This topic is very real. I’m not sure why you are needing to address it in away that it may not be. I’m a victim myself and it’s very upsetting how you are addressing SRA. The Pace memo I have read many times and it addressed the topic very well. It is a great description of a small portion of how much we suffered and the abuse that was done.
If it was very real there would have been an excess of solid evidence in multiple cases. In relation to the daycare cases - you could not have the horrific abuse, torture and murder of humans and multiple animals and claims of widespread production of CSAM without a shed of evidence being found by the SBI, FBI, Interpol… In relation to RM therapies countless women that went through the therapy discussed the false memories they were left with and the damage it did to them and all their loved ones. The techniques being used were known to be fringe, highly problematic and blatant examples of malpractice in several cases.
Food for thought… For the last 40+ years actual child predators have listened to, read and thoroughly enjoyed discussions - forums where people gather to share tales of SRA. Why wouldn’t they? It’s the perfect fantasy for a predator. A child is allegedly horrifically tortured, abused, killed and then resurrected with their memories wiped clean and their wounds healed just so the abusers can start the whole process over again - just like the first time. There is something deeply wrong with the whole picture.
The only person repressed memories would benefit is the predator. It’s not in line with research on memory. There are situations where people won’t remember or understand everything due to their age, incapacitation, etc.. There are situations where people have memories but they were so young that they couldn’t understand them until they got a bit older and had more life experience. This is not a repressed memory. We know that people that experienced the Holocaust have memories of years of terror. We know that attempted murder victims remember their attacks. We know that people trapped in mass shootings have lucid and vivid memories. All involve horrific trauma. It’s only in cases involving sex that primarily women are said to spiral in an alternate reality and not remember abuse that lasted for several years during sentient ages. Nothing in the science of memory says this is likely. The science of memory does note that it is mailable and false memories can be created.
The last thing I’ll say… False memories can seem very real to people struggling with their mental health. People do not end up in a therapists offices and RM therapy because everything is going great. They are struggling. I sympathize. I don’t want to see more people in this situation. I know that some people who have actually experienced various forms of abuse can be more susceptible. At the same time you will find journal entry after journal entry from people in RM therapies saying they know it isn’t real. This didn’t happen. This isn’t real. This can’t be real but everyone is telling me it is. Many know to some extent but they have been completely isolated from friends and family and only surrounded by believers. It’s grotesque. You will also find many grifters and frauds making up claims to sell books or get tv appearances. It’s an incredibly fraught topic but I don’t think anyone can afford to tiptoe or avoid ruffling feathers. It causes too much destruction in the lives of patients and everyone around them.
Very interesting podcast. I'm not Mormon, but I do have my own experience. Therapists can be so dangerous. I trust very few of them. First of all, I was physically, mentally & emotionally abused by my father, however, he NEVER molested me in any way. In the 80's I went into therapy and the therapist constantly tried to convince me that I'd suffered ritual sexual abuse. She was positive I was and I was positive I wasn't. I finally had to quit because she was so adamant that I'd been sexually abused. In the 90's my sister ALSO went to a therapist who did a past life regression with her. Now my sister claims that in her regression she discovered that I'd murdered her several times in past lives. Now that my parents are very elderly, she's actually convinced them that I'm a murderer and about a month ago, I was kicked out of the family, not allowed to contact anyone, and disinherited. They actually told me in a letter that they can't prove that I'm a murderer, however, they believe my sister because she's so convinced. So now I'm without a family.
@@realolivertwisted Thank you. I appreciate it. I grew up learning how to be tough. Not that I'm disinherited and have no more family, I'm "adopting" my own. "Enfin Libre" is french for "finally free".
Fascinating topic. He is obviously very learned. His sarcasm and somewhat dismissive tone is a bit distracting to me. Sunlight definitely needs to be shone on this topic.
WHY ARE YOU USING THE WORD RUMOUR IN YOUR TITLE???? This is real and people go through this and it is TREMENDOUSLY disrespectful to call it a rumour for crying out loud. I used to have so much respect for you. No longer.
My sister who has been suffering from some mental health issues for most of her life saw a therapist in Utah a few years ago and is now very sure she and our older brother had been a victim of this ritual satanic stuff when she was a very little girl around 1970 in Orem. The abusers would be their babysitters. My brother had already passed away in an accident, so we are unable to get a statement from him. She's convinced her mental health issues were caused by this abuse, but it's also possible that she has these mental health issues that a therapist was able to exploit to convince her of these memories.
Almost as an aside, there are still grandmother's in some rural cultures that threaten disobedient children with the specter of being carried off by these ancient bogeymen.
Glenn L Pace and his Companion, Elder Maybe, taught and Baptized. My Wife ,before I knew her, that was a Junior in High School in Elosworth, Maine around 1961 while I was serving in The California Mission.
"There's no way this many people could claim it and it not be true!" "Here's a way." - Science "Huh? No, lol there's no way haha." What a great argument!
Will Durant indicates in his book set that in Egypt, when the Nile inundated, that the priests would tale two virgins and throw them in to the waters as a sacrifice to their pantheon of gods so that the crops would grow and the Nile would continue to flow. Better that two virgins perish than an entire people be starved from lack of food. Many cult...ures were dedicated to the zodiacal "Season of Sacrifice" which runs from the Spring Equinox from March 19/20 to the Summer Solstice June 20/21. At the center is the Sabbath Midpoint or Walpurgisnacht. We know that Biblically people in Jerusalem took their children to sacrifice to the god Molech. Why? One occult construct I read of indicated that the theology was that the god Molech would come down on the wedding night of a couple and have sex with the wife. Since the god's generative sperm created the firstborn, that child had to be sacrificed in order to replace the energy back to the god. Who do people attach themselves to toxic world views like these? So many reasons and such a long discussion. Alister Crowley was a famous Dark Occultist. But, he was not the leader of the Church of Satan. That was Anton LaVey out of San Francisco. If you want to contact a person who will widen your understanding of this topic contact Mark Passio at WhatOnEarthIsHappening.com. He was part of the Church of Satan church for ten years but has come out and has a great deal of information. He is outspoken for sure. but, his information is amazing. Love Dr. Frankfurter's conversation.
There’s a RUclips video showing 2 young kids being interviewed about this kind of stuff. I wouldn’t think these kids could make up the stories they told. But I don’t know about Mormon leaders having sex slaves in the tunnels. If that’s true, that’s crazy stuff! I’d like to know more and see the evidence!
This topic is very real. I’m not sure why you are needing to address it in away that it may not be. I’m a victim myself and it’s very upsetting how you are addressing SRA. The Pace memo I have read many times and it addressed the topic very well. It is a great description of a small portion of how much we suffered and the abuse that was done.
I believe you, I hear you, and I stand with you. ✊🏽🗣📣
If it was very real there would have been an excess of solid evidence in multiple cases.
In relation to the daycare cases - you could not have the horrific abuse, torture and murder of humans and multiple animals and claims of widespread production of CSAM without a shed of evidence being found by the SBI, FBI, Interpol…
In relation to RM therapies countless women that went through the therapy discussed the false memories they were left with and the damage it did to them and all their loved ones.
The techniques being used were known to be fringe, highly problematic and blatant examples of malpractice in several cases.
Food for thought…
For the last 40+ years actual child predators have listened to, read and thoroughly enjoyed discussions - forums where people gather to share tales of SRA.
Why wouldn’t they?
It’s the perfect fantasy for a predator.
A child is allegedly horrifically tortured, abused, killed and then resurrected with their memories wiped clean and their wounds healed just so the abusers can start the whole process over again - just like the first time.
There is something deeply wrong with the whole picture.
The only person repressed memories would benefit is the predator.
It’s not in line with research on memory.
There are situations where people won’t remember or understand everything due to their age, incapacitation, etc..
There are situations where people have memories but they were so young that they couldn’t understand them until they got a bit older and had more life experience.
This is not a repressed memory.
We know that people that experienced the Holocaust have memories of years of terror.
We know that attempted murder victims remember their attacks.
We know that people trapped in mass shootings have lucid and vivid memories.
All involve horrific trauma.
It’s only in cases involving sex that primarily women are said to spiral in an alternate reality and not remember abuse that lasted for several years during sentient ages.
Nothing in the science of memory says this is likely.
The science of memory does note that it is mailable and false memories can be created.
The last thing I’ll say…
False memories can seem very real to people struggling with their mental health.
People do not end up in a therapists offices and RM therapy because everything is going great. They are struggling.
I sympathize. I don’t want to see more people in this situation.
I know that some people who have actually experienced various forms of abuse can be more susceptible.
At the same time you will find journal entry after journal entry from people in RM therapies saying they know it isn’t real. This didn’t happen. This isn’t real. This can’t be real but everyone is telling me it is.
Many know to some extent but they have been completely isolated from friends and family and only surrounded by believers.
It’s grotesque.
You will also find many grifters and frauds making up claims to sell books or get tv appearances.
It’s an incredibly fraught topic but I don’t think anyone can afford to tiptoe or avoid ruffling feathers.
It causes too much destruction in the lives of patients and everyone around them.
I believe it happend throughout history and still does no matter the religion. Good show. Very interesting.
Yeah! I think your right!!
@@lamaramariewilson6746 Definitely. Check out the Australian Royal Commission and the JWs.
@@debravictoria7452 I will 👌
A whole trilogy to attempt to debunk sra in Utah. How about bringing on a victim to balance the scales? Way to stay balanced and unbiased
Very interesting podcast. I'm not Mormon, but I do have my own experience. Therapists can be so dangerous. I trust very few of them. First of all, I was physically, mentally & emotionally abused by my father, however, he NEVER molested me in any way. In the 80's I went into therapy and the therapist constantly tried to convince me that I'd suffered ritual sexual abuse. She was positive I was and I was positive I wasn't. I finally had to quit because she was so adamant that I'd been sexually abused.
In the 90's my sister ALSO went to a therapist who did a past life regression with her. Now my sister claims that in her regression she discovered that I'd murdered her several times in past lives. Now that my parents are very elderly, she's actually convinced them that I'm a murderer and about a month ago, I was kicked out of the family, not allowed to contact anyone, and disinherited. They actually told me in a letter that they can't prove that I'm a murderer, however, they believe my sister because she's so convinced. So now I'm without a family.
Enfin Libre NM - what a horrible story! 😥 I'm so sorry. 😪 Wish I had something helpful or useful to say. ☹️
Enfin Libre NM - these therapists ruining people's lives need to get the crap sued out of them and lose their licenses.
@@realolivertwisted Thank you. I appreciate it. I grew up learning how to be tough. Not that I'm disinherited and have no more family, I'm "adopting" my own. "Enfin Libre" is french for "finally free".
@@EnfinLibreNM cool name
@@Paralelalamb Thank you. So obviously you're aware of the meaning. ;-)
How about victims story?????
Fascinating topic. He is obviously very learned. His sarcasm and somewhat dismissive tone is a bit distracting to me. Sunlight definitely needs to be shone on this topic.
WHY ARE YOU USING THE WORD RUMOUR IN YOUR TITLE???? This is real and people go through this and it is TREMENDOUSLY disrespectful to call it a rumour for crying out loud. I used to have so much respect for you. No longer.
My sister who has been suffering from some mental health issues for most of her life saw a therapist in Utah a few years ago and is now very sure she and our older brother had been a victim of this ritual satanic stuff when she was a very little girl around 1970 in Orem. The abusers would be their babysitters. My brother had already passed away in an accident, so we are unable to get a statement from him. She's convinced her mental health issues were caused by this abuse, but it's also possible that she has these mental health issues that a therapist was able to exploit to convince her of these memories.
Just curious. What is the figurine prominently displayed on top of his bookcase ( above and to the side of his head?)
Can’t tell! 😂🧐
Dr. Frank-N-Furter was great in the Rocky Horror Picture Show! Who knew that Tim Curry was a member of the MORmON cult?
Call It brainwashing, undue influence or indoctrination or thought reform or whatever. It is part of human lanscape and culture.
Almost as an aside, there are still grandmother's in some rural cultures that threaten disobedient children with the specter of being carried off by these ancient bogeymen.
45:29 to 48:18 is so meta. It's adorable that they can't see it 😍
00:10 Recorded July 31st, 2020? Those time traveling tapirs are at it again!
Terron Ayala he did say 2019 😂
Chef Heber Rivera he did, huh 😅
Wow! This guy was doing in-depth real meaning pod-casts very early on. Close to a pod-cast employee.
Glenn L Pace and his Companion, Elder Maybe, taught and Baptized. My Wife ,before I knew her, that was a Junior in High School in Elosworth, Maine around 1961 while I was serving in The California Mission.
I remember reading Jay’s Journal. I was at BYU in the late seventies early eighties too
This Frankfurter guy has more letters behind his name than I have in my alphabet.
Gatekeeping! Anyone who does serious investigation knows it goes on.
Link to the Pace memo?
Easy to find online. I know its posted on SCRIBD.
The guest is smug, condescending and dismissive. Apparently he is omniscient, as he glibly threw a blanket dismissal over SRA as pure fantasy. Gross.
I agree, I am disappointed the JD videoed his introduction as if he is going to be unbiased .. but the biased provails.
"There's no way this many people could claim it and it not be true!"
"Here's a way." - Science
"Huh? No, lol there's no way haha."
What a great argument!
Will Durant indicates in his book set that in Egypt, when the Nile inundated, that the priests would tale two virgins and throw them in to the waters as a sacrifice to their pantheon of gods so that the crops would grow and the Nile would continue to flow. Better that two virgins perish than an entire people be starved from lack of food. Many cult...ures were dedicated to the zodiacal "Season of Sacrifice" which runs from the Spring Equinox from March 19/20 to the Summer Solstice June 20/21. At the center is the Sabbath Midpoint or Walpurgisnacht. We know that Biblically people in Jerusalem took their children to sacrifice to the god Molech. Why? One occult construct I read of indicated that the theology was that the god Molech would come down on the wedding night of a couple and have sex with the wife. Since the god's generative sperm created the firstborn, that child had to be sacrificed in order to replace the energy back to the god. Who do people attach themselves to toxic world views like these? So many reasons and such a long discussion. Alister Crowley was a famous Dark Occultist. But, he was not the leader of the Church of Satan. That was Anton LaVey out of San Francisco. If you want to contact a person who will widen your understanding of this topic contact Mark Passio at WhatOnEarthIsHappening.com. He was part of the Church of Satan church for ten years but has come out and has a great deal of information. He is outspoken for sure. but, his information is amazing. Love Dr. Frankfurter's conversation.
There’s a RUclips video showing 2 young kids being interviewed about this kind of stuff. I wouldn’t think these kids could make up the stories they told. But I don’t know about Mormon leaders having sex slaves in the tunnels. If that’s true, that’s crazy stuff! I’d like to know more and see the evidence!
listen to " Child Trafficking in the 80's George Tonks Perspective " by. Carmen Smith Studer
Tell this to Richard Kerr
British songwriter?
Most Witches don’t do rituals in the woods .. just sayin. This guy is ignorance parading as knowledge. Incredibly biased.
Rev 13