If I remember correctly, I believe the call was for a replacement for a sidearm for rear echelon troops. Much like the M1 carbine was designed to replace the 1911. Also, I believe the MP-7 also has a drop leg holster.
While I love the Zonda reference and how everyone is talking about that comparison... But, as an FYI the Zonda is made by Pagani and not Koenigsegg. Both Unobtainium in the car world, but very very different companies lol
I don’t get why people like to compare the p90 to the 556 round. It was never meant to replace an infantry rifle it was made to compete with 9mm sub machines guns and the 5.7 outperforms 9mm in every way. It was meant for people who use their hands for other things like a pilot or tank crew as a last ditch weapon.Look at the Fort Hood shooting everyone that got hit center mass is dead and that was with the pistol. The 5.7 shoots like a laser beam. Two operators with the same skill level one armed with a handgun and the other guy with the p90 I’m putting my money on the latter.
@@wilemelliott You can also have a P90 magazine inserted in the weapon with the bullets facing up. Certain deployments where you do not have a magazine in the weapon but require you to carry one with you at all times. This is very convenient
My understanding was that neither one of these were meant to replace a main fighting rifle. They're pdws and specialized in their application from the day they where designed. Dont understated why they are comparing it to 556 and .308
4.6 and FiveSeven were meant to be pistol and submachine gun rounds. Not to be compared with the shells for frontline battle rifles. That would be like comparing a Mk 19 grenade launcher to a 40 mm Bofors antiaircraft weapon and saying, "the Mk 19 sucks!"
I’m a p90 fanboy ever since I’ve been into guns, it’s been my holy grail gun and I love shooting it and using it, love the ergo and everything. (Coming from an HK fanboy who’s edc is a USPc)
Again same. I'm primarily a WW2 NFA collector, but the P90 is probably the one modern gun I most want. I really need to get a PS90 w/ ring sight to SBR now that 5.7 ammo prices have dropped a bit.
The kid in me playing CS:GO back in the day really wants both of these guns. The stargate fan in me really wants a P90. Practically speaking I have no reason to own either of these guns but that’s not going to stop me from owning one some day. Beautiful video guys.
I think for the role these guns have picked up in PSD’s and such they fill a hole between pistols and rifles. Small enough to keep under a correctly sized (for the job) suit coat then being able to dump rounds into the specific threat. Outside of PSD and beating soft armor neither the other of them really seem to have a purpose
I like that you're still rocking the PIG gloves. Love the pair I got based on your video. Took a turkey a couple weeks ago while wearing them Also MP7 all day every day
its probably an old and very often shot gun so tha platic charging handle has lost a bit of its "gripping" force if you know what i mean. normally it shloudnt do that. and in other videos of people shooting the gun you also cant see this. repacing the charging handle should fix that for a couple 10k rounds.
Most videos comparing these two favor the MP7 but we should remember that it came out 11 years after the P90. Having that time to see what your only competitor for that NATO contract had done gave them a serious advantage in terms of knowing what things to do better. And yet when trials were actually held those decision makers couldn't agree that the MP7 was better. It shows how good the P90 is (relative to NATO's original request) that HK couldn't dramatically improve on it over 11 years of development.
I’m curious why you say that I can’t imagine it being a Better option slower reloads seems like it would be bad. 50 rounds is fucking amazing but it’s easy expend that in a stressful scenario.
@@zackzaney5563 I specially said it’s better for MOUNTING ACCESSORIES. The MP7 has full picatinny rail on its top, allowing more space for lasers, low profile lights and different optics rather than a red dot. The P90 reloading from the top leaves a very small portion of picatinny available in the front that it’s not suitable for optics that larger or have eye relief, like prism optics.
It's not a myth even with green tip it takes a lot with 556. We shot one guy over 70 times point blank as he was placing a IED and sure he was down eye balls blown out and fucked up but not dead. However once we started using Black Hills 556 given to us by CAG we started dropping targets far faster but still always put at least 5 in them that's why I always train by putting 3 to chest 2 in head. I also have never fired full auto once with my rifle in theatre and I always tell people that who love these binary triggers and they look at me like I am a fool. Anyways just some actual experience talking.
Good stuff! Greatly appreciated the perspectives especially regarding the ergonomics of use. I became interested in the P90 from TV/movies but I didn't give as much thought to reloading and non-pointing hand position. Thanks!
@@J3o3 9mm has been running a dollar a round in most places. The shitty blue box 5.7 has ALWAYS been more expensive than 9mm by a factor of 2. The 5.7 ammo I bought was SS190 which is restricted to governments only (penetrates 3 layers of any soft body armor). I was more than happy to pay that price in these times.
@@J3o3 That price would make me cream my pants. I have NEVER seen SS197 below $65 a box. It s usually $100 a box. Fuckin ridiculous. Right now SS190 is $10/round.
Awesome comparison video. I have been researching the histories of the P90 and was interested to see the two rivals go head to head. Germany vs. Belgium.
These guns are niche, suitable for police, body guarding and undercover where you are moving in and out of cars all day, in the past those units choose 9 mm which doesn't over penetrate but is unsuitable now because attackers have body Armour. P90 and MP7 will get through modern body Armour and that's why the Mexican cartel likes to use the five seven. As for the 5.56 it's been proven time and again to be an insufficient round by both front line troops and special forces as it doesn't have enough mass, neither does the P90 or MP7 round of course but the PDWs are designed to dump rounds at close range and are very lethal at that range. The P90 or MP7 though isn't meant to replace the 5.56 because it's really only a short range round, 6.8 mm or 7.62 mm is a more suitable round to replace 5.56. If you were to go into battle you might choose P90 or MP7 for areas where over penetration is a concern and your opponents might be armored, and if you were fighting in the open at medium to long range as a regular soldier or special forces you might choose 6.8 mm or 7.62 mm.
I think it is pertinent to compare the mp7 with collapsed stock to the FN P90. The goal of choosing either is to bring a compact weapon that is better than a pistol. Otherwise anyone would choose a rifle.
P90 because 5.7 > 4.6 and it’s more compact and efficient bullpup design. Both are made to penetrate armor, but 5.7 is the cartridge that NATO approved OVER THE 4.6, so the MP7 while loved by HK fan boys is just not the one to go for over a P90.
i think i'd prefer the 5.7 too, but for reasons like bullet availability, lower pressure nature etc. that said, the 4.6 appears to be a tad more potent on paper, though my reloading software does not support the numbers for some reason. see how the 4.6 duplicates the 5.7 velocities with the same bullet weights (higher sectional density), even tho the P90 has a 50% longer barrel?
@@davidh9659 Their honestly VERY similar ballistically to each other and both are actually kind of shit at going through armor even at closer ranges. And while we can talk about what’s the better round all day I’m still choosing the one that can put the larger diameter hole while also performing the same function of punching the hole through soft armor and doin damage. Also a bullpup style with more rounds in the way it’s magazine works is my style. The P90 was always far ahead of its time and the superior gun but you can’t please HK fan boys with anything else but the MP7
That guy on the left loses credibility with his magazine conversation. There are guys that can use speed loaders and change out all 7 rounds in a revolver just as fast as somebody can do a magazine change. The fact that he's complaining about using two buttons versus one button when it's a pinching motion? And he brought up that you need to use your non-shooting hand to change the magazine, well you have to change the magazine using your hand on any firearm. He clearly has a bias that he cannot get over and he's not making great points trying to discredit the firearm that he is trying hard to discredit. Yes, it is a couple inches longer than the other magazine, but it also holds a lot more rounds. I'll take a 22 inch 5.7 green tip that can hold 50 and is 30% lighter than an AR holding 30 and is almost twice the length.
"Don't know anyone who went full auto in his career." These guns weren't originally built for "Operators" doing night raids in a "war on terror"-scenario. They were meant for a full-scale war against the USSR and to replace pistols and submachine guns carried by personnel that would carry those as their primary weapons. Meaning people who would only need to really use them if they had to abandon their tank mid battle, for example. If you just look at Ukraine, how eyelevel infantry vs. infantry really looks, full auto IS going to be used at some point. If only to establish fire superiority. Again, we're speaking normie soldiers and conscripts, probably specialized on operating a Leopard 2 and not infantry combat, finding themselves in the midst of two combined arms engines colliding. I heard a lot about veteran special forces volunteering to Ukraine not finding the war to correspond to their previous experiences. Rarely to never US-soldiers, much less special forces, find themselves on the receiving end of airstrikes and MLRS barrages. That said, the originally intended scenario did not play a role for these weapons until now, so the criticism regarding their use in US 1990-2021 context is still relevant. Just wanted to point out that the target audience here was 19 year old european conscripts who got their tank shot off under them in WW3. So probably best viewed in comparison to pistol calibers smgs and 9mm pistols.
Some manufacturer should chamber something with the form factor of an MP7 in 5.7x28 or 9mm. it would be one heck of a PDW/truck gun/ranch gun/small game gun.
It is intellectually dishonest to compare a 5.7x28 to a rifle round. The PDW concept was always intended to replace handguns and SMGs, and that is what it needs to be compared to. The terminal effect of 9mm ball isn't that outstanding either, and it doesn't penetrate soft body armor, nor have the trajectory to reach out 150 to 200 yards. If you compare the P90 and the 5.7 cartridge in the role it was intended to fill, similar to that of the M1 Carbine, as a replacement for the handgun that offered more firepower and capabilities for troops in the rear and those frontline troops needing something very compact and lightweight, like certain airborne or mechanized troops, and consider it has been adopted by over 40 countries, it was absolutely successful.
A 9 mm is a bigger diameter bullet. This has some implications, you have more design-options with bigger bullets , like for instance the russian designs with a mantle, some plastics and a penetrator core. Pretty good against unprotected areas and still light and able to penetrate vests with the core. Pretty decent benchmark. Standard 9 mm ball ammo, well the only thing I can see it fit for is with the MP5SD.
Is anyone else’s having a problem to where no one can hear what they are saying? I’ve tried to watch this on my phone, smart TV, and Ps5 and it’s the same on every one of them.
At 0:43, and again at 0:47, and 0:55, it looks like the charging handle is blowing back. Is it supposed to do that? Looks kinda dangerous to teeth. heh
The sad irony of these beauties is, in today's world they are probably "obsolete" in their original intended role: there are ar15s that weight less than 6 pounds, short stock, 11inch barrels, compact enough and effective with the 5.56 rounds that makes you say "...why would I need something else? "
Have a PS90 and a RUGER 57 so you know my answer to this question. NATO tests found the FN 5.7 x 28 cartridge was better at the task than the 4.6. P90 magazines are LONG and can best be carried in chest mounted double mag pouches. I use "The Vest Guy" custom pouches on my vest. (Two double mag pouches = 4 mags)
These days with improved "near peer" body armor (mainly Chinese B.C Russians spend body armor budgets on mega yachts) it's the WOUNDING ability that is more important.
By constantly comparing these to ars, I think they kind of missed the point. But the argument has been kind of settled, NATO made their decision twice now.
Please, next time with video comparison like that show us more footage of a gun. I come for the MP7 pron and I have a feeling that You gave P90 more time on the screen.
Nowadays i feel like running a 6inch 7inch 300blk is a much better option in terms of a subgun package. 30 cal bullet coming out of a super short barrel when you have subs and a suppressor its super quiet, you can throw a law folder on it or get a folded up piston version, all while still maintaining m4 controls and manual of arms. Cant go wrong in terms of a subgun setup, id rather that then anything pistol caliber personally
Personally in the submachine or PPC class of firearms I wouldn't pick either as a first choice but if I had to choose one it will be the HK MP7 ... Good video 👍🏻
P90 is cool but I have no experience with the MP7 to do a comparison. I would think the P90 is better in around structures, doorways and other confined spaces. It also has the better round
Yeah the MP7 might be more ergonomic, more modern, lighter, faster, turns everything to gold etc... But I dare you to find somebody who owns an MP7 more often than one who owns a P90, semi auto or not ;]
@@alexc6582 the design of the P90 was so like a “space gun” + size form factor requirement for very compact / high capacity and ability to defeat level III / IV armor … it was so forward thinking (high capacity magazine as you would need a lot of rounds to mitigate threat(s)) then many could not see value added + a caliber most did not understand back then (SOF got it / conventional forces not so much). Flash forward 1st time I got to handle the MP7 suppressed (Thank you Norwegian SOF) as their PSS personnel put it very small form factor - small w/plenty of punch and they could conceal very discreet. He put best what I could not put into words all those years ago - fully develop the cartridge and what it must do - can do - and if you get dual purpose … that’s just the cherry on top - design of weapon platforms will then go beyond what any end user will have thought thru (HK MP7 imagine if we had that instead on the P90 1st where the MP7 would be today). Or analogy I like to use: Drove a Audi RS4 when I owned a M3… the Audi is what I wish my M3 could have grown up to be 😀
@@davedave2941 Trying to find 5.7in the US, you may as well be looking for diamonds at $2/round. 4.6? You're looking for unobtanium at the most ridiculous prices I can possibly imagine. Not to mention the 5.7 outperforming 4.6 in trials. Plus a pistol chambered in the same caliber? We know the winner.
Nice vid, Nice content! These two PDW are very interesting, and the 4.6 and 5.7 cartridges are pretty effective. I was lucky to have been able to fire the HK MP7 and the P90, and i prefer the MP7. The P90 and the 5.7 bullet is nice, but to my mind, the P90 is very weird looking, and the firing position with is not intuitive as the MP7 for me, it’s not my thing. However, tastes are subjective about the look of course. Apart from that, i don’t like the feeling of the P90, no ajustable stock like the MP7, and there is not so much room for my weak hand. You can ad a lot of things to the MP7 : PEQ/DBAL/Lights/Optics…is very modular, plug and play like an AR (almost). You can do the same with the upper Picatinny rail with the P90, but not so easily on the side, some versions do not necessarily have Picatinny on the side… The Picatinny space in general on the P90 is smaller than the MP7 with it’s possibilities. And finally, for a concealed carry PDW for a specific task, the MP7 is more compact, it looks like a big handgun when the stock is not deployed !
I honestly think both guns are better suited for a civilian self defense/personal defense role than a military role. A PDW like the MP-7 makes a lot of sense in a home defense roll given the small size, light weight, light recoil, lower blast, and good capacity. You give up terminal ballistics to get all of that of course when compared to a typical 5.56 carbine.
Who in the sweet f*ck are the 2 “people” that already did “not” like this video? For Sh*t’s sake we have two of the arguably coolest sub guns on the market and and they shoot them… , Just watch the video assholes it’s cool!!! Just ahhh dismiss practically, money and effectiveness aside. 🥸
Would loose some velocity in the short platform. Also, you'd probably have to redesign the grip/magazines since the 5.7 is longer overall. 4.6 in a 10"+ barrel would rock though, most certainly.
The P90 was very effective in taking down Goa’uld
It’s true
True, there is no clear winner, as you can just drop a conversion kit on an AR for 5.7 and get a good, ergonomic effect, along with a strong round.
Bravo. They will need hollow point rounds for the Wraith
So was the MP5
And Trees 🌴
If I remember correctly, I believe the call was for a replacement for a sidearm for rear echelon troops. Much like the M1 carbine was designed to replace the 1911. Also, I believe the MP-7 also has a drop leg holster.
Fn p90 for the win
Me: Uses 6.8x51 SPC Sig Sauer Gun*
*hehe boi*
Yes 👍
While I love the Zonda reference and how everyone is talking about that comparison...
But, as an FYI the Zonda is made by Pagani and not Koenigsegg. Both Unobtainium in the car world, but very very different companies lol
Yep I had a flub
3:58 video starts
Thanks fartsniffer
I don’t get why people like to compare the p90 to the 556 round. It was never meant to replace an infantry rifle it was made to compete with 9mm sub machines guns and the 5.7 outperforms 9mm in every way. It was meant for people who use their hands for other things like a pilot or tank crew as a last ditch weapon.Look at the Fort Hood shooting everyone that got hit center mass is dead and that was with the pistol. The 5.7 shoots like a laser beam. Two operators with the same skill level one armed with a handgun and the other guy with the p90 I’m putting my money on the latter.
P90 because ammo availability and pistol that shoots the same ammo
Perfect pear
also the mag doesn't stick out the bottom making it more awkward to carry under a jacket in a PDW rig.
@@wilemelliott
It's easier to reload the P90 in the prone position because of its top-down Bullpup orientation
@@wilemelliott
You can also have a P90 magazine inserted in the weapon with the bullets facing up. Certain deployments where you do not have a magazine in the weapon but require you to carry one with you at all times. This is very convenient
the MP7 is basically a pistol...
Both guns are amazing but we all know the MP5 is the big daddy
MP5 and MP7
MP5 is a 9mm MP, MP7 and P90 are 4.7 and 5.7mm PDWs.
Less velocity = better
@@M33t3y that depends on the purpose. The MP7‘s 4.7mm high velocity rounds can penetrate all body armors, the 9mm rounds can’t.
@@venkmanny4100 all body armours? thats not true
The charging handle kn the MP7 reciprocates?!
It’s a quirk
My understanding was that neither one of these were meant to replace a main fighting rifle. They're pdws and specialized in their application from the day they where designed. Dont understated why they are comparing it to 556 and .308
4.6 and FiveSeven were meant to be pistol and submachine gun rounds. Not to be compared with the shells for frontline battle rifles. That would be like comparing a Mk 19 grenade launcher to a 40 mm Bofors antiaircraft weapon and saying, "the Mk 19 sucks!"
yea, its a perfect first contact gun ... and the 338 or 6,5 on your back ...
I’m a p90 fanboy ever since I’ve been into guns, it’s been my holy grail gun and I love shooting it and using it, love the ergo and everything. (Coming from an HK fanboy who’s edc is a USPc)
Same. Just got one 2 days ago. Its so ugly is beautiful.
Again same. I'm primarily a WW2 NFA collector, but the P90 is probably the one modern gun I most want. I really need to get a PS90 w/ ring sight to SBR now that 5.7 ammo prices have dropped a bit.
The kid in me playing CS:GO back in the day really wants both of these guns. The stargate fan in me really wants a P90. Practically speaking I have no reason to own either of these guns but that’s not going to stop me from owning one some day. Beautiful video guys.
Thanks my dude
I think for the role these guns have picked up in PSD’s and such they fill a hole between pistols and rifles. Small enough to keep under a correctly sized (for the job) suit coat then being able to dump rounds into the specific threat. Outside of PSD and beating soft armor neither the other of them really seem to have a purpose
neither dump enough energy to effectively fill any other role
I like that you're still rocking the PIG gloves. Love the pair I got based on your video. Took a turkey a couple weeks ago while wearing them
Also MP7 all day every day
Still my go too gloves 90% of the time
Hunting is gay
7:09 Dude is unwilling to be gay with his homies. A clear sign he's sus.
WTF is up with the MP7 charging handle constantly YEETING out and back again while firing on auto?
That’s normal
Quirk of the platform
It comes loose but it isn't reciprocating. It's really not that big a deal
its probably an old and very often shot gun so tha platic charging handle has lost a bit of its "gripping" force if you know what i mean. normally it shloudnt do that. and in other videos of people shooting the gun you also cant see this.
repacing the charging handle should fix that for a couple 10k rounds.
But which one is better for shooting through hostages?
You should ask a Russian operator
@@Dreadnought-415 I did, I asked Jake the Speztnaz Hostage Remover.
Haha
Jake has legit experience schwaking hostages
🤣🤣🤣 here in Gotham, we have been more successful with the p90.
Smart guy makes the point. 55.6 is better that either. But he really should be saying both of these are superior then .45 or 9x18 pistols.
Most videos comparing these two favor the MP7 but we should remember that it came out 11 years after the P90. Having that time to see what your only competitor for that NATO contract had done gave them a serious advantage in terms of knowing what things to do better. And yet when trials were actually held those decision makers couldn't agree that the MP7 was better. It shows how good the P90 is (relative to NATO's original request) that HK couldn't dramatically improve on it over 11 years of development.
FN for the win
I like the P90 better, it's more compact with the same barrel lengths, it holds more rounds, the reloading is just something you'd have to practice
The Mp7 definitely takes the cake when it comes to mounting accessories
p90 for cqb for sure
I’m curious why you say that I can’t imagine it being a Better option slower reloads seems like it would be bad. 50 rounds is fucking amazing but it’s easy expend that in a stressful scenario.
@@zackzaney5563 I specially said it’s better for MOUNTING ACCESSORIES. The MP7 has full picatinny rail on its top, allowing more space for lasers, low profile lights and different optics rather than a red dot.
The P90 reloading from the top leaves a very small portion of picatinny available in the front that it’s not suitable for optics that larger or have eye relief, like prism optics.
I've been waiting for this video since y'all teased it in the P90 vid. Thank y'all for the great content
Our pleasure
How the heck did you get that surefire flash hider on that p90? nice vid man
It's not a myth even with green tip it takes a lot with 556. We shot one guy over 70 times point blank as he was placing a IED and sure he was down eye balls blown out and fucked up but not dead. However once we started using Black Hills 556 given to us by CAG we started dropping targets far faster but still always put at least 5 in them that's why I always train by putting 3 to chest 2 in head. I also have never fired full auto once with my rifle in theatre and I always tell people that who love these binary triggers and they look at me like I am a fool. Anyways just some actual experience talking.
P90 over the MP7
P90 has a longer barrel in a Bullpup configuration, it has a bit more range and punch and 10 more rounds..
These are probably number 1 and 2 on my holy grail guns list! The NFA really needs to go away. Great video, as always guys!
I’m right there with ya
Good stuff!
Greatly appreciated the perspectives especially regarding the ergonomics of use.
I became interested in the P90 from TV/movies but I didn't give as much thought to reloading and non-pointing hand position.
Thanks!
The P90 is a close combat police/swat gun, 99% of the time they don't shoot more than one mag. It's so compact that it wins every time.
OMG all that 5.7 ammo...these guys must had to take a second mortgage to do this episode
Or third
@@1911syndicate Just blew 1k on 500 rounds. RIP my bank account.
@@J3o3 9mm has been running a dollar a round in most places. The shitty blue box 5.7 has ALWAYS been more expensive than 9mm by a factor of 2. The 5.7 ammo I bought was SS190 which is restricted to governments only (penetrates 3 layers of any soft body armor). I was more than happy to pay that price in these times.
@@joekeil954 well yeah ss190 is usually 250 a box but blue tips ( ss197) should only be 25 dollars a box max
@@J3o3 That price would make me cream my pants. I have NEVER seen SS197 below $65 a box. It s usually $100 a box. Fuckin ridiculous. Right now SS190 is $10/round.
Love it when you guys bring Jason in on the video, always drops some real knowledge. Keep the videos coming.
Thanks man we are fortunate to call him a friend. A very knowledgeable, skilled, bad ass friend.
This is the last time you’ll see him for a while
This comparison will be very interesting, interested in seeing how they perform, the test you guys do and where the both of these stand respectfully
You should expect less. It’s more of a discussion
@@1911syndicate ah I see, but still interesting to see not many guntubers discuss the two they will say one or the other and which they prefer
Zonda was a great analogy. I just started rewatching S1 of Top Gear. Amazing car from a no name company.
Pagani’s made a name for themselves with the Huayra. They’re making some strides I hear.
Why’d y’all reverse the brands lol next they gonna the Sig 416 vs HK MCX
Awesome comparison video. I have been researching the histories of the P90 and was interested to see the two rivals go head to head. Germany vs. Belgium.
I'm just thinking that's like $200 a mag for the mp7 and $70 a mag for the ps90, thrse ammo pricing
It was thrilling and sad
Before the pandemic hit, it was only 24$ a mag, now it's 40$.
These guns are niche, suitable for police, body guarding and undercover where you are moving in and out of cars all day, in the past those units choose 9 mm which doesn't over penetrate but is unsuitable now because attackers have body Armour. P90 and MP7 will get through modern body Armour and that's why the Mexican cartel likes to use the five seven. As for the 5.56 it's been proven time and again to be an insufficient round by both front line troops and special forces as it doesn't have enough mass, neither does the P90 or MP7 round of course but the PDWs are designed to dump rounds at close range and are very lethal at that range. The P90 or MP7 though isn't meant to replace the 5.56 because it's really only a short range round, 6.8 mm or 7.62 mm is a more suitable round to replace 5.56. If you were to go into battle you might choose P90 or MP7 for areas where over penetration is a concern and your opponents might be armored, and if you were fighting in the open at medium to long range as a regular soldier or special forces you might choose 6.8 mm or 7.62 mm.
With 50 rounds in the p90 mag, your need to reload is nearly half. That pretty much makes up for the longer reloading time.
if im not wrong the hk also made a 40 round mag for the mp7
@@BB05151 Correct. But that hurts my autism because it fires 3 round bursts.
Couldn't they have made 42 round magazines instead?
@@Simon-hd6dc the mp7 doesn't fire 3 round bursts, single fire or full auto
Do an update in both calibers from cmmg.
Meh
Natos goal was NOT to pierce body armor, it was to replace 9mm plain and simple. They had a CRISAT plate as part of the test simply to exclude 9mm
The MP7 is just HNGGGGGG
Which is feels good, these two guns or new army Smg apc9k in terms of ergonomic?
Def not P90 for ergonomics. If you’re a die hard AR guy, B&T ergos will be closest
@@1911syndicate thanks
I think it is pertinent to compare the mp7 with collapsed stock to the FN P90. The goal of choosing either is to bring a compact weapon that is better than a pistol. Otherwise anyone would choose a rifle.
P90 because 5.7 > 4.6 and it’s more compact and efficient bullpup design. Both are made to penetrate armor, but 5.7 is the cartridge that NATO approved OVER THE 4.6, so the MP7 while loved by HK fan boys is just not the one to go for over a P90.
the MP7 is the way more compact gun... also the MP7 is a way better pistol replacement
Me: Uses 6.8x51 SPC Sig Sauer Gun*
*hehe boi*
i think i'd prefer the 5.7 too, but for reasons like bullet availability, lower pressure nature etc.
that said, the 4.6 appears to be a tad more potent on paper, though my reloading software does not support the numbers for some reason.
see how the 4.6 duplicates the 5.7 velocities with the same bullet weights (higher sectional density), even tho the P90 has a 50% longer barrel?
@@davidh9659 Their honestly VERY similar ballistically to each other and both are actually kind of shit at going through armor even at closer ranges. And while we can talk about what’s the better round all day I’m still choosing the one that can put the larger diameter hole while also performing the same function of punching the hole through soft armor and doin damage. Also a bullpup style with more rounds in the way it’s magazine works is my style. The P90 was always far ahead of its time and the superior gun but you can’t please HK fan boys with anything else but the MP7
That guy on the left loses credibility with his magazine conversation. There are guys that can use speed loaders and change out all 7 rounds in a revolver just as fast as somebody can do a magazine change. The fact that he's complaining about using two buttons versus one button when it's a pinching motion? And he brought up that you need to use your non-shooting hand to change the magazine, well you have to change the magazine using your hand on any firearm. He clearly has a bias that he cannot get over and he's not making great points trying to discredit the firearm that he is trying hard to discredit. Yes, it is a couple inches longer than the other magazine, but it also holds a lot more rounds. I'll take a 22 inch 5.7 green tip that can hold 50 and is 30% lighter than an AR holding 30 and is almost twice the length.
.300 Blk up to .338 Lapua against body armour?
MP7 All the way!!!!!! and yes i'm a HK fan boy..............
Would it be risky to buy a PS90 due to the ammo? What I mean is will 5.7 be around for the foreseeable future?
I think it’s valid. Buy a lotta ammo if you do
"Don't know anyone who went full auto in his career."
These guns weren't originally built for "Operators" doing night raids in a "war on terror"-scenario. They were meant for a full-scale war against the USSR and to replace pistols and submachine guns carried by personnel that would carry those as their primary weapons. Meaning people who would only need to really use them if they had to abandon their tank mid battle, for example.
If you just look at Ukraine, how eyelevel infantry vs. infantry really looks, full auto IS going to be used at some point. If only to establish fire superiority.
Again, we're speaking normie soldiers and conscripts, probably specialized on operating a Leopard 2 and not infantry combat, finding themselves in the midst of two combined arms engines colliding.
I heard a lot about veteran special forces volunteering to Ukraine not finding the war to correspond to their previous experiences. Rarely to never US-soldiers, much less special forces, find themselves on the receiving end of airstrikes and MLRS barrages.
That said, the originally intended scenario did not play a role for these weapons until now, so the criticism regarding their use in US 1990-2021 context is still relevant. Just wanted to point out that the target audience here was 19 year old european conscripts who got their tank shot off under them in WW3. So probably best viewed in comparison to pistol calibers smgs and 9mm pistols.
Whatever happened to the kac pdw?
🤷🏼♂️
Tommy built needs to get on the mp7
So which one is more accurate?
Some manufacturer should chamber something with the form factor of an MP7 in 5.7x28 or 9mm. it would be one heck of a PDW/truck gun/ranch gun/small game gun.
That HK whacking people in the face 😂
In East Germany, HK slappen you
Just a few love taps
It is intellectually dishonest to compare a 5.7x28 to a rifle round. The PDW concept was always intended to replace handguns and SMGs, and that is what it needs to be compared to. The terminal effect of 9mm ball isn't that outstanding either, and it doesn't penetrate soft body armor, nor have the trajectory to reach out 150 to 200 yards. If you compare the P90 and the 5.7 cartridge in the role it was intended to fill, similar to that of the M1 Carbine, as a replacement for the handgun that offered more firepower and capabilities for troops in the rear and those frontline troops needing something very compact and lightweight, like certain airborne or mechanized troops, and consider it has been adopted by over 40 countries, it was absolutely successful.
Me: Uses 6.8x51 SPC Sig Sauer Gun*
*hehe boi*
@@user-cv8xu2yk7m 6.8x51 has less than zero relevence to this discussion...
A 9 mm is a bigger diameter bullet. This has some implications, you have more design-options with bigger bullets , like for instance the russian designs with a mantle, some plastics and a penetrator core. Pretty good against unprotected areas and still light and able to penetrate vests with the core. Pretty decent benchmark. Standard 9 mm ball ammo, well the only thing I can see it fit for is with the MP5SD.
@@MTMILITIAMAN7.62 uhh yea! 6.8 is strong as heck.
@@user-cv8xu2yk7m Which is exactly why it has no relevence in a discussion about PDWs...
Is anyone else’s having a problem to where no one can hear what they are saying? I’ve tried to watch this on my phone, smart TV, and Ps5 and it’s the same on every one of them.
First I’ve heard of that
@@1911syndicate yea not sure myself what’s up with it as well, rest of the videos are fine. Oh well, thumbs up regardless haha
They made 9mm ap in the 90s it just washed very accurate beyond around 75yrds if I remember
Damn, you guys are killing it!
🤙🏻🍻
At 0:43, and again at 0:47, and 0:55, it looks like the charging handle is blowing back. Is it supposed to do that? Looks kinda dangerous to teeth. heh
03:36
Tactical disapproval from D man
Great Comparison! These are both interesting firearms, but I'd still take a Sig Rattler in 300BLK over both.
There’s some validity to that
Stopping Power 👅 lol 😂
The sad irony of these beauties is, in today's world they are probably "obsolete" in their original intended role: there are ar15s that weight less than 6 pounds, short stock, 11inch barrels, compact enough and effective with the 5.56 rounds that makes you say "...why would I need something else? "
Konigsegg Zonda??? Wooot 🤯
Have a PS90 and a RUGER 57 so you know my answer to this question.
NATO tests found the FN 5.7 x 28 cartridge was better at the task than the 4.6.
P90 magazines are LONG and can best be carried in chest mounted double mag pouches. I use "The Vest Guy" custom pouches on my vest. (Two double mag pouches = 4 mags)
there's more involved in nato tests than simply performance...
That's not what Nato tests found, they found the rounds are overall equal with the 4.6 having better penetration and the 5.7 better wounding
You are correct but OVERALL the 5.7 x 28 was preferred by NATO, and, I might add, by many police forces.@@E9X330
These days with improved "near peer" body armor (mainly Chinese B.C Russians spend body armor budgets on mega yachts) it's the WOUNDING ability that is more important.
By constantly comparing these to ars, I think they kind of missed the point. But the argument has been kind of settled, NATO made their decision twice now.
Is that ALI G in the blue jacket
Please, next time with video comparison like that show us more footage of a gun. I come for the MP7 pron and I have a feeling that You gave P90 more time on the screen.
Nowadays i feel like running a 6inch 7inch 300blk is a much better option in terms of a subgun package. 30 cal bullet coming out of a super short barrel when you have subs and a suppressor its super quiet, you can throw a law folder on it or get a folded up piston version, all while still maintaining m4 controls and manual of arms. Cant go wrong in terms of a subgun setup, id rather that then anything pistol caliber personally
I like all of them
Personally in the submachine or PPC class of firearms I wouldn't pick either as a first choice but if I had to choose one it will be the HK MP7 ... Good video 👍🏻
Love the ergonomics of the mp7 over the p90 though the 5.7 is a superior round in my opinion
European weapons for the win!
Very good explanations. I’ll keep my diamondback 57 and not worry about the ps90
For what it's worth, the Zonds was from Pagani not Koenigsegg.
P90 is cool but I have no experience with the MP7 to do a comparison. I would think the P90 is better in around structures, doorways and other confined spaces. It also has the better round
Better round in which way ?
The MP7 is my dream gun. I don't understand why they aren't available in a civilian version...
Complicated import things
@@1911syndicate I wonder if they will start. CMMG just released a 4.6 banshee.
@@1911syndicateHK doesn't need our money, so they aren't in a rush to give us new toys. Unfortunately.
The koenigsegg zonda… you were close 😂
Yeah the MP7 might be more ergonomic, more modern, lighter, faster, turns everything to gold etc...
But I dare you to find somebody who owns an MP7 more often than one who owns a P90, semi auto or not ;]
MP7 is just sexier. And the 5.7 armour piercing rounds are a bitch to source.
wtf clickbaited me? thought you guys were going to have a gun fight
Aw, guys! You remembered my birthday.
Who?
I still think a 5.5” 300Blackout, like the rattler, is still superior to either of those space gats. Fight me
1st saw / handled P90 on 1993 - hands down would take the MP7 over it as a PDW
How come
@@alexc6582 the design of the P90 was so like a “space gun” + size form factor requirement for very compact / high capacity and ability to defeat level III / IV armor … it was so forward thinking (high capacity magazine as you would need a lot of rounds to mitigate threat(s)) then many could not see value added + a caliber most did not understand back then (SOF got it / conventional forces not so much). Flash forward 1st time I got to handle the MP7 suppressed (Thank you Norwegian SOF) as their PSS personnel put it very small form factor - small w/plenty of punch and they could conceal very discreet.
He put best what I could not put into words all those years ago - fully develop the cartridge and what it must do - can do - and if you get dual purpose … that’s just the cherry on top - design of weapon platforms will then go beyond what any end user will have thought thru (HK MP7 imagine if we had that instead on the P90 1st where the MP7 would be today). Or analogy I like to use: Drove a Audi RS4 when I owned a M3… the Audi is what I wish my M3 could have grown up to be 😀
Me too, never held either.
@@davedave2941 the 5.7 beat the 4.6 though, so I wouldn't say that the Mp7 lethality is greater.. HK just vetoed it and no one won
@@davedave2941 Trying to find 5.7in the US, you may as well be looking for diamonds at $2/round. 4.6? You're looking for unobtanium at the most ridiculous prices I can possibly imagine. Not to mention the 5.7 outperforming 4.6 in trials. Plus a pistol chambered in the same caliber? We know the winner.
Who uses a SiCO MAAD mount anymore? Apparently you never had a can fly off using one of them.
FNP90+ EOTECH VORTEX = BEST CQB AND WINNER
Gordon Freeman vs. COL Jack O'Neil
Good video boys 👍🏼
🍻
the p90 is still great at what it was design to do its 50 rounds you can keep stuck in your vehicle
Nice vid, Nice content!
These two PDW are very interesting, and the 4.6 and 5.7 cartridges are pretty effective.
I was lucky to have been able to fire the HK MP7 and the P90, and i prefer the MP7.
The P90 and the 5.7 bullet is nice, but to my mind, the P90 is very weird looking, and the firing position with is not intuitive as the MP7 for me, it’s not my thing.
However, tastes are subjective about the look of course.
Apart from that, i don’t like the feeling of the P90, no ajustable stock like the MP7, and there is not so much room for my weak hand.
You can ad a lot of things to the MP7 : PEQ/DBAL/Lights/Optics…is very modular, plug and play like an AR (almost).
You can do the same with the upper Picatinny rail with the P90, but not so easily on the side, some versions do not necessarily have Picatinny on the side…
The Picatinny space in general on the P90 is smaller than the MP7 with it’s possibilities.
And finally, for a concealed carry PDW for a specific task, the MP7 is more compact, it looks like a big handgun when the stock is not deployed !
MP7 all day
Oh thaz noize
Team gamer: mp7
Black Dragon Fang 5.7 or Elitle Ammunition T6 is the difference maker for that round. Otherwise your just high priced plinking.
I honestly think both guns are better suited for a civilian self defense/personal defense role than a military role. A PDW like the MP-7 makes a lot of sense in a home defense roll given the small size, light weight, light recoil, lower blast, and good capacity. You give up terminal ballistics to get all of that of course when compared to a typical 5.56 carbine.
Grabs popcorn.
Finally someone make this video!
Really cool channel and as a fellow larper I'll help with the sub count🔥
Cheers my friend
MP7 all day over the P90
I like the ps 90 and I’ve got 50 rounds a mag.
I like both of them. They are perfect in my opinion as PDW, but I LOVE P90!
Who in the sweet f*ck are the 2 “people” that already did “not” like this video? For Sh*t’s sake we have two of the arguably coolest sub guns on the market and and they shoot them… , Just watch the video assholes it’s cool!!! Just ahhh dismiss practically, money and effectiveness aside. 🥸
Lol people are funny man
The MP7 in 5.7, HK make this happen
Would loose some velocity in the short platform. Also, you'd probably have to redesign the grip/magazines since the 5.7 is longer overall.
4.6 in a 10"+ barrel would rock though, most certainly.
"I've never looked at a man and licked my lips in my entire life!" Um, ok...?