Thanks for the demonstration Richard. Looks like a must for Sota, was interested in your Mast support, must check your site before the end of the Black Friday deals !!
Hi Richard - another interesting video and the mast looks really compact. Seeing your field demonstration in all your cold weather gear reminds me of why I moved "downunder"! Keep the videos coming.
I'm very pleased with the outcome as I've been toying with the idea of going portable and with only a foundation license and a 817nd every db counts many thanks M7JMC 73s
I would have liked to have seen some control experiments using your test rig - e.g. comparison of (a) fibreglass (b) carbon fibre and (c) metal. Without a control we don't know whether your test is testing anything.
Another great video Richard, thanks! Great that you have dispelled the long-standing myth. Looks like you were having some wintery fun on Gun! Such a mast would be a great addition to our newly formed village club “EARS” G5EA. Cheers, Nick M1DDD
Hi Richard, I posted some results with a carbon fibre pole back in 2015 as a reply on Ham Radio Deals. I ran a worst case scenario of a 28 MHz 1/2 wave end fed wire would tightly around a 5m CF pole. With 100W of JT65 applied over 2 minutes the pole heated up by 0.7 decrees C. Like I say this was a worst case, if you use it to support a horizontal antenna or let the vertical wire hang off the pole it will work fine. 73, Chris G4HYG
Thanks for taking the time to test out this often wheeled out taboo. Good to know it is in effect bollx. Looks like I will need to give you some more money! 2E0HWO
Interesting, however instead of the effect on a coil I would be more interested on the effect on vertical antenna when the antenna wire runs along the carbon fibre in parallel. How does it affect the impedance and the radiation pattern? However I do not expect that much difference on portable setups where the terrain itself could have bigger impact.
Interesting and useful to see the question explored. Thank you Richard. I wonder how the carbon fibre mast compares with other materials/structures amateurs routinely use, without problems, such as trees (filled with sap, with presumably some conductivity).
Thanks for this and your other videos Richard, very informative. The lab comparison is interesting, perhaps you could do a field comparison of fiberglass and carbon fiber masts with a vertical antenna. Keep up the good work! 73 Rolfe
Nice video although I agree that a comparison with a fibre glass pole in the lab would have been interesting. Was great to see how easy it is the set up an antenna! M0SUD.
Thanks for posting this video, Richard. I have wondered if there would be any difference between fiberglass and carbon fiber. Seems to be none from a practical standpoint...
Thanks for posting the vid Richard. Likewise, I too am surprised that carbon masts are suitable for antenna supports. Seems like there is a lot of work to be done to dispel the myths. Had better get a new mast and try it out. Thanks again and 73. G1YOY.
Can’t blame my mast any more then ;-) As per the comment someone else has made, would be interesting to see a comparison with fibreglass in the test rig.
The supply of fiberglass rods is slim here in El Paso. I need to couple my Vacuum Variable Cap shaft to a gear reducer. What we are concerned about is if the hi RF Voltage could pass down rod risking a RF contact by user. Magnetic Loop voltages can be hi as 5Kv and currents up wards of 15 Amp so insulation between the shaft on capacitor and turning motor critical. Otherwise could get messy.
Richard... thanks for posting this analysis. I'd be curious to know what readings you would get if you placed other materials such as copper, aluminum, steel, or even PVC into your test jig. I'm very interested in this carbon fiber mast. AD7KG
Great video! What was the rod that you placed in the ground support the mast? What kit was it from? Would you recommend that or another rod or support for the Carbon-6 Mast? Thank you!
Thanks for the video I have been looking for something like this as confirmation , but I wasn't sure with the problems of carbon fibre as I understood there was. I have an idea for developing my idea for 80m and 160m cubicle quad.
I've used several carbon fiber mast for years with no noticeable ill effects. Save the heavier fiberglass for surf fishing! Nice editing with the relevant B-roll on the open! ...de wGOAT
Yet we make masts out of inexpensive chain link top rail that is metal and what are towers made out of again? I love my carbon fiber masts and I own several for different reasons supporting many types of antennas. I have not had any issues with them including a doublet. I did keep the ladder line about 6 inches away from the mast but that was it.
Wow I don't know what to say but thank you Richard I will defiantly make great use of this as I am just started to get into WWFF here in Australia. 73's
Just a thought, would the loss, even .07 db, be distributed across an entire antenna. Impedance of antenna and it's efficiency does take into consideration radiation resistance. Have you measured the effect on radiation resistance in a vertical antenna at ten meters. Curious what your findings might be. My experience is that many vertical antennas are not "linear" loads, but instead a complex impedance. Good video...73. K0COA - Amateur Extra Class, Broadcast Engineer
you remove the bottom plug and have a ground stake wiggle inside? i think it would be better to have plastic spacers so there is no point of hard contact. i am a fisherman and a ham radio operator. those carbon fiber rod are sensible to hard stress. when the force is applied softly they wont snap.
Thanks for doing the testing and sharing it with us! It would have been interesting to insert a fiberglass mast into your test rig to see if it induced more or less than 0.07dB loss. 73 de w8tam
Great to see real life tests, dissapointed your vertical test was not the same as inverted V. My fear has always been for a vertical wire on the side of a carbon as opposed to glass fibre for directional,as well as absorbtion. Ideal would be a) inside pole like my current portable, dont expect anything there b) strung alongside c) wound to get higher bands on a shorter pole. All compared to same on a fibre glass pole for loss and directional. I would prefer carbon fibre but always been told to avoid them. Sounds like the inverted V is now viable.
I am most decidely learning and I am attempting to find the best option for my twin carbon fibre mast sailboat. There are no stays. The masts are carbon fibre wrapped in a then layer of standard epoxy glass. The mast are also self supporting. Is it possible to turn the mast into an HF antenna using the stainless mast step? I am really trying to find something that doesn't have to be moved in and out of the way of my booms and I'm not loving the look of a tall fixed antenna on the stern.
I think carbom fibre absorb just uhf and vhf - in hf it should work with 0,8 to 2 db loss (not much). I mean to remember: Above 300 Mhz carbon begins to go bad -> for 144 Mhz it can be theoretical used (with a big loss), for 70cm (433 Mhz) you need other materials.
Hi .....can u run bare copper strap around the mast , if mast is 5 mtrs and u run 1 2 or 3 or 4 mtr copper strap , would there be any possibility the carbon rod starys to become an antenna , i build a 20mtr vertical with insulated wire around it , but would like to build something more robust and use copper strapping then make it into a 17 15 12 and 10 mtr vertical ..... so will the carbon rod conduct to such an extent that the rod will become the antenna instead of the wire ? ZS6AF JOHAN VISAGIE Sunny south africa
What about change in RF pattern or loss if a vertical wire is wrapped around or just run up the pole? I think I have seen videos of those tests (when these poles first came out) and the conclusion was that it was not a good idea to wrap the wire around the pole. Fiberglass was ok though in those tests. I would go for lighter and stronger any day myself. Thanks. Dave K8WPE
I suspect that different poles will perform differently. The one that I tested was clearly not likely to cause problems. It will be interesting to see measurements of other poles.
Hello, Thank you for video that answers the qustion I was thinking about. I am planing to start sota activities. Got myself small ft-817 and would love to have telescopic must to support my wires. Best 73 9a4na
It would be interesting to see what happens at 2m / 70cm with wires inside of carbon fibre tubes. It could make a nice, light arrow antenna for satellites? :)
aluminium masts have been used for ever, with a bit of spacing used for vertical antennas so a mast made with carbon fibre is a definite advantage , low loss and low weight. Good to see some hearsay debunked !
Hi I am glad that you have done a test I have only bought your 10masts but I will be looking at your compact masts for when I am out backpacking my station chris G0WFH
Thank you! I found the spectrum analyzer portion very intriguing I may have to give that a shot myself
Thanks for the demonstration Richard. Looks like a must for Sota, was interested in your Mast support, must check your site before the end of the Black Friday deals !!
I've seen discussions about this issue on the SOTA reflector. Thanks for doing the testing and clearing the matter up.
Patrick - ac0sr
Really useful to know as I had been reluctant to use these masts for radio antennas.
Very interesting, thanks for taking the time to explore this. Matt
Well worth watching Richard. Thanks for the interesting information. Alan
Hi Richard. Many thanks for doing the research on the carbon fibre mast.
Interesting results.
Thank you for taking a closer look at this topic! 👍
Very informative - good to know that he losses are small. Looks like a perfect mast for SOTA.
Hi Richard - another interesting video and the mast looks really compact. Seeing your field demonstration in all your cold weather gear reminds me of why I moved "downunder"! Keep the videos coming.
Thanks Richard for clearing the facts out. With that amount of resistance it is not possible to use the mast as an antenna either.
Richard thanks, I have always wondered about the interaction of the mast and my vertical wire antennas, thanks for answer. Your videos are the best.
I'm very pleased with the outcome as I've been toying with the idea of going portable and with only a foundation license and a 817nd every db counts many thanks M7JMC 73s
I would have liked to have seen some control experiments using your test rig - e.g. comparison of (a) fibreglass (b) carbon fibre and (c) metal. Without a control we don't know whether your test is testing anything.
Good point. In fact I did both those tests. Fibreglass shows no effect at all. Metal completely detuned the circuit.
Interesting results, but I wonder what effect, if any, going up and down in frequency will have? Thanks for the chance to win a sweet CF mast.
Good to dispel the myth - I’ll be adding this to my Christmas list! 73 M0VVA
Good video, and that looks like a great pole to get an Antenna up in the small space I have available to me for some winter operating
Another great video Richard, thanks! Great that you have dispelled the long-standing myth. Looks like you were having some wintery fun on Gun! Such a mast would be a great addition to our newly formed village club “EARS” G5EA. Cheers, Nick M1DDD
Thanks for correcting an common misunderstanding about carbon fibre poles, I'll be ordering one.
Interesting results - I suspected that there would little difference and nice for you to demonstrate so.
Hi Richard, I posted some results with a carbon fibre pole back in 2015 as a reply on Ham Radio Deals. I ran a worst case scenario of a 28 MHz 1/2 wave end fed wire would tightly around a 5m CF pole. With 100W of JT65 applied over 2 minutes the pole heated up by 0.7 decrees C. Like I say this was a worst case, if you use it to support a horizontal antenna or let the vertical wire hang off the pole it will work fine. 73, Chris G4HYG
You are the man Richard i was surprised with your result will look at a carbon mast next time for sure
Great video Richard. One of these wod complement my Sota setup nicely!
Great video and a lovely mast which would be perfect for my QRP SOTA outings.
Thanks for the testing of the carbon fiber mast. Enjoy your videos. Thanks
Thanks Richard. Mast be nearly Christmas.
Very interesting results and contacts too!
Great informative video ,Thanks Richard
Thanks for the test Richard. Now is the time to collect some Sotabeams gear for the next outdoor season ;o) 73, ON4CDJ
Richard, thank you. Very informative as always. Martin
Thanks for taking the time to test out this often wheeled out taboo. Good to know it is in effect bollx. Looks like I will need to give you some more money! 2E0HWO
Interesting, however instead of the effect on a coil I would be more interested on the effect on vertical antenna when the antenna wire runs along the carbon fibre in parallel. How does it affect the impedance and the radiation pattern? However I do not expect that much difference on portable setups where the terrain itself could have bigger impact.
My thoughts as well. It would be interesting to see. Malen VE6VID
Interesting and useful to see the question explored. Thank you Richard. I wonder how the carbon fibre mast compares with other materials/structures amateurs routinely use, without problems, such as trees (filled with sap, with presumably some conductivity).
Thanks for a very interesting video, about time someone actually tested a Carbon fibre mast.
Nice mast......sure will be very good for SOTA. If endfed used as a inverted v with the legs in one line...its very good !!
It’s good to know, as a 10w foundation holder I’m keen to keep my losses as low as possible.
Yes - that's a good idea. As you can see, the loss I measured was negibible with this specific mast.
Nice performance of your sota setup ! On 20m band I suppose.
Thanks for this and your other videos Richard, very informative. The lab comparison is interesting, perhaps you could do a field comparison of fiberglass and carbon fiber masts with a vertical antenna. Keep up the good work! 73 Rolfe
I may do that sometime.
Thanks for the video Richard an great portable operating 👍
Nice video although I agree that a comparison with a fibre glass pole in the lab would have been interesting. Was great to see how easy it is the set up an antenna! M0SUD.
Thanks for posting this video, Richard. I have wondered if there would be any difference between fiberglass and carbon fiber. Seems to be none from a practical standpoint...
Bear in mind thtt different types of carbon fibre poles could give different results.
Really interesting, thanks for the video! 😀😀
Interesting setup... but wouldn't a vertical wire antenna interact with the carbon and pull the SWR out ?
That was really interesting. I would have thought that Carbon would have caused more trouble. I am pleasantly surprised.
Sounds great! I am sure interested.
Nice Thanks for the test.
I like the videos Richard. Have been buying some Sotabeam products and have been happy so far. Thank you.
Thanks! Enjoy the videos.
Thanks for posting the vid Richard. Likewise, I too am surprised that carbon masts are suitable for antenna supports. Seems like there is a lot of work to be done to dispel the myths. Had better get a new mast and try it out. Thanks again and 73. G1YOY.
Brilliant film Richard, I use verticals and inverted Vs when Portable. One of these would suit me, ‘down to the ground’. 73 de G6EXF
Can’t blame my mast any more then ;-) As per the comment someone else has made, would be interesting to see a comparison with fibreglass in the test rig.
The supply of fiberglass rods is slim here in El Paso. I need to couple my Vacuum Variable Cap shaft to a gear reducer. What we are concerned about is if the hi RF Voltage could pass down rod risking a RF contact by user. Magnetic Loop voltages can be hi as 5Kv and currents up wards of 15 Amp so insulation between the shaft on capacitor and turning motor critical. Otherwise could get messy.
It's conductive! Works great as a lightning conductor! Think I'll stick to fiberglass thanks!!!😮
I think you will find fibreglass will act as a lightning conductor when wet too. Then there’s the antenna….
Looks like a good match for use with my home brew speaker wire antenna. 73 de KE2SX
Richard... thanks for posting this analysis. I'd be curious to know what readings you would get if you placed other materials such as copper, aluminum, steel, or even PVC into your test jig. I'm very interested in this carbon fiber mast. AD7KG
Okay, yeah. But did you test it with deer antlers? (Reference to another YT "test" video).
Nice, what kind of wind strength could it be used up to?
Nice addition to the QRP toolkit! 73
Interesting experiment....would b interested to see result from same test ...in lab...using fibreglass pole
Great to have empirical data as opposed to speculation.
Great video! What was the rod that you placed in the ground support the mast? What kit was it from? Would you recommend that or another rod or support for the Carbon-6 Mast? Thank you!
It was a fibreglass rod from SOTABEAMS
Looks as if I might invest in one of these and add to my portable kit.
Love to win this SOTA mast for my backpacking trips. Cheers
Just ordered my second Carbon-6. I wish replacement sections were available.
Thanks for the video I have been looking for something like this as confirmation , but I wasn't sure with the problems of carbon fibre as I understood there was. I have an idea for developing my idea for 80m and 160m cubicle quad.
Test your C-F properly. It's all different!
I've used several carbon fiber mast for years with no noticeable ill effects. Save the heavier fiberglass for surf fishing! Nice editing with the relevant B-roll on the open! ...de wGOAT
Thank you for your interview on zeer interesting video
Yet we make masts out of inexpensive chain link top rail that is metal and what are towers made out of again? I love my carbon fiber masts and I own several for different reasons supporting many types of antennas. I have not had any issues with them including a doublet. I did keep the ladder line about 6 inches away from the mast but that was it.
An the Winner of the mast is Steven Brodie! commentpicker.com/youtube.php
Wow I don't know what to say but thank you Richard I will defiantly make great use of this as I am just started to get into WWFF here in Australia. 73's
Just a thought, would the loss, even .07 db, be distributed across an entire antenna. Impedance of antenna and it's efficiency does take into consideration radiation resistance. Have you measured the effect on radiation resistance in a vertical antenna at ten meters. Curious what your findings might be. My experience is that many vertical antennas are not "linear" loads, but instead a complex impedance. Good video...73. K0COA - Amateur Extra Class, Broadcast Engineer
I added on the top of my carbon fishing pole a short piece (± 50 cm) of pvc electric pipe. I never had any problems with these construction.
you remove the bottom plug and have a ground stake wiggle inside? i think it would be better to have plastic spacers so there is no point of hard contact. i am a fisherman and a ham radio operator. those carbon fiber rod are sensible to hard stress. when the force is applied softly they wont snap.
Thanks for doing the testing and sharing it with us! It would have been interesting to insert a fiberglass mast into your test rig to see if it induced more or less than 0.07dB loss.
73 de w8tam
Nicely done.
Great to see real life tests, dissapointed your vertical test was not the same as inverted V. My fear has always been for a vertical wire on the side of a carbon as opposed to glass fibre for directional,as well as absorbtion. Ideal would be a) inside pole like my current portable, dont expect anything there b) strung alongside c) wound to get higher bands on a shorter pole.
All compared to same on a fibre glass pole for loss and directional.
I would prefer carbon fibre but always been told to avoid them. Sounds like the inverted V is now viable.
I am most decidely learning and I am attempting to find the best option for my twin carbon fibre mast sailboat. There are no stays. The masts are carbon fibre wrapped in a then layer of standard epoxy glass. The mast are also self supporting. Is it possible to turn the mast into an HF antenna using the stainless mast step? I am really trying to find something that doesn't have to be moved in and out of the way of my booms and I'm not loving the look of a tall fixed antenna on the stern.
That is to say a vertical antenna
interesting video many thanks for showing us
Love to win this Just bought the Band Hopper II and the Linked dipole kit 2 weeks ago and I'm sure this would go great with them.
Hi Steven - you are the winner! Please contact Aaron to arrange delivery: sotabeams.shipping@gmail.com
Looks like a great mast
I think carbom fibre absorb just uhf and vhf - in hf it should work with 0,8 to 2 db loss (not much).
I mean to remember: Above 300 Mhz carbon begins to go bad -> for 144 Mhz it can be theoretical used (with a big loss), for 70cm (433 Mhz) you need other materials.
Very good into to interaction of carbon 6
Very interesting, that's going to make my backpack lighter
Interesting and useful bit of analysis. Thanks. 73, M0TTE.
Good to know, I will buy one for sure to save weight in my sota pack.
73 de VA2EGD
Great video!
Have tested on the field a friends carbon mast and never saw any diference now i now why.
73 de CT7ARQ
Hi .....can u run bare copper strap around the mast , if mast is 5 mtrs and u run 1 2 or 3 or 4 mtr copper strap , would there be any possibility the carbon rod starys to become an antenna , i build a 20mtr vertical with insulated wire around it , but would like to build something more robust and use copper strapping then make it into a 17 15 12 and 10 mtr vertical ..... so will the carbon rod conduct to such an extent that the rod will become the antenna instead of the wire ? ZS6AF JOHAN VISAGIE Sunny south africa
I doubt that a carbon fibre mast would radiate very efficiently
Look no further. I'm glad there is a carbon mast I can trust instead of the cheap ones.
Also wonder if you'll be selling the Carbon-6 mast via DXEngineering in the US?
Yes they have it.
An interesting thing would be to run your test on a wet or salt water wet fiberglass mast. I'll bet it is a little more lossy or similarly so.
The loss would also vary if I spead strawberry jam on it...
Very helpful, thank you for your video .
My pleasure!
Nice things. I will buy one of this.
What about change in RF pattern or loss if a vertical wire is wrapped around or just run up the pole? I think I have seen videos of those tests (when these poles first came out) and the conclusion was that it was not a good idea to wrap the wire around the pole. Fiberglass was ok though in those tests. I would go for lighter and stronger any day myself. Thanks.
Dave K8WPE
I suspect that different poles will perform differently. The one that I tested was clearly not likely to cause problems. It will be interesting to see measurements of other poles.
Hello, Thank you for video that answers the qustion I was thinking about. I am planing to start sota activities. Got myself small ft-817 and would love to have telescopic must to support my wires. Best 73 9a4na
It would be interesting to see what happens at 2m / 70cm with wires inside of carbon fibre tubes. It could make a nice, light arrow antenna for satellites? :)
I feel foolish now. I've turned down some bargains as they were Carbon Fibre. Now I know better, thanks and Merry Christmas. 73 M6THQ
They remain a bargain!
Bear in mind that the video only applies to the type of mast I tested. Others may well be different.
aluminium masts have been used for ever, with a bit of spacing used for vertical antennas so a mast made with carbon fibre is a definite advantage , low loss and low weight. Good to see some hearsay debunked !
Damn!! another item to buy got to have it.
Hi, good test. I’m KD9TDW -Derek J Ingram
Thanks,very interesting.
You are welcome.
I'm impressed :-)
Hi I am glad that you have done a test I have only bought your 10masts but I will be looking at your compact masts for when I am out backpacking my station chris G0WFH