This is my third dual boiler machine, and despite not being the most expensive one it is my favorite. Having dealt with issues in the past, I like how solid and easy to work on this one is, and that stainless steel frame is really a nice bonus, I have had coated steel frames rust after 5 or so years. Add a flow control knob, and the sky is the limit. A very underrated machine.
@@Wholelattelovepage yep, quick mill was only really lacking in the aesthetics department, this one removes the ugly and keeps the good. Also, the steam wand stays notably cooler on this than on any of the 3 rockets I’ve owned that have all had no burn wands. I noticed quick mill has an extra silicone gasket on the inside of their steam tip that rocket does not have.
hi there, how is this one compare with the Profitec 600? as in the product quality, which one has a stronger milk steam? As I am base in Australia, I only can find the black one, just worry if the coated colour will get rust in years. Thanks!
@@Wholelattelovepage thanks Marc... Hope all is well. honestly hung up against Crem Profiler and the Lelit Bianca... been waiting for your video to drop to pull the trigger! :-)
I’ve owned the Vetrano Design for almost a year now and received the machine operating at just above 9 bar pressure when using a blank and real coffee puck. Should the pressure be adjusted this way? Or should I back it down to reach a max of 9 bar pressure on the gauge? I love this machine so far, just wondering where the pressure should be set at when it reaches its max pressure during a shot. Thank you so much for all of your wonderful videos on everything you guys sell, makes decision making much easier for me!
Hi d, Thanks for the kind comment, question and sharing your love and thoughts on the Vetrano Design. Your good set to 9 bar with blank inserted. Rotary pump machines like yours have higher flow rates at a given pressure than a vibration pump machine which we typically set at 10 bar with a blank in. In all machines there's a slight difference, a drop of pressure from what's on the machine gauge and the actual pressure in the portafilter during an extraction. That's because the tap for the pressure gauge is behind a one way valve in the hydraulic system and it can flow more water than is released as espresso. You could try turning up the pressure to 10 on the machine gauge with blank inserted, pull a shot and see if you taste a difference - I doubt you will but only one way to find out. Marc
Of course! Thank you so much for taking the time to answer my question! I’ve been searching what pressure rotary pumps should be set at and this answers my question. I will leave it set at just above 9 bar since that’s what tastes best to me after trying 10 bar a while back, I had also experienced channeling at 10 bar than at just above the line at 9 bar. Keep up the phenomenal in depth reviews, you do an awesome job Marc!! as well as the entire staff at WLL!!
Hey Mongoose, Thanks for the comment and question. Here's a link to a side by side spec comparison of the Vetrano Design and Duo MN: www.wholelattelove.com/pages/compare?products=NjU0MzAxMTI1MDIzMCwxNTQ2MDAxODc1MDAz Similar machines in many respects. Notes... Vetrano: Easier access to brew pressure adjustment, larger stainless steel boilers, simpler controls of PID. Duo: touchscreen control panel w/digital gauges, copper boilers, a little more complex under the hood, automatic pre-infusion cycle As to which I would prefer, it's a bit of a toss up. Slight edge to the Vetrano with the larger boilers and easy BP adjustment. Also, I have a minor aversion to touchscreen controls on a classic design espresso machine. Hope that helps! Marc
Hi Mark, I am new in the espresso machine world other than syarbuck for my cappuccino drink, I need your advice to what is the best espresso and coffee grinder machine to buy and where to buy it. I was looking for the Profitec pro 500 with the coffee grinder Eureka mignon specialita or the dual boilers Profitec pro 600 along withe Eureka mignon specialita. There is so much brand ou there like the Ecm Luca, Bezzera. Of course i have to watch my budget too. Please give some recommendations and advice. Thank You.
Is the main difference between this version and the 2B Evo on your site really just the outside aesthetics (less lights and etching) and the levers vs knobs?
Hi Marc. Would you guys consider doing a video comparison between the Pro 700 and the Quick Mill Vetrano? Would those be the two comparable models from each manufacturer?
Hi AA, Thanks for the request - I'll see what I can do for a comparison video. In the meantime, here's a side by side spec comparison of the machines: www.wholelattelove.com/pages/compare?products=NDgzMjYzMDYzNjU5OCwxNTQ1OTk3MzUzMDE5 I do have a bunch of existing videos on the Pro 700. Most recently is this extensive tour of internal components: ruclips.net/video/iKRWh4ophGE/видео.html I don't know how long it will last but there are currently some special offers on both machines. Marc
Hi Mark and WLL team, thanks for the detailed info. How do you compare this machine with ECM Synchronika. I have been thinking to buy Synchronika in June 2022 but am now considering Vetrano too. My impression is that it is almost identical with Synchronika and Profitec Pro 700, that is why I am interested in Vetrano. Moreover, it is priced cheaper than Synchronika and Pro 700 in my country. Thanks again.
Hi Marc! One general question in the context of another DB beauty with SS boilers. Why so many vendors switched from copper to SS boilers? I mean that steel is much more sensitive to chemical reactions that copper when it comes to descaling. From this perspective do you think it is easier to maintain SS boiler than copper one? Or the hidden idea is to replace the SS boiler instead of descaling copper one?
Hi PR, If fed with water that can cause scale any boiler regardless of metal type will scale. While copper was the traditional material for boilers I believe advances in manufacturing and materials made stainless boilers more practical. Stainless boilers can be descaled so there's no hidden agenda. Urnex which is the most well known descaling product manufacturer for coffee machines advises all of their descaling products are good to use in stainless boilers. For aluminum boilers they advise limiting contact time to 20 minutes when using their citric acid based descaling products. Marc
great video as always. I thought I had norrowed my pick down to pro 700 and the synchronika but now this looks very nice...between the veltrano, pro 700 and synchronika are they all just as quiet as one another or how would you rank them purely on how quiet they are? Thanks again
Hi David, Thanks for the comment and question. All 3 machines have rotary pumps so are very quiet - not much difference in sound level between them. Marc
An interesting review of this machine. It makes it quiet difficult to decide which espresso machine I'm going to buy. According to the reviews on your channel, my 3 favorite machines are: ECM Synchronika, Profitec Pro 700 and the Quick Mill Vetrano. Interesting of the Profitec that I can add a flow control afterward, or is this possible with all the machines? Another question I have regarding the Quick Mill, that you reviewed the machine with the joy-sticks. When I open the site of Quick Mill, there are knobs on the machine instead of the joy-sticks and I can't find the version you reviewed. Finally the main question: what's your favorite machine of the 3 I mentioned taking also the price into consideration? Thanks and good luck with your channel.
Hi Frank, The version of the Vetrano we have, the Vetrano Design is something we worked with QM on to customize. That's why it's a little different than what you see on their site. Of the 3 machines my favorite is the ECM Synchronika. Internally the Synchronika and Pro 700 are essentially identical. They are made by the same company. While both have excellent external finishing the Synchronika is nicer. I like the custom taper of its E61 group, Gauges up high for easy viewing, angled portafilters and exquisite finishing detail like chrome tips on levers and handles. If you purchase the Synchronika or Pro 700 from us without flow control you can upgrade down the road. Marc
I chose the Quick Mill over the ECM for the easy access boilers, fully stainless steel chassis, easy access pump pressure adjustment vs on the bottom and brass fittings vs the plastic ones on the ECM. Also didn’t love the zip tied capacitor on the ECM.
Hey FK, Thanks for the comments and request. I do not have a video with the machines side by side but here's a link to a side by side spec comparison: www.wholelattelove.com/pages/compare?products=NjU0MzAxMTI1MDIzMCwyMDM4MTQ2NzI3OTkw And here's a link to my video covering the Pro 700: ruclips.net/video/l54y-_Vx_ts/видео.html They are similar machines but I give an edge to the Pro 700 with its higher steaming power and currently available from us with a free flow control upgrade. Here's my video covering the R Cinquantotto (formerly R58): ruclips.net/video/Xjjzw7kMCU0/видео.html Hope that helps! Marc
@@sandyd4271 they are very sexy machines I have to admit! I’ve used the virtual thing that WLL has on their website with the appartamento and was obsessed with how it looks in my kitchen
Does the ECM Synchronika have the edge over the QM Vetrano in terms of parts & component quality? Both seems to be very similar in features and design.
Hi Paul, Thanks for the question. The machines are very close in component quality. I've always been a fan of ECM design but think in this case it comes down to your style preferences. With proper care and maintenance both machines should be very reliable. Marc
Hi Marc. A little unrelated but I currently have a Gaggia Classic Pro with breville smart grinder Pro- I feel this grinder is too inconsistent and want to upgrade. Which grinder would you recommend? For espresso only, as I will keep my Breville for drip/filter grinding Love your videos. Thanks Conor
Hi Conor I also habe the Gaggia classic pro in combination with a Eureka Specialità. You would probably also get good espresso with less than that but I think its better to have a better grinder than your machine... I know that many recommend the Baratza 270wi for the gaggia but in my opinion it’s better to spend a bit more and get the Eureka (what I did). Enjoy your coffee ☕️💪 Sandy
I have a GCP and recently sold my Vario and got a Eureka Silenzio. Would second Sandy's comment and recommend a Silenzio/Specilita. The infinite grind adjustment is great and it's a good looking grinder too.
Hey Conor, @Sandy D gives good advice. Grind is critical. Specialita is a good grinder and built a heck of a lot better than the SGP. But you get what you pay for. I've used the SGP in the past. It's def appliance grade with lots of (nearly all) plastic, clumpy grind at espresso sizes, rather slow and limited in precision of grind size adjustment. Sette is appliance grade as well and has some wear parts. That said we currently use one daily on the bar in the studio. It's weight based grinding is magical. Grind is fluffy and well distributed, it's very fast and kinda loud. It's also susceptible to static - particularly when new and when used in low humidity. It will eventually wear out but Baratza has great support and a fixed price repair program if you need it. Over in the lab I use a Ceado E37S when working with new machines. It's the grinder sitting next to the Vetrano Design in this video. It's big $$ but will likely still be grinding when I'm in the ground :) Grinder choice depends on your expectations, budget and future plans. If you can do without time based grinding and it's in your budget IMO the Ceado E5P is the best bang for the buck with 64mm flat burrs, excellent distribution into PF, precise stepless grind size adjustment and build quality that's better than the competition. Marc
Hi Mike, Main differences are the design has joystick levers on steam and hot water valves and wood trim on those levers, group lever and portafilters. Marc
What, WLL inspired but no flow control? Nice to see another machine with the levers. Do you think the levers become a retro fit item for the profitec pro 700
Hi A, Thanks for the question. I think it's unlikely you'll see lever retrofit for the Pro 700. Sister company ECM has levers on the Synchronika which is essentially identical to the Pro 700 under the hood. As far as the FC... not every user wants it> Marc
Hey Albert, Well, here's a link to a spec comparison of the machines and current pricing: /pages/compare?products=NDgzMjYzMDYzNjU5OCwxNTQ1OTkwODY0OTU1 If it's a Synchronika with flow control that's what I would choose. Especially if not plumbing the machines. But it does cost more. There are aesthetic details of both machines which appeal to me but that's subjective. I really like the subtle touches on the Synchronika like the slight taper to the group head, angled PF handle, gauges up high on the face and the PID display which blends into the face. On the Vetrano Design I like how the drip tray sits between the lower case frame elements which are seamless front to back. Also like the boiler drains and easy access to brew pressure adjustment. If you take flow control out of the mix there's no reason to think one would make a better espresso than the other. Marc
@@Wholelattelovepage Great detailed overview video, Marc. To add to the earlier question about comparing this to the ECM Synchronika, do you think one is more likely to last longer than the other based on build quality or brand reputability?
@@ianpollack8888 Thanks for the comment and question. No doubt ECM has excellent reputation for build/finish quality and reliability. I've been using ECM machines for nearly a decade now so have a lot of experience with them. Have not had nearly as long using QM machines but looking at components under the hood everything is good. IMO once manufacturers get to a base level of quality long-term reliabilty has a lot to do with the end user. Feeding a machine good water, backflushing etc and doing regular maintenance go a long way to keeping things running smoothly. Marc
@@Wholelattelovepage I have a heat exchanger QM that dates to before the Andreja Prem. It was imported by a local distributor. I had to replace the boiler immediately, I was the second owner - first was a local Italian deli - but given the price I paid it was well worth it. I just replaced the vibration pump last year (~15 years on the original). I added flow control to it and everything works great. It helps that I use the proper water. So my take is QM has great build quality and would not sacrifice that on this dual boiler machine.
Hi Luke, Thanks for the kind comment and website feature request! No wish list feature at this point but we do have AR which allows you to put many machines virtually on your own countertop - about as close to owning the machine without purchasing. Could always add products to a shopping cart without purchasing to keep track. Marc
Hi Shane, The drip tray is 11.25"W x 6.25"D - measurement does not include front and side bars surrounding removable drip tray surface. Clearance between drip tray surface and tips of portafilter spouts is 3.4" Marc
I love these informative videos! Would love to see a 2021 video of recommended prosumer machines for home, especially for someone upgrading from a nespresso 😂 I considered the “affordable” entry-level machines like the Rancillio Silva and Gaggia Classic, but almost want to save a bit more money for a machine that will last a lifetime. Recommendations?
Hey D, Thanks for the kind comment. First, know that the Silvia and the Classic can last a lifetime. They are true machines and are very repairable if needed. Key to keeping them running well is feeding with good water to prevent scale deposits and/or descaling as needed. Both are single boiler machines so a little more involved to use. They are less temperature stable than more expensive machines with heat exchange or dual boilers and PID. When using a single boiler machine you cannot brew and steam simultaneously and must cool down the boiler after steaming. All that adds time and complexity to making milk-based espresso beverages. Entry into HX boiler machines starts a little less than double the price of a Silvia. The Profitec Pro 500 is an HX PID machine with exceptional build quality: www.wholelattelove.com/collections/semi-automatic-espresso-machines/products/profitec-pro-500-pid-espresso-machine Hope that helps! Marc
Hello Marc! I've learned a lot from your valuable videos :) I have bought used E61 wega mininova 2015 with 14 grams stock basket and I have little trouble in dialing in proxess. I have a low end delonghi kg79 grinder and to get 27 seconds for 15 grams of coffee I see small coffee grounds in my cup button Does that means that my pump could need opv to get 27 secomds with little coarser grinds Or this could be because the grinder is low end and generate coffee dust like that pass the filter and that causes inconsistent results Of course I have followed your valuable guide for dialing in video Would really appreciate to advise me and I'm really thankful for your time 🙂 Zak
Hi MZ, I have not used that machine so am not familiar with it's OPV control. But, I believe (unless a different model) the machine uses a rotary pump. Brew pressure on rotary pump machines are usually adjusted on the pump itself. The adjustment in many rotary pump machines is found underneath the machine or sometime adjustment is at back of machine. Typically adjusted using a screwdriver. If you want to adjust you'll need a blind basket in your PF, then turn on pump like you were pulling a shot and turn the adjustment to a reading of 9 bar on the brew pressure gauge. But I think it's more likely your grind quality causing troubles. That grinder is below capabilities I'd recommend for that level of machine. Marc
@@Wholelattelovepage Hello Marc! Thanks a lot for your time to reply to my comment, I really appreciate it :) I followed your advice and got a grinded coffee from a coffee shop near to my home and it was ok and no coffee grounds were found :) Thanks again
Here it is: ruclips.net/video/Vvu2b4ejFQE/видео.html And this put up this Crema Wave video yesterday in which we meet the roaster and learn more about the coffees used in the blend: ruclips.net/video/D3Px4QilE5Y/видео.html Marc
Hi Paul, Thanks for the question. Tough call - might be an aesthetic choice. If not plumbing perhaps the Infuser as you can still do the gradual soft pre-infusion from reservoir. The Vetrano is a more traditional build while the Crem employs newer materials like a poly-carbonate frame base. Marc
![[SFM] Risky Recital](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/RzNkY1_Nk3o/mqdefault.jpg)
This is my third dual boiler machine, and despite not being the most expensive one it is my favorite. Having dealt with issues in the past, I like how solid and easy to work on this one is, and that stainless steel frame is really a nice bonus, I have had coated steel frames rust after 5 or so years.
Add a flow control knob, and the sky is the limit.
A very underrated machine.
Hi Ron, Thanks a bunch for sharing your thoughts on the Vetrano - it's a hidden gem for sure!
Marc
@@Wholelattelovepage yep, quick mill was only really lacking in the aesthetics department, this one removes the ugly and keeps the good.
Also, the steam wand stays notably cooler on this than on any of the 3 rockets I’ve owned that have all had no burn wands. I noticed quick mill has an extra silicone gasket on the inside of their steam tip that rocket does not have.
Hi! how long does it heat up after you turn it on?
High end espresso machines do, in fact, do a fantastic job at extraction. Wallet extraction.
hahahaha
If you have to ask the price..........
This is how espresso machines should be reviewed and demo'ed!
Hi e, Thanks a whole latte for taking the moment to leave your comment- it’s appreciated!
Marc
Unexpected video from my fav channel! Thanks Marc.
Hey Felix, You are welcome and thanks for the comment!
Marc
hi there, how is this one compare with the Profitec 600? as in the product quality, which one has a stronger milk steam? As I am base in Australia, I only can find the black one, just worry if the coated colour will get rust in years. Thanks!
What a espresso machine 🤩
Yes, very nice and great value!
Marc
I own a version of this machine. Really appreciate your indepth review highlighting the internal features.
Hey PI, You are welcome and I appreciate your taking the time to leave a comment!
Marc
Great Machine, great review, another fantastic job from Quick Mill another great review from you guys.
Hi DA, Thanks for the comment!
Marc
Marc when you gonna upload the Crem Profiler video?
Hi TA, I'm working on the video now. Hoped to have it up sooner but got sidetracked by some personal stuff.
Marc
@@Wholelattelovepage thanks Marc... Hope all is well. honestly hung up against Crem Profiler and the Lelit Bianca... been waiting for your video to drop to pull the trigger! :-)
I’ve owned the Vetrano Design for almost a year now and received the machine operating at just above 9 bar pressure when using a blank and real coffee puck. Should the pressure be adjusted this way? Or should I back it down to reach a max of 9 bar pressure on the gauge? I love this machine so far, just wondering where the pressure should be set at when it reaches its max pressure during a shot. Thank you so much for all of your wonderful videos on everything you guys sell, makes decision making much easier for me!
Hi d, Thanks for the kind comment, question and sharing your love and thoughts on the Vetrano Design. Your good set to 9 bar with blank inserted. Rotary pump machines like yours have higher flow rates at a given pressure than a vibration pump machine which we typically set at 10 bar with a blank in. In all machines there's a slight difference, a drop of pressure from what's on the machine gauge and the actual pressure in the portafilter during an extraction. That's because the tap for the pressure gauge is behind a one way valve in the hydraulic system and it can flow more water than is released as espresso. You could try turning up the pressure to 10 on the machine gauge with blank inserted, pull a shot and see if you taste a difference - I doubt you will but only one way to find out.
Marc
Of course! Thank you so much for taking the time to answer my question! I’ve been searching what pressure rotary pumps should be set at and this answers my question. I will leave it set at just above 9 bar since that’s what tastes best to me after trying 10 bar a while back, I had also experienced channeling at 10 bar than at just above the line at 9 bar. Keep up the phenomenal in depth reviews, you do an awesome job Marc!! as well as the entire staff at WLL!!
Aside from a few cosmetic differences, this machine seems to be the same as the Lucca M58 also by Quick Mill.
Hi j, Thanks for the comment. Yes, many similarities across models of a single manufacturers machines.
Marc
Other than aesthetics and knobs, is this an upgrade from the evo 2b??
Beautiful machine and great review! How would you compare it to the Bezzera DUO MN, and which one would you prefer?
Hey Mongoose, Thanks for the comment and question. Here's a link to a side by side spec comparison of the Vetrano Design and Duo MN: www.wholelattelove.com/pages/compare?products=NjU0MzAxMTI1MDIzMCwxNTQ2MDAxODc1MDAz
Similar machines in many respects.
Notes...
Vetrano: Easier access to brew pressure adjustment, larger stainless steel boilers, simpler controls of PID.
Duo: touchscreen control panel w/digital gauges, copper boilers, a little more complex under the hood, automatic pre-infusion cycle
As to which I would prefer, it's a bit of a toss up. Slight edge to the Vetrano with the larger boilers and easy BP adjustment. Also, I have a minor aversion to touchscreen controls on a classic design espresso machine.
Hope that helps!
Marc
@@Wholelattelovepage It absolutely helped, thanks for the great detailed response!
Hi Mark, I am new in the espresso machine world other than syarbuck for my cappuccino drink, I need your advice to what is the best espresso and coffee grinder machine to buy and where to buy it. I was looking for the Profitec pro 500 with the coffee grinder Eureka mignon specialita or the dual boilers Profitec pro 600 along withe Eureka mignon specialita. There is so much brand ou there like the Ecm Luca, Bezzera. Of course i have to watch my budget too. Please give some recommendations and advice. Thank You.
Hi Marc, are you guys going to review the CREM ONE LFPP??
Hey TL, Thanks for the question. Yes, I'm working on that now. We are calling the machine the Crem One Profiler. LFPP is kinda bland!
Marc
@@Wholelattelovepage thanks Marc. appreciate it
Life is to short not to own a machine like this!
Hey M J, For sure!
Marc
Is the main difference between this version and the 2B Evo on your site really just the outside aesthetics (less lights and etching) and the levers vs knobs?
WOW kinda like an R2D2 design, Looks like a great unit
Hey Bruce, Thanks for the comment!
Marc
Hi Marc. Would you guys consider doing a video comparison between the Pro 700 and the Quick Mill Vetrano? Would those be the two comparable models from each manufacturer?
Hi AA, Thanks for the request - I'll see what I can do for a comparison video. In the meantime, here's a side by side spec comparison of the machines: www.wholelattelove.com/pages/compare?products=NDgzMjYzMDYzNjU5OCwxNTQ1OTk3MzUzMDE5
I do have a bunch of existing videos on the Pro 700. Most recently is this extensive tour of internal components: ruclips.net/video/iKRWh4ophGE/видео.html
I don't know how long it will last but there are currently some special offers on both machines.
Marc
Hi Mark and WLL team, thanks for the detailed info. How do you compare this machine with ECM Synchronika. I have been thinking to buy Synchronika in June 2022 but am now considering Vetrano too. My impression is that it is almost identical with Synchronika and Profitec Pro 700, that is why I am interested in Vetrano. Moreover, it is priced cheaper than Synchronika and Pro 700 in my country. Thanks again.
I live in a small nyc apt. It's the breville express for me
Hey Andrew, It does save some space. It's an appliance which packs in a lot of features!
Marc
I have been looking for a custom walnut trim on my Rubino forever. This gives me hope
Hi Ethan, Well, I do not have any for the Rubino but there's always hope. We worked directly with QM to get the Walnut.
Marc
Hi Marc! One general question in the context of another DB beauty with SS boilers. Why so many vendors switched from copper to SS boilers? I mean that steel is much more sensitive to chemical reactions that copper when it comes to descaling. From this perspective do you think it is easier to maintain SS boiler than copper one? Or the hidden idea is to replace the SS boiler instead of descaling copper one?
Hi PR, If fed with water that can cause scale any boiler regardless of metal type will scale. While copper was the traditional material for boilers I believe advances in manufacturing and materials made stainless boilers more practical. Stainless boilers can be descaled so there's no hidden agenda. Urnex which is the most well known descaling product manufacturer for coffee machines advises all of their descaling products are good to use in stainless boilers. For aluminum boilers they advise limiting contact time to 20 minutes when using their citric acid based descaling products.
Marc
@@Wholelattelovepage Thank you, Marc!
great video as always. I thought I had norrowed my pick down to pro 700 and the synchronika but now this looks very nice...between the veltrano, pro 700 and synchronika are they all just as quiet as one another or how would you rank them purely on how quiet they are?
Thanks again
Hi David, Thanks for the comment and question. All 3 machines have rotary pumps so are very quiet - not much difference in sound level between them.
Marc
@@Wholelattelovepage thanks
An interesting review of this machine. It makes it quiet difficult to decide which espresso machine I'm going to buy. According to the reviews on your channel, my 3 favorite machines are: ECM Synchronika, Profitec Pro 700 and the Quick Mill Vetrano. Interesting of the Profitec that I can add a flow control afterward, or is this possible with all the machines? Another question I have regarding the Quick Mill, that you reviewed the machine with the joy-sticks. When I open the site of Quick Mill, there are knobs on the machine instead of the joy-sticks and I can't find the version you reviewed. Finally the main question: what's your favorite machine of the 3 I mentioned taking also the price into consideration? Thanks and good luck with your channel.
Hi Frank, The version of the Vetrano we have, the Vetrano Design is something we worked with QM on to customize. That's why it's a little different than what you see on their site. Of the 3 machines my favorite is the ECM Synchronika. Internally the Synchronika and Pro 700 are essentially identical. They are made by the same company. While both have excellent external finishing the Synchronika is nicer. I like the custom taper of its E61 group, Gauges up high for easy viewing, angled portafilters and exquisite finishing detail like chrome tips on levers and handles. If you purchase the Synchronika or Pro 700 from us without flow control you can upgrade down the road.
Marc
I chose the Quick Mill over the ECM for the easy access boilers, fully stainless steel chassis, easy access pump pressure adjustment vs on the bottom and brass fittings vs the plastic ones on the ECM. Also didn’t love the zip tied capacitor on the ECM.
Alright maybe do a trouble shoot on heating issues for this machine I haven’t had mine for 7 months and it’s already not heating.
Is There a chance to see this machine side by side against the Profitec pro 700 as they have almost the same specs. Thanks you.
And maybe also the rocket 58. Keep up the good work.
Hey FK, Thanks for the comments and request. I do not have a video with the machines side by side but here's a link to a side by side spec comparison: www.wholelattelove.com/pages/compare?products=NjU0MzAxMTI1MDIzMCwyMDM4MTQ2NzI3OTkw
And here's a link to my video covering the Pro 700: ruclips.net/video/l54y-_Vx_ts/видео.html
They are similar machines but I give an edge to the Pro 700 with its higher steaming power and currently available from us with a free flow control upgrade.
Here's my video covering the R Cinquantotto (formerly R58): ruclips.net/video/Xjjzw7kMCU0/видео.html
Hope that helps!
Marc
This thing looks amazing! Thanks for putting this on my radar. Now I have to figure out what limbs or organs I have to sell.
Is it more expensive than a similar Rocket???
@@sandyd4271 do you prefer the look of the rocket?
@@LivingRad I actually do. I like the stealth mode of the Rocket machines, but they have very flashy prices 😅
@@sandyd4271 they are very sexy machines I have to admit! I’ve used the virtual thing that WLL has on their website with the appartamento and was obsessed with how it looks in my kitchen
You're welcome. I take no responsibility for missing body parts :)
Marc
Hi Marc, awesome video. can ECM pressure profiling be fitted to my rocket R Cinquantotto your reply is highly appreciated thanks
Hey BAD EV, Thanks for the question. We have tested the flow control on Rocket machines w/E61 group and it works!
Marc
@@Wholelattelovepage Thank you Marc 🙏
Does the ECM Synchronika have the edge over the QM Vetrano in terms of parts & component quality? Both seems to be very similar in features and design.
Hi Paul, Thanks for the question. The machines are very close in component quality. I've always been a fan of ECM design but think in this case it comes down to your style preferences. With proper care and maintenance both machines should be very reliable.
Marc
Hi Marc.
A little unrelated but I currently have a Gaggia Classic Pro with breville smart grinder Pro- I feel this grinder is too inconsistent and want to upgrade. Which grinder would you recommend? For espresso only, as I will keep my Breville for drip/filter grinding
Love your videos.
Thanks
Conor
Hi Conor
I also habe the Gaggia classic pro in combination with a Eureka Specialità. You would probably also get good espresso with less than that but I think its better to have a better grinder than your machine... I know that many recommend the Baratza 270wi for the gaggia but in my opinion it’s better to spend a bit more and get the Eureka (what I did). Enjoy your coffee ☕️💪
Sandy
If you want a more affordable great quality grinder try the Rok GRINDER GC (hand grinder) I did a review on my channel
I have a GCP and recently sold my Vario and got a Eureka Silenzio. Would second Sandy's comment and recommend a Silenzio/Specilita. The infinite grind adjustment is great and it's a good looking grinder too.
Hey Conor, @Sandy D gives good advice. Grind is critical. Specialita is a good grinder and built a heck of a lot better than the SGP. But you get what you pay for. I've used the SGP in the past. It's def appliance grade with lots of (nearly all) plastic, clumpy grind at espresso sizes, rather slow and limited in precision of grind size adjustment. Sette is appliance grade as well and has some wear parts. That said we currently use one daily on the bar in the studio. It's weight based grinding is magical. Grind is fluffy and well distributed, it's very fast and kinda loud. It's also susceptible to static - particularly when new and when used in low humidity. It will eventually wear out but Baratza has great support and a fixed price repair program if you need it. Over in the lab I use a Ceado E37S when working with new machines. It's the grinder sitting next to the Vetrano Design in this video. It's big $$ but will likely still be grinding when I'm in the ground :) Grinder choice depends on your expectations, budget and future plans. If you can do without time based grinding and it's in your budget IMO the Ceado E5P is the best bang for the buck with 64mm flat burrs, excellent distribution into PF, precise stepless grind size adjustment and build quality that's better than the competition.
Marc
@Sandy D, Thanks for sharing - good advice!
Marc
Great video fun and informative, superbly done, a beautiful beautiful and well thought out espresso machine.
Hey Orrin, Thanks for the kind comment and your activity in the comments over the years!
Marc
@@Wholelattelovepage your welcome Marc
What’s the difference between this and the 2B Evo ?
Hi Mike, Main differences are the design has joystick levers on steam and hot water valves and wood trim on those levers, group lever and portafilters.
Marc
What, WLL inspired but no flow control? Nice to see another machine with the levers. Do you think the levers become a retro fit item for the profitec pro 700
Hi A, Thanks for the question. I think it's unlikely you'll see lever retrofit for the Pro 700. Sister company ECM has levers on the Synchronika which is essentially identical to the Pro 700 under the hood. As far as the FC... not every user wants it>
Marc
ECM Synchronika versus this?
Hey Albert, Well, here's a link to a spec comparison of the machines and current pricing: /pages/compare?products=NDgzMjYzMDYzNjU5OCwxNTQ1OTkwODY0OTU1
If it's a Synchronika with flow control that's what I would choose. Especially if not plumbing the machines. But it does cost more. There are aesthetic details of both machines which appeal to me but that's subjective. I really like the subtle touches on the Synchronika like the slight taper to the group head, angled PF handle, gauges up high on the face and the PID display which blends into the face. On the Vetrano Design I like how the drip tray sits between the lower case frame elements which are seamless front to back. Also like the boiler drains and easy access to brew pressure adjustment. If you take flow control out of the mix there's no reason to think one would make a better espresso than the other.
Marc
@@Wholelattelovepage Great detailed overview video, Marc. To add to the earlier question about comparing this to the ECM Synchronika, do you think one is more likely to last longer than the other based on build quality or brand reputability?
@@ianpollack8888 Thanks for the comment and question. No doubt ECM has excellent reputation for build/finish quality and reliability. I've been using ECM machines for nearly a decade now so have a lot of experience with them. Have not had nearly as long using QM machines but looking at components under the hood everything is good. IMO once manufacturers get to a base level of quality long-term reliabilty has a lot to do with the end user. Feeding a machine good water, backflushing etc and doing regular maintenance go a long way to keeping things running smoothly.
Marc
@@Wholelattelovepage I have a heat exchanger QM that dates to before the Andreja Prem. It was imported by a local distributor. I had to replace the boiler immediately, I was the second owner - first was a local Italian deli - but given the price I paid it was well worth it. I just replaced the vibration pump last year (~15 years on the original). I added flow control to it and everything works great. It helps that I use the proper water. So my take is QM has great build quality and would not sacrifice that on this dual boiler machine.
awesome review! I wish there are a "wish list" button on your website so I can keep track of all the things I want to purchase from you
Hi Luke, Thanks for the kind comment and website feature request! No wish list feature at this point but we do have AR which allows you to put many machines virtually on your own countertop - about as close to owning the machine without purchasing. Could always add products to a shopping cart without purchasing to keep track.
Marc
What are the dimensions of the drip tray surface and the height of the group head above it? I'm trying to size my cups and scale.
Hi Shane, The drip tray is 11.25"W x 6.25"D - measurement does not include front and side bars surrounding removable drip tray surface. Clearance between drip tray surface and tips of portafilter spouts is 3.4"
Marc
I love these informative videos! Would love to see a 2021 video of recommended prosumer machines for home, especially for someone upgrading from a nespresso 😂 I considered the “affordable” entry-level machines like the Rancillio Silva and Gaggia Classic, but almost want to save a bit more money for a machine that will last a lifetime. Recommendations?
Hey D, Thanks for the kind comment. First, know that the Silvia and the Classic can last a lifetime. They are true machines and are very repairable if needed. Key to keeping them running well is feeding with good water to prevent scale deposits and/or descaling as needed. Both are single boiler machines so a little more involved to use. They are less temperature stable than more expensive machines with heat exchange or dual boilers and PID. When using a single boiler machine you cannot brew and steam simultaneously and must cool down the boiler after steaming. All that adds time and complexity to making milk-based espresso beverages. Entry into HX boiler machines starts a little less than double the price of a Silvia. The Profitec Pro 500 is an HX PID machine with exceptional build quality: www.wholelattelove.com/collections/semi-automatic-espresso-machines/products/profitec-pro-500-pid-espresso-machine
Hope that helps!
Marc
@@Wholelattelovepage and what machines would you recommend as an upgrade to my Rocket Cellini espresso machine?
Hello Marc!
I've learned a lot from your valuable videos :)
I have bought used E61 wega mininova 2015 with 14 grams stock basket and I have little trouble in dialing in proxess. I have a low end delonghi kg79 grinder and to get 27 seconds for 15 grams of coffee I see small coffee grounds in my cup button
Does that means that my pump could need opv to get 27 secomds with little coarser grinds
Or
this could be because the grinder is low end and generate coffee dust like that pass the filter and that causes inconsistent results
Of course I have followed your valuable guide for dialing in video
Would really appreciate to advise me and I'm really thankful for your time 🙂
Zak
Hi MZ, I have not used that machine so am not familiar with it's OPV control. But, I believe (unless a different model) the machine uses a rotary pump. Brew pressure on rotary pump machines are usually adjusted on the pump itself. The adjustment in many rotary pump machines is found underneath the machine or sometime adjustment is at back of machine. Typically adjusted using a screwdriver. If you want to adjust you'll need a blind basket in your PF, then turn on pump like you were pulling a shot and turn the adjustment to a reading of 9 bar on the brew pressure gauge. But I think it's more likely your grind quality causing troubles. That grinder is below capabilities I'd recommend for that level of machine.
Marc
@@Wholelattelovepage Hello Marc!
Thanks a lot for your time to reply to my comment, I really appreciate it :)
I followed your advice and got a grinded coffee from a coffee shop near to my home and it was ok and no coffee grounds were found :)
Thanks again
What happened to the cream wave video. I was trying to look into it more but the video is gone
Here it is: ruclips.net/video/Vvu2b4ejFQE/видео.html
And this put up this Crema Wave video yesterday in which we meet the roaster and learn more about the coffees used in the blend: ruclips.net/video/D3Px4QilE5Y/видео.html
Marc
@@Wholelattelovepage thank you!
Side note I was wondering if I could adjust the pressure on my apartamento without voiding my warranty?
Might want to include a link to the espresso machine.
Hey y, Thanks for the catch! Had a card link in video. Links updated in video description.
Marc
Why is this lower priced than comparable profitec/rocket machines?
Hi m, Well, Rocket may get a bit of a premium for their branding.
I’d love to have it - what’s the cost per month payment plan 😉
Hey D CASH, Wait a second... with a name like that you need a monthly payment plan? :)
Marc
@@Wholelattelovepage you would think! But when it comes to espresso, the cost keeps going up 😍
This one or CREM One Infuser?
Hi Paul, Thanks for the question. Tough call - might be an aesthetic choice. If not plumbing perhaps the Infuser as you can still do the gradual soft pre-infusion from reservoir. The Vetrano is a more traditional build while the Crem employs newer materials like a poly-carbonate frame base.
Marc
@@Wholelattelovepage When are we getting a profiler video?
We want profitec 700 pro 2021 review.
Hey smile, Thanks for the request. When we get one you'll get it. My understanding is changes are aesthetic only with no functional impact.
Marc
Still like the ECM Synchronika better.
Hi ML, Thanks for the comment. The Synchronika is a class act - perhaps the best DB prosumer level machine available. It's also just few more $$.
Marc
First 🥰 love your videos Marc!!!
Thanks! I would be very disappointed if you were not #1!!!
Marc
It's a great machine! I wonder if you would mind gifting me one unit? If not no problem just keep on making these videos!
Well, wish I could! Will definitely keep making the vids😀
Marc
@@Wholelattelovepage well. then I at least have an coffee on you when i visit you. best wishes from Austria
$2,795.00
Hi Mark, Current pricing here: www.wholelattelove.com/products/quick-mill-vetrano-design-espresso-machine
Marc