Speed of evacuation from Japan Airlines plane after Haneda crash ‘amazing’: Expert
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- Опубликовано: 8 июн 2024
- The speed of evacuation by the 367 passengers and 12 crew members from the Japan Airlines plane was an amazing feat, helped by the light smoke in the cabin and passengers not trying to take their belongings with them, which is typically a major hindrance when evacuating an aircraft. Assistant professor of aviation and integrated systems engineering Shawn Pruchnicki from Ohio State University shares more on CNA’s Asia First.
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Since the majority of people on the plane were Japanese, they remained sane and mostly calm and followed instructions. They did not immediately jump up, jam the aisles, fight with each other to move in random directions (since they wouldn't have known where to go) and go crazy in general. And this was the result - a successful evacuation that everyone on the passenger plane survived.
Exactly my first thought.
Short answer : because they weren't Americans!
Exactly. Imagine if it was full of Americans.
They also didn’t start bickering with staff and complaining about what they were entitled to and refuse to leave or let others leave the burning plane until they received. They had human decency.
I think, some passengers needed to act as crew members, too, when an plane accident happened. The passengers nearest the escape doors. There are sometimes 4 emergency doors, 2 on both sides. Not sure if those passengers were able to open those doors and deploy the evacuation slides and let other passengers out before they could slide down.
Well trained crew and very disciplined passengers!!!
That. Highest praise goes to the well trained crew!
After the Kollision when the aircraft slid over the runway it was engulfed in a wall of fire, a slight cabin overpressure kept the flames the important first minutes outside. The highly trained Japanese staff reacted perfect, and the airport's safety systems just functioned.
Therefore, praise also to the unknown engineers. They made it possible that the aircraft could keep its structural integrity for the important ,minutes longer, and to the fire workers who kept the flames away from the passengers while they disembarked.
This is not a story grown in my brain, it is what the German reported.
You are right. All crews are trained. Problem is with hysteric, narcissistic and entitled passengers who do not listen.
@@lulaerdeljan159 They had a few unruly, not many. For as long as the majority goes with the crew, it will dramatically increase the chances everyone can disembark.
I wonder what would happen with Singapore passengers.
This was mentioned on another channel. The reason they evacuated so quickly has to do with the discipline and obedience of the Japanese people. I agree.
Yes, but it is also because Japanese are very slim and are not obese like in some other countries. They move a lot faster.
not simple obedience, but the understanding that cooperation will save everyone, and selfishness would kill.
if you've flown on an european flight you'd see how selfish people are even during normal times. extremely slow to board, taking their time to find the perfect place for their luggage, then extremely rushing and pushing when getting off the plane.
@@freemanolAgreed. If just one passenger started to get their luggage overhead, others would follow suit out of irrational "can I get mine too" thinking. Only takes one. The fact that no one dared to take their luggage and got out in a safe and orderly fashion in less than 2 minutes showed everyone cooperated with the plane crew and fought any selfish urge (if any). Amazing.
@@matzmnmaybe try India or Indonesia, there’s not many obese people also but I doubt the evacuations would be as successful as the Japanese.
You still gotta be impressed by the discipline levels of the Japanese. Japanese people tend to have a communal thinking rather than individualism.
No FFs worried about their bags full of 🍩
Read many comments on this. I am Japanese. Most of Japanese tried to survive NOT I , ALL OF US who including passengers, cabin attendants and pilot with helping each other. Be calm and following instruction by crew, we have leaned and be accustomed to do it is the best way to survive all of us. Because we have been facing a lot of natural disaster any time.
People from other countries should learn from you guys, good job.
Well said..
The culture of the Japanese society in being aware and then following orders is so unique. A great example in a very unfortunate incident.
The passengers were super calm .. and the evacuation was smooth as well
An 18 minute evacuation, according to another news source.
I saw a video showing passengers still in their seats while there was fire outside, seemingly waiting instructions, but then I realized that it is Japan, a highly disciplined and organized culture.
The Japanese are the most discipline and orderly people in the world .
That explains the suicide rates
@@WTC2014it does actually, the pressure of expectations for japanese social norms is not something everyone can handle
@WTC2014
日本よりアメリカの方が自殺率高いよ
@@WTC2014 You might be confused with South Korea? Japan’s suicide rate is ranked at the 49th in the world, according to WHO (2020). South Korea is #12, the USA #31, Belgium #35, India #41….etc. Still a big problem of course, but not a leading country in the world in that matter.
It was actually 18 minutes after the Collison and the start of the fire before the passengers were all off. The evacuation itself may have taken 90 seconds but that's the time it actually took. They were incredibly lucky to survive.
The Professor says a lot but as a European himself, he fails to mention something that's not typical in his culture but in Japanese culture. Most if not all of the passengers in this domestic flight are Japanese. As Japan is an earthquake-prone country, people there incl children in schools have been trained to be calm and composed when calamities happened. That's why you didn't see chaos in the plane, all in their seats awaiting for further instructions to ecavcuate. And when it evacuates, all know what to do and not like ants on hot wok flying in different directions, thus saving time and possible casualties. All planes are made by that 1 or 2 aviation companies, so what he has said is nothing exceptional. The difference is the composure and discipline of the Japanese passengers. Any other international airplanes with people all over the world in it would have been very different.
Crew are trained to evacuate passengers in 90 seconds with 8 doors (this aircraft)
So for the crew of this flight to successfully evacuate all passengers and crew in that time using less than HALF the exits is truly amazing!!This cannot be said enough and I truly applaud my fellow safety officers and the amazing passengers who listened to their crew's instructions!
And condolences to the family of the crew of the coast guard plane who lost their lives 🙏
no, only 4 doors permitted to certify.
Yes, all aircraft, 50% of all doors in 90 seconds.@@garymartin9777
Crew aren’t trained to evacuate in 90 seconds. Only manufacturer demonstrates .
At BA we were trained to get all pax off as quickly and safely as soon as possible. 90 seconds sounds good to me. Although I never did it for real, thankfully.@@youtubechangemynamewhy
Waiting 8 minutes doing nothing. Then evacuating in 10 minutes. That's a total failure. Just wait for official investigation results and you will see how they all screwed up big time.
Discipline, Obedience and Stop grabbing your belongings during this emergency.
I DONT CARE HOW DISCIPLINED OR OBIEADENT PEOPLE SEEM TO BE WHEN THEY ATRE TRAPPED IN A INFPORNO OF A AIRPLANE PEOPLE ARE PEOPLE AND WHEN THEY ARE TRAPED THEY PANIC END OF
Sounds like someone is already panicked even before boarding here
Except during the pandemic, I traveled to Japan more than twice a year on average. Most of the tie I flew either JAL or ANA. What always amazed me was that the Japanese carriers allocated only 30 minutes to board a 777, and 25 minutes of less for smaller aircraft. American carriers would require 45 to 50 minutes for a 777, and usually 40 minutes for small aircraft. Years ago I noticed how much more business-like the Japanese passengers when boarding planes overall. So it is not surprising to me that it took 379 souls to evacuate this plane in 90 seconds with only 3 of the 8 exits available.
Time everyone pay attention to safety presentation. Don't be selfish and think of oneself. The Japanese is exemplary.
90 sec is actually the common drill time to evacuate all the passengers after securing the exits. They say it took minutes to confirm and secure the safest three exits out of eight because they knew the high heat around the main wings whose jet engines were on fire.
I have seen videos of the Japanese passengers inside the plane. What is amazing though is that despite their panicks and fears, everyone remains in their seats while waiting for their turn to be evacuated. There is no rush to take their luggages and there is no rush to the exits. Everyone cooperated .So probably there is no blockage and stampede inside the airplane. So everyone can exit quickly.
I remembered seeing videos of Japanese queueing up in an orderly fashion when they are recieving aids during previous natural disasters. And was amazed at how orderly they are even in the midst of disasters.😮
The Japanese learnt that it is better for everyone to cooperate during disasters.
If this has happened in other countries, probably there will be many passengers attempting to take their luggages and rushing all together to the exits, creating a blockage at the aisles and the exits.
Our God is faithful
True, but there are a lot of differences.
- FIrstly the certification requires them to evacute in 90 sec from 50% of the exits (which on an A350 is 4 of 8 exits). In this evacuation they could only use 2 1/2 exit. They started the evacution only using the front 2 exits. Half way through they decided they could also open the back left exit. The 4 exits over the wings could not be used because this is where the fire was, and the back right exit was behind a running engine that was on fire.
- Secondly, the certification test is done with all adults, able bodied passengers, who knows the drill will start. I have seen these, and its almost like a sporting event with athletes sitting ready to run. Very far from a real life scenario. There is no children, no elderly, no undisciplined passengers going for their luggage, no high heels, no disabled, no families trying to stay together, no panic, no fire, no smoke etc. etc.
- Thirdly, this plane had a collapsed front wheel, which meant that the emergency slides did not work correctly. The front was too low to the ground the back was too high. THis meant that people could not slide down and clear the slide fast enough in the front, where most people exited.
Under these circumstances it is amazing they could do it in 96 seconds (assuming that reported figure is correct).
The Japanese trust their government and authorities to help them. Most countries know their authorities oppress them. Everyman for himself. But not in Japan. It wouldn’t happen in Europe or USA
I think they were told not to take baggage. I know at least that some passengers didnt have passports later.
JAL and ANA are still always my top choices 🙏amazing Japan🎌
Japanese people are very obedient and cooperative unlike American culture. The Japanese culture helped with this success.
As a Republican and proud NRA member, I must remind everyone who finds themselves in this position to be sure to get your overhead luggage prior to letting anyone pass you.
@@northernbohemianrealist1412 lol. educated cultured Americans with international experience will do just as fine, but in a US domestic flight I would be very concerned with the selfish Karens and other me first folks grabbing their luggage instead of just following instructions and escape asap. This JAL flight crew and the passengers both domestic and international did great. Saw storied from Japanese folks, 12 Australians, a Swedish kid, etc. Honestly the flight crew on that JAL flight are heroes and the passengers should give themselves a pat on the back for being good passengers. Yeah they may have lost some luggage which it gets compensated by the airliners anyways, but also ensured safety of all other passengers on the flight. Crazy start to 2024 for Japan, but glad all the passengers on that JAL flight survived. My deepest condolences for the 5 lives lost from the coast guard plane.
You’ve never been to China then. The locals in China can’t even get in and out of the train in an orderly manner. Can’t imagine the chaos that’ll ensue if they’re faced with critical situation like this.
exactly. if they were a bunch of entitled karens fighting over who goes out first, most of them would be barBQ.
🤣@@northernbohemianrealist1412
As someone said, it’s a survival of everyone mentality rather than I NEED TO SURVIVE / LIVE that helped everyone. Teamwork like. This needs to be modeled and be a benchmark for everyone to follow
I agree
That’s called Asian efficiency, the Japan once patched a huge earthquake sink hole within 12 hours.
It’ll probably take the Americans 12 months and $500 billion dollars to patch that same sink hole.
Not Asian, only Japanese. They are trained from young on disaster management
Only Japanese as I am Asian and knowing other groups never pay attention and very selfish.....this miracle only for the Japanese
@@souldoc70 Agree, only the Japanese
@@kwokmingng4548 Agree, only the Japanese.
Only Japanese. No way China or India.
It's their discipline that led to successful evacuation.❤
Japanese are disciplined and respectful.
Training, training, training and discipline. I remember the Air France crash in Toronto, in really lousy weather. The crew in the front office certainly did not win any price for airmanship, but the cabin crew, they managed to evacuate the whole plane at exactly the time limit set in training. Everyone were rain soaked but alive. I drove by at the time, and it was rare the rain was so heavy that many of us had to pull over the shoulder. One A 340 cooked well done. Most people do not know, that is the exact reason why the cabin crew are there, serving you drinks and meals are just a secondary duties.
90 sec for full plane is max survival rate on papers. But the efficiency of crew n cooperation of pax are crucial. Well done the Capt n do not take away credits from the cabin crew n the pax! Sukoi!!! Superb!
Sugoi NE!
i don't understand how can people compare drill time to actual emergency with a burning fire and smoke in front of you. Human behavior is so unpredictable in time of extreme distress such as this. I am sure all crew member were well trained. BUT I can guarantee none of the passengers ever went through a drill like this. This is nothing short of incredible and thank God for their safety.
I'm Japanese, well i wanna explain a bit…Japan is a country with a lot of volcanoes and earthquakes, and there are many difficult disasters, so we have repeated and thorough evacuation drills since we were in elementary school. We respond calmly, judge the situation silently, cooperate with the surroundings and help each other. It has been deeply penetrated into our culture for a long time as a common practice. I have received such strict training, so I will naturally help you even if there are foreign travelers nearby. It is very important for us to work together to help everyone. Thank you for your concern from people all over the world.
I bet they were told not to take any baggage and they listen. Culture has a lot to do with this. If this was an American, European or Chinese flight…. no question it would not be that way.
There was a British airways flight a few years back which had a fire on. May have been before takeoff not sure but everyone managed to get off safely but many passengers slowed evacuation down by grabbing hand luggage. It was the pilots final flight before retirement.
As a Republican and proud NRA member, I must remind everyone who finds themselves in this position to be sure to get your overhead luggage prior to letting anyone pass you.
If this was an American, European, Indian or Chinese flights it would be a different tale!
Right. Some people think compliance always goes against their 'freedom'.
@@northernbohemianrealist1412 So you're "anti-safety"?
90 seconds to evacuate 400 passengers is super amazing feat. Credits go the crews and the predominantly Japanese passengers who are well-disciplined. Had it been other nations the story would be different. Having been in Japan for few months, I could state this with conviction.
Other Countries need not to say.
we do not know how long the evac took for this incident. 90s is the safety requirement.
They didn’t do it in 90 seconds
I heard more like 5 minutes.
Bullshit lah no way it was all done in 90 seconds with 400 pax and 2-3 emergency exits.
They must have a had a guardian angel on board. Also that everybody stayed fairly calm and did the right thing. Most Japanese people are that way.
Yes, lucky not Singaporean 😂
You mean like the mostly Americans that also successfully evacuated onto the wings of USAir 1549 as they were sinking into the Hudson River?
That landing still fascinates me. They sure had guardian angels on board too. Most passengers were business travelers. I still can see all those people standing on the wings. Americans are helpful people who look after others and if they are able too, also help others.
Everyone is seated and not panicked, waiting for instructions? Amazing.
I'm Japanese, just wanna explain a bit…Japan is a country with a lot of volcanoes and earthquakes, and there are many difficult disasters, so we have repeated and thorough evacuation drills since we were in Kindergarten. We respond calmly, judge the situation silently, cooperate with the surroundings and help each other. It has been deeply penetrated into our culture for a long time as a common practice. I have received such strict trainings repeatedly, so I will naturally help you even if there are foreign travelers nearby. It is very important for us to work together to help everyone. Thank you for your concern from people all over the world.
the training of evacuation is one of the mandatory education in Japan. When I was in a primary school in Tokyo 35 years ago, we had the training 6 times a year (twice every semester). Since most casualties of the Tokyo massive earthquake in 1923 were burnt by the fire following the quake, kids were rather trained for the fire.
The lessons learnt from other fires were followed. Do not delay evacuation. Stop on the runway and immediately evacuate. You wait to see how bad it is, you try and move the plane, a lot of people will die. You need to stop asap, on the runway, and get everyone out immediately, and that's what they did.
But in this very film you can see they did delay the evacuation (not saying that is wrong). there was about 18 minutes of delay. Crash occurred at 5:47pm, firecrews arrived at 5.51pm, but evacuation was not completed until 6:05pm. they were assessing the safest evacuation routes, there was time to film the inside while sitting on fire raging outside. But all these comments about the "speed of evacuation" are missing that.
They were a mostly homogeneous group of Japanese citizens on board the Airbus A350. That means they live in a country where disasters from earthquakes, tsunamis, fires, and volcanoes are an everyday fact of life. They've trained their whole lives to respond instantly to emergencies because not to do so means one stands a much greater chance of dying.
When that burning plane that was rapidly filling up with smoke came to a stop, the emergency exits opened, and the slides deployed, the passengers INSTANTLY obeyed the cabin crew taking ONLY what was immediately on their persons with them. Each person saved their own individual life, as well as the lives of everyone else on board that night by not acting irrational, selfish, stupid, narcissistic, sociopathic, or psychopathic. They willingly left behind hundreds of thousands of dollars *(multiple millions of yen)* in clothing and personal possessions which if they had attempted to retrieve any of them would have spelled disaster and undoubtedly caused a huge bottleneck, thus causing a large number of people to die.
My gut tells me if this exact same scenario had occurred in the United States of America with the same age Airbus A350 aircraft, in the exact same condition, with the same environmental conditions, at night, with an American flight crew, and an all American passenger manifest, then at least one half of those in board would have died. Because there would be no less than 10% of the passengers who would disobey the flight crew in some fashion for totally selfish reasons and that lack of instant obedience would cost one hell of a lot of people to perish needlessly.
You mean like the mostly Americans that also successfully evacuated onto the wings of USAir 1549 as they were sinking into the Hudson River?
if I am a basic engineer, I can have a quick calculate 400 people need evacuate to 4 doors, front and back (2 doors at the winds couldn't use)., means 1 person per second. The last person ran is velocity by the half length of the aircraft divides by the time in 90 seconds, then you can see it is possible or not.
Since when child, Japanese people practice disaster and fire drills at least once a year, either at school, at work, or in large apartment complexes.
The three common rules for evacuation, called "Okashi", are as follows
Do not push other people(Osanai)
Do not run(Kakenai)
Do not talk(Shyaberanai)
Respect Japan ✊🏽
It seems they actually had more time than is being reported as it was 18 minutes before the last person was off. It’s amazing that the fuselage wasn’t ripped open given that it’s just gone through another plane. If it had and the fire was able to get inside immediately then I think we would be looking at a completely different outcome. Bravo to the plane designers.
Where’d you get the 90 seconds from? JAL said it took 18 minutes…..
Cabin crew move the passengers out efficiently...they deserve credit for making this happen.
I do not want to imagine what could have happened if it had been a flight from Beijing.
The best safety video japan airlines. Not a fancy safety video. Leave the baggage during evacuation. Only japan airlines explained need leave baggage. Video simple, serious and easy to understand.
Thank You And Congratulations #CNA For Sharing This News With Us All... #Yes #indeed.
Since birth they are told to be disciplined and follow the authorities and listen to them because they trust each other. Do I have to mention that there are 500 seismic jolts every day in Japan and people don't panic at all.
best crews in the world….period…
Cant wait to visit Japan. Was talking to a guy, he doesnt think American passengers would listen.
Because japanese people are disciplined, composed, and actually listen to the staff
Meanwhile in the US people would be running around in all directions before some of the flight gets killed
He takes the credit for her question 😂
The passengers know they will be compensated for loss of valuable, people are honest and companies are good.
The biggest problem is documentation like ID and passports which should always be on your person.
Yes, this accident will make people think and they should pack such that it does not become difficult to just escape, not caring for your luggage.
On a lighter note: it’s time to move to Japan 🇯🇵 seeing their abilities to save the people and people themselves able to follow the instructions and in the end coming out alive
Not all cultures are equal. Some are better than others and im saying this as a non-japanese
All passengers followed the instructions of the crew, abandoned their luggage and evacuated. The disciplined behavior of the passengers caused a miracle. Meanwhile, in the 2013 Asiana crash in San Francisco, many Chinese passengers ignored the instructions of the crew and fled with their luggage.
Fortunately, there were no passengers who prioritized their own luggage over other people's lives.
In the records, the conversations were conducted in aviation terminology using English, the dialogue between the Japan Coast Guard aircraft and the controller took place from 45 minutes and 11 seconds to 19 seconds.
The controller, after informing about the first departure scheduled among the aircraft near the runway with the term 'Number One,' stated, 'Proceed with ground movement to the position before the runway on taxiway C5,' instructing the aircraft to taxi to the stopping position on taxiway C5 just before runway C. The Japan Coast Guard aircraft acknowledged, 'Heading to the stopping position before the runway, C5. Thank you,' in response.
Runway C?
There should be an inquiry to the June 9th, 2023 collision between a Thai and EVA aircraft at Haneda. Japan aviation authorities still haven’t reported on the cause of that incident. The JAL 516 incident happened less than 7 months later.
A similar incident occurred in 2007 in Okinawa as CI120 and just like the recent Japan Airlines crash, everyone managed to evacuate just before the plane exploded in flames
Jeez,Just read Shawn's Bio, He's the safety expert's safety expert! The Japanese have the stereo type of being well disciplined - well if this is the outcome - then a trait that paid off. A remarkable outcome to an otherwise horrific alternative.
I think that in an emergency - any passenger who takes luggage should automatically void any insurance claim against the airline.
In fact, a first class passenger yelled, "Open the door quickly!"
In Japan, the dignity of wealthy people is inferior.
Did he mention at all the training the flight attendants go through in order to initiate a 90 second evacuation? Did he mention, like pilots, they are required to go through yearly training in order to maintain their certification?
It wasn’t 90 seconds.
That's how it supposed to be and thats what for all the drills are made in the first place. As well as a discipline of public and understanding of importance of evacuation procedures during an emergency. Not a a moment to reach for your luggage and stuff
Why did 379 passengers and crew of Japan Airlines survive?
That's because this was a domestic flight and most of the passengers were Japanese. Japanese people have been used to acting in groups since kindergarten, and evacuation drills are often held, just as Americans have been practicing evacuation drills for gunfights since they were children.
I'm sure in another country they wouldn't have left the airplane this fast.
Airbus Design. Japanese Crew. Disciplined Japanese Passengers.
The FAA does not get its information from the media professor.
The fact that while we saw the flame at the bottom of the ANA flight was intense when it landed, the passengers inside the cabin didn't experience thick smoke, as professor suggested, the light was still on, they probably didn't aware of the great flame below, so that they might not be so panicky, as might be in some other situation. All these added to the success of evacuation.
This accident shows the world how Japanese are disciplined.
You mean like the mostly Americans that also successfully evacuated onto the wings of USAir 1549 as they were sinking into the Hudson River?
I saw a JAL drama more than 10 years back. It showed how they conduct their trainings for their cabin crews. I am amazed the 90 second evacuation was actually executed. While I'm at it, the drama is called Attention Please. It's episode 3 for anyone interested.
It wasn’t
It is not the first «miraculous » evacuation .. in 2005 an Air France Flight in Toronto crash and all the passengers (more than 300 people) were evacuated in less than 90 sec … and no one died .. the plane was destroyed by the fire . Very bad weather and too short runway…
Flight attendants need to be thanked and respected !!
Beside the tragedy this will be a big investigation which gives a lot of information and new knowledge on how to deal with the latest generation of (partly) composite aircraft as far as rescue and firefighting concerns taking in account it took over 6 hours to extinguish the fire
The airport fire dept are called RFFS - Rescue and Firefighting Service because their priority is rescue. When they arrive at the scene they have to prioritise rescue over firefighting of the aircraft. Yes they will have to do some firefighting but that is to protect the evacuating passengers from aviation fuel on the ground and to protect the hull from fire to give the passengers time to get clear. They also may have to get on the aircraft to assist. With this particular incident there was another aircraft also on fire on another part of the runway so the fire trucks would have had to deploy to both thus splitting the available crews until further resources arrived form the Tokyo City Fire Service. This would have given the fire time to get a hold of the aircraft, once the rescue is complete then they can switch to defensive firefighting which is less of a risk to the firefighters. Why would they risk their own lives to put a fire out after all the passengers had been evacuated.
Probably AI should improve things in ATCs of the future. Not to do away with people in ATC, but to prevent mistakes by ATC guys and as an aid for them.
If it’s other Asian countries, definitely we will see panicking and chaos.
hugh respect to japanese
Haneda just admitted the taxiway stop lights were non functional. This was listed in NOTAM . . .
This reminds me of the LAX debacle with heavy landing on top of Skywest
I will only fly via JAL or ANA when I travel to Japan moving forward 😅
This is why I make sure I have my shoes on, and my essentials (wallet, passport, keys, phone) in my pockets when the plane begins it’s approach. I also mentally prioritize emergency exits…
I'd keep my luggage to a small carry-on. The major essentials like documents, money, plane ticket/itinerary, necessary meds and phone/laptop, in a front facing traveler's cross body sling bag I'd keep on my person. As well as keep shoes and jacket on at all times during flight. If I should have to evacuate a plane fast, I'd abandon the carry on but my essentials are already on my body safe and secure.
EXACTLY
The question is who was the in-charge of the control towers,??
seems like the control tower had given the right instruction though. the investigation says it could be due to misunderstanding from smaller plane side… but who knows. investigation is still ongoing so too early to say
the recording is fine except coast guard plane didn't read back or follow instructions
that's not really the question, but ok. Who was in charge at the time means nothing until we know what was said.
1 of 2 things likely happened:
1.) Dash 8 missed or misunderstood instruction to hold short of the runway. I suspect this is most likely given the timing.
2.) tower forgot they had someone (JAL) cleared to land or forgot they had the Dash in position and cleared JAL to land. JAL should have been cleared to land well before the accident happened though.
Very unlikely the JAL flight did anything wrong. I was ATC in the Air Force. That was almost 20 years ago soo yeah, not claiming to be an expert or anything but I certainly have experience here. Got out of the AF and started working airfield management.
Hope not cos imagine the guilt that pilot will feel if it was his mistake as everyone apart from pilot was killed on smaller planes pilot badly injured so may not be conscious yet but imagine how he will feel when he finds out.
Coast guard plane not given permission to proceed... Latest info.
this is where asia shines. there's a culture of the common good. sure, some countries aren't there yet, but it's in the root of our culture to know when to obey the authority
Only few asian has the discipline. Two asian countries with the biggest population certainly don't have it.
Not all of Asia, though. India and China passengers would be highly indisciplined and chaotic.
I remember my flights with India passengers (HK-India but transiting via KL or Singapore, hence the Indian passengers when I'm just flying HK-KL or HK-Singapore). They can't even comply with simple instructions like stow away your electronic devices.. or keep the tray table stowed away for takeoff and landing. When the seat belt signs came on, or when you're not supposed to go to the bathroom during turbulence, these people will still be walking everywhere with aplomb and even taking things in and out of their bags in the overhead compartment. Not sure if it's purely due to the lack of discipline, consideration and common sense, or if it's because of a language barrier.
definitely not where asia shines. only japanese
@@jswong8200yeah true. Honestly, Probably only the Japanese are this discipline. I've seen other Asians behaving as you have described too. I think it is this lack of care and 'I am an exception' attitude.
Definitely not China. Maybe Singapore can match. That’s that.
In US, instead of following instructions, passengers will try to practice their constitutional rights not to follow instructions and start a fight with the crew.
You mean like the mostly Americans that also successfully evacuated onto the wings of USAir 1549 as they were sinking into the Hudson River?
The media doesn't understand. The Japanese have a secret code, "Okashimo". If you cast this spell, the Japanese will forcibly line up.
This spell can only be used in an emergency. Japanese people cannot even notice that this spell has been used.
I heard that “OKASHIMO” thing! O, Ka, Shi, Mo are the first sounds of “don’t push, don’t run, don’t talk, don’t go back” if I remember correctly. All Japanese kids participate the evacuation drills often at schools with these words repeatedly taught. Maybe this is a part of the reason they were relatively calm while waiting for the instruction?
i feel like most of the people being interviewed about it, all those "experts" didn't even bother to listen to the ATC Audio.
Like..why does this guy actually question that JAL516 was on the correct runway? Dude.. it was. listen to the ATC and you would know.
"What could be implemented to prevent similar accidents to happen", she asks. She is a journalist /interviewer and need talking points, I understand that.
But it is already painfully clear the dash-8 where at a spot it was not cleard to be at. In other words this tragic event was all down to human error.
The dash-8 didnt read back its given instructions _and_ the tower didnt catch that, hence it didnt question why it didnt do so.
As long as there are humans involved, you can have as many systems in place you want. The human is sooner or later find a way around it.
That said, I am not willing to go on a flight with no humans at the controls.
It seems highly unlikely that the early report of a 96 second evacuation is correct. Who timed it?
The latest report is that the last occupant vacated 18 minutes after the accident.
Be careful of making absolute judgements from hearsay.
Maybe it was captured by the security cameras with time stamp? Or by the fire fighters? Or by checking the videos the passengers took?
The 18 minutes includes everything starting at the collision to the captain’s evacuation. It sounds like the “96 seconds” starts with the opening the exit doors or the slides deployment and ends the last person’s landing on the ground. It’s been really confusing about this…
@@Astrid-jx5dw
I think maybe it was the fog of early reports. I saw a video from a Japanese TV channel that superimposed a timer on passenger video. The evacuation seemed to start about six minutes after the collision and the passenger filming was out pretty quickly. Another report said the Captain did a walk through after and persuaded a last few panicked passengers to get out before exiting himself after 18 minutes.
Thanks Google Tranlate!😉
Because materials can be replaced, lives can not.
WAIT A MINUTE!! Sure, the evacuation itself went smoothly, but it took the flight attendants over 7 min. (after landing) to open the doors. Reason: intercom to cockpit failed. And since Japanese from early age are taught to wait for instructions from the top, nobody dares to makes decisions on their own.
It was only AFTER the entire pack shouted "open the door!!" that they did so, without further waiting for instructions. But those 7 min. could have been fatal. The entire plane could have exploded.
7 min. is far to long, and I believe that they were just lucky. Or else, a super guardian angel was at the site, just right in time......
No. They were assessing the surroundings to decide which exits to be used for the evacuation. There were 8 exits and 5 of them were unusable due to fire. One engine was still running (couldn’t turn it off). If you get to watch the full video of their 18 minutes until the evacuation, you could hear them checking outside and communicating without the intercom. You can’t just open the door and let people jump into the fire. Someone in other comment section said a big part of the survival rate depends on this decision.
And not “the entire pack” shouted open the door, and that’s not why they opened the doors. Have you really watched the videos?
And the attendants didn’t just wait for the direction from the captain. As soon as they realized the intercom wasn’t working, they immediately started the evacuation procedures by themselves.
It is not quickly, it is standard! From any full plane (with babies and disable persons on board) evacuation takes maximum of 90 seconds if half of exits are in use. If it is possible to use all the exits than no more than 45 seconds. All crews are trained for that.
Turns out they didn’t and it took 18 minutes to get the last person out. You need to update your story.
If it was an American plane, the first obstacle is the obese passengers with mobility issues. Japanese passengers by and large do not face this huge issue. Therefore they can move rapidly out of their seats and down the aisles to the emergency exits in a structured orderly manner as per their disciplined way of life.
Good point, seems to be a fairly young group of travellers as well.
In which case elderly, mobility challenged disabled people, parents with small childeren or obese people may have to either be required seated closest to the exit doors for fastest evacuation first or left for last so faster, more fit ones can exit fastest to save the most lives. Either way it appears discriminating to certain groups and does not please anybody who are the least bit selfish.
@@annecronin8339 Then I guess it boils down to whether an airline wants to be politically correct and avoid offending anyone, or if they'd prefer to keep casualties to a minimum in case of a mishap. Pretty hard to juggle both, honestly..
If this accident were to happen in any South East Asian country, the result will be totally catastrophic.
That is because the passengers are majority Japanese. If it happened to that big country...
In future, shouldn’t it be a crime for passengers to exit with their luggage, in an emergency. Good thing no one did here, but has happened in the past. Making it a crime would be a great way to stop people trying to take their luggage and so help to save lives.
One more feature should be added to the accident situations. All laggeges should be blocked on the shelves
I think it was a miracle that the fire was extinguished so quickly.I have a question. Was it possible to open the bulk in that situation? A cat and dog were killed.
The plane burned to the ground so it wasn't extinguished quickly.
I don’t think there was enough time for someone go to the cargo, get the carriers, and evacuate. After the captain checked the cabin and evacuated himself, I think there were only a few (at least less than 10) minutes until the entire plane got engulfed by flames.
Someone commented that you sign the waiver-type document at checking your animal in, and it says the animal could be left behind in case of emergency like this. So we need to really think what it could mean for animals to be checked in to the cargo in the first place. It’s not supposed to be a light, casual decision
Confucianism is one of the fundamental ideas of Japanese politeness. Confucianism stresses loyalty, justice, sense of shame, refined manners, modesty and honor among other values.
Bushido
Japanese are very orderly people....that may explain the fast exit.
That's just a generalization. Been to Japan and it can be disorderly, too. Like on packed trains in the evening hours. No breathing air at all, unreal. In this situation, they got their act together. Wonder how many evacuation slides went down and how many escape doors were shut and couldn't be opened or were not opened. If only one door was open to get out, the crew in front did a double-time good job with responding passengers running out without hesitation.
You mean like the mostly Americans that also successfully evacuated onto the wings of USAir 1549 as they were sinking into the Hudson River?
Its simply the japanese social discipline the make them survive the crash
I'd say that there are more. As he said things are getting much busier and the human brain is only equipped to handle so much. This, sort of thing, I fear, will happen much more.
I can only imagine the carnage if the flight had been filled with me-first Americans.
There are 4 runways at Haneda.
With that number of runways, I am surprised that they are duel using the runway for landing and taking off. I know with single runway airports they have no choice but with multiple runways they do. Also having different ATC Operators directing the same runway on different frequencies and in English & Japanese does not sound a good idea
pax were evacuated 18minutes after the crash.. are you kidding me?!
A lot of content of this CNA channel is copied/pasted from the Chinese 🇨🇳 SCMP channel. Why?
No permission for the Japan Coast Guard aircraft to enter. The Ministry of Land, Infrastructure, Transport, and Tourism has disclosed the communication records🙏🙏
Pure Negligence!
Mistakes happen
@@johnp139 Yeah Particularly in Japan people are overworked and tired. Risking others lives.
Avoid Air Travel in Japan!