros. It's fine.

  • @girlsaysstuff
    @girlsaysstuff Год назад +23

    I saw a tumblr post that said that LOTR didn't feel cold or sterile even though there was no sex, and it was because of the tenderness of the friendship, and. You know. Yeah.

  • @mbumtaia8822
    @mbumtaia8822 Год назад +32

    Two videos in a month girl you’ve changed
    Also bringing up those lotr references and talking about friendships brought tears to my eye

  • @dakotarawlins297
    @dakotarawlins297 Год назад +42

    I absolutely agree 100%, though I do think it's important to add the nuance of a lack of real feeling/genuine queer relationships in mainstream media that leads to so many people shipping friendships (like Frodo and Sam) that are already beautiful when platonic, same with the Wednesday show- it's still frustrating, but it's a little more complicated in those examples imo

  • @joyjenkins9052
    @joyjenkins9052 Год назад +34

    I seriously appreciate this video. I totally agreed with your point when you made it in the Wednesday video and when you briefly mentioned it in your euphoria video. In K-dramas, there are so many more visible platonic relationships that actually matter and affect the plot and it’s so refreshing to watch. Twenty-five Twenty-one is a show mostly about platonic relationships prioritized over romantic ones. In Crash Landing on You, the protagonist’s platonic relationship with the four main side characters is way more endearing and captivating than the main love story ever is.
    For me, as someone who’s only ever had one serious romantic relationship and never plans on dating ever again, my platonic relationships with my best friends are everything to me. They matter more than anyone else and I feel no lack from having zero romantic relationships in my life.

  • @Anna1047-m1g
    @Anna1047-m1g Год назад +82

    Im aromantic and this makes me happy! I think this issue is more prominent amongst straight people with the cult of heteronormativity. But even in queer spaces it can be so toxic! Like if I say i prefer two same-sex characters as best friends, people could get upset. I think whenever a close bond is shared between two characters, everyone's tendency is to label it as romantic, and sometimes it makes me feel really left out and hopeless as someone who will never experience that form of love. Closeness and romance are not mutually exclusive

  • @kayleighdriessen
    @kayleighdriessen 9 месяцев назад +4

    I'm late to reply but seriously many people in this human-society like to portray friendship in media with barely to no intimacy to contrast it with excessive amounts of intimacy in romantic relationships in media as if too afraid to end up blurring the lines and admit that love has never been rooted in overly big gestures or sharing literally everything about yourself with another person leaving nothing to the imagination. I've at some point realized how platonic love is so beautiful like seen in Samwise and Frodo's friendship due to it never being rooted in the most superficial aspects of sex like in romance and it's simpy about two people who regardless of gender and despite the fact they're never gonna procreate together are as close as they can be, like I'd want that regardless of how me and my platonic loved one might be looked at as a married couple cause I don't need some pair of rings to prove my fond devotion to someone so beautiful inside and out. I strongly believe that the devaluing of platonic love is partially why this modern society especially in it's age of Social Media has been failing but once platonic love is no longer devalued and romantic love is no longer so overvalued then this and any world would be a far better place.

  • @pineberry212
    @pineberry212 Год назад +6

    I spent all day yesterday getting the 8 dozen cookies I made to the people who I platonically love, and spending about 30 minutes with each and just chatting for a little bit if they were available. For my unmarried friend, I was the only person who reached out to him.
    Decided that my time was better spent showing those I care about that "I (platonically) love you", then wallowing in pity as a single father.

  • @borkbork4124
    @borkbork4124 Год назад +10

    I am in therapy and it has been strengthening the love I have with my sister. We have childhood trauma and it was just the two of us and now as adults our love has been growing and it is good to know that I have family that loves me and that I can lean on, bc I can’t with my parents. Not to say Disney is the best in this convo lol, but my sister and I love Frozen because it is about the sisters’ love for each other.

  • @summerreadingnook
    @summerreadingnook Год назад +5

    That’s really great that you mentioned Lord of the Rings because I’m pretty sure Tolkien himself had some things to say on this topic, especially love between men, I’m too lazy to look it up right now, lol

  • @trinaq
    @trinaq Год назад +13

    Another apt video, Olivia. I wish that there could be more depictions of platonic friendships as the focus point of a plot, as opposed to romantic love. One of my favourite Young Adult novels is called "Radio Silence" by Alice Oseman, about the friendship between a Bisexual girl and a Demisexual boy who start a podcast together.

    • @historyshaker7412
      @historyshaker7412 Год назад +5

      I think I Am Not Okay With This centers the solidarity of the friendship despite there being romance and love interests. I love that

  • @historyshaker7412
    @historyshaker7412 Год назад +6

    Thx for posting this on Valentine's
    As an aromantic asexual person I highly appreciate it.
    Romantic relationships are not inherently more valuable and important than platonic ones!!!
    I think, in part, shipping of women comes from decades of lesbians relationships being invalidated and dismissed as friendships; and shipping of men from how much society restricts and 'doesn't allow' men to show affection publicly and proudly unless they are in a (cisgender and heterosexual) romantic or sexual relationship.
    If anyone is interested, I'd reccomened looking into amatonormativity (the prioritization and over-value placed on coupling, romance, and just not being single) and queerplatonicism (prioritizing friendship beyond conventional bounds and treating it as important as society treats romantic relationships, if not more)
    i want a world where friendship is appreciated as a form of romance. i want a world where when people ask if we are seeing anyone we can list the names of all of our best friends and no one will bat an eyelid. i want monuments and holidays and certificates and ceremonies to commemorate friendship. i want a world that doesn't require us to be in a sexual/romantic partnership to be seen as mature (let alone complete). i want a movement that fights for all forms of relationships, not just the sexual ones. i want thousands of songs and movies and poems about the intimacy between friends. i want a world where our worth isn't linked to our desireability, our security to our monogamy, our family to our biology.
    ~ friendship is romance by Alok Vaid-Menon ~

  • @crystalflash27
    @crystalflash27 Год назад +44

    This is something I've been frustrated by recently...how every character has to be "shipped" with another. That's actually so incredibly shallow to think that the only deep relationship someone can have has to be sex based.

  • @mayawaalkes3591
    @mayawaalkes3591 Год назад +7

    Very articulate and well-said. :) I never liked the expression "More than friends" for many of the same reasons as you! The saying just feels like a verbalization of the idea that romance is "more" than platonic love. Tbh i think that MANY of the deepest, most permanent relationships we have are platonic, and invalidating those (very real!!) connections can be disheartening. We should love and cherish the strong relationships we have

  • @AngelineProductions
    @AngelineProductions Год назад +3

    Nicely said. I had a conversation with one of my best friends last week about this, and we both agreed that friendship itself is sort of "romantic." We definitely have our priorities skewed in Western culture when it comes to showing affection in non-sexual ways.

  • @pear.820
    @pear.820 Год назад +4

    I think its really important and great for queer (especially wlw) love to be represented more in media, as a lot of people's minds turn to "best friends" when they see women kissing or being intimate with each other, and it isnt taken as seriously. The term "girlfriends" is often used to describe best friends, and it can be very annoying when people "decide" that your wlw relationship is actually just platonic because a lot of the instances of intimacy you see between women are just friends.
    Although, i do agree with your point. Friends are extremely important, especially many people of different personalities. You can talk with different topics that you wouldnt with others, they can support you in ways others cant, and vice versa. People should be able to exist without ships, they're just plain annoying in my opinion.

  • @Βασιλική-ΝικολέτταΣακελλάρη

    Loved the video. I have been with my husband since I was 16 BUT my best friends and my mom are my valentine's also!!! You cannot really love just one person. Love is romance AND friendship and family!!!
    💗 Keep on analysing these subjects 👍

  • @LunaWitcherArt
    @LunaWitcherArt Год назад +5

    Girlie you're back 😭😭😭
    I've missed your videos talking about media, but I'm here now and the notifications ARE ON 💅

  • @oywiththepoodlesalready
    @oywiththepoodlesalready Год назад +2

    “..which leads to how devaluing that platonic familial love leads to the ruin of romance.” Girl just dropped the mic like 5 times right there

  • @Dani_77709
    @Dani_77709 Год назад +2

    CATHARSIS! THANK YOU!

  • @FallenDaffodil
    @FallenDaffodil Год назад +5

    Oh god, I hATEEED that post about not helping your friends move. Some of my happiest memories with my friends are of us doing menial manual labour, cracking jokes or just...enjoying each others presence.
    Friendship is such a beautiful thing , and the fact we're kind of losing touch with that side of relationships is just so saddening.

  • @librarycard69
    @librarycard69 Год назад +1

    Thank you for bringing light to this! (And in such an eloquent, succinct, enjoyable way. I love your videos) 💗

  • @roxanaa1303
    @roxanaa1303 Год назад +5

    i agree for the most part. however, queer relationships that are complex and well written are still very scarce. so this comparison with straight relationships is misplaced

  • @bwcat5586
    @bwcat5586 Год назад +1

    Everything you said in this video is true. I'm glad you came out and said it. Well done.

  • @flannelplant
    @flannelplant Год назад +1

    i've been having a rough few months and your uploads are really getting me through it girl, love ya

  • @nocturnus009
    @nocturnus009 Год назад +1

    Just Started Melville’s Moby Dick, So much of what you are illuminating in Ishmael & Queequeg. You can also check Maverick & Goose, I smell production tampering in the writers room when Top Gun (1986) was in development to evade that Quentin Tarantino party rant. We are collectively deficient to not have space to have what you are talking about in our art.

  • @wrld-sq5pe
    @wrld-sq5pe Год назад +2

    I've been waiting for this ever since you mentioned last video that you'd talk about it 🙏 🙏 🙏

    • @wrld-sq5pe
      @wrld-sq5pe Год назад +1

      And yesss the anti porn section. So glad you mentioned it

  • @mallratserf
    @mallratserf Год назад +3

    i i love watching you come online after like 3 months or so and dropping a banger and going off the grid again (yes i know u stream on twitch but i choose to ignore that cuz i dislike twitch)

  • @Lummmlee
    @Lummmlee Год назад +2

    I forgot this channel existed! Haven’t listened to the video yet but as a gay I do enjoy some gay shipping. It never happens anyway.

    • @Lummmlee
      @Lummmlee Год назад

      The first example was Wednesday and however you spell her blonde roommates name. It turned straight quickly

    • @Lummmlee
      @Lummmlee Год назад +1

      Wait this is about how romantic book tension or somethings tv tension ruins friendships? I have ace friends. I don’t think my friends want to fuck me

  • @beabunny.
    @beabunny. Год назад +5

    I value friendships so much and one of my closest friends is actually a guy and I’m a girl and I know he is sexually attracted to girls and we’ve beeen friends for so long that I’ve witnessed him dating so many of my other friends and both of our relationships with those people have faded but ours is still strong, maybe stronger than ever now. But I love him so much and I’m terrified if he ever tells me he likes me romantically. It certainly wouldn’t ruin the friendship for me but I love him so much like a brother and I’d be scared of losing him if he ever felt that way, cause I never will. Maybe that’s just the narcissist in me :/

    • @OliviaKathryn
      @OliviaKathryn  Год назад +7

      you don’t sound like a narcissist to me! my best friend is a guy and i love him to death. nothing wrong with just wanting a friend

  • @JadedAlice
    @JadedAlice Год назад +3

    THANK YOU

  • @NemFX
    @NemFX Год назад +1

    Video 95 btw, you're coming up on 100 :3

  • @markatag2680
    @markatag2680 Год назад

    Bellamy and Clarke from the 100 springs to mind

  • @erdemmemisyazici3950
    @erdemmemisyazici3950 Год назад +2

    Humans are deeply social creatures?

  • @kait.5437
    @kait.5437 Год назад +1

    As I’ve grown up I think I’ve gotten the urge to ship friend characters out of my system, but I do think that part of that especially when I was younger was my desire to see queer relationships in media. So, I give people a bit of a pass for shipping Wednesday and Enid or Frodo and Sam. Like I don’t really ship them but I get why someone might.

  • @UmDevoto
    @UmDevoto Год назад +1

    Media doesnt deserve this vid

  • @jonnasavolainen2860
    @jonnasavolainen2860 Год назад +1

    Agree completely!

  • @SoVidushi
    @SoVidushi Год назад +1

    Missed you

  • @charlesmartinjr3971
    @charlesmartinjr3971 Год назад

    Relationships - of all kinds - are dying. This should be fought tooth and nail.

  • @chenierderrick
    @chenierderrick Год назад

    Good video. I agree 100%!

  • @daviderde
    @daviderde Год назад +2

    Super love the first half of the video - disagree on the second half. I guess because fundamentally I don't think there is anything unhealthy about masturbation. And people use a variety of things for that experience - porn being a VERY wide channel of things (anywhere from a written story, drawings, photos, to a video or audio file). The kind of porn you're talking about is certainly very popular but brings up more conversations regarding patriarchy, as well as systemic racism and sexism. And elements as you said like sex work and sex trafficking - well thats a huge huge topic I am NOT a scholar on but I've learnt enough to understand most ppls perception of how it works is really not the standard concept of young woman grabbed off the sidewalk. Just like most sexual assaults are not from a stranger its from someone you know.
    So to me in a hope to work against stopping violence against sex workers, and violence against women, and advocating for a world where people do not feel the need to sell their bodies to any corporations for any variety of work - blaming this strictly on porno videos is kind of like blaming video games on shootings.
    It's more a value to focus on young people to help them understand ideas like consent and safe sex, while also totally criticizing the ways mostly mainstream pornography can be incredibly problematic and trying to make impact there for ethically produced content and boycotting unethical production (which is incredibly difficult in the world when almost everything is unethically produced)
    I think its important to stay sex positive and your angle is coming from the right direction with what feels like a few rough conclusions for me to be on board with. Hope you can hear me out there - love ya jams!

    • @OliviaKathryn
      @OliviaKathryn  Год назад +3

      humans masturbated for thousands of years before porn existed. i never said anyone had to stop doing that.
      “ethical porn” doesn’t not exist. even only fans creators are still catering to misogynistic culture by giving the (mostly) men who pay for it exactly what they want. it’s not empowering, it’s treating a human body like a commodity to be bought and used.
      even what many consider “ethical” porn still affects the brain the same way “regular” porn does.
      i don’t have the time (or energy, frankly) to type a thesis here in the comments. please, do research on the effects of porn on the brain. Fight the New Drug (FTND) has many resources and studies on how porn affects the brain, human relationships, and sex trafficking. There are other studies, too, it’s just handy to have a website where they’re all in one place.
      Like i said in my video, it’s not based on the “morality” (outside of trafficking), but based on the science of neural pathways in the brain.
      i don’t say any of this as an attack to you. it comes from a deep compassion for women (and men, but women are disproportionately affected) all around the world affected by the poison of porn in the human psyche.

    • @daviderde
      @daviderde Год назад +1

      @@OliviaKathryn yeah I'll look into some more stuff on the topic - but with research reports its important to see where the funding is coming from. I'm not here to specifically cite or refute information except to state many people will cite reports funded by institutions for biased unethical results.
      I'm not feeling attacked at all btw! I just wanted to voice my opinion, you dont need to reply or whatever just yknow - open comment box so had to say what i wanted there. Studies regarding how the internet and tiktaks and all this shit effecting the mind is certainly very worth digging into and i think these elements are way more broadly effecting to people than simply just porn.
      And if you believe people who wish to masturbate have a right to do that in a healthy way it'd be good for you to at least have a clear stance on how you expect people to engage with media that could be potentially harmful. I'm advocating for media literacy here amongst a bunch of other things of course, all I'm hearing on your end is "do not consume any porn at all it is all bad" instead of sex education and reform practices. I also feel like I'm getting the sense you may have a shallow understanding of the world of porn out there - which is fine but I'm thinking you're a bit misinformed about consumption statistics and also the variety of industries.
      Your points from what I see are not invalid (tho the neurology stuff we could uh...table for now as its tricky to make hard conclusions there) and I support your issues I'm just saying your conclusions may be a bit undeveloped and to a degree showing a lack of understanding.

  • @annamanaccia5838
    @annamanaccia5838 Год назад +1

    OMG I AGREE SO MUCH

  • @Saint_nobody
    @Saint_nobody Год назад

    I was just wondering about you the other day, hope all is well with you and yours...

  • @dianeaishamonday9125
    @dianeaishamonday9125 Год назад +1

    🌹🌹🌹🌹🌹

  • @NemFX
    @NemFX Год назад +1

    You are gorgeous

  • @NosManJr
    @NosManJr Год назад

    I'm Confusion Cuz I thought love was just for kissing people...?

  • @AlwonDomz
    @AlwonDomz 10 месяцев назад

    The thing with platonic relationships, is they’re overly abundant and not gender specific. For heterosexuals, a romantic relationship can’t be replaced by platonic relationships and is gender specific.

    • @vaniavivanco
      @vaniavivanco 2 месяца назад

      I wouldn't say heterosexuals, it depends on the person! But yeah, i guess the majority of people have this idea in mind that platonic love can't be as valuable and important as romantic love.

    • @AlwonDomz
      @AlwonDomz Месяц назад

      @@vaniavivanco Heterosexuals like myself value marriage, family and legacy. Platonic relationships are great but they can never replace the value of a marriage, family and legacy because it can’t provide things like that.

  • @Lenny-ue8hk
    @Lenny-ue8hk Год назад

    Bold of you to assume I don't have sex with my friends

  • @shrill_2165
    @shrill_2165 Год назад +4

    THANK YOU

    • @shrill_2165
      @shrill_2165 Год назад

      aw man someone else already commented the exact same thing