Had a friend excited to show me his 5.1.2 all IN CEILING system. Didn’t have the heart to tell them what they were missing. Brand new construction via builder suggested setup 🤢🤦♂️
For a long time waited looking for a good speaker package option before upgrading from 5.1. Eventually my system's video overtook and I decided to grab some cheap speakers just for testing. A year later I'm still enjoying atmos on miss matched speakers. I will upgrade eventually but I'm enjoying just being able to listen at home at the full spec of the source
I threw together my movie room on a budget in 2016 and in 2020 I redid the room and corrected many things. Changed the room to movie theater red with black ceiling and black front wall. Built sound acoustic panels and placed them accordingly and then stopped using the Audyssey eq correction and downloaded the app to manage it. It is a while different world down there now. Before the redo I had white ceilings brown walls, coffee tables, end tables and the room was off center with no sound absorbing panels. So much echoing in that room and it was just loud. Now I have to turn things down because they are so clear and come at you correctly. Still a work in progress as I finish up the front wall panels and install red velvet curtains. Great videos on here.
My brother had my parents center channel in the back of the listening area in the basement. It was strange when the dialogue was coming from behind me. I had to redo everything and place the LCR in front. I told him and my parents not to touch anything, ever, and let me know if something is out of whack.
Speaker level and distance have been the most important. I've gone back and fourth with the auto eq, always end up turning it off and manually setting levels with a sound level meter. Awesome video.
After watching this I decided to rerun calibration setup. My display is a projector so always have had the fan noise during calibration. I powered it off and just used the iPad as display. Checked and verified speaker distance was correct along with levels. I found Sub 1's level too low. Corrected it and reran setup. I am amazed at the difference in Bass response. I had assumed Audyssey had set levels correctly in the past. I won't make that mistake again. I'm happy with the improvement and thankful for the video.
Great summary! I think you covered most of the mistakes in principle. Probably the worst is the in-ceiling front channel (I have seen this done in expensive installations), though in-ceiling rear speakers can be nearly as bad (a herd of horses sounding like they are flying through the air, etc. [I have heard this]). Speakers too far apart or too close together is another common one that you covered. And yes, nothing beats an SPL meter, a tape measure, and one's own ears for correct settings.
I visited a house with an interesting set up recently. It was a huge log house with an enormous hall area. I was buying a pair of Celestion bookcase speakers, and he had them placed widely apart in an area the shape of an expanding funnel into the hall. They sound WAY better than they had any right to, and much better than they did when I got them home. The thing I wanted to ask though, was that his main speakers were large three way mounted either side of the hall half way up the wall, and aiming directly at each other. They were 15 foot from the ground and 30 foot apart (did I mention it was a BIG area?) I wish I could have heard them. He did tell me he had to get a bigger amp to drive them.
This video inspired me to dig through some boxes and find my Radio Shack Analog Sound Level Meter. Then I went to Lowe's and bought a BOSCH GLM42 Laser Measure and made precise distance measurements from my seated position to the Paradigm speakers and the SVS subwoofer. The Marantz receiver manual setup menu allowed these distance measurements, in feet and tenths of an inch, to be entered for the speakers and subwoofer. Then I used the Analog Sound Level Meter, mounted on a tripod, to set the levels for the speakers and subwoofer. SVS Tech Support told me to set the subwoofer at -3db before setting the subwoofer level in the receiver. Then I used the BOSCH GLM42 to precisely adjust the toe-in of the Left and Right main speakers. The living room in my townhouse is acoustically awful, but after doing these adjustments, I CAN'T BELIEVE HOW MUCH BETTER MY SYSTEM SOUNDS! THANK YOU GENE!
Despite seeing repeated videos talking about dual sub setups, I thought it was just more honeyed audiophile words. But I but a sub from a company with a generous return policy and I tried it out and damn. This is the type of bass response I was looking for when I got into home theater stuff to begin with. It's a full, even sound if I were to describe it accurately.
@@RicochetForce need to try this then, just bought Polk Audio s60 towers s30 center speaker, s15 as my rears and hts10 sub, everything sounds amazing, except for the sub, it sounds horrible honestly, my towers produce more deep and even bass and its annoying as hell. Still havent sold my old yamaha sw515, gonna try to go dual sub
@@sneikiusas Try working with your sub woofer placement, cross over and phase adjustments. But, only do one at a time or you may be chasing your tail. One night I changed my sub from 0 phase to 180 and BOOM. Now I've got bass.
@@sneikiusas Definitely try it. Make sure your receiver can accept a second sub, get a long enough cable for its position in your room (or use a wireless adapter), and away you go. I have my first sub next to my Front Right speaker, so I put the second one in a location diagonal from the first in the middle of the wall. This avoided getting some corner boom from the second sub. One thing you should be prepared for is the significantly increased bass power. A 25 or 30Hz note from one sub is nothing compared to two, so be prepared to tweak your subwoofer settings to account for this.
I recently, and finally managed to get my dad away from soundbars and wireless speakers, I found a half decent set of q acoustic speakers dirt cheap and we all chipped in and got him a early Christmas present of a Sony str dn1080 I also found a nice little set of wharfdale modus to use as front high Atmos speakers. My mum had nipped out so we put on ready player one and wound the volume right up. The look on his face was priceless when the race at the beginning of the film kicked off. It's not a super high end system by any means but it's all set up properly so all he has to do now is turn it up and enjoy it.
Good stuff Gene... I've been to a friends house and see the towers to the rear of the room and the bookshelves speakers on stands on top of the tv stand at the front ..lol
Hi Gene, I think the number 1 problem that people have is that they didn't go with a high end sound bar instead, & that eliminates most of the problems mentioned. EQ's are very simplified inside them. Soundbar still have a common issue is that you still have to calibrate the settings as which speakers you want to have the most sound coming from them. Vizio lowers every setting out of the box. Soundbars got much much better in the last 4 years.
Great top 5 pics Gene... Other important things to get sound as close to perfect: - Good room treatment (absorption/diffusion/treatment of 1st reflection points... - get 2 or more subs for more even bass response - Use a quality preamp with high quality DACs - shielded audio cables and good power conditioner and amps to deliver clean sound - get a RTA mic and do room analysis in a quiet room without any external noises.
WOW!! What a difference that made just by measuring with a tape measure and adjusting DB volume levels. Even changing the distances by 1/2 foot to a foot, you can hear how much better it sounds..Thank you so much!!!
I agree with your list, here's what I would add. 6) Not addressing 1st reflections. a) Adding a carpet or throwing some pillows on the floor made a noticeable difference. b) getting the coffee table out of the listening area or at least covering with a towel, blanket or quilt. c) With directional speakers, like my Klipsch RB-61s, towing in the speakers in extremely windened the sweet spot significantly, like 8 feet wider. This has the added benefit of reducing the first reflections off the side walls because there is much less energy there with the speakers towed in. 7) Only buying 1 subwoofer. I blame the Bose trend for this because prior to the acoustimass sub our L/R speakers had large woofer drivers which helped with room modes and low frequency output. I was a skeptic of multis and thought you were trying to sell me a bunch of RSL Speedwoofers, but when I added an additional Klipsch RW-12D to my main system the bass throughout the room smoothed out, I gained a bunch of head room and the bass became so much more believable, smooth and real sounding. To this day I can't believe the difference multisub makes. 8) Sub integration. You kid of hind on this with the settings, but I think really spending some time on the placement and settings of the subwoofers so they are properly integrated goes along way to adding realism. This is especially true when listening to music in stereo.
Thank you for talking about crossover frequency and subs. I just checked my High Pass Amp and Low Pass. The electronic crossover on the High Pass was close, I had it set at 83Hz. The Low Pass was set at 265Hz for some reason. I've got them both set at 79Hz. I'm using a pair of dreaded Crown XLS-1500's. The High Pass amp is driving a pair of Klipsch RB-81 Mk II's. The other Crown is running in Low Pass Bridged mode powering an Klipsch R-115SW. I got one of their subs with a bad amp, so I drilled a hole in the back plate, and made it a passive. I wish I would have checked the impedance of the sub's driver while I had it open. Either way, the XLS-1500 produces 1050W bridged @ 8 ohms or 1550W bridged @ 4 ohms. As long as you don't over drive the pre amp outs on the receiver, these Class D amps aren't that noisy.
Great stuff Gene.! 2 channel / surround system, room acoustic treatment must be a jungle for most "serious" enthusiasts. Diffuser or absorber, or mix.... First reflection point.. Behind speaker... Ceiling... Rear wall...Experts can't agree on this topic. Would be awesome if, i/we had your in depth talk about this. Thanks again 🙏👊🏿✌️
I always use a 2-channel soundstage to tweak the left/right speaker position and angles. I have acoustic treatments on the walls and I've found that it's beneficial to have more "bounce" off the walls to get a wider soundstage. When I angle my left/right speakers more toward the sweet spot the soundstage collapses. REW and a DSP have been fantastic for my bass response. My next phase is tweaking the receiver's auto-EQ using REW. Great content!!!!!
Are people still using REW? I found it a bit tedious initially but massive improvement especially at the top end of my KEF Q series and blending multiple subs. (noob audio enthusiast here) Thanks BTW Gene you have been a valuable source of information and guidance.
@3D - I know some people who use REW. I'm using Sonarworks Reference 4.? correction in my DAW which feeds right/left and active sub. The best improvement I have ever made has been getting the proper amount of acoustical treatment installed. Good acoustic treatment is like magic when used with electronic correction.
I recently used REW to work on my sub placement and EQ. Great program! Made major improvements in suckouts below 80 Hz just by moving my sub (using a UMIK-1 mike, btw) and then used REW to auto-generate para EQ's in a MiniDSP HD and smooth out my bass response significantly. I will be using it again soon to tweak my auto-eq settings on my receiver next and get the top end just where I want it. I have 2x4 panels of 4" thick fiberglass wrapped in acoustic cloth at my primary and secondary reflection points and to be honest the room is a bit over-dampened.
Love your audio knowledge, I recently tested 3 different AVRs and used their microphone calibrations, and you are spot on, you have to tweak the calibration from distance, size, htz and levels.. what was amazing the lower end amph had great home theater sound but lacked in HiFi quality.
Great video and advice! I limited audessey to 500hz and my system sounded more natural.i also realized my seats were in the wrong position as i always felt the bass wasn't as strong as it should be.i moved them 3' back from center of my room and now i have punchy bass that is tight and i can feel it now. I'm going to try 300hz limit and see if i notice a difference. Keep up the good work!
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Yeah Audyssey always sets my fronts to large and full range. I'd go back and change them to small and crossover at 80hz. BUT I got a mic and a minidsp HD for my subwoofers and found a huge dip at 80hz. I now crossover my speakers at 100hz. Which is crazy for towers but let me tell you the sound difference was amazing! I also set no EQ from Audyssey on the L, R, and sub.
I have gained some knowledge over the years, since I bought my first system in ‘74. Some trial and error and videos such as this have helped greatly. The biggest problem I’ve seen over the years is terrible speaker placement, especially the front 3. Main L/R speakers shoved in corners, cc’s on the floor, sound path blocked
When setting up I always run the auto-setup first so that its get a rough idea of the speakers, distances, levels and the EQ of all the speakers to the room. I then go in and manually adjust the speakers distances to match what they actually are and then level test all channels. Works well.
The distances it sets are for the delay. Though you may be 12 feet from the speaker, it might set it at say 10 feet due to how things are reacting in your specific room. Your gear in my room at the same 12 ft seat distance could return 14ft. Both are correct as our rooms are unique.
I run the auto-setup, turn of the auto-EQ and set it up by my self from the listening position were the mic for auto-setup was placed and in that way I get great base, middletone and treble for my taste, works great for me.
The biggest difference I've found is from underpowered speakers, external amplification has opened up a whole new world of imaging, clarity and fullness in my speakers. Most people are also unaware of how inaccurate their reciever power ratings are.
This is something I’ve just come to realise. In a way it’s kind of misleading because AVR specs will say something like 125W per channel and I’d always just taken it for granted that it meant for each of my 7.2 channels. External amplification is way down my list of things to buy in life.
I've already corrected speaker placement which had a huge impact. Can wait to get home and see if I can't get the eq set up with the new avr I just hooked up. Bass is an issue I was having with it.
Fortunately for me 1 and 2 weren't a big deal since I knew where the speakers should be placed anyway, but I absolutely agree with 3 4 and 5. My receiver's calibration did a fairly good job with 3, but I hated what it did with 4 and 5. I always set my towers to small with an xover at 80 bc that crossover sounded the best to me, and I always prefer my manual Eq, which basically acts like a tone control that I adjusted to my personal tastes. I tone down the harsh frequencies above 3 khz because they just give me ear fatigue, and I like how big the bass sounds and how small the speakers sound when I tone down the 198 hz range, which makes them complement each other, then I just boost all the low and punchy bass frequencies and the 1-2 khz range bc they just feel very cinematic!
Thanks for this video, your advice is always helpful. If I could add something that I discovered struggling with my new denon receiver to get it to sound great. My source device was a new 4k ROKU player which I finally realized had an audio setting to smooth out the volume range; nothing too loud nothing too quiet, which I'm sure has its place but really reduced the realism of the playback. After turning this feature off everything sounded great. I have found that almost all the automatic features on sound and video intended to enhance the viewing experience actually reduces it and are better turned off.
I think that I will have to go into my receiver's settings and set the front speakers to small after watching this. I have noticed that 2 channel audio does sound weak from my system. Also going to try to spread out my front left and right channel speakers. I will have to watch your video on setting delays though, because that sounds complicated! One thing that might actually be good about my older early 2000's receiver is that it doesn't have any of that fancy auto calibration stuff, so it's basically forcing me to manually set all those things like EQ and delays. Thank you for the great tips in this video! I have owned a surround sound system for a few years now, but I have not really gotten into calibrating everything properly. It's nice to find ways to boost performance of my aging system for free!
It's so nice to hear you focusing on speaker placement. It's the single, most important thing one can do to improve sound (and it's funny - so many people get their panties in a bunch when you suggest they move their speakers... it's strange, really). Proper placement cannot be stressed enough. I've seen speakers that cost near 10k that were jammed into corners / up against walls... Made me want to cry on more than one occasion. By the way - the inclusion of the clip at the end was very amusing. lol Another good video @Audioholics
Every time I watch a home audio video, my brain melts a little more. I have an Onkyo 616, Klipsch L&R towers and center, Fluance L&R surround and am adding a sub soon. I still struggle with perceived quality, and speech levels always seem too low in movies.
Thanks for reassuring me I am not crazy! I run Dirac with Paradigm speakers through a NAD receiver, messed with calibration for almost a month before I just had it calibrate bass(because of the 40hz bloat in my room)! Also (side note) even if you decide to not use a calibration, at least run it for distance. I have realized distance isn't necessarily feet (physical distance is a good start), but what it really does is time delay sound so it reaches you correctly. Subs are a perfect example when they are placed by the fronts but yet it will tell you they're twice the distance or zero feet (this is not a mistake). My back channels are physically 6feet away, but sound perfect if the receiver thinks they are 13feet(dirac set them to this)!?!? Proof that everyone's rooms are different. AUDIOHOLICS FTW!
I agree on the auto room correction. I had a bad experience with Anthem ARC about ten years ago. I'm suspect it works better now but I still plan to do everything manually in my new theater. My analogy is that automatic room correction is like a point and shoot camera, for someone that doesn't know or want to know how to set manual settings it's possibly better than nothing but it can never match a proper manual setup.
Hello, I have to put the Surround Side Speakers on to my Wall. I´ve read its better for the whole row if they are a little bit higher up than ear level and angled down. My question is, if I have to angle down a Bookshelf Speaker, can I use instead a wallmounted Atmos Speaker, because they´re already angled down as Surround Sides?
What really gets me is that people are willing to invest a fair amount of money into a decent system, but have no interest in learning about how to set it up. Maybe its just me but I have spent hours playing with settings and doing lots of research to a point where I still think I can get it slightly better, but for me that is part of the fun. The app for the Marantz and Denon is definitely worth the little bit extra just to be able to make those finer adjustments as well as to store different setups that you can change relatively quickly.
Exactly. Mofos will laugh at first until they shit down, then say how much do I have to pay to get it like this. Lol 125. I got an old school set up from the 70s. This amp rocks harder than most car stereo with crazy bass.u Kno the ones I'm talking about
Yup. MANY stories over the years about that one. Happily my second wife of now 23 years has never peeped, EVEN THOUGH she has little interest in music quality (perfectly happy to listen to MP3 over the laptop speakers :-( )
I suggest to convert the ceiling pre-wire to height channels or ATMOS and go buy floor standing L/R and center speaker for tv stand or wall mount, etc.
Worst still are $100,000 Wilson speakers in these same homes placed in a reflective room filled with marble flooring, glass windows, zero room treatment
This video was amazing! I appreciate the tips greatly. 200% increase in the sound quality. I found the auto eq butchered my listing experience. The biggest tip was setting the sub LFE to 80 and using the SPL meter to set up the levels. Thank you Thank you Thank you.
Setting the delay and level really helped my setup. I didn’t like what Audysse was doing to my newly acquired Klipsch RF-83s, but it sounded too boomy without it. So, I downloaded a simple app to check the spl of the speakers and just set it between 75-80 and man what a difference.
Hey, when it comes to the subwoofer on my 5.1 you are correct, because when it comes to movies its great but with music, I'm always saying where’s the BASS? It’s hardly ever there. New carpet being installed this week and I just got a new Yamaha RX A2A so will use your recommendations once everything is done. Thank you!
@@liquiddag The multi-sub EQ is only available on 2080 and above, I think that's why he asked for 2080. Other than that, it should be the same for 1080.
@@JayHernandez30 I agree. I have used my YPAO multiple times and it seems it changes just a bit every time. would love to be able to fine tune it. Especially the subs phase
Yes look at the graphic eq from the auto eq , it’s got up to 10db boosts and cuts. It’s obvious on music just turn off and on. So yes limit the correction, work on placement, then treat your room.
When i set my speaker levels with a spl meter from my phone manually, i notice a massive difference of what the sound was like, it made the movie sound more impressive and more 3d it was.
I agree that the auto setup programs typically set the bass incorrectly. I used the auto setup for my Onkyo Receiver and didn't like the results, The program set the bass level at -10 dB, which really muted the bass. I went into each setting and tweaked them until I was satisfied with the results. I found that +3 dB on the bass gave the best results with anything more just too room-rattling. I also tweaked the other settings for my listening position and the distances to each speaker from there. My Home Theater System now sounds terrific. I'm thinking auto setups are just a waste of time even when done correctly. I prefer to tweak, then listen to the results before entering final settings. Each listener has different tastes, so the system should be tune to suit the listeners of that particular system.
with large front floor standing speakers i prefer adjusting in the receiver the speaker size to large position because at small with music you don't have the complete bass from you're front speakers wich i think is better and more accurate(precise) then the one from the sub.So i prefer a sub more discrete and have bass gain from the left and right front speakers (better sound image) i have wharfedale opus 2-2 front speakers ( wich have 2 8 inches carbon fiber woofers in each one),paradigm dsp 3100 10 inch subwoofer and pioneer elite sc37 receiver (yes a bit old but still very good with my 7.1 configuration and even tested the atmos blu-ray demo from dolby that we have in store and the 360 degrees 7.1 effect are all tehre with no blank or have the impression that something is missing.Love youère test and reviews by the way,good job and always interesrting.
I was good on 1-3 but did rely on Audyssey for the room correction, EQ, and distance (I assume this one is solid though my sub registered as almost twice as far as the center channel and they're roughly collocated right now). I'll have to work on 4 and 5 to see if I can tell a difference.
I do agree and practice limiting speakers to 80hz but there is a case for extending range of a larger speaker that is set to small. My Klipsch setup with a LF10 subwoofer does not respond well to a wide bandwidth so I set the front towers to 50hz. I agree with your statement of trusting your ears and that it should be applied to ever part of setup.
The ears are delicate and precious to most people. I think what Americans are looking for is NOT to over do it. But get a nice comfortable sound out of music equipment that also produces music realistically at a good price. Most people only have a small 15ft x 15ft family room to work with. So they don’t need to over do it. Yet they want a good sounding system that can provide for them hours of listening enjoyment with-out giving them a head ache or damaging the ears. Nerves are the sensors in our human bodies and a head ache is cause from pain. Pain is NOT good but caused by irritation or damage.
General comment that wasn't actually a mistake. My old 2-channel system was the Martin Logan Theos and I was in a small condo and living room was really small. I sent them up according to the manual; however due to the sound partially going out the back, it would bounce off the back of the speakers and then hit the back wall behind the listeners and everyone who look around for the back set of speakers. It was pretty cool/cheesy surround sound or I should say acoustic deflection? Thanks for the video Gene, will come back to this one when I get around to having a place that I can have a room designed for both 2 channel and home theater.
I've watched all your videos and I'm trying to figure out my surround sound how to work. I bought Klipsch two tall standing speakers and center with sub at garage sale and told me they all worked but the sub is not working at all but I can hear the buzz everytime I unplugged the RCA. Did all the setting
Great video, amazing to think you can get all this info for free nowadays from a specialist who clearly has empirical knowledge. As a side note - Does anyone ever feel like they're in The Truman Show? No word of a lie, at 7:19 in this video "Bang" appears on the screen, the first firework of the day went off and exploded at the EXACT same time it appeared... (It's currently 18:39) WEIRD MAAAN. Happy new years to everyone.
Great video as always! I have never done these mistakes. You have an amazing room and speakers. I do not have such a great room or speakers. After watching your videos I decided to upgrade. I ordered the Focal Kanta for the front end and Kef LS50 meta for the soround speakers. They are not in your league but I can only do what I can afford. I also have to use my main room for 2 channel too since cannot afford separate set up for 2 channel.
Gene thanks for the advice. I had my front speakers set to large on my Denon AVR--X4500h (an awesome pair of Martin Logan towers) but I can't seem to get my 2 subs to work, a pair of Klipschs. Now I know what to correct and maybe I'll finally get to fully enjoy them!
very informative, have a yamaha system , use a laser to measure from the listening spot to set delay and distance, crossover was set to 80 hz because it seemed to give better bass, thanks for hte info.
GENE ,thank you for another great video . I wish people put more attention to those factors , they going to help in setting any system a lot Better . Like you said , use Calibration but Also your Ears .
Great video once again thanks! The 80Hz rule should come with a warning that it's dependant on the frequency response of your front speaks no? I know it's an edge case, but the Kef T series for instance have crossover values on paper of 110Hz from what I recall, when run through receiver setups I've seen the crossover detected anywhere between 110-150Hz for the T series, going to 80Hz will presumably risk damaging them, hence setting them to 110Hz is surely the right move.
If that's an Atmosphere speaker, yes use a higher crossover. A main channel should be able to play down to 80hz otherwise use a larger speaker or dual subs closely located near each left/right speaker so you can push the crossover frequency higher without localization issues.
Gene - At 4:55 in the video you promise a link to a separate link on "How to balance your channels." Didn't see it in the description below. Am I missing something? I've always relied on the auto callibration tools for my receivers and I'm finding from professionals like yourself that this packaged process is pretty much junk. I want to learn how to callibrate my system manually. Thanks!
Magnepan did some research from old RCA Lab stereo giving three channels across the front to better simulate an orchestra than two channels which were all that record grooves could make. They added a center channel through Dolby Pro-Logic and test audiences all found it could better sound like an orchestra than two channels and it has a wider sweet spot. I tried this with Nagnepan speakers and I agree.
Huh. I've had the center on my 5.1 PSB Imagine setup (T2 mains) on the floor ever since. Only have a cantilever shelf (now occupied by the new SR5015 and Oppo) to move it to, worry a bit about resonance off the shelf, but I'll try it (move the center to just under the tv). Thanx for that one.
Gene, thanks for all the great info, you've made a believer out of me. I often call SVS for questions and they suggested not limiting the speakers but setting the crossover 15Hz to 20Hz above the lower frequency response. For my height channels in my 7.2.4 system that's 150Hz. I don't think my small speakers can handle 80 Hz, should I still set the crossover to 80Hz for all my speakers?
Don't Atmos receivers allow you to set a seperates crossover for your height speakers? After all, Nobody in their right mind would mount tower speakers to the ceiling to serve as Amos height channels. Right? Right?
@@xavdeman That's funny but yes, the receiver does let me set the crossover for the height channels. My questions is more specific to the 80Hz crossover for the height channels as Gene mentioned in the video. He didn't mentioned the speakers being able to handle it before setting it to 80Hz.
You're talking about the SVS Elevation speakers? I have those as my height and surrounds in a 7.2.4 setup and I set them for 80hz on the surround and 90 on the heights and they sound perfectly fine for me. Those little speakers are fully capable of producing some good bass so don't limit them. After all, thunderstorms and jets flying overhead have bass in them so it's good to hear that. Everything below that, the subs can take care of . You can always test it yourself by playing around with both settings, turning only the heights on, putting in an Atmos disc with a favorite scene that has a hefty height sound and see what you like. To me, they're fully capable at 80 or 90HZ.
I would say it depends on your subwoofer. I set crossover of my ear level speakers to 80hz (they could go lower). My height channels should be crossed over at 150hz too. But when I do that, my sub has to handle the height channel bass. That leads to an awful overall bass sound, since my sub is not build to keep clean bass above 120hz. So I set them to 100hz crossover. Sounds overall much better and the few 100-150 hz bass heavy height effects don’t matter that much to me compared to an overall bad bass response. Just try the different crossovers with a few atmos tracks like i.e. the race in ready player one or the arena scenes in alita battle angel. Let your ears decide on that one.
@@BenjAmin-vx3jz Thanks, that's kind of what I was leaning towards. I also had to adjust the settings on the subs via the Marantz since Audyssey was giving me some wonky results. Overall pleased with my system but always willing to try new tricks from the gurus on this channel 😀.
My center channel is on the floor at the moment, but I’m aware it’s bad. Coming this week will be all new stuff: Klipsch RF-7 IIIs along with the RC-64 III center channel and their 15” sub. My 10yo Yamaha receiver is getting replaced with a Marantz SR8015. The fun part will be calibrating all that.
What mistakes have you made when setting up your home theater? Are they one of the five on this list?
Had my center channel set to large set it to small world of difference thanks Gene always helpful and always informative big thumbs up 👍
You wouldn't let me make them ;)
Had a friend excited to show me his 5.1.2 all IN CEILING system. Didn’t have the heart to tell them what they were missing. Brand new construction via builder suggested setup 🤢🤦♂️
For a long time waited looking for a good speaker package option before upgrading from 5.1. Eventually my system's video overtook and I decided to grab some cheap speakers just for testing. A year later I'm still enjoying atmos on miss matched speakers. I will upgrade eventually but I'm enjoying just being able to listen at home at the full spec of the source
@@CoachCole71 That's the biggest problem. They really are not getting it at the builder level, unfortunately.
I threw together my movie room on a budget in 2016 and in 2020 I redid the room and corrected many things. Changed the room to movie theater red with black ceiling and black front wall. Built sound acoustic panels and placed them accordingly and then stopped using the Audyssey eq correction and downloaded the app to manage it. It is a while different world down there now.
Before the redo I had white ceilings brown walls, coffee tables, end tables and the room was off center with no sound absorbing panels. So much echoing in that room and it was just loud. Now I have to turn things down because they are so clear and come at you correctly. Still a work in progress as I finish up the front wall panels and install red velvet curtains.
Great videos on here.
all those corrections made a night and day difference, thank you
thanks Gene - I learn more from your channel than I do anywhere else. Keep up the incredible work.
Hello Mr. DELLASALA YOU ARE THE BEST AND MOST HONEST PERSON WHO NEVER TRY TO SELL ANYTHING JUST PURE HELP FOR ALL AUDIO LOVERS Thanks a lot 🙏 😊
My brother had my parents center channel in the back of the listening area in the basement. It was strange when the dialogue was coming from behind me. I had to redo everything and place the LCR in front. I told him and my parents not to touch anything, ever, and let me know if something is out of whack.
Lol oh that's funny
@@dmo848 I know.
Mama: We had one helluva effects whenever somebody was trying to sneak up on somebody, it was lifelike !!
Speaker level and distance have been the most important. I've gone back and fourth with the auto eq, always end up turning it off and manually setting levels with a sound level meter. Awesome video.
After watching this I decided to rerun calibration setup. My display is a projector so always have had the fan noise during calibration. I powered it off and just used the iPad as display. Checked and verified speaker distance was correct along with levels. I found Sub 1's level too low. Corrected it and reran setup. I am amazed at the difference in Bass response. I had assumed Audyssey had set levels correctly in the past. I won't make that mistake again. I'm happy with the improvement and thankful for the video.
Great summary! I think you covered most of the mistakes in principle. Probably the worst is the in-ceiling front channel (I have seen this done in expensive installations), though in-ceiling rear speakers can be nearly as bad (a herd of horses sounding like they are flying through the air, etc. [I have heard this]). Speakers too far apart or too close together is another common one that you covered. And yes, nothing beats an SPL meter, a tape measure, and one's own ears for correct settings.
I visited a house with an interesting set up recently. It was a huge log house with an enormous hall area. I was buying a pair of Celestion bookcase speakers, and he had them placed widely apart in an area the shape of an expanding funnel into the hall. They sound WAY better than they had any right to, and much better than they did when I got them home. The thing I wanted to ask though, was that his main speakers were large three way mounted either side of the hall half way up the wall, and aiming directly at each other. They were 15 foot from the ground and 30 foot apart (did I mention it was a BIG area?) I wish I could have heard them. He did tell me he had to get a bigger amp to drive them.
This video inspired me to dig through some boxes and find my Radio Shack Analog Sound Level Meter. Then I went to Lowe's and bought a BOSCH GLM42 Laser Measure and made precise distance measurements from my seated position to the Paradigm speakers and the SVS subwoofer. The Marantz receiver manual setup menu allowed these distance measurements, in feet and tenths of an inch, to be entered for the speakers and subwoofer. Then I used the Analog Sound Level Meter, mounted on a tripod, to set the levels for the speakers and subwoofer. SVS Tech Support told me to set the subwoofer at -3db before setting the subwoofer level in the receiver. Then I used the BOSCH GLM42 to precisely adjust the toe-in of the Left and Right main speakers. The living room in my townhouse is acoustically awful, but after doing these adjustments, I CAN'T BELIEVE HOW MUCH BETTER MY SYSTEM SOUNDS! THANK YOU GENE!
Mistake #6: spending an extra $1,000 to upgrade your 5 bed level speakers one tier up when that difference could be spent on adding a second subwoofer
Or for room treatment
Despite seeing repeated videos talking about dual sub setups, I thought it was just more honeyed audiophile words. But I but a sub from a company with a generous return policy and I tried it out and damn. This is the type of bass response I was looking for when I got into home theater stuff to begin with. It's a full, even sound if I were to describe it accurately.
@@RicochetForce need to try this then, just bought Polk Audio s60 towers s30 center speaker, s15 as my rears and hts10 sub, everything sounds amazing, except for the sub, it sounds horrible honestly, my towers produce more deep and even bass and its annoying as hell. Still havent sold my old yamaha sw515, gonna try to go dual sub
@@sneikiusas Try working with your sub woofer placement, cross over and phase adjustments. But, only do one at a time or you may be chasing your tail. One night I changed my sub from 0 phase to 180 and BOOM. Now I've got bass.
@@sneikiusas Definitely try it. Make sure your receiver can accept a second sub, get a long enough cable for its position in your room (or use a wireless adapter), and away you go. I have my first sub next to my Front Right speaker, so I put the second one in a location diagonal from the first in the middle of the wall. This avoided getting some corner boom from the second sub. One thing you should be prepared for is the significantly increased bass power. A 25 or 30Hz note from one sub is nothing compared to two, so be prepared to tweak your subwoofer settings to account for this.
I recently, and finally managed to get my dad away from soundbars and wireless speakers, I found a half decent set of q acoustic speakers dirt cheap and we all chipped in and got him a early Christmas present of a Sony str dn1080 I also found a nice little set of wharfdale modus to use as front high Atmos speakers. My mum had nipped out so we put on ready player one and wound the volume right up. The look on his face was priceless when the race at the beginning of the film kicked off. It's not a super high end system by any means but it's all set up properly so all he has to do now is turn it up and enjoy it.
Which q acoustic speakers did you get? I’m leaning toward 3050i with the same receiver
@@Lovestacos Hiya mate I can't remember off the top of my head I'll give my dad a shout and get back to you asap.
Good stuff Gene... I've been to a friends house and see the towers to the rear of the room and the bookshelves speakers on stands on top of the tv stand at the front ..lol
Hi Gene,
I think the number 1 problem that people have is that they didn't go with a high end sound bar instead, & that eliminates most of the problems mentioned.
EQ's are very simplified inside them.
Soundbar still have a common issue is that you still have to calibrate the settings as which speakers you want to have the most sound coming from them.
Vizio lowers every setting out of the box.
Soundbars got much much better in the last 4 years.
Perfect timing!
I just got the Marantz SR 8012 and I want to make sure i extract the best sound out of it.
Same here. Just got an Onkyo tx-nr696 and some new Paradigm speakers. I want this to sound GOOD!!
Totally agree! Use your ears when you setup the sound-calibration. This have worked the best for me every single time. Both for music and movies!
Great top 5 pics Gene...
Other important things to get sound as close to perfect:
- Good room treatment (absorption/diffusion/treatment of 1st reflection points...
- get 2 or more subs for more even bass response
- Use a quality preamp with high quality DACs
- shielded audio cables and good power conditioner and amps to deliver clean sound
- get a RTA mic and do room analysis in a quiet room without any external noises.
WOW!! What a difference that made just by measuring with a tape measure and adjusting DB volume levels. Even changing the distances by 1/2 foot to a foot, you can hear how much better it sounds..Thank you so much!!!
I agree with your list, here's what I would add.
6) Not addressing 1st reflections. a) Adding a carpet or throwing some pillows on the floor made a noticeable difference. b) getting the coffee table out of the listening area or at least covering with a towel, blanket or quilt. c) With directional speakers, like my Klipsch RB-61s, towing in the speakers in extremely windened the sweet spot significantly, like 8 feet wider. This has the added benefit of reducing the first reflections off the side walls because there is much less energy there with the speakers towed in.
7) Only buying 1 subwoofer. I blame the Bose trend for this because prior to the acoustimass sub our L/R speakers had large woofer drivers which helped with room modes and low frequency output. I was a skeptic of multis and thought you were trying to sell me a bunch of RSL Speedwoofers, but when I added an additional Klipsch RW-12D to my main system the bass throughout the room smoothed out, I gained a bunch of head room and the bass became so much more believable, smooth and real sounding. To this day I can't believe the difference multisub makes.
8) Sub integration. You kid of hind on this with the settings, but I think really spending some time on the placement and settings of the subwoofers so they are properly integrated goes along way to adding realism. This is especially true when listening to music in stereo.
What's a tape measure?! Great video my man. Keep up the great work! Adjustments made and quality improved on my older Avanatages x3
Thank you for talking about crossover frequency and subs. I just checked my High Pass Amp and Low Pass. The electronic crossover on the High Pass was close, I had it set at 83Hz. The Low Pass was set at 265Hz for some reason. I've got them both set at 79Hz. I'm using a pair of dreaded Crown XLS-1500's. The High Pass amp is driving a pair of Klipsch RB-81 Mk II's. The other Crown is running in Low Pass Bridged mode powering an Klipsch R-115SW. I got one of their subs with a bad amp, so I drilled a hole in the back plate, and made it a passive. I wish I would have checked the impedance of the sub's driver while I had it open. Either way, the XLS-1500 produces 1050W bridged @ 8 ohms or 1550W bridged @ 4 ohms. As long as you don't over drive the pre amp outs on the receiver, these Class D amps aren't that noisy.
Great stuff Gene.! 2 channel / surround system, room acoustic treatment must be a jungle for most "serious" enthusiasts.
Diffuser or absorber, or mix.... First reflection point.. Behind speaker... Ceiling... Rear wall...Experts can't agree on this topic. Would be awesome if, i/we had your in depth talk about this. Thanks again 🙏👊🏿✌️
I always use a 2-channel soundstage to tweak the left/right speaker position and angles. I have acoustic treatments on the walls and I've found that it's beneficial to have more "bounce" off the walls to get a wider soundstage. When I angle my left/right speakers more toward the sweet spot the soundstage collapses. REW and a DSP have been fantastic for my bass response. My next phase is tweaking the receiver's auto-EQ using REW. Great content!!!!!
I did use db meter and tape measure, and from me manually setting speaker level from the ypao it got so much better more satisfied with the sound
Are people still using REW? I found it a bit tedious initially but massive improvement especially at the top end of my KEF Q series and blending multiple subs. (noob audio enthusiast here) Thanks BTW Gene you have been a valuable source of information and guidance.
@3D - I know some people who use REW. I'm using Sonarworks Reference 4.? correction in my DAW which feeds right/left and active sub. The best improvement I have ever made has been getting the proper amount of acoustical treatment installed.
Good acoustic treatment is like magic when used with electronic correction.
I recently used REW to work on my sub placement and EQ. Great program! Made major improvements in suckouts below 80 Hz just by moving my sub (using a UMIK-1 mike, btw) and then used REW to auto-generate para EQ's in a MiniDSP HD and smooth out my bass response significantly. I will be using it again soon to tweak my auto-eq settings on my receiver next and get the top end just where I want it. I have 2x4 panels of 4" thick fiberglass wrapped in acoustic cloth at my primary and secondary reflection points and to be honest the room is a bit over-dampened.
Love your audio knowledge, I recently tested 3 different AVRs and used their microphone calibrations, and you are spot on, you have to tweak the calibration from distance, size, htz and levels.. what was amazing the lower end amph had great home theater sound but lacked in HiFi quality.
Great video and advice! I limited audessey to 500hz and my system sounded more natural.i also realized my seats were in the wrong position as i always felt the bass wasn't as strong as it should be.i moved them 3' back from center of my room and now i have punchy bass that is tight and i can feel it now. I'm going to try 300hz limit and see if i notice a difference. Keep up the good work!
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Yeah Audyssey always sets my fronts to large and full range. I'd go back and change them to small and crossover at 80hz. BUT I got a mic and a minidsp HD for my subwoofers and found a huge dip at 80hz. I now crossover my speakers at 100hz. Which is crazy for towers but let me tell you the sound difference was amazing! I also set no EQ from Audyssey on the L, R, and sub.
I have gained some knowledge over the years, since I bought my first system in ‘74. Some trial and error and videos such as this have helped greatly. The biggest problem I’ve seen over the years is terrible speaker placement, especially the front 3. Main L/R speakers shoved in corners, cc’s on the floor, sound path blocked
As always, extremely helpful. Thank you!!
When setting up I always run the auto-setup first so that its get a rough idea of the speakers, distances, levels and the EQ of all the speakers to the room. I then go in and manually adjust the speakers distances to match what they actually are and then level test all channels. Works well.
I always turn the surrounds up afterwards.
The distances it sets are for the delay. Though you may be 12 feet from the speaker, it might set it at say 10 feet due to how things are reacting in your specific room. Your gear in my room at the same 12 ft seat distance could return 14ft. Both are correct as our rooms are unique.
@@garcjr
Especially the atmos ones in the ceiling. at least +2db.
I run the auto-setup, turn of the auto-EQ and set it up by my self from the listening position were the mic for auto-setup was placed and in that way I get great base, middletone and treble for my taste, works great for me.
The biggest difference I've found is from underpowered speakers, external amplification has opened up a whole new world of imaging, clarity and fullness in my speakers. Most people are also unaware of how inaccurate their reciever power ratings are.
This is something I’ve just come to realise. In a way it’s kind of misleading because AVR specs will say something like 125W per channel and I’d always just taken it for granted that it meant for each of my 7.2 channels. External amplification is way down my list of things to buy in life.
I like the tip for switching all speakers to small. I'm going to try that tomorrow. 👍
I've already corrected speaker placement which had a huge impact. Can wait to get home and see if I can't get the eq set up with the new avr I just hooked up. Bass is an issue I was having with it.
Fortunately for me 1 and 2 weren't a big deal since I knew where the speakers should be placed anyway, but I absolutely agree with 3 4 and 5. My receiver's calibration did a fairly good job with 3, but I hated what it did with 4 and 5. I always set my towers to small with an xover at 80 bc that crossover sounded the best to me, and I always prefer my manual Eq, which basically acts like a tone control that I adjusted to my personal tastes. I tone down the harsh frequencies above 3 khz because they just give me ear fatigue, and I like how big the bass sounds and how small the speakers sound when I tone down the 198 hz range, which makes them complement each other, then I just boost all the low and punchy bass frequencies and the 1-2 khz range bc they just feel very cinematic!
Thanks for this video, your advice is always helpful. If I could add something that I discovered struggling with my new denon receiver to get it to sound great. My source device was a new 4k ROKU player which I finally realized had an audio setting to smooth out the volume range; nothing too loud nothing too quiet, which I'm sure has its place but really reduced the realism of the playback.
After turning this feature off everything sounded great. I have found that almost all the automatic features on sound and video intended to enhance the viewing experience actually reduces it and are better turned off.
I think that I will have to go into my receiver's settings and set the front speakers to small after watching this. I have noticed that 2 channel audio does sound weak from my system. Also going to try to spread out my front left and right channel speakers. I will have to watch your video on setting delays though, because that sounds complicated! One thing that might actually be good about my older early 2000's receiver is that it doesn't have any of that fancy auto calibration stuff, so it's basically forcing me to manually set all those things like EQ and delays.
Thank you for the great tips in this video! I have owned a surround sound system for a few years now, but I have not really gotten into calibrating everything properly. It's nice to find ways to boost performance of my aging system for free!
Hey Man, I corrected the distance as you suggested, it sound better. Thank you!!!
Such a value concise and informative video. Thank you very much!
It's so nice to hear you focusing on speaker placement. It's the single, most important thing one can do to improve sound (and it's funny - so many people get their panties in a bunch when you suggest they move their speakers... it's strange, really). Proper placement cannot be stressed enough. I've seen speakers that cost near 10k that were jammed into corners / up against walls... Made me want to cry on more than one occasion.
By the way - the inclusion of the clip at the end was very amusing. lol Another good video @Audioholics
Always wondering, Did I do a good job on setting my speaker levels and delays? Keeps me up at night lol
Every time I watch a home audio video, my brain melts a little more. I have an Onkyo 616, Klipsch L&R towers and center, Fluance L&R surround and am adding a sub soon. I still struggle with perceived quality, and speech levels always seem too low in movies.
Thanks for reassuring me I am not crazy! I run Dirac with Paradigm speakers through a NAD receiver, messed with calibration for almost a month before I just had it calibrate bass(because of the 40hz bloat in my room)! Also (side note) even if you decide to not use a calibration, at least run it for distance. I have realized distance isn't necessarily feet (physical distance is a good start), but what it really does is time delay sound so it reaches you correctly. Subs are a perfect example when they are placed by the fronts but yet it will tell you they're twice the distance or zero feet (this is not a mistake). My back channels are physically 6feet away, but sound perfect if the receiver thinks they are 13feet(dirac set them to this)!?!? Proof that everyone's rooms are different. AUDIOHOLICS FTW!
I agree on the auto room correction. I had a bad experience with Anthem ARC about ten years ago. I'm suspect it works better now but I still plan to do everything manually in my new theater. My analogy is that automatic room correction is like a point and shoot camera, for someone that doesn't know or want to know how to set manual settings it's possibly better than nothing but it can never match a proper manual setup.
Hello,
I have to put the Surround Side Speakers on to my Wall. I´ve read its better for the whole row if they are a little bit higher up than ear level and angled down.
My question is, if I have to angle down a Bookshelf Speaker, can I use instead a wallmounted Atmos Speaker, because they´re already angled down as Surround Sides?
Interesting comment about limiting the multi EQ correction range. I’ll try it out.
Gene 1 coronavirus 0 keep it up man I’ll keep watching 👍
What really gets me is that people are willing to invest a fair amount of money into a decent system, but have no interest in learning about how to set it up. Maybe its just me but I have spent hours playing with settings and doing lots of research to a point where I still think I can get it slightly better, but for me that is part of the fun. The app for the Marantz and Denon is definitely worth the little bit extra just to be able to make those finer adjustments as well as to store different setups that you can change relatively quickly.
My wife always gets mad because I prioritize sound quality over aesthetics...until she sits down to watch a movie.
Exactly. Mofos will laugh at first until they shit down, then say how much do I have to pay to get it like this. Lol 125. I got an old school set up from the 70s. This amp rocks harder than most car stereo with crazy bass.u Kno the ones I'm talking about
Same here lol
@@dmo848 i too shit down sometimes
@@bpali2001 Cleaner than shitting up
Yup. MANY stories over the years about that one. Happily my second wife of now 23 years has never peeped, EVEN THOUGH she has little interest in music quality (perfectly happy to listen to MP3 over the laptop speakers :-( )
I see $30 million homes with theaters that have ceiling LCRs...
I know it kills me to see this done so often in new homes.
I suggest to convert the ceiling pre-wire to height channels or ATMOS and go buy floor standing L/R and center speaker for tv stand or wall mount, etc.
In general I would never do LCR in the ceiling but the GoldenEar HTR7000 are actually pretty good if set up properly.
Worst still are $100,000 Wilson speakers in these same homes placed in a reflective room filled with marble flooring, glass windows, zero room treatment
@@stopthefomo lmao, poor puppies.
This video was amazing! I appreciate the tips greatly. 200% increase in the sound quality. I found the auto eq butchered my listing experience. The biggest tip was setting the sub LFE to 80 and using the SPL meter to set up the levels. Thank you Thank you Thank you.
Unless your main speakers are really good in upper bass, passing through at 80dB is too low. 90-100 is better. Most speakers costing
Setting the delay and level really helped my setup. I didn’t like what Audysse was doing to my newly acquired Klipsch RF-83s, but it sounded too boomy without it. So, I downloaded a simple app to check the spl of the speakers and just set it between 75-80 and man what a difference.
Hey, when it comes to the subwoofer on my 5.1 you are correct, because when it comes to movies its great but with music, I'm always saying where’s the BASS? It’s hardly ever there. New carpet being installed this week and I just got a new Yamaha RX A2A so will use your recommendations once everything is done. Thank you!
Nice to see you looking healthy Gene, that masculine straight posture is back!
Lifting from the ground to above your head with a barbell does wonders for posture.
Thanks for that . I'll apply a couple of your tips to my home theatre set up
Great tips and wish your channel continued successful!!!
Great video, would love for you to do a step by step setup for ypao/yamaha.
Good Idea.
@@Audioholics I would definitely be interested in that YPAO tutorial for either the Yamaha RX A2080 OR RX A3080.
@@JayHernandez30 oh nice I have the 1080 I assume it would all be useful.
@@liquiddag
The multi-sub EQ is only available on 2080 and above, I think that's why he asked for 2080. Other than that, it should be the same for 1080.
@@JayHernandez30 I agree. I have used my YPAO multiple times and it seems it changes just a bit every time. would love to be able to fine tune it. Especially the subs phase
Always learn something new from your channel, bit nervous as I ordered KEF Q950 system to build 1st HT and I hope 🤞🏻 to get is correct!
THANK YOU for the education
Excellent content, I've done HT install for a few years and I learned some things from this. Most importantly, though, what's your workout routine?!
One of the best detailed video
Please make one with set up tv and receiver connection and Apple TV connection
Thanks
Very good advice thanks Gene! Invest in good quality speakers, less EQ needed if any.. 🤘
Yes look at the graphic eq from the auto eq , it’s got up to 10db boosts and cuts. It’s obvious on music just turn off and on. So yes limit the correction, work on placement, then treat your room.
Very informative. Thank you.
Thanks for the video. At 8:20 - do you have a video on the audyssey app you mention?
When i set my speaker levels with a spl meter from my phone manually, i notice a massive difference of what the sound was like, it made the movie sound more impressive and more 3d it was.
Hello Gene 👋. How you doing brother? Once again another interesting video. Anyways Gene stay safe & well. 👍
I agree that the auto setup programs typically set the bass incorrectly. I used the auto setup for my Onkyo Receiver and didn't like the results, The program set the bass level at -10 dB, which really muted the bass. I went into each setting and tweaked them until I was satisfied with the results. I found that +3 dB on the bass gave the best results with anything more just too room-rattling. I also tweaked the other settings for my listening position and the distances to each speaker from there. My Home Theater System now sounds terrific. I'm thinking auto setups are just a waste of time even when done correctly. I prefer to tweak, then listen to the results before entering final settings. Each listener has different tastes, so the system should be tune to suit the listeners of that particular system.
Excellent presentation Gene...
with large front floor standing speakers i prefer adjusting in the receiver the speaker size to large position because at small with music you don't have the complete bass from you're front speakers wich i think is better and more accurate(precise) then the one from the sub.So i prefer a sub more discrete and have bass gain from the left and right front speakers (better sound image) i have wharfedale opus 2-2 front speakers ( wich have 2 8 inches carbon fiber woofers in each one),paradigm dsp 3100 10 inch subwoofer and pioneer elite sc37 receiver (yes a bit old but still very good with my 7.1 configuration and even tested the atmos blu-ray demo from dolby that we have in store and the 360 degrees 7.1 effect are all tehre with no blank or have the impression that something is missing.Love youère test and reviews by the way,good job and always interesrting.
Pure gold 🎯 😃👍
Gene, I'm not seeing the link to the SPL leveling video. Please advise. Thank you
I was good on 1-3 but did rely on Audyssey for the room correction, EQ, and distance (I assume this one is solid though my sub registered as almost twice as far as the center channel and they're roughly collocated right now). I'll have to work on 4 and 5 to see if I can tell a difference.
Thanks for vid. I find with my tweeters, I want them below my ears lest they get a tad screechie.
I do agree and practice limiting speakers to 80hz but there is a case for extending range of a larger speaker that is set to small. My Klipsch setup with a LF10 subwoofer does not respond well to a wide bandwidth so I set the front towers to 50hz. I agree with your statement of trusting your ears and that it should be applied to ever part of setup.
The ears are delicate and precious to most people. I think what Americans are looking for is NOT to over do it. But get a nice comfortable sound out of music equipment that also produces music realistically at a good price. Most people only have a small 15ft x 15ft family room to work with.
So they don’t need to over do it. Yet they want a good sounding system that can provide for them hours of listening enjoyment with-out giving them a head ache or damaging the ears. Nerves are the sensors in our human bodies and a head ache is cause from pain. Pain is NOT good but caused by irritation or damage.
Thank you. very educational.
General comment that wasn't actually a mistake. My old 2-channel system was the Martin Logan Theos and I was in a small condo and living room was really small. I sent them up according to the manual; however due to the sound partially going out the back, it would bounce off the back of the speakers and then hit the back wall behind the listeners and everyone who look around for the back set of speakers. It was pretty cool/cheesy surround sound or I should say acoustic deflection? Thanks for the video Gene, will come back to this one when I get around to having a place that I can have a room designed for both 2 channel and home theater.
I've watched all your videos and I'm trying to figure out my surround sound how to work. I bought Klipsch two tall standing speakers and center with sub at garage sale and told me they all worked but the sub is not working at all but I can hear the buzz everytime I unplugged the RCA. Did all the setting
Great video, amazing to think you can get all this info for free nowadays from a specialist who clearly has empirical knowledge.
As a side note - Does anyone ever feel like they're in The Truman Show?
No word of a lie, at 7:19 in this video "Bang" appears on the screen, the first firework of the day went off and exploded at the EXACT same time it appeared...
(It's currently 18:39) WEIRD MAAAN.
Happy new years to everyone.
Great video as always! I have never done these mistakes.
You have an amazing room and speakers. I do not have such a great room or speakers. After watching your videos I decided to upgrade.
I ordered the Focal Kanta for the front end and Kef LS50 meta for the soround speakers. They are not in your league but I can only do what I can afford. I also have to use my main room for 2 channel too since cannot afford separate set up for 2 channel.
Nice video well done !
Gene thanks for the advice. I had my front speakers set to large on my Denon AVR--X4500h (an awesome pair of Martin Logan towers) but I can't seem to get my 2 subs to work, a pair of Klipschs. Now I know what to correct and maybe I'll finally get to fully enjoy them!
very informative, have a yamaha system , use a laser to measure from the listening spot to set delay and distance, crossover was set to 80 hz because it seemed to give better bass, thanks for hte info.
GENE ,thank you for another great video . I wish people put more attention to those factors , they going to help in setting any system a lot Better . Like you said , use Calibration but Also your Ears .
very true my friend. Good to still see you watching these videos ;)
@@Audioholics i will continue for Shure . I miss the live videos , I hope you do one soon .
Great video once again thanks! The 80Hz rule should come with a warning that it's dependant on the frequency response of your front speaks no? I know it's an edge case, but the Kef T series for instance have crossover values on paper of 110Hz from what I recall, when run through receiver setups I've seen the crossover detected anywhere between 110-150Hz for the T series, going to 80Hz will presumably risk damaging them, hence setting them to 110Hz is surely the right move.
If that's an Atmosphere speaker, yes use a higher crossover. A main channel should be able to play down to 80hz otherwise use a larger speaker or dual subs closely located near each left/right speaker so you can push the crossover frequency higher without localization issues.
Gene - At 4:55 in the video you promise a link to a separate link on "How to balance your channels." Didn't see it in the description below. Am I missing something? I've always relied on the auto callibration tools for my receivers and I'm finding from professionals like yourself that this packaged process is pretty much junk. I want to learn how to callibrate my system manually. Thanks!
Heard about the Audyssey app filter recently. Downloading and re-running Audyssey soon.
Magnepan did some research from old RCA Lab stereo giving three channels across the front to better simulate an orchestra than two channels which were all that record grooves could make. They added a center channel through Dolby Pro-Logic and test audiences all found it could better sound like an orchestra than two channels and it has a wider sweet spot. I tried this with Nagnepan speakers and I agree.
"Beatles" producer George Martin, on a pre-"Beatles" visit to Capitol Records in the US, was blown away by their three-channel MONO system.
I've set up my LCR's in my neighbors gazebo. Is that a good placement?
I wonder how expensive you may be to come to my home. I live in Austin, Tx. It would be an honor speaking to someone like you.
Huh. I've had the center on my 5.1 PSB Imagine setup (T2 mains) on the floor ever since. Only have a cantilever shelf (now occupied by the new SR5015 and Oppo) to move it to, worry a bit about resonance off the shelf, but I'll try it (move the center to just under the tv). Thanx for that one.
Gene, thanks for all the great info, you've made a believer out of me. I often call SVS for questions and they suggested not limiting the speakers but setting the crossover 15Hz to 20Hz above the lower frequency response. For my height channels in my 7.2.4 system that's 150Hz. I don't think my small speakers can handle 80 Hz, should I still set the crossover to 80Hz for all my speakers?
Don't Atmos receivers allow you to set a seperates crossover for your height speakers?
After all, Nobody in their right mind would mount tower speakers to the ceiling to serve as Amos height channels. Right? Right?
@@xavdeman That's funny but yes, the receiver does let me set the crossover for the height channels. My questions is more specific to the 80Hz crossover for the height channels as Gene mentioned in the video. He didn't mentioned the speakers being able to handle it before setting it to 80Hz.
You're talking about the SVS Elevation speakers? I have those as my height and surrounds in a 7.2.4 setup and I set them for 80hz on the surround and 90 on the heights and they sound perfectly fine for me. Those little speakers are fully capable of producing some good bass so don't limit them. After all, thunderstorms and jets flying overhead have bass in them so it's good to hear that. Everything below that, the subs can take care of .
You can always test it yourself by playing around with both settings, turning only the heights on, putting in an Atmos disc with a favorite scene that has a hefty height sound and see what you like. To me, they're fully capable at 80 or 90HZ.
I would say it depends on your subwoofer. I set crossover of my ear level speakers to 80hz (they could go lower). My height channels should be crossed over at 150hz too. But when I do that, my sub has to handle the height channel bass. That leads to an awful overall bass sound, since my sub is not build to keep clean bass above 120hz. So I set them to 100hz crossover. Sounds overall much better and the few 100-150 hz bass heavy height effects don’t matter that much to me compared to an overall bad bass response. Just try the different crossovers with a few atmos tracks like i.e. the race in ready player one or the arena scenes in alita battle angel. Let your ears decide on that one.
@@BenjAmin-vx3jz Thanks, that's kind of what I was leaning towards. I also had to adjust the settings on the subs via the Marantz since Audyssey was giving me some wonky results. Overall pleased with my system but always willing to try new tricks from the gurus on this channel 😀.
OmJesus.... I have some much to learn. Thank you sir
My center channel is on the floor at the moment, but I’m aware it’s bad. Coming this week will be all new stuff: Klipsch RF-7 IIIs along with the RC-64 III center channel and their 15” sub. My 10yo Yamaha receiver is getting replaced with a Marantz SR8015. The fun part will be calibrating all that.
Great video Gene!
Thank you ! Thank you! Thank you so so much!!!!! Now I understand!!!!!!😃😃😃😄😄😄😄😄
TY for the information. great video
I would rather pay someone to come home and configure my equipment, there are simply too many things to tweak and is overwhelming.
So, should the subs be set at 80hz or stay at 120hz?